xblackroxe wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

xblackroxe wrote: »

Of every class can heal but thats nit what a healer is about. A healer is there to buff/ debuff and support your ressources and thats simply what only a templar can really do. Everyone can spam heal and call him/herself a good healer but thats just the start not everything a healer is about.

Non-Templar healers have lots of options to buff/debuff/support resources. There's Elemental Drain, Combat Prayer, Siphon Spirit, Orbs, War Horn, Igneous Weapons, Empowered Ward, etc.

Really the only thing that's unique to Templars is their ability to give out tons of stamina replenishment, but in 95% or more of the content that shouldn't be required unless your stamina users aren't even a little self-sufficient. For trials, yeah you probably want at least one or two Templars throwing shards. For pretty much anything else, you absolutely don't need a Templar.

For everything but trials a healer is not required. I can come on any dd i have and survive ealsily without haveing a healer. Templars have Power of the Light which is the only non poison source for minor breach/fracture and the passive that grant minor sorcery. DK buffs/debuffs already come from the tank and everybody in a raid needs stamina as there are many things a mag dd also has to block/dodge.

*facepalm*

Wow, thanks for coming into a discussion about healers in group dungeons and making blanket statements about healer that actually only apply to trials. Good job there.

xblackroxe wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

xblackroxe wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

xblackroxe wrote: »

Of every class can heal but thats nit what a healer is about. A healer is there to buff/ debuff and support your ressources and thats simply what only a templar can really do. Everyone can spam heal and call him/herself a good healer but thats just the start not everything a healer is about.

Non-Templar healers have lots of options to buff/debuff/support resources. There's Elemental Drain, Combat Prayer, Siphon Spirit, Orbs, War Horn, Igneous Weapons, Empowered Ward, etc.

Really the only thing that's unique to Templars is their ability to give out tons of stamina replenishment, but in 95% or more of the content that shouldn't be required unless your stamina users aren't even a little self-sufficient. For trials, yeah you probably want at least one or two Templars throwing shards. For pretty much anything else, you absolutely don't need a Templar.

For everything but trials a healer is not required. I can come on any dd i have and survive ealsily without haveing a healer. Templars have Power of the Light which is the only non poison source for minor breach/fracture and the passive that grant minor sorcery. DK buffs/debuffs already come from the tank and everybody in a raid needs stamina as there are many things a mag dd also has to block/dodge.

*facepalm*

Wow, thanks for coming into a discussion about healers in group dungeons and making blanket statements about healer that actually only apply to trials. Good job there.

LoL
How is this even a discussion.In dungeons you can go stamina and spam vigor and be fine. So whats thsi about? Ofc Sorc/NB/DK´s can heal but so what? Faceroll content doesn´t count for anything. Most of those dungeons can easily be soloed.

The elitist attitude doesn't help. Most groups running dungeons don't work that way. Sure sometimes there's a person or two who can self sustain, but not all groups out there run with people fully decked out, or even have all their skills unlocked yet. I'd say maybe 20% of the dungeons I run (and I practically live in dungeons) have someone who can do what you describe. Is it great when I win the lotto and get that player? Hell yeah. But most groups struggle because they're a) not leveled up yet and don't have the required skills, b) new to the game or trying a new class, or c) don't have the time to sink to get gear that lets them play that way.

That "faceroll content" is what most people are playing, new and old. Sorry we aren't all in the top percentile. Let people play how they like. The game has options for a reason, nobody has to cookie cutter the whole game.

Folks must stop talking about healers. The role of your "healer" is not only to heal, his main purpose is to support.
And while Sorcs and all other classes are perfectly valid at healing, Templars are the best when it comes to support.

Templars are unbeatable in this aspect. That's what they are meant to be.
So only because you are good at healing, doesn't mean you are a valueable supporter. Everyone can spam breath of life, healing springs, matriarch etc.

I've healed every Veteran Dungeon and every Normal Trial in the game with a Sorcerer. I've also healed Veteran Aetherian Archive. I don't even use the Winged Twilight, since I prefer to have those extra slots available for buffs.

I've also healed every Veteran Dungeon except for Vet Cradle of Shadows with a Dragonknight. DKs are an amazing buff class and can help with everything except Stamina regeneration. That problem will be solved once I get my Master Restoration Staff.

My Templar is actually my third favourite class for Healing. I prefer to use him as a DPS/Healer mix than as a straight Healer.

My Nightblade Healer isn't Level 50 yet, but I've run with other Nightblade Healers before. Their sap abilities are superb for keeping the group alive.

It's ridiculous to say that only Templars can heal, and extremely ridiculous for people to kick you from a group for being a Sorc Healer.

My healer is a Sorcerer too, and he is very much capable of doing his job. However, I understand why people prefer Templars. Twilight dies = delayed "Breath of Life".

That said, please buff Twilight Health Zenimax! 7.4k is a joke.

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

You lost me at I have never had any one die. I dont care how good a healer you are, there is always dps dumb enough to kill themselves. And if you truely have never had someone die, i honestly think that says more about the quality of people you are playing with then anything about how great a healer you are.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

TheValkyn wrote: »

RomansXXI wrote: »

I'm sick of being kicked from groups because I am a sorcerer healer. I have been able to out heal Templars any day and my build focuses on healing when needed and dps when not. I have completed many veteran dungeons and had not a single group member die on me. Please give us a chance before removing us cause we are not the healer designated class!

You've never out healed a competent templar..

I admit Breath of Life is stronger than Twilight Matriarch in terms of raw numbers, but you can barely tell in PvE when your healing as a Sorcerer is still strong enough to do your job as a healer.

What do you mean breath is stronger? It only heals one at full and the other at half that value. Twilight hits both at full value. Unless you mean because of major mending. Even then. Maybe you mean cause it is a pet and can die.

True the one to get the half heal is probably getting less than what the Twilight gives but I was indeed referring to the first one to be healed in terms of figures.

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

TheValkyn wrote: »

RomansXXI wrote: »

I'm sick of being kicked from groups because I am a sorcerer healer. I have been able to out heal Templars any day and my build focuses on healing when needed and dps when not. I have completed many veteran dungeons and had not a single group member die on me. Please give us a chance before removing us cause we are not the healer designated class!

You've never out healed a competent templar..

I admit Breath of Life is stronger than Twilight Matriarch in terms of raw numbers, but you can barely tell in PvE when your healing as a Sorcerer is still strong enough to do your job as a healer.

What do you mean breath is stronger? It only heals one at full and the other at half that value. Twilight hits both at full value. Unless you mean because of major mending. Even then. Maybe you mean cause it is a pet and can die.

True the one to get the half heal is probably getting less than what the Twilight gives but I was indeed referring to the first one to be healed in terms of figures.

With a properly set up sorc healer, you ought to have compareable numbers, IE on my temp without major mending, I get around 22k crits with the main heal of breath with being an argonian and 10% into blessed. On my sorc, who is a DPS without any points into blessed and being an high elf, it crits for around 20k. Thanks to having around 42k mana. Seems to me it would be easy to have the sorc hit for more, IE more into blessed or having the necropotence set. Really though, anything about like 18k is more then enough, as most DPS have l around that in health.

Indeed. Some people are just biased toward Healers though.

I just don't understand why someone would create a sorc simply to heal... Makes no sense. A Templar does a better job AND you get an entire skill line dedicated for healing lol. As a sorc healer you're missing out the true POWER of a sorc. Not hating.. But I think it's a downgrade

(I'm a magicka sorc)

The biggest advantage that a Templar has in terms of healing is not BOL (because that basically overheals everyone), rather it's very easy access to HOTs, major mending, and medium healing.

The HOT that Templars have comes from their Ritual of Retribution/Extended Ritual, which just helps with healing.

The bigger thing that it adds is Major Mending. Now, that doesn't help much with BOL, because even without that buff, it'll still heal your target to max, but Major Mending helps your other HOTs tick for more (IE Healing Springs and Regeneration)

Also, Templars have access to a great heal, Repentance, which heals for 4-6k per body purified, which is not the overheal that is BOL, in addition, Repentance is free. I won't touch on the stamina restore on it.

That's really the advantage that Templars have over other classes in terms of healing 4-man content. BOL is usually an expensive, too powerful for its own good, crutch that you generally don't need (other classes can use Healing Ward as a replacement).

In terms for 4-man content, so long as your stamina dps and tanks don't mind going without shards, the 4 classes can all handle healing perfectly well.

However, Templars are still the better healer due to the Restoring Light line, and they then become the better supports as you start examining group utility, because they can cheaply cleanse allies of harmful effects, and restore stamina to allies.


In the end, the biggest thing that the other 3 classes can't do is restore large amounts of stamina to team members; everything but shards and Repentance is either available to all classes, or has a replacement.

RedFireDisco wrote: »

Major Mending is 30%.

That's the clincher right there.

It's also available from more sources than just Templar passives.

Pet-based sorc who can't keep the pet alive is a bad sorc. They probably don't know that there's a button to command the pet. Or just simply lazy and just keep the pet wander by itself and died. Played with many healers that are sorcs, and it was just fine. Being templar doesn't guarantee a good healer, in the end it depends on the players.