ESO Future for hardcore players

Mitoice · June 2016

First of all, I want to start this thread by saying I love this game, but the lack of objectives or things to do, is making me take a break from this game for several months or at least till housing comes, I’m considered a Hardcore gamer, a player that logs in every day for several hours and spent more tan 500 bucks in this game, but every new expansión feels weaker and weaker.

I want to continue playing this game daily, but ZOS is trying his best to convert me into a softcore gamer, one that logs in once a week, I don’t have anything else to do in this game besides creating more alts,

Things that make this game lose appeal to hardcore gamers:

-Level cap is hardly ever increased – Im in the 600 champs, this means im gonna be over the cap for several expansións to come.

- Same ol Gear - Still have the same gear since Wrothgar (Julianos) – There’s hardly any need to find new gear since every gear created is purely situational like vicious death or Spell Power Cure. Maelstrom weapons are gonna be the best weapons for a looooong time.

- Lack of objectives – You have a nice open end world without any good objectives, put some time objectives to dungeons, more tasks in PVP etc.

- Lack of Challenge – I can basically one shot anything besides world bosses or 3 squared bosses, Dark Bortherhood was soooo boring for me cause everything died without a challenge, no matter how many mistakes I make, they can barely hit me. The only challenge left in this game is PVP, VMoL, Maelstrom (Veteran).

- Hacking Exploits – Lack of action by ZOS

After this, Ive decided to take a break from ESO till they added enough stuff for me to have something to do maybe 1-2 years and then come back or maybe my problem was that I’ve played so much of this game that now I have nothing else to do and I have to play it like ZOS wants me to, once per month.

FloppyFrank · June 2016

There really isn't a future for hardcore players cause ZOS doesn't really cater to them. They don't really care about putting out new endgame content, for all they care they could just keep making singleplayer dlc and new crown store ***. They just wanna make money

Mitoice · June 2016

Thats how I felt when I saw a new mount at 4k crowns but the dlc costing 2k, felt like ZOS was putting more effort in making new mounta than new dlcs

N0TPLAYER2 · June 2016

Mitoice wrote: »

Thats how I felt when I saw a new mount at 4k crowns but the dlc costing 2k, felt like ZOS was putting more effort in making new mounta than new dlcs

Not more effort into the mounts, more effort into making $. Which is worse

idk · June 2016

Hardcore?

1 New trial - first trial with normal, Vet and Vet HM.
2. The old trials reworked and scaled to our level and will be in normal, Vet and Vet HM.
3. vDSA will be scaled to our level
4. 2 new 4 man dungeons.
5. New gear in the new trial
6. Older rework trials have they'd gear sets reworked.

Open world quests are rarely challenging these days. It's the group content that provides the challenge to the hard core player.

I don't see this as a time to suggest hard core players have no challenges in the game.

Justice31st · June 2016

Mitoice wrote: »

First of all, I want to start this thread by saying I love this game, but the lack of objectives or things to do, is making me take a break from this game for several months or at least till housing comes, I’m considered a Hardcore gamer, a player that logs in every day for several hours and spent more tan 500 bucks in this game, but every new expansión feels weaker and weaker.

I want to continue playing this game daily, but ZOS is trying his best to convert me into a softcore gamer, one that logs in once a week, I don’t have anything else to do in this game besides creating more alts,

Things that make this game lose appeal to hardcore gamers:

-Level cap is hardly ever increased – Im in the 600 champs, this means im gonna be over the cap for several expansións to come.

- Same ol Gear - Still have the same gear since Wrothgar (Julianos) – There’s hardly any need to find new gear since every gear created is purely situational like vicious death or Spell Power Cure. Maelstrom weapons are gonna be the best weapons for a looooong time.

- Lack of objectives – You have a nice open end world without any good objectives, put some time objectives to dungeons, more tasks in PVP etc.

- Lack of Challenge – I can basically one shot anything besides world bosses or 3 squared bosses, Dark Bortherhood was soooo boring for me cause everything died without a challenge, no matter how many mistakes I make, they can barely hit me. The only challenge left in this game is PVP, VMoL, Maelstrom (Veteran).

- Hacking Exploits – Lack of action by ZOS

After this, Ive decided to take a break from ESO till they added enough stuff for me to have something to do maybe 1-2 years and then come back or maybe my problem was that I’ve played so much of this game that now I have nothing else to do and I have to play it like ZOS wants me to, once per month.

Do NOT put ESO and hardcore in the same sentence. This game is for casuals and was already stated for the future by the lead developer.

cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO · June 2016

Yeah, I've abandoned the game pretty much, although I still voice my opinion on here hoping they'll see reason and give us some good challenging open world content. Hardcore is dead in this game unfortunately. I'd say even "mediumcore" is going away and all that will be left is hello kitty level of difficulty. I really hope the game burns down to the ground soon enough so that it can die a decent death.

Justice31st · June 2016

cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO wrote: »

Yeah, I've abandoned the game pretty much, although I still voice my opinion on here hoping they'll see reason and give us some good challenging open world content. Hardcore is dead in this game unfortunately. I'd say even "mediumcore" is going away and all that will be left is hello kitty level of difficulty. I really hope the game burns down to the ground soon enough so that it can die a decent death.

^I agree 100%. I just uninstalled ESO from my system. Once Paul Sage left this game became only about corporate greed, and milking the consumers through the crown store with bait and switch methods such as doing race changes 6 months ago and then again right before the race change was implemented into the crown store for money. I have played many hardcore MMO's throughout my life, and this game compared to Final Fantasy 11 online or World of Warcraft is the farthest from a hardcore game.

tinythinker · June 2016

This new DLC coming out net month updates a ton of general use sets to CP160. As for more stuff to do. I agree.

Hence:

Here is a model of what ZOS could do with such a project for expanding content in the base game zones:

you have things such as the TG and DB repeatables and fishing already to get people back into these zones so leave those as they are
turn dark fissures into events on par with dark anchors to add more "we don't need to group but can still come together" style moments
add -- some to start and more over time -- new repeatable quests for the base alliance zones for 15 zones worth of "new" content for any individual player:
- one at first and then another Wrothgar-like quest for each delve which you get from innkeepers (TES nostalgia!)
- one at first and then up to three repeatable quests for the public dungeons
- two or three at first and then up to ??? new quests for overworld where you either have to kill so many existing mobs and grab an item placed there by the quest, or do something with new mobs placed there by the quest, etc; can do standard MMO quests or hopefully get really creative or at least add some fun elements like in-jokes for TES fans
- you can get an XP/gold bonus each day for doing one of each type of repeatable quest in each Alliance (so three bonuses per day times three Alliances)
- loot table would include some fun sets that don't ever get scaled up but now will be available at your true level when scaling
- loot table would include other items that even experienced players would like such as stacks of mats
redo portions of Craglorn based on the model from DLC successes

Doing these things will open up so much for ESO and really move the game closer than ever toward that TES feel people always talk about. This content can either include or be in addition to adding repeatable quests to the Fighters and Mages Guilds. For Fighters, the contract against the daedra is still in place, so either these are all still related to that (daedra have appeared outside of some town, a portal to Oblivion has spawned in some little old lady's basement, etc) or maybe there is room for a little something different. Some would be available right away when you join the Fighters Guild, and new ones would open up when you reach maximum rank in it. The Mages Guild would work the same way but without the restrictions the current setting/lore has on the targets of the Fighters Guild. Of course, the Psijic Order would--oh, wait. Sorry. Not supposed to talk about that yet. I said nothing, I wrote nothing.

--from https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/271579/the-base-game-and-its-future-with-one-tamriel

and

Repeatable quests for Fighters Guild and Mages guild

A new DLC zone or two could be added to give these guilds a "headquarters", but honestly the Mages Guild already has this with Eyevea and the Fighters Guild with the Earth Forge. If you have to complete the storylines of these guilds to get repeatable quests there is no problem, and this would be a good reward for doing so and make these mini-zones more useful and populated. An alternative to either adding a headquarters in a new zone (which wouldn't have to be all about the guild just an added bonus) or using the existing mini-zones would be adding quest-boards in all guild halls.

A compromise for all three:

-quest boards for basic quests available in all guild halls for base games and DLC zones
-special quests available only in Eyevea/the Earth Forge.

For the Fighters Guild, the contract against the daedra is still in place, so either these are all still related to that (daedra have appeared outside of some town, a portal to Oblivion has spawned in some little old lady's basement, etc) or maybe there is room for a little something different. Two types of special quests that occurred to me are training missions and hunts. Feel free to add your own ideas for types of special FG quests, but first read the spoiler-based concept I propose below which is hidden for new players who haven't done that guild's storyline or the main storyline:

The FG lost members like the traitor Aelif and got a new Guild Master when Merrick took over, and also suffered heavy losses as part of the invasion force that struck deep into Coldharbour but also gained members such as Skordo the Knife. Skordo is the one who runs the dailies, and has a quest type to help rebuild the Guild by assisting in the training of new (NPC) recruits. So you go out and help these NPCs with their missions. This doesn't have to mean escort quests!

Another special quest type for those who complete the Guild storyline is a separate board for really big monsters. They may or may not be daedra but they are all dangerous and need to be dealt with. Some can be soloed by pretty much anyone if you take long enough, some may require 2-4 players (unless you are just soooo good), and some may require 4-8 players (again your mileage may vary). You can pick which of each type to do (some or all) that are currently available, but they spawn in random places so there is also a hunting element involved. You would know the zone, but have to look for the beast. These would clearly have big rewards.

The Mages Guild would be similar to Fighters but without the restrictions the current setting/lore has on the targets of the Fighters Guild. These quests could be highly variable, from gathering ingredients in dangerous areas to rescuing researchers and so on. I have no particular ideas at the moment for the special quest types you unlock at the end of the Mages Guild storyline, but I am sure some fun things could be added. Not sure who the quest giver should be for those (Valaste doesn't make sense as she was important for her translating, so someone else should do this).

These new Fighters and Mages guild quests can be broad and creative, with jokes and nostalgia pulled from prior games as well as new things to fit the current era.

--from https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/272744/new-npc-guild-questlines-adding-mages-fighters-repeatables

and

INN EVENTS

After looking at the OPs suggestions and revisiting Giddy's thread, as well as considering the way development has gone and trying to get the most players into it, my own recommendations would be:

1. Have the events be short and repeatable with XP/gold rewards and also with achievements for successfully completing something 10, 50, and 100 times. Or 5, 15, 30 times. Or 10, 100, 200 times. Depends on the event, but you get the idea. This encourages players to come to inns for as long as they want without feeling like they have to stay a long time to get anything out of it. If the events are fun, have decent rewards, and unlock achievements with funny/clever titles, people will still visit inns more and stay longer.

2. Have some events be universal, and others rare (original new events or unique versions of universal events). Drinking contests, patterned after the event already present at Geirmund's Hall in The Rift, could be universal. Others could be rare, only spawning at certain times like the Lightbringer, Crimes Pays, Give to the Poor, and I Like M'aiq achievements. The rare ones encourage people to stop more often at different inns. Have NPC comments-in-passing come up if you get the full achievement series for one of the event types ("I heard you can really hold your mead! You're no milk-drinker!").

3. Have a focus on NPC events. That isn't to say no player vs player contests should be available, but if most or all inn events require other players to try/complete the concept will flop. Some players prefer to be solo all of the time, and some play at odd hours. Having fun, rewarding events (see #1) that have some rare, achievement based elements mixed in (see #2) will get people into the inns. But if I go in a certain inn off-hours and no one is there or they are busy, I don't want to have to wait around. Certainly though, have one or two events that players can do together with some nice rewards.

As for the event types/categories I would endorse:

- Bar Brawls. These would be fists only, no ability bar, and without pushover NPCs. You wouldn't be 100-0. You'd have to work for the wins and lose a fair amount. Special/rare version would involve getting drunk first as part of the NPC's challenge as you do in some fights in Ebonheart. The drunk versions would be like rare spawns and have their own achievement. Another rare version would be special named bar brawler champion types that are particularly tough and spawn randomly.
Rewards: XP, Gold, Credit Toward Achievement(s)

- Drinking Contests. Like Geirmund's Hall include a mechanic that allows you to not pass out (like eating food every so many drink) but with fast/hard drinking NPCs competing at the same time to make it a challenge. This one could include an option for multiple players to join in after the event is triggered but the NPCs would still compete.
Rewards: XP, Gold, Credit Toward Achievement

- Gambling. Something simple that is easy to follow with text prompt and a basic graphics display but that requires some strategy and luck, like a slightly more sophisticated version of rock-paper-scissors. It should have a chance to make a mistake/lose a round at least twice before the event ends with the player winning or losing, like picking a master lock on a door or chest. Have it be a single game so players can learn/practice it and work on the achievement anywhere in Tamriel.
Rewards: XP, Gold, Credit Toward Achievement

- Singing. Again, goes back to Geirmund's Hall (and every karaoke night in a bar ever). You pick up a job as an entertainer and have a choice to get a drink (or two, or three, or... the bottle... what was I you me?) before you proceed. You then get a glance at the lyric sheet and begin. The more you have to drink the greater the potential rewards but also the less time you have to read the lyrics at the start and the faster the text prompts go by (if you miss one the default is "..."). The more accurate you are the higher the reward.

So getting tanked and hitting every lyric is a big pay day. Also the drunker you are the blurrier the lyric sheet is at the start. The song book from which your selection is drawn is quite large and some songs are region specific. Achievements for completing songs, completing songs totally wasted, completing songs perfectly, completing songs perfectly while totally wasted, and a single achievement for gloriously blowing a song while totally wasted are included.
Rewards: XP, Gold, Credit Toward Achievement(s)

INN FEATURES

As for features other than humorous NPC dialogue and being able to buy food and drink or prepare food and drink:

Rent a room for enlightenment bonus. Log out for the night (or at least so many hours) in a room you've rented at the inn and find that your enlightenment bonus has been magnified when you log back in.

Player Guild recruitment board. Click to search guilds by categories and name (level 50 only, crafting, trading, raiding, PvP, etc)

Innkeeper quests. Like prior TES games for an expanded, One Tamriel.

--from https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/3093795#Comment_3093795

just to give a few examples.

Crowzer · June 2016

ESO not aim hardcore gamers and it's a good thing.

FLuFFyxMuFFiN · June 2016

Justice31st wrote: »

cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO wrote: »

Yeah, I've abandoned the game pretty much, although I still voice my opinion on here hoping they'll see reason and give us some good challenging open world content. Hardcore is dead in this game unfortunately. I'd say even "mediumcore" is going away and all that will be left is hello kitty level of difficulty. I really hope the game burns down to the ground soon enough so that it can die a decent death.

^I agree 100%. I just uninstalled ESO from my system. Once Paul Sage left this game became only about corporate greed, and milking the consumers through the crown store with bait and switch methods such as doing race changes 6 months ago and then again right before the race change was implemented into the crown store for money. I have played many hardcore MMO's throughout my life, and this game compared to Final Fantasy 11 online or World of Warcraft is the farthest from a hardcore game.

Bye Felicia

TequilaFire · June 2016

Hello kitty users.
Goodbye serious players.

kevlarto_ESO · June 2016

I think not many of us left, seems like the easy street instant gratification players are where the money is, and companies will always go where the money is, If Camelot Unchained turns out to be good game, it will attract more hardcore players nothing in that game will be instant, from what I have read and seen.

Kalifas · June 2016

Your only hardcore hope is Pantheon: Rise Of The Fallen. They swear up and down they won't be swayed by anyone trying to alter their course. Hardcore game with strict group content.

This game started on the casual route since Champions became account wide and Veteran ranks got the axe. Still a fun game if you don't want to invest lots of time into one game.

Mitoice · June 2016

Kalifas wrote: »

Your only hardcore hope is Pantheon: Rise Of The Fallen. They swear up and down they won't be swayed by anyone trying to alter their course. Hardcore game with strict group content.

This game started on the casual route since Champions became account wide and Veteran ranks got the axe. Still a fun game if you don't want to invest lots of time into one game.

WOW appeals to the hardcore gamers, Final Fantasy too, i just hate WOW graphics and FF combat.

ADarklore · June 2016

Justice31st wrote: »

Do NOT put ESO and hardcore in the same sentence. This game is for casuals and was already stated for the future by the lead developer.

It wasn't the lead developer, it was the GAME DIRECTOR... big difference. Matt Firor decides which direction the game will go, the content, etc... so for him to come out and pretty much boldly state that content is shifting to accommodate casual players... it's not just some random lead dev speaking.

cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO wrote: »

Yeah, I've abandoned the game pretty much, although I still voice my opinion on here hoping they'll see reason and give us some good challenging open world content. Hardcore is dead in this game unfortunately. I'd say even "mediumcore" is going away and all that will be left is hello kitty level of difficulty. I really hope the game burns down to the ground soon enough so that it can die a decent death.

I've never understood this mentality, if you don't like the game, fine... if you quit... fine... but there are clearly MILLIONS of us that do enjoy it. But your clear negative obsession with the game just goes beyond my comprehension. So the game didn't cater to you, so now you wish it to die; I would say that ESO is not the one with the problem here.

Daemons_Bane · June 2016

Hoping the game burns down.? So because YOU don't like it, no one is allowed to enjoy it.? Well feel free to quit, your mentality will not be missed

MaxwellC · June 2016

@Mitoice
ESO Future for casual gamers* Fixed it for you OP since Matt Firor said we don't exist and only caters to casuals who got to another game at the flip of the switch while us hardcore players do that buy faithfully return to game.

Mitoice · June 2016

Daemons_Bane wrote: »

Hoping the game burns down.? So because YOU don't like it, no one is allowed to enjoy it.? Well feel free to quit, your mentality will not be missed

Ive bever said i didnt like the game, in fact I started saying I love this game, im just saying it isnt appealing to hardcore gamers, a phrase Matt Firor, the game director, used, cause of lack of things to do, thats all

ADarklore · June 2016

Mitoice wrote: »

Daemons_Bane wrote: »

Hoping the game burns down.? So because YOU don't like it, no one is allowed to enjoy it.? Well feel free to quit, your mentality will not be missed

Ive bever said i didnt like the game, in fact I started saying I love this game, im just saying it isnt appealing to hardcore gamers, a phrase Matt Firor, the game director, used, cause of lack of things to do, thats all

That previous comment from @Daemons_Bane wasn't directed at you... it was directed at @cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO

Mitoice · June 2016

My only question to ZOS is,
is there a way to make this game appealing to casual and hardcore gamers alike?
maybe a way to level up your char but instead of giving you more power like the current champ points, gives you cosmetic stuff like the payday system?

ADarklore · June 2016

Mitoice wrote: »

My only question to ZOS is,
is there a way to make this game appealing to casual and hardcore gamers alike?
maybe a way to level up your char but instead of giving you more power like the current champ points, gives you cosmetic stuff like the payday system?

That would be a NO... they don't have the resources to devote to that and if they did so with their current small team that would stop them from adding future content. As it is right now, they're devoting much of their devs to the whole 'One Tamriel' re-boot which means existing players have to WAIT for any new 'sizeable' content until after One Tamriel is complete.

disintegr8 · June 2016

All games can become tedious or boring at some stage but there are probably still plenty of players out there with 8 maxed out characters still happy to play and enjoy the game for what it is. If I get bored with the game I will just find something else to do, not blame ZOS for failing to keep me entertained.

Now that no subscription is required, most income probably comes from people buying the game and the DLC's, and ZOS has to have an income stream in order to keep the game alive. As long as people buy DLC, whether they play it for 3 hours or 3 months makes no difference.

Mitoice · June 2016

ADarklore wrote: »

Mitoice wrote: »

My only question to ZOS is,
is there a way to make this game appealing to casual and hardcore gamers alike?
maybe a way to level up your char but instead of giving you more power like the current champ points, gives you cosmetic stuff like the payday system?

That would be a NO... they don't have the resources to devote to that and if they did so with their current small team that would stop them from adding future content. As it is right now, they're devoting much of their devs to the whole 'One Tamriel' re-boot which means existing players have to WAIT for any new 'sizeable' content until after One Tamriel is complete.

you have a good point, one tamriel is already done, and they got their hands full with housing.

Averya_Teira · June 2016

ESO is not a game for Hardcore players.

End of story.

ADarklore · June 2016

Mitoice wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

Mitoice wrote: »

My only question to ZOS is,
is there a way to make this game appealing to casual and hardcore gamers alike?
maybe a way to level up your char but instead of giving you more power like the current champ points, gives you cosmetic stuff like the payday system?

That would be a NO... they don't have the resources to devote to that and if they did so with their current small team that would stop them from adding future content. As it is right now, they're devoting much of their devs to the whole 'One Tamriel' re-boot which means existing players have to WAIT for any new 'sizeable' content until after One Tamriel is complete.

you have a good point, one tamriel is already done, and they got their hands full with housing.

One Tamriel isn't nearly done... not for a few months... and then player housing next year, sometime in Q1. I'm thinking One Tamriel is probably going to be released sometime around December.

Mitoice · June 2016

disintegr8 wrote: »

All games can become tedious or boring at some stage but there are probably still plenty of players out there with 8 maxed out characters still happy to play and enjoy the game for what it is. If I get bored with the game I will just find something else to do, not blame ZOS for failing to keep me entertained.

Now that no subscription is required, most income probably comes from people buying the game and the DLC's, and ZOS has to have an income stream in order to keep the game alive. As long as people buy DLC, whether they play it for 3 hours or 3 months makes no difference.

not necessarily, if i play every day, as my friends also did, we ended up buying things like a 4k featured mount which costs more than two dlc, or costumes, etc, to be honest, ive bought more non dlc stuff than dlc

PurifedBladez · June 2016

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

I think not many of us left, seems like the easy street instant gratification players are where the money is, and companies will always go where the money is, If Camelot Unchained turns out to be good game, it will attract more hardcore players nothing in that game will be instant, from what I have read and seen.

I hope it's good, honestly. Lol

Clarkieson · June 2016

The future is this:

Nerf things so builds have to change extending game life abit more

Rehash content and set gear to new CP level

Crown store tat

Intriduce new bugs and glitches, keep old ones going a bit longer

Profit

ADarklore · June 2016

Clarkieson wrote: »

The future is this:

Nerf things so builds have to change extending game life abit more

Rehash content and set gear to new CP level

Crown store tat

Intriduce new bugs and glitches, keep old ones going a bit longer

Profit

Let's discuss ESO, not DCUO.

Clarkieson · June 2016

ADarklore wrote: »

Clarkieson wrote: »

The future is this:

Nerf things so builds have to change extending game life abit more

Rehash content and set gear to new CP level

Crown store tat

Intriduce new bugs and glitches, keep old ones going a bit longer

Profit

Let's discuss ESO, not DCUO.

What is DCUO? Another nerf?