mr_wazzabi wrote: »

If they can parse as high as dw in trials then I'm all for it.

Right now 2h is a pvp weapon, which is a shame.

And DW is utter crap in PvP (aside from Duels), which is also a shame?

Could buff cleave, almost no one uses that for pvp. So that would be mostly a pve buff. How we would go about that in a way that wouldnt make it OP in pvp im not sure. Maybe make cleave hurt more the more enemies it hits? People clump less in pvp as much as mobs do in pve.

Though 2h will still underperform against bosses. I have no ideas on how to buff that. Without buffing in pvp.

I feel like right now 2h is practically perfect in pvp. So we cant buff it in anyway that would make it better in pvp.
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Perhaps we could have a ground dot of some kind, players are almost always moving, ads dont. So say we had a ground dot that if they stayed in that would make the difference? What ability this would go on, im not sure. But that could work. Make it so after 2 seconds they take damage if they dont move out of the area.

Could maybe use wrecking blow.

Pretty sure Trump memes are here to stay for a few more years now. At least it's not Harambe.

Glurin wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Why can't 1 just be better in pve and 1 better in pvp?

Because that is extremely limiting and completely against the spirit of Elder Scrolls and "play how you want to". I'm not looking for a game of rock, paper, scissors, lizard, Spock. All weapon types should be effective in both environments.

Obviously there will be various situations where one weapon out performs another, and there will always be meta police who claim that because you get .003% more DPS out of weapon x, you should only ever use weapon x. But the reality should be that in the overall scheme of things all weapon types are roughly equal in their effectiveness.

my belief on balance is it should be simple - Nothing is best everywhere and everything is best somewhere.

unfortunately, PVE vs PVP isn't the division its the player grouping caused by exactly what you asked for.

When *some folks* talk "in PVE" and balance they aren't talking about 90%+ of the PVE content.
Right?
i believe most folks will say that in 90%+ of pVE content you can and will be completely effective with 2H skills or with DW skills. you will be able to succeed without much difficulty in most cases if your an average to above average player in decent gear not BiS etc.

So, my bet is you also feel that way, right?

or do you think 2H in PVE is so inferior that delve bosses are gonna be trouble?

No...

Ok so are you worried about normal dungeons in 4 man groups not being able to succeed with 2H weapons?

No, me neither. Friggin solo them with bows - or mauls - or Dw or staves...

So what is often the "in PVE" being talked about for this kind of discussion is really the leaderboard stuff - trials mostly - but sometimes VMSA and sometimes hardmode dungeon types but mostly its trials IMX.

@H is more good for burst and decent for rally and its heal.
DW does good at sustained DPS.

These are broad statements and sweeping crushes yes but thats one of the more common divisions.

Those are why 2h=PVP is a sort of meme - burst is good for PVP as is solo-functionality and 2h provides a lot of variety (gap closer, stun, potent execute, hvy hit, stamina based heal) and why DW is good for PVE is a meme cuz sustained dps while someone keeps you afloat health wise is optimal for trials.

So your wish is granted - both are good at lots and lots of the content - most of it in fact. both can finish off 905 or more of that content.

But the "each has different strengths" means when one narrows ones lens to just "trial pve" or "leaderboard pve" the flavors in the DW milkshake serve that content better while when one looks for PVP/solos kinds of stuff - the toppings for 2H stand out.

Now, as an aside, or the main point buried lead, i think what we are seeing here is not so much a skill line imbalance but a content imbalance.

How many times in "relevant" PVE content is burst and solo vital?
Compare that to how many time in "relevant" PVE content is sustained DPS while getting group support vital?
MSA is often brought up as the solo-end game but many folks have posted that its really more a puzzle that once you get the patterns down you can beat with any kind of weapons - even bows - so we fall back to group/trials kinds of stuff.

But if you are down now to "well trials yeah thats where we see problems" then you are down to not wanting each good at some things and bad at others but wanting both good at that one slice of content...

or you want leaderboard trial content built that hinges as much on burst/solo strengths as the current ones do on group/sustained dps.

Run any 12 man leaderboard where everyone gets thrown into brief solo burst-kill or die situations as often as they are in long sustain hammer down the big boss and adds?