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I feel not offering crafting bags "for purchase" is disingenuous
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NewBlacksmurf✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »To be honest,
The crafting bags ...are a base game patch feature just like poisons, champion system, name plates, etc according to ZOS so these should be in game gold.
If the crown store wants to add opportunities that is fine.
If the ESO Plus wants to further extent the slots to some astronomical number, fine but there should be a basic 20 - `00 slot option or buy in game to access and then upgrade just like the bank because its an inventory feature and not any actual items.
Even ZOS writes it as a base game patch but then decides to lock that one feature behind a subscription even tho they write that all base game patch features would always not require a sub.
SMH
That is simple why it is a base game feature - if you have acquired that bag by subscription and unsubscribe, you will still have access to the bag, you can just not put anything into it any longer - it has limited functionality when unsubscribed.
@Lysette
Here is the problem ....it is a base game feature "locked behind" a subscription requirement. It goes against everything ZOS announced about Tamriel Unlimited for base game updates.
The first word in your comment "if" followed by "subscriptions" between the word "lock"
That's the problem....it's either a base game feature or not.
According to ZOS in their ESO live and in the info on Tamriel Unlimited "base game patches" are included without the need to sub. This is not the case for this one feature amongst all others as described by ZOS.
yes, the feature is included, that this bag is not ceasing to be, if you unsub, so it has to be part of the base game - but the bag itself is not obtainable without a subscription.
@Lysette
Actually no, the feature is not included. That's the whole point.
It's literally excluded to non subscribers....but only that one not the others.
It's never accessible until you subscribe.
So by default ZOS has decided to go back on the once confirmed statement that all base game update patches will not require a sub.
By that token you should object to any bonus given to subscribers, all of which are base game bonuses as a DLC isn't necessary to enjoy them, although I suspect that in practice you only object to this one, presumably because you want it while not being willing or able for whatever reason to subscribe in order to get it.
To put it another way, if instead of announcing the introduction of crafting bags ZOS had announced a slight increase in the xp bonus rates for subscribers or an extra couple of hundred crowns per month to subscribers, would you have felt so aggrieved that these were base game updates only available to subscribers and therefore in breach of previous statements by ZOS? I don't believe in all honesty that we would have seen a fraction of the posts from you that we've seen on this topic and yet the principle would have been exactly the same.
@Tandor
Actually no.
The benefits excluding crafting bags enhance the base game features that are available to everyone outside of a sub. I have no objection to this even to the extent that ESO plus should keep the "unlimited" nature of the crafting bags but the access should not require a sub or crowns.
Base game update in how ZOS has used it and how it was described in context to the Tamriel Unlimited changes were that ESO Plus would remain (so those benefits were added to the old sub under a name name) and that all base game updates would remain for all outside of a sub to existing customers and new customers who purchase ESO TU.
Again...I have no objections to ESO Plus benefits at al and even to your example I actually have suggested that they should offer increased bonuses as well. Changing the sub in those ways is not a breach of the Tamriel Unlimited confirmed statements by Matt F.
I believe your assumptions are completely invalid as well as the context that somehow this doesn't specifically conflict with what's still officially on this site. The forums, the Xbox, PC and PS4 retail sites and the announcements by ZOS on the PS4 social sites and Redditt made by Gina and Jessica.
-PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *5011 -
Luigi_Vampa✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »I don't subscribe but I totally agree with crafting bags!
People that pay monthly should get something for their money! "Paying customers" make the game go foward, not people that constantly complain.
@binho
In your way of using "paying customers" does that exclude customers who buy crowns at an average of 1500/month?
Yes,it does.Those people who buy crowns every month,..MAYBE,..arent guaranteed income.If they sign a contract to do that then and only then should they be considered genuine paying customers.
I am fairly sure 99% of players do NOT buy that many crowns every month.I think they may buy that many whenever it suites them,but not as a continual thing.
They buy them when they are on sale, so they pay less than they say they do for the dlcs. And that... Is disingenuous!PC/EU DC0 -
kevlarto_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭DarkWombat wrote: »Who subs JUST FOR CRAFTING BAGS???
You would be surprised I know several people that did because they are craftaholics and had loads and loads of crafting items.0 -
Volkodav✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »To be honest,
The crafting bags ...are a base game patch feature just like poisons, champion system, name plates, etc according to ZOS so these should be in game gold.
If the crown store wants to add opportunities that is fine.
If the ESO Plus wants to further extent the slots to some astronomical number, fine but there should be a basic 20 - `00 slot option or buy in game to access and then upgrade just like the bank because its an inventory feature and not any actual items.
Even ZOS writes it as a base game patch but then decides to lock that one feature behind a subscription even tho they write that all base game patch features would always not require a sub.
SMH
That is simple why it is a base game feature - if you have acquired that bag by subscription and unsubscribe, you will still have access to the bag, you can just not put anything into it any longer - it has limited functionality when unsubscribed.
@Lysette
Here is the problem ....it is a base game feature "locked behind" a subscription requirement. It goes against everything ZOS announced about Tamriel Unlimited for base game updates.
The first word in your comment "if" followed by "subscriptions" between the word "lock"
That's the problem....it's either a base game feature or not.
According to ZOS in their ESO live and in the info on Tamriel Unlimited "base game patches" are included without the need to sub. This is not the case for this one feature amongst all others as described by ZOS.
yes, the feature is included, that this bag is not ceasing to be, if you unsub, so it has to be part of the base game - but the bag itself is not obtainable without a subscription.
@Lysette
Actually no, the feature is not included. That's the whole point.
It's literally excluded to non subscribers....but only that one not the others.
It's never accessible until you subscribe.
So by default ZOS has decided to go back on the once confirmed statement that all base game update patches will not require a sub.
By that token you should object to any bonus given to subscribers, all of which are base game bonuses as a DLC isn't necessary to enjoy them, although I suspect that in practice you only object to this one, presumably because you want it while not being willing or able for whatever reason to subscribe in order to get it.
To put it another way, if instead of announcing the introduction of crafting bags ZOS had announced a slight increase in the xp bonus rates for subscribers or an extra couple of hundred crowns per month to subscribers, would you have felt so aggrieved that these were base game updates only available to subscribers and therefore in breach of previous statements by ZOS? I don't believe in all honesty that we would have seen a fraction of the posts from you that we've seen on this topic and yet the principle would have been exactly the same.
@Tandor
Actually no.
The benefits excluding crafting bags enhance the base game features that are available to everyone outside of a sub. I have no objection to this even to the extent that ESO plus should keep the "unlimited" nature of the crafting bags but the access should not require a sub or crowns.
Base game update in how ZOS has used it and how it was described in context to the Tamriel Unlimited changes were that ESO Plus would remain (so those benefits were added to the old sub under a name name) and that all base game updates would remain for all outside of a sub to existing customers and new customers who purchase ESO TU.
Again...I have no objections to ESO Plus benefits at al and even to your example I actually have suggested that they should offer increased bonuses as well. Changing the sub in those ways is not a breach of the Tamriel Unlimited confirmed statements by Matt F.
I believe your assumptions are completely invalid as well as the context that somehow this doesn't specifically conflict with what's still officially on this site. The forums, the Xbox, PC and PS4 retail sites and the announcements by ZOS on the PS4 social sites and Redditt made by Gina and Jessica.
If the bags werent introduced with the base game patch,just how would you suggest it was added.Remember,it is only for subs.So,give us your solution,since adding the simple little bag offended you as part of the patch.
What other manner of a dding it to the game do you see as proper,..except giving it to all players who dont sub.2 -
Callous2208✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »To be honest,
The crafting bags ...are a base game patch feature just like poisons, champion system, name plates, etc according to ZOS so these should be in game gold.
If the crown store wants to add opportunities that is fine.
If the ESO Plus wants to further extent the slots to some astronomical number, fine but there should be a basic 20 - `00 slot option or buy in game to access and then upgrade just like the bank because its an inventory feature and not any actual items.
Even ZOS writes it as a base game patch but then decides to lock that one feature behind a subscription even tho they write that all base game patch features would always not require a sub.
SMH
That is simple why it is a base game feature - if you have acquired that bag by subscription and unsubscribe, you will still have access to the bag, you can just not put anything into it any longer - it has limited functionality when unsubscribed.
@Lysette
Here is the problem ....it is a base game feature "locked behind" a subscription requirement. It goes against everything ZOS announced about Tamriel Unlimited for base game updates.
The first word in your comment "if" followed by "subscriptions" between the word "lock"
That's the problem....it's either a base game feature or not.
According to ZOS in their ESO live and in the info on Tamriel Unlimited "base game patches" are included without the need to sub. This is not the case for this one feature amongst all others as described by ZOS.
yes, the feature is included, that this bag is not ceasing to be, if you unsub, so it has to be part of the base game - but the bag itself is not obtainable without a subscription.
@Lysette
Actually no, the feature is not included. That's the whole point.
It's literally excluded to non subscribers....but only that one not the others.
It's never accessible until you subscribe.
So by default ZOS has decided to go back on the once confirmed statement that all base game update patches will not require a sub.
By that token you should object to any bonus given to subscribers, all of which are base game bonuses as a DLC isn't necessary to enjoy them, although I suspect that in practice you only object to this one, presumably because you want it while not being willing or able for whatever reason to subscribe in order to get it.
To put it another way, if instead of announcing the introduction of crafting bags ZOS had announced a slight increase in the xp bonus rates for subscribers or an extra couple of hundred crowns per month to subscribers, would you have felt so aggrieved that these were base game updates only available to subscribers and therefore in breach of previous statements by ZOS? I don't believe in all honesty that we would have seen a fraction of the posts from you that we've seen on this topic and yet the principle would have been exactly the same.
@Tandor
Actually no.
The benefits excluding crafting bags enhance the base game features that are available to everyone outside of a sub. I have no objection to this even to the extent that ESO plus should keep the "unlimited" nature of the crafting bags but the access should not require a sub or crowns.
Base game update in how ZOS has used it and how it was described in context to the Tamriel Unlimited changes were that ESO Plus would remain (so those benefits were added to the old sub under a name name) and that all base game updates would remain for all outside of a sub to existing customers and new customers who purchase ESO TU.
Again...I have no objections to ESO Plus benefits at al and even to your example I actually have suggested that they should offer increased bonuses as well. Changing the sub in those ways is not a breach of the Tamriel Unlimited confirmed statements by Matt F.
I believe your assumptions are completely invalid as well as the context that somehow this doesn't specifically conflict with what's still officially on this site. The forums, the Xbox, PC and PS4 retail sites and the announcements by ZOS on the PS4 social sites and Redditt made by Gina and Jessica.
You just contradicted yourself in the opening statement here. In fact, all the bag does is enhance the base game features available to everyone outside of a sub. The bag is space, albeit an unlimited source of it for particular items. It has no other unique features. Space is available to all already, regardless of sub. This extra "enhancement" on inventory space is not.0 -
Clerics1985✭✭✭DarkWombat wrote: »Who subs JUST FOR CRAFTING BAGS???
I subscribed just for the Extra Experience Bump in the first place. since I already bought "most" expansions outright (didn't Buy Orsinium, but I got IC/TG/DB how shoddy is that xD) as well as QOL additions such as Assistant etc Costumes etc. The crafting bags will be even Better reason to keep my sub up cuz atm I just Sub back up whenever I feel I need to, the crafting bag coupled with the assistant will ensure 100% space in my bag at all times and I never have to go to town again Muahahaha0 -
NewBlacksmurf✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »To be honest,
The crafting bags ...are a base game patch feature just like poisons, champion system, name plates, etc according to ZOS so these should be in game gold.
If the crown store wants to add opportunities that is fine.
If the ESO Plus wants to further extent the slots to some astronomical number, fine but there should be a basic 20 - `00 slot option or buy in game to access and then upgrade just like the bank because its an inventory feature and not any actual items.
Even ZOS writes it as a base game patch but then decides to lock that one feature behind a subscription even tho they write that all base game patch features would always not require a sub.
SMH
That is simple why it is a base game feature - if you have acquired that bag by subscription and unsubscribe, you will still have access to the bag, you can just not put anything into it any longer - it has limited functionality when unsubscribed.
@Lysette
Here is the problem ....it is a base game feature "locked behind" a subscription requirement. It goes against everything ZOS announced about Tamriel Unlimited for base game updates.
The first word in your comment "if" followed by "subscriptions" between the word "lock"
That's the problem....it's either a base game feature or not.
According to ZOS in their ESO live and in the info on Tamriel Unlimited "base game patches" are included without the need to sub. This is not the case for this one feature amongst all others as described by ZOS.
yes, the feature is included, that this bag is not ceasing to be, if you unsub, so it has to be part of the base game - but the bag itself is not obtainable without a subscription.
@Lysette
Actually no, the feature is not included. That's the whole point.
It's literally excluded to non subscribers....but only that one not the others.
It's never accessible until you subscribe.
So by default ZOS has decided to go back on the once confirmed statement that all base game update patches will not require a sub.
By that token you should object to any bonus given to subscribers, all of which are base game bonuses as a DLC isn't necessary to enjoy them, although I suspect that in practice you only object to this one, presumably because you want it while not being willing or able for whatever reason to subscribe in order to get it.
To put it another way, if instead of announcing the introduction of crafting bags ZOS had announced a slight increase in the xp bonus rates for subscribers or an extra couple of hundred crowns per month to subscribers, would you have felt so aggrieved that these were base game updates only available to subscribers and therefore in breach of previous statements by ZOS? I don't believe in all honesty that we would have seen a fraction of the posts from you that we've seen on this topic and yet the principle would have been exactly the same.
@Tandor
Actually no.
The benefits excluding crafting bags enhance the base game features that are available to everyone outside of a sub. I have no objection to this even to the extent that ESO plus should keep the "unlimited" nature of the crafting bags but the access should not require a sub or crowns.
Base game update in how ZOS has used it and how it was described in context to the Tamriel Unlimited changes were that ESO Plus would remain (so those benefits were added to the old sub under a name name) and that all base game updates would remain for all outside of a sub to existing customers and new customers who purchase ESO TU.
Again...I have no objections to ESO Plus benefits at al and even to your example I actually have suggested that they should offer increased bonuses as well. Changing the sub in those ways is not a breach of the Tamriel Unlimited confirmed statements by Matt F.
I believe your assumptions are completely invalid as well as the context that somehow this doesn't specifically conflict with what's still officially on this site. The forums, the Xbox, PC and PS4 retail sites and the announcements by ZOS on the PS4 social sites and Redditt made by Gina and Jessica.
If the bags werent introduced with the base game patch,just how would you suggest it was added.Remember,it is only for subs.So,give us your solution,since adding the simple little bag offended you as part of the patch.
What other manner of a dding it to the game do you see as proper,..except giving it to all players who dont sub.
@Volkodav
The bags are a base game patch. They are just locked behind a required sub.
Base game patch update features
-If it were done in alignment with Matt F's confirmations, it would work just like poisons or DB motifs. You'd have to obtain access within the game.
Specifically I believe it should require going to the bag merchant to but the initial 20 or so slots and upgrade like the bank but to a max of let's say 100 slots.
See I do believe ESO Plus should offer benefits and further enhance and that's good for business.
-PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *5010 -
RandalMarrs✭✭✭I don't think the op even visits this thread anymore. So if we just stop answering, this thread will disappear as it is not needed anymore.Edited by RandalMarrs on June 14, 2016 7:28PM0
-
NewBlacksmurf✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Callous2208 wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »To be honest,
The crafting bags ...are a base game patch feature just like poisons, champion system, name plates, etc according to ZOS so these should be in game gold.
If the crown store wants to add opportunities that is fine.
If the ESO Plus wants to further extent the slots to some astronomical number, fine but there should be a basic 20 - `00 slot option or buy in game to access and then upgrade just like the bank because its an inventory feature and not any actual items.
Even ZOS writes it as a base game patch but then decides to lock that one feature behind a subscription even tho they write that all base game patch features would always not require a sub.
SMH
That is simple why it is a base game feature - if you have acquired that bag by subscription and unsubscribe, you will still have access to the bag, you can just not put anything into it any longer - it has limited functionality when unsubscribed.
@Lysette
Here is the problem ....it is a base game feature "locked behind" a subscription requirement. It goes against everything ZOS announced about Tamriel Unlimited for base game updates.
The first word in your comment "if" followed by "subscriptions" between the word "lock"
That's the problem....it's either a base game feature or not.
According to ZOS in their ESO live and in the info on Tamriel Unlimited "base game patches" are included without the need to sub. This is not the case for this one feature amongst all others as described by ZOS.
yes, the feature is included, that this bag is not ceasing to be, if you unsub, so it has to be part of the base game - but the bag itself is not obtainable without a subscription.
@Lysette
Actually no, the feature is not included. That's the whole point.
It's literally excluded to non subscribers....but only that one not the others.
It's never accessible until you subscribe.
So by default ZOS has decided to go back on the once confirmed statement that all base game update patches will not require a sub.
By that token you should object to any bonus given to subscribers, all of which are base game bonuses as a DLC isn't necessary to enjoy them, although I suspect that in practice you only object to this one, presumably because you want it while not being willing or able for whatever reason to subscribe in order to get it.
To put it another way, if instead of announcing the introduction of crafting bags ZOS had announced a slight increase in the xp bonus rates for subscribers or an extra couple of hundred crowns per month to subscribers, would you have felt so aggrieved that these were base game updates only available to subscribers and therefore in breach of previous statements by ZOS? I don't believe in all honesty that we would have seen a fraction of the posts from you that we've seen on this topic and yet the principle would have been exactly the same.
@Tandor
Actually no.
The benefits excluding crafting bags enhance the base game features that are available to everyone outside of a sub. I have no objection to this even to the extent that ESO plus should keep the "unlimited" nature of the crafting bags but the access should not require a sub or crowns.
Base game update in how ZOS has used it and how it was described in context to the Tamriel Unlimited changes were that ESO Plus would remain (so those benefits were added to the old sub under a name name) and that all base game updates would remain for all outside of a sub to existing customers and new customers who purchase ESO TU.
Again...I have no objections to ESO Plus benefits at al and even to your example I actually have suggested that they should offer increased bonuses as well. Changing the sub in those ways is not a breach of the Tamriel Unlimited confirmed statements by Matt F.
I believe your assumptions are completely invalid as well as the context that somehow this doesn't specifically conflict with what's still officially on this site. The forums, the Xbox, PC and PS4 retail sites and the announcements by ZOS on the PS4 social sites and Redditt made by Gina and Jessica.
You just contradicted yourself in the opening statement here. In fact, all the bag does is enhance the base game features available to everyone outside of a sub. The bag is space, albeit an unlimited source of it for particular items. It has no other unique features. Space is available to all already, regardless of sub. This extra "enhancement" on inventory space is not.
@Callous2208
There no contradiction in my comments.
The crafting bags features is a new tab within the inventory options we have.
This tab is only accessible by means of a sub
That's not an ehancement benefit because without the sub there is nothing to enhance.
You either have the feature or you don't which is locked behind a sub but Matt F said that would not be the case so I'm expressing my discontent as well as the OP of them going back on their word.
-PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *5011 -
vyndral13preub18_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
Zos said they were not going free to play., or buy to play.
They then went buy to play.
They then said base game items would be free to everyone.
But then you need to subscribe for some of them.
So really Zos kept their word and never went buy to play and we are still subscription based!
It is all smoke and mirrors!1 -
DarkWombat✭✭✭✭RandalMarrs wrote: »I don't think the op even visits this thread anymore. So if we just stop answering, this thread will disappear as it is not needed anymore.
Yeah, I said a few pages back that im gonna sub. I did not know that once you have the bag, it can still hold things even after the sub was over. You cant add things but they will stay in there.
Please people we are done here lol.0 -
maboleth✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'd probably subscribe to support the game and get the crafting bags and some crowns, BUT, I do not want 10% XP gain.
I already level too fast, for my taste. Leveling 10% faster would be a no-no. Maybe when One Tamriel comes out and the content is scaled. But until I see that, I do not want 10% increase.0 -
Callous2208✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »Callous2208 wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »To be honest,
The crafting bags ...are a base game patch feature just like poisons, champion system, name plates, etc according to ZOS so these should be in game gold.
If the crown store wants to add opportunities that is fine.
If the ESO Plus wants to further extent the slots to some astronomical number, fine but there should be a basic 20 - `00 slot option or buy in game to access and then upgrade just like the bank because its an inventory feature and not any actual items.
Even ZOS writes it as a base game patch but then decides to lock that one feature behind a subscription even tho they write that all base game patch features would always not require a sub.
SMH
That is simple why it is a base game feature - if you have acquired that bag by subscription and unsubscribe, you will still have access to the bag, you can just not put anything into it any longer - it has limited functionality when unsubscribed.
@Lysette
Here is the problem ....it is a base game feature "locked behind" a subscription requirement. It goes against everything ZOS announced about Tamriel Unlimited for base game updates.
The first word in your comment "if" followed by "subscriptions" between the word "lock"
That's the problem....it's either a base game feature or not.
According to ZOS in their ESO live and in the info on Tamriel Unlimited "base game patches" are included without the need to sub. This is not the case for this one feature amongst all others as described by ZOS.
yes, the feature is included, that this bag is not ceasing to be, if you unsub, so it has to be part of the base game - but the bag itself is not obtainable without a subscription.
@Lysette
Actually no, the feature is not included. That's the whole point.
It's literally excluded to non subscribers....but only that one not the others.
It's never accessible until you subscribe.
So by default ZOS has decided to go back on the once confirmed statement that all base game update patches will not require a sub.
By that token you should object to any bonus given to subscribers, all of which are base game bonuses as a DLC isn't necessary to enjoy them, although I suspect that in practice you only object to this one, presumably because you want it while not being willing or able for whatever reason to subscribe in order to get it.
To put it another way, if instead of announcing the introduction of crafting bags ZOS had announced a slight increase in the xp bonus rates for subscribers or an extra couple of hundred crowns per month to subscribers, would you have felt so aggrieved that these were base game updates only available to subscribers and therefore in breach of previous statements by ZOS? I don't believe in all honesty that we would have seen a fraction of the posts from you that we've seen on this topic and yet the principle would have been exactly the same.
@Tandor
Actually no.
The benefits excluding crafting bags enhance the base game features that are available to everyone outside of a sub. I have no objection to this even to the extent that ESO plus should keep the "unlimited" nature of the crafting bags but the access should not require a sub or crowns.
Base game update in how ZOS has used it and how it was described in context to the Tamriel Unlimited changes were that ESO Plus would remain (so those benefits were added to the old sub under a name name) and that all base game updates would remain for all outside of a sub to existing customers and new customers who purchase ESO TU.
Again...I have no objections to ESO Plus benefits at al and even to your example I actually have suggested that they should offer increased bonuses as well. Changing the sub in those ways is not a breach of the Tamriel Unlimited confirmed statements by Matt F.
I believe your assumptions are completely invalid as well as the context that somehow this doesn't specifically conflict with what's still officially on this site. The forums, the Xbox, PC and PS4 retail sites and the announcements by ZOS on the PS4 social sites and Redditt made by Gina and Jessica.
You just contradicted yourself in the opening statement here. In fact, all the bag does is enhance the base game features available to everyone outside of a sub. The bag is space, albeit an unlimited source of it for particular items. It has no other unique features. Space is available to all already, regardless of sub. This extra "enhancement" on inventory space is not.
@Callous2208
There no contradiction in my comments.
The crafting bags features is a new tab within the inventory options we have.
This tab is only accessible by means of a sub
That's not an ehancement benefit because without the sub there is nothing to enhance.
You either have the feature or you don't which is locked behind a sub but Matt F said that would not be the case so I'm expressing my discontent as well as the OP of them going back on their word.
So if you could click that tab, see the empty window, but not use it...all would be well? If this is what everyone is so upset about I say by all means, let the non subs click on and preview their empty bags.4 -
ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭Holy ***, shut up."As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?2 -
NewBlacksmurf✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Callous2208 wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »Callous2208 wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »To be honest,
The crafting bags ...are a base game patch feature just like poisons, champion system, name plates, etc according to ZOS so these should be in game gold.
If the crown store wants to add opportunities that is fine.
If the ESO Plus wants to further extent the slots to some astronomical number, fine but there should be a basic 20 - `00 slot option or buy in game to access and then upgrade just like the bank because its an inventory feature and not any actual items.
Even ZOS writes it as a base game patch but then decides to lock that one feature behind a subscription even tho they write that all base game patch features would always not require a sub.
SMH
That is simple why it is a base game feature - if you have acquired that bag by subscription and unsubscribe, you will still have access to the bag, you can just not put anything into it any longer - it has limited functionality when unsubscribed.
@Lysette
Here is the problem ....it is a base game feature "locked behind" a subscription requirement. It goes against everything ZOS announced about Tamriel Unlimited for base game updates.
The first word in your comment "if" followed by "subscriptions" between the word "lock"
That's the problem....it's either a base game feature or not.
According to ZOS in their ESO live and in the info on Tamriel Unlimited "base game patches" are included without the need to sub. This is not the case for this one feature amongst all others as described by ZOS.
yes, the feature is included, that this bag is not ceasing to be, if you unsub, so it has to be part of the base game - but the bag itself is not obtainable without a subscription.
@Lysette
Actually no, the feature is not included. That's the whole point.
It's literally excluded to non subscribers....but only that one not the others.
It's never accessible until you subscribe.
So by default ZOS has decided to go back on the once confirmed statement that all base game update patches will not require a sub.
By that token you should object to any bonus given to subscribers, all of which are base game bonuses as a DLC isn't necessary to enjoy them, although I suspect that in practice you only object to this one, presumably because you want it while not being willing or able for whatever reason to subscribe in order to get it.
To put it another way, if instead of announcing the introduction of crafting bags ZOS had announced a slight increase in the xp bonus rates for subscribers or an extra couple of hundred crowns per month to subscribers, would you have felt so aggrieved that these were base game updates only available to subscribers and therefore in breach of previous statements by ZOS? I don't believe in all honesty that we would have seen a fraction of the posts from you that we've seen on this topic and yet the principle would have been exactly the same.
@Tandor
Actually no.
The benefits excluding crafting bags enhance the base game features that are available to everyone outside of a sub. I have no objection to this even to the extent that ESO plus should keep the "unlimited" nature of the crafting bags but the access should not require a sub or crowns.
Base game update in how ZOS has used it and how it was described in context to the Tamriel Unlimited changes were that ESO Plus would remain (so those benefits were added to the old sub under a name name) and that all base game updates would remain for all outside of a sub to existing customers and new customers who purchase ESO TU.
Again...I have no objections to ESO Plus benefits at al and even to your example I actually have suggested that they should offer increased bonuses as well. Changing the sub in those ways is not a breach of the Tamriel Unlimited confirmed statements by Matt F.
I believe your assumptions are completely invalid as well as the context that somehow this doesn't specifically conflict with what's still officially on this site. The forums, the Xbox, PC and PS4 retail sites and the announcements by ZOS on the PS4 social sites and Redditt made by Gina and Jessica.
You just contradicted yourself in the opening statement here. In fact, all the bag does is enhance the base game features available to everyone outside of a sub. The bag is space, albeit an unlimited source of it for particular items. It has no other unique features. Space is available to all already, regardless of sub. This extra "enhancement" on inventory space is not.
@Callous2208
There no contradiction in my comments.
The crafting bags features is a new tab within the inventory options we have.
This tab is only accessible by means of a sub
That's not an ehancement benefit because without the sub there is nothing to enhance.
You either have the feature or you don't which is locked behind a sub but Matt F said that would not be the case so I'm expressing my discontent as well as the OP of them going back on their word.
So if you could click that tab, see the empty window, but not use it...all would be well? If this is what everyone is so upset about I say by all means, let the non subs click on and preview their empty bags.
@Callous2208
Please read and review my other comments on this here
The feature and access to it should come to some limited extent outside of a sub and crowns.
Meaning I should be able to go to the bag merchant and use gold to buy access and upgrade it to let's say a max of 100 slots or so
-PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *5010 -
Callous2208✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »Callous2208 wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »Callous2208 wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »To be honest,
The crafting bags ...are a base game patch feature just like poisons, champion system, name plates, etc according to ZOS so these should be in game gold.
If the crown store wants to add opportunities that is fine.
If the ESO Plus wants to further extent the slots to some astronomical number, fine but there should be a basic 20 - `00 slot option or buy in game to access and then upgrade just like the bank because its an inventory feature and not any actual items.
Even ZOS writes it as a base game patch but then decides to lock that one feature behind a subscription even tho they write that all base game patch features would always not require a sub.
SMH
That is simple why it is a base game feature - if you have acquired that bag by subscription and unsubscribe, you will still have access to the bag, you can just not put anything into it any longer - it has limited functionality when unsubscribed.
@Lysette
Here is the problem ....it is a base game feature "locked behind" a subscription requirement. It goes against everything ZOS announced about Tamriel Unlimited for base game updates.
The first word in your comment "if" followed by "subscriptions" between the word "lock"
That's the problem....it's either a base game feature or not.
According to ZOS in their ESO live and in the info on Tamriel Unlimited "base game patches" are included without the need to sub. This is not the case for this one feature amongst all others as described by ZOS.
yes, the feature is included, that this bag is not ceasing to be, if you unsub, so it has to be part of the base game - but the bag itself is not obtainable without a subscription.
@Lysette
Actually no, the feature is not included. That's the whole point.
It's literally excluded to non subscribers....but only that one not the others.
It's never accessible until you subscribe.
So by default ZOS has decided to go back on the once confirmed statement that all base game update patches will not require a sub.
By that token you should object to any bonus given to subscribers, all of which are base game bonuses as a DLC isn't necessary to enjoy them, although I suspect that in practice you only object to this one, presumably because you want it while not being willing or able for whatever reason to subscribe in order to get it.
To put it another way, if instead of announcing the introduction of crafting bags ZOS had announced a slight increase in the xp bonus rates for subscribers or an extra couple of hundred crowns per month to subscribers, would you have felt so aggrieved that these were base game updates only available to subscribers and therefore in breach of previous statements by ZOS? I don't believe in all honesty that we would have seen a fraction of the posts from you that we've seen on this topic and yet the principle would have been exactly the same.
@Tandor
Actually no.
The benefits excluding crafting bags enhance the base game features that are available to everyone outside of a sub. I have no objection to this even to the extent that ESO plus should keep the "unlimited" nature of the crafting bags but the access should not require a sub or crowns.
Base game update in how ZOS has used it and how it was described in context to the Tamriel Unlimited changes were that ESO Plus would remain (so those benefits were added to the old sub under a name name) and that all base game updates would remain for all outside of a sub to existing customers and new customers who purchase ESO TU.
Again...I have no objections to ESO Plus benefits at al and even to your example I actually have suggested that they should offer increased bonuses as well. Changing the sub in those ways is not a breach of the Tamriel Unlimited confirmed statements by Matt F.
I believe your assumptions are completely invalid as well as the context that somehow this doesn't specifically conflict with what's still officially on this site. The forums, the Xbox, PC and PS4 retail sites and the announcements by ZOS on the PS4 social sites and Redditt made by Gina and Jessica.
You just contradicted yourself in the opening statement here. In fact, all the bag does is enhance the base game features available to everyone outside of a sub. The bag is space, albeit an unlimited source of it for particular items. It has no other unique features. Space is available to all already, regardless of sub. This extra "enhancement" on inventory space is not.
@Callous2208
There no contradiction in my comments.
The crafting bags features is a new tab within the inventory options we have.
This tab is only accessible by means of a sub
That's not an ehancement benefit because without the sub there is nothing to enhance.
You either have the feature or you don't which is locked behind a sub but Matt F said that would not be the case so I'm expressing my discontent as well as the OP of them going back on their word.
So if you could click that tab, see the empty window, but not use it...all would be well? If this is what everyone is so upset about I say by all means, let the non subs click on and preview their empty bags.
@Callous2208
Please read and review my other comments on this here
The feature and access to it should come to some limited extent outside of a sub and crowns.
Meaning I should be able to go to the bag merchant and use gold to buy access and upgrade it to let's say a max of 100 slots or so
I've read them. I'm just being a jerk because these threads are tiresome and I disagree with your points entirely.3 -
Silver_Strider✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭If I can't have crafting bags, can you at least let materials stack upwards of 1000 mats per stack instead of the 200 currently in place?
Having 20 stacks of Ancestor Silk, Rubedo Leather and Rubidite each with another 12 stacks of Lorhkan tears really takes up all my bank space.Argonian forever0 -
Redhawk05✭✭After playing, and absolutely loving this game, they have earned my $15 per month. They deserve it, and the developers, company, janitors, window cleaners, coders, managers, marketers, etc all deserve to make a living off of their hard work. I have been looking for an entertaining, immersive, MMORPG since I played Everquest in 2002. A game where teamwork, and cooperation still matters, not just fighting next to each other where everyone can heal themselves and DPS like in Guild Wars 2. EQ 2 was ok, but it was very much like Guild Wars 2 in that no one really worked together. Everquest Next? Yeah right. WoW? If you like cartoony graphics. Rift, Aeon, etc, are they still around? ESO blows away the current MMORPG competition, and I'm hoping it can continue so for years to come. My 3 favorite games besides Madden right now are ESO, Fallout 4, and Skyrim on PC(and soon PS4!) - all Bethesda. You've earned my hard earned dollar Bethesda, Zenimax, whatever, and I trust you will keep putting out content worthy of it.
Although I do have high hopes for Final Fantasy XV. Square Enix, Naughty Dog, and EA(for the most part if you like sports sims) are the other companies still making great games.
Bioware/EA used to be another one, but really missed the boat in my opinion with Dragon Age Inquisition. What garbage compared to what Dragon Age Origins was. I have to build ladders and towers? Send people places for diplomacy? Hold down R2 for 80% of the fight without strategy? Craft system was total garbage. Completely uninteresting characters and plot compared to Origins. And Neverwinter Online on PC...awful compared to ESO.0 -
Volkodav✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »To be honest,
The crafting bags ...are a base game patch feature just like poisons, champion system, name plates, etc according to ZOS so these should be in game gold.
If the crown store wants to add opportunities that is fine.
If the ESO Plus wants to further extent the slots to some astronomical number, fine but there should be a basic 20 - `00 slot option or buy in game to access and then upgrade just like the bank because its an inventory feature and not any actual items.
Even ZOS writes it as a base game patch but then decides to lock that one feature behind a subscription even tho they write that all base game patch features would always not require a sub.
SMH
That is simple why it is a base game feature - if you have acquired that bag by subscription and unsubscribe, you will still have access to the bag, you can just not put anything into it any longer - it has limited functionality when unsubscribed.
@Lysette
Here is the problem ....it is a base game feature "locked behind" a subscription requirement. It goes against everything ZOS announced about Tamriel Unlimited for base game updates.
The first word in your comment "if" followed by "subscriptions" between the word "lock"
That's the problem....it's either a base game feature or not.
According to ZOS in their ESO live and in the info on Tamriel Unlimited "base game patches" are included without the need to sub. This is not the case for this one feature amongst all others as described by ZOS.
yes, the feature is included, that this bag is not ceasing to be, if you unsub, so it has to be part of the base game - but the bag itself is not obtainable without a subscription.
@Lysette
Actually no, the feature is not included. That's the whole point.
It's literally excluded to non subscribers....but only that one not the others.
It's never accessible until you subscribe.
So by default ZOS has decided to go back on the once confirmed statement that all base game update patches will not require a sub.
By that token you should object to any bonus given to subscribers, all of which are base game bonuses as a DLC isn't necessary to enjoy them, although I suspect that in practice you only object to this one, presumably because you want it while not being willing or able for whatever reason to subscribe in order to get it.
To put it another way, if instead of announcing the introduction of crafting bags ZOS had announced a slight increase in the xp bonus rates for subscribers or an extra couple of hundred crowns per month to subscribers, would you have felt so aggrieved that these were base game updates only available to subscribers and therefore in breach of previous statements by ZOS? I don't believe in all honesty that we would have seen a fraction of the posts from you that we've seen on this topic and yet the principle would have been exactly the same.
@Tandor
Actually no.
The benefits excluding crafting bags enhance the base game features that are available to everyone outside of a sub. I have no objection to this even to the extent that ESO plus should keep the "unlimited" nature of the crafting bags but the access should not require a sub or crowns.
Base game update in how ZOS has used it and how it was described in context to the Tamriel Unlimited changes were that ESO Plus would remain (so those benefits were added to the old sub under a name name) and that all base game updates would remain for all outside of a sub to existing customers and new customers who purchase ESO TU.
Again...I have no objections to ESO Plus benefits at al and even to your example I actually have suggested that they should offer increased bonuses as well. Changing the sub in those ways is not a breach of the Tamriel Unlimited confirmed statements by Matt F.
I believe your assumptions are completely invalid as well as the context that somehow this doesn't specifically conflict with what's still officially on this site. The forums, the Xbox, PC and PS4 retail sites and the announcements by ZOS on the PS4 social sites and Redditt made by Gina and Jessica.
If the bags werent introduced with the base game patch,just how would you suggest it was added.Remember,it is only for subs.So,give us your solution,since adding the simple little bag offended you as part of the patch.
What other manner of a dding it to the game do you see as proper,..except giving it to all players who dont sub.
@Volkodav
The bags are a base game patch. They are just locked behind a required sub.
Base game patch update features
-If it were done in alignment with Matt F's confirmations, it would work just like poisons or DB motifs. You'd have to obtain access within the game.
Specifically I believe it should require going to the bag merchant to but the initial 20 or so slots and upgrade like the bank but to a max of let's say 100 slots.
See I do believe ESO Plus should offer benefits and further enhance and that's good for business.
Yes,but that is because you arent happy with it being only for subscribers.And you want to have it limited in space by only upgrades,..for everyone.However,it isnt for everyone,is it.It is a "perk",..cant you get that part? Never meant for everyone.
You didnt answer my question though.
I asked how you would have added it,"still only for subers"
NOT for all.
What manner would you have put in for "only those people" to get it? ZOS wanted those bags to be for Subbers,and I asked you since you didnt like the way it was implemented,how you would add it.
I didnt ask how you would have preferred the bag be available.0 -
NewBlacksmurf✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »NewBlacksmurf wrote: »To be honest,
The crafting bags ...are a base game patch feature just like poisons, champion system, name plates, etc according to ZOS so these should be in game gold.
If the crown store wants to add opportunities that is fine.
If the ESO Plus wants to further extent the slots to some astronomical number, fine but there should be a basic 20 - `00 slot option or buy in game to access and then upgrade just like the bank because its an inventory feature and not any actual items.
Even ZOS writes it as a base game patch but then decides to lock that one feature behind a subscription even tho they write that all base game patch features would always not require a sub.
SMH
That is simple why it is a base game feature - if you have acquired that bag by subscription and unsubscribe, you will still have access to the bag, you can just not put anything into it any longer - it has limited functionality when unsubscribed.
@Lysette
Here is the problem ....it is a base game feature "locked behind" a subscription requirement. It goes against everything ZOS announced about Tamriel Unlimited for base game updates.
The first word in your comment "if" followed by "subscriptions" between the word "lock"
That's the problem....it's either a base game feature or not.
According to ZOS in their ESO live and in the info on Tamriel Unlimited "base game patches" are included without the need to sub. This is not the case for this one feature amongst all others as described by ZOS.
yes, the feature is included, that this bag is not ceasing to be, if you unsub, so it has to be part of the base game - but the bag itself is not obtainable without a subscription.
@Lysette
Actually no, the feature is not included. That's the whole point.
It's literally excluded to non subscribers....but only that one not the others.
It's never accessible until you subscribe.
So by default ZOS has decided to go back on the once confirmed statement that all base game update patches will not require a sub.
I think you're playing fast and loose with semantics here. Yes, due to the fact that crafting bags are not tied to a specific DLC they are technically part of the "base game." However, ZOS never once mentioned crafting bags as anything but an ESO+ perk.
If they put "Crafting Bag" in its own section in the patch notes (maybe "Subscriber Perks" or something) would that really change what they are doing from disingenuous to above board?
@wayfarerx
It's not semantics and listing the feature elsewhere would be wrong because it's a base game feature "locked behind a required sub"
The only way to make it right would be if they had something like a crafting assistant NPC that held your stuff.
If it's an item or some optional NPC or place then that is frustrating but it's no longer a base game feature which means the items in there stay and are only assessed and managed with either the purchase of a sub.
This here is literally blocking off an inventory option.
Just look at the PC and Xbox One patch notes. They literally decided to add a sub requirement to the base game patch feature.
It's like adding a sub to poisons
@NewBlacksmurf
It is semantics, you're overloading the term "base game feature." What is that supposed to even mean? Is anything you can get while subbed but still have access to after cancelling a "base game feature?" So maelstrom weapons, the TG and DB skill lines, etc. are all "base game features" because they don't disappear when you unsub?
ZOS never promised crafting bags without a sub. If they had and went back on it then I would say yes, that's disingenuous, but that is simply not the case. It is, and always has been, a subscriber perk. Arguments based on how it's categorized or implementation
details are far more disingenuous IMO.
@wayfarerx
I'm not going to go back n forth with you.
Matt F specifically stated and said that Base Game Patch updates current and future will never require a sub.
The crafting bag per the devs is a base game update feature.
It's described as such on PTS, PC, Xbox one patch notes and the web articles.
Within this, among other features like poison, the bag has an added sub requirement.
This isn't about crafting bags but it relates because crafting bag feature is a base game patch update.
My apologies if my comments are confusing but it's literally that as described by ZOS and previously clarified by ZOS in Ask us anything that this would not be the case
-PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *5011 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »That's not an ehancement benefit because without the sub there is nothing to enhance.
That's odd, I thought the whole point was that the crafting bag enhanced a player's inventory management - a feature that is common to all players, whether subbed or not. The fact that with the enhancement you get a new tab and without it you don't is at best pedantic and at worst nonsensical.
I can accept that there is a difference of degree between a base game update that increases a subscriber's xp and one that increases his inventory management as done by the crafting bag, but there's no difference in principle, both are base game changes dependent on subscribing, and the difference in degree was required because the incentive to subscribe was previously pretty well non-existent as shown by all the "you subscribers are losers" posts.0 -
Defilted✭✭✭✭✭
✭@NewBlacksmurf
You state that crafting bags are a game based feature. This is your opinion(Even if based on years of MMO play). ESO may not consider these to be game based feature. Even if ESO made an official statement that they where and then later changed their mind I still do not see an issue.XBOX NA
XBOX Series X
#NightmareBear0 -
anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭DarkWombat wrote: »Who subs JUST FOR CRAFTING BAGS???
I don't (yet, I might get weak and give in) but if I did, it would be ONLY for the crafting bags (+ it's a relevan way to get crowns to purchase DLCs)0 -
NewBlacksmurf✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@NewBlacksmurf
You state that crafting bags are a game based feature. This is your opinion(Even if based on years of MMO play). ESO may not consider these to be game based feature. Even if ESO made an official statement that they where and then later changed their mind I still do not see an issue.
@Defilted
Please go read the announcement article and patch notes.
This isn't my opinion or a misunderstanding it's a quote from ZOS information and communications.
As written your statement is off base
(Please don't take this harsh as its not intnded to be short or harsh but I'd like you to o read so your comments make sense in context to what ZOS has provided previously)-PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *5011 -
nimander99✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I guess I fall in between the two groups, as I sub and purchase outright all DLC content...I AM UPDATING MY PRIVACY POLICY
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
∽∽∽ 2 years of Elder Scrolls Online ∼∼∼
"Give us money" = Box sales & monthly sub fees,
"moar!" = £10 palomino horse,
"MOAR!" = Switch to B2P, launch cash shop,
"MOAR!!" = Charge for DLC that subs had already paid for,
"MOAR!!!" = Experience scrolls and riding lessons,
"MOARR!!!" = Vampire/werewolf bites,
"MOAARRR!!!" = CS exclusive motifs,
"MOOAARRR!!!" = Crown crates,
"MOOOAAARRR!!!" = 'Chapter's' bought separately from ESO+,
"MOOOOAAAARRRR!!!!" = ???
Male, Dunmer, VR16, Templar, Aldmeri Dominion, Master Crafter & all Traits, CP4502 -
NewBlacksmurf✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »That's not an ehancement benefit because without the sub there is nothing to enhance.
That's odd, I thought the whole point was that the crafting bag enhanced a player's inventory management - a feature that is common to all players, whether subbed or not. The fact that with the enhancement you get a new tab and without it you don't is at best pedantic and at worst nonsensical.
I can accept that there is a difference of degree between a base game update that increases a subscriber's xp and one that increases his inventory management as done by the crafting bag, but there's no difference in principle, both are base game changes dependent on subscribing, and the difference in degree was required because the incentive to subscribe was previously pretty well non-existent as shown by all the "you subscribers are losers" posts.
@Tandor
I agree that the community feedback was requesting QoL updates or as you write "inventory enhancements" but as written the crafting bag is a new base game feature locked behind a required subscription in order to access it at all. Then if the sub expires, the access is limited furthermore
Your words and not mine....we didn't get an enhancement but instead we got a new base game feature update.
We aren't discussion exp so no idea why that's brought up.
We are discussing DB base game feature updates where one is specifically limited to a required subscription that Matt F previously confirmed would not be the case for "any base game updates".
-PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *5010 -
Defilted✭✭✭✭✭
✭I never saw a comment from ZOS that said Crafting bags specifically are a game base feature.XBOX NA
XBOX Series X
#NightmareBear0
