Everyone yelling, "it will ruin my build" or ruin mag tanks etc, you are crazy.

If this approximate increase in 300 cost ruins your build, then it was not good to begin with. When your spammavke dps/heal amity is about 1250 cost with no cost reduction in heavy, then it does not cost enough. So now it will cost roughly 1500 instead. Really not a huge difference. This was like nb complaining about the nerf to ambush damage or incap damage when in reality the nerf was very very minor.

Problem is everyone looks at the 38% increase number and starts crying. It is not that big a deal. Especially in a game where resource management does not matter. If anything, this is a step in the right direction as far as resource management goes.

No, no one asked for it. But just because we don't talk about it does not mean some changes can not.be made.

The cost of this ability in full light is like 900. Add in champ points and the cost can be reduced easily to 700 currently. So 700 for a spammavke dps which also heals and gives increased healing or heals another. Even if you don't use siphoning attacks at that point and put nothing into your recovery it would still be a free cast.

I have been a nb since beta and believe that this change is fine. However, that does not mean that magnb can't use help elsewhere. There are a few aspects of a mag nb I would like to see changed as well as stam nb.

So i was running vma yesterday with my dw build and almost ran out of magicka, even with 1400 recovery and 5 light. I have 90 cp in cost reduction and 90 in recovery. I do use siphoning attacks. If this cost increase goes through, I would have died.

Please ZOS, as @ztyhurstub17_ESO mentioned, this does hurt solo builds. Don't nerf a class that needs help unless you give them a strong buff in the same patch.

Even still, the nerf was never needed. Strife is far from op given that it's the weakest spammable dps ability in the game. Leave us the cheap cost.

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

So i was running vma yesterday with my dw build and almost ran out of magicka, even with 1400 recovery and 5 light. I have 90 cp in cost reduction and 90 in recovery. I do use siphoning attacks. If this cost increase goes through, I would have died.

Please ZOS, as @ztyhurstub17_ESO mentioned, this does hurt solo builds. Don't nerf a class that needs help unless you give them a strong buff in the same patch.

Even still, the nerf was never needed. Strife is far from op given that it's the weakest spammable dps ability in the game. Leave us the cheap cost.

You ran out of resources because a lack of resource managment. In 5 light with what an additional 15% cost reduction from cp would put cost of strife no higher at worst then 900. My guess is it really is somewhere around 700 for the cost. You would literally be gaining mag with that recovery you have every t I me you used it. My guess is you did not run out of mag because of strife. It is because of your other buffs and mag drains you were close to running out. Not strife.

Additionally, what makes SA good is the ability to weave in light attacks. A task that is more difficult with DW and less efficient because of the low damage you get from the light attack. Not to mention dw gives stamina back and not mag further hurting your resources.

Strife increase in cost is not what is hurting you. I'm guessing your rotation coupled with the fact ed you are using dw is the issue. A 300 cost increase on Strife is not going to be your problem.

Again, mag nb could use some love, but that does not mean a cost increase was not justified. To me it was a matter of when not if they would increase the cost. Resource manage nt is a joke in this game. Man, I wonder what you would have done before cp.

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

So i was running vma yesterday with my dw build and almost ran out of magicka, even with 1400 recovery and 5 light. I have 90 cp in cost reduction and 90 in recovery. I do use siphoning attacks. If this cost increase goes through, I would have died.

Please ZOS, as @ztyhurstub17_ESO mentioned, this does hurt solo builds. Don't nerf a class that needs help unless you give them a strong buff in the same patch.

Even still, the nerf was never needed. Strife is far from op given that it's the weakest spammable dps ability in the game. Leave us the cheap cost.

You ran out of resources because a lack of resource managment. In 5 light with what an additional 15% cost reduction from cp would put cost of strife no higher at worst then 900. My guess is it really is somewhere around 700 for the cost. You would literally be gaining mag with that recovery you have every t I me you used it. My guess is you did not run out of mag because of strife. It is because of your other buffs and mag drains you were close to running out. Not strife.

Additionally, what makes SA good is the ability to weave in light attacks. A task that is more difficult with DW and less efficient because of the low damage you get from the light attack. Not to mention dw gives stamina back and not mag further hurting your resources.

Strife increase in cost is not what is hurting you. I'm guessing your rotation coupled with the fact ed you are using dw is the issue. A 300 cost increase on Strife is not going to be your problem.

Again, mag nb could use some love, but that does not mean a cost increase was not justified. To me it was a matter of when not if they would increase the cost. Resource manage nt is a joke in this game. Man, I wonder what you would have done before cp.

My cost was 989. There were times i had to spam strife to ranged ads as i couldnt run up to them and use concealed weapon. That was when i almost ran out of magicka.

Yes there were times magicka was low because of other skills, but a low cost strife would save my life through its heal.

I shouldn't be pigeonholed into a staff build. "Play how you like" as zos says. It's not meta, but it's still possible to play well in the hardest content with niche builds. The cost increase of strife moves the game away from this direction, which is no good. It goes agai st what zos originally intended and marketed.

Really this again. "Play as you want" is not the same as "play as you want and be just as good as every other build"

People seem to really not get that in this game. I can slap on medium armor and run a resto and play the game to a degree, but that does not mean I will be as good as someone who is in all light with Max mag running a resto.

You don't have to be pigeon hold into a staff but understand that your choice to play that way has its detriments. Your skills have a higher damage, but your overall dps suffers from lack of proper weaving. You can't properlly take advantage of SA without weaving which hurts your sustain. Plus, dw does not give mag back. Your choice has a downside. All the increase does is make you slightly have to think about a little better resource managment. Again, strife going from your current cost to 1300 is not what breaks your build. If it does, then you should reevaluate your build.

Are you running a staff on back bar? If not maybe you should. Maybe that bar is where you take advantage of SA or heavy resto weaved in for resources.

Play as you want does not mean your build is viable in all content.

The cost increase does not move the game away from that direction. It is simply putting the cost on par with the cost of other abilities. And it is still cheaper then just about anything else with the nerf. Resource management is a joke in this game. Imo, cp system should not award more then 5% increase in a star with 100cp.

Go ahead and use dw, but you have to live with the reality that your choic3 to play as you want has detriments.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

So i was running vma yesterday with my dw build and almost ran out of magicka, even with 1400 recovery and 5 light. I have 90 cp in cost reduction and 90 in recovery. I do use siphoning attacks. If this cost increase goes through, I would have died.

Please ZOS, as @ztyhurstub17_ESO mentioned, this does hurt solo builds. Don't nerf a class that needs help unless you give them a strong buff in the same patch.

Even still, the nerf was never needed. Strife is far from op given that it's the weakest spammable dps ability in the game. Leave us the cheap cost.

You ran out of resources because a lack of resource managment. In 5 light with what an additional 15% cost reduction from cp would put cost of strife no higher at worst then 900. My guess is it really is somewhere around 700 for the cost. You would literally be gaining mag with that recovery you have every t I me you used it. My guess is you did not run out of mag because of strife. It is because of your other buffs and mag drains you were close to running out. Not strife.

Additionally, what makes SA good is the ability to weave in light attacks. A task that is more difficult with DW and less efficient because of the low damage you get from the light attack. Not to mention dw gives stamina back and not mag further hurting your resources.

Strife increase in cost is not what is hurting you. I'm guessing your rotation coupled with the fact ed you are using dw is the issue. A 300 cost increase on Strife is not going to be your problem.

Again, mag nb could use some love, but that does not mean a cost increase was not justified. To me it was a matter of when not if they would increase the cost. Resource manage nt is a joke in this game. Man, I wonder what you would have done before cp.

My cost was 989. There were times i had to spam strife to ranged ads as i couldnt run up to them and use concealed weapon. That was when i almost ran out of magicka.

Yes there were times magicka was low because of other skills, but a low cost strife would save my life through its heal.

I shouldn't be pigeonholed into a staff build. "Play how you like" as zos says. It's not meta, but it's still possible to play well in the hardest content with niche builds. The cost increase of strife moves the game away from this direction, which is no good. It goes agai st what zos originally intended and marketed.

Really this again. "Play as you want" is not the same as "play as you want and be just as good as every other build"

People seem to really not get that in this game. I can slap on medium armor and run a resto and play the game to a degree, but that does not mean I will be as good as someone who is in all light with Max mag running a resto.

You don't have to be pigeon hold into a staff but understand that your choice to play that way has its detriments. Your skills have a higher damage, but your overall dps suffers from lack of proper weaving. You can't properlly take advantage of SA without weaving which hurts your sustain. Plus, dw does not give mag back. Your choice has a downside. All the increase does is make you slightly have to think about a little better resource managment. Again, strife going from your current cost to 1300 is not what breaks your build. If it does, then you should reevaluate your build.

Are you running a staff on back bar? If not maybe you should. Maybe that bar is where you take advantage of SA or heavy resto weaved in for resources.

Play as you want does not mean your build is viable in all content.

The cost increase does not move the game away from that direction. It is simply putting the cost on par with the cost of other abilities. And it is still cheaper then just about anything else with the nerf. Resource management is a joke in this game. Imo, cp system should not award more then 5% increase in a star with 100cp.

Go ahead and use dw, but you have to live with the reality that your choic3 to play as you want has detriments.

I have destro staff backbar for vma wall of elements and destro ult. I do have bis gear, just like to use it differently than the meta. I do fully understand the shortcomings of my build, but I have the right to object to a nerf that would handicap me even more don't I?

the_man_of_steal wrote: »

The Strife nerf is horrendous and I use DW on my magblade not destro. I enjoy the diversity that was allowed with strife and completely dislike the changes. If you want to make it cost more that's fine but 38% is absolute overkill especially when NO ONE was complaining about this skill.

Please change this @Wrobel @ZOS_RichLambert

it is overkill for sure

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

As someone who raids most in a magNB I have to agree that strife was to cheap. I'd slot it instead of FP if magika support was not great. The coat needed to be increased to be comparable. Is 38% the right number, don't know.

For Mag NB tanking, the increased cost will not hurt use of stride for keeping health up but that's not why they use it. It's used to help regen stam for sap tanking and mya have an affect there.

Here's the issue I have with it - as you just admitted, even before the cost increase strife wasn't even good enough to slot - yet now it has its cost increased dramatically (and yes people 38% is dramatic no matter how you cut it, you never see ZOS increase or decrease numbers by that much - see for example the only 5% damage decrease on destro ult). As I said in an earlier post, I do think it is fair to say that in vacuum it makes sense to increase strife's cost because it is so cheap. And I don't think most of the people complaining about this nerf are saying they'll never be able to sustain or that there is no way strife should ever have received a cost increase. Rather, they are looking at the big picture.

The core problem is that strife is already a mediocre skill and magblade is a mediocre class (other than in vMA). Therefore, to provide absolutely no buffs to magblades whatsoever yet provide a large cost increase to their ranged spamable really is a slap in the face. So sure, in practice this won't really effect my PvP build (which is what I primarily do although I've done plenty of vet dungeons, gotten flawless conq, etc. so I also understand PvE pretty well). The nerf also won't effect PvE builds because they don't even use strife anyway (yet it gets nerfed...)! I never run out of resources in PvE and in PvP I typically only run out of resources when I have to spam shields and mistform. So once again, in a vacuum it makes sense to increase the cost so sustain isn't overly easy, I get that. But why would you nerf a class spamable that is already considered weak and often not even used over the weapon line alternative? Especially when it is on a class that is considered weak to the point where it is practically impossible to even find people playing it (at least in PvP it is so rare to see non-bomber magblades)? This is why people are complaining - because ZOS felt the need to nerf an already under performing skill on an under performing class. It would be like if ZOS reduced the damage on Jabs for Stamplars.

It is funny how many people I have seen say they don't care about the strife nerf because they don't even use it anyway. That is why people are mad. Why kick us why we are down? Why nerf a skill that isn't even good to begin with on a class that is struggling? I get that a struggling class can still be OP in certain areas. And a magblade's sustain is probably unmatched. Which is, again, why I say it makes sense, in a vacuum, to increase strife's cost. But ZOS provided absolutely no buffs to strife or directs buffs to magblades in general.

So in short, to me at least, it is really the principle behind the nerf that ticks me off. It isn't the fact that I won't be able to sustain or do just as well as before, it isn't that I think the nerf was unnecessary, its the fact the the "great balance patch" brought no changes to the struggling magblade class other than to nerf our already sub-par ranged spamable. That is why I am complaining about the nerf - its literally the only balance change we got.

bubbygink wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

As someone who raids most in a magNB I have to agree that strife was to cheap. I'd slot it instead of FP if magika support was not great. The coat needed to be increased to be comparable. Is 38% the right number, don't know.

For Mag NB tanking, the increased cost will not hurt use of stride for keeping health up but that's not why they use it. It's used to help regen stam for sap tanking and mya have an affect there.

Here's the issue I have with it - as you just admitted, even before the cost increase strife wasn't even good enough to slot - yet now it has its cost increased dramatically (and yes people 38% is dramatic no matter how you cut it, you never see ZOS increase or decrease numbers by that much - see for example the only 5% damage decrease on destro ult). As I said in an earlier post, I do think it is fair to say that in vacuum it makes sense to increase strife's cost because it is so cheap. And I don't think most of the people complaining about this nerf are saying they'll never be able to sustain or that there is no way strife should ever have received a cost increase. Rather, they are looking at the big picture.

The core problem is that strife is already a mediocre skill and magblade is a mediocre class (other than in vMA). Therefore, to provide absolutely no buffs to magblades whatsoever yet provide a large cost increase to their ranged spamable really is a slap in the face. So sure, in practice this won't really effect my PvP build (which is what I primarily do although I've done plenty of vet dungeons, gotten flawless conq, etc. so I also understand PvE pretty well). The nerf also won't effect PvE builds because they don't even use strife anyway (yet it gets nerfed...)! I never run out of resources in PvE and in PvP I typically only run out of resources when I have to spam shields and mistform. So once again, in a vacuum it makes sense to increase the cost so sustain isn't overly easy, I get that. But why would you nerf a class spamable that is already considered weak and often not even used over the weapon line alternative? Especially when it is on a class that is considered weak to the point where it is practically impossible to even find people playing it (at least in PvP it is so rare to see non-bomber magblades)? This is why people are complaining - because ZOS felt the need to nerf an already under performing skill on an under performing class. It would be like if ZOS reduced the damage on Jabs for Stamplars.

It is funny how many people I have seen say they don't care about the strife nerf because they don't even use it anyway. That is why people are mad. Why kick us why we are down? Why nerf a skill that isn't even good to begin with on a class that is struggling? I get that a struggling class can still be OP in certain areas. And a magblade's sustain is probably unmatched. Which is, again, why I say it makes sense, in a vacuum, to increase strife's cost. But ZOS provided absolutely no buffs to strife or directs buffs to magblades in general.

So in short, to me at least, it is really the principle behind the nerf that ticks me off. It isn't the fact that I won't be able to sustain or do just as well as before, it isn't that I think the nerf was unnecessary, its the fact the the "great balance patch" brought no changes to the struggling magblade class other than to nerf our already sub-par ranged spamable. That is why I am complaining about the nerf - its literally the only balance change we got.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @Wrobel @ZOS_RichLambert

This post says it all. Please revisit strife nerf

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

HA nerf on top of strife.... NB Sap Tank is getting totally screwed. Thought this update was going to make Hybrid viable.

Totally agree here, my Nightblade sap Tank getting run into the ground, what the hell....