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· [COMPLETE] NA megaservers for maintenance – February 23, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EST (17:00 UTC)
· [COMPLETE] EU megaservers for maintenance – February 23, 9:00 UTC (4:00AM EST) - 17:00 UTC (12:00PM EST)
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If you had 500 million dollars to buy ZOS and ESO.......
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Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »Let them keep it.. I don't know how to do their job, and overall, I am happy with the product that they offer to me
I am as well.....I am not a hater here.........just there is a distinct difference skyrim and the eso model.
Duh. Skyrim is single-player and ESO is multi-player.
Duh. Then I should be able to do the same exact thing just like in oblivion......and skyrim........just online.......not a portion of it.......give me these games and allow me to do what I do there......online. Oh wait I can't, its not the same game so call it something else. Duh.
And they are different games for a reason. One game is an MMO and the rest are not. As an MMO the game has certain needs that the others do not provide. For example: Swordplay in Skyrim is nothing but swinging said Sword, no special moves like ESO has or anything. Make an MMO out of Skyrim and you either get A) TESO or
A Magicka-build-only game.
So yeah call TES1-5 and TESO what you like but a SRPG is a Singleplayer RPG and an MMORPG is an Massively Multiplayer Online RPG. You want Skyrim? Well go have fun playing it or wait 2 months for HD lol
I am not convinced about that - I think ESO would be a far more successful game if it would not have PvP at all - then it would be truely different from other MMOs out there and would not have most of the problems it has now. It would attract a different crowd and those who stood away from ESO due to that, would replace the PvP crowd - there would be an end to this cumbersome and endless balancing, because it is not required anymore and we could finally concentrate on roleplay stuff.
The game would have a population, which is interested in customization of their character and interesting roleplay - this means, a well done cash shop with reasonable prices would pay for the show - I would make it subscription-based again - to keep the kiddies out.
Every MMO NEEDS PvP though. I honestly do not know of a single one that has ever not had PvP. People LIKE to compete, and no PvP would rob them of that.
That is always the argument - until someone does it in a different way - innovation is not done by doing it like everyone else. There are many ways to compete, it does not have to be to kill each other - it attracts the wrong crowd, IMO - I would not want them as customers.
The wrong crowd? What is wrong with us PvPers?
Nothing, but the topic is about a hypothetical investment - and if that has to be invested into ESO - the game has to get to a whole new dimension to be a proper investment - and then I have to weed out, what costs a lot of money and does not make an amount equivalent to what they cost me - and then they are just wrong.
Edit: they are wrong, because they burn through content too quickly - one can never make them happy ever - different to casuals, who do not have the time to burn through the content quickly - I just have to make them stay, and the money is rolling in. second Life shows that something like that works - I just have to attract this kind of people and give them a world, in which they can do what they like best - socialize, role play, buy stuff from a reasonable crown store - this makes the money and is a win-win. Then give them the tools to create their own costumes and designs - approved by the votes in fashion shows - it is different of course, but it would bring in the coin. And this is what this topic was all about - wasn't it?Edited by Lysette on August 18, 2016 2:46AM0 -
Luigi_Vampa✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »Let them keep it.. I don't know how to do their job, and overall, I am happy with the product that they offer to me
I am as well.....I am not a hater here.........just there is a distinct difference skyrim and the eso model.
Duh. Skyrim is single-player and ESO is multi-player.
Duh. Then I should be able to do the same exact thing just like in oblivion......and skyrim........just online.......not a portion of it.......give me these games and allow me to do what I do there......online. Oh wait I can't, its not the same game so call it something else. Duh.
And they are different games for a reason. One game is an MMO and the rest are not. As an MMO the game has certain needs that the others do not provide. For example: Swordplay in Skyrim is nothing but swinging said Sword, no special moves like ESO has or anything. Make an MMO out of Skyrim and you either get A) TESO or A Magicka-build-only game.
So yeah call TES1-5 and TESO what you like but a SRPG is a Singleplayer RPG and an MMORPG is an Massively Multiplayer Online RPG. You want Skyrim? Well go have fun playing it or wait 2 months for HD lol
I am not convinced about that - I think ESO would be a far more successful game if it would not have PvP at all - then it would be truely different from other MMOs out there and would not have most of the problems it has now. It would attract a different crowd and those who stood away from ESO due to that, would replace the PvP crowd - there would be an end to this cumbersome and endless balancing, because it is not required anymore and we could finally concentrate on roleplay stuff.
The game would have a population, which is interested in customization of their character and interesting roleplay - this means, a well done cash shop with reasonable prices would pay for the show - I would make it subscription-based again - to keep the kiddies out.
Every MMO NEEDS PvP though. I honestly do not know of a single one that has ever not had PvP. People LIKE to compete, and no PvP would rob them of that.
That is always the argument - until someone does it in a different way - innovation is not done by doing it like everyone else. There are many ways to compete, it does not have to be to kill each other - it attracts the wrong crowd, IMO - I would not want them as customers.
The wrong crowd? What is wrong with us PvPers?
Nothing, but the topic is about a hypothetical investment - and if that has to be invested into ESO - the game has to get to a whole new dimension to be a proper investment - and then I have to weed out, what costs a lot of money and does not make an amount equivalent to what they cost me - and then they are just wrong.
Edit: they are wrong, because they burn through content too quickly - one can never make them happy ever - different to casuals, who do not have the time to burn through the content quickly - I just have to make them stay, and the money is rolling in. second Life shows that something like that works - I just have to attract this kind of people and give them a world, in which they can do what they like best - socialize, role play, buy stuff from a reasonable crown store - this makes the money and is a win-win. Then give them the tools to create their own costumes and designs - approved by the votes in fashion shows - it is different of course, but it would bring in the coin. And this is what this topic was all about - wasn't it?
I just feel like you are confusing PvPers with hardcore progression PvEers. PvPers have basically been playing the same game since launch. Imperial City was more a PvE zone with PvP allowed. There were no PvP objectives originally. Since then they have added flags to IC and three towns. How exactly are we burning through content?PC/EU DC1 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »Let them keep it.. I don't know how to do their job, and overall, I am happy with the product that they offer to me
I am as well.....I am not a hater here.........just there is a distinct difference skyrim and the eso model.
Duh. Skyrim is single-player and ESO is multi-player.
Duh. Then I should be able to do the same exact thing just like in oblivion......and skyrim........just online.......not a portion of it.......give me these games and allow me to do what I do there......online. Oh wait I can't, its not the same game so call it something else. Duh.
And they are different games for a reason. One game is an MMO and the rest are not. As an MMO the game has certain needs that the others do not provide. For example: Swordplay in Skyrim is nothing but swinging said Sword, no special moves like ESO has or anything. Make an MMO out of Skyrim and you either get A) TESO or A Magicka-build-only game.
So yeah call TES1-5 and TESO what you like but a SRPG is a Singleplayer RPG and an MMORPG is an Massively Multiplayer Online RPG. You want Skyrim? Well go have fun playing it or wait 2 months for HD lol
I am not convinced about that - I think ESO would be a far more successful game if it would not have PvP at all - then it would be truely different from other MMOs out there and would not have most of the problems it has now. It would attract a different crowd and those who stood away from ESO due to that, would replace the PvP crowd - there would be an end to this cumbersome and endless balancing, because it is not required anymore and we could finally concentrate on roleplay stuff.
The game would have a population, which is interested in customization of their character and interesting roleplay - this means, a well done cash shop with reasonable prices would pay for the show - I would make it subscription-based again - to keep the kiddies out.
Every MMO NEEDS PvP though. I honestly do not know of a single one that has ever not had PvP. People LIKE to compete, and no PvP would rob them of that.
That is always the argument - until someone does it in a different way - innovation is not done by doing it like everyone else. There are many ways to compete, it does not have to be to kill each other - it attracts the wrong crowd, IMO - I would not want them as customers.
The wrong crowd? What is wrong with us PvPers?
Nothing, but the topic is about a hypothetical investment - and if that has to be invested into ESO - the game has to get to a whole new dimension to be a proper investment - and then I have to weed out, what costs a lot of money and does not make an amount equivalent to what they cost me - and then they are just wrong.
Edit: they are wrong, because they burn through content too quickly - one can never make them happy ever - different to casuals, who do not have the time to burn through the content quickly - I just have to make them stay, and the money is rolling in. second Life shows that something like that works - I just have to attract this kind of people and give them a world, in which they can do what they like best - socialize, role play, buy stuff from a reasonable crown store - this makes the money and is a win-win. Then give them the tools to create their own costumes and designs - approved by the votes in fashion shows - it is different of course, but it would bring in the coin. And this is what this topic was all about - wasn't it?
I just feel like you are confusing PvPers with hardcore progression PvEers. PvPers have basically been playing the same game since launch. Imperial City was more a PvE zone with PvP allowed. There were no PvP objectives originally. Since then they have added flags to IC and three towns. How exactly are we burning through content?
Yeah you are playing the same content - but you burnt through that content, what is THE GAME - all of Tamriel outside of Cyrrodil. Furthermore there is not much you would need from the crown store for your game play - this is what i get from the forums - you guys see it as fluff and not necessary - but this is earning the coin and I rather want people, who have an urge to buy pretty much everything what is on the crown store, than those, who think this is just fluff - I want paying customers, who are accommodated in every way they desire, but what I do not need are people, who are not interested in that kind of content, what makes the most money. As an investor I have to think like that.Edited by Lysette on August 18, 2016 3:02AM1 -
TX12001rwb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Don't they have like a billion dollars, I doubt 500,000,000 would be enough.1 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »Don't they have like a billion dollars, I doubt 500,000,000 would be enough.
Do not mix Zenimax with Zenimax online studio - ZOS is not worth that - not even close. I would probably think about it when it would cost 90M, with a few demands, I have stated in a post above. But it is not worth 500M, this is for certain.
Edit: you have to see it like that - ESO could be a cash cow for about 5 years to come - not much more, than TES VI will be there and ESO will be outdated and slowly die off - so those 500M have to come in in those 5 years plus a decent interest rate of at least 12.7% p.a., more would be better, because with just 12.7% it would not be a really good investment - and this after costs and taxes.
So it has to make about double of it before taxes - so we have per year 200M as ROI and roughtly 125M as revenue - before costs - we have to see the running costs as well for staff, equipment, offices and so on - this will never come in from ESO - so it is not worth 500M.Edited by Lysette on August 18, 2016 3:12AM0 -
Valen_Byte✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I would go back to sub based.
I would remove the resource pool damage scaling and make it the way it was at launch.
I would remove the CP system.
I would open the world so that there are no borders.
I would remove classes and make all skills and abilities open. So you can truly play the way you want.
I would add arenas for people who want small scale pvp.
I would put the deer back in cyro.
I would separate pve and pvp characters so that they can be balanced individually.
I would remove the crown store.
I would have a central hub where you can view all guild stores in tamriel from one location. Or you can travel around to the dif kiosks if you prefer.
I would give myself the best gear and all the moneys.
I would never work again.***Dixon Kay MagDK FORMER EMPEROR***Deca Dix MagDK FORMER EMPORER***Valonious MagPlar FORMER EMPEROR***
GM of BYTE
MAY YOUR DEATHS BE SWIFT, AND YOUR LOAD SCREENS LONG.
And alien tears will fill for him, Pity’s long-broken urn, For his mourners will be outcast men, And outcasts always mourn4 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Valen_Byte wrote: »I would go back to sub based.
I would remove the resource pool damage scaling and make it the way it was at launch.
I would remove the CP system.
I would open the world so that there are no borders.
I would remove classes and make all skills and abilities open. So you can truly play the way you want.
I would add arenas for people who want small scale pvp.
I would put the deer back in cyro.
I would separate pve and pvp characters so that they can be balanced individually.
I would remove the crown store.
I would have a central hub where you can view all guild stores in tamriel from one location. Or you can travel around to the dif kiosks if you prefer.
I would give myself the best gear and all the moneys.
I would never work again.
Hahaha, that is what all think before they actually got the money - but afterwards you will see, that a life of leisure is not fun and you will start working again, just in a different way than before - creating businesses, buying properties and assets, supporting interesting projects - stuff like this.
And look for interesting opportunities - example: Vancouver - properties in Vancouver - why, because rich chinese tend to send their offspring to Vancouver and let them spend millions of dollars there - the housing market there is booming and exploding - opportunity!!!!Edited by Lysette on August 18, 2016 3:25AM0 -
raidentenshu_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭If I had 500 million dollars to burn to purchase ZoS the first thing I would do......
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75SEy1qu71I
Is fire a lot of people.0 -
Valen_Byte✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Valen_Byte wrote: »I would go back to sub based.
I would remove the resource pool damage scaling and make it the way it was at launch.
I would remove the CP system.
I would open the world so that there are no borders.
I would remove classes and make all skills and abilities open. So you can truly play the way you want.
I would add arenas for people who want small scale pvp.
I would put the deer back in cyro.
I would separate pve and pvp characters so that they can be balanced individually.
I would remove the crown store.
I would have a central hub where you can view all guild stores in tamriel from one location. Or you can travel around to the dif kiosks if you prefer.
I would give myself the best gear and all the moneys.
I would never work again.
Hahaha, that is what all think before they actually got the money - but afterwards you will see, that a life of leisure is not fun and you will start working again, just in a different way than before - creating businesses, buying properties and assets, supporting interesting projects - stuff like this.
Um, Im a grown ass man with three children. One of them just graduated. I would have no problem at all leaving my labor intensive job that I have been at for over 20 years, to do nothing but play games and hang out with my honey : ))***Dixon Kay MagDK FORMER EMPEROR***Deca Dix MagDK FORMER EMPORER***Valonious MagPlar FORMER EMPEROR***
GM of BYTE
MAY YOUR DEATHS BE SWIFT, AND YOUR LOAD SCREENS LONG.
And alien tears will fill for him, Pity’s long-broken urn, For his mourners will be outcast men, And outcasts always mourn0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Valen_Byte wrote: »Valen_Byte wrote: »I would go back to sub based.
I would remove the resource pool damage scaling and make it the way it was at launch.
I would remove the CP system.
I would open the world so that there are no borders.
I would remove classes and make all skills and abilities open. So you can truly play the way you want.
I would add arenas for people who want small scale pvp.
I would put the deer back in cyro.
I would separate pve and pvp characters so that they can be balanced individually.
I would remove the crown store.
I would have a central hub where you can view all guild stores in tamriel from one location. Or you can travel around to the dif kiosks if you prefer.
I would give myself the best gear and all the moneys.
I would never work again.
Hahaha, that is what all think before they actually got the money - but afterwards you will see, that a life of leisure is not fun and you will start working again, just in a different way than before - creating businesses, buying properties and assets, supporting interesting projects - stuff like this.
Um, Im a grown ass man with three children. One of them just graduated. I would have no problem at all leaving my labor intensive job that I have been at for over 20 years, to do nothing but play games and hang out with my honey : ))
But for how long?- 5 years, 10 years? - this would be like being retired - do you want to live like that for the rest of your life?
Edit: another thing - hang out with your honey - can be very problematic - so far you never had to be with her for long all day round. This will be a surprise to you, what that actually means, if you have to do that with no other interests than those, you just described.Edited by Lysette on August 18, 2016 3:32AM0 -
Valen_Byte✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Valen_Byte wrote: »Valen_Byte wrote: »I would go back to sub based.
I would remove the resource pool damage scaling and make it the way it was at launch.
I would remove the CP system.
I would open the world so that there are no borders.
I would remove classes and make all skills and abilities open. So you can truly play the way you want.
I would add arenas for people who want small scale pvp.
I would put the deer back in cyro.
I would separate pve and pvp characters so that they can be balanced individually.
I would remove the crown store.
I would have a central hub where you can view all guild stores in tamriel from one location. Or you can travel around to the dif kiosks if you prefer.
I would give myself the best gear and all the moneys.
I would never work again.
Hahaha, that is what all think before they actually got the money - but afterwards you will see, that a life of leisure is not fun and you will start working again, just in a different way than before - creating businesses, buying properties and assets, supporting interesting projects - stuff like this.
Um, Im a grown ass man with three children. One of them just graduated. I would have no problem at all leaving my labor intensive job that I have been at for over 20 years, to do nothing but play games and hang out with my honey : ))
But for how long?- 5 years, 10 years? - this would be like being retired - do you want to live like that for the rest of your life?
yes
***Dixon Kay MagDK FORMER EMPEROR***Deca Dix MagDK FORMER EMPORER***Valonious MagPlar FORMER EMPEROR***
GM of BYTE
MAY YOUR DEATHS BE SWIFT, AND YOUR LOAD SCREENS LONG.
And alien tears will fill for him, Pity’s long-broken urn, For his mourners will be outcast men, And outcasts always mourn0 -
Valen_Byte✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Valen_Byte wrote: »Valen_Byte wrote: »I would go back to sub based.
I would remove the resource pool damage scaling and make it the way it was at launch.
I would remove the CP system.
I would open the world so that there are no borders.
I would remove classes and make all skills and abilities open. So you can truly play the way you want.
I would add arenas for people who want small scale pvp.
I would put the deer back in cyro.
I would separate pve and pvp characters so that they can be balanced individually.
I would remove the crown store.
I would have a central hub where you can view all guild stores in tamriel from one location. Or you can travel around to the dif kiosks if you prefer.
I would give myself the best gear and all the moneys.
I would never work again.
Hahaha, that is what all think before they actually got the money - but afterwards you will see, that a life of leisure is not fun and you will start working again, just in a different way than before - creating businesses, buying properties and assets, supporting interesting projects - stuff like this.
Um, Im a grown ass man with three children. One of them just graduated. I would have no problem at all leaving my labor intensive job that I have been at for over 20 years, to do nothing but play games and hang out with my honey : ))
But for how long?- 5 years, 10 years? - this would be like being retired - do you want to live like that for the rest of your life?
Edit: another thing - hang out with your honey - can be very problematic - so far you never had to be with her for long all day round. This will be a surprise to you, what that actually means, if you have to do that with no other interests than those, you just described.
You are assuming an awful lot here. We are the most amazing and close couple on the planet. She is my bestest friend of all time. We have adjoining desks. We sit right next to each other as we game everyday. I spend more time with her than I do working or sleeping. We literally NEVER do anything without each other. We don't have separate anything. I couldn't ever get tired of being with her.***Dixon Kay MagDK FORMER EMPEROR***Deca Dix MagDK FORMER EMPORER***Valonious MagPlar FORMER EMPEROR***
GM of BYTE
MAY YOUR DEATHS BE SWIFT, AND YOUR LOAD SCREENS LONG.
And alien tears will fill for him, Pity’s long-broken urn, For his mourners will be outcast men, And outcasts always mourn4 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Valen_Byte wrote: »Valen_Byte wrote: »Valen_Byte wrote: »I would go back to sub based.
I would remove the resource pool damage scaling and make it the way it was at launch.
I would remove the CP system.
I would open the world so that there are no borders.
I would remove classes and make all skills and abilities open. So you can truly play the way you want.
I would add arenas for people who want small scale pvp.
I would put the deer back in cyro.
I would separate pve and pvp characters so that they can be balanced individually.
I would remove the crown store.
I would have a central hub where you can view all guild stores in tamriel from one location. Or you can travel around to the dif kiosks if you prefer.
I would give myself the best gear and all the moneys.
I would never work again.
Hahaha, that is what all think before they actually got the money - but afterwards you will see, that a life of leisure is not fun and you will start working again, just in a different way than before - creating businesses, buying properties and assets, supporting interesting projects - stuff like this.
Um, Im a grown ass man with three children. One of them just graduated. I would have no problem at all leaving my labor intensive job that I have been at for over 20 years, to do nothing but play games and hang out with my honey : ))
But for how long?- 5 years, 10 years? - this would be like being retired - do you want to live like that for the rest of your life?
Edit: another thing - hang out with your honey - can be very problematic - so far you never had to be with her for long all day round. This will be a surprise to you, what that actually means, if you have to do that with no other interests than those, you just described.
You are assuming an awful lot here. We are the most amazing and close couple on the planet. She is my bestest friend of all time. We have adjoining desks. We sit right next to each other as we game everyday. I spend more time with her than I do working or sleeping. We literally NEVER do anything without each other. We don't have separate anything. I couldn't ever get tired of being with her.
Ok, that is a special case then - I love my partner as well, but she would drive me nuts, if I would have her around all the time. I like to be with her, but I like as well to be apart from her and do my own thing - I could not live like you do, but I accept, what you said about your relationship - it would just not be for me at all.0 -
Luigi_Vampa✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »Let them keep it.. I don't know how to do their job, and overall, I am happy with the product that they offer to me
I am as well.....I am not a hater here.........just there is a distinct difference skyrim and the eso model.
Duh. Skyrim is single-player and ESO is multi-player.
Duh. Then I should be able to do the same exact thing just like in oblivion......and skyrim........just online.......not a portion of it.......give me these games and allow me to do what I do there......online. Oh wait I can't, its not the same game so call it something else. Duh.
And they are different games for a reason. One game is an MMO and the rest are not. As an MMO the game has certain needs that the others do not provide. For example: Swordplay in Skyrim is nothing but swinging said Sword, no special moves like ESO has or anything. Make an MMO out of Skyrim and you either get A) TESO or A Magicka-build-only game.
So yeah call TES1-5 and TESO what you like but a SRPG is a Singleplayer RPG and an MMORPG is an Massively Multiplayer Online RPG. You want Skyrim? Well go have fun playing it or wait 2 months for HD lol
I am not convinced about that - I think ESO would be a far more successful game if it would not have PvP at all - then it would be truely different from other MMOs out there and would not have most of the problems it has now. It would attract a different crowd and those who stood away from ESO due to that, would replace the PvP crowd - there would be an end to this cumbersome and endless balancing, because it is not required anymore and we could finally concentrate on roleplay stuff.
The game would have a population, which is interested in customization of their character and interesting roleplay - this means, a well done cash shop with reasonable prices would pay for the show - I would make it subscription-based again - to keep the kiddies out.
Every MMO NEEDS PvP though. I honestly do not know of a single one that has ever not had PvP. People LIKE to compete, and no PvP would rob them of that.
That is always the argument - until someone does it in a different way - innovation is not done by doing it like everyone else. There are many ways to compete, it does not have to be to kill each other - it attracts the wrong crowd, IMO - I would not want them as customers.
The wrong crowd? What is wrong with us PvPers?
Nothing, but the topic is about a hypothetical investment - and if that has to be invested into ESO - the game has to get to a whole new dimension to be a proper investment - and then I have to weed out, what costs a lot of money and does not make an amount equivalent to what they cost me - and then they are just wrong.
Edit: they are wrong, because they burn through content too quickly - one can never make them happy ever - different to casuals, who do not have the time to burn through the content quickly - I just have to make them stay, and the money is rolling in. second Life shows that something like that works - I just have to attract this kind of people and give them a world, in which they can do what they like best - socialize, role play, buy stuff from a reasonable crown store - this makes the money and is a win-win. Then give them the tools to create their own costumes and designs - approved by the votes in fashion shows - it is different of course, but it would bring in the coin. And this is what this topic was all about - wasn't it?
I just feel like you are confusing PvPers with hardcore progression PvEers. PvPers have basically been playing the same game since launch. Imperial City was more a PvE zone with PvP allowed. There were no PvP objectives originally. Since then they have added flags to IC and three towns. How exactly are we burning through content?
Yeah you are playing the same content - but you burnt through that content, what is THE GAME - all of Tamriel outside of Cyrrodil. Furthermore there is not much you would need from the crown store for your game play - this is what i get from the forums - you guys see it as fluff and not necessary - but this is earning the coin and I rather want people, who have an urge to buy pretty much everything what is on the crown store, than those, who think this is just fluff - I want paying customers, who are accommodated in every way they desire, but what I do not need are people, who are not interested in that kind of content, what makes the most money. As an investor I have to think like that.
People get annoyed at the fluff because there are many aspects of this game that are broken. Lag that has never been fixed is extra annoying when you feel like the devs are only interested in making digital clothes anymore. Step inside of Cyrodiil however and you will see many people who have crown store mounts and costumes. I don't really know if you can claim which people spend more money unless you have some actual numbers and data from ZOS, instead of these made up percentages.
To add on to crown store purchases I'd wadger that PvPers are more likely to buy race changes than the casual crowd due to the competetive nature of PvP. Many would also buy class changes if that was ever available. This could be quite profitable.
Anyway, I don't really need to argue what you think would be a good game. That is a hypothetical to anwser however you see fit. I just didn't like seeing PvPers as the "wrong crowd". For as toxic as people like to say the PvP community is, it is the casual PvE community that likes to call us cancer, and sociopaths, and that we might as well go torture animals because all we care about is causing suffering to others. (These are all things I've read on these forums in the last week or so.) It gets tiring listening to people who think we are awful for the game when all we want to do is fight and compete against people.PC/EU DC1 -
VincentBlanquin✭✭✭send my favourite dev on vacation
Irwen Vincinter - Nord - Dragonknight
Irw´en - Bosmer - Nightblade1 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »Let them keep it.. I don't know how to do their job, and overall, I am happy with the product that they offer to me
I am as well.....I am not a hater here.........just there is a distinct difference skyrim and the eso model.
Duh. Skyrim is single-player and ESO is multi-player.
Duh. Then I should be able to do the same exact thing just like in oblivion......and skyrim........just online.......not a portion of it.......give me these games and allow me to do what I do there......online. Oh wait I can't, its not the same game so call it something else. Duh.
And they are different games for a reason. One game is an MMO and the rest are not. As an MMO the game has certain needs that the others do not provide. For example: Swordplay in Skyrim is nothing but swinging said Sword, no special moves like ESO has or anything. Make an MMO out of Skyrim and you either get A) TESO or A Magicka-build-only game.
So yeah call TES1-5 and TESO what you like but a SRPG is a Singleplayer RPG and an MMORPG is an Massively Multiplayer Online RPG. You want Skyrim? Well go have fun playing it or wait 2 months for HD lol
I am not convinced about that - I think ESO would be a far more successful game if it would not have PvP at all - then it would be truely different from other MMOs out there and would not have most of the problems it has now. It would attract a different crowd and those who stood away from ESO due to that, would replace the PvP crowd - there would be an end to this cumbersome and endless balancing, because it is not required anymore and we could finally concentrate on roleplay stuff.
The game would have a population, which is interested in customization of their character and interesting roleplay - this means, a well done cash shop with reasonable prices would pay for the show - I would make it subscription-based again - to keep the kiddies out.
Every MMO NEEDS PvP though. I honestly do not know of a single one that has ever not had PvP. People LIKE to compete, and no PvP would rob them of that.
That is always the argument - until someone does it in a different way - innovation is not done by doing it like everyone else. There are many ways to compete, it does not have to be to kill each other - it attracts the wrong crowd, IMO - I would not want them as customers.
The wrong crowd? What is wrong with us PvPers?
Nothing, but the topic is about a hypothetical investment - and if that has to be invested into ESO - the game has to get to a whole new dimension to be a proper investment - and then I have to weed out, what costs a lot of money and does not make an amount equivalent to what they cost me - and then they are just wrong.
Edit: they are wrong, because they burn through content too quickly - one can never make them happy ever - different to casuals, who do not have the time to burn through the content quickly - I just have to make them stay, and the money is rolling in. second Life shows that something like that works - I just have to attract this kind of people and give them a world, in which they can do what they like best - socialize, role play, buy stuff from a reasonable crown store - this makes the money and is a win-win. Then give them the tools to create their own costumes and designs - approved by the votes in fashion shows - it is different of course, but it would bring in the coin. And this is what this topic was all about - wasn't it?
I just feel like you are confusing PvPers with hardcore progression PvEers. PvPers have basically been playing the same game since launch. Imperial City was more a PvE zone with PvP allowed. There were no PvP objectives originally. Since then they have added flags to IC and three towns. How exactly are we burning through content?
Yeah you are playing the same content - but you burnt through that content, what is THE GAME - all of Tamriel outside of Cyrrodil. Furthermore there is not much you would need from the crown store for your game play - this is what i get from the forums - you guys see it as fluff and not necessary - but this is earning the coin and I rather want people, who have an urge to buy pretty much everything what is on the crown store, than those, who think this is just fluff - I want paying customers, who are accommodated in every way they desire, but what I do not need are people, who are not interested in that kind of content, what makes the most money. As an investor I have to think like that.
People get annoyed at the fluff because there are many aspects of this game that are broken. Lag that has never been fixed is extra annoying when you feel like the devs are only interested in making digital clothes anymore. Step inside of Cyrodiil however and you will see many people who have crown store mounts and costumes. I don't really know if you can claim which people spend more money unless you have some actual numbers and data from ZOS, instead of these made up percentages.
To add on to crown store purchases I'd wadger that PvPers are more likely to buy race changes than the casual crowd due to the competetive nature of PvP. Many would also buy class changes if that was ever available. This could be quite profitable.
Anyway, I don't really need to argue what you think would be a good game. That is a hypothetical to anwser however you see fit. I just didn't like seeing PvPers as the "wrong crowd". For as toxic as people like to say the PvP community is, it is the casual PvE community that likes to call us cancer, and sociopaths, and that we might as well go torture animals because all we care about is causing suffering to others. (These are all things I've read on these forums in the last week or so.) It gets tiring listening to people who think we are awful for the game when all we want to do is fight and compete against people.
Well, the topic was about what I would change if I would have to invest that money - and then my focus is not "making a good game", but "making a game, which earns the coin required" - if it would be about making a good game without to have to think about costs and profits, I would do it in a different way - I just argued from the perspective of an investment.
If the OP would have said 50M or 90M - this wouild be a totally different kind of thing - but 500M is too much and then things have to be changed drastically - I would rather give that money to charity before buying ZOS and ESO at that price tag - because I think it would be a waste of money to do that - then rather benefit those, who are less fortunate in life.Edited by Lysette on August 18, 2016 3:58AM0 -
Luigi_Vampa✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »Let them keep it.. I don't know how to do their job, and overall, I am happy with the product that they offer to me
I am as well.....I am not a hater here.........just there is a distinct difference skyrim and the eso model.
Duh. Skyrim is single-player and ESO is multi-player.
Duh. Then I should be able to do the same exact thing just like in oblivion......and skyrim........just online.......not a portion of it.......give me these games and allow me to do what I do there......online. Oh wait I can't, its not the same game so call it something else. Duh.
And they are different games for a reason. One game is an MMO and the rest are not. As an MMO the game has certain needs that the others do not provide. For example: Swordplay in Skyrim is nothing but swinging said Sword, no special moves like ESO has or anything. Make an MMO out of Skyrim and you either get A) TESO or A Magicka-build-only game.
So yeah call TES1-5 and TESO what you like but a SRPG is a Singleplayer RPG and an MMORPG is an Massively Multiplayer Online RPG. You want Skyrim? Well go have fun playing it or wait 2 months for HD lol
I am not convinced about that - I think ESO would be a far more successful game if it would not have PvP at all - then it would be truely different from other MMOs out there and would not have most of the problems it has now. It would attract a different crowd and those who stood away from ESO due to that, would replace the PvP crowd - there would be an end to this cumbersome and endless balancing, because it is not required anymore and we could finally concentrate on roleplay stuff.
The game would have a population, which is interested in customization of their character and interesting roleplay - this means, a well done cash shop with reasonable prices would pay for the show - I would make it subscription-based again - to keep the kiddies out.
Every MMO NEEDS PvP though. I honestly do not know of a single one that has ever not had PvP. People LIKE to compete, and no PvP would rob them of that.
That is always the argument - until someone does it in a different way - innovation is not done by doing it like everyone else. There are many ways to compete, it does not have to be to kill each other - it attracts the wrong crowd, IMO - I would not want them as customers.
The wrong crowd? What is wrong with us PvPers?
Nothing, but the topic is about a hypothetical investment - and if that has to be invested into ESO - the game has to get to a whole new dimension to be a proper investment - and then I have to weed out, what costs a lot of money and does not make an amount equivalent to what they cost me - and then they are just wrong.
Edit: they are wrong, because they burn through content too quickly - one can never make them happy ever - different to casuals, who do not have the time to burn through the content quickly - I just have to make them stay, and the money is rolling in. second Life shows that something like that works - I just have to attract this kind of people and give them a world, in which they can do what they like best - socialize, role play, buy stuff from a reasonable crown store - this makes the money and is a win-win. Then give them the tools to create their own costumes and designs - approved by the votes in fashion shows - it is different of course, but it would bring in the coin. And this is what this topic was all about - wasn't it?
I just feel like you are confusing PvPers with hardcore progression PvEers. PvPers have basically been playing the same game since launch. Imperial City was more a PvE zone with PvP allowed. There were no PvP objectives originally. Since then they have added flags to IC and three towns. How exactly are we burning through content?
Yeah you are playing the same content - but you burnt through that content, what is THE GAME - all of Tamriel outside of Cyrrodil. Furthermore there is not much you would need from the crown store for your game play - this is what i get from the forums - you guys see it as fluff and not necessary - but this is earning the coin and I rather want people, who have an urge to buy pretty much everything what is on the crown store, than those, who think this is just fluff - I want paying customers, who are accommodated in every way they desire, but what I do not need are people, who are not interested in that kind of content, what makes the most money. As an investor I have to think like that.
People get annoyed at the fluff because there are many aspects of this game that are broken. Lag that has never been fixed is extra annoying when you feel like the devs are only interested in making digital clothes anymore. Step inside of Cyrodiil however and you will see many people who have crown store mounts and costumes. I don't really know if you can claim which people spend more money unless you have some actual numbers and data from ZOS, instead of these made up percentages.
To add on to crown store purchases I'd wadger that PvPers are more likely to buy race changes than the casual crowd due to the competetive nature of PvP. Many would also buy class changes if that was ever available. This could be quite profitable.
Anyway, I don't really need to argue what you think would be a good game. That is a hypothetical to anwser however you see fit. I just didn't like seeing PvPers as the "wrong crowd". For as toxic as people like to say the PvP community is, it is the casual PvE community that likes to call us cancer, and sociopaths, and that we might as well go torture animals because all we care about is causing suffering to others. (These are all things I've read on these forums in the last week or so.) It gets tiring listening to people who think we are awful for the game when all we want to do is fight and compete against people.
Well, the topic was about what I would change if I would have to invest that money - and then my focus is not "making a good game", but "making a game, which earns the coin required" - if it would be about making a good game without to have to think about costs and profits, I would do it in a different way - I just argued from the perspective of an investment.
Okay, my point stands. I'm not interested in debating what you think would make a profitable game. So far you have just used made up percentages so there isn't even any objective thing to debate. I was challenging your negetive view of PvPers. If you think they aren't a profitable playerbase, I won't argue because I don't have actual data on that. It is just opinion. If, however, you think PvPers are bad people that you wouldn't want in your game because they are toxic and drive others away, I'd have some objections.PC/EU DC0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »Let them keep it.. I don't know how to do their job, and overall, I am happy with the product that they offer to me
I am as well.....I am not a hater here.........just there is a distinct difference skyrim and the eso model.
Duh. Skyrim is single-player and ESO is multi-player.
Duh. Then I should be able to do the same exact thing just like in oblivion......and skyrim........just online.......not a portion of it.......give me these games and allow me to do what I do there......online. Oh wait I can't, its not the same game so call it something else. Duh.
And they are different games for a reason. One game is an MMO and the rest are not. As an MMO the game has certain needs that the others do not provide. For example: Swordplay in Skyrim is nothing but swinging said Sword, no special moves like ESO has or anything. Make an MMO out of Skyrim and you either get A) TESO or A Magicka-build-only game.
So yeah call TES1-5 and TESO what you like but a SRPG is a Singleplayer RPG and an MMORPG is an Massively Multiplayer Online RPG. You want Skyrim? Well go have fun playing it or wait 2 months for HD lol
I am not convinced about that - I think ESO would be a far more successful game if it would not have PvP at all - then it would be truely different from other MMOs out there and would not have most of the problems it has now. It would attract a different crowd and those who stood away from ESO due to that, would replace the PvP crowd - there would be an end to this cumbersome and endless balancing, because it is not required anymore and we could finally concentrate on roleplay stuff.
The game would have a population, which is interested in customization of their character and interesting roleplay - this means, a well done cash shop with reasonable prices would pay for the show - I would make it subscription-based again - to keep the kiddies out.
Every MMO NEEDS PvP though. I honestly do not know of a single one that has ever not had PvP. People LIKE to compete, and no PvP would rob them of that.
That is always the argument - until someone does it in a different way - innovation is not done by doing it like everyone else. There are many ways to compete, it does not have to be to kill each other - it attracts the wrong crowd, IMO - I would not want them as customers.
The wrong crowd? What is wrong with us PvPers?
Nothing, but the topic is about a hypothetical investment - and if that has to be invested into ESO - the game has to get to a whole new dimension to be a proper investment - and then I have to weed out, what costs a lot of money and does not make an amount equivalent to what they cost me - and then they are just wrong.
Edit: they are wrong, because they burn through content too quickly - one can never make them happy ever - different to casuals, who do not have the time to burn through the content quickly - I just have to make them stay, and the money is rolling in. second Life shows that something like that works - I just have to attract this kind of people and give them a world, in which they can do what they like best - socialize, role play, buy stuff from a reasonable crown store - this makes the money and is a win-win. Then give them the tools to create their own costumes and designs - approved by the votes in fashion shows - it is different of course, but it would bring in the coin. And this is what this topic was all about - wasn't it?
I just feel like you are confusing PvPers with hardcore progression PvEers. PvPers have basically been playing the same game since launch. Imperial City was more a PvE zone with PvP allowed. There were no PvP objectives originally. Since then they have added flags to IC and three towns. How exactly are we burning through content?
Yeah you are playing the same content - but you burnt through that content, what is THE GAME - all of Tamriel outside of Cyrrodil. Furthermore there is not much you would need from the crown store for your game play - this is what i get from the forums - you guys see it as fluff and not necessary - but this is earning the coin and I rather want people, who have an urge to buy pretty much everything what is on the crown store, than those, who think this is just fluff - I want paying customers, who are accommodated in every way they desire, but what I do not need are people, who are not interested in that kind of content, what makes the most money. As an investor I have to think like that.
People get annoyed at the fluff because there are many aspects of this game that are broken. Lag that has never been fixed is extra annoying when you feel like the devs are only interested in making digital clothes anymore. Step inside of Cyrodiil however and you will see many people who have crown store mounts and costumes. I don't really know if you can claim which people spend more money unless you have some actual numbers and data from ZOS, instead of these made up percentages.
To add on to crown store purchases I'd wadger that PvPers are more likely to buy race changes than the casual crowd due to the competetive nature of PvP. Many would also buy class changes if that was ever available. This could be quite profitable.
Anyway, I don't really need to argue what you think would be a good game. That is a hypothetical to anwser however you see fit. I just didn't like seeing PvPers as the "wrong crowd". For as toxic as people like to say the PvP community is, it is the casual PvE community that likes to call us cancer, and sociopaths, and that we might as well go torture animals because all we care about is causing suffering to others. (These are all things I've read on these forums in the last week or so.) It gets tiring listening to people who think we are awful for the game when all we want to do is fight and compete against people.
Well, the topic was about what I would change if I would have to invest that money - and then my focus is not "making a good game", but "making a game, which earns the coin required" - if it would be about making a good game without to have to think about costs and profits, I would do it in a different way - I just argued from the perspective of an investment.
Okay, my point stands. I'm not interested in debating what you think would make a profitable game. So far you have just used made up percentages so there isn't even any objective thing to debate. I was challenging your negetive view of PvPers. If you think they aren't a profitable playerbase, I won't argue because I don't have actual data on that. It is just opinion. If, however, you think PvPers are bad people that you wouldn't want in your game because they are toxic and drive others away, I'd have some objections.
I do not have a general aversion to PvPers - I play EVE since 2008 and that is PvP everywhere - and I feel quite comfortable there. I did PvP in the past, but due to my lack of time to play, this has changed and now I am a causal carebear there - with a different meaning to what it is used here - it is not about wanting all easy, it is more about living a more industry/trade related life there now instead of doing a lot of PvP - I do that sometimes still, but it is no longer large scale battles, but small scale.
Edit: the only data I have is from EVE, because they show interesting data on fanfest - some years ago it was about what players do in the game - in an all pvp game that is - and it turned out that just about 20% take part in PvP - and that is where I took the percentage from, assuming that if this is that way in a PvP-everywhere game, then it will be even less in a mixed game.Edited by Lysette on August 18, 2016 4:16AM0 -
Thealteregoroman✭✭✭✭✭
✭Stovahkiin wrote: »If I had 500m, then why in the bloody hell would I waste it on ESO?
Cause you already are wasting your time and money on it.....****Master Healer...****1 -
SolarCat02✭✭✭✭✭If I had $500m, I would get into real estate, not the gaming market.
But if I had full control of the direction of this game? (I believe that is the actual question).
- I would change the RNG. The pure random doesn't really work, it's very frustrating. I would run some simulations on the test server, trying out tokens and also a weighted RNG (i.e. The longer it's been since you have gotten a particular item, the better a chance you will get it), to see which works better for what situation. Both have their strengths. And for goodness sake, nobody should be getting underleveled gear from max level monsters on a max level character. (Exceptions made for the weapons from DSA and Maelstrom of course; obtaining the next level down for doing normal mode rather than veteran is a fair compromise to consider).
- I would prioritize the more annoying bugs, and try to fix them on a faster timescale. Visual stuff isn't as big deal (although it's still nice to fix). You will lose more people to a crashing location or a broken group finder, though, than you do for a ponytail sticking through a shield or a bear that sometimes turns metallic green for no reason. The game breaker fixes should be pushed ASAP (at a less popular time of day for the server, unless it's a huge deal), while the nice-to-haves can piggyback off the next update, critical patch, or DLC.
- Actual GMs in game, on PC and Console. You don't need to have a ton online at the same time, but some are needed, and they need to be visible. Maybe also involve the community some, with especially helpful players being given some basic moderator abilities. (Nothing anyone could use to cheat, because these would be players actually playing the game, and it's unfair to all players to add that temptation for some! But maybe a beefed up "Reporting" option, or a way to summon an in-game GM; abilities that would be lost if abused. This way there could be community assistance to help the GMs filter through everything to find the things most in need of immediate attention, like cheating-in-progress or a very toxic player in chat scaring off the newbies.)
Just my thoughts.Why be normal when you can be better?
Elissandra Ravenwing, Magicka Dragonknight Healer
Lady Kalila, Stamina Templar DPS
Stands-in-Danger, Nightblade Saptank
Zalarah, Stamina Dragonknight DPS0 -
Luigi_Vampa✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »Let them keep it.. I don't know how to do their job, and overall, I am happy with the product that they offer to me
I am as well.....I am not a hater here.........just there is a distinct difference skyrim and the eso model.
Duh. Skyrim is single-player and ESO is multi-player.
Duh. Then I should be able to do the same exact thing just like in oblivion......and skyrim........just online.......not a portion of it.......give me these games and allow me to do what I do there......online. Oh wait I can't, its not the same game so call it something else. Duh.
And they are different games for a reason. One game is an MMO and the rest are not. As an MMO the game has certain needs that the others do not provide. For example: Swordplay in Skyrim is nothing but swinging said Sword, no special moves like ESO has or anything. Make an MMO out of Skyrim and you either get A) TESO or A Magicka-build-only game.
So yeah call TES1-5 and TESO what you like but a SRPG is a Singleplayer RPG and an MMORPG is an Massively Multiplayer Online RPG. You want Skyrim? Well go have fun playing it or wait 2 months for HD lol
I am not convinced about that - I think ESO would be a far more successful game if it would not have PvP at all - then it would be truely different from other MMOs out there and would not have most of the problems it has now. It would attract a different crowd and those who stood away from ESO due to that, would replace the PvP crowd - there would be an end to this cumbersome and endless balancing, because it is not required anymore and we could finally concentrate on roleplay stuff.
The game would have a population, which is interested in customization of their character and interesting roleplay - this means, a well done cash shop with reasonable prices would pay for the show - I would make it subscription-based again - to keep the kiddies out.
Every MMO NEEDS PvP though. I honestly do not know of a single one that has ever not had PvP. People LIKE to compete, and no PvP would rob them of that.
That is always the argument - until someone does it in a different way - innovation is not done by doing it like everyone else. There are many ways to compete, it does not have to be to kill each other - it attracts the wrong crowd, IMO - I would not want them as customers.
The wrong crowd? What is wrong with us PvPers?
Nothing, but the topic is about a hypothetical investment - and if that has to be invested into ESO - the game has to get to a whole new dimension to be a proper investment - and then I have to weed out, what costs a lot of money and does not make an amount equivalent to what they cost me - and then they are just wrong.
Edit: they are wrong, because they burn through content too quickly - one can never make them happy ever - different to casuals, who do not have the time to burn through the content quickly - I just have to make them stay, and the money is rolling in. second Life shows that something like that works - I just have to attract this kind of people and give them a world, in which they can do what they like best - socialize, role play, buy stuff from a reasonable crown store - this makes the money and is a win-win. Then give them the tools to create their own costumes and designs - approved by the votes in fashion shows - it is different of course, but it would bring in the coin. And this is what this topic was all about - wasn't it?
I just feel like you are confusing PvPers with hardcore progression PvEers. PvPers have basically been playing the same game since launch. Imperial City was more a PvE zone with PvP allowed. There were no PvP objectives originally. Since then they have added flags to IC and three towns. How exactly are we burning through content?
Yeah you are playing the same content - but you burnt through that content, what is THE GAME - all of Tamriel outside of Cyrrodil. Furthermore there is not much you would need from the crown store for your game play - this is what i get from the forums - you guys see it as fluff and not necessary - but this is earning the coin and I rather want people, who have an urge to buy pretty much everything what is on the crown store, than those, who think this is just fluff - I want paying customers, who are accommodated in every way they desire, but what I do not need are people, who are not interested in that kind of content, what makes the most money. As an investor I have to think like that.
People get annoyed at the fluff because there are many aspects of this game that are broken. Lag that has never been fixed is extra annoying when you feel like the devs are only interested in making digital clothes anymore. Step inside of Cyrodiil however and you will see many people who have crown store mounts and costumes. I don't really know if you can claim which people spend more money unless you have some actual numbers and data from ZOS, instead of these made up percentages.
To add on to crown store purchases I'd wadger that PvPers are more likely to buy race changes than the casual crowd due to the competetive nature of PvP. Many would also buy class changes if that was ever available. This could be quite profitable.
Anyway, I don't really need to argue what you think would be a good game. That is a hypothetical to anwser however you see fit. I just didn't like seeing PvPers as the "wrong crowd". For as toxic as people like to say the PvP community is, it is the casual PvE community that likes to call us cancer, and sociopaths, and that we might as well go torture animals because all we care about is causing suffering to others. (These are all things I've read on these forums in the last week or so.) It gets tiring listening to people who think we are awful for the game when all we want to do is fight and compete against people.
Well, the topic was about what I would change if I would have to invest that money - and then my focus is not "making a good game", but "making a game, which earns the coin required" - if it would be about making a good game without to have to think about costs and profits, I would do it in a different way - I just argued from the perspective of an investment.
Okay, my point stands. I'm not interested in debating what you think would make a profitable game. So far you have just used made up percentages so there isn't even any objective thing to debate. I was challenging your negetive view of PvPers. If you think they aren't a profitable playerbase, I won't argue because I don't have actual data on that. It is just opinion. If, however, you think PvPers are bad people that you wouldn't want in your game because they are toxic and drive others away, I'd have some objections.
I do not have a general aversion to PvPers - I play EVE since 2008 and that is PvP everywhere - and I feel quite comfortable there. I did PvP in the past, but due to my lack of time to play, this has changed and now I am a causal carebear there - with a different meaning to what it is used here - it is not about wanting all easy, it is more about living a more industry/trade related life there now instead of doing a lot of PvP - I do that sometimes still, but it is no longer large scale battles, but small scale.
Edit: the only data I have is from EVE, because they show interesting data on fanfest - some years ago it was about what players do in the game - in an all pvp game that is - and it turned out that just about 20% take part in PvP - and that is where I took the percentage from, assuming that if this is that way in a PvP-everywhere game, then it will be even less in a mixed game.
Although EVE is an open world PvP game, I feel like more players are interested in the trading, market analysis and complex economy rather than combat. I don't know, I've played very little of EVE. For me, although I love the world of Tamriel and its lore. I'm really only interested in combat in this game. PvP is all I really care to do because I can't immerse myself in ESO like I can in the single player titles.PC/EU DC0 -
Thealteregoroman✭✭✭✭✭
✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »Let them keep it.. I don't know how to do their job, and overall, I am happy with the product that they offer to me
I am as well.....I am not a hater here.........just there is a distinct difference skyrim and the eso model.
Duh. Skyrim is single-player and ESO is multi-player.
Duh. Then I should be able to do the same exact thing just like in oblivion......and skyrim........just online.......not a portion of it.......give me these games and allow me to do what I do there......online. Oh wait I can't, its not the same game so call it something else. Duh.
And they are different games for a reason. One game is an MMO and the rest are not. As an MMO the game has certain needs that the others do not provide. For example: Swordplay in Skyrim is nothing but swinging said Sword, no special moves like ESO has or anything. Make an MMO out of Skyrim and you either get A) TESO or A Magicka-build-only game.
So yeah call TES1-5 and TESO what you like but a SRPG is a Singleplayer RPG and an MMORPG is an Massively Multiplayer Online RPG. You want Skyrim? Well go have fun playing it or wait 2 months for HD lol
I am not convinced about that - I think ESO would be a far more successful game if it would not have PvP at all - then it would be truely different from other MMOs out there and would not have most of the problems it has now. It would attract a different crowd and those who stood away from ESO due to that, would replace the PvP crowd - there would be an end to this cumbersome and endless balancing, because it is not required anymore and we could finally concentrate on roleplay stuff.
The game would have a population, which is interested in customization of their character and interesting roleplay - this means, a well done cash shop with reasonable prices would pay for the show - I would make it subscription-based again - to keep the kiddies out.
Every MMO NEEDS PvP though. I honestly do not know of a single one that has ever not had PvP. People LIKE to compete, and no PvP would rob them of that.
That is always the argument - until someone does it in a different way - innovation is not done by doing it like everyone else. There are many ways to compete, it does not have to be to kill each other - it attracts the wrong crowd, IMO - I would not want them as customers.
PvE competes by trying to outdo one another, PvP outright competes. No matter how you slice it competition is in every game, somehow or another.
Well why can't we have a eso like GTA...........I can enter your game or we can make private games or have duels in arena?****Master Healer...****0 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Thealteregoroman wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »Let them keep it.. I don't know how to do their job, and overall, I am happy with the product that they offer to me
I am as well.....I am not a hater here.........just there is a distinct difference skyrim and the eso model.
Duh. Skyrim is single-player and ESO is multi-player.
Duh. Then I should be able to do the same exact thing just like in oblivion......and skyrim........just online.......not a portion of it.......give me these games and allow me to do what I do there......online. Oh wait I can't, its not the same game so call it something else. Duh.
And they are different games for a reason. One game is an MMO and the rest are not. As an MMO the game has certain needs that the others do not provide. For example: Swordplay in Skyrim is nothing but swinging said Sword, no special moves like ESO has or anything. Make an MMO out of Skyrim and you either get A) TESO or A Magicka-build-only game.
So yeah call TES1-5 and TESO what you like but a SRPG is a Singleplayer RPG and an MMORPG is an Massively Multiplayer Online RPG. You want Skyrim? Well go have fun playing it or wait 2 months for HD lol
I am not convinced about that - I think ESO would be a far more successful game if it would not have PvP at all - then it would be truely different from other MMOs out there and would not have most of the problems it has now. It would attract a different crowd and those who stood away from ESO due to that, would replace the PvP crowd - there would be an end to this cumbersome and endless balancing, because it is not required anymore and we could finally concentrate on roleplay stuff.
The game would have a population, which is interested in customization of their character and interesting roleplay - this means, a well done cash shop with reasonable prices would pay for the show - I would make it subscription-based again - to keep the kiddies out.
Every MMO NEEDS PvP though. I honestly do not know of a single one that has ever not had PvP. People LIKE to compete, and no PvP would rob them of that.
That is always the argument - until someone does it in a different way - innovation is not done by doing it like everyone else. There are many ways to compete, it does not have to be to kill each other - it attracts the wrong crowd, IMO - I would not want them as customers.
The wrong crowd? What is wrong with us PvPers?
Nothing, but the topic is about a hypothetical investment - and if that has to be invested into ESO - the game has to get to a whole new dimension to be a proper investment - and then I have to weed out, what costs a lot of money and does not make an amount equivalent to what they cost me - and then they are just wrong.
Edit: they are wrong, because they burn through content too quickly - one can never make them happy ever - different to casuals, who do not have the time to burn through the content quickly - I just have to make them stay, and the money is rolling in. second Life shows that something like that works - I just have to attract this kind of people and give them a world, in which they can do what they like best - socialize, role play, buy stuff from a reasonable crown store - this makes the money and is a win-win. Then give them the tools to create their own costumes and designs - approved by the votes in fashion shows - it is different of course, but it would bring in the coin. And this is what this topic was all about - wasn't it?
I just feel like you are confusing PvPers with hardcore progression PvEers. PvPers have basically been playing the same game since launch. Imperial City was more a PvE zone with PvP allowed. There were no PvP objectives originally. Since then they have added flags to IC and three towns. How exactly are we burning through content?
Yeah you are playing the same content - but you burnt through that content, what is THE GAME - all of Tamriel outside of Cyrrodil. Furthermore there is not much you would need from the crown store for your game play - this is what i get from the forums - you guys see it as fluff and not necessary - but this is earning the coin and I rather want people, who have an urge to buy pretty much everything what is on the crown store, than those, who think this is just fluff - I want paying customers, who are accommodated in every way they desire, but what I do not need are people, who are not interested in that kind of content, what makes the most money. As an investor I have to think like that.
People get annoyed at the fluff because there are many aspects of this game that are broken. Lag that has never been fixed is extra annoying when you feel like the devs are only interested in making digital clothes anymore. Step inside of Cyrodiil however and you will see many people who have crown store mounts and costumes. I don't really know if you can claim which people spend more money unless you have some actual numbers and data from ZOS, instead of these made up percentages.
To add on to crown store purchases I'd wadger that PvPers are more likely to buy race changes than the casual crowd due to the competetive nature of PvP. Many would also buy class changes if that was ever available. This could be quite profitable.
Anyway, I don't really need to argue what you think would be a good game. That is a hypothetical to anwser however you see fit. I just didn't like seeing PvPers as the "wrong crowd". For as toxic as people like to say the PvP community is, it is the casual PvE community that likes to call us cancer, and sociopaths, and that we might as well go torture animals because all we care about is causing suffering to others. (These are all things I've read on these forums in the last week or so.) It gets tiring listening to people who think we are awful for the game when all we want to do is fight and compete against people.
Well, the topic was about what I would change if I would have to invest that money - and then my focus is not "making a good game", but "making a game, which earns the coin required" - if it would be about making a good game without to have to think about costs and profits, I would do it in a different way - I just argued from the perspective of an investment.
Okay, my point stands. I'm not interested in debating what you think would make a profitable game. So far you have just used made up percentages so there isn't even any objective thing to debate. I was challenging your negetive view of PvPers. If you think they aren't a profitable playerbase, I won't argue because I don't have actual data on that. It is just opinion. If, however, you think PvPers are bad people that you wouldn't want in your game because they are toxic and drive others away, I'd have some objections.
I do not have a general aversion to PvPers - I play EVE since 2008 and that is PvP everywhere - and I feel quite comfortable there. I did PvP in the past, but due to my lack of time to play, this has changed and now I am a causal carebear there - with a different meaning to what it is used here - it is not about wanting all easy, it is more about living a more industry/trade related life there now instead of doing a lot of PvP - I do that sometimes still, but it is no longer large scale battles, but small scale.
Edit: the only data I have is from EVE, because they show interesting data on fanfest - some years ago it was about what players do in the game - in an all pvp game that is - and it turned out that just about 20% take part in PvP - and that is where I took the percentage from, assuming that if this is that way in a PvP-everywhere game, then it will be even less in a mixed game.
Although EVE is an open world PvP game, I feel like more players are interested in the trading, market analysis and complex economy rather than combat. I don't know, I've played very little of EVE. For me, although I love the world of Tamriel and its lore. I'm really only interested in combat in this game. PvP is all I really care to do because I can't immerse myself in ESO like I can in the single player titles.
it is both - because combat is just the other side of the same coin in EVE - if you want a thriving market you need PvP to destroy stuff - and lots of it for a healthy economy in EVE - so PvP is beneficial, both sides need each other and depend on each other - you cannot produce and sell your stuff, if there is no demand for it - and that demand is created by destruction.0 -
Thealteregoroman✭✭✭✭✭
✭TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »Don't they have like a billion dollars, I doubt 500,000,000 would be enough.
Do not mix Zenimax with Zenimax online studio - ZOS is not worth that - not even close. I would probably think about it when it would cost 90M, with a few demands, I have stated in a post above. But it is not worth 500M, this is for certain.
Edit: you have to see it like that - ESO could be a cash cow for about 5 years to come - not much more, than TES VI will be there and ESO will be outdated and slowly die off - so those 500M have to come in in those 5 years plus a decent interest rate of at least 12.7% p.a., more would be better, because with just 12.7% it would not be a really good investment - and this after costs and taxes.
So it has to make about double of it before taxes - so we have per year 200M as ROI and roughtly 125M as revenue - before costs - we have to see the running costs as well for staff, equipment, offices and so on - this will never come in from ESO - so it is not worth 500M.
You think the game will die off once the new elder scrolls come out?****Master Healer...****0 -
Thealteregoroman✭✭✭✭✭
✭FireCowCommando wrote: »Sometimes its better to buy a thing just to watch it burn
RUDE!!!****Master Healer...****0
