Has Zos given up on fixing pvp lag or is there a plan?

OrangeTheCat · April 2016

timidobserver wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Asherons_Call wrote: »

Some people seem to think that they are doing nothing and are ignoring the problem. Pretty ridiculous assumption. Do you think the devs are happy with this? Of course they aren't.

Exactly this. We want this fixed as much as you guys do (seriously!) and in this situation, the fixes do need to be baby steps. It's not the same as a broken quest where we can implement a fix, and it's done. This is a problem on a much larger scale, and more times than not, it only exists on the Live servers and not the internal ones. This makes it much more difficult to test fixes and really see the impact of what we've implemented.

Can we at least get a road map of the upcoming baby steps. Over the next few months, what steps are being taken to address PvP performance.

@ZOS_GinaBruno

Or share time-dependent performance data so that we can see that after "baby step" N if there is a improvement or not and then see the plot over time. Then we can see for ourselves that an effort is being made. Maybe then ZOS will recover some of its credibility in this regard (PvP).

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

HairyFairy wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Asherons_Call wrote: »

Some people seem to think that they are doing nothing and are ignoring the problem. Pretty ridiculous assumption. Do you think the devs are happy with this? Of course they aren't.

Exactly this. We want this fixed as much as you guys do (seriously!) and in this situation, the fixes do need to be baby steps. It's not the same as a broken quest where we can implement a fix, and it's done. This is a problem on a much larger scale, and more times than not, it only exists on the Live servers and not the internal ones. This makes it much more difficult to test fixes and really see the impact of what we've implemented.

Take the servers down, give everyone notice, give everyone shinies because of it, and fix the problem before rebooting the game to the public.

So your solution is simply turn off PVP totally until they "fix" lag? You know that means PVP will never be in the game again if they do that right? How can they fix it when they just said internally it doesnt work like it does on live. The only way to test these fixes are publish them live see what effect they have.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Asherons_Call wrote: »

Some people seem to think that they are doing nothing and are ignoring the problem. Pretty ridiculous assumption. Do you think the devs are happy with this? Of course they aren't.

Exactly this. We want this fixed as much as you guys do (seriously!) and in this situation, the fixes do need to be baby steps. It's not the same as a broken quest where we can implement a fix, and it's done. This is a problem on a much larger scale, and more times than not, it only exists on the Live servers and not the internal ones. This makes it much more difficult to test fixes and really see the impact of what we've implemented.

Can we at least get a road map of the upcoming baby steps. Over the next few months, what steps are being taken to address PvP performance.

@ZOS_GinaBruno

Or share time-dependent performance data so that we can see that after "baby step" N if there is a improvement or not and then see the plot over time. Then we can see for ourselves that an effort is being made. Maybe then ZOS will recover some of its credibility in this regard (PvP).

They do this practically every ESO live. Last time he showed a bunch of charts too about lag across the entire game including cyrodill.

kevlarto_ESO · April 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Asherons_Call wrote: »

Some people seem to think that they are doing nothing and are ignoring the problem. Pretty ridiculous assumption. Do you think the devs are happy with this? Of course they aren't.

Exactly this. We want this fixed as much as you guys do (seriously!) and in this situation, the fixes do need to be baby steps. It's not the same as a broken quest where we can implement a fix, and it's done. This is a problem on a much larger scale, and more times than not, it only exists on the Live servers and not the internal ones. This makes it much more difficult to test fixes and really see the impact of what we've implemented.

Trust me most of here know this and appreciate what you guys do.

This^^ I see the small improvements, there were times when three factions could not have a battle, now it takes longer before I can't use things with and induction, have had some great large scale battles that were not possible a few months ago, I hope one of these performance patches really shine and kinda slaps you in face noticeable.

FENGRUSH · April 2016

Muizer wrote: »

Gina's a community manager. She's basically here to take the heat. It's kind of sad. I think everybody likes her (good pick for the job). So it's kind of pointless to rage at her. It's also probably pointless to rage at the devs. I am quite sure the ones who were involved with Cyrodiil aren't happy with the situation and would like to get it sorted asap. That said, it is hard to believe they'd get to set aside their work on upcoming DLC for this even if they wanted to. As released content, any improvement will have to be done in the margins of future paid content, which unlike Cyrodiil will come with hard deadlines.

RDMyers65b14_ESO · April 2016

People only see what they wish to see. No matter how many fixes happen, there are some who will constantly complain that it is not enough. I PVP on a daily basis and I have seen a steady improvement to PVP performance. It is rare for me to drop into single digits of fps anymore and the lag is better. Of course, I don't play on the vastly overpopulated Trueflame campaign.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

People only see what they wish to see. No matter how many fixes happen, there are some who will constantly complain that it is not enough. I PVP on a daily basis and I have seen a steady improvement to PVP performance. It is rare for me to drop into single digits of fps anymore and the lag is better. Of course, I don't play on the vastly overpopulated Trueflame campaign.

You will also notice its the same people who complain they dont communicate. Then when they do comment on a thread they get their heads chewed off by those people. Im glad they still are willing to communicate with us.

Asherons_Call · April 2016

"Why do I get the feeling that giving birth will be less painful for Gina than posting here?"

This post is the winner of this thread (and probably true for Gina!)

tinythinker · April 2016

I appreciate that the internal server and the PTS aren't big enough to stress the system and replicate the problems on live, but, still not sure why the PTS isn't moved to a larger (set of) server(s) so that more and bigger things can be added for testing more quickly. This would also mean catching more bugs from new PvE content as well before a new update goes live.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

tinythinker wrote: »

I appreciate that the internal server and the PTS aren't big enough to stress the system and replicate the problems on live, but, still not sure why the PTS isn't moved to a larger (set of) server(s) so that more and bigger things can be added for testing more quickly.

I think the problem at least with PTS is not enough people use it. I dont have it installed because I dont like spoiling the story etc by doing it all on PTS. Plus its another what 40 gigs of stuff to download?

TequilaFire · April 2016

I got a chuckle at the "baby steps" at this particular time for Gina.

ZOS_GinaBruno · April 2016

Asherons_Call wrote: »

"Why do I get the feeling that giving birth will be less painful for Gina than posting here?"

This post is the winner of this thread (and probably true for Gina!)

Haha it definitely made me laugh

Wollust · April 2016

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We've implemented some fixes for Cyrodiil performance in incremental patches, and though they are small, they are making it better. We also have some fixes going into the next big update, but as it's been stated in this thread, no one fix is going to be the "silver bullet" that fixes everything. What we don't want happening is we put in a whole bunch of potential fixes only to find that something ends up making the problem worse, then we have to backtrack.

We understand this has been frustrating, but appreciate your patience and understanding. Fixing the performance in Cyrodiil is still one of our highest priorities, and we are still actively working on it.

It's always the same that is being said. Fact is, performance keeps tanking.
I don't know where you guys play on, but definitely not on EU Trueflame during primetime.
It's a freaking slideshow. Every day during primetime, when the beloved wrobel-protected zergs hit each other, the FPS goes down and the ping up into unholy areas.
Simply embarassing for a triple A game.

Edit: Not personal against you @ZOS_GinaBruno, you have the ungrateful job of taking the flak. I feel sorry for you. At least you'll have a thick skin after this job. That's something, I guess?

ComboBreaker88 · April 2016

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We've implemented some fixes for Cyrodiil performance in incremental patches, and though they are small, they are making it better. We also have some fixes going into the next big update, but as it's been stated in this thread, no one fix is going to be the "silver bullet" that fixes everything. What we don't want happening is we put in a whole bunch of potential fixes only to find that something ends up making the problem worse, then we have to backtrack.

We understand this has been frustrating, but appreciate your patience and understanding. Fixing the performance in Cyrodiil is still one of our highest priorities, and we are still actively working on it.

Honesty at this point, you're making excuses. I get that the game is huge. I understand that it is complicated. I also know that it's a huge headache. But at this point, none of that matters. Your product is broken. And everyone; including yourselves, knows it. The issue isn't that it's hard to fix these problems the issue is, you are a business and people pay you for a product. And your product is flawed and barely playable. The only reason it's still even online is because of the Elder Scrolls name. That will carry you for awhile... but you need to step it up and take it to the next level. If you can't fix the lag why not implement some more functional guild management and interface features? Talk about player housing? Shut down cryodil for 1 week and do some major testing and fix it? Just my thoughts.. but honestly the social aspects of the game as a guild leader are off putting. Please add more features. If you can't fix all these other issues then implement some new features that have nothing to do with player content but with social content.

ComboBreaker88 · April 2016

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Asherons_Call wrote: »

Some people seem to think that they are doing nothing and are ignoring the problem. Pretty ridiculous assumption. Do you think the devs are happy with this? Of course they aren't.

Exactly this. We want this fixed as much as you guys do (seriously!) and in this situation, the fixes do need to be baby steps. It's not the same as a broken quest where we can implement a fix, and it's done. This is a problem on a much larger scale, and more times than not, it only exists on the Live servers and not the internal ones. This makes it much more difficult to test fixes and really see the impact of what we've implemented.

Being happy about something and changing it are 2 different things. Who knows what the developers actually think about the game? This person commenting about the emotional state of another person they have never met is ridiculous. Also all evidence points to the contrary, why introduce a set like Vicious Death (which caters to night blade magika users) in PvP if your goal really was to fix the PvP lag? The introduction of that set was more an act of "screw it just light it on fire and walk away" than a fix. You say you are fixing things. Maybe you are. But until the player base as a whole notices it you're lying not only to them but to yourselves as well.

tinythinker · April 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

I appreciate that the internal server and the PTS aren't big enough to stress the system and replicate the problems on live, but, still not sure why the PTS isn't moved to a larger (set of) server(s) so that more and bigger things can be added for testing more quickly.

I think the problem at least with PTS is not enough people use it. I dont have it installed because I dont like spoiling the story etc by doing it all on PTS. Plus its another what 40 gigs of stuff to download?

Plenty of people use it when an update is coming, but, they can only have either NA or EU characters at one time, and only one small PvP campaign. If the PTS was bigger and bold new changes to fix PvP were being put up, it would have people who play on both PC megaservers lining up to try it.

reften · April 2016

Good to hear there is a least an acknowledgement that the problem still exists and continued efforts to resolve.

When resolved, I believe you'll see a dramatic increase in the # of people playing again.

Mysteri0n · April 2016

Wouldn't it be better just post pone the dark brother hood and do a update to fix all the problems in the games current state, all though go back to April 2014 before the first patch you could have 400 players fighting on screen and no lag, put a vanilla ESO in crown store like it was back then when the game was actually fun,

Lucious90 · April 2016

I saw a few weeks a go a rant about female representation within the crown store and game..... What did they do? new patch and released skimpy outfits on female models(though my Orc male looks pretty sexy in) Where is that representation within Cyrodil? The imediate response, outside of we are working on it? What are you working on? What is your game plan? I love this game, and its the pvp that got me involved.... Though the lack of BG and Arenas (thats a whole separate argument) was disappointing I had fun with Open world pvp. Now when I log into Horse Simulator online I lag out maybe 5 or 6 times.... My spell bar still locks up, then I am fast forwarded through time, sometimes lag=>Die. If I hit a zerg, I cant even play, dont say its my internet 105 mbps down I should be seeing the future. So right now it feels like Zos is just throwing things at the wall and hoping something will stick.

TLDR: ZOS I would like to see a road map of what you are wanting to do to fix the Lag

Ra'Shtar · April 2016

Mysteri0n wrote: »

Wouldn't it be better just post pone the dark brother hood and do a update to fix all the problems in the games current state, all though go back to April 2014 before the first patch you could have 400 players fighting on screen and no lag, put a vanilla ESO in crown store like it was back then when the game was actually fun,

That's just not wise to do, applying a change like this is something very delicate and if not done right hundreds of new bug might be introduced and then they would have to backtrack through the whole update to see what went wrong and where, doing smaller updates guarantees that if something goes wrong they know better where to look for the problem. As you may know pretty much every update introduced a big bug of some kind so is better not to break the whole game r trying to fix it.

MichYodias · April 2016

I am certain that if you wanted to test heavy loads on the server, both Eu and Na players would hop on the pts and simulate some large scale combat. We want to help just ask. Also no offense but judging from watching the devs play in IC, you guys need us.

Averya_Teira · April 2016

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We've implemented some fixes for Cyrodiil performance in incremental patches, and though they are small, they are making it better. We also have some fixes going into the next big update, but as it's been stated in this thread, no one fix is going to be the "silver bullet" that fixes everything. What we don't want happening is we put in a whole bunch of potential fixes only to find that something ends up making the problem worse, then we have to backtrack.

We understand this has been frustrating, but appreciate your patience and understanding. Fixing the performance in Cyrodiil is still one of our highest priorities, and we are still actively working on it.

We would believe all that crap if anything had been done during the last TWO YEARS lol. Do you realize how long 2 years is In the video game business ?

rotaugen454 · April 2016

Averya_Teira wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We've implemented some fixes for Cyrodiil performance in incremental patches, and though they are small, they are making it better. We also have some fixes going into the next big update, but as it's been stated in this thread, no one fix is going to be the "silver bullet" that fixes everything. What we don't want happening is we put in a whole bunch of potential fixes only to find that something ends up making the problem worse, then we have to backtrack.

We understand this has been frustrating, but appreciate your patience and understanding. Fixing the performance in Cyrodiil is still one of our highest priorities, and we are still actively working on it.

We would believe all that crap if anything had been done during the last TWO YEARS lol. Do you realize how long 2 years is In the video game business ?

Approximately 730 days?

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

People who say nothing has been for two years havent read the patch notes.

OrangeTheCat · April 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

People who say nothing has been for two years havent read the patch notes.

I don't think it is about whether patch notes say if something was done or not.

What matters is whether people can tell that there is an improvement or not. Clearly, some people here say "no".

You can't just brush it off with a "havent read the patch notes" throw away comment.

Korah_Eaglecry · April 2016

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

People who say nothing has been for two years havent read the patch notes.

I don't think it is about whether patch notes say if something was done or not.

What matters is whether people can tell that there is an improvement or not. Clearly, some people here say "no".

You can't just brush it off with a "havent read the patch notes" throw away comment.

So we should endure their ignorance? And what of the ones that make multiple threads and posts over the course of weeks and months on the very forms where the patch notes are stored? That obviously have no interest in the truth but rather enjoy starting a forum fire and watching it quickly burn itself out with a Mod closing the thread?

Sorry but Ive about had it with the constant nagging attitude thats been prevalent on these forums over the last 6+ months. Hardly any discussions can be had with out someone bringing Cyrodiil and the lag up. Even when the topic couldnt be further from that issue. "I might buy that costume in the Crown Store if THEYD FIX THE LAAAAAGGGG!".

As if somehow hijacking threads constantly [snip] is going to get Cyrodiil fixed any faster. Or somehow draw the sympathy of anyone but the same typese of people behaving this way.

If this was just people frustrated and by happens chance not read the patch notes over the LAST 8+ months. That would be one thing. But no, I suspect these are players who are either absolutely done with this game and should have the common sense to walk away. Or they just love that dopamine rush from constantly letting that rage loose on others.

[edited for bait]

Leogon · April 2016

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Asherons_Call wrote: »

Some people seem to think that they are doing nothing and are ignoring the problem. Pretty ridiculous assumption. Do you think the devs are happy with this? Of course they aren't.

Exactly this. We want this fixed as much as you guys do (seriously!) and in this situation, the fixes do need to be baby steps. It's not the same as a broken quest where we can implement a fix, and it's done. This is a problem on a much larger scale, and more times than not, it only exists on the Live servers and not the internal ones. This makes it much more difficult to test fixes and really see the impact of what we've implemented.

Trust me most of here know this and appreciate what you guys do.

This. Don't mind the Jon Snows, they know nothing.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · April 2016

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

People who say nothing has been for two years havent read the patch notes.

I don't think it is about whether patch notes say if something was done or not.

What matters is whether people can tell that there is an improvement or not. Clearly, some people here say "no".

You can't just brush it off with a "havent read the patch notes" throw away comment.

You also cannot claim they have tried nothing in two years. Since the patch notes prove otherwise. Maybe it hasnt worked but they have tried things.

NeillMcAttack · April 2016

If I'm being perfectly honest, and having played in the most populated server since console release, I have to say I AM noticing improvements. Yes is sucks that I can't get a random rapid buff, and personally i detest that these are some of the changes required, but I'll trade that for better game performance any day.
Let's just hope it doesn't get to a point where you cant give non-grouped players a healing ward, or even a heal in general.

MasterSpatula · April 2016

It is truly amazing to me how many people don't get the problem with internally testing these fixes: The problems are caused by large numbers of players using the system at the same time.

You can't test solutions to a problem if you can't replicate the problem. The only way to replicate this problem is on the live server. The only way to test these things is to push them live. If they do this and it's terrible, congrats, they just broke PVP.

Which, unless my memory is playing tricks on me, has happened a time or two.

Seriously, it's like some of you guys want so desperately to keep your mad-on going that you're willing to overlook basic reason.