Dragon Knight PTS discussion (homestead)

TheDefiantOne · January 2017

DKsUnite wrote: »

Yeh I think my time as a mDK is coming to an end. Stam DK is just so tanky compared...

^ hail. Also with heavy armor passives your stam DK can still talon as much as a group needs it to do, as you prooved in your last video.

Joy_Division · January 2017

jaburns wrote: »

IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »

Ferocious Leap Flame damage OP. We finally have some decent burst boys. I can already feel the Powerlash into Dragon Leap combo with Engulfing and Burning up. Can't wait to put on some PvP gear. Been stuck in PvE for way too long.

Toast_STS wrote: »

I'm excited for the Ferocious Leap change. I was playing around with take flight in cyrodiil yesterday on my mDK and hitting 10k leaps so it will be nice to add some spell pen and CP into that.

Edit: oh but take flight does more damage and costs less anyway. I'm not that excited anymore

I'd love to see how Ferocious Leap will compare to Take Flight. If anyone tests it tomorrow in the PTS- could you please post about it? I'm specifically concerned with the tooltip readout for it. Is it a firey AOE? (Does it synergize with the DK passive World in Ruin?) Will it still knock back enemies?

I'm thinking of a good PVP move with a Dunmer mDK tank build from the updates:

Black Rose, Burning Spellweave, Valkyn Skoria

Ferocious Leap into a crowd to proc a firey AOE DOT. Toss up Burning Talons, roll dodge out of the crowd, hit Eruption. This should proc Valkyn Skoria, using Eruption should replace the stamina of the roll dodge. Let the DOTs do the inital damage for your group to come in and clean up.

@DKsUnite @Joy_Division @leepalmer95 @Rohamad_Ali

I think it's cool some people are seeing a silver lining and trying to make this work. We certainly do need people actually testing this stuff because we have been wrong about the PTS before.

My issues with DK stem all the way back to the changes in the 1.6 patch, when I think the base game, which had accommodated the DK so well - it was by far the best class design IMHO - had been undermined by the direction the developers had took the game. I always saw the DK built as a sustain class that wore down opponents through attrition and I felt that was a very viable strategy before 1.6, especially with the way dynamic ultimate worked.

After 1.6 however, it seems like the only way I can get a kill on a good player is with on demand burst. I also disliked just about every change they made to DK skills: inferno, cinderstorm, the 200 ultimate standard, scales, battleroar, etc., all sapped much of the enthusiasm I had for the class; the only change I liked was the heal on burning embers.

I am probably in the minority though because most DKs have specifically pointed to the Dragon Blood heal as their #1 priority, which tells me they can live without burst damage, provided they get a decent heal. Maybe they are content with being tanks. Don;t get me wrong, I don't mind being the last one alive in the middle of an enemy zerg, there is a certain awesomeness to that. But I'd like the option of doing that or actually killing players, and without burst and the relative easy manner in which good players can sustain, trying to do damage in PvP on a DK is like running on a treadmill.

If ZoS had done something with light armor, I'd be more optimistic about trying something, but I think I'll stick with pvping with my other classes.

Faulgor · January 2017

tinythinker wrote: »

So critting was the big change to making Dragon's Blood useful again. The boost to Volatile Armor is how we can now really pressure opponents with DoTs. And health matters now rather than just stam or magicka because... uhhh...

But I guess I can just play on my MagBla--

"Strife: Increased the cost of this ability and its morphs by approximately 38%."

That was the most important change I was looking forward to, although it's not DK-specific. Wrobel said in the last AMA that he's working on something so people don't just put all attribute points into magicka or stamina. Was this scrapped or didn't it make the cut yet?

Our goal is to make it more valuable to spend points in health instead of just going all magicka or stamina. The reason this is so powerful is you're getting to deal more damage and heal yourself for more by maxing offensive stats. The current design is still in progress, so l don't have concrete details for you right now.

https://reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/546mo4/welcome_to_the_one_tamriel_eso_ama/d7zdqt6/?context=3

SublimeSparo · January 2017

Lucky28 wrote: »

I thought this was a balance patch. i really don't understand why magicka is being nerfed on pretty much all fronts but destro ult.... what a disappointment.

I think technically the destro ult got a buff for sorc lolz,
If you have a destro ability slotted aoe damage increased by 8% yea, destro ult nerfed by 5% so 3% buff hahaha

NBrookus · January 2017

I didn't have high expectations to begin with, but this... just... whaaaa? I keep rereading the patch notes looking for the sense of direction or goal. Are some patch notes missing? Are there typos? Did they stealth fix some stuff (like chains) so that this all means something? Am I really understanding they actually made CBD worse by being even less reliable, or is this just some horrible wording?

Because I'm not seeing all the buffs that were promised. I'm seeing some mostly tiny changes and a pointless nerf to a situational, difficult to use and expensive ultimate. Honestly, if they just removed CDB from Battle Spirit and gave us a token 5% buff to whip I would have been reasonably content.

I can think of a dozen new build ideas but I have the sinking feeling they'll all be on par with the 30 or so builds I've tried since 1T, i.e. underwhelming because they are trying to bandaid together what's broken. I just logged off tonight and I'm not feeling particularly motivated to bother attempting to roll this rock up the hill on PTS tomorrow.

I'm withholding final judgement for testing and potential clarification on CDB from @Wrobel, but my gut feeling is

techprince · January 2017

You guys missed a huge change, Major Evasion will now be 15% instead of 20%. RIP Tava Builds.

Carbonised · January 2017

These changes have me in a bipolar mood.

As a master crafter and completionist, I'm very excited about the changes that are coming to crafting and furniture. As a magDK, however, I'm somewhat disappointed by the announced changes.

Flame whip 5 % up, okay, nothing big but nice anyway. Banner nerf was uncalled for. Banner was a nice ult to drop in PvE, now it deals both less damage and has less damage mitigation to you. Not needed.

Dragon Blood I just have to agree with everyone here. It may have gotten from a bad skill to an even worse one. I play both PvE and PvP, and I fail to see the use of this in either arena, for your usual firestaff magDK. Is it really that hard to just make a simple, effective and reliable self heal? I mean, we already have both Vigor and Breath of Life, so you guys know how to make 'em ...

Fire morph of Dragon Flight is nice, we'll just have to see how it compares to Shooting Star and Banner. I have an inkling that this will be attractive for PvP only, and be left to dust in PvE.

Chains are still bad, weapon lines and other class skill still have way, way more powerful and interesting gap closers. Changing expedition fro 2 to 8 secs isn't changing anything.

And wow, for a patch that was specifically supposed to adress MDKs and Magicka in general, no change to skills that suck like stonefist/obsidian shard? NO change AT ALL to Inferno/FOO/Cauterize? Perhaps the most useless, sucky, superfluous, laughable skill in our entire skill lines? How could you fail to make something out of this. Inferno was just sitting there, waiting to become again a large AOE with secondary effects.

Mage guild changes - so you bumped fire rune up, well nice. We'll just have to see if it's enough to compete with Wall of Elements and Eruption, I doubt it is. Balance is still a weird and crappy skill, I doubt the changes in defense buffs are gonna change that.

Destro staff changes - most mDKs use this weapon, so it affects us a lot. You worked the passives around, and it seems like fire staffs will get a boost, which is nice. Crushing shock and destro clench are still underperforming, however, compared to other weapon lines. I'd not want to slot any of these outside PvP. Impulse got a change. Without the DoT on Ele Ring, though, the distance doesn't really help in any way. I see some use for this in PvP as a distanced AOE spammable, not really no use in PvE. Meaning we're back to Wall being the only skill from the destro line that has use in PvE. You should have looked more at the damage on Ele Ring, and on Destro Clench and Crushing Shock, as it is now they just don't compete with class skills as DPS skills in PvE, which is sad.

Cinbri · January 2017

Overall magicka dk this update got most sweetest buffs. #LeapTillWin.

redTechInc · January 2017

RIP magDK, instead of decent buffs we once again got nerfed into oblivion.

Maybe one day you will really listen to your playerbase instead of pointlessly *** up overpriced ultimates...

Etaniel · January 2017

They didn't kill dk, they just didn't make it great again. We got some minor buffs that will actually help out a lot - leap+whip+volatile.

Coagulating blood is going to be crap.
We just have to swtch to gdb and lose 8% healing. That sucks, but it's not the end of the world.

I'm having fun on my dk in this patch, that's probably not gonna change next patch.

Lord_Hev · January 2017

Etaniel wrote: »

They didn't kill dk, they just didn't make it great again. We got some minor buffs that will actually help out a lot - leap+whip+volatile.

Coagulating blood is going to be crap.
We just have to swtch to gdb and lose 8% healing. That sucks, but it's not the end of the world.

I'm having fun on my dk in this patch, that's probably not gonna change next patch.

I agree with you but.....

Etaniel wrote: »

.
We just have to swtch to gdb and lose 8% healing. That sucks, but it's not the end of the world.

This right here is the issue. And I mean, this is a very serious issue. Like.... why the **** is this even a reality? how incompetent can a professional game developer be for us(the players) to have to actually consider this?

Why is this the reality we have to expect next patch? Why can't get get a reliable self-heal? Why is this a thing? WTF is wrong with ZOS? Why has it come to this??

Saint_Bud · January 2017

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Wow, really disappointed at the salt level in this thread. At first, I was confused by the patch notes, then it hit me. This patch is gonna be very good for mDKs. The issue mDKs have had for a long time is they need to stack all three stats: magicka for damage, health for CDB, and stamina for blocking.

You have to look at the patch notes in their entirety. When you consider the entire notes, with an ice staff we only have to stack a single stat...magicka. With our magicka pool, we can now block, heal, and deal damage! We gain light attacks that actually deal damage instead of tickle. With large magicka pools we gain the ability to use damage shields that are actually decently sized.

Let me repeat that...no longer do we have to split our stat pool!!!

I don't think you realize how much you'll be able to permablock with an ice staff and desert rose.

The CDB changes will be better than old CDB in every way. My magicka pool, even with trainee and argonian passives, is 10k higher than my health pool. Of course my DB heals will be stronger. Only scenario where they won't is when I'm ganked. I don't recall the last time I was ganked where I didn't die instantly to 5 proc sets going off at the same time, so not worried about that scenario really (and am not convinced the proc set nerf will change this, but that's a different thread).

Flame leap will be a cheaper ult than meteor that hits just as hard, and doesn't require a fossilize to guarantee a hit because it doesn't telegraph.

Whips hit harder.

In PvE, whip damage is buffed 13% with destro staff changes.

I'm excited about these changes. In @Wrobel we trust!

You forget a lot man
When you stuned or rooted it will still coast stamina for break free.

Sanct16 · January 2017

@Lord_Hev

What are you on about?

We always take feedback seriously. One Tamriel was so huge we had to focus on the balance and new item sets. With the next major update we will be focusing on class balance and abilities. We have a pretty cool new version of Dragon Blood planned that will help magicka DKs while maintaining it's power level for high health characters.

Derra · January 2017

SublimeSparo wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

I thought this was a balance patch. i really don't understand why magicka is being nerfed on pretty much all fronts but destro ult.... what a disappointment.

I think technically the destro ult got a buff for sorc lolz,
If you have a destro ability slotted aoe damage increased by 8% yea, destro ult nerfed by 5% so 3% buff hahaha

If you could explain why anyone would use a lightning staff in pvp that is

Valencer · January 2017

Was hoping Stamina DKs would have a bit more purpose again this update. Because of the current tank + destro ulti meta, the only thing I can really use my stam DK for in group play is rapid maneuvers spam. Respeccing to mag DK is pointless because Ill simply be a less effective version of a mag NB on bomb spec, since all that matters is pushing enough destro ultis with high damage.

In open world PvP I don't burst as well as any other class because DKs dont have any innate burst. Im basically getting shoehorned into running a boring tank build and trying to outlast people, because thats all a DK can really do better than other classes now.

I was reeeaaally hoping they would do something about 1) everyone being a tank and 2) destro ulti being the BiS PvP ulti by far. Apparently these issues aren't of any concern to ZOS though. Think I might just stop playing my DK when she hits rank 45, because I cant find an enjoyable purpose for her anymore.

SublimeSparo · January 2017

Derra wrote: »

SublimeSparo wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

I thought this was a balance patch. i really don't understand why magicka is being nerfed on pretty much all fronts but destro ult.... what a disappointment.

I think technically the destro ult got a buff for sorc lolz,
If you have a destro ability slotted aoe damage increased by 8% yea, destro ult nerfed by 5% so 3% buff hahaha

If you could explain why anyone would use a lightning staff in pvp that is

"for sorcs" was kind of the key to that statement, and it's a 2.6% damage buff to lightning destro ult.
Plus lightning staves are pretty effective for any class in pvp- can't shuffle/dodge roll channels, and now it has a chance to inflict minor vulnerability via concussion

KisoValley · January 2017

Valencer wrote: »

Was hoping Stamina DKs would have a bit more purpose again this update. Because of the current tank + destro ulti meta, the only thing I can really use my stam DK for in group play is rapid maneuvers spam. Respeccing to mag DK is pointless because Ill simply be a less effective version of a mag NB on bomb spec, since all that matters is pushing enough destro ultis with high damage.

In open world PvP I don't burst as well as any other class because DKs dont have any innate burst. Im basically getting shoehorned into running a boring tank build and trying to outlast people, because thats all a DK can really do better than other classes now.

I was reeeaaally hoping they would do something about 1) everyone being a tank and 2) destro ulti being the BiS PvP ulti by far. Apparently these issues aren't of any concern to ZOS though. Think I might just stop playing my DK when she hits rank 45, because I cant find an enjoyable purpose for her anymore.

Valencar retiring from his DK? Wow what have Zos done.......

miahus · January 2017

So the class that's all about over time skills, doesn't have a heal over time. Laughable. I propose to change the name of coagulating blood to trolling blood.

Armitas · January 2017

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Wow, really disappointed at the salt level in this thread. At first, I was confused by the patch notes, then it hit me. This patch is gonna be very good for mDKs. The issue mDKs have had for a long time is they need to stack all three stats: magicka for damage, health for CDB, and stamina for blocking.

You have to look at the patch notes in their entirety. When you consider the entire notes, with an ice staff we only have to stack a single stat...magicka. With our magicka pool, we can now block, heal, and deal damage! We gain light attacks that actually deal damage instead of tickle. With large magicka pools we gain the ability to use damage shields that are actually decently sized.

Let me repeat that...no longer do we have to split our stat pool!!!

I don't think you realize how much you'll be able to permablock with an ice staff and desert rose.

The CDB changes will be better than old CDB in every way. My magicka pool, even with trainee and argonian passives, is 10k higher than my health pool. Of course my DB heals will be stronger. Only scenario where they won't is when I'm ganked. I don't recall the last time I was ganked where I didn't die instantly to 5 proc sets going off at the same time, so not worried about that scenario really (and am not convinced the proc set nerf will change this, but that's a different thread).

Flame leap will be a cheaper ult than meteor that hits just as hard, and doesn't require a fossilize to guarantee a hit because it doesn't telegraph.

Whips hit harder.

In PvE, whip damage is buffed 13% with destro staff changes.

I'm excited about these changes. In @Wrobel we trust!

That wouldn't be so bad if we were iceknights but we have an entire line of skills like engulfing flame and fire passives and a lot of mDK's are dunmers. While I also agree that froststaves are going to be the new permablock (can even juggle with s/b) sets like desert rose and building to sustain that magicka are going to be counter intuitive to cDB. (all theoretically speaking until more time on the pts)

Carbonised · January 2017

Wrobel: "So hey, let's look at this dragon blood skill that everyone's complaining about. So, it heals for 33 % of lost health, yet people say it's too little, and most of them pump up magicka instead of health. Hm ... Let's scale it off magicka then! No, wait, that won't work, too powerful, everyone will yell at me. Hey, let's scale it off magicka, but only heal 33 % like the old dragon blood! Everyone's happy, another problem solved. Now let me see how to turn this frost staff that no one uses into a tank weapon, now that would be cool".

Armitas · January 2017

I can't believe combustion and elder dragon made it through without a change but iron skin got a tool tip change.

Bashev · January 2017

Armitas wrote: »

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Wow, really disappointed at the salt level in this thread. At first, I was confused by the patch notes, then it hit me. This patch is gonna be very good for mDKs. The issue mDKs have had for a long time is they need to stack all three stats: magicka for damage, health for CDB, and stamina for blocking.

You have to look at the patch notes in their entirety. When you consider the entire notes, with an ice staff we only have to stack a single stat...magicka. With our magicka pool, we can now block, heal, and deal damage! We gain light attacks that actually deal damage instead of tickle. With large magicka pools we gain the ability to use damage shields that are actually decently sized.

Let me repeat that...no longer do we have to split our stat pool!!!

I don't think you realize how much you'll be able to permablock with an ice staff and desert rose.

The CDB changes will be better than old CDB in every way. My magicka pool, even with trainee and argonian passives, is 10k higher than my health pool. Of course my DB heals will be stronger. Only scenario where they won't is when I'm ganked. I don't recall the last time I was ganked where I didn't die instantly to 5 proc sets going off at the same time, so not worried about that scenario really (and am not convinced the proc set nerf will change this, but that's a different thread).

Flame leap will be a cheaper ult than meteor that hits just as hard, and doesn't require a fossilize to guarantee a hit because it doesn't telegraph.

Whips hit harder.

In PvE, whip damage is buffed 13% with destro staff changes.

I'm excited about these changes. In @Wrobel we trust!

That wouldn't be so bad if we were iceknights but we have an entire line of skills like engulfing flame and fire passives and a lot of mDK's are dunmers. While I also agree that froststaves are going to be the new permablock (can even juggle with s/b) sets like desert rose and building to sustain that magicka are going to be counter intuitive to cDB. (all theoretically speaking until more time on the pts)

The frost staff change now give a chance to templars and sorcs to be magicka permablockers too. They couldnt take advantage of the 1h/s cause they dont have damaging class abilities that synergize. Now they can use crushing shock and hold block as DKs .

Teridaxus · January 2017

techprince wrote: »

You guys missed a huge change, Major Evasion will now be 15% instead of 20%. RIP Tava Builds.

Nope, dodging is still extremly powerful because zos nerfed it in the wrong way.
It's not a 15% to dodge every single hit.
It's a 15% chance to make you invicible for 0.3 seconds taking 0 damage from all attacks during that period. Only pve tanks where adds are missing during a boss fight will notice it and the whole ulti tank meta outshining other tanks that hard isn't that healthy excalty.

Seraphayel · January 2017

Didn't they say they wanted to "buff" Magicka DKs? They did like nothing for that. It's hilarious.

AverageJo3Gam3r · January 2017

@Saint_Bud 10k stamina is plenty for break free if that's all you're using your stamina pool for. Plus, we still have helping hands and battle roar. Most sorcs and mNB roll with 10k stamina since the witch mothers brew came out. We only needed more for blocking.

tinythinker · January 2017

Missing patch notes:

Lava Whip: Increased the damage from this ability and its morphs by 5% and now has a 10% chance to apply a burning status effect.

Cauterize (Inferno morph) now heals for an additional 30%.

Coagulating Blood (Dragon Blood morph): This morph now heals you for 33% of your missing Magicka instead of 33% of your missing Health and inflicts Minor Magickasteal and Major Lifesteal to all enemies within 12 meters of the caster for 6 seconds.

Green Dragon's Blood (Dragon Blood morph): This morph now heals you for 33% of your missing Stamina instead of 33% of your missing Health and inflicts Minor Staminaasteal and Major Lifesteal to all enemies within 12 meters of the caster for 6 seconds.

Obsidian Shard (morph of Stonefist) now applies Minorlifesteal to the caster or a nearby ally for 4 seconds in addition to the initial heal.

Stone Giant (morph of Stonefist) now grants Major Resolve instead of Minor Resolve.

Ishammael · January 2017

techprince wrote: »

You guys missed a huge change, Major Evasion will now be 15% instead of 20%. RIP Tava Builds.

This won't make a big difference because it was changed in the wrong way. Still remains the best defensive buff in the game.
They didn't even restrict it to 5 medium armor pieces like was rumored!

Armitas wrote: »

I can't believe combustion and elder dragon made it through without a change but iron skin got a tool tip change.

Yeah this is baffling. NO passives addressed...

Derra wrote: »

SublimeSparo wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

I thought this was a balance patch. i really don't understand why magicka is being nerfed on pretty much all fronts but destro ult.... what a disappointment.

I think technically the destro ult got a buff for sorc lolz,
If you have a destro ability slotted aoe damage increased by 8% yea, destro ult nerfed by 5% so 3% buff hahaha

If you could explain why anyone would use a lightning staff in pvp that is

+8% AoE damage
Minor Vulnerability on Concussion! (+8% damage taken!)
+5% lightning dmg passive on Sorc
Lightning Storm is gonna be ridiculous.
Might even see players spamming 28m impulse.

Unreflectable Crushing Shock is actually a pretty big deal. Totally changes the DK/Sorc matchup dynamic.

Etaniel wrote: »

They didn't kill dk, they just didn't make it great again. We got some minor buffs that will actually help out a lot - leap+whip+volatile.

Coagulating blood is going to be crap.
We just have to swtch to gdb and lose 8% healing. That sucks, but it's not the end of the world.

I'm having fun on my dk in this patch, that's probably not gonna change next patch.

Agreed that Leap + Volatile + Whip is a good buff.

My hope is that Coag gets fixed to something more reasonable. I find it bizarre that ZOS was able to take a crap skill and make it even more crap.

What I find most disappointed is that there were no changes to Inferno, Stone fist, Cinder Storm.

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Wow, really disappointed at the salt level in this thread. At first, I was confused by the patch notes, then it hit me. This patch is gonna be very good for mDKs. The issue mDKs have had for a long time is they need to stack all three stats: magicka for damage, health for CDB, and stamina for blocking.

You have to look at the patch notes in their entirety. When you consider the entire notes, with an ice staff we only have to stack a single stat...magicka. With our magicka pool, we can now block, heal, and deal damage! We gain light attacks that actually deal damage instead of tickle. With large magicka pools we gain the ability to use damage shields that are actually decently sized.

Let me repeat that...no longer do we have to split our stat pool!!!

I don't think you realize how much you'll be able to permablock with an ice staff and desert rose.

The CDB changes will be better than old CDB in every way. My magicka pool, even with trainee and argonian passives, is 10k higher than my health pool. Of course my DB heals will be stronger. Only scenario where they won't is when I'm ganked. I don't recall the last time I was ganked where I didn't die instantly to 5 proc sets going off at the same time, so not worried about that scenario really (and am not convinced the proc set nerf will change this, but that's a different thread).

Flame leap will be a cheaper ult than meteor that hits just as hard, and doesn't require a fossilize to guarantee a hit because it doesn't telegraph.

Whips hit harder.

In PvE, whip damage is buffed 13% with destro staff changes.

I'm excited about these changes. In @Wrobel we trust!

I appreciate your excitement! But I don't think the Ice Staff blocking build will work out like you described on a DK. It will on a Templar with the new manasteal buff.

In PvE players won't use whip, they'll use the other morph b/c it increases DoT dmg.

victorhrpereira · January 2017

That's Dragonblood for us. We asked to make it a simple hot like vigor, a decent heal like BoL or even remove it from the Battle Spirit, but then they change it to an even worse version of what we have now and still didn't fix the other morph GDB.

Seriously, it's really frustrating that they took like 2 years (?) to make that change even after all the feedback they got from us.

Moglijuana · January 2017

Ghost-Shot wrote: »

DKsUnite wrote: »

*** wrobel

^

^^

Izaki · January 2017

Hey guys at least we can use Black Rose now...