Update 49 is now available for testing on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/categories/pts
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The Meta Isn't Always Fun - Do Your Own Thing
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Gothren✭✭✭✭✭i gonna cut through chase, 20k dps is not low, 20k dps is on point for a non-cheater. only way to beat the 20k dps mark is literally this thing called animation cancelling. now you can say all you want zos dont, care, but news flash, why would zos care when if they did away with animation cancelling most of the game's pop would leave. btw on top of the *** with 1t that tells you the game is dying, the fact they would allow cheating such as animation canceling to exist is also a sign of game dying. you can say i am wrong all you want but end of story is animations were put on skills for a reason, and to bypass those reasons is the definition of cheating.
have you been living under a rock? ZOS likes animation canceling as do most players in game. so no its not cheating.3 -
Wollust✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭i gonna cut through chase, 20k dps is not low, 20k dps is on point for a non-cheater. only way to beat the 20k dps mark is literally this thing called animation cancelling. now you can say all you want zos dont, care, but news flash, why would zos care when if they did away with animation cancelling most of the game's pop would leave. btw on top of the *** with 1t that tells you the game is dying, the fact they would allow cheating such as animation canceling to exist is also a sign of game dying. you can say i am wrong all you want but end of story is animations were put on skills for a reason, and to bypass those reasons is the definition of cheating.
Zos's official stance on animation canceling was that is was an unintended side effect of the combat mechanics, but adds an interesting depth of skill for the game. So they kept it.
So based on those who made the game, you could argue the animations ARE there for a reason like you said. The reason? To animation cancel. /Dropmic
actually they said that about light attack weaving, not animation cancelling. light attack weaving is just doing a light attack, with a skill, not cancelling a skills animation to do another skill then cancel that animation to do anotehr skill pulling of up to 5 skills per second instead of the 1 skill per second designed with animations.
Yeah..... no that's not how it works. You can AC as much as you want, global cooldowns are a thing and by now even the biggest morons should know that AC does not let you skip the global cooldowns.
You should try to learn about the games mechanics first before you go and start a discussion about it.
Edited by Wollust on October 30, 2016 2:44AMSusano'o
Zerg Squad7 -
Phica_Lovic✭✭✭✭WuffyCerulei wrote: »
We know that it is single target. Most "great" DDs can do 25k-40k dps.
We know you WERENT saying 20k dps for a mob, because my healer can pull ~80k dps for a mob.PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
Phica -Max CP - Lvl 50 Argonian Sorc Healer since launch0 -
FrostFallFox✭✭✭✭Why would you be worried about what other people are wearing? You do you and I already did me sooo.\(^-,,-^)/0 -
Rebornlogic✭✭i gonna cut through chase, 20k dps is not low, 20k dps is on point for a non-cheater. only way to beat the 20k dps mark is literally this thing called animation cancelling. now you can say all you want zos dont, care, but news flash, why would zos care when if they did away with animation cancelling most of the game's pop would leave. btw on top of the *** with 1t that tells you the game is dying, the fact they would allow cheating such as animation canceling to exist is also a sign of game dying. you can say i am wrong all you want but end of story is animations were put on skills for a reason, and to bypass those reasons is the definition of cheating.
lol i can push 23k+ just using my skill rotations w/o animation cancelling animation canceling only adds like 1k dps. hope you dont attempt maelstrom. inb4 "i cant do this there is wayyy to many bugs:(" "i shouldnt have to animation cancel (cheat) just to do this:(" let me know if i need to put more " "2 -
Rebornlogic✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »The problem is more setups are not viable, and the game never tells you important steps to maximize DPS, such as animation cancling and buff management, (Which the game does a terrible job of giving help with, with the default UI. When the default UI has a bufftracker, we may finally be able to rest. And by that I mean a decent one, not the visual effects we have now.)
I'd love to make 2handed DPS. I like tanky DPS. But their not viable and if it's not meta people are not interested on working on it. ZOS has allways done this, be it with DPS or tanks, we are pidgeon holed not because it's 'meta'. It became meta because it was one of the only things to be proven effective. (Sidenote, if anyone has a setup for 2H in PVE that pulls 20 or higher DPS holla at me, I''d love to see it.)
You are preaching to the chior, I wish ZOS would overhaul their system and give us sample builds or even fighting styles full of preselect abilities just to give some friggin clue on how to build characters. Many of my friends hate this game not because it's not fun, but because it almost takes joy in not telling you how to hit the DPS numbers it should be hitting.
So yeah, the Meta will dissapear when the game allows more things to be viable. But under our current staff team, it will never happen.
TLDR: I hear you. But until ZOS gives us rigid classes or makes higher DPS easier to achieve or starts actually teaching how to achieve it, people will go with what has been proven to work. We saw great strides with the weapon ultimates, further outlining and giving tools. But until we get more skill lines, or more ways to hit high DPS with fewer buffs, we will see the same old thing.
20k is pretty easy to achieve with 2h . if you have maelstrom or masters bow on off wep0 -
Abeille✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Rebornlogic wrote: »i gonna cut through chase, 20k dps is not low, 20k dps is on point for a non-cheater. only way to beat the 20k dps mark is literally this thing called animation cancelling. now you can say all you want zos dont, care, but news flash, why would zos care when if they did away with animation cancelling most of the game's pop would leave. btw on top of the *** with 1t that tells you the game is dying, the fact they would allow cheating such as animation canceling to exist is also a sign of game dying. you can say i am wrong all you want but end of story is animations were put on skills for a reason, and to bypass those reasons is the definition of cheating.
lol i can push 23k+ just using my skill rotations w/o animation cancelling animation canceling only adds like 1k dps. hope you dont attempt maelstrom. inb4 "i cant do this there is wayyy to many bugs:(" "i shouldnt have to animation cancel (cheat) just to do this:(" let me know if i need to put more " "
You can do vMA with much, MUCH less dps. You just won't get a good score because it will take longer, too.
But maybe you meant that you hope they don't attempt to get top scores? Yeah, that would be the case. But finishing it? They can finish it with 20k. But they might have some issues with resource management without weaving a few heavy attacks here and there, is that what you mean?Just so that everyone knows, my Altmer still can't have black hair. About a dozen of Altmer NPCs in the game have black hair. Just saying.
Meet my characters:Command: Do the thing.
Zadarri, Khajiit Fist of Thalmor: The thing was done, as commanded.
Durza gra-Maghul, Orc blacksmith: The thing was done perfectly, in the most efficient way.
Tegwen, Bosmer troublemaker: You can't prove I didn't do the thing.
Sings-Many-Songs, Argonian fisher: Sure, I'll do the thing... Eventually. Maybe.
Aerindel, Altmer stormcaller: After extensive research, I've come to the conclusion that doing the thing would be a waste of resources.
Liliel, Dunmer pyromancer: Aerindel said I shouldn't do the thing. Something about "resources".
Gyda Snowcaller, Nord cryomancer: I will find a way to do it that won't waste resources and make Aerindel proud of me.
Beatrice Leoriane, Breton vampire: I persuaded someone else into doing the thing. You are welcome, dear.
Sahima, Redguard performer: Doing the thing sounds awfully unpleasant and really not my problem.
Ellaria Valerius, Imperial priestess: I'll pray to the Eight for the thing to be done, if it is Their will.0 -
Rebornlogic✭✭Rebornlogic wrote: »i gonna cut through chase, 20k dps is not low, 20k dps is on point for a non-cheater. only way to beat the 20k dps mark is literally this thing called animation cancelling. now you can say all you want zos dont, care, but news flash, why would zos care when if they did away with animation cancelling most of the game's pop would leave. btw on top of the *** with 1t that tells you the game is dying, the fact they would allow cheating such as animation canceling to exist is also a sign of game dying. you can say i am wrong all you want but end of story is animations were put on skills for a reason, and to bypass those reasons is the definition of cheating.
lol i can push 23k+ just using my skill rotations w/o animation cancelling animation canceling only adds like 1k dps. hope you dont attempt maelstrom. inb4 "i cant do this there is wayyy to many bugs:(" "i shouldnt have to animation cancel (cheat) just to do this:(" let me know if i need to put more " "
You can do vMA with much, MUCH less dps. You just won't get a good score because it will take longer, too.
But maybe you meant that you hope they don't attempt to get top scores? Yeah, that would be the case. But finishing it? They can finish it with 20k. But they might have some issues with resource management without weaving a few heavy attacks here and there, is that what you mean?
my point with it was saying that 20k+ is cheating obviously points out the fact that as a dps there gear/rotations are off. as it can be achieved relevantly easy. so i made a reference to vMA as there gear/skill rotation is most likely not sufficient to clear it0 -
AzuraKin✭✭✭✭✭Rebornlogic wrote: »Rebornlogic wrote: »i gonna cut through chase, 20k dps is not low, 20k dps is on point for a non-cheater. only way to beat the 20k dps mark is literally this thing called animation cancelling. now you can say all you want zos dont, care, but news flash, why would zos care when if they did away with animation cancelling most of the game's pop would leave. btw on top of the *** with 1t that tells you the game is dying, the fact they would allow cheating such as animation canceling to exist is also a sign of game dying. you can say i am wrong all you want but end of story is animations were put on skills for a reason, and to bypass those reasons is the definition of cheating.
lol i can push 23k+ just using my skill rotations w/o animation cancelling animation canceling only adds like 1k dps. hope you dont attempt maelstrom. inb4 "i cant do this there is wayyy to many bugs:(" "i shouldnt have to animation cancel (cheat) just to do this:(" let me know if i need to put more " "
You can do vMA with much, MUCH less dps. You just won't get a good score because it will take longer, too.
But maybe you meant that you hope they don't attempt to get top scores? Yeah, that would be the case. But finishing it? They can finish it with 20k. But they might have some issues with resource management without weaving a few heavy attacks here and there, is that what you mean?
my point with it was saying that 20k+ is cheating obviously points out the fact that as a dps there gear/rotations are off. as it can be achieved relevantly easy. so i made a reference to vMA as there gear/skill rotation is most likely not sufficient to clear it
20k dps is not easily achived, max spell power + max magicka min/maxed builds barely hit during the burst phase of entropy - meteor - high damage dot - direct damage skill to execute -execute in a 20s fight in trials without cheating. cheating is bypassing systems of limitation. it doesnt matter wether zos cares or not about people bypassing the system, its still cheating. saying zos doesnt care so its not cheating is like saying, stealing the answers to the math test to get 100 on the test isnt cheating if the teacher doesnt care.v160 spellsword (nightblade)
v160 restoration archmage (Templar)
v160 battlemage (sorcerer)
v160 restoration archmage (Templar)
v160 warrior (DragonKnight)
v160 assassin (nightblade)
v160 swordsman (sorcerer)
v160 spellsword (nightblade)2 -
BlanketFort✭✭✭✭EDIT: ignore. Just ignore
quoted and posted in wrong thread. Edited by BlanketFort on October 30, 2016 8:27AM0 -
Rune_Relic✭✭✭✭✭
✭Problem is people play stupid builds and then DEMAND that the most difficult content be completable with it.
You wanna play a pet sorcerer hybrid with bow, fine with me, go do normal dungeons, but stay away from difficult content.lordrichter wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »WuffyCerulei wrote: »A lot of times, I see 99.99% of builds for ESO are very much meta and dry-cut. Magicka builds: you HAVE to be Altmer, Breton, or Dunmer. Stamina builds: you HAVE to be Orc or Redguard. Yes, these races all have decent passives for their builds, but it leaves everything feeling the same. You don't see much with creative builds anymore. It's all Twice-Born this or Vicious Ophidian that. People, get creative with your builds. Wanna be a butt-kicking khajiit magicka templar with high damage or a tanky altmer, you can find many ways to get that build to work. Heck, I'm getting a magicka khajiit sorcerer with 40k magicka and 20k dps. Don't let it seem you have to do a meta build to be good. ESO has many many possibilities with builds, especially with One Tamriel.
20k dps is pretty low.
Most of my characters barely get 15k single target, and then only if the combat is entirely burst and the target goes down right away. And.. I don't care, because even 4-8k average DPS during a long combat from a level 10 is sufficient for the vast majority of the game.
LOL.
But this is the problem....
..why shouldnt/isnt pet sorc hybrid competitive ?
Why cant a team be created around such a build ?
ZOS imbalance denies content.
Player intolerance/bigotry denies content.
Both need to end.Edited by Rune_Relic on October 30, 2016 8:55AMAnything that can be exploited will be exploited6 -
SublimeSparo✭✭✭✭✭Rebornlogic wrote: »Rebornlogic wrote: »i gonna cut through chase, 20k dps is not low, 20k dps is on point for a non-cheater. only way to beat the 20k dps mark is literally this thing called animation cancelling. now you can say all you want zos dont, care, but news flash, why would zos care when if they did away with animation cancelling most of the game's pop would leave. btw on top of the *** with 1t that tells you the game is dying, the fact they would allow cheating such as animation canceling to exist is also a sign of game dying. you can say i am wrong all you want but end of story is animations were put on skills for a reason, and to bypass those reasons is the definition of cheating.
lol i can push 23k+ just using my skill rotations w/o animation cancelling animation canceling only adds like 1k dps. hope you dont attempt maelstrom. inb4 "i cant do this there is wayyy to many bugs:(" "i shouldnt have to animation cancel (cheat) just to do this:(" let me know if i need to put more " "
You can do vMA with much, MUCH less dps. You just won't get a good score because it will take longer, too.
But maybe you meant that you hope they don't attempt to get top scores? Yeah, that would be the case. But finishing it? They can finish it with 20k. But they might have some issues with resource management without weaving a few heavy attacks here and there, is that what you mean?
my point with it was saying that 20k+ is cheating obviously points out the fact that as a dps there gear/rotations are off. as it can be achieved relevantly easy. so i made a reference to vMA as there gear/skill rotation is most likely not sufficient to clear it
20k dps is not easily achived, max spell power + max magicka min/maxed builds barely hit during the burst phase of entropy - meteor - high damage dot - direct damage skill to execute -execute in a 20s fight in trials without cheating. cheating is bypassing systems of limitation. it doesnt matter wether zos cares or not about people bypassing the system, its still cheating. saying zos doesnt care so its not cheating is like saying, stealing the answers to the math test to get 100 on the test isnt cheating if the teacher doesnt care.
Lets do some rough math:
Dots
Wall of elements ~3k per second
Liquid Lightning ~5k per second
Velocious Curse ~20k per 3.5s (6k per second roughly)
Spammables
Force Pulse ~3x5k per second + Light attack ~4k weaved
Procs
Crystal frags on proc ~30k every 5s roughly (6k per second roughly)
It's too early to do proper maths but at the most basic-
Placing wall of elements and liquid lightning followed by light attack weaved force pulse will get you ~20k dps
Adding curse and proc'd frags in probably gets you closer to 30k
Now add ultimates, monster set procs and raid buffs in and you get up to the 40k+ territory
Edited by SublimeSparo on October 30, 2016 9:41AMPS4 EU CP900. PS4 NA CP600,
vAA HM ☆ vHRC HM ☆ vSO HM ☆ vMOL
4th Console vMOL clear,
vMA cleared on all classes stam & magic
My TribeEU
High Sparo - Altmer - mSo DD.
Wood Sparo - Bosmer - sNB DD
Nord Sparo - Nord -sDK DD/Tank.
Bubble Girl - Imperial -sTe DD
Succubus Sue - Breton - mNB Tank.
Andrana Stormlock - Altmer - mTe Healer/ DD
Elvali Marvani - Dunmer - mDK DD.
Venemus Draconem - Redguard - sDK DD
Jayri Leki - Redguard - sSo DD.
Miss Jabsalot - Altmer - mTe PvP DD/ Tank
Mireli Hlaano - Dunmer - mNB DD.
Ms Shanks - Redguard - sNB DD/ le bank
NA
Dilemma Dame - Altmer - mDK DD
Stamsorc Kitty - Redguard - sSor DD
Aia Draconis - Imperial - sDK Tank
Decides-Who-Lives - Argonian - mTe Healer
You wont stop me - Altmer - mSo DD
Stab in the dark - Khajiit - sNB DD
Jabjabjab Beambeambeam - Dunmer - mTe DD
Spatium Auxiliarus - Imperial - hTe Tank&bank
Spectre - Altmer - mNB DD
Can't-Main-Tank -Argonian - sDK offTank3 -
BlackEar✭✭✭✭✭Just because guides mention that running Altmer or Breton is the best race for that particular build does not mean you HAVE to do it. Hence the word "guide". I've read tons of guides and nowhere does it state "you must comply to play this race or forfeit to use this guide".
I am playing how I want, that does not mean that when I read a guide I want only subpar options. I choose and pick to my own liking but I like that my guide highlights what to do to maximise my DPS.
Tl;dr: The meta is a guideline. Never was anthing else, and people complaining about it read too much into guides being the absolute truth.Bjorn Blackbear - Master Angler - Collector - Black Market Mogul - Ebonheart Pact - Exterminatus - EU.
Achievement hunter:
Visit my profile page to find out about which achievement I am currently hunting.
Check out Anemonean's thieving guide!6 -
MaselClass RepresentativeJust because guides mention that running Altmer or Breton is the best race for that particular build does not mean you HAVE to do it. Hence the word "guide". I've read tons of guides and nowhere does it state "you must comply to play this race or forfeit to use this guide".
I am playing how I want, that does not mean that when I read a guide I want only subpar options. I choose and pick to my own liking but I like that my guide highlights what to do to maximise my DPS.
Tl;dr: The meta is a guideline. Never was anthing else, and people complaining about it read too much into guides being the absolute truth.
This. You don't need the ideal damage to complete everything in ESO, it just makes it faster and easier. For vDSA for example, two dds with 20k dps are sufficient. You don't even need more than 10k dps in vMA as long as you follow the mechanics and stay alive. In group play, you just need to accept that the group also depends on your performance, so it's understandable that others get frustrated when there are people using ineffective builds and slowing everyone down, because it's their time that you take,especially in vet trials.PC EU
All Trial Trifecta Titles Done!
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChVEG6ckuAgGs5OyA6VeisA1 -
notimetocare✭✭✭✭✭
✭leepalmer95 wrote: »WuffyCerulei wrote: »A lot of times, I see 99.99% of builds for ESO are very much meta and dry-cut. Magicka builds: you HAVE to be Altmer, Breton, or Dunmer. Stamina builds: you HAVE to be Orc or Redguard. Yes, these races all have decent passives for their builds, but it leaves everything feeling the same. You don't see much with creative builds anymore. It's all Twice-Born this or Vicious Ophidian that. People, get creative with your builds. Wanna be a butt-kicking khajiit magicka templar with high damage or a tanky altmer, you can find many ways to get that build to work. Heck, I'm getting a magicka khajiit sorcerer with 40k magicka and 20k dps. Don't let it seem you have to do a meta build to be good. ESO has many many possibilities with builds, especially with One Tamriel.
20k dps is pretty low.
For dps not spammed with warhorn? Thats perfectly fine and barely behind otherwise.3 -
Lava_Croft✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭The amount of absolute scrubs in this thread should both warm Wrobel's heart as well as instill fear into the hearts of people wanting to be challenged by ESO's content.
Time to make to game easier, Wrobel!5 -
RazorCaltrops✭✭✭It seems play the way you want disease is more common than people think.
You already have %99.9 of the game. Being unable to find a dps slot with dreugh king slayer or hybrid heal tank templar in %0.1 of the content shouldn't hurt people.PS4 EU3 -
LEGENDARYYY✭✭✭✭i gonna cut through chase, 20k dps is not low, 20k dps is on point for a non-cheater. only way to beat the 20k dps mark is literally this thing called animation cancelling. now you can say all you want zos dont, care, but news flash, why would zos care when if they did away with animation cancelling most of the game's pop would leave. btw on top of the *** with 1t that tells you the game is dying, the fact they would allow cheating such as animation canceling to exist is also a sign of game dying. you can say i am wrong all you want but end of story is animations were put on skills for a reason, and to bypass those reasons is the definition of cheating.
I almost passed out reading this. I mean, you can use one or two skills and maintain 25k+ dps without light attacking at all. Open your eyes man.Edited by LEGENDARYYY on October 30, 2016 4:32PMCP capped.
EP - Nord - Eystein Blodsbringar - Tristat DK Tank
EP - Nord - Eyjolf Blodsbringar - Stamina NB PvPer
EP - Argonian - Tired-Of-Cats - Magicka Sorc PvPer
EP - Khajit - Cutepaws - Banker
EP - Redguard - Jathod Trearan - Stamina DK DD
EP - Redgaurd - Dhenus Okzhat-Si - Stamina Sorcerer DD (vMSA toon, 569K)
EP - Altmer - Haqsin - Magicka Sorc DD
EP - Altmer - Minia Feaine - Templar Healer
+ about 20 deleted alts
GM of Pact Veteran Trade (Craglorn), Traders of the Ebonheart (Mournhold), Pact Veteran Trade II (Mournhold)
All part of the "Akatosh Imperium".
Want competitive Cyrodiil? Support THIS thread.
Me soloing Veteran Elden Hollow and AA: HERE4 -
LEGENDARYYY✭✭✭✭notimetocare wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »WuffyCerulei wrote: »A lot of times, I see 99.99% of builds for ESO are very much meta and dry-cut. Magicka builds: you HAVE to be Altmer, Breton, or Dunmer. Stamina builds: you HAVE to be Orc or Redguard. Yes, these races all have decent passives for their builds, but it leaves everything feeling the same. You don't see much with creative builds anymore. It's all Twice-Born this or Vicious Ophidian that. People, get creative with your builds. Wanna be a butt-kicking khajiit magicka templar with high damage or a tanky altmer, you can find many ways to get that build to work. Heck, I'm getting a magicka khajiit sorcerer with 40k magicka and 20k dps. Don't let it seem you have to do a meta build to be good. ESO has many many possibilities with builds, especially with One Tamriel.
20k dps is pretty low.
For dps not spammed with warhorn? Thats perfectly fine and barely behind otherwise.
Have you been living under a rock since launch?
itll take som time to get there, but anything less than 30k single is not fine atm. Edited by LEGENDARYYY on October 30, 2016 5:36PMCP capped.
EP - Nord - Eystein Blodsbringar - Tristat DK Tank
EP - Nord - Eyjolf Blodsbringar - Stamina NB PvPer
EP - Argonian - Tired-Of-Cats - Magicka Sorc PvPer
EP - Khajit - Cutepaws - Banker
EP - Redguard - Jathod Trearan - Stamina DK DD
EP - Redgaurd - Dhenus Okzhat-Si - Stamina Sorcerer DD (vMSA toon, 569K)
EP - Altmer - Haqsin - Magicka Sorc DD
EP - Altmer - Minia Feaine - Templar Healer
+ about 20 deleted alts
GM of Pact Veteran Trade (Craglorn), Traders of the Ebonheart (Mournhold), Pact Veteran Trade II (Mournhold)
All part of the "Akatosh Imperium".
Want competitive Cyrodiil? Support THIS thread.
Me soloing Veteran Elden Hollow and AA: HERE1 -
Florial✭✭✭This. You don't need the ideal damage to complete everything in ESO, it just makes it faster and easier. For vDSA for example, two dds with 20k dps are sufficient. You don't even need more than 10k dps in vMA as long as you follow the mechanics and stay alive. In group play, you just need to accept that the group also depends on your performance, so it's understandable that others get frustrated when there are people using ineffective builds and slowing everyone down, because it's their time that you take,especially in vet trials.
You make a good point here. One additional thing I would like to add is that it isn't all about builds either. I'm really starting to get into dungeons and am healing in all normals to get the lay of the land before getting into only vets. One thing I've noticed is that you can have the best of builds, pump out massive amounts of DPS, etc. However so many folks are terrible at self survival tools like blocking or dodging. Forgetting these basics is really frustrating for the whole group, especially the healer. I am always amused when I queue up for a run and the low level guy or gal, without all the skills, is staying alive versus some of the glass canons I encounter who simply can't stay out of the red, blue or whatever bad stuff is flying around. I would rather deal a low DPS group that survives versus a high DPS group that can't stay alive.
4 -
MaselClass RepresentativeLEGENDARYYY wrote: »notimetocare wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »WuffyCerulei wrote: »A lot of times, I see 99.99% of builds for ESO are very much meta and dry-cut. Magicka builds: you HAVE to be Altmer, Breton, or Dunmer. Stamina builds: you HAVE to be Orc or Redguard. Yes, these races all have decent passives for their builds, but it leaves everything feeling the same. You don't see much with creative builds anymore. It's all Twice-Born this or Vicious Ophidian that. People, get creative with your builds. Wanna be a butt-kicking khajiit magicka templar with high damage or a tanky altmer, you can find many ways to get that build to work. Heck, I'm getting a magicka khajiit sorcerer with 40k magicka and 20k dps. Don't let it seem you have to do a meta build to be good. ESO has many many possibilities with builds, especially with One Tamriel.
20k dps is pretty low.
For dps not spammed with warhorn? Thats perfectly fine and barely behind otherwise.
Have you been living under a rock since launch? itll take som time to get there, but anything less than 30k single is not fine atm.
Do you mean 30k in a buffed trial situation or 30k on pure single target, E.g. bloodspawn testing? Because 30k nontrial is basically as far as you can get without vma weapons & perfect rotations. And that includes functioning as a robot and training a fixed rota, which takes out the fun in playing if you ask me. Don't get me wrong, I've done all endgame content and trained rotations myself, but I find that just boring and annoying. Many people, especially beginners I know, compare their numbers to guides and builds from raidguildies, which is simply unreachable for the regular player and not needed for anything in the game.PC EU
All Trial Trifecta Titles Done!
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChVEG6ckuAgGs5OyA6VeisA6 -
Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭SublimeSparo wrote: »
Lets do some rough math:
Dots
Wall of elements ~3k per second
Liquid Lightning ~5k per second
Velocious Curse ~20k per 3.5s (6k per second roughly)
Spammables
Force Pulse ~3x5k per second + Light attack ~4k weaved
Procs
Crystal frags on proc ~30k every 5s roughly (6k per second roughly)
It's too early to do proper maths but at the most basic-
Placing wall of elements and liquid lightning followed by light attack weaved force pulse will get you ~20k dps
Adding curse and proc'd frags in probably gets you closer to 30k
Now add ultimates, monster set procs and raid buffs in and you get up to the 40k+ territory
The bolded items are why I think that the typical DPS for the typical player is right in the 4-8k range, and that is plenty to kill most overworld mobs solo and even handle delves solo, if something like a pet can distract them away from you or you can CC them.
AoE DoTs are dependent upon the target sticking in those areas, which can get tricky at times, so often I see things like Liquid Lightning off to the side where some mob used to be. If the mobs gets out of the red, that is a problem. Yes, it comes down to L2P, but as I said before, if they can kill what they need to kill, they pretty much have.
Sadly, the curses are only available later in the character's development.
Another thread talked about one bar vs two bars, and that is also an issue. The bars do not necessarily swap when told to swap, and if the player is not expecting this, they could be spamming "molten armaments" or some other such waste of time. I see this as a reason why many players really do not effectively use the second bar during combat. And, yes, they can get away with that because enough DPS can be put on the main bar to get by a lot of mobs solo, more if they are playing in a group that can draw upon more DPS.
I think that the 2 weapon bars were intended to be used for "build options" so that someone could use Bar 1 in one scenario and Bar 2 in another. I figure we surprised them by attempting to swap the bars during combat, and while they have done thing to make that viable, I think there are still glitches in that.XBox EU/NA:@ElsonsoJannus
PC NA/EU: @Elsonso
PSN NA/EU: @ElsonsoJannus
Total in-game hours: 11321
X/Twitter: ElsonsoJannus3 -
AnnieBeGood✭✭✭✭1. Did I kill the monster?
2. Am I still alive?
Are the only things I count when I fight.
1. Did they kill the monster?
2. Are they still alive?
Are the only things I count when I am healing.Gulrosa V160 Templar -healer and master crafter
Annie Spaceshifter V160 magica NB - just a thieving assassin, now retired
Katerina - 'Daedric Annie' - V160 Stamina DK - now bank alt, wardrobe mistress
Anni Bee - Vet 160Templar - pvp magica templar - Daedric Lord Slayer
Lily Malone - stam sorc - pve goddess
Rey of Jakku Plain - Vet 160 - magica templar dd
Savanna - magica warden, still learning to play
and several babies...... learning to ride
EU server, pc and All for the Pact
Alith, the best guild in the EU4 -
cpuScientist✭✭✭✭✭
✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »To the people going "Game is fine, git gud scrubs"
It's not fine. It's reallly not. Just because the system quote "Works" Unquote does not mean it's a good system. Ramping up the difficulty and demanding players do the hardest content to maximize DPS when it should -only- be needed for trials, (And oh god was this game in better shape before those ever came around) and not dungeons.
With One Tamriel, ZOS has *** the happy ballance they were going for, and now no one is happy. I wish, that they would look at the mess they created and fix it sooner rather than later. For now, I wait for them to make the build I have made, have fought hard to make viable and fun, to be made unplayable so I can leave this game. I dont have any other MMO's to go to, so, this will simply be....where I leave.
I'm happy. So are many others I know.but to you we are no one 0 -
MIZRETH✭✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »To the people going "Game is fine, git gud scrubs"
It's not fine. It's reallly not. Just because the system quote "Works" Unquote does not mean it's a good system. Ramping up the difficulty and demanding players do the hardest content to maximize DPS when it should -only- be needed for trials, (And oh god was this game in better shape before those ever came around) and not dungeons.
With One Tamriel, ZOS has *** the happy ballance they were going for, and now no one is happy. I wish, that they would look at the mess they created and fix it sooner rather than later. For now, I wait for them to make the build I have made, have fought hard to make viable and fun, to be made unplayable so I can leave this game. I dont have any other MMO's to go to, so, this will simply be....where I leave.
Neverwinter D&D on PS4 (or XB1) and it's FREE! That's what I've been subbing for ESO lately. I went from a daily player spending cash monthly on this game to logging on to do some guild stuff every couple days (because I've been running the guild for over a year now and I need to support my guildies) but as far as "playing" ESO, not going to happen until they repeal OWT. We just decided to go multi-game and spend our time & money on other PS4 games.Edited by MIZRETH on October 30, 2016 11:03PMMIZRETH
The Dollar Tree Guild
XBOX SERIES X0 -
DocFrost72✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Next time I see someone calling 20k sustained DPS low, I'm going to scream. BARRING DLC hard mode 4 man's and vet trials, that is well above what you need...5 -
Zagnut123Zagnut123✭✭✭✭i gonna cut through chase, 20k dps is not low, 20k dps is on point for a non-cheater. only way to beat the 20k dps mark is literally this thing called animation cancelling. now you can say all you want zos dont, care, but news flash, why would zos care when if they did away with animation cancelling most of the game's pop would leave. btw on top of the *** with 1t that tells you the game is dying, the fact they would allow cheating such as animation canceling to exist is also a sign of game dying. you can say i am wrong all you want but end of story is animations were put on skills for a reason, and to bypass those reasons is the definition of cheating.
High dps isnt from animation cancelling. Its from a perfect rotation and weaving in light heavy attacks. Animation cancelling is a pvp thing so if you want to complain about it in that aspect you can but in pve It makes little sences to be constantly animation cancelling. Also it isn't a bug or a cheat if you don't like it dont do it but the developers have claimed its here to stay.0 -
AuldWolf✭✭✭✭✭This thread is a brilliantly shining example of why it's harmful for ZOS to cater to elitists, who'll alienate and scare off paying customers. Basically, hostile minorities (obnoxious PvP duel trolls, hardcore elitists, et cetera) will kill a game faster than anything else. They killed Champions Online. They killed Battleborn. And if ZOS isn't careful, they'll kill ESO.
I can't stop worrying about this. I keep seeing the pattern repeating, over and over. So many games have died thanks to this.6 -
kevlarto_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭To me the real shame is there even is a meta, I see posts about how people want to be different in a sea where everything looks alike or plays a like, the meta limits your game play and pigeon holes you to play a particular way, so much for play the way you want the meta kills that. I refuse to embrace the meta fully some things you just can't get around, but I find a certain amount of satisfaction in my game play killing meta players and fotm's in pvp.1
