UrQuan wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

DoccEff wrote: »

- Gives no debuff on the boss.
- Can't be performed while blocking.
- Will result in newbies taunting away bosses.
- Will result in froststaffs being even worse for PvE.
-> Complete garbage if you want to do anything higher than normal dungeons.

The whole patch is just ridiculous but this change tops everything.

Mind you, the bold part is a potentially big issue.

That just comes down to educating newbies, though, and really it's no different from newbies not knowing that S&B isn't good for DPS and that the first skill in that skill line is a bad one for them to be using as a DPS because it takes aggro from the tank.

How is it a problem?

Healing pulls aggro, a lot of dps pulls aggro and some tanks don't even taunt.

Now the use of the staff allows a ping pong effect.
At worse when ppl are trying to taunt or kite and slow adds.

umm no Blacksmurf. Healing and dps do not pull aggro here is how it works Taunt is a hard ability it works for as long as that counter is going. once it disapates the mob is open to target anyone. you can make the boss immune to taunting by having multiple people apply the taunt. then the boss gain an immunity and will not be tauntable until the taunts are off .

There are no aggro tables in ESO per the devs this has been discussed and answered by the dev team.

@UrQuan and @Wifeaggro13

Guys....healing definately pulls aggro.

Do you all heal as your main spec in PvE dungeons and trials?

If it doesn't pull aggro then please detail exactly why as a healer I'm being targeted by NPCs after a tank taunts. And this isn't occurring due to a 12 second timer or less depending upon the taunt used.

Do u guys remember when the taunt was changed where u would have adverse taunts for using it prior to 12 seconds?

You're wrong. Period. No ifs ands or buts. I do all 3 roles (although only 1 at a time) in virtually all PVE content. You don't ever get aggro from a taunted boss unless it's a mechanic (or boss) that specifically ignores taunts, or unless you apply your own taunt. Edit: I shouldn't just say "unless you apply your own taunt" because if any 2 or more people apply taunts to the same target a total of 3 or more times within 12 seconds then the target becomes temporarily immune to taunts. It takes at least 2 people taunting to do that though, and if only 1 person is taunting it will never happen - it's been that way since Imperial City dropped.

And yes, I remember when over-taunting was a thing. As a tank it took me a while to get used to not having to wait to apply my next taunt.

@UrQuan

Well if I'm wrong then the Xbox one version has been broken since release and before then, I guess when I was on PC, everyone was taunting causing the issue by multiple players.


No.....bud, healing cause aggro. It's not due to bad players or what not. It's cause the game doesn't have an aggro table like some other MMOs but as a healer I get aggro.

That's not debatable.

You're wrong period. That's not debatable. The only reason you (whether on Xbox or any other platform) will ever get aggro from a taunted boss is if it's a mechanic that specifically ignores taunts, or if 2 or more people apply too many taunts within 12 seconds, giving it temporary taunt immunity. You can't magically get aggro from a taunted target by healing. It doesn't happen.

Also I guess you're not aware of when the Xbox version of the game came out. It was before Imperial City, so it was back when a tank could be the only one taunting and still over-taunt. And if you were back on PC before that, that also would have been back when a single person could over-taunt.

The fact of the matter is you simply don't understand the taunt mechanics in ESO. And apparently you never have.

@UrQuan

Whaaat are you even talking about.

Man here's the ESO live - https://youtu.be/At1pt88wa6s

That was prior to console release.
The taunting changes prior were that a tank could overtaunt and it was changed so that a single player couldn't overtaunt but multiple players could still overtaunt.

None of that changed the aggro that a healer would get. The whole reason why overtaunting was occurring is as result of this weird taunt table so to speak.

I've definately been around a or longer than you and definately understand some thing a lot better than you just from keeping on top of things that matter.

Specifically, being a healer in terms of aggro.

Geez man....why do you think ppl complain about the tank not taunting. It's due to the aggro table which is wonky that does draw aggro to the healer and dps.

That's why they removed the overtaunt.
So to get back on topic....

This staff feature helps the magic based builds and also can help in other cases but Ta not a problem because the tank isn't loosing their taunt effectiveness.

UrQuan wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

DoccEff wrote: »

- Gives no debuff on the boss.
- Can't be performed while blocking.
- Will result in newbies taunting away bosses.
- Will result in froststaffs being even worse for PvE.
-> Complete garbage if you want to do anything higher than normal dungeons.

The whole patch is just ridiculous but this change tops everything.

Mind you, the bold part is a potentially big issue.

That just comes down to educating newbies, though, and really it's no different from newbies not knowing that S&B isn't good for DPS and that the first skill in that skill line is a bad one for them to be using as a DPS because it takes aggro from the tank.

How is it a problem?

Healing pulls aggro, a lot of dps pulls aggro and some tanks don't even taunt.

Now the use of the staff allows a ping pong effect.
At worse when ppl are trying to taunt or kite and slow adds.

umm no Blacksmurf. Healing and dps do not pull aggro here is how it works Taunt is a hard ability it works for as long as that counter is going. once it disapates the mob is open to target anyone. you can make the boss immune to taunting by having multiple people apply the taunt. then the boss gain an immunity and will not be tauntable until the taunts are off .

There are no aggro tables in ESO per the devs this has been discussed and answered by the dev team.

@UrQuan and @Wifeaggro13

Guys....healing definately pulls aggro.

Do you all heal as your main spec in PvE dungeons and trials?

If it doesn't pull aggro then please detail exactly why as a healer I'm being targeted by NPCs after a tank taunts. And this isn't occurring due to a 12 second timer or less depending upon the taunt used.

Do u guys remember when the taunt was changed where u would have adverse taunts for using it prior to 12 seconds?

You're wrong. Period. No ifs ands or buts. I do all 3 roles (although only 1 at a time) in virtually all PVE content. You don't ever get aggro from a taunted boss unless it's a mechanic (or boss) that specifically ignores taunts, or unless you apply your own taunt. Edit: I shouldn't just say "unless you apply your own taunt" because if any 2 or more people apply taunts to the same target a total of 3 or more times within 12 seconds then the target becomes temporarily immune to taunts. It takes at least 2 people taunting to do that though, and if only 1 person is taunting it will never happen - it's been that way since Imperial City dropped.

And yes, I remember when over-taunting was a thing. As a tank it took me a while to get used to not having to wait to apply my next taunt.

[SNIp] Dps and healing does in fact get agro, that does not mean the tank can do such a good job that dps and healing does not get agro but there has been plenty of times I have seen my dps or healing pull agro off a tank.

[Edited for Bait]

CosmicSoul wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

DoccEff wrote: »

- Gives no debuff on the boss.
- Can't be performed while blocking.
- Will result in newbies taunting away bosses.
- Will result in froststaffs being even worse for PvE.
-> Complete garbage if you want to do anything higher than normal dungeons.

The whole patch is just ridiculous but this change tops everything.

Mind you, the bold part is a potentially big issue.

That just comes down to educating newbies, though, and really it's no different from newbies not knowing that S&B isn't good for DPS and that the first skill in that skill line is a bad one for them to be using as a DPS because it takes aggro from the tank.

How is it a problem?

Healing pulls aggro, a lot of dps pulls aggro and some tanks don't even taunt.

Now the use of the staff allows a ping pong effect.
At worse when ppl are trying to taunt or kite and slow adds.

umm no Blacksmurf. Healing and dps do not pull aggro here is how it works Taunt is a hard ability it works for as long as that counter is going. once it disapates the mob is open to target anyone. you can make the boss immune to taunting by having multiple people apply the taunt. then the boss gain an immunity and will not be tauntable until the taunts are off .

There are no aggro tables in ESO per the devs this has been discussed and answered by the dev team.

@UrQuan and @Wifeaggro13

Guys....healing definately pulls aggro.

Do you all heal as your main spec in PvE dungeons and trials?

If it doesn't pull aggro then please detail exactly why as a healer I'm being targeted by NPCs after a tank taunts. And this isn't occurring due to a 12 second timer or less depending upon the taunt used.

Do u guys remember when the taunt was changed where u would have adverse taunts for using it prior to 12 seconds?

You're wrong. Period. No ifs ands or buts. I do all 3 roles (although only 1 at a time) in virtually all PVE content. You don't ever get aggro from a taunted boss unless it's a mechanic (or boss) that specifically ignores taunts, or unless you apply your own taunt. Edit: I shouldn't just say "unless you apply your own taunt" because if any 2 or more people apply taunts to the same target a total of 3 or more times within 12 seconds then the target becomes temporarily immune to taunts. It takes at least 2 people taunting to do that though, and if only 1 person is taunting it will never happen - it's been that way since Imperial City dropped.

And yes, I remember when over-taunting was a thing. As a tank it took me a while to get used to not having to wait to apply my next taunt.

I am sorry but are you a twit sir? Dps and healing does in fact get agro, that does not mean the tank can do such a good job that dps and healing does not get agro but there has been plenty of times I have seen my dps or healing pull agro off a tank.

You only get aggro if the tank misses refreshing his taunt, or if it's a mechanic that ignores taunts, or if 2 or more people taunt the same target. That's it.

Those things happen, and when they do you can get aggro from your DPS or your healing. But if the tank keeps taunt up, and there's no mechanic that ignores taunt, and nobody else is taunting, then you'll never draw aggro from that target.

UrQuan wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

DoccEff wrote: »

- Gives no debuff on the boss.
- Can't be performed while blocking.
- Will result in newbies taunting away bosses.
- Will result in froststaffs being even worse for PvE.
-> Complete garbage if you want to do anything higher than normal dungeons.

The whole patch is just ridiculous but this change tops everything.

Mind you, the bold part is a potentially big issue.

That just comes down to educating newbies, though, and really it's no different from newbies not knowing that S&B isn't good for DPS and that the first skill in that skill line is a bad one for them to be using as a DPS because it takes aggro from the tank.

How is it a problem?

Healing pulls aggro, a lot of dps pulls aggro and some tanks don't even taunt.

Now the use of the staff allows a ping pong effect.
At worse when ppl are trying to taunt or kite and slow adds.

umm no Blacksmurf. Healing and dps do not pull aggro here is how it works Taunt is a hard ability it works for as long as that counter is going. once it disapates the mob is open to target anyone. you can make the boss immune to taunting by having multiple people apply the taunt. then the boss gain an immunity and will not be tauntable until the taunts are off .

There are no aggro tables in ESO per the devs this has been discussed and answered by the dev team.

@UrQuan and @Wifeaggro13

Guys....healing definately pulls aggro.

Do you all heal as your main spec in PvE dungeons and trials?

If it doesn't pull aggro then please detail exactly why as a healer I'm being targeted by NPCs after a tank taunts. And this isn't occurring due to a 12 second timer or less depending upon the taunt used.

Do u guys remember when the taunt was changed where u would have adverse taunts for using it prior to 12 seconds?

You're wrong. Period. No ifs ands or buts. I do all 3 roles (although only 1 at a time) in virtually all PVE content. You don't ever get aggro from a taunted boss unless it's a mechanic (or boss) that specifically ignores taunts, or unless you apply your own taunt. Edit: I shouldn't just say "unless you apply your own taunt" because if any 2 or more people apply taunts to the same target a total of 3 or more times within 12 seconds then the target becomes temporarily immune to taunts. It takes at least 2 people taunting to do that though, and if only 1 person is taunting it will never happen - it's been that way since Imperial City dropped.

And yes, I remember when over-taunting was a thing. As a tank it took me a while to get used to not having to wait to apply my next taunt.

@UrQuan

Well if I'm wrong then the Xbox one version has been broken since release and before then, I guess when I was on PC, everyone was taunting causing the issue by multiple players.


No.....bud, healing cause aggro. It's not due to bad players or what not. It's cause the game doesn't have an aggro table like some other MMOs but as a healer I get aggro.

That's not debatable.

You're wrong period. That's not debatable. The only reason you (whether on Xbox or any other platform) will ever get aggro from a taunted boss is if it's a mechanic that specifically ignores taunts, or if 2 or more people apply too many taunts within 12 seconds, giving it temporary taunt immunity. You can't magically get aggro from a taunted target by healing. It doesn't happen.

Also I guess you're not aware of when the Xbox version of the game came out. It was before Imperial City, so it was back when a tank could be the only one taunting and still over-taunt. And if you were back on PC before that, that also would have been back when a single person could over-taunt.

The fact of the matter is you simply don't understand the taunt mechanics in ESO. And apparently you never have.

@UrQuan

Whaaat are you even talking about.

Man here's the ESO live - https://youtu.be/At1pt88wa6s

That was prior to console release.
The taunting changes prior were that a tank could overtaunt and it was changed so that a single player couldn't overtaunt but multiple players could still overtaunt.

None of that changed the aggro that a healer would get. The whole reason why overtaunting was occurring is as result of this weird taunt table so to speak.

I've definately been around a or longer than you and definately understand some thing a lot better than you just from keeping on top of things that matter.

Specifically, being a healer in terms of aggro.

Geez man....why do you think ppl complain about the tank not taunting. It's due to the aggro table which is wonky that does draw aggro to the healer and dps.

That's why they removed the overtaunt.
So to get back on topic....

This staff feature helps the magic based builds and also can help in other cases but Ta not a problem because the tank isn't loosing their taunt effectiveness.

The change to not allow a single player to over-taunt came in with patch 2.1.4 for PC in August of 2015:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/212035/pc-mac-patch-notes-v2-1-4#latest

Patch Notes wrote:

Taunt immunity can no longer be triggered by a single player character taunting the same target.

Two or more player characters who taunt a single target a total of three times among them will still cause the target to become immune.
Taunts from combat pets do not count toward the limit, and pets will no longer taunt targets already taunted by a player character.

That was patch 1.1.0.0 for Xbox:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/216413/xbox-one-patch-notes-v1-1-0-0#latest

But, but, how could it be in a patch for Xbox if it happened before the Xbox version came out? Well, that's because like I said that change was made after the Xbox version came out.

It's simple. You don't ever get aggro on a taunted (but not over-taunted, and not with the taunt expired) target from healing. Ever.

If you're getting aggro, then either the target isn't taunted, or it's a mechanic that ignores taunts, or 2 or more people have taunted it a total of 3 or more times to give it taunt immunity. That's all. By all means though, keep believing that healing magically overrides a taunt (even though it only happens to you), just like you should keep believing that the change to make it so a single player can't over-taunt came before the Xbox version came out. I mean, I probably hacked the forums to add in those patch notes I just linked right?

@UrQuan

So then why even taunt if the dps and healer aren't drawing aggro?

Or as I'm asking in terms of this discussion.....how does this frost staff change hurt anything?

The frost staff doesn't taunt automatically. It taunt if the passive is selected so.....knowing this....ZOS is extending the taunting opportunities for someone.

Either it's read as DPS needs and taunt or that some tanks may use the frost staff to taunt.

Neither are healers

Who is everyone else ranting away from danger? And why do they need to taunt away from the third role.....if the healer doesn't draw aggro?

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I use an ice staff in pvp. The blocking passive is interesting I'll admit, but if I'm expected to use a taunt in pvp I want a magicka tremorscale pls.

A magic tremorscale? You want balance huh? Lol

xXSilverDragonXx wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

It's simple. You don't ever get aggro on a taunted (but not over-taunted, and not with the taunt expired) target from healing. Ever.

Actually, I've got to say on this one that I always get aggro from the blackheart haven final boss with my res staff. No matter how long I wait, I get it. If he is taunted or not. He comes after me then turns me into a skeleton and I hope I get back to my healer before everyone dies. The only way I can avoid it is to never use my res staff on the boss. So as a healer I do pull aggro. You here are saying from 'healing' so if you are talking about tossing out heals, then I have never gotten a taunt as I heal but that res staff, bosses like that.

That's actually a mechanic that specifically ignores taunts. That can hit anyone regardless of whether the boss is taunted, but it seems to me that he usually goes for the character who's farthest away. That last part is based purely on anecdotal evidence though, and it could be that he usually goes after healers. It may be the same as the WGT fight where someone gets locked in a cage in terms of determining who the target is.

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

Clarkieson wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I use an ice staff in pvp. The blocking passive is interesting I'll admit, but if I'm expected to use a taunt in pvp I want a magicka tremorscale pls.

A magic tremorscale? You want balance huh? Lol

I wasn't being serious, should have used an emoji. I was making a point about taunts being useless for a magicka build in pvp. It wouldn't matter if it was a skill you could opt out of but it's actually a passive you'll be missing out on if you choose an ice staff in pvp.

So from that point of view if you use an ice staff in pvp ts effectively been nerfed because you lose out on a passive skill

The silly thing here is that new pve players will maybe use an ice staff, and they may have no knowledge of the game or mechanics. So they will go into group pve content with a tank and not even realize that they are taunting with the heavy attacks they do. It will create a pve mess that tremorscale dps have already started to make

Poor old tank

UrQuan wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

CosmicSoul wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

DoccEff wrote: »

- Gives no debuff on the boss.
- Can't be performed while blocking.
- Will result in newbies taunting away bosses.
- Will result in froststaffs being even worse for PvE.
-> Complete garbage if you want to do anything higher than normal dungeons.

The whole patch is just ridiculous but this change tops everything.

Mind you, the bold part is a potentially big issue.

That just comes down to educating newbies, though, and really it's no different from newbies not knowing that S&B isn't good for DPS and that the first skill in that skill line is a bad one for them to be using as a DPS because it takes aggro from the tank.

How is it a problem?

Healing pulls aggro, a lot of dps pulls aggro and some tanks don't even taunt.

Now the use of the staff allows a ping pong effect.
At worse when ppl are trying to taunt or kite and slow adds.

umm no Blacksmurf. Healing and dps do not pull aggro here is how it works Taunt is a hard ability it works for as long as that counter is going. once it disapates the mob is open to target anyone. you can make the boss immune to taunting by having multiple people apply the taunt. then the boss gain an immunity and will not be tauntable until the taunts are off .

There are no aggro tables in ESO per the devs this has been discussed and answered by the dev team.

@UrQuan and @Wifeaggro13

Guys....healing definately pulls aggro.

Do you all heal as your main spec in PvE dungeons and trials?

If it doesn't pull aggro then please detail exactly why as a healer I'm being targeted by NPCs after a tank taunts. And this isn't occurring due to a 12 second timer or less depending upon the taunt used.

Do u guys remember when the taunt was changed where u would have adverse taunts for using it prior to 12 seconds?

You're wrong. Period. No ifs ands or buts. I do all 3 roles (although only 1 at a time) in virtually all PVE content. You don't ever get aggro from a taunted boss unless it's a mechanic (or boss) that specifically ignores taunts, or unless you apply your own taunt. Edit: I shouldn't just say "unless you apply your own taunt" because if any 2 or more people apply taunts to the same target a total of 3 or more times within 12 seconds then the target becomes temporarily immune to taunts. It takes at least 2 people taunting to do that though, and if only 1 person is taunting it will never happen - it's been that way since Imperial City dropped.

And yes, I remember when over-taunting was a thing. As a tank it took me a while to get used to not having to wait to apply my next taunt.

I am sorry but are you a twit sir? Dps and healing does in fact get agro, that does not mean the tank can do such a good job that dps and healing does not get agro but there has been plenty of times I have seen my dps or healing pull agro off a tank.

You only get aggro if the tank misses refreshing his taunt, or if it's a mechanic that ignores taunts, or if 2 or more people taunt the same target. That's it.

Those things happen, and when they do you can get aggro from your DPS or your healing. But if the tank keeps taunt up, and there's no mechanic that ignores taunt, and nobody else is taunting, then you'll never draw aggro from that target.

Believe what you want dude it literally makes no difference to me, I know my experience and guess what its litetally the same in nearly every other mmorpg I have played.

And you know that the devs have explicitly said it doesn't work the same in ESO as in other MMOs right?

And where does it say agro mechanics do not work the same? It is also my experiences and others that show this.

Clarkieson wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

Clarkieson wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I use an ice staff in pvp. The blocking passive is interesting I'll admit, but if I'm expected to use a taunt in pvp I want a magicka tremorscale pls.

A magic tremorscale? You want balance huh? Lol

I wasn't being serious, should have used an emoji. I was making a point about taunts being useless for a magicka build in pvp. It wouldn't matter if it was a skill you could opt out of but it's actually a passive you'll be missing out on if you choose an ice staff in pvp.

So from that point of view if you use an ice staff in pvp ts effectively been nerfed because you lose out on a passive skill

The silly thing here is that new pve players will maybe use an ice staff, and they may have no knowledge of the game or mechanics. So they will go into group pve content with a tank and not even realize that they are taunting with the heavy attacks they do. It will create a pve mess that tremorscale dps have already started to make

Poor old tank

Yeah I'm not pro proc set so I really don't want to see more. I pve a bit and I use my sharpened vma ice staff there too. I medium weave and it will be interesting to see if the taunt procs off a medium attack or whether it actually has to be a fully charged heavy. To knock down an npc after a successful interrupt you only need a minimum charge medium attack, not that that means anything. I just hope the taunt needs a fully charged heavy.

Just take away the taunt. That's the biggest issue IMO cause if you don't, how could you ever run dungeons and use frost as anything but a tank? Ice was fine the way it was.

jaburns wrote: »

For all of you screaming that the sky is falling: Like @NewBlacksmurf pointed out... the taunt from Ice Staff is a passive. If you don't put points into the passive- it won't taunt.

If people are concerned that newer players (or trolls) my select the passive anyway- I'd suggest that ZoS could put a "disable" on taunting if you're not selected as a tank roll in the group.

@ZOS_RichLambert You can thank me later for that suggestion.

Sometimes as healer I will taunt with Inner Fire in very specific circumstances.

Some big examples:
I will taunt one of the harvesters in Banished Cells II if the tank is inexperienced or doesn't have Inner Fire yet.
Final fight on Dragonstar, as healer I grab the main boss while our tank handles his boss adds.
Some groups request that the healer taunt the final boss of Aetherian Archive.

jaburns wrote: »

For all of you screaming that the sky is falling: Like @NewBlacksmurf pointed out... the taunt from Ice Staff is a passive. If you don't put points into the passive- it won't taunt.

If people are concerned that newer players (or trolls) my select the passive anyway- I'd suggest that ZoS could put a "disable" on taunting if you're not selected as a tank roll in the group.

@ZOS_RichLambert You can thank me later for that suggestion.

Except If you were to use another staff while you level because you don't know which staff to use yet. Or if you got a maelstrom ice staff and use it on you magblade. Now you are screwed. So that really sucks because now your magblade taunts and you can't use it in a trial like you once did. You lost the one good drop you got in your countless runs of VMA because some idiot thought putting a taunt on a random staff would be a smart way to go. Better yet, you could just spend 11k redoing your skill points to remove that passive but you don't get damage bonuses now from trifocus. And so tri focus is now dual focus and your vma ice staff is trash.

It was a stupid move. Shame on ZOS.

If they wanted to try to go in this direction they could have put some balls and smarts into the move and went full on with all staves added a new passive to all stave trees (resto and desto) that makes all staves taunt. Then they would have in one swift and simple move given hybrid desto/sb tanks and templar tanks with resto back bars a much more viable option that now taunts and they no longer have to waste magicka on inner fire. Would have been a pretty good move. But they didn't actually think about it because they don't know the game, the players, the builds people want to do because they never really listen and they don't really care. That is the problem. It's broad and sweeping. It would have only taken a bit of time to look around and see how to make this work in a way that doesn't make it a joke or a headache or mess with people who have ice staves, tri focus and want to keep trifocus, keep using their staves and not become tanks.

@ZOS_RichLambert - why not go all the way, give the staff trees a passive to taunt and see the cool tanks people come up with. Leave trifocus alone and let people who got VMA staves keep using what they have.

SolarCat02 wrote: »

jaburns wrote: »

For all of you screaming that the sky is falling: Like @NewBlacksmurf pointed out... the taunt from Ice Staff is a passive. If you don't put points into the passive- it won't taunt.

If people are concerned that newer players (or trolls) my select the passive anyway- I'd suggest that ZoS could put a "disable" on taunting if you're not selected as a tank roll in the group.

@ZOS_RichLambert You can thank me later for that suggestion.

Sometimes as healer I will taunt with Inner Fire in very specific circumstances.

Some big examples:
I will taunt one of the harvesters in Banished Cells II if the tank is inexperienced or doesn't have Inner Fire yet.
Final fight on Dragonstar, as healer I grab the main boss while our tank handles his boss adds.
Some groups request that the healer taunt the final boss of Aetherian Archive.

In those cases, you'd select the healer and tank role.

Solariken wrote: »

We already have a ranged magicka-based taunt. Why tf are they adding a taunt that basically has a 3s cast time? Seriously wtf is happening here.

Look at the rest around blocking and such. Think of it all as magic 100%

Tryxus wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

DoccEff wrote: »

- Gives no debuff on the boss.
- Can't be performed while blocking.
- Will result in newbies taunting away bosses.
- Will result in froststaffs being even worse for PvE.
-> Complete garbage if you want to do anything higher than normal dungeons.

The whole patch is just ridiculous but this change tops everything.

So you don't see the benefits of regenerating stamina while blocking with your staff, and then swapping to S&B so you can regenerate magicka while blocking with your S&B? Or the benefits of a ranged taunt that replenishes resources instead of costing resources?

Tanking with only staves will be garbage if you want to do anything higher than normal dungeons. Tanking with S&B on one bar and a frost staff on the other will likely become the new tanking meta.

That taunt is the one thing I don't agree with.

I love the changes they made to Frost Staves, and they open up a lot of new possibilities in Cyro.

But in PvE, Frost Staff DPSers are now at risk of taunting the boss. I'm currently using a Master's Ice Staff for both PvP and PvE, since I haven't been lucky enough to obtain a Fire Staff from either arena or an Aether Staff. And now I'm at risk for using it in vet trials due to the taunt they added to it.

Personally, I think they should get rid of the taunt and revert back to the Damage Shield we had (make it stronger maybe?) or have Frost Heavy attacks snare (or remove snares from the caster?) so that the weapon still has useful tanking abilities without compromising the DPSers

The reality is I'm not going to fret over the changes. They're going to do what they're going to do, and from a big picture perspective I am not going to cry over them wanting to offer a magic weapon for magical tanks. Ice seems the right thing for that since Flame and Electric get all the damage bonuses. The details of what this would be tomorrow won't be the same as what it'll be in half a year or next year. Perhaps they should offer something unique for ice staves that allow a choice between magic dps and magic tank? Just a thought. I'm just surprised they didn't have one of the morphs of the skills be where the taunt is placed. That would have allowed both options.