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Dodge roll everything
Mayrael
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So everyone wants that all skills should be dodgeable we should also think about roll dodge balance. The state where you can roll out of any troubles is as broken as RD spam everywhere (which is answer to roll dodge everywhere) so what are your ideas?
- make it to dodge only 2 skills per cast or
- while in roll dodge state you dodge also all heals or
- increase global cool down so you cant go from roll dodge to roll dodge to roll dodge without any gaps or... Any ideas?
- make it to dodge only 2 skills per cast or
- while in roll dodge state you dodge also all heals or
- increase global cool down so you cant go from roll dodge to roll dodge to roll dodge without any gaps or... Any ideas?
I'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.
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Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think the increased cost, and even greater increased cost when used within the cooldown is fine as it is.20 -
Justice31st✭✭✭✭✭
✭Magicka based characters need dodge roll based off their max magicka then everything would be fine."The more you know who you are, and what you want, the less you let things upset you."15 -
Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Justice31st wrote: »Magicka based characters need dodge roll based off their max magicka then everything would be fine.
I disagree. When playing a magicka build you generally have more access to good class survivability skills anyway.
Sorc has Streak
Nightblade can spam cloak indefinitely/shadow image
Templar has BoL
Dragonknight can... do dragon stuff
Edited by Voxicity on July 6, 2016 9:41PM18 -
phaneub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I should be able to dodge roll and throw a dagger at your face while doing it!5 -
Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭phaneub17_ESO wrote: »I should be able to dodge roll and throw a dagger at your face while doing it!
Technically you can dodge roll animation cancel
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WillhelmBlack✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Justice31st wrote: »Magicka based characters need dodge roll based off their max magicka then everything would be fine.
watPC EU2 -
Justice31st✭✭✭✭✭
✭Justice31st wrote: »Magicka based characters need dodge roll based off their max magicka then everything would be fine.
I disagree. When playing a magicka build you generally have more access to good class survivability skills anyway.
Sorc has Streak
Nightblade can spam cloak indefinitely
Templar has BoL
Dragonknight can... do dragon stuff
I disagree. Not all magicka based classes get major evasion."The more you know who you are, and what you want, the less you let things upset you."3 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think the increased cost, and even greater increased cost when used within the cooldown is fine as it is.
So you think that being able to heal from 20% up to 100% while being "immune" to almost 90% of attacks is fine? Roll dodge isnt even a skill, you dont need to slot it and its the most powerfull defensive strategy right now as there is rly few ways to counter it and kill someone while 1v1.I'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.5 -
Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Justice31st wrote: »Justice31st wrote: »Magicka based characters need dodge roll based off their max magicka then everything would be fine.
I disagree. When playing a magicka build you generally have more access to good class survivability skills anyway.
Sorc has Streak
Nightblade can spam cloak indefinitely
Templar has BoL
Dragonknight can... do dragon stuff
I disagree. Not all magicka based classes get major evasion.
You can slot shuffle on any character. Granted it won't be as good as on a stamina character, but it's still possible if you really want it that badly.2 -
AfkNinja✭✭✭✭✭
✭Justice31st wrote: »Justice31st wrote: »Magicka based characters need dodge roll based off their max magicka then everything would be fine.
I disagree. When playing a magicka build you generally have more access to good class survivability skills anyway.
Sorc has Streak
Nightblade can spam cloak indefinitely
Templar has BoL
Dragonknight can... do dragon stuff
I disagree. Not all magicka based classes get major evasion.
You can slot shuffle on any character. Granted it won't be as good as on a stamina character, but it's still possible if you really want it that badly.
Unchained makes it decent as well, almost free even.
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Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think the increased cost, and even greater increased cost when used within the cooldown is fine as it is.
So you think that being able to heal from 20% up to 100% while being "immune" to almost 90% of attacks is fine? Roll dodge isnt even a skill, you dont need to slot it and its the most powerfull defensive strategy right now as there is rly few ways to counter it and kill someone while 1v1.
Well I don't think dodge roll spamming is an issue here. People who dodge roll spam generally end up dead anyway 'cause they have little or no stamina left. A good player will dodge roll into shuffle into cloak (edit: or reflective scales or a similar skill) into dodge roll again when it's off cooldown. I think anyway, I'm no expert.
Edited by Voxicity on July 6, 2016 9:57PM1 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Justice31st wrote: »Magicka based characters need dodge roll based off their max magicka then everything would be fine.
TBH once ive posted a thread how to implement it...
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/274467/armor-tweaks#latestI'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.0 -
Mashille✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭If only dodge actually F***** worked. XD
Most abilities in PvP hit you anyway, even mid-dodge and when they aren't meant to.House Baratheon: 'Ours Is The Fury'12 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Stop please with the dodgers .Not everyone has a shield to spam yes ? Ruining my PvE immersion ...1 -
Shader_Shibes✭✭✭✭✭
✭I have 2k stam regen, 7x medium armour, all legendary with 5x well-fitted and 10% roll dodge cost reduction in pvp and if i spam roll dodge im still out of stamina in no time.
It's fine as is.12 -
Molag_Crow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It's fine as it is.
It's shuffle that's causing the dodge-fests; claiming 20% when it's not, and even if it REALLY is, RNG is ridiculous. It should be something like 20% less damage taken and 3% chance to dodge or something like that, because right now, the RNG element makes Evasion/Shuffle dodge like 80% of the time.
Want proof? I'll be sure to record a clip of it next time just in case you don't do enough PvP to believe me.--ϟ-- Crows_Descend - Templar - Ebonheart Pact [PS4]&[PC] [EU] --ϟ--
YoutTube ESO Playlist
The greatest prison that people live in, is the fear of what other people think. - David Icke
Be your true, authentic self.0 -
Hymzir✭✭✭✭✭
✭You can totally get Major Evasion of any Magicka Class. Just slot Shuffle, I do it all the time on my magicka templar because why the hell I wouldn't? It's just that bloody good. Well worth the stamina and it also has a long up time too.
Fixing the issue with dodge rolling in general wont be easy, since it is intertwined with so many core mechanics and calculations. Don't know if it can really be fixed. My solution to the issue would be to give each class a decent channeled ability. That way countering dodge rollers or not is a build choice. And would maybe force pure dodge roller builds to try to incorporate some other defenses, and thus thus make then being able to dodge roll a bit less.0 -
Justice31st✭✭✭✭✭
✭Shader_Shibes wrote: »I have 2k stam regen, 7x medium armour, all legendary with 5x well-fitted and 10% roll dodge cost reduction in pvp and if i spam roll dodge im still out of stamina in no time.
It's fine as is.
That's because you don't have Engine Guardian with well fitted traits equipped."The more you know who you are, and what you want, the less you let things upset you."0 -
Egonieser✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think the increased cost, and even greater increased cost when used within the cooldown is fine as it is.
So you think that being able to heal from 20% up to 100% while being "immune" to almost 90% of attacks is fine? Roll dodge isnt even a skill, you dont need to slot it and its the most powerfull defensive strategy right now as there is rly few ways to counter it and kill someone while 1v1.
Well I don't think dodge roll spamming is an issue here. People who dodge roll spam generally end up dead anyway 'cause they have little or no stamina left. A good player will dodge roll into shuffle into cloak (edit: or reflective scales or a similar skill) into dodge roll again when it's off cooldown. I think anyway, I'm no expert.
My Stamblade has a full set of well fitted (gold quality) and some points in Tumbling. You won't ever see me run out of stamina from rolldodging, not in a single fight anyway. Combine it with 2.5k stam regen and 35k stamina - it's very much lethal, until lag hits and the b-stard refuses to dodge after spamming W 4 times in a row.Sometimes, I dream about...cheese...
Dermont - v16 Pompous Altmer Sorcerer (With a very arrogant face!)
Egonieser - v16 Nord Stamina Dragonborn Wannabe
Endoly - v16 Tiny Redguard Sharpened MaceBlade
Egosalina - v16 Breton Cheesus Beam Specialist
Egowen - v16 Dunmer Whipping Expert (Riding crops eluded her)
(Yes, I had to grind all these to v16)
Akamanakh - lvl 22 Khajiit GankBlade (Inspired by Top Cat)
Targos Icewind - lvl 34 Imperial (Future) Jabplar
(CP 830+)
PC - EU1 -
Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I think we should reduce the cooldown to 2 or 3 seconds from 4. The only people that can spam dodge rolling are the ones geared with well-fitted. Although evasive; these players sacrifice damage mitigation, and all that's required is one good CC, and they're dead; unlike damage shields which last for 6 seconds, and are just as effective as dodge rolling except it has a longer duration, no punishment for spamming, and remains on your while CC'd. It's this reason why magicka players have better survivability and resource management. If anything we need to reduce the cost of dodge rolling or reduce the cooldown.2 -
WreckfulAbandon✭✭✭✭✭
✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »I think we should reduce the cooldown to 2 or 3 seconds from 4. The only people that can spam dodge rolling are the ones geared with well-fitted. Although evasive; these players sacrifice damage mitigation, and all that's required is one good CC, and they're dead; unlike damage shields which last for 6 seconds, and are just as effective as dodge rolling except it has a longer duration, no punishment for spamming, and remains on your while CC'd. It's this reason why magicka players have better survivability and resource management. If anything we need to reduce the cost of dodge rolling or reduce the cooldown.
Damage shields are not as effective as dodge rolling.
If 5 ppl are hitting you and you throw up a dmg shield, it will still break after the 10k or so dmg it states it will mitigate on the tooltip. If 5 ppl are hitting you and you dodge roll, you can potentially avoid much more dmg.
Also, if you want to discuss magicka players having "better survivability and resource management" I'm all for it, but pls don't post things like this like they are established fact.
Cause for starters, no magicka race has got anything on that Reguard sustainability.PC NA
All my comments are regarding PvP3 -
acw37162✭✭✭✭✭
✭Justice31st wrote: »Magicka based characters need dodge roll based off their max magicka then everything would be fine.
No they don't and if you can't list at least three reasons why you need to think about what imbalance issues that would create.
Magica players do need a major expidition and major gallop ability tho.
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Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭WreckfulAbandon wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »I think we should reduce the cooldown to 2 or 3 seconds from 4. The only people that can spam dodge rolling are the ones geared with well-fitted. Although evasive; these players sacrifice damage mitigation, and all that's required is one good CC, and they're dead; unlike damage shields which last for 6 seconds, and are just as effective as dodge rolling except it has a longer duration, no punishment for spamming, and remains on your while CC'd. It's this reason why magicka players have better survivability and resource management. If anything we need to reduce the cost of dodge rolling or reduce the cooldown.
Damage shields are not as effective as dodge rolling.
If 5 ppl are hitting you and you throw up a dmg shield, it will still break after the 10k or so dmg it states it will mitigate on the tooltip. If 5 ppl are hitting you and you dodge roll, you can potentially avoid much more dmg.
Also, if you want to discuss magicka players having "better survivability and resource management" I'm all for it, but pls don't post things like this like they are established fact.
Cause for starters, no magicka race has got anything on that Reguard sustainability.
Ah now you're cherry picking. Against 2 opponents they're equally effective, against a single target shields are more effective, and against 3 or more dodge rolling is more effective, but that's a losing fight in most cases anyways. So yes, in a practical sense damage shields are more effective and not as harsh on your resources.2 -
Junipus✭✭✭✭✭WreckfulAbandon wrote: »Cause for starters, no magicka race has got anything on that Reguard sustainability.
Since we're talking about dodge-rolling, you can take Adrenaline rush out of the equation since you won't be doing melee damage unless you're animation cancelling dodge-rolls and if you can do that then dodge-rolling isn't the issue. Altmer have the magicka equivalent of the other redguard passives.
It's a difficult thing to change since it'll imbalance too many other things at the same time depending on what changes are made.
Can't dodge-roll channeled attacks? RD is too OP
Stop stamina regen while dodge-rolling similar to holding block? People will stack higher regen
Increase subsequent dodge-rolling cost penalties? People will just change builds for even more regen/cost reduction
Grant major evasion while dodge-rolling instead of dodging all attacks? PvE will be pissed and complain loudly
Grant magicka users major evasion for all classes? It's the wrong argumentThe Legendary Nothing4 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Use aoe.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...2 -
KenaPKK✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Justice31st wrote: »Magicka based characters need dodge roll based off their max magicka then everything would be fine.
I disagree. When playing a magicka build you generally have more access to good class survivability skills anyway.
Sorc has Streak
Nightblade can spam cloak indefinitely/shadow image
Templar has BoL
Dragonknight can... do dragon stuff
Except that cloak is broken and useless in combat and shade is telegraphed and grants one poof.0 -
Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think the increased cost, and even greater increased cost when used within the cooldown is fine as it is.
So you think that being able to heal from 20% up to 100% while being "immune" to almost 90% of attacks is fine? Roll dodge isnt even a skill, you dont need to slot it and its the most powerfull defensive strategy right now as there is rly few ways to counter it and kill someone while 1v1.
Well I don't think dodge roll spamming is an issue here. People who dodge roll spam generally end up dead anyway 'cause they have little or no stamina left. A good player will dodge roll into shuffle into cloak (edit: or reflective scales or a similar skill) into dodge roll again when it's off cooldown. I think anyway, I'm no expert.
My Stamblade has a full set of well fitted (gold quality) and some points in Tumbling. You won't ever see me run out of stamina from rolldodging, not in a single fight anyway. Combine it with 2.5k stam regen and 35k stamina - it's very much lethal, until lag hits and the b-stard refuses to dodge after spamming W 4 times in a row.
But do you spam it? Or wait for the cool down to finish?0
