Brrrofski wrote: »

I love how zos gave the already strongest stam class the best buffs this patch. DKs only got buffs if you use dots, stamplars got decent buffs I suppose and stam sorcs... Nothing. Absolutely nothing. ZOS are the ultimate trolls.

I cant say it from a PVP POV, but in PVE, Stam DKS are mayby the stronges dps class of all, comming this patch.
While NB was always the second weakest, since the introduction of the MSA weapons.
So from a PVE POV thisx change simply could mean, that we are not so weak anymore, if we can get that dmg buff most of the time,+ some decent dmg for casting it. And 16k doesnt seem much for a single target one time cast, with a hella long animation. For a sustained dmg rota, this dmg is quite average. Just my opinion.

Compared to overload which is hitting for similar damage yet can be used multiple times over and over for even less ult cost, incap does not seem all that special to me.

How, common, how could an ultimate balanced around magic damage be unbalanced when add "only" 25% damage and a minor defile to a mere BiS ability?

Really, how strange...

Kappa.

There is nothing wrong with it. Magblades already hit that number too while buffed using soul harvest.

Sharee wrote: »

Compared to overload which is hitting for similar damage yet can be used multiple times over and over for even less ult cost, incap does not seem all that special to me.

Lol if you cant counter overload its a l2p issue. The first overload requires 2 gcd so you have all the time you want to cloak, reflect dodge shield or block it

susmitds wrote: »

There is nothing wrong with it. Magblades already hit that number too while buffed using soul harvest.

If you want to be able to reach this number with a magicka nb you have to use dual wield as a mag build, and inner light/entropy before... means you dont have the 8k heavy attack weave in it, and have to waste a gcd between your lotus fan and your soul harvest. Oh wait 2 bc you also need to recast cloak

Haven't had a chance to test this, but I'm not a fan of kneejerk changes, like adjusting the damage AND giving it a guaranteed stun.

Same thing with Dawnbreaker of Smiting, which I think initially hits for around 90% of the damage of Incap Strike does and then does more than 110% of its initial hit in DOT dmg over the next 5 seconds. Added to the fact that Dawnbreaker isn't dodgeable (unless that's been changed?) is AOE dmg + AOE CC, and passively gives 3% weapon damage, I am pretty sure it has higher potential to be more of a problem in the meta than Incap Strike, especially to the Templars who had lack of a good ult in the past and stand to gain a bit by throwing a few CP into Thaumaturge as well.

I'll be down to test this in a few duels tomorrow if you're going to be online. I want to see what the burst is like.

Erondil wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

If you want to be able to reach this number with a magicka nb you have to use dual wield as a mag build, and inner light/entropy before... means you dont have the 8k heavy attack weave in it, and have to waste a gcd between your lotus fan and your soul harvest. Oh wait 2 bc you also need to recast cloak

That does not change the fact that Magicka NBs can still do it some way or the other.

And also to get these numbers with Incap Strike on PTS with a Stam NB, you need Major Brutality, Minor Berserk, 36+ stam and a great deal of weapon dmg and crit dmg bonus and have to get it empowered by Ambush. Oh yeah, it also has to be critical hit.

THAT'S A LOT OF IFS.

You dont need 36k+stam to reach this. "It has to be empowered by ambush" yeah you mean the best gapcloser in the game, thats gonna crit for 6-7k and give you a free empowerement? Mmh indeed seems to be a huge sacrifice youre making to get this incap buffed... very comparable to wasting 1 or 2 gcd as a magicka build to proc might of the guild! Again yes magicka could pull off the same numbers or nearly before, but it requires many more IF and keep in mind it wouldnt come at the same time as a 6k ambush or a 6-8k medium/heavy attack.

Stam Nbs are the best for single target ganks.. Which is what happened in the pic. A full glass cannon NB hit the opponent and did what all glass cannons do. Wreck from stealth. Catch him out of stealth and this NB is most likely dead meat. Prolly running 0 sustain and 18k health.

Magblades are the best bombs. Take one of these guys with glass cannon build and you can wipe a group of enemies...

15k damage to one target is SOOOO Op but wiping out 15-20 players with VD proxy Soul T cheese is completely fine yes? I have both a stam and a magblade and trust me when I say they are both fantastic at what they do in different situations. Comparing magblade to a stamblade is like comparing apples to bananas. Yeah they're both fruits but they have totally different flavours.

Vangy wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

If you want to be able to reach this number with a magicka nb you have to use dual wield as a mag build, and inner light/entropy before... means you dont have the 8k heavy attack weave in it, and have to waste a gcd between your lotus fan and your soul harvest. Oh wait 2 bc you also need to recast cloak

That does not change the fact that Magicka NBs can still do it some way or the other.

And also to get these numbers with Incap Strike on PTS with a Stam NB, you need Major Brutality, Minor Berserk, 36+ stam and a great deal of weapon dmg and crit dmg bonus and have to get it empowered by Ambush. Oh yeah, it also has to be critical hit.

THAT'S A LOT OF IFS.

You dont need 36k+stam to reach this. "It has to be empowered by ambush" yeah you mean the best gapcloser in the game, thats gonna crit for 6-7k and give you a free empowerement? Mmh indeed seems to be a huge sacrifice youre making to get this incap buffed... very comparable to wasting 1 or 2 gcd as a magicka build to proc might of the guild! Again yes magicka could pull off the same numbers or nearly before, but it requires many more IF and keep in mind it wouldnt come at the same time as a 6k ambush or a 6-8k medium/heavy attack.

Stam Nbs are the best for single target ganks.. Which is what happened in the pic. A full glass cannon NB hit the opponent and did what all glass cannons do. Wreck from stealth. Catch him out of stealth and this NB is most likely dead meat. Prolly running 0 sustain and 18k health.

Magblades are the best bombs. Take one of these guys with glass cannon build and you can wipe a group of enemies...

15k damage to one target is SOOOO Op but wiping out 15-20 players with VD proxy Soul T cheese is completely fine yes?

You dont need to be in a gank situation to reach those numbers mate, unless everytime you see somebody using cloak+ambush is a gank for you. Its not 15k single target its 7+15k which is a very easy way to oneshot; probably even easier than the 1.7 dk bow heavy attack from stealth. Thats simply not healthy in PvP.
If you with 15-20 people got rekt by 1 magicka NB with vd its simply l2p or stop afking at bad spots, you dont stack within 8 meters with 15 people if you dont want to, and a mag NB cant wipe 15 people if they are not all stacked up not blocking and without any shield up.
I agree there is imbalance on live regarding largescale fights, stamina NB and stamina builds in general needed buff for those largescale/AoE fights but they didnt need single target buffs ffs

So incap strike is now worth using? I would say that's good news, can't remember the last time I even considered using it instead of soul harvest or dawnbreaker.

Erondil wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Compared to overload which is hitting for similar damage yet can be used multiple times over and over for even less ult cost, incap does not seem all that special to me.

Lol if you cant counter overload its a l2p issue. The first overload requires 2 gcd so you have all the time you want to cloak, reflect dodge shield or block it

All I said was that the damage overload does is similar to the damage of incap, the cost is lower, and the former can be used multiple times in a row.

How on earth you arrived at the conclusion that the above means i can't counter overload is beyond me.

Derra wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Compared to overload which is hitting for similar damage yet can be used multiple times over and over for even less ult cost, incap does not seem all that special to me.

Lol if you cant counter overload its a l2p issue. The first overload requires 2 gcd so you have all the time you want to cloak, reflect dodge shield or block it

All I said was that the damage overload does is similar to the damage of incap, the cost is lower, and the former can be used multiple times in a row.

How on earth you arrived at the conclusion that the above means i can't counter overload is beyond me.

Well if you´re comparing the easiest ultimate to counter to something that´s virtually unavoidable you´re either bad at countering the former or on some kind of agenda.
Either way your argumentation does not make sense - hence he assumes you can´t properly counter overload instead of assuming you have personal interest in derailing the argument with illogical comparisons.

The thread is not about what is avoidable and what isn't, it is about about how much damage it does, and how low the cost is(check the OP).

Thus, that is what i am comparing.

Which of the two is easier to avoid is an entirely different debate.

Lyar09 wrote: »

Okay explain this then. I have 15% mitigation from cp...8% damage mitigation with restoring focus...18k physical resist....and 2.3k crit resist and I get hit for 10k plus incap strikes. Most people dont mitigate damage anywhere near what I do and I still get ridiculously hard. This is not balance. The ability is fine as is with damage on live. I like the knock down mechanic now

Can hit 10k soul harvests on live right now in a full gank build. I think the highest @Suru hit was 17k on live after CP cap. Could be wrong though, I think he has a screenshot.

susmitds wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Compared to overload which is hitting for similar damage yet can be used multiple times over and over for even less ult cost, incap does not seem all that special to me.

Lol if you cant counter overload its a l2p issue. The first overload requires 2 gcd so you have all the time you want to cloak, reflect dodge shield or block it

All I said was that the damage overload does is similar to the damage of incap, the cost is lower, and the former can be used multiple times in a row.

How on earth you arrived at the conclusion that the above means i can't counter overload is beyond me.

Well if you´re comparing the easiest ultimate to counter to something that´s virtually unavoidable you´re either bad at countering the former or on some kind of agenda.
Either way your argumentation does not make sense - hence he assumes you can´t properly counter overload instead of assuming you have personal interest in derailing the argument with illogical comparisons.

Well you can dodge roll as soon you see a nightblade holding his hands upwards in cross position. Incapacitating Strike won't hit you.

anime cancel here you go

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

The same guy that got hit for 16 with an incapacitating strike, got hit by a 7200 ambush. His defenses were garbage. Realistically incapacitating strike is probably going to hit for 8-9k on average. Heavy hitters will hit around 12k.

Exactly. Plus it is still garbage in PvE in majority situations.

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

The same guy that got hit for 16 with an incapacitating strike, got hit by a 7200 ambush. His defenses were garbage. Realistically incapacitating strike is probably going to hit for 8-9k on average. Heavy hitters will hit around 12k.

lol. I guess its been a while since the last time you played a light amor build