is this game getting too easy?

Frawr · October 2016

Game got easy about 2 years ago or earlier. Really a shame. It was easy long before CP.

Doshia for example. A big scary boss and one of the first that you find on the main questlines.

she has 2k health. 2k.

the level 5 boss in the level 3 story quest in daggerfall has 5k HP.

incidentally, i don't want this changed. that boss feels like an actual fight. it is a good fight in white gear without CP.

Doshia is a joke even in white gear and without CP.

I guess that this is symptomatic of a company trying to make a game accessible based on measures and spreadsheets. The target audience is, I assume, players who are relatively new to the concept of wasd movement and pointing with a mouse.

I had a guildie who I sat with and explained movement and aiming and use of destro staff. Her playstyle dramatically improved as a result. This does go to show that the game isn't necessarily easy for everyone. Perhaps their target audience is actually players who are new to video games...

Quite why you would choose to take an existing IP and target new gamers is beyond me.

Wolfenbelle · October 2016

Game is not too easy. Some people (like me) enjoy being able to clear content quickly without dying frequently. My playing time is very limited, so getting through content quickly means a lot to me.

kamimark · October 2016

The game is fairly easy, and so much easier than it used to be, but many players are unskilled, and ZOS does nothing to teach gameplay.

I miss Doshia being an impossible barrier until you learned to play and the Feast mechanics, and even then was no joke.

LaiTash · October 2016

ArchMikem wrote: »

LaiTash wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

Milvan wrote: »

I'm not a totally pro, I actually suck at it and I think the game is very casual oriented (AKA easy).

And there's nothing wrong with that.

It's boring. Boring is wrong.

Boring is relative, as different people find excitement in varying degrees. What's boring to you is still enjoyable to others.

Yeah i know there are people who find it exciting to have a press x to win button everywhere.

Frawr · October 2016

Wolfenbelle wrote: »

Game is not too easy. Some people (like me) enjoy being able to clear content quickly without dying frequently. My playing time is very limited, so getting through content quickly means a lot to me.

This is the point isn't it.

You are their target audience. Fair enough.

I guess that it is also easier to make content for this audience because they digest it slower and are more satisfied by it.

I would appreciate a little more challenge though. it starts out easy and remains so.

charley222 · October 2016

i`m the first a few day ago saying this patch is the best ever but i`m worng , the map scaling and the game look a little bit harder maybe 5 % and really enjoy this, but after trying the new set character become half god , this game become a real joke everything is so easy pure dps build just kill normal monster in1 hit , mini boss take 3 hit

world boss 10 hit lol
this patch have nice stuff but the new set are so overpower , this game will offer anymore challenge after 1 or 2 month terrible job for the one balancing this game or maybe they looking for very casual gameplay , thank you

raidentenshu_ESO · October 2016

Daran_Cousland wrote: »

or are my skills just too awesome for this game?

Show us a video of you soloing vMOL with your awesome skills

Banana · October 2016

Not me. I die all the time

Lava_Croft · October 2016

Frawr wrote: »

Wolfenbelle wrote: »

Game is not too easy. Some people (like me) enjoy being able to clear content quickly without dying frequently. My playing time is very limited, so getting through content quickly means a lot to me.

This is the point isn't it.

You are their target audience. Fair enough.

I guess that it is also easier to make content for this audience because they digest it slower and are more satisfied by it.

I would appreciate a little more challenge though. it starts out easy and remains so.

I remember the joy over the challenge that the Veteran zones provided before they got nerfed into the ground.

Doctordarkspawn · October 2016

Frawr wrote: »

Game got easy about 2 years ago or earlier. Really a shame. It was easy long before CP.

Doshia for example. A big scary boss and one of the first that you find on the main questlines.

she has 2k health. 2k.

the level 5 boss in the level 3 story quest in daggerfall has 5k HP.

incidentally, i don't want this changed. that boss feels like an actual fight. it is a good fight in white gear without CP.

Doshia is a joke even in white gear and without CP.

I guess that this is symptomatic of a company trying to make a game accessible based on measures and spreadsheets. The target audience is, I assume, players who are relatively new to the concept of wasd movement and pointing with a mouse.

I had a guildie who I sat with and explained movement and aiming and use of destro staff. Her playstyle dramatically improved as a result. This does go to show that the game isn't necessarily easy for everyone. Perhaps their target audience is actually players who are new to video games...

Quite why you would choose to take an existing IP and target new gamers is beyond me.

If you seriously want Doshia to be hard again, you want to drive away most of the playerbase. Battles. Pick them please.

The base game difficulty is why I left three years ago.

Lava_Croft · October 2016

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Frawr wrote: »

Game got easy about 2 years ago or earlier. Really a shame. It was easy long before CP.

Doshia for example. A big scary boss and one of the first that you find on the main questlines.

she has 2k health. 2k.

the level 5 boss in the level 3 story quest in daggerfall has 5k HP.

incidentally, i don't want this changed. that boss feels like an actual fight. it is a good fight in white gear without CP.

Doshia is a joke even in white gear and without CP.

I guess that this is symptomatic of a company trying to make a game accessible based on measures and spreadsheets. The target audience is, I assume, players who are relatively new to the concept of wasd movement and pointing with a mouse.

I had a guildie who I sat with and explained movement and aiming and use of destro staff. Her playstyle dramatically improved as a result. This does go to show that the game isn't necessarily easy for everyone. Perhaps their target audience is actually players who are new to video games...

Quite why you would choose to take an existing IP and target new gamers is beyond me.

If you seriously want Doshia to be hard again, you want to drive away most of the playerbase. Battles. Pick them please.

If most of the player base is not able to beat old Doshia, I wonder if we are playing Candy Crush or ESO.

Doctordarkspawn · October 2016

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Frawr wrote: »

Game got easy about 2 years ago or earlier. Really a shame. It was easy long before CP.

Doshia for example. A big scary boss and one of the first that you find on the main questlines.

she has 2k health. 2k.

the level 5 boss in the level 3 story quest in daggerfall has 5k HP.

incidentally, i don't want this changed. that boss feels like an actual fight. it is a good fight in white gear without CP.

Doshia is a joke even in white gear and without CP.

I guess that this is symptomatic of a company trying to make a game accessible based on measures and spreadsheets. The target audience is, I assume, players who are relatively new to the concept of wasd movement and pointing with a mouse.

I had a guildie who I sat with and explained movement and aiming and use of destro staff. Her playstyle dramatically improved as a result. This does go to show that the game isn't necessarily easy for everyone. Perhaps their target audience is actually players who are new to video games...

Quite why you would choose to take an existing IP and target new gamers is beyond me.

If you seriously want Doshia to be hard again, you want to drive away most of the playerbase. Battles. Pick them please.

If most of the player base is not able to beat old Doshia, I wonder if we are playing Candy Crush or ESO.

A gross exaggeration for people who cannot entertain the notion that different people have different tastes for five seconds.

You are not worthy of further discussion. And you will not be until you grow the ability to become reasonable.

eserras7b16_ESO · October 2016

Daran_Cousland wrote: »

or are my skills just too awesome for this game?

Did you complete vMA? My answer will change depending on the answer.

Lava_Croft · October 2016

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Frawr wrote: »

Game got easy about 2 years ago or earlier. Really a shame. It was easy long before CP.

Doshia for example. A big scary boss and one of the first that you find on the main questlines.

she has 2k health. 2k.

the level 5 boss in the level 3 story quest in daggerfall has 5k HP.

incidentally, i don't want this changed. that boss feels like an actual fight. it is a good fight in white gear without CP.

Doshia is a joke even in white gear and without CP.

I guess that this is symptomatic of a company trying to make a game accessible based on measures and spreadsheets. The target audience is, I assume, players who are relatively new to the concept of wasd movement and pointing with a mouse.

I had a guildie who I sat with and explained movement and aiming and use of destro staff. Her playstyle dramatically improved as a result. This does go to show that the game isn't necessarily easy for everyone. Perhaps their target audience is actually players who are new to video games...

Quite why you would choose to take an existing IP and target new gamers is beyond me.

If you seriously want Doshia to be hard again, you want to drive away most of the playerbase. Battles. Pick them please.

If most of the player base is not able to beat old Doshia, I wonder if we are playing Candy Crush or ESO.

A gross exaggeration for people who cannot entertain the notion that different people have different tastes for five seconds.

You are not worthy of further discussion. And you will not be until you grow the ability to become reasonable.

So pulling a random statement like "drive away most of the player base" out of your behind is in no way a gross exaggeration, but me countering your argument with a similar piece of hyperbole gets you all agitated.

I'd take some of that 'reason' yourself.

gel214thb14_ESO · October 2016

Lava_Croft wrote: »

So pulling a random statement like "drive away most of the player base" out of your behind is in no way a gross exaggeration, but me countering your argument with a similar piece of hyperbole gets you all agitated.

I'd take some of that 'reason' yourself.

Actually a few polls done recently, informal of course, showed the majority like the changes.

Lava_Croft · October 2016

gel214thb14_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

So pulling a random statement like "drive away most of the player base" out of your behind is in no way a gross exaggeration, but me countering your argument with a similar piece of hyperbole gets you all agitated.

I'd take some of that 'reason' yourself.

Actually a few polls done recently, informal of course, showed the majority like the changes.

I think you're confused. We were talking about Doshia's difficulty. I doubt there have been a few recent polls about that specific subject.

Frawr · October 2016

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Frawr wrote: »

Game got easy about 2 years ago or earlier. Really a shame. It was easy long before CP.

Doshia for example. A big scary boss and one of the first that you find on the main questlines.

she has 2k health. 2k.

the level 5 boss in the level 3 story quest in daggerfall has 5k HP.

incidentally, i don't want this changed. that boss feels like an actual fight. it is a good fight in white gear without CP.

Doshia is a joke even in white gear and without CP.

I guess that this is symptomatic of a company trying to make a game accessible based on measures and spreadsheets. The target audience is, I assume, players who are relatively new to the concept of wasd movement and pointing with a mouse.

I had a guildie who I sat with and explained movement and aiming and use of destro staff. Her playstyle dramatically improved as a result. This does go to show that the game isn't necessarily easy for everyone. Perhaps their target audience is actually players who are new to video games...

Quite why you would choose to take an existing IP and target new gamers is beyond me.

If you seriously want Doshia to be hard again, you want to drive away most of the playerbase. Battles. Pick them please.

The base game difficulty is why I left three years ago.

Please define 'most'. It seems quite hyperbolic.

I struggle comprehend the game through your eyes. I didn't find it that difficult. It took a few attempts to work out what to do but it was a challenge rather than an issue over which to quit. Now, by comparison, I find it to be a joke. Granted, I understand how harvesters work and I am able to block and dodge as necessary, but that wasn't particularly different before the nerf either. It took longer and required concentration.

greylox · October 2016

ArchMikem wrote: »

LaiTash wrote: »

gel214thb14_ESO wrote: »

No. I'm finding it tough going with level 10 characters. At the end of most quest lines is a boss that I have trouble beating solo with a magicka Templar or a Magicka Sorcerer.

Sure, i understand it's not that easy for lowbies, but you are not going to be level 10 forever. Actually, you'll spend most of your game time with cp160+.

I'm not an "elite" min-max player, i don't play by the meta, and i hardly deal 10k dps single-target on my cp160 magsorc. Still i find the overland content waaaaay to easy,

Go to Rivenspire and find an area boss thats in a ruined tower made up of a caster and 2 skeletons, one physical and one magic. Id like to know your opinion and the difficulty of that one.

All world bosses can be soloe'd, that one included. It's a medium difficulty one imo, there's harder.

akl77 · October 2016

When you are grouped with tank who is not a tank, healer who is not healing, dps no aoe attack, all on low levels like 10 and doing vet ICP or Mazzatun, this is harder than dark souls, hopeless, you can just quit.

BlackguardBob · October 2016

Is this game getting too easy? No

Are players becoming very familiar with ESO to the point where it is not the same challenge it used to be? Yes.

There have been numerous examples where even savvy players have struggled with ESO at some point & they have asked to have the difficulty of a certain creature/boss/sub-boss etc toned down to manageable levels on these forums.

ZoS complied and we can all compete in the game, dare I say it, "as was intended".

Craglorn is another example of being a zone that ZoS have admitted was too difficult for the majority of soloists who wanted to partake in this zone but had much difficulty with it and so it became a desert. This zone has been the subject on these forums of being requested to being competitive to all players and not just professionals that form groups from guilds.

So Craglorn is getting, for want of use of a better expression, dumbed down. And I say hurray to that. Craglorn is a zone too far out of my capability to compete in (I have tried often) and frustrates me no end. So when the console release comes out I shall try again. But this is only possible because, "the game is getting too easy", as some of you would describe it. I prefer to call it manageable.

ESO is a living, growing thing and it has to be adjusted for the greater good of all concerned even if that means taking it down a notch or three with regards to difficulty. After all, it isn't cool to admit that any game is "too difficult". That can make a player look like he is a noob in the eyes of the L2P brigade or, his perceived credibility will down the toilet.

To say a game is too easy is to do a disservice to the devs who built it and may even be insulting to those that struggle with it from time to time.

akl77 · October 2016

Also, playing vet dungeons with lag and freezes constantly over half a minute each freeze, tell me if the game is still easy.

Doctordarkspawn · October 2016

Frawr wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Frawr wrote: »

Game got easy about 2 years ago or earlier. Really a shame. It was easy long before CP.

Doshia for example. A big scary boss and one of the first that you find on the main questlines.

she has 2k health. 2k.

the level 5 boss in the level 3 story quest in daggerfall has 5k HP.

incidentally, i don't want this changed. that boss feels like an actual fight. it is a good fight in white gear without CP.

Doshia is a joke even in white gear and without CP.

I guess that this is symptomatic of a company trying to make a game accessible based on measures and spreadsheets. The target audience is, I assume, players who are relatively new to the concept of wasd movement and pointing with a mouse.

I had a guildie who I sat with and explained movement and aiming and use of destro staff. Her playstyle dramatically improved as a result. This does go to show that the game isn't necessarily easy for everyone. Perhaps their target audience is actually players who are new to video games...

Quite why you would choose to take an existing IP and target new gamers is beyond me.

If you seriously want Doshia to be hard again, you want to drive away most of the playerbase. Battles. Pick them please.

The base game difficulty is why I left three years ago.

Please define 'most'. It seems quite hyperbolic.

I struggle comprehend the game through your eyes. I didn't find it that difficult. It took a few attempts to work out what to do but it was a challenge rather than an issue over which to quit. Now, by comparison, I find it to be a joke. Granted, I understand how harvesters work and I am able to block and dodge as necessary, but that wasn't particularly different before the nerf either. It took longer and required concentration.

Let me define most.

Do you know a person who's currently annoyed by the dungeon difficulty right now, saying it takes far too long to kill trash mobs? Those people will leave, because no one enjoys having to spend a hour on something that should take ten minutes. That is an exaggeration, but I digress.

I beat Molag Bal in the first month after the game launched. I did one of the hardest boss battles at the original difficulty, I beat Doshia, I beat plenty of other bosses. Do you know why I still balk at the concept of going back? Because I dont play MMO's for that. I play MMO's nowadays for short bursts of content and RP. That's it. Why do I do RP? Because the base game has grown stale, as it usually will and RP is one of those ways I keep myself interested in the game. If I wanted something on the level of Doshia or Molag bal oldschool, I'd go play darksouls, a platform that would give me that, but better ballanced, more nuanced, and a experience I expressly sign up for, frustration and all.

Increasing the damage, and health of encounters wont give you difficulty, it will give you a timesink. And it will drive everyone away who actually values their time, values nuance, and values interaction that does not make you want to hate the other people involved due to sheer irritation at how long this is taking. I left because I couldn't reasonibly succeed at veteran ranks from -basic- mobs, something I had been doing for ages now, because the designers decided it was arbitrarily time to demand I either become best in slot DPS or grab friends. I will leave again, if necessary. Much like the current dungeon design now, the ones shots dont inspire me to work harder. They inspire me to find something else to do with my time.

Your vision of the game is difficult for all of the wrong reasons. The experience you crave will never be provided for a MMO, even one of those permadeath, hardcore MMO's, because what you want is nuanced gameplay designed to challenge you, and a MMO isn't going to provide that. Their too mechanically limited to. Too focused on group play, not challenging an individual.

The day Doshia becomes what she was back in the day, is the day I walk out the door and leave you to the doomed world you have created. Because clearly, the dream you have leaves no room for anyone else. Us who only have limited time to play, us who want content you dont need a study group to do, need to GTFO for the sake of your vision. Well. Lets see if you can sustain that vision on the real percentage interested.

TLDR: An MMO is designed with group difficulty, and the fact all these people have to work tomorrow in mind. In the case of raids or other activities, they are designed for players to work at over time. Dark souls is designed with individual challenge and as much time as you can spare, in mind. Dont go to the former, and expect the latter. And dont demand the former conform to your expectations, which the latter allready conforms to. And if you do demand it, consider whether or not this platform will be sustainable when you factor in the person paying for it's bottom line.

@Frawr . Hopefully some of that will be understandable despite the apparent difficulty inherent in comprehending new idea's.

Solid_Metal · October 2016

getting easier?, i think the game getting a bit harder, especially on vet dungeon, even world boss finally give some challenge now

but if you meant by getting easier is the normal mob on the surface of PvE area that already very easy to begin with?, well then yeah sure

billp_ESO · October 2016

I think the 1-50 game is too easy.

Even with a sub-optimal build, the game is easy. Players can play the whole game using a poor build, and then crash badly at the end.

C0wrex · October 2016

Plot twist: What if we're easy?

newtinmpls · October 2016

newtinmpls wrote: »

I like that there are world bosses that a group of four can NOT take.

Typhoios wrote: »

Which ones? I haven't found any that hard yet.

Umm... we were running around (short pause to scream at my sweetie) Rivenspire. About half we could do just the two of us, and there were others that a gang of 6-7 had trouble.

Of course if you are thinking "overkill PvP BiS meta" then I totally take back my comments.

I'm talking about .... normal players, not the top teeny %

disintegr8 · October 2016

To all of the players out there complaining that the game is too easy and how often they have beaten vMSA - who cares? Go and find another game to play or stay off the forums and leave the game to those of us who enjoy it.

Why do you still play the game if it is so easy?

I still play PVE because I enjoy the game and what it has to offer. I have passed CP cap but am still learning things about certain characters, bosses and dungeons. And yes,like most players, I still die in dungeons and trials.

I am still playing with different setups, potions, weapons and armour. I do not have BiS gear or min/max builds, do not have maelstrom weapons and when I want to be brought down to earth, I venture into Cyrodiil and get terminated.

I do all of this because it is fun. If the game is no longer fun for you, please go away and leave us in peace. If it is still fun, just enjoy playing and stop complaining about it being too easy.

Funkopotamus · October 2016

This game is Casual Scrolls Online.. Didn't you know?

It is "fun", but nothing about CasualScrollsOnline is anywhere near the level of other MMO's when it comes to a challenge.

The thing that kills ESO in that department is the fact that ESO doesn't know what it wants to be.. Is it a MMO.. Is it a single player RPG? It tries very hard to be both and it only makes the game fall flat in so many areas because of that fact alone.

Rastoide · October 2016

Funkopotamus wrote: »

This game is Casual Scrolls Online.. Didn't you know?

It is "fun", but nothing about CasualScrollsOnline is anywhere near the level of other MMO's when it comes to a challenge.

The thing that kills ESO in that department is the fact that ESO doesn't know what it wants to be.. Is it a MMO.. Is it a single player RPG? It tries very hard to be both and it only makes the game fall flat in so many areas because of that fact alone.

Its a casual game. Thats what it is.
They should add the "Casual" tag to steam tags at least..

kaithuzar · October 2016

I think they really just need to tone down battle leveling . Outside of that they really need to change entire game mechanics . For instance I feel there should really be a supporter role but there isn't much of a class for it anymore . There should be a class that can cast an " immunity to damage" spell on another player but not themselves , and bosses should have one shot mechanics that you have to figure out how to deal with ; or rely on having a supporter class with you !

Regarding solo style places like maelstrom arena it gives the player too much time in between . There should be constant waves of enemies flooding the place and they should get bigger and harder as you progress . But it's really the same number of mobs with different mechanics which to me seems kind of lame .

Maybe it's the reasoning the whole test your strength is a little played out . What if another player was trapped and you had to rescue them and there was a maze that you both had to go through to regroup in order to beat the final boss that could be something !

Just my opinion on how I see the MMO genre .