HeroOfNone wrote: »

I'd say a permanent ban was too harsh if this went down how you say, but I still question it.

meanwhile I hope they have called customer support or emailed to try and appeal this ban. if its as easy as they say they could be out in hours.

I don't know who Java has been talking to, but the guildmates in my guild who were banned used the set in an instanced dungeon and took no loot. It was purely to show that the set was still bugged.

Even if they didn't though, I still don't think permabans are a fit response. The fit response would be fixing their bugs in a timely manner. In no other game I have played do you get permabanned for simply using items in the game. You do nothing special to make this bug happen. You simply put on the set. It is just irresponsible of ZOS to leave these sets in the game. And then they turn the player base against itself by doing stealth bans and lumping these players in with all the others who are truly toxic to the game--Cheat Engine users.

Also, I don't know how others interact with Customer Service but I live with one of the banned people and he was professional in his communications. ZOS responded by saying he was permanently banned and his account would not be returned. When he requested information on why he was banned they just said it was a ban-worthy offense. He requested again that they tell him what he did to offend. They said they would not be responding to any more appeals. And they have not responded since.

I suspect they are either understaffed or that the Customer Service is outsourced and those folks do not have information on why people were banned, just that they were. That is only speculation though. This lack of communication from Customer Support is what finally was the last straw for me and made me cancel my subscription and stop logging in. I don't feel safe investing my time in a game where I could lose access to my account at any time for wearing a set I didn't even know was broken because they make no announcement anywhere I would see it. And then based on our experience with Customer Support, we wouldn't be able to contact anyone to explain my case.

starkerealm wrote: »

HeroOfNone wrote: »

I'd say a permanent ban was too harsh if this went down how you say, but I still question it.

I only have your word @JavaWho, who heard it from them that they only used this set once in Vet Spindleclutch and Rawl Kha. ZOS, since they won't name or shame, can't fight a battle of public opinion unless someone comes forward with a different story on a different forum. I just hope they are being honest with you and not only giving half the story.

Part of my skepticism comes from how many complained about how easy it is to get out of a ban by contacting customer support and apologizing. Those not unbanned typically had a history of issues, they are rude when they contact support, or they blatently exploited something to the point of abuse. I don't know the two involved though, so I can't judge their character, just the facts presented.

So if this is their first offense and it was limited to 2 PVE experiences like this, a warning would have sufficed. If they told a half truth and did use this in PVP, a suspension for a few days seems fair. If they had a history of exploiting things, a permanent ban might be in order until they come back and apologize. That's my opinion though, I'm sure ZOS has its own evidence and policy on how they ban folks now.

meanwhile I hope they have called customer support or emailed to try and appeal this ban. if its as easy as they say they could be out in hours.

Honestly, this is where a lot of my skepticism on this whole mess is coming from.

This is an egregious exploit. It was well documented on the PTS. It slipped into the live build (okay, yeah, that's a serious mistake to make, on ZOS).

And suddenly, a lot of people rushed out, and "accidentally" chased down a full set of grind gear, to gain access to the exploit so they could "test" it?

Something about this whole situation smells off. I'm sorry.

I'm sorry for your friends, too. But, I have a really hard time chalking this one up to an honest mistake.

Even if they maliciously chased after the set, that does not deserve a permanent ban to me, but would validate a temp suspension. Permanent bans are something you should reserve with significant toxic effects on the community and/or significant impact to disrupt game play. If some of the resulting permanent bans are as benign as some claim they are, then I think ZOS is over reaching as a result of folks calling out for harsher bans after the cheating exploit. I'd argue a gentler hand might be needed, but again, the Naming and Shaming policy prevents us from knowing and really giving an informed opinion.

HeroOfNone wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

HeroOfNone wrote: »

I'd say a permanent ban was too harsh if this went down how you say, but I still question it.

I only have your word @JavaWho, who heard it from them that they only used this set once in Vet Spindleclutch and Rawl Kha. ZOS, since they won't name or shame, can't fight a battle of public opinion unless someone comes forward with a different story on a different forum. I just hope they are being honest with you and not only giving half the story.

Part of my skepticism comes from how many complained about how easy it is to get out of a ban by contacting customer support and apologizing. Those not unbanned typically had a history of issues, they are rude when they contact support, or they blatently exploited something to the point of abuse. I don't know the two involved though, so I can't judge their character, just the facts presented.

So if this is their first offense and it was limited to 2 PVE experiences like this, a warning would have sufficed. If they told a half truth and did use this in PVP, a suspension for a few days seems fair. If they had a history of exploiting things, a permanent ban might be in order until they come back and apologize. That's my opinion though, I'm sure ZOS has its own evidence and policy on how they ban folks now.

meanwhile I hope they have called customer support or emailed to try and appeal this ban. if its as easy as they say they could be out in hours.

Honestly, this is where a lot of my skepticism on this whole mess is coming from.

This is an egregious exploit. It was well documented on the PTS. It slipped into the live build (okay, yeah, that's a serious mistake to make, on ZOS).

And suddenly, a lot of people rushed out, and "accidentally" chased down a full set of grind gear, to gain access to the exploit so they could "test" it?

Something about this whole situation smells off. I'm sorry.

I'm sorry for your friends, too. But, I have a really hard time chalking this one up to an honest mistake.

Even if they maliciously chased after the set, that does not deserve a permanent ban to me, but would validate a temp suspension. Permanent bans are something you should reserve with significant toxic effects on the community and/or significant impact to disrupt game play. If some of the resulting permanent bans are as benign as some claim they are, then I think ZOS is over reaching as a result of folks calling out for harsher bans after the cheating exploit. I'd argue a gentler hand might be needed, but again, the Naming and Shaming policy prevents us from knowing and really giving an informed opinion.

Given we had players clogging up the leaderboards with this, which was probably what provoked the ban wave in the first place? The zero tolerance across the board approach starts to make a lot more sense.