Proposed Blackrose change
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juhasman✭✭✭✭There is 1 simple solution to resolve heavy armor problem in PvP. Make armor skills available to use when You have 5 pieces of armor from that skill line
No more shuffle no more heavy armor. 3 -
Edziu✭✭✭✭✭
✭Waffennacht wrote: »I didn't know vali + eternal hunt + viper was black rose?
yea.,.....this is also very f... sick combo...while you dont have any stacke weapon damage, go in max sustain in medium armor and wait till set burst proc and thats all....same overpowered ***.
when I have seen when viper set is hitting harder than main spammable dps skill on pvp on this cancer build0 -
Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
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Amberplasm is 1k magicka, 600 spell crit, 130 spell damage and 300 magicka and 300 stamina regen. Pretty damn close when you consider that 185 stam/mag you're giving black rose is conditional on being hit every 4 seconds and exactly at every 4 seconds. Say you're hit at the zero seconds and constitution procs. Then you take a burst of dmg over the next 3.5 seconds. Then you take no dmg for 2.5 seconds. That's a very believable and frequent occurrence wouldn't you say? In that situation your 185 stam/mag regen from black rose dips to 120.You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points3 -
Lokey0024✭✭✭✭✭
You mistake me. Im pointing out that Black Rose, while good, isnt the best. Its a great sustain set, actually the only one that utilizes heavy passives. Other sets combined with heavy passives are better dmg.
Amberplasm is 1k magicka, 600 spell crit, 130 spell damage and 300 magicka and 300 stamina regen. Pretty damn close when you consider that 185 stam/mag you're giving black rose is conditional on being hit every 4 seconds and exactly at every 4 seconds. Say you're hit at the zero seconds and constitution procs. Then you take a burst of dmg over the next 3.5 seconds. Then you take no dmg for 2.5 seconds. That's a very believable and frequent occurrence wouldn't you say? In that situation your 185 stam/mag regen from black rose dips to 120.
Kags armor set comes to mind. It has more spell dmg so less regen and base stats, can be crafted in heavy, but only helps magika regen. Sure i could dig thru eso foundry for others but i think i made my point.Edited by Lokey0024 on September 6, 2016 11:50PM0 -
SanTii.92✭✭✭✭✭
✭At this point anyone denying the overpowerness of Black Rose on it's current state is either completly delusional or wants to keep abusing the most broken set of the game, by far - Here is why.
Black Rose has not only the strongest combination of tankiness, damge and sustain but also, and most importanly provides an obscene amount of utility in the form of magicka regen, allowing sorcs streaking way more than they should, nightblades cloaking when they shouldn't be able and, the worse offenders, templars purging everything time and time again. I've fought templars who purged my curses, and I'm not kidding here, four or five times consecutivly with no apparent strain on theirs magicka pool when they haven't invested anything on magicka sustain besides maybe tri-food.
I believe this set is one, if not the main reason of the current stamina dominance, at the point that anyone trying to competitivly play a stam char for small scale not using this set is heavily hindering himeslf.
Zenimax for the love of a healthier balance please, nerf this set to the godamn ground already. Thank you
Tldr - Black Rose is hands down the strongest combination of tankyness, sustain and damage while also providing almost unlimited utilty to purge, cloak or streak with no trade off whatsoever.
Edited by SanTii.92 on September 7, 2016 4:35AMWhen the snows fall and the white winds blow,
the lone wolf dies, but the pack survives.
Arg | Pc Na | Factionless Mag Warden.3 -
Xinthisis✭✭✭✭If you run heavy, ANY heavy armor, for dps.....nm for now.
Ooook. 1800÷4= 450 not 650.
Stam poison breaks any Heavy armor build unless dot heavy or Heavy attack is spammed. Heavy attack takes 3 seconds to charge and can be dodged easy.
Medium armor cost reduction almost negates stam poison.
Black Rose is fine. Your complaint is with heavy armor in general it sounds like. If anything heavy armor should have reduced movement speed.
Can keep going but think This is enough. Dont be mad your NB doesnt have a spammable regen source. Siphon is awesome.
You do realize regen tics every 2 seconds right?
Stam poison breaks heavy armor? So now we're bringing in mechanics that arent related to armor now? K
The lengths people will go to defend things that are obviously too strong.
"We need magicka versions" smfh, thats not why magicka is crap. That's a whole separate discussion.
Wasnt mathing right, my bad. Still doesnt change the fact your beef is with heavy armor, not black rose
Seems like most people that are disagreeing with me aren't mathing right, or taking into consideration how actual combat in cyrodiil plays out. Kinda funny how that happens.
All I'm asking for is a rebalancing. If people truly are using it as a sustain set, then lets leave the sustain aspects of it alone. Get rid of the wd and spell damage, and since everyone is always complaining about how magicka gets no love. Make it a universal set by making one of the stam buffs a mag buff.
Or we can just leave it as is and watch the 5 black rose, 5 dreugh (max stam set), 2 monster helm stam builds dominate cyrodiil next patch.
Funny because you didn't math right either just to push your agenda.
Which math was I not doing right exactly?0 -
Xinthisis✭✭✭✭At this point anyone denying the complete overpowerness of Black Rose on it's current state is either completly delusional or wants to keep abusing the most broken set of the game, by far - Here is why.
Black Rose has not only the strongest combination of tankiness, damge and sustain but also, and most importanly provides an obscene amount of utility in the form of magicka regen, allowing sorcs streaking way more than they should, nightblades cloaking when they shouldn't be able and, the worse offenders, templars purging everything time and time again. I've fought templars who purged my curses, and I'm not kidding here, four or five times consecutivly with no apparent strain on theirs magicka pool when they haven't invested anything on magicka sustain besides maybe tri-food.
I believe this set is one, if not the main reason of the current stamina dominance, at the point that anyone trying to competitivly play a stam char for small scale not using this set is heavily hindering himeslf.
Zenimax for the love of a healthier balance please, nerf this set to the godamn ground already. Thank you
Tldr - Black Rose is the hands down the strongest combination of tankyness, sustain and damage while also providing almost unlimited utilty to purge, cloak or streak with no trade off whatsoever.
Yeah, I thought about the magicka sustain on it as well. I realize that nerfing that would definitely hurt the set, but I dont think it will balance it. It will send it back into the depths of never being used again if the sustain is taken from it. I think tanks should have access to this set. Get hit, gain resources. Cool.
What I dont like is the fact that it gives damage. It makes no sense. I really do hope zos gets rid of at least one of the max stam buffs to make it max magicka and to remove the weapon damage and spell damage. The way I see it is this, you wanna stand there and get your resources back. Thats fine. You shouldn't be getting damage from the same set that's giving you sustain, and tankiness all in one.0 -
Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭If you run heavy, ANY heavy armor, for dps.....nm for now.
Ooook. 1800÷4= 450 not 650.
Stam poison breaks any Heavy armor build unless dot heavy or Heavy attack is spammed. Heavy attack takes 3 seconds to charge and can be dodged easy.
Medium armor cost reduction almost negates stam poison.
Black Rose is fine. Your complaint is with heavy armor in general it sounds like. If anything heavy armor should have reduced movement speed.
Can keep going but think This is enough. Dont be mad your NB doesnt have a spammable regen source. Siphon is awesome.
You do realize regen tics every 2 seconds right?
Stam poison breaks heavy armor? So now we're bringing in mechanics that arent related to armor now? K
The lengths people will go to defend things that are obviously too strong.
"We need magicka versions" smfh, thats not why magicka is crap. That's a whole separate discussion.
Wasnt mathing right, my bad. Still doesnt change the fact your beef is with heavy armor, not black rose
Seems like most people that are disagreeing with me aren't mathing right, or taking into consideration how actual combat in cyrodiil plays out. Kinda funny how that happens.
All I'm asking for is a rebalancing. If people truly are using it as a sustain set, then lets leave the sustain aspects of it alone. Get rid of the wd and spell damage, and since everyone is always complaining about how magicka gets no love. Make it a universal set by making one of the stam buffs a mag buff.
Or we can just leave it as is and watch the 5 black rose, 5 dreugh (max stam set), 2 monster helm stam builds dominate cyrodiil next patch.
Funny because you didn't math right either just to push your agenda.
Which math was I not doing right exactly?
When you said black rose gives 650 stam/mag regen. It actually only provides around 185 stam/mag regen with 5H/2M because it only gives a 40% boost to constitution passive and that's only if you are hit the moment the constitution passive comes off cool down every time.You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points3 -
Lokey0024✭✭✭✭✭At this point anyone denying the complete overpowerness of Black Rose on it's current state is either completly delusional or wants to keep abusing the most broken set of the game, by far - Here is why.
Black Rose has not only the strongest combination of tankiness, damge and sustain but also, and most importanly provides an obscene amount of utility in the form of magicka regen, allowing sorcs streaking way more than they should, nightblades cloaking when they shouldn't be able and, the worse offenders, templars purging everything time and time again. I've fought templars who purged my curses, and I'm not kidding here, four or five times consecutivly with no apparent strain on theirs magicka pool when they haven't invested anything on magicka sustain besides maybe tri-food.
I believe this set is one, if not the main reason of the current stamina dominance, at the point that anyone trying to competitivly play a stam char for small scale not using this set is heavily hindering himeslf.
Zenimax for the love of a healthier balance please, nerf this set to the godamn ground already. Thank you
Tldr - Black Rose is the hands down the strongest combination of tankyness, sustain and damage while also providing almost unlimited utilty to purge, cloak or streak with no trade off whatsoever.
No tradeoff. Like dodge roll. Or reduced cost skills. Or moving faster.
You do realize that ALL heavy armor gives magika regen too, right?
Like i tried telling other nerf advocate, your beef is with heavy armor in general, not black rose. Which, if you really think about it, is a serious l2p issue.1 -
SanTii.92✭✭✭✭✭
✭At this point anyone denying the complete overpowerness of Black Rose on it's current state is either completly delusional or wants to keep abusing the most broken set of the game, by far - Here is why.
Black Rose has not only the strongest combination of tankiness, damge and sustain but also, and most importanly provides an obscene amount of utility in the form of magicka regen, allowing sorcs streaking way more than they should, nightblades cloaking when they shouldn't be able and, the worse offenders, templars purging everything time and time again. I've fought templars who purged my curses, and I'm not kidding here, four or five times consecutivly with no apparent strain on theirs magicka pool when they haven't invested anything on magicka sustain besides maybe tri-food.
I believe this set is one, if not the main reason of the current stamina dominance, at the point that anyone trying to competitivly play a stam char for small scale not using this set is heavily hindering himeslf.
Zenimax for the love of a healthier balance please, nerf this set to the godamn ground already. Thank you
Tldr - Black Rose is the hands down the strongest combination of tankyness, sustain and damage while also providing almost unlimited utilty to purge, cloak or streak with no trade off whatsoever.
No tradeoff. Like dodge roll. Or reduced cost skills. Or moving faster.
You do realize that ALL heavy armor gives magika regen too, right?
Like i tried telling other nerf advocate, your beef is with heavy armor in general, not black rose. Which, if you really think about it, is a serious l2p issue.
If it's a l2p issue, explain to my why almost every small scale / dueler is running with black rose. Even taking away the utility it provides with magicka regen, wich is the strongest part, there isn't any other set that provides anywhere close as this much of tankyness, sustain and dmge.
Heavy armor is probably overperforming, black rose just make it so obvious.When the snows fall and the white winds blow,
the lone wolf dies, but the pack survives.
Arg | Pc Na | Factionless Mag Warden.1 -
juhasman✭✭✭✭
Amberplasm is 1k magicka, 600 spell crit, 130 spell damage and 300 magicka and 300 stamina regen. Pretty damn close when you consider that 185 stam/mag you're giving black rose is conditional on being hit every 4 seconds and exactly at every 4 seconds. Say you're hit at the zero seconds and constitution procs. Then you take a burst of dmg over the next 3.5 seconds. Then you take no dmg for 2.5 seconds. That's a very believable and frequent occurrence wouldn't you say? In that situation your 185 stam/mag regen from black rose dips to 120.
Amberplasm is light armor. And light armor is trash comparing to heavy or medium in PvP. But ok lets compare it. It gives only more regens , spell crit which is not so usefull in PvP less wep/spell dmg and much less resources.Edited by juhasman on September 7, 2016 5:38AM1 -
Lokey0024✭✭✭✭✭At this point anyone denying the complete overpowerness of Black Rose on it's current state is either completly delusional or wants to keep abusing the most broken set of the game, by far - Here is why.
Black Rose has not only the strongest combination of tankiness, damge and sustain but also, and most importanly provides an obscene amount of utility in the form of magicka regen, allowing sorcs streaking way more than they should, nightblades cloaking when they shouldn't be able and, the worse offenders, templars purging everything time and time again. I've fought templars who purged my curses, and I'm not kidding here, four or five times consecutivly with no apparent strain on theirs magicka pool when they haven't invested anything on magicka sustain besides maybe tri-food.
I believe this set is one, if not the main reason of the current stamina dominance, at the point that anyone trying to competitivly play a stam char for small scale not using this set is heavily hindering himeslf.
Zenimax for the love of a healthier balance please, nerf this set to the godamn ground already. Thank you
Tldr - Black Rose is the hands down the strongest combination of tankyness, sustain and damage while also providing almost unlimited utilty to purge, cloak or streak with no trade off whatsoever.
No tradeoff. Like dodge roll. Or reduced cost skills. Or moving faster.
You do realize that ALL heavy armor gives magika regen too, right?
Like i tried telling other nerf advocate, your beef is with heavy armor in general, not black rose. Which, if you really think about it, is a serious l2p issue.
If it's a l2p issue, explain to my why almost every small scale / dueler is running with black rose. Even taking away the utility it provides with magicka regen, wich is the strongest part, there isn't any other set that provides anywhere close as this much of tankyness, sustain and dmge.
Heavy armor is probably overperforming, black rose just make it so obvious.
So 90% of the fotm build stam classes where running Hundings before Heavy was adjusted, does that make hundings OP?
The "tankyness" your talking about comes from having more HPs, not the extra 3k armor, right?4 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭At this point anyone denying the complete overpowerness of Black Rose on it's current state is either completly delusional or wants to keep abusing the most broken set of the game, by far - Here is why.
Black Rose has not only the strongest combination of tankiness, damge and sustain but also, and most importanly provides an obscene amount of utility in the form of magicka regen, allowing sorcs streaking way more than they should, nightblades cloaking when they shouldn't be able and, the worse offenders, templars purging everything time and time again. I've fought templars who purged my curses, and I'm not kidding here, four or five times consecutivly with no apparent strain on theirs magicka pool when they haven't invested anything on magicka sustain besides maybe tri-food.
I believe this set is one, if not the main reason of the current stamina dominance, at the point that anyone trying to competitivly play a stam char for small scale not using this set is heavily hindering himeslf.
Zenimax for the love of a healthier balance please, nerf this set to the godamn ground already. Thank you
Tldr - Black Rose is the hands down the strongest combination of tankyness, sustain and damage while also providing almost unlimited utilty to purge, cloak or streak with no trade off whatsoever.
No tradeoff. Like dodge roll. Or reduced cost skills. Or moving faster.
You do realize that ALL heavy armor gives magika regen too, right?
Like i tried telling other nerf advocate, your beef is with heavy armor in general, not black rose. Which, if you really think about it, is a serious l2p issue.
If it's a l2p issue, explain to my why almost every small scale / dueler is running with black rose. Even taking away the utility it provides with magicka regen, wich is the strongest part, there isn't any other set that provides anywhere close as this much of tankyness, sustain and dmge.
Heavy armor is probably overperforming, black rose just make it so obvious.
So 90% of the fotm build stam classes where running Hundings before Heavy was adjusted, does that make hundings OP?
The "tankyness" your talking about comes from having more HPs, not the extra 3k armor, right?
Thank you! 8% healing, even on a 3k vigor tick is only 282 health, or 1/30th of a single jab (a nice common attack)
The armor is what 8% less damage? (Unless your opponent us stackin penetration, which they should be)
The 20% or so cost reduction/stam regen for medium armor is far higher than the stam return
Medium armor provides a higher and far more consistent damage boost
Then you can compare actual stats, the amount of damage given to an attack by even 200 weapon/spell damage is something like maybe 400 dps (at most) - eternal hunt's proc deals a minimum of 4k, or the equivalent of 200 weapon or spell damage over 10 seconds in 1 sec (in other words it would take you 10 attacks to equal the damage dealt by one rune with blackrose)
I really think black rose is good, but in no way OP
Edit:for some reason I did 30% (darn you major vitality and mending! )Edited by Waffennacht on September 9, 2016 8:33PM1 -
AverageJo3Gam3r✭✭✭✭✭As a mDK that uses black rose, I approve dropping a stam bonus for a magicka bonus.4 -
SanTii.92✭✭✭✭✭
✭At this point anyone denying the complete overpowerness of Black Rose on it's current state is either completly delusional or wants to keep abusing the most broken set of the game, by far - Here is why.
Black Rose has not only the strongest combination of tankiness, damge and sustain but also, and most importanly provides an obscene amount of utility in the form of magicka regen, allowing sorcs streaking way more than they should, nightblades cloaking when they shouldn't be able and, the worse offenders, templars purging everything time and time again. I've fought templars who purged my curses, and I'm not kidding here, four or five times consecutivly with no apparent strain on theirs magicka pool when they haven't invested anything on magicka sustain besides maybe tri-food.
I believe this set is one, if not the main reason of the current stamina dominance, at the point that anyone trying to competitivly play a stam char for small scale not using this set is heavily hindering himeslf.
Zenimax for the love of a healthier balance please, nerf this set to the godamn ground already. Thank you
Tldr - Black Rose is the hands down the strongest combination of tankyness, sustain and damage while also providing almost unlimited utilty to purge, cloak or streak with no trade off whatsoever.
No tradeoff. Like dodge roll. Or reduced cost skills. Or moving faster.
You do realize that ALL heavy armor gives magika regen too, right?
Like i tried telling other nerf advocate, your beef is with heavy armor in general, not black rose. Which, if you really think about it, is a serious l2p issue.
If it's a l2p issue, explain to my why almost every small scale / dueler is running with black rose. Even taking away the utility it provides with magicka regen, wich is the strongest part, there isn't any other set that provides anywhere close as this much of tankyness, sustain and dmge.
Heavy armor is probably overperforming, black rose just make it so obvious.
So 90% of the fotm build stam classes where running Hundings before Heavy was adjusted, does that make hundings OP?
The "tankyness" your talking about comes from having more HPs, not the extra 3k armor, right?
You just got to check the most popular streamers, and input !build on the live chat to be proven wrong.
And then, after we agree on Black Rose dominance, we can discuss reasons and potential solutions.When the snows fall and the white winds blow,
the lone wolf dies, but the pack survives.
Arg | Pc Na | Factionless Mag Warden.0 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Amberplasm is 1k magicka, 600 spell crit, 130 spell damage and 300 magicka and 300 stamina regen. Pretty damn close when you consider that 185 stam/mag you're giving black rose is conditional on being hit every 4 seconds and exactly at every 4 seconds. Say you're hit at the zero seconds and constitution procs. Then you take a burst of dmg over the next 3.5 seconds. Then you take no dmg for 2.5 seconds. That's a very believable and frequent occurrence wouldn't you say? In that situation your 185 stam/mag regen from black rose dips to 120.
Amberplasm is light armor. And light armor is trash comparing to heavy or medium in PvP. But ok lets compare it. It gives only more regens , spell crit which is not so usefull in PvP less wep/spell dmg and much less resources.
Light armor could use some love, but it isn't crap in pvp. I actually find it preferable to heavy armor, even Black Rose. But don't forget that Amberplasm comes in jewelry, too.1 -
People just want what's killing them nerfed. I'm gonna go ahead and predict there will be several posts titled, "Valkyn Skoria NEEDS a Nerf Now," in about a month.6
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leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
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Amberplasm is 1k magicka, 600 spell crit, 130 spell damage and 300 magicka and 300 stamina regen. Pretty damn close when you consider that 185 stam/mag you're giving black rose is conditional on being hit every 4 seconds and exactly at every 4 seconds. Say you're hit at the zero seconds and constitution procs. Then you take a burst of dmg over the next 3.5 seconds. Then you take no dmg for 2.5 seconds. That's a very believable and frequent occurrence wouldn't you say? In that situation your 185 stam/mag regen from black rose dips to 120.
Amberplasm is light armor. And light armor is trash comparing to heavy or medium in PvP. But ok lets compare it. It gives only more regens , spell crit which is not so usefull in PvP less wep/spell dmg and much less resources.
Light armor could use some love, but it isn't crap in pvp. I actually find it preferable to heavy armor, even Black Rose. But don't forget that Amberplasm comes in jewelry, too.
Doesn't come in impen thoughPS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...0 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »
Amberplasm is 1k magicka, 600 spell crit, 130 spell damage and 300 magicka and 300 stamina regen. Pretty damn close when you consider that 185 stam/mag you're giving black rose is conditional on being hit every 4 seconds and exactly at every 4 seconds. Say you're hit at the zero seconds and constitution procs. Then you take a burst of dmg over the next 3.5 seconds. Then you take no dmg for 2.5 seconds. That's a very believable and frequent occurrence wouldn't you say? In that situation your 185 stam/mag regen from black rose dips to 120.
Amberplasm is light armor. And light armor is trash comparing to heavy or medium in PvP. But ok lets compare it. It gives only more regens , spell crit which is not so usefull in PvP less wep/spell dmg and much less resources.
Light armor could use some love, but it isn't crap in pvp. I actually find it preferable to heavy armor, even Black Rose. But don't forget that Amberplasm comes in jewelry, too.
Doesn't come in impen though
3 jewelry and 2 light (not impen) is acceptable. You can still run 5p impen with other stuff. Oh...you an also run weapons with Amber and have complete Impen on armor, too.Edited by maxjapank on September 8, 2016 2:38AM0 -
DHale✭✭✭✭✭
✭I do not use or even own BR at time of this writing. I get killed by all the one v xers that wear BR all the time when I run solo. Kodi, Jules, Sypher, etc... It does not bother me in the slightest even if they go back to morukulin or shield breaker or hunding rage they will still kill me. They will also still kill you. BR nor any armor set is going to make a bad player a good player. Conversely, it is not the BR armor that made them good. I also kill tons of Kodi and Jules and Sypher wanna bees who run their builds but do not have any of their skill.
I am glad BR is available to everyone and anyone in the game. I think most people are using it as an excuse why you cant burst people down in 2 seconds (too tanky) or why you get killed by BR users all the time (too much damage). The truth is even if they change back to medium armor because lets face it their are no heavy armor alternatives and even if there was forum warriors would complain about that too. The ONLY concerns I have about BR is their is no magic equivalent of BR which there should be and most importantly. Why is there only one good HA set for stamina users? As usual magic users get jack nola.
People that run solo and in small groups need and deserve some armor that gives them mitigation. Getting zerged down by 15 players is no bueno and the only chance they have is in heavy armor... good heavy armor not the rest of the in game crap. On my DK I wear and use elf bane when I kill someone i get accused of wearing BR quite a bit. Even if i tell them I don't run BR they don't believe me so I now tell them to dust off their tin foil hats. Those are the people that want BR nerfed.
If I wanted to compete with them and other elite players. I would play more, gold out my gear, run malestrorm, run VDSA, heck even level my alchemy on all my toons. In summary I would get good. But for the vast majority of people I just don't need to do that. I would play on all stam toons (even though I have waaaayyy more fun on my magic toons). But those people who don't want to change their builds or play style or adapt will always call for nerfs of others to suit their own play style.
If you want to use BR use it... it will not make you any better. It may take a player at my level nine seconds to kill you instead of three seconds I for one am totally ok with that. I am not going to run out and buy it with my 130k tel var stones. At this point I just don't need it but I do like to know I can get it if I ever want to get it. I say more pew pew and less qq will make this game a lot better. Remember AOE caps were put in this game to give a nerf. Has this made the game better? Dynamic ult gen was removed as part of a nerf. Has this made the game better? Nerfs are not the answer they are the problem.Sorcerna, proud beta sorc. RIP April 2014 to May 31 2016 DArk Brotherhood. Out of retirement for negates and encases. Sorcerna will be going back into retirement to be my main crafter Fall 2018. Because an 8 k shield is f ing useless. Died because of baddies on the forum. Too much qq too little pew pew. 16 AD 2 DC. 0 EP cause they bad, CP 2300 plus 18 level 50 toons. NA, PC, Grey Host#SORCLIVESMATTER actually they don’t or they wouldn’t keep getting nerfed constantly.4 -
Xsorus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭.....
For future reference; Blackrose isn't overpowered because you die to another player in PvP
You died because you lost to the better player
Learn from your mistakes and move on.https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXpX7JMwRXtczc5GTrIYRIw
ESO and GW2 PvP videos5 -
Xinthisis✭✭✭✭I do not use or even own BR at time of this writing. I get killed by all the one v xers that wear BR all the time when I run solo. Kodi, Jules, Sypher, etc... It does not bother me in the slightest even if they go back to morukulin or shield breaker or hunding rage they will still kill me. They will also still kill you. BR nor any armor set is going to make a bad player a good player. Conversely, it is not the BR armor that made them good. I also kill tons of Kodi and Jules and Sypher wanna bees who run their builds but do not have any of their skill.
I am glad BR is available to everyone and anyone in the game. I think most people are using it as an excuse why you cant burst people down in 2 seconds (too tanky) or why you get killed by BR users all the time (too much damage). The truth is even if they change back to medium armor because lets face it their are no heavy armor alternatives and even if there was forum warriors would complain about that too. The ONLY concerns I have about BR is their is no magic equivalent of BR which there should be and most importantly. Why is there only one good HA set for stamina users? As usual magic users get jack nola.
People that run solo and in small groups need and deserve some armor that gives them mitigation. Getting zerged down by 15 players is no bueno and the only chance they have is in heavy armor... good heavy armor not the rest of the in game crap. On my DK I wear and use elf bane when I kill someone i get accused of wearing BR quite a bit. Even if i tell them I don't run BR they don't believe me so I now tell them to dust off their tin foil hats. Those are the people that want BR nerfed.
If I wanted to compete with them and other elite players. I would play more, gold out my gear, run malestrorm, run VDSA, heck even level my alchemy on all my toons. In summary I would get good. But for the vast majority of people I just don't need to do that. I would play on all stam toons (even though I have waaaayyy more fun on my magic toons). But those people who don't want to change their builds or play style or adapt will always call for nerfs of others to suit their own play style.
If you want to use BR use it... it will not make you any better. It may take a player at my level nine seconds to kill you instead of three seconds I for one am totally ok with that. I am not going to run out and buy it with my 130k tel var stones. At this point I just don't need it but I do like to know I can get it if I ever want to get it. I say more pew pew and less qq will make this game a lot better. Remember AOE caps were put in this game to give a nerf. Has this made the game better? Dynamic ult gen was removed as part of a nerf. Has this made the game better? Nerfs are not the answer they are the problem.
Every single one of those great players you mentioned agree with the fact that Blackrose is overperforming. Yet its cool, we can just enjoy this meta because people are okay with some levels of inbalance.
Btw the balancing I'm talking about would actually make it a universal set. Able to run it on magicka or stamina, because at the very minimum there needs to be a change to one of the max stam buffs. People are still getting bursted with, or without blackrose. Next patch that remains the same. Just hop in any of those top players streams and ask them what they think will be the best setup next patch. Black rose is in 90% of the builds. Yet its cool, we can stick with this meta and kill build diversity because people think that my proposal has anything to do with the fact that I play a nb. Even though I have a max dk, sorc, and templar on the way.
I really do need to get to fixing my signature block.
Blackrose is overperforming for stamina based builds. Lets deal with this issue, and discuss magicka on another post.1 -
Hiero_Glyph✭✭✭✭✭I do not use or even own BR at time of this writing. I get killed by all the one v xers that wear BR all the time when I run solo. Kodi, Jules, Sypher, etc... It does not bother me in the slightest even if they go back to morukulin or shield breaker or hunding rage they will still kill me. They will also still kill you. BR nor any armor set is going to make a bad player a good player. Conversely, it is not the BR armor that made them good. I also kill tons of Kodi and Jules and Sypher wanna bees who run their builds but do not have any of their skill.
I am glad BR is available to everyone and anyone in the game. I think most people are using it as an excuse why you cant burst people down in 2 seconds (too tanky) or why you get killed by BR users all the time (too much damage). The truth is even if they change back to medium armor because lets face it their are no heavy armor alternatives and even if there was forum warriors would complain about that too. The ONLY concerns I have about BR is their is no magic equivalent of BR which there should be and most importantly. Why is there only one good HA set for stamina users? As usual magic users get jack nola.
People that run solo and in small groups need and deserve some armor that gives them mitigation. Getting zerged down by 15 players is no bueno and the only chance they have is in heavy armor... good heavy armor not the rest of the in game crap. On my DK I wear and use elf bane when I kill someone i get accused of wearing BR quite a bit. Even if i tell them I don't run BR they don't believe me so I now tell them to dust off their tin foil hats. Those are the people that want BR nerfed.
If I wanted to compete with them and other elite players. I would play more, gold out my gear, run malestrorm, run VDSA, heck even level my alchemy on all my toons. In summary I would get good. But for the vast majority of people I just don't need to do that. I would play on all stam toons (even though I have waaaayyy more fun on my magic toons). But those people who don't want to change their builds or play style or adapt will always call for nerfs of others to suit their own play style.
If you want to use BR use it... it will not make you any better. It may take a player at my level nine seconds to kill you instead of three seconds I for one am totally ok with that. I am not going to run out and buy it with my 130k tel var stones. At this point I just don't need it but I do like to know I can get it if I ever want to get it. I say more pew pew and less qq will make this game a lot better. Remember AOE caps were put in this game to give a nerf. Has this made the game better? Dynamic ult gen was removed as part of a nerf. Has this made the game better? Nerfs are not the answer they are the problem.
Every single one of those great players you mentioned agree with the fact that Blackrose is overperforming. Yet its cool, we can just enjoy this meta because people are okay with some levels of inbalance.
Btw the balancing I'm talking about would actually make it a universal set. Able to run it on magicka or stamina, because at the very minimum there needs to be a change to one of the max stam buffs. People are still getting bursted with, or without blackrose. Next patch that remains the same. Just hop in any of those top players streams and ask them what they think will be the best setup next patch. Black rose is in 90% of the builds. Yet its cool, we can stick with this meta and kill build diversity because people think that my proposal has anything to do with the fact that I play a nb. Even though I have a max dk, sorc, and templar on the way.
I really do need to get to fixing my signature block.
Blackrose is overperforming for stamina based builds. Lets deal with this issue, and discuss magicka on another post.
Except the answer to fixing Black Rose is to make it like Twice-Born Star and change one of the max stamina bonuses to max magicka. BR already has a +wep/spell dmg bonus, so why doesn't it have a +max magicka bonus? Let's be honest, having 2x max stam bonuses would be like Clever Alchemist having 1x health and 1x magicka. Why favor one resource when the set is obviously intended to be neutral? Other than that, dropping the wep/spell dmg bonus to a typical value would probably help.1 -
Xinthisis✭✭✭✭Hiero_Glyph wrote: »I do not use or even own BR at time of this writing. I get killed by all the one v xers that wear BR all the time when I run solo. Kodi, Jules, Sypher, etc... It does not bother me in the slightest even if they go back to morukulin or shield breaker or hunding rage they will still kill me. They will also still kill you. BR nor any armor set is going to make a bad player a good player. Conversely, it is not the BR armor that made them good. I also kill tons of Kodi and Jules and Sypher wanna bees who run their builds but do not have any of their skill.
I am glad BR is available to everyone and anyone in the game. I think most people are using it as an excuse why you cant burst people down in 2 seconds (too tanky) or why you get killed by BR users all the time (too much damage). The truth is even if they change back to medium armor because lets face it their are no heavy armor alternatives and even if there was forum warriors would complain about that too. The ONLY concerns I have about BR is their is no magic equivalent of BR which there should be and most importantly. Why is there only one good HA set for stamina users? As usual magic users get jack nola.
People that run solo and in small groups need and deserve some armor that gives them mitigation. Getting zerged down by 15 players is no bueno and the only chance they have is in heavy armor... good heavy armor not the rest of the in game crap. On my DK I wear and use elf bane when I kill someone i get accused of wearing BR quite a bit. Even if i tell them I don't run BR they don't believe me so I now tell them to dust off their tin foil hats. Those are the people that want BR nerfed.
If I wanted to compete with them and other elite players. I would play more, gold out my gear, run malestrorm, run VDSA, heck even level my alchemy on all my toons. In summary I would get good. But for the vast majority of people I just don't need to do that. I would play on all stam toons (even though I have waaaayyy more fun on my magic toons). But those people who don't want to change their builds or play style or adapt will always call for nerfs of others to suit their own play style.
If you want to use BR use it... it will not make you any better. It may take a player at my level nine seconds to kill you instead of three seconds I for one am totally ok with that. I am not going to run out and buy it with my 130k tel var stones. At this point I just don't need it but I do like to know I can get it if I ever want to get it. I say more pew pew and less qq will make this game a lot better. Remember AOE caps were put in this game to give a nerf. Has this made the game better? Dynamic ult gen was removed as part of a nerf. Has this made the game better? Nerfs are not the answer they are the problem.
Every single one of those great players you mentioned agree with the fact that Blackrose is overperforming. Yet its cool, we can just enjoy this meta because people are okay with some levels of inbalance.
Btw the balancing I'm talking about would actually make it a universal set. Able to run it on magicka or stamina, because at the very minimum there needs to be a change to one of the max stam buffs. People are still getting bursted with, or without blackrose. Next patch that remains the same. Just hop in any of those top players streams and ask them what they think will be the best setup next patch. Black rose is in 90% of the builds. Yet its cool, we can stick with this meta and kill build diversity because people think that my proposal has anything to do with the fact that I play a nb. Even though I have a max dk, sorc, and templar on the way.
I really do need to get to fixing my signature block.
Blackrose is overperforming for stamina based builds. Lets deal with this issue, and discuss magicka on another post.
Except the answer to fixing Black Rose is to make it like Twice-Born Star and change one of the max stamina bonuses to max magicka. BR already has a +wep/spell dmg bonus, so why doesn't it have a +max magicka bonus? Let's be honest, having 2x max stam bonuses would be like Clever Alchemist having 1x health and 1x magicka. Why favor one resource when the set is obviously intended to be neutral? Other than that, dropping the wep/spell dmg bonus to a typical value would probably help.
I've literally said that multiple times....... Is anyone reading my original post, or do they just see "AD NB" and think "Oh, heres another whiner with no concept of what this game is"
Change one of the max stam buffs to max magicka, and remove the weapon and spell damage. That's my proposal.0 -
Edziu✭✭✭✭✭
✭Black Rose has not only the strongest combination of tankiness, damge and sustain but also, and most importanly provides an obscene amount of utility in the form of magicka regen, allowing sorcs streaking way more than they should, nightblades cloaking when they shouldn't be able and, the worse offenders, templars purging everything time and time again. I've fought templars who purged my curses, and I'm not kidding here, four or five times consecutivly with no apparent strain on theirs magicka pool when they haven't invested anything on magicka sustain besides maybe tri-food......
For future reference; Blackrose isn't overpowered because you die to another player in PvP
You died because you lost to the better player
Learn from your mistakes and move on.
yes, I died because this player was better than me because he was in set for all where *** can be unkillabe and I was in set for glass cannon, example for other set with debuffs,
fassala guile, with 5 items your enemy who attacking you have reduced healing by 50% for 2 sec....now when he bursting you he have nonstop reducced healing be 50%, now add 30% heal debuff from power bash from shield skill, add again 10-20% bonus to healing debufs from CP and what we have? in total you reducing 90% healing taken for your enemy when you attacking you, now you dont need any skill, if he dont stop....mostly someone wont stop bursting when have resources for this so you can just kill him by only light attacks.
or he will stop attack you to heal when losing health or you will kill him by only spamming light attacks because of healing debuff, much skill, veru much.
like in mostly tank builds, just survive main burst damage and rest fight is easy peasy for this tank, only skill needed is just heavy attack, skill, bash combo just for burst attack medium/light wearer and that is all, no more skill needed if you dont fight agains someone other in heavy1 -
DHale✭✭✭✭✭
✭I did read your post and am also na ad. I don't like the proposed change and still want it left alone there was no build diversity before black rose. There was no heavy armor being used at all for Stam builds. There is one good heavy armor set nerfing is not going make the other crappy armor sets viable. Changing one set piece to magic just makes it less effective and removing the weapon and spell damage makes it worthless. Why would you run it then? It ok to have a meta in a game it ok to use a meta there is nothing wrong with it... Nothing.
I don't care about build diversity I want stuff to be effective and fun. Right now Stam is the meta... I rarely play my Stam toons. I like the challenge I like overcoming the adversity. I still have fun I still make a Azz ton of AP. As for it being overpowered people would be a fool to not admit it's strong but everyone of those streamers use it. One even took it off went back to medium armor said they could move like the wind that's a quote, got obliterated by group after group next stream on the very next day back in black rose. We just don't need another worthless set of heavy armor. We have plenty already.Sorcerna, proud beta sorc. RIP April 2014 to May 31 2016 DArk Brotherhood. Out of retirement for negates and encases. Sorcerna will be going back into retirement to be my main crafter Fall 2018. Because an 8 k shield is f ing useless. Died because of baddies on the forum. Too much qq too little pew pew. 16 AD 2 DC. 0 EP cause they bad, CP 2300 plus 18 level 50 toons. NA, PC, Grey Host#SORCLIVESMATTER actually they don’t or they wouldn’t keep getting nerfed constantly.0 -
Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No matter what you think of black rose, nerfing it a month before thirty plus new sets are released is dumb. Who knows, maybe no one will be using it in a month.You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points4 -
Hiero_Glyph✭✭✭✭✭Hiero_Glyph wrote: »I do not use or even own BR at time of this writing. I get killed by all the one v xers that wear BR all the time when I run solo. Kodi, Jules, Sypher, etc... It does not bother me in the slightest even if they go back to morukulin or shield breaker or hunding rage they will still kill me. They will also still kill you. BR nor any armor set is going to make a bad player a good player. Conversely, it is not the BR armor that made them good. I also kill tons of Kodi and Jules and Sypher wanna bees who run their builds but do not have any of their skill.
I am glad BR is available to everyone and anyone in the game. I think most people are using it as an excuse why you cant burst people down in 2 seconds (too tanky) or why you get killed by BR users all the time (too much damage). The truth is even if they change back to medium armor because lets face it their are no heavy armor alternatives and even if there was forum warriors would complain about that too. The ONLY concerns I have about BR is their is no magic equivalent of BR which there should be and most importantly. Why is there only one good HA set for stamina users? As usual magic users get jack nola.
People that run solo and in small groups need and deserve some armor that gives them mitigation. Getting zerged down by 15 players is no bueno and the only chance they have is in heavy armor... good heavy armor not the rest of the in game crap. On my DK I wear and use elf bane when I kill someone i get accused of wearing BR quite a bit. Even if i tell them I don't run BR they don't believe me so I now tell them to dust off their tin foil hats. Those are the people that want BR nerfed.
If I wanted to compete with them and other elite players. I would play more, gold out my gear, run malestrorm, run VDSA, heck even level my alchemy on all my toons. In summary I would get good. But for the vast majority of people I just don't need to do that. I would play on all stam toons (even though I have waaaayyy more fun on my magic toons). But those people who don't want to change their builds or play style or adapt will always call for nerfs of others to suit their own play style.
If you want to use BR use it... it will not make you any better. It may take a player at my level nine seconds to kill you instead of three seconds I for one am totally ok with that. I am not going to run out and buy it with my 130k tel var stones. At this point I just don't need it but I do like to know I can get it if I ever want to get it. I say more pew pew and less qq will make this game a lot better. Remember AOE caps were put in this game to give a nerf. Has this made the game better? Dynamic ult gen was removed as part of a nerf. Has this made the game better? Nerfs are not the answer they are the problem.
Every single one of those great players you mentioned agree with the fact that Blackrose is overperforming. Yet its cool, we can just enjoy this meta because people are okay with some levels of inbalance.
Btw the balancing I'm talking about would actually make it a universal set. Able to run it on magicka or stamina, because at the very minimum there needs to be a change to one of the max stam buffs. People are still getting bursted with, or without blackrose. Next patch that remains the same. Just hop in any of those top players streams and ask them what they think will be the best setup next patch. Black rose is in 90% of the builds. Yet its cool, we can stick with this meta and kill build diversity because people think that my proposal has anything to do with the fact that I play a nb. Even though I have a max dk, sorc, and templar on the way.
I really do need to get to fixing my signature block.
Blackrose is overperforming for stamina based builds. Lets deal with this issue, and discuss magicka on another post.
Except the answer to fixing Black Rose is to make it like Twice-Born Star and change one of the max stamina bonuses to max magicka. BR already has a +wep/spell dmg bonus, so why doesn't it have a +max magicka bonus? Let's be honest, having 2x max stam bonuses would be like Clever Alchemist having 1x health and 1x magicka. Why favor one resource when the set is obviously intended to be neutral? Other than that, dropping the wep/spell dmg bonus to a typical value would probably help.
I've literally said that multiple times....... Is anyone reading my original post, or do they just see "AD NB" and think "Oh, heres another whiner with no concept of what this game is"
Change one of the max stam buffs to max magicka, and remove the weapon and spell damage. That's my proposal.
Honestly this thread is so long and this idea has been stated by so many I'm not sure who posted it first (does it even matter?). The point stands that BR needs to have a stamina bonus changed to magicka. I would prefer to see the wep/sp dmg bonus reduced, not strictly removed but I agree that it needs to be toned down as heavy armor has the Wrath passive already.1 -
Hiero_Glyph✭✭✭✭✭No matter what you think of black rose, nerfing it a month before thirty plus new sets are released is dumb. Who knows, maybe no one will be using it in a month.
No, it still needs to be balanced, regardless of when it happens. Besides, after this Tel Var event it will continue to be a problem due to how easy it is to acquire. Your solution sounds like something ZOS would say, and we know they suck at balance already.2