Pelinals Aptitude

Emma_Overload · April 2016

I was able to put together a rough build on the PTS with a Dunmer Templar that tooltipped a 12K Wrecking Blow with an 8K Breath of Life. That's not as good as a "min-maxed" build for either magicka or stamina, but it's cool to have both on the same bar. I was using 5 Heavy 1 Medium 1 Light for the armor, so I could use the Constitution passive effectively while still getting the Undaunted passive to buff stats. I also used the Engine Guardian set with Agility jewelry and the Maelstrom 2H.

acw37162 · April 2016

Also very much a damage ranking set with health regen and balanced stat pools a tank might have would benefit from this gear set up.

Needs to be the highest value of weapon or spell damage plus max stamina or magica and I would have this wet in the first two hours after launch

ADarklore · April 2016

So if this set calculates on 'highest damage between spell and weapon damage' does it take into consideration the highest 'crit' rate as well? So you now can get equal damage yet your crit difference could be WAY off... which would effectively put your overall DPS way off as well.

mrdavis1118ub17_ESO · April 2016

no it doesnt scale crit, it should at the very least though. Ive spent HOURS going through every v16 set arrangement since PTS launch to find some kind of combo that would work with this, and it just falls flat. If the crit scaled as well that WOULD actually open up some opportunities. One of the other main issues are lack of jewelry options in general, so you can actually pair this with other sets. For example, one may want to do a a max magicka/wep dmg build, using 5 medium for the wep dmg bonus, as well as the 8% wep bonus from dawnbreaker, and other fighters guild skills to get access to a significant amount of spell damage you could get no other way, but the set arrangements are just not available, and you are basically left with just being able to put wep dmg enchants on jewelry. Most of the modern sets give both wep and spell dmg already, defeating the purpose of this set. BUT if the crit scaled too, then there actually are some 3-4-5 piece wep dmg centric sets you could fit with it. Another option would be doing the opposite (Max stam/spell dmg), essentially turning entropy into a stam skill (Hp buff, empower, 20% wep dmg buff all in one) I would take that over hidden blade any day of the week.

And before anyone says anything about using dawnbreaker, yes I know it is physical dmg now, but it will still scale off max stat, you just lose out on the extra physical dmg from CP tree (we need more people in non CP campaign anyways, not an issue there).

Minno · April 2016

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

I was able to put together a rough build on the PTS with a Dunmer Templar that tooltipped a 12K Wrecking Blow with an 8K Breath of Life. That's not as good as a "min-maxed" build for either magicka or stamina, but it's cool to have both on the same bar. I was using 5 Heavy 1 Medium 1 Light for the armor, so I could use the Constitution passive effectively while still getting the Undaunted passive to buff stats. I also used the Engine Guardian set with Agility jewelry and the Maelstrom 2H.

As a Templar using heavy armor, engine gaurdian is required if you want to switch some regen to spell/weapon power.

Solid rough build though!

Lucius_Aelius · April 2016

I'm very interested in this set for my Templar, who already I had specced as a Mag/Stam Tank/Heal/DPS Hybrid but respecced to be Magicka only when I saw how awful my healing was. My idea had been to use a Two-Hander for damage and save my Magicka for heals, so I could attack all I wanted without worrying about not being able to heal because they make use of different resources. I liked that build a lot and was loathe to change it but in PvP with healing cut in half it just wasn't working well enough and had to go.

So if this set can make that Build work then I'd be thrilled and will happily go back to using it, but as others have said there's also the resource pools, crit chance and penetration to take into account, and without boosts to those as well I'm worried this just isn't doing enough to justify sacrificing a 5-piece bonus over. Frankly since 5-piece bonuses are generally so good on the best sets, I don't think it'd be OP at all to have this bonus make all of those things equal to whichever is highest, it still forces you to lose out on Regen in order to stack those things as high as a min/max build, and if your regen is lower then damage output will be lower and that should prevent any possibility of the set being OP.

Hutch679 · May 2016

No comment

Spearshard · May 2016

I've been thinking about this set. I had planned on using briarheart jewlery, 2 pieces armor for the 5 bonus, and pelinals 5 piece, plus molag kena shoulder on my stamplar. The regen would be nice and having access to a good heal as well as blazing spear as another DoT and radiant for a finisher. Shame that magica won't have the same crit, but I do get about 30% from champion points. I haven't had a chance to test it, but seems like a fun build.

Birdovic · May 2016

Hutch679 wrote: »

What if you ran this to get spell power maxed. Hear me out....

3/3 agility jewelry arcane (2 weapon damage/1 magicka recovery glyphs) this gives lots of weapon damage
Dual wield swords - gives passive to increase weapon damage based on off hand and passive to increase weapon damage from two swords
5/5 medium armor (pelinals obviously) - gives 12% weapon damage bonus
Flawless dawnbreaker slotted on dps bar- gives another 5% weapon damage
2/5 Lekis focus - gives 129 weapon damage

I'm a Dk so I can use igneous weapons for both the wep/spell damage buffs...

Run all max magicka glyphs, slot inner light. Call it a day.

Now wouldn't this be an incredibly high amount of spell damage as what you could get off of julianos or kagrenacs hope?

I can't test it I'm not on PC, but I would think it would be decent. It would allow you to still use dawnbreaker too due to having high weapon damage. Also champion points would be spread to spell damage and NOT mighty. Mighty doesn't buff weapon damage, only tool tip damage of physical skills (I think...).

Thoughts?

You should keep in mind:

Igneous Weapons does indeed increase Weapon AND Spelldamage, but with Pelinals Aptitude in its current state, it wont work as you assume it does.

Lets say you have 1200 Spelldmg and 3600 Weapon damage and use Igneous Weapons.
You will receive 3600 Weapon Damage +20% only, the Spelldmg increase wont activate aswell because its base value is lower and therefore only Weapon Damage is taken into consideration.

But yeah, if you want to stack damage, Weapon Damage is easier to get high than Spelldmg.

And for Dawnbreaker:
Both Morphs will be Physical Damage when DB DLC hits Live Servers

Lexxypwns · May 2016

So I can get 46k Stam and magika on my sorc? Yes please.

Birdovic · May 2016

Lexxypwns wrote: »

So I can get 46k Stam and magika on my sorc? Yes please.

Pelinals only brings your lower Damage Type (lets say Spelldmg) up to the higher one (Weapon Damage).

Lets say your stats are:
1200 Spell Damage
3600 Weapon Damage

Your Spell Damage will become 3600 aswell.

Ressource Pools are not affected.

Hutch679 · May 2016

No comment

Ashamray · May 2016

So this set is generally for stamina hybrides, because usually Wdamage is higher than Sdamage.

Birdovic · May 2016

Hutch679 wrote: »

andypappb16_ESO wrote: »

Hutch679 wrote: »

What if you ran this to get spell power maxed. Hear me out....

3/3 agility jewelry arcane (2 weapon damage/1 magicka recovery glyphs) this gives lots of weapon damage
Dual wield swords - gives passive to increase weapon damage based on off hand and passive to increase weapon damage from two swords
5/5 medium armor (pelinals obviously) - gives 12% weapon damage bonus
Flawless dawnbreaker slotted on dps bar- gives another 5% weapon damage
2/5 Lekis focus - gives 129 weapon damage

I'm a Dk so I can use igneous weapons for both the wep/spell damage buffs...

Run all max magicka glyphs, slot inner light. Call it a day.

Now wouldn't this be an incredibly high amount of spell damage as what you could get off of julianos or kagrenacs hope?

I can't test it I'm not on PC, but I would think it would be decent. It would allow you to still use dawnbreaker too due to having high weapon damage. Also champion points would be spread to spell damage and NOT mighty. Mighty doesn't buff weapon damage, only tool tip damage of physical skills (I think...).

Thoughts?

You should keep in mind:

Igneous Weapons does indeed increase Weapon AND Spelldamage, but with Pelinals Aptitude in its current state, it wont work as you assume it does.

Lets say you have 1200 Spelldmg and 3600 Weapon damage and use Igneous Weapons.
You will receive 3600 Weapon Damage +20% only, the Spelldmg increase wont activate aswell because its base value is lower and therefore only Weapon Damage is taken into consideration.

But yeah, if you want to stack damage, Weapon Damage is easier to get high than Spelldmg.

And for Dawnbreaker:
Both Morphs will be PhysiCal Damage when DB DLC hits Live Servers

I realize those two major won't stack together into one value... The point was there is no skill that a magicka Dk can use to gain major brutality outside of igneous weapons or rally from two hand. Since it wouldn't be logical to use rally, igneous weapons would be used to increase weapon damage by 20%.
Right dawn breaker will scale with physical damage hence why you can run it with this set because your weapon damage is really high... Also pelinals doesn't say it matches base damage, it says it scales to the highest of the two values. Meaning if you have 1200 spell damage and 3600 weapon damage while wearing this set, both you spell damage and weapon damage will equal 3600. If you apply major brutality then you weapon damage will scale an additional 20 percent making your new weapon damage 4320. The 5 piece matches this value to spell damage so your spell damage would also be 4320.

Nah you misunderstood me.
Yes of course you can use Major Brutality to increase both Values as result. Just wanted to make sure you dont think its possible to increase by 20% with Weapon Damage buffs and afterwards, going from the now higher value increasing Spelldmg again by 20% or something lol.
What I meant with base damage is, which of the two (Weapon or Spelldmg) is higher at the beginning, without buffs etc.

AfkNinja · May 2016

Hutch679 wrote: »

andypappb16_ESO wrote: »

Hutch679 wrote: »

What if you ran this to get spell power maxed. Hear me out....

3/3 agility jewelry arcane (2 weapon damage/1 magicka recovery glyphs) this gives lots of weapon damage
Dual wield swords - gives passive to increase weapon damage based on off hand and passive to increase weapon damage from two swords
5/5 medium armor (pelinals obviously) - gives 12% weapon damage bonus
Flawless dawnbreaker slotted on dps bar- gives another 5% weapon damage
2/5 Lekis focus - gives 129 weapon damage

I'm a Dk so I can use igneous weapons for both the wep/spell damage buffs...

Run all max magicka glyphs, slot inner light. Call it a day.

Now wouldn't this be an incredibly high amount of spell damage as what you could get off of julianos or kagrenacs hope?

I can't test it I'm not on PC, but I would think it would be decent. It would allow you to still use dawnbreaker too due to having high weapon damage. Also champion points would be spread to spell damage and NOT mighty. Mighty doesn't buff weapon damage, only tool tip damage of physical skills (I think...).

Thoughts?

You should keep in mind:

Igneous Weapons does indeed increase Weapon AND Spelldamage, but with Pelinals Aptitude in its current state, it wont work as you assume it does.

Lets say you have 1200 Spelldmg and 3600 Weapon damage and use Igneous Weapons.
You will receive 3600 Weapon Damage +20% only, the Spelldmg increase wont activate aswell because its base value is lower and therefore only Weapon Damage is taken into consideration.

But yeah, if you want to stack damage, Weapon Damage is easier to get high than Spelldmg.

And for Dawnbreaker:
Both Morphs will be PhysiCal Damage when DB DLC hits Live Servers

I realize those two major won't stack together into one value... The point was there is no skill that a magicka Dk can use to gain major brutality outside of igneous weapons or rally from two hand. Since it wouldn't be logical to use rally, igneous weapons would be used to increase weapon damage by 20%.
Right dawn breaker will scale with physical damage hence why you can run it with this set because your weapon damage is really high... Also pelinals doesn't say it matches base damage, it says it scales to the highest of the two values. Meaning if you have 1200 spell damage and 3600 weapon damage while wearing this set, both you spell damage and weapon damage will equal 3600. If you apply major brutality then you weapon damage will scale an additional 20 percent making your new weapon damage 4320. The 5 piece matches this value to spell damage so your spell damage would also be 4320.

Forward Momentum could be a great skill when using Pelinials though. 8 seconds of snare/bind immunity is pretty awesome in this bombard meta.

Hutch679 · May 2016

No comment

Brutusmax1mus · May 2016

Is a skill like flurry or other weapon attacks considered a spell which would proc frags? Or just staff weapon attacks?

mrdavis1118ub17_ESO · May 2016

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Is a skill like flurry or other weapon attacks considered a spell which would proc frags? Or just staff weapon attacks?

has to be a magicka spell period.

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO · May 2016

actosh wrote: »

Hey Guys/Girls,

while i like the base idea of this set, especially the 5 piece, it is still lackluste since your dmg also comes from your stam/mag pools.
To make it competitive, it should not only push spell weap dmg to the highest, but also the stam mag pool.

May look a bit op at first glance, but keep in mind that u still need 4 buffs to get any kindf of decent dmg, u need the spell/weap crit, major brutality and Major sorcery.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @Wrobel @ZOS_RichLambert u may wanna consider this.

are you completly clueless? are you suggesting that my 40k magica build should get 40k stamina by using this set? that is so outrageously out of any semblance of balance LOL come on.

Brutusmax1mus · May 2016

I'm definitely making a melee ranged mag sorc tank with this set. I'll kill baddies it's OK. Heavy attack and run around soft ccing, stunning healers, procing implode, taking for from my teammates. Good group tank imo as I'll have endless stam from heavy attacks, endless shield, and escape mechanics.

acw37162 · May 2016

I played with this a little last night since they re-enabled it with the last test update.

Went and found the crafting station - it's a 9 trait set.

Stam sorc - over load - load your overload bar with 4 fighters build abilities and inner light - thief mundus stone - put overload in your DW bar use two swords with precise or Nirn, sharpened is best for PVP.

You can squeeze almost 60 % spell crit with all divines and depending on what sets you use push 4 to 5 K weapon and spell damage of you work in 2 piece kena you could go a little higher.

With all that it is still underwhelming damage on overload compared to a straight magica sorc with 40 K magica and CP points in elements expert.

You could run a dark elf and all infused hakijo enchantments to get your Mac magica at a respectable level but your giving up around 6 % crit from your mundus.

This set need one two things;

Scale with max star and max damage value;

Or

Carries the highest crit modifier along with the highest damage value; this would
Be a worthy 9 trait set with this I believe.

Added benefit for magica users is attack weaving with DW or 2H should not be a DPS loss.

This set is a great idea and I absolutely love the idea it sort of under performs with the few things I've tried so far.

Maybe when more people get their hands on it it will blossom into something else.

Also, this is an exceptional tanking set to pair with any of the sets that offer jewlery or weapons

5 armor master of s & s bar

And

5 aptitude on resto bat

With any jewlery set you prefer would be a very nice set up

Gottbeard · May 2016

I don't think this set needs a buff. If it automatically and overwhelmingly supported a full hybrid build just for putting it on it would be the most op best in slot Pandora's box mistake ZoS has ever made.

This is not a full hybrid set. It is a border jumper set. It requires careful design from the player to make something that works and therein lies the balance of the set. It is not a bad set. It is very good as is. But it is definitely a "proceed with caution" set.

jbjondeaueb17_ESO · May 2016

Did somebody test it on stam char with Vicious Death, add poisons to this and i'm a little bit afraid of this combination.

susmitds · May 2016

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

This set is really bad. It should be renamed to "I'm going to suck now" or "watch me suck now", WMSN for short.

With this set you have to choose which form of armor to take (L/M/H) and then divide it up so you can get some of the passives from their skill lines. Best case scenario you choose 5 pieces of one so you can get the 5pc passive bonuses (light has 2, Concentration and Prodigy).

You still need to slot skills that give Major Savagery and Major Prophecy, or you're a DK running Flames of Oblivion.
Your glyphs are going to be bad. Your CP is going to be bad as you will need to split between Mooncalf/Arcanist, Warlord/Magician, Mighty/Elemental Expert, and Elfborn/Precise Strikes.

There is absolutely no reason to use this set as you can't even be competitive due to sub-par performance. This is true for PvP and PvE.

All of my Magicka based characters have over 43k Magicka, 50+ Spell Crit, and 4kish achievable Spell Damage.
All of my Stamina based characters have over 33k Stamina, 50+ Crit and 4k+ish Weapon Damage with 2kish Stamina Regen.
These are just my PvP stats, PvE would be even better.

If you want to be competitive you will neeed similar numbers. You will not achieve this using this set.

I don't think the set is as bad as you say, but the results will depend greatly on what the theory crafter is trying to achieve. I agree that splitting CP and resources are still going to result in a weak "hybrid" build, but what about simply using the set to min-max a traditional spell power build?

Imagine if you substituted this set for Kagrenac's Hope, which I believe is the best set for PvP, although others may prefer Julianos or whatever. You'd be giving up 967 magicka and 224 spell power in exchange for 129 stamina regen and the opportunity to max weapon damage in place of spell power. I haven't done the math yet, but it wouldn't surprise me if you could more than make up that fior spell power deficit simply by enchanting your staff with a weapon power enchant and slotting Flawless Dawnbreaker as your Ultimate. Of course, all your jewelry enchants and set bonuses would have to be weapon power instead of spell power, but it could definitely work.

For Sorcerers in particular, this would be a HUGE advantage, because the Sorc could slot Critical Surge instead of Power Surge. That would make the Surge heals use the 60% multiplier instead of 40%... that's a 50% increase in Surge heal output!

You don't think it's as bad as I say?
You split CP. This makes you below average.
You are missing the point about glyphs and resource pools. Weapon Damage and Spell Damage don't mean squat when your Magicka and Stamina are under 20k.

With a Heavy Armor build and tri-stat glyphs you have around 30k Health, 17-18k Stamina and Magicka. This is flat out terrible. If you decide to glyph straight Magicka or Stamina one will suffer and defeats the purpose of going hybrid in the first place.
Even if you successfully manage to get your Spell Damage/Weapon Damage your tooltip damage on abilities is going to be low due to low Magicka/Stamina pools.
Even your surge hypothesis is flawed by this. You will not heal for very much because your overall damage from said ability is going to be lower than normal and you are getting a % of that back as a heal.

Again, this set is bad.

I don't think you understood my post. I'm not suggesting a "hybrid" build with split CP or resources. I'm merely suggesting a spell damage build that stacks weapon damage and uses Pelinal's to convert it to spell damage. You wouldn't have to change ANY of your CP passives, because Pelinal's automatically boosts your spell damage to match your stacked weapon damage. In this scenario, you would use your magicka spells to do damage as you normally do, and no passives or attribute allocations would need to be changed. I tested it on the PTS, and it really works.

Purely stacking spell damage will result in much better DPS as you get to use better set bonuses and LA passives. In PTS, I was using this set on a Magicka Templar, while there was a good raise in Spell Dmg, the overall DPS was a good deal lower and the damage was not worth it. Additionally Sustain took a big hit.

WhiteNoiseMaker · May 2016

I'm currently testing this set on a Heavy Armor DK build. My explorations with it have been for 'offrole' usage as a primary tank who can hotswap it in for Solo/DPS use. I like how it performs in Heavy, but I suspect it might do better as a Medium suit for DLC solo play, simply for the Stealth passives which are needed to do DB stuff. With the new beefing-up to HA sustain however, I've done quite well with it but I don't know if people who are fine-tuned DPS players will be satisfied with its performance.

susmitds · May 2016

WhiteNoiseMaker wrote: »

I'm currently testing this set on a Heavy Armor DK build. My explorations with it have been for 'offrole' usage as a primary tank who can hotswap it in for Solo/DPS use. I like how it performs in Heavy, but I suspect it might do better as a Medium suit for DLC solo play, simply for the Stealth passives which are needed to do DB stuff. With the new beefing-up to HA sustain however, I've done quite well with it but I don't know if people who are fine-tuned DPS players will be satisfied with its performance.

The main reason to use the set is going to be a way to get a high weapon damage and for that you will need medium armor.

GreenSoup2HoT · May 2016

Can anyone do me a favor? Use this set on a maxed out stamina build and check how much proximity detonation hit's for. It's time for some payback magicka builds...

Septimus_Magna · May 2016

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Can anyone do me a favor? Use this set on a maxed out stamina build and check how much proximity detonation hit's for. It's time for some payback magicka builds...

You'll need a maxed out weapon dmg build and hit enough targets to do any significant dmg because the base dmg of proxy det has been nerfed.

susmitds · May 2016

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Can anyone do me a favor? Use this set on a maxed out stamina build and check how much proximity detonation hit's for. It's time for some payback magicka builds...

You'll need a maxed out weapon dmg build and hit enough targets to do any significant dmg because the base dmg of proxy det has been nerfed.

Don't worry, we stamina builds will combine proxy det with Steel tornado spam.

KenaPKK · May 2016

I am interested in this set for a drink stamblade build. Not sure what magicka abilities I want to use yet...but gosh durnit it sounds cool. >.<