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Lets Balance Radiant Destruction
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Hashtag_✭✭✭✭✭
A range of 10-14 meters, which will make the skill not affected by "Reach" in PvP is plenty of distance for PvE.timidobserver wrote: »I'm honestly not one for nerfs. It something has to be done about Radiant. I mainly play stamplar and magplar.
RD, when someone is at 30% health is almost instant death. Now, skills such as reverse slice can maybe one shot people at that low. Thing is, it's melee range and can be dodged.
Radiant's range really does need nerfing. You can't even escape a group reliably if one guy has Radiant. Just keep spamming it on and as soon as someone else hits you, game over. I think a range reduction would work, without really hurting pve at all.
A range reduction would cause issues for some builds in PvE just because the execute range would have a shorter range than some skills. That is the issue with how balancing is done in this game. Templar is not a top PvE DPS ATM, which means that they don't deserve even the smallest nerf to their DPS skills, but PvP balancing would require them to eat the nerf anyway.
1 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
A range of 10-14 meters, which will make the skill not affected by "Reach" in PvP is plenty of distance for PvE.timidobserver wrote: »I'm honestly not one for nerfs. It something has to be done about Radiant. I mainly play stamplar and magplar.
RD, when someone is at 30% health is almost instant death. Now, skills such as reverse slice can maybe one shot people at that low. Thing is, it's melee range and can be dodged.
Radiant's range really does need nerfing. You can't even escape a group reliably if one guy has Radiant. Just keep spamming it on and as soon as someone else hits you, game over. I think a range reduction would work, without really hurting pve at all.
A range reduction would cause issues for some builds in PvE just because the execute range would have a shorter range than some skills. That is the issue with how balancing is done in this game. Templar is not a top PvE DPS ATM, which means that they don't deserve even the smallest nerf to their DPS skills, but PvP balancing would require them to eat the nerf anyway.
Yeh Templar could work around it, but they should not have to eat a nerf over PvP when they are not over performing in PvE.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
Sandman929✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
A range of 10-14 meters, which will make the skill not affected by "Reach" in PvP is plenty of distance for PvE.timidobserver wrote: »I'm honestly not one for nerfs. It something has to be done about Radiant. I mainly play stamplar and magplar.
RD, when someone is at 30% health is almost instant death. Now, skills such as reverse slice can maybe one shot people at that low. Thing is, it's melee range and can be dodged.
Radiant's range really does need nerfing. You can't even escape a group reliably if one guy has Radiant. Just keep spamming it on and as soon as someone else hits you, game over. I think a range reduction would work, without really hurting pve at all.
A range reduction would cause issues for some builds in PvE just because the execute range would have a shorter range than some skills. That is the issue with how balancing is done in this game. Templar is not a top PvE DPS ATM, which means that they don't deserve even the smallest nerf to their DPS skills, but PvP balancing would require them to eat the nerf anyway.
I don't think there's a problem with the execute as it is right now, and I don't think there's a problem with this suggested change.1 -
Hashtag_✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »
A range of 10-14 meters, which will make the skill not affected by "Reach" in PvP is plenty of distance for PvE.timidobserver wrote: »I'm honestly not one for nerfs. It something has to be done about Radiant. I mainly play stamplar and magplar.
RD, when someone is at 30% health is almost instant death. Now, skills such as reverse slice can maybe one shot people at that low. Thing is, it's melee range and can be dodged.
Radiant's range really does need nerfing. You can't even escape a group reliably if one guy has Radiant. Just keep spamming it on and as soon as someone else hits you, game over. I think a range reduction would work, without really hurting pve at all.
A range reduction would cause issues for some builds in PvE just because the execute range would have a shorter range than some skills. That is the issue with how balancing is done in this game. Templar is not a top PvE DPS ATM, which means that they don't deserve even the smallest nerf to their DPS skills, but PvP balancing would require them to eat the nerf anyway.
Yeh Templar could work around it, but they should not have to eat a nerf over PvP when they are not over performing in PvE.
How is shortening a distance a nerf, honestly? You want to sit here and cry about a nerf, come on.0 -
Brrrofski✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »
A range of 10-14 meters, which will make the skill not affected by "Reach" in PvP is plenty of distance for PvE.timidobserver wrote: »I'm honestly not one for nerfs. It something has to be done about Radiant. I mainly play stamplar and magplar.
RD, when someone is at 30% health is almost instant death. Now, skills such as reverse slice can maybe one shot people at that low. Thing is, it's melee range and can be dodged.
Radiant's range really does need nerfing. You can't even escape a group reliably if one guy has Radiant. Just keep spamming it on and as soon as someone else hits you, game over. I think a range reduction would work, without really hurting pve at all.
A range reduction would cause issues for some builds in PvE just because the execute range would have a shorter range than some skills. That is the issue with how balancing is done in this game. Templar is not a top PvE DPS ATM, which means that they don't deserve even the smallest nerf to their DPS skills, but PvP balancing would require them to eat the nerf anyway.
Yeh Templar could work around it, but they should not have to eat a nerf over PvP when they are not over performing in PvE.
It would have little to no bearing in pve while making a huge difference on pvp. There are basically 4 options.
Reduce range
Reduce overall damage
Make it dodgeable (but only helps stam builds)
Take that first instant tick away.
2 of them really hurt pve. One only benefits stam builds. Reduction is the beat option.
I mean, if you're at 28 metres are you even in the fight? Most people are fighting way closer than that. What are you doing 28 metres away? For real?2 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »
A range of 10-14 meters, which will make the skill not affected by "Reach" in PvP is plenty of distance for PvE.timidobserver wrote: »I'm honestly not one for nerfs. It something has to be done about Radiant. I mainly play stamplar and magplar.
RD, when someone is at 30% health is almost instant death. Now, skills such as reverse slice can maybe one shot people at that low. Thing is, it's melee range and can be dodged.
Radiant's range really does need nerfing. You can't even escape a group reliably if one guy has Radiant. Just keep spamming it on and as soon as someone else hits you, game over. I think a range reduction would work, without really hurting pve at all.
A range reduction would cause issues for some builds in PvE just because the execute range would have a shorter range than some skills. That is the issue with how balancing is done in this game. Templar is not a top PvE DPS ATM, which means that they don't deserve even the smallest nerf to their DPS skills, but PvP balancing would require them to eat the nerf anyway.
Yeh Templar could work around it, but they should not have to eat a nerf over PvP when they are not over performing in PvE.
How is shortening a distance a nerf, honestly? You want to sit here and cry about a nerf, come on.
It means that any ranged DPS build would have to stand closer or lose DPS when they have to move closer for execute.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
Hashtag_✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »
A range of 10-14 meters, which will make the skill not affected by "Reach" in PvP is plenty of distance for PvE.timidobserver wrote: »I'm honestly not one for nerfs. It something has to be done about Radiant. I mainly play stamplar and magplar.
RD, when someone is at 30% health is almost instant death. Now, skills such as reverse slice can maybe one shot people at that low. Thing is, it's melee range and can be dodged.
Radiant's range really does need nerfing. You can't even escape a group reliably if one guy has Radiant. Just keep spamming it on and as soon as someone else hits you, game over. I think a range reduction would work, without really hurting pve at all.
A range reduction would cause issues for some builds in PvE just because the execute range would have a shorter range than some skills. That is the issue with how balancing is done in this game. Templar is not a top PvE DPS ATM, which means that they don't deserve even the smallest nerf to their DPS skills, but PvP balancing would require them to eat the nerf anyway.
Yeh Templar could work around it, but they should not have to eat a nerf over PvP when they are not over performing in PvE.
How is shortening a distance a nerf, honestly? You want to sit here and cry about a nerf, come on.
It means that any ranged DPS build would have to stand closer or lose DPS when they have to move closer for execute.
What templars are using ranged DPS though? Main bread and butter DPS for magplars is sweeps. They would likely be in the thick of the fight anyway. On rare occasions they are using dark flare but that isn't optimum DPS.0 -
Sandman929✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »
A range of 10-14 meters, which will make the skill not affected by "Reach" in PvP is plenty of distance for PvE.timidobserver wrote: »I'm honestly not one for nerfs. It something has to be done about Radiant. I mainly play stamplar and magplar.
RD, when someone is at 30% health is almost instant death. Now, skills such as reverse slice can maybe one shot people at that low. Thing is, it's melee range and can be dodged.
Radiant's range really does need nerfing. You can't even escape a group reliably if one guy has Radiant. Just keep spamming it on and as soon as someone else hits you, game over. I think a range reduction would work, without really hurting pve at all.
A range reduction would cause issues for some builds in PvE just because the execute range would have a shorter range than some skills. That is the issue with how balancing is done in this game. Templar is not a top PvE DPS ATM, which means that they don't deserve even the smallest nerf to their DPS skills, but PvP balancing would require them to eat the nerf anyway.
Yeh Templar could work around it, but they should not have to eat a nerf over PvP when they are not over performing in PvE.
It would have little to no bearing in pve while making a huge difference on pvp. There are basically 4 options.
Reduce range
Reduce overall damage
Make it dodgeable (but only helps stam builds)
Take that first instant tick away.
2 of them really hurt pve. One only benefits stam builds. Reduction is the beat option.
I mean, if you're at 28 metres are you even in the fight? Most people are fighting way closer than that. What are you doing 28 metres away? For real?
Some people like spamming it on full health targets just in case one gets knocked into execution range by someone else, and they don't want to admit that. Some people do the same thing and freely admit that. I don't think anyone using it as an actual execute would care about the range getting reduced to be under the limit to get the Reach passive.
I wouldn't want it dodgeable, and I don't like the idea of reducing damage on a mag ability with so many ridiculously high damage stam abilities in play.3 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »
A range of 10-14 meters, which will make the skill not affected by "Reach" in PvP is plenty of distance for PvE.timidobserver wrote: »I'm honestly not one for nerfs. It something has to be done about Radiant. I mainly play stamplar and magplar.
RD, when someone is at 30% health is almost instant death. Now, skills such as reverse slice can maybe one shot people at that low. Thing is, it's melee range and can be dodged.
Radiant's range really does need nerfing. You can't even escape a group reliably if one guy has Radiant. Just keep spamming it on and as soon as someone else hits you, game over. I think a range reduction would work, without really hurting pve at all.
A range reduction would cause issues for some builds in PvE just because the execute range would have a shorter range than some skills. That is the issue with how balancing is done in this game. Templar is not a top PvE DPS ATM, which means that they don't deserve even the smallest nerf to their DPS skills, but PvP balancing would require them to eat the nerf anyway.
Yeh Templar could work around it, but they should not have to eat a nerf over PvP when they are not over performing in PvE.
How is shortening a distance a nerf, honestly? You want to sit here and cry about a nerf, come on.
It means that any ranged DPS build would have to stand closer or lose DPS when they have to move closer for execute.
What templars are using ranged DPS though? Main bread and butter DPS for magplars is sweeps. They would likely be in the thick of the fight anyway. On rare occasions they are using dark flare but that isn't optimum DPS.
There are a few decent ranged DPS option for Templar. One really powerful one when fighting bosses that spawn mobs like all of the bosses in Vet Maw, but that is really irrelevant. It is still a noticeable nerf to ranged DPS builds, which as you pointed out, are already not the optimum DPS. Suboptimal DPS builds should not have to eat nerfs over PvP.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
frozywozy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I think it's more than time to buff magplar. They have been down the food chain for long enough.Frozn - Stamdk - AR50
Frosted - Magplar - AR50
Frodn - Magden - AR50
Warmed - Magblade - AR50
Mmfrozy - Magsorc - AR44
Necrozn - Magcro - AR32
Twitch.TV/FrozyTV
PvP Group Builds
“Small minds discuss people, average minds discuss events, and great minds discuss ideas.” -Eleanor Roosevelt- Fix Volendrung (spawn location - weapon white on the map causing the wielder to keep it forever - usable with emperorship)
- Remove / Change CPs System, remove current CP/noCP campaigns and introduce one 30days with lock, one with no locks
- Fix crashes when approaching a keep under attack because of bad / wrong rendering prioritization system
- Change emperorship to value faction score points and not alliance points - see this and this
- Fix long loading screens (mostly caused by players joining group out of rendering range)
- Add 2 more quickslots to the wheel or add a different wheel for sieges weaponry only
- Fix Balista Bolts not dealing damage on walls or doors if deployed at a certain place
- Release bigger battlegrounds with 8 to 16 players per team and only two teams
- Fix the permanent block animation - see examples : link1 link2 link3 link4 link5
- Gives players 10 minutes to get back into Cyrodiil after relogging / crashing
- Add a function to ignore the Claiming system of useless rewards
- Improve the Mailing System / Rewards of the Worthy stacking
- Assign specific group sizes to specific campaigns (24-16-8)
- Make forward camps impossible to place near objectives
- Make snares only available from ground effects abilities
- Change emperorship to last minimum 24hours
- Fix body sliding after cc breaking too quickly
- Remove Block Casting through Battle Spirit
- Fix the speed drop while jumping - see video
- Fix loading screens when keeps upgrade
- Fix Rams going crazy (spinning around)
- Bring back dynamic ulti regeneration
- Fix speed bug (abilities locked)
- Introduce dynamic population
- Lower population cap by 20%
- Add Snare Immunity potions
- Bring resurrection sickness
- Fix character desync
- Fix cc breaking bug
- Fix gap closer bug
- Fix health desync
- Fix combat bug
- Fix streak bug
- Fix server lag
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Astanphaeus✭✭✭✭✭
A range of 10-14 meters, which will make the skill not affected by "Reach" in PvP is plenty of distance for PvE.timidobserver wrote: »I'm honestly not one for nerfs. It something has to be done about Radiant. I mainly play stamplar and magplar.
RD, when someone is at 30% health is almost instant death. Now, skills such as reverse slice can maybe one shot people at that low. Thing is, it's melee range and can be dodged.
Radiant's range really does need nerfing. You can't even escape a group reliably if one guy has Radiant. Just keep spamming it on and as soon as someone else hits you, game over. I think a range reduction would work, without really hurting pve at all.
A range reduction would cause issues for some builds in PvE just because the execute range would have a shorter range than some skills. That is the issue with how balancing is done in this game. Templar is not a top PvE DPS ATM, which means that they don't deserve even the smallest nerf to their DPS skills, but PvP balancing would require them to eat the nerf anyway.
RD's range is fine if you just remove Reach from the game which is what I would like to see happen.0 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@zheg how do you feel about his "pre beaming"idea?
First, we both know zos wouldnt be able to code that without it bugging in some obscene way. Second, what would happen if they heal to just above 49%? The skill shouldnt scale even if the beam by itself brings them below the threshold again? Sounds pretty stacked against the skill.
As has been said before, an exhausting amount of times, stop comparing the functionality to instant cast executes. People expect the skill should never be used unless theyre super low hp, at that point, the fact that its a channel is largely irrelevant, youre expecting the skill to do instant execute damage. Its. A. Channel. Stop comparing it to other executes that are instant and significantly cheaper. There are many times when you launch a DF, jav, and go into a jesus beam so your buddy can continue the damage pressure. Its an intended function of the skill, just like mages wrath is meant to linger and fire off if your burst is strong enough. If they heal up and the chance to kill is lost, the templar can eat the magicka loss and cancel the beam or stand there like a derp and make themselves vulnerable.
RD does do instant execute damage at the first tick, also people spam it on you at 100% HP not just execute HP. No one spams any other execute in the game on someone at 100% other than RD. Doesn't that tell you RD is overperforming vs other executes?
No, it tells me there are a lot of FOTM morons playing templars because they heard that RD is EZ mode.
And, by the way, it is categorically false that sorcerers do not use their execute Mage's Fury against targets not in execute range, even full health. Indeed it is advantageous to do so.bob.ellisonb16_ESO wrote: »Let's get back on topic it's the most frustrating spell in the game and the solutions are simple (though might require slightly more skill)
Any one would be acceptable and not really a nerf.
1. Make it dodge rollable...
The skill was dodge rollable for 6 months and the opinion of templars, even those who believe the skill is stupid OP now, was that this completely ruined the skill. Been there, done that, anyone who is halfway honest and knowledgable knows it's NOT a reasonable solution
"Not really a nerf" - lol. You're right, it's not really a nerf. It's an evisceration.
*****
I still think the best compromise would be to prevent the spell from doing moderate damage and functioning as an execute. I do agree that is too much in the same package. Make the templar pick one or the other from their morph choices (I would have the moderate damage morph have some sort of buff/debuff otherwise it will not measure up).Edited by Joy_Division on July 22, 2016 10:11PMMake Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.5 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »@zheg how do you feel about his "pre beaming"idea?
First, we both know zos wouldnt be able to code that without it bugging in some obscene way. Second, what would happen if they heal to just above 49%? The skill shouldnt scale even if the beam by itself brings them below the threshold again? Sounds pretty stacked against the skill.
As has been said before, an exhausting amount of times, stop comparing the functionality to instant cast executes. People expect the skill should never be used unless theyre super low hp, at that point, the fact that its a channel is largely irrelevant, youre expecting the skill to do instant execute damage. Its. A. Channel. Stop comparing it to other executes that are instant and significantly cheaper. There are many times when you launch a DF, jav, and go into a jesus beam so your buddy can continue the damage pressure. Its an intended function of the skill, just like mages wrath is meant to linger and fire off if your burst is strong enough. If they heal up and the chance to kill is lost, the templar can eat the magicka loss and cancel the beam or stand there like a derp and make themselves vulnerable.
RD does do instant execute damage at the first tick, also people spam it on you at 100% HP not just execute HP. No one spams any other execute in the game on someone at 100% other than RD. Doesn't that tell you RD is overperforming vs other executes?
No, it tells me there are a lot of FOTM morons playing templars because they heard that RD is EZ mode.
And, by the way, it is categorically false that sorcerers do not use their execute Mage's Fury against targets not in execute range, even full health. Indeed it is advantageous to do so.bob.ellisonb16_ESO wrote: »Let's get back on topic it's the most frustrating spell in the game and the solutions are simple (though might require slightly more skill)
Any one would be acceptable and not really a nerf.
1. Make it dodge rollable...
The skill was dodge rollable for 6 months and the opinion of templars, even those who believe the skill is stupid OP now, was that this completely ruined the skill. Been there, done that, anyone who is halfway honest and knowledgable knows it's NOT a reasonable solution
"Not really a nerf" - lol. You're right, it's not really a nerf. It's an evisceration.
*****
I still think the best compromise would be to prevent the spell from doing moderate damage and functioning as an execute. I do agree that is too much in the same package. Make the templar pick one or the other from their morph choices (I would have the moderate damage morph have some sort of buff/debuff otherwise it will not measure up).
I used RD when it was dodgeroll, it worked fine then. It wasn't hard to use it as an actual execute, then hits 25% it's a instant death, you don't even see the beam the first tick hits so fast.
If people use it as an actual exeute like every other execute in the game and not someone to spam when they hit 50%~ so you can kill them in two ticks. Use it when there low and 1 tick range for instant death.@Hashtag_
Your statments are inaccurate. Rd does not do "execute" damage from the first tick. It is not an "execute". It's a channel with an execute component.
Your range suggestion is laughable. Let me guess, you play a stam based something with charge?
Ya you do...
RD is a execute... come on really.
What wrong with having to actually be in the fight to use an OP skill? It's execute thats a channel.
I have 4 magicka characters and two stamina. Anyone with even a bit of knowledge in this game and who has actually played more than 1 class knows this skill is OP.
The only thing a shorter range will do it cut down the full radiant FOTM idiots that are everywhere in cyrodiil.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...3 -
Destyran✭✭✭✭✭Lets balance nbs? Remove some of the dozens of buffs they have access too? Lets balance the fact that they nerfed wards to 6seconds long when magic toons only defense is 10-15k stam while a stam build has nearly 40k high stam regen crazy high dodge chance and its all from the same pool to cc break dodge roll sprint ohh and what about yhe fact the took Dbos away from magicka build because of pvp where in pve stam builds still do huge damage with ice comet. cant even use werewolf while stam can be a were wolf or a vamp and benifit from it. A stam nb can one shot players with incap? Some one can stand at the back of a zerg and snipe glitch same thing? RO isnt op you just see the channel damage quit thinking you have 40k health RO is the only counter to perma dodge chance/dodge roll high busrt stam builds that just lol at you while they bob and weave like ALI barely getting hit. Lets talk about balancing the game bot the fact that you cant 1v5 properly because jesus beam killed you. I have never had a problem fighting against this move ar all. I may get jesus beamed and dragon leaped occasionally but gg to the9 -
Hempyre✭✭✭✭No, it's not an execute. Why would it be channeled? Why would it snare the caster? Why would it have escalating damage rather than straight to its max %? Why would it have any other attributes? And it has more. It's a channeled skill with an execute component. Similar to how Poison Shot, and "spin to win" are skills with an execute component among other aspects but not executes solely.
Why does it matter when a player uses a skill? Who cares? What difference does it make? RD by itself is easy to heal out of. It doesn't hit for particularly much on its own. How is it different from any other range spam skill? I should only spam you with my staff? Or a bow? I can't fish with it? I can't use it to help keep back a rush because players hesitate? I'm only allowed to use my channeled skill that snares me when I use it as an actual execute only, and not for any other purposes I can contrive?
Do any of these questions sound ridiculous?
They should.
I play my toons the way I play them. I use the skills I slot, when, and how, and for whatever reason I choose. As do we all. And for the record, I'm in the fight, whether melee or ranged. Ranged skills are ranged...
There's no way in hell shortening the range of a channel to within near charge distance is balancing. That would make it a death sentence to use.
I get spammed by bow users all the time, multiples of them, using Poison Shot (an execute by your rationale) or Snipe. I get spammed by Surprise Attack, over and over again. Should we restrict just when and how frequently, or at what health range these skill should be available? As per most points, we have an execute not being used as such. We have a very effective skill being overutilised, but again, past it's intended purpose. We have a skill being spammed by a group of players that has an excessive reach. These are the bulk of the issues being claimed with RD, and they apply equally as well to several other skills. Hell Poison Shot does more damage per tick or use, doesn't snare, executes at the same hp range, AND can be animation cancelled/woven with LA or whatever to add substantially more dps. Where's your nerf call? Dodgeable you say? Not so much from stealth, Balanced...
I fish with Wrath sometimes on my sorc, helps to proc Frags. Is that not allowed either now because it's an execute?
Since when are play style choices relevant?
I don't know that RD is OP. I don't one shot people with it and I don't get one shot by it. That's just the build I play. If you're having those issues then maybe look more at the build you play.
Pro Tip: Even though it's a frequent addition to many of these types of posts, it doesn't strengthen your points to suggest anyone that disagrees with them is in some fashion "different", or unknowledgeable.Edited by Hempyre on July 24, 2016 11:53AM6 -
Lokey0024✭✭✭✭✭No, it's not an execute. Why would it be channeled? Why would it snare the caster? Why would it have escalating damage rather than straight to its max %? Why would it have any other attributes? And it has more. It's a channeled skill with an execute component. Similar to how Poison Shot, and "spin to win" are skills with an execute component among other aspects but not executes solely.
Why does it matter when a player uses a skill? Who cares? What difference does it make? RD by itself is easy to heal out of. It doesn't hit for particularly much on its own. How is it different from any other range spam skill? I should only spam you with my staff? Or a bow? I can't fish with it? I can't use it to help keep back a rush because players hesitate? I'm only allowed to use my channeled skill that snares me when I use it as an actual execute only, and not for any other purposes I can contrive?
Do any of these questions sound ridiculous?
They should.
I play my toons the way I play them. I use the skills I slot, when, and how, and for whatever reason I choose. As do we all. And for the record, I'm in the fight, whether melee or ranged. Ranged skills are ranged...
There's no way in hell shortening the range of a channel to within near charge distance is balancing. That would make it a death sentence to use.
I get spammed by bow users all the time, multiples of them, using Poison Shot (an execute by your rationale) or Snipe. I get spammed by Surprise Attack, over and over again. Should we restrict just when and how frequently, or at what health range these skill should be available? As per most points, we have an execute not being used as such. We have a very effective skill being overutilised, but again, past it's intended purpose. We have a skill being spammed by a group of players that has an excessive reach. These are the bulk of the issues being claimed with RD, and they apply equally as well to several other skills. Hell Poison Shot does more damage per tick or use, doesn't snare, executes at the same hp range, AND can be animation cancelled/woven with LA or whatever to add substantially more dps. Where's your nerf call? Dodgeable you say? Not so much from stealth, Balanced...
I fish with Wrath sometimes on my sorc, helps to proc Frags. Is that not allowed either now because it's an execute?
Since when are play style choices relevant?
I don't know that RD is OP. I don't one shot people with it and I don't get one shot by it. That's just the build I play. If you're having those issues then maybe look more at the build you play.
Pro Tip: Even though it's a frequent addition to many of these types of posts, it doesn't strengthen your points to suggest anyone that disagrees with them is in some fashion "different", or unknowledgeable.
If i shot you with poison injection and the initial damage was scaled up depending on your health, you would be getting more 10k death recaps for poison injection as the last.
Im all for keeping it like it is, if they make molten armernments reverted to be an execute. I will wtfbbq the full health RD spammers np.0 -
Darnathian✭✭✭✭✭
✭leepalmer95 wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »@zheg how do you feel about his "pre beaming"idea?
First, we both know zos wouldnt be able to code that without it bugging in some obscene way. Second, what would happen if they heal to just above 49%? The skill shouldnt scale even if the beam by itself brings them below the threshold again? Sounds pretty stacked against the skill.
As has been said before, an exhausting amount of times, stop comparing the functionality to instant cast executes. People expect the skill should never be used unless theyre super low hp, at that point, the fact that its a channel is largely irrelevant, youre expecting the skill to do instant execute damage. Its. A. Channel. Stop comparing it to other executes that are instant and significantly cheaper. There are many times when you launch a DF, jav, and go into a jesus beam so your buddy can continue the damage pressure. Its an intended function of the skill, just like mages wrath is meant to linger and fire off if your burst is strong enough. If they heal up and the chance to kill is lost, the templar can eat the magicka loss and cancel the beam or stand there like a derp and make themselves vulnerable.
RD does do instant execute damage at the first tick, also people spam it on you at 100% HP not just execute HP. No one spams any other execute in the game on someone at 100% other than RD. Doesn't that tell you RD is overperforming vs other executes?
No, it tells me there are a lot of FOTM morons playing templars because they heard that RD is EZ mode.
And, by the way, it is categorically false that sorcerers do not use their execute Mage's Fury against targets not in execute range, even full health. Indeed it is advantageous to do so.bob.ellisonb16_ESO wrote: »Let's get back on topic it's the most frustrating spell in the game and the solutions are simple (though might require slightly more skill)
Any one would be acceptable and not really a nerf.
1. Make it dodge rollable...
The skill was dodge rollable for 6 months and the opinion of templars, even those who believe the skill is stupid OP now, was that this completely ruined the skill. Been there, done that, anyone who is halfway honest and knowledgable knows it's NOT a reasonable solution
"Not really a nerf" - lol. You're right, it's not really a nerf. It's an evisceration.
*****
I still think the best compromise would be to prevent the spell from doing moderate damage and functioning as an execute. I do agree that is too much in the same package. Make the templar pick one or the other from their morph choices (I would have the moderate damage morph have some sort of buff/debuff otherwise it will not measure up).
I used RD when it was dodgeroll, it worked fine then. It wasn't hard to use it as an actual execute, then hits 25% it's a instant death, you don't even see the beam the first tick hits so fast.
If people use it as an actual exeute like every other execute in the game and not someone to spam when they hit 50%~ so you can kill them in two ticks. Use it when there low and 1 tick range for instant death.@Hashtag_
Your statments are inaccurate. Rd does not do "execute" damage from the first tick. It is not an "execute". It's a channel with an execute component.
Your range suggestion is laughable. Let me guess, you play a stam based something with charge?
Ya you do...
RD is a execute... come on really.
What wrong with having to actually be in the fight to use an OP skill? It's execute thats a channel.
I have 4 magicka characters and two stamina. Anyone with even a bit of knowledge in this game and who has actually played more than 1 class knows this skill is OP.
The only thing a shorter range will do it cut down the full radiant FOTM idiots that are everywhere in cyrodiil.
Wrong. Nerfing range is a huge deal to a class that has no mobility.
There are plenty of players in here that play multiple classes that have listed counters to everyone of the nerf whiners. They just choose not to listen.
And i can tell you own a templar toon. But obviously dont play it enough if you spout non sense loke that.Edited by Darnathian on July 24, 2016 10:40PM3 -
Hashtag_✭✭✭✭✭Darnathian wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »@zheg how do you feel about his "pre beaming"idea?
First, we both know zos wouldnt be able to code that without it bugging in some obscene way. Second, what would happen if they heal to just above 49%? The skill shouldnt scale even if the beam by itself brings them below the threshold again? Sounds pretty stacked against the skill.
As has been said before, an exhausting amount of times, stop comparing the functionality to instant cast executes. People expect the skill should never be used unless theyre super low hp, at that point, the fact that its a channel is largely irrelevant, youre expecting the skill to do instant execute damage. Its. A. Channel. Stop comparing it to other executes that are instant and significantly cheaper. There are many times when you launch a DF, jav, and go into a jesus beam so your buddy can continue the damage pressure. Its an intended function of the skill, just like mages wrath is meant to linger and fire off if your burst is strong enough. If they heal up and the chance to kill is lost, the templar can eat the magicka loss and cancel the beam or stand there like a derp and make themselves vulnerable.
RD does do instant execute damage at the first tick, also people spam it on you at 100% HP not just execute HP. No one spams any other execute in the game on someone at 100% other than RD. Doesn't that tell you RD is overperforming vs other executes?
No, it tells me there are a lot of FOTM morons playing templars because they heard that RD is EZ mode.
And, by the way, it is categorically false that sorcerers do not use their execute Mage's Fury against targets not in execute range, even full health. Indeed it is advantageous to do so.bob.ellisonb16_ESO wrote: »Let's get back on topic it's the most frustrating spell in the game and the solutions are simple (though might require slightly more skill)
Any one would be acceptable and not really a nerf.
1. Make it dodge rollable...
The skill was dodge rollable for 6 months and the opinion of templars, even those who believe the skill is stupid OP now, was that this completely ruined the skill. Been there, done that, anyone who is halfway honest and knowledgable knows it's NOT a reasonable solution
"Not really a nerf" - lol. You're right, it's not really a nerf. It's an evisceration.
*****
I still think the best compromise would be to prevent the spell from doing moderate damage and functioning as an execute. I do agree that is too much in the same package. Make the templar pick one or the other from their morph choices (I would have the moderate damage morph have some sort of buff/debuff otherwise it will not measure up).
I used RD when it was dodgeroll, it worked fine then. It wasn't hard to use it as an actual execute, then hits 25% it's a instant death, you don't even see the beam the first tick hits so fast.
If people use it as an actual exeute like every other execute in the game and not someone to spam when they hit 50%~ so you can kill them in two ticks. Use it when there low and 1 tick range for instant death.@Hashtag_
Your statments are inaccurate. Rd does not do "execute" damage from the first tick. It is not an "execute". It's a channel with an execute component.
Your range suggestion is laughable. Let me guess, you play a stam based something with charge?
Ya you do...
RD is a execute... come on really.
What wrong with having to actually be in the fight to use an OP skill? It's execute thats a channel.
I have 4 magicka characters and two stamina. Anyone with even a bit of knowledge in this game and who has actually played more than 1 class knows this skill is OP.
The only thing a shorter range will do it cut down the full radiant FOTM idiots that are everywhere in cyrodiil.
Wrong. Nerfing range is a huge deal to a class that has no mobility.
There are plenty of players in here that play multiple classes that have listed counters to everyone of the nerf whiners. They just choose not to listen.
And i cant tell you own a templar toon. But obviously dont play it enough if you spout non sense loke that.
The class has the best heals in the game, that is the exchange for not having mobility. Dk's tankiness is the exchange for not having mobility.1 -
Darnathian✭✭✭✭✭
✭Darnathian wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »@zheg how do you feel about his "pre beaming"idea?
First, we both know zos wouldnt be able to code that without it bugging in some obscene way. Second, what would happen if they heal to just above 49%? The skill shouldnt scale even if the beam by itself brings them below the threshold again? Sounds pretty stacked against the skill.
As has been said before, an exhausting amount of times, stop comparing the functionality to instant cast executes. People expect the skill should never be used unless theyre super low hp, at that point, the fact that its a channel is largely irrelevant, youre expecting the skill to do instant execute damage. Its. A. Channel. Stop comparing it to other executes that are instant and significantly cheaper. There are many times when you launch a DF, jav, and go into a jesus beam so your buddy can continue the damage pressure. Its an intended function of the skill, just like mages wrath is meant to linger and fire off if your burst is strong enough. If they heal up and the chance to kill is lost, the templar can eat the magicka loss and cancel the beam or stand there like a derp and make themselves vulnerable.
RD does do instant execute damage at the first tick, also people spam it on you at 100% HP not just execute HP. No one spams any other execute in the game on someone at 100% other than RD. Doesn't that tell you RD is overperforming vs other executes?
No, it tells me there are a lot of FOTM morons playing templars because they heard that RD is EZ mode.
And, by the way, it is categorically false that sorcerers do not use their execute Mage's Fury against targets not in execute range, even full health. Indeed it is advantageous to do so.bob.ellisonb16_ESO wrote: »Let's get back on topic it's the most frustrating spell in the game and the solutions are simple (though might require slightly more skill)
Any one would be acceptable and not really a nerf.
1. Make it dodge rollable...
The skill was dodge rollable for 6 months and the opinion of templars, even those who believe the skill is stupid OP now, was that this completely ruined the skill. Been there, done that, anyone who is halfway honest and knowledgable knows it's NOT a reasonable solution
"Not really a nerf" - lol. You're right, it's not really a nerf. It's an evisceration.
*****
I still think the best compromise would be to prevent the spell from doing moderate damage and functioning as an execute. I do agree that is too much in the same package. Make the templar pick one or the other from their morph choices (I would have the moderate damage morph have some sort of buff/debuff otherwise it will not measure up).
I used RD when it was dodgeroll, it worked fine then. It wasn't hard to use it as an actual execute, then hits 25% it's a instant death, you don't even see the beam the first tick hits so fast.
If people use it as an actual exeute like every other execute in the game and not someone to spam when they hit 50%~ so you can kill them in two ticks. Use it when there low and 1 tick range for instant death.@Hashtag_
Your statments are inaccurate. Rd does not do "execute" damage from the first tick. It is not an "execute". It's a channel with an execute component.
Your range suggestion is laughable. Let me guess, you play a stam based something with charge?
Ya you do...
RD is a execute... come on really.
What wrong with having to actually be in the fight to use an OP skill? It's execute thats a channel.
I have 4 magicka characters and two stamina. Anyone with even a bit of knowledge in this game and who has actually played more than 1 class knows this skill is OP.
The only thing a shorter range will do it cut down the full radiant FOTM idiots that are everywhere in cyrodiil.
Wrong. Nerfing range is a huge deal to a class that has no mobility.
There are plenty of players in here that play multiple classes that have listed counters to everyone of the nerf whiners. They just choose not to listen.
And i cant tell you own a templar toon. But obviously dont play it enough if you spout non sense loke that.
The class has the best heals in the game, that is the exchange for not having mobility. Dk's tankiness is the exchange for not having mobility.
God forbid they can kill anything to go with those healz.
The range of RD suits DF and Javelin perfectly. You want to kill them get in close and interupt them.
The game is balanced towards 1 on 1. And most agree there is no problem there.1 -
Hempyre✭✭✭✭If i shot you with poison injection and the initial damage was scaled up depending on your health, you would be getting more 10k death recaps for poison injection as the last.
Unless I was within execute range the initial tick wouldn't scale up but would do standard damage, just like RD. I'm not sure I understood what you were saying here, so clarify pls if I misunderstood.
0 -
Lokey0024✭✭✭✭✭If i shot you with poison injection and the initial damage was scaled up depending on your health, you would be getting more 10k death recaps for poison injection as the last.
Unless I was within execute range the initial tick wouldn't scale up but would do standard damage, just like RD. I'm not sure I understood what you were saying here, so clarify pls if I misunderstood.
RD has an impact tick that scales with health. If poison injection did it would hit for around 10k and execute you if you're under 25%. As it is right now it doesnt scale the impact dmg, just the dot tick.0 -
Zheg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭If i shot you with poison injection and the initial damage was scaled up depending on your health, you would be getting more 10k death recaps for poison injection as the last.
Unless I was within execute range the initial tick wouldn't scale up but would do standard damage, just like RD. I'm not sure I understood what you were saying here, so clarify pls if I misunderstood.
RD has an impact tick that scales with health. If poison injection did it would hit for around 10k and execute you if you're under 25%. As it is right now it doesnt scale the impact dmg, just the dot tick.
Poison Injection is also a one-time instant cast ability. It's almost like... they function differently because they're different skills. It's almost like RD functions differently from other executes that are instant cast. Whodathunkit.
No one has contributed an original thought to the topic in months. Let's stop having the same arguments over and over and over please?5 -
Lokey0024✭✭✭✭✭If i shot you with poison injection and the initial damage was scaled up depending on your health, you would be getting more 10k death recaps for poison injection as the last.
Unless I was within execute range the initial tick wouldn't scale up but would do standard damage, just like RD. I'm not sure I understood what you were saying here, so clarify pls if I misunderstood.
RD has an impact tick that scales with health. If poison injection did it would hit for around 10k and execute you if you're under 25%. As it is right now it doesnt scale the impact dmg, just the dot tick.
Poison Injection is also a one-time instant cast ability. It's almost like... they function differently because they're different skills. It's almost like RD functions differently from other executes that are instant cast. Whodathunkit.
No one has contributed an original thought to the topic in months. Let's stop having the same arguments over and over and over please?
Did you read the question before it, or just come out from under your bridge to test the waters?
Original idea, give my mag dk molten armnts back and ill shut upEdited by Lokey0024 on July 25, 2016 3:08AM0 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Templars are the only class with zero passives to a stat recovery or regen and are forced to slot a skill(Repentence) taking up a precious skill slot to get what other classes get as Passives. RD is to make up for that.
Furthermore look at the Templar Ultimates they could be the worst in the game. Sure Nova is a good group Ulty that very expensive and not solo friendly, Crescent sweep sucks and missed most of the time and the healing ultimate is ok maybe if your in a Zerg as a full healer.
RD makes up for the Templar poor resource passives and group oriented ultimates.
Pvp is so much about zergs and perma root bombard spam does it really matter if you die to beam or some other skill?
It's been nerfed twice since it was introduced in 1.6, leave it alone.Rinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak5 -
Hashtag_✭✭✭✭✭RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »Templars are the only class with zero passives to a stat recovery or regen and are forced to slot a skill(Repentence) taking up a precious skill slot to get what other classes get as Passives. RD is to make up for that.
Furthermore look at the Templar Ultimates they could be the worst in the game. Sure Nova is a good group Ulty that very expensive and not solo friendly, Crescent sweep sucks and missed most of the time and the healing ultimate is ok maybe if your in a Zerg as a full healer.
RD makes up for the Templar poor resource passives and group oriented ultimates.
Pvp is so much about zergs and perma root bombard spam does it really matter if you die to beam or some other skill?
It's been nerfed twice since it was introduced in 1.6, leave it alone.
Templars have an ulti that cost 70 and it can hit for 6-10k. You're underrating the *** out of crescent sweep.1 -
Waylander✭✭✭✭I would be happy with the following change to radiant destruction
If enemy is under 50% health, radiant performs as it currently does. If over 50% health, radiant heals your enemy (pretty much like the current damage but in reverse - the higher health the enemy is the more it heals them).
Would open some amazing cross faction trolling however, so it could never be implemented.
On a serious note, I think if the beam could only be seen by the templar and enemy effected, it would stop a lot of the complaints as you wouldn't find yourself beamed multiple templars or beamed and gap closed. Current beam lights you up like a christmas tree allowing for no brain focus fire.
Edited by Waylander on July 25, 2016 5:39AMNocturnal - AD Oceanic PvP Guild
Waylander
Frankie
Krylla
Uniter
Macgyverr
Ivy1 -
Zheg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭If i shot you with poison injection and the initial damage was scaled up depending on your health, you would be getting more 10k death recaps for poison injection as the last.
Unless I was within execute range the initial tick wouldn't scale up but would do standard damage, just like RD. I'm not sure I understood what you were saying here, so clarify pls if I misunderstood.
RD has an impact tick that scales with health. If poison injection did it would hit for around 10k and execute you if you're under 25%. As it is right now it doesnt scale the impact dmg, just the dot tick.
Poison Injection is also a one-time instant cast ability. It's almost like... they function differently because they're different skills. It's almost like RD functions differently from other executes that are instant cast. Whodathunkit.
No one has contributed an original thought to the topic in months. Let's stop having the same arguments over and over and over please?
Did you read the question before it, or just come out from under your bridge to test the waters?
Original idea, give my mag dk molten armnts back and ill shut up
In what world does buffing molten armaments have ANYTHING to do with the balance of radiant destruction? That's not an original idea, and it's certainly not an original idea in the context of being relevant.1
