Nightblades Ruining PVP Again...

Frawr · April 2016

The problem is stupid design.

With dynamic ult and no aoe falloff, a variety of classes could stand up against larger numbers.

With the current static system, 1 class build can effectively suicide bomb a larger group. Over and over.

The current meta is not good. It provides individuals with short term amusement from using 1 cookie cutter build.

This design is stupid. It's so stupid that it is almost funny. It's funny because it is so obvious what the 'fix' should be, yet those in charge refuse to do it.

What are they afraid of? A few precious flowers die repeatedly? That happens now.

This pvp experience would be vastly improved with:

No aoe falloff
No proxy det
No vicious death
Bigger health pools
Less inherent armour penetration.

Why is ZOS so resistant? Just do it.......

phillyboy7897 · April 2016

The game would be a lot better if they did all of that no doubt. Probably less lag too.

phillyboy7897 · April 2016

Currently NB is not balanced and never has been since I've been playing the game. Always been the best class for 8+ months go into cyro and witness the mag NB spam.

ArchMikem · April 2016

I actually had my first Death by Vicious Death Set tonight. In the Imperial Sewers with a group of probably eight or so doing an oblivion gate and some Dominion guys jumped us. That set was probably why three Dominion players took down a group almost three times their size.

Frawr · April 2016

ArchMikem wrote: »

I actually had my first Death by Vicious Death Set tonight. In the Imperial Sewers with a group of probably eight or so doing an oblivion gate and some Dominion guys jumped us. That set was probably why three Dominion players took down a group almost three times their size.

There's nothing inherently wrong with killing a bigger group.

The problem comes with it being through cheese mechanics rather than superior skill.

Taonnor · April 2016

And the discussion comes again. As i said in my "Myth AoE Cap" thread it is a never ending story.

@Wrobel wanted an "intelligent" fix with VD set and prox det changes, instead of taking hands on aoe caps to fix the core problem (@Wrobel said in one of the ESO live shows that aoe cap removing is not an "intelligent" fix). I think VD and prox det are not realy "intelligent" design. Sry but i think so.

Many, many players said before if this changes comes live that these situation will come. Especially @Sypher or @FENGRUSH in one of their "we are eso" podcasts.

So all i can say is. Level up a magicka NB and have fun. It is the intend way that ZOS wants.

Docmandu · April 2016

Jaronking wrote: »

Wait I thought everyone said NB are going to be dead because of the changes to cloak and magelight.What changed?

Same like everyone complained that sorc would be dead in 1.6

phillyboy7897 · April 2016

Yea they freaked out and rolled around on the ground screaming about magelight till it was toned down 5x. I've yet to see a NB get popped out by it personally.

phillyboy7897 · April 2016

As much as I agree w/ this its a side issue... IGAF about balancing give me some FPS and functional abilities first pls.

outsideworld76 · April 2016

All I can say is that it's no longer a suprise attack when you use it more than once.

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

outsideworld76 wrote: »

All I can say is that it's no longer a suprise attack when you use it more than once.

Lol. That's very true. I haven't really thought about that like that before.

Jaronking · April 2016

This thread Lol.

Frawr · April 2016

Taonnor wrote: »

And the discussion comes again. As i said in my "Myth AoE Cap" thread it is a never ending story.

@Wrobel wanted an "intelligent" fix with VD set and prox det changes, instead of taking hands on aoe caps to fix the core problem (@Wrobel said in one of the ESO live shows that aoe cap removing is not an "intelligent" fix). I think VD and prox det are not realy "intelligent" design. Sry but i think so.

Many, many players said before if this changes comes live that these situation will come. Especially @Sypher or @FENGRUSH in one of their "we are eso" podcasts.

So all i can say is. Level up a magicka NB and have fun. It is the intend way that ZOS wants.

@Taonnor

That thread was brilliant and clearly showed one thing and one thing only.

What I fail to understand is why they fight it. No amount of gimmick sets or gimmick skills makes up for the general damage restrictions.

This set and skill combo is incredibly UN-intelligent. It is so because it requires zero skill.

Surviving as a dk vs 20 people was skillful because it required fast reactions, good knowledge of skills and experience of using the class.

Dynamic ult and lack of aoe falloff was the absolute answer to zergs.

These gimmicks are making the whole experience frustrating because it reduces pvp to the most basic and *** exercise in bombing.

At the very least, there should be some sort of penalty for dying. 2% reduction in stats per death on a rolling 10 minute basis?

Extra 30 second wait to respawn after each death in a rolling 10 minute period?

Please ZOS, quit this awful meta of gimmick sets and skills and instead free us to make the core game fun.

Remove the aoe fall off
Remove proxy det
Remove vicious death
Increase health bars back to 1.5:1
Remove innate player penetration

@Wrobel, @ZOS_GinaBruno, @ZOS_BrianWheeler

How hard is it to code this into one campaign to allow us to try it?

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

Xael · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. As it is PVP is dying, and the lag there is horrendous... Now you have this bs going on. I just don't know, ZOS... I really don't know. But I really hope the next TESO comes soon. Because this nonsense right here...? I'm not feeling it.

Actually all I see is zergs, lag, and more zergs.

You are being extremely dishonest:
You imply Nightblades are the only class using Prox Det. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a gap closer. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a point blank AoE. You imply Nightblades are the only class with an AoE ult and what's more hilarious is that you imply all Nightblades spam Lotus Fan? Really? Lotus Fan is one of the worst abilities to spam considering it does not have a mini stun (like Ambush did) and its damage outside of stealth does less than a fully charged heavy attack with an Inferno staff. Abilities like Force Pulse/Crushing Shock do more damage and even give you the option to keep your distance where it's safe. I can do all this cheese on a Magicka Templar and Sorc just as easily as a Nightblade...

Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of Prox Det.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all gap close.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all point blank AoE.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all AoE ult.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of these skills/tactics in conjunction with the Vicious Death set.

You say PvP is dying and you blame Nightblades and VD making it worse? Yeah ok... because it's clearly not Stam (insert any class) using Shuffle, dodge rolling around objects while mashing Vigor cheesing everything up. It's not hordes of players running in zergs from A-Z trying to find safety in numbers right? As usual lets blame Nightblades and ask for more nerfs because we are misinformed and fueled by our misinformed state and otherwise can't be bothered to change up the way we play...

Lastly the greatest threat to this game are the developers who refuse to fix the lag in Cyrodiil caused by coding which started in v.1.2.3 that is exacerbated by players like yourself that pull the "safety in numbers" zerg nonsense. In fact this set (VD), used by any class, is one of the best things ZOS has done to counter all zergball aoe cap abusers.

If you are worried so much about VD spread out. Stop abusing AoE caps and spread out. Stop running in a zerg and play better. The problem isn't nightblades and it sure as hell isn't VD. The problem is people who think they are otherwise good at PvP in this game remove themselves and their bs tactics from the equation, pick a scapegoat and cry for nerfs while postulating false information to facilitate change. If you care so much about the state of PvP, stop posting threads like these and focus on the true problem that is lag and fps drops. It's been almost 2 years since 1.2.3 and it has only got worse. In fact I dare say the PvP has become the same PvP of the first weekend beta stress tests that occured in late 2013 where you had constant rubber bands and 2-3 second delay.

Taonnor · April 2016

Frawr wrote: »

At the very least, there should be some sort of penalty for dying. 2% reduction in stats per death on a rolling 10 minute basis?

Extra 30 second wait to respawn after each death in a rolling 10 minute period?

@Frawr

A Death penalty is a realy graet idea. I thought about the 2m timer after camp using.

My idea is:

- 2m timer on entrance (the both entrance release points), keep & camp releases
- Rezz sickness

The rezz sickness could be like your idea.

Why i am for a death penalty?

At the moment the biggest problem in my eyes are the never ending rezzes in fights against larger groups. So a bigger group still win, because they rezz up and rezz up and rezz up. That is dump gameplay. You can play far better than the other group, but shorter or longer they will win, because they can infinite rezz up without a penalty. So @Wrobel could this be an idea for further patches?

I speak from my own expierience. At the moment we have a situation on EU Ebony. Blue locked and yellow with 2 bars. We defend our home keeps. Blue attacks with 60+ zerg against 20 yellow. Most we kill 30 of them, but if we try to kill the other 30, the first 30 are rezzed up and it is 20vs60 again. In many cases we are far far better than blue, but there is no pause if you have a success defend or bursted a greater blob. Shorter or later the 20 will loose. There is no reward for success fighting against larger groups. No extra gear, nothing. This is very frustrating for the underpop alliance. There is no way to win the campaign. This is a delicate topic and goes hand in hand with aoe cap discussions and so on. But this is on @ZOS_BrianWheeler side.

Frawr · April 2016

Xael wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. As it is PVP is dying, and the lag there is horrendous... Now you have this bs going on. I just don't know, ZOS... I really don't know. But I really hope the next TESO comes soon. Because this nonsense right here...? I'm not feeling it.

Actually all I see is zergs, lag, and more zergs.

You are being extremely dishonest:
You imply Nightblades are the only class using Prox Det. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a gap closer. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a point blank AoE. You imply Nightblades are the only class with an AoE ult and what's more hilarious is that you imply all Nightblades spam Lotus Fan? Really? Lotus Fan is one of the worst abilities to spam considering it does not have a mini stun (like Ambush did) and its damage outside of stealth does less than a fully charged heavy attack with an Inferno staff. Abilities like Force Pulse/Crushing Shock do more damage and even give you the option to keep your distance where it's safe. I can do all this cheese on a Magicka Templar and Sorc just as easily as a Nightblade...

Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of Prox Det.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all gap close.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all point blank AoE.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all AoE ult.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of these skills/tactics in conjunction with the Vicious Death set.

You say PvP is dying and you blame Nightblades and VD making it worse? Yeah ok... because it's clearly not Stam (insert any class) using Shuffle, dodge rolling around objects while mashing Vigor cheesing everything up. It's not hordes of players running in zergs from A-Z trying to find safety in numbers right? As usual lets blame Nightblades and ask for more nerfs because we are misinformed and fueled by our misinformed state and otherwise can't be bothered to change up the way we play...

Lastly the greatest threat to this game are the developers who refuse to fix the lag in Cyrodiil caused by coding which started in v.1.2.3 that is exacerbated by players like yourself that pull the "safety in numbers" zerg nonsense. In fact this set (VD), used by any class, is one of the best things ZOS has done to counter all zergball aoe cap abusers.

If you are worried so much about VD spread out. Stop abusing AoE caps and spread out. Stop running in a zerg and play better. The problem isn't nightblades and it sure as hell isn't VD. The problem is people who think they are otherwise good at PvP in this game remove themselves and their bs tactics from the equation, pick a scapegoat and cry for nerfs while postulating false information to facilitate change. If you care so much about the state of PvP, stop posting threads like these and focus on the true problem that is lag and fps drops. It's been almost 2 years since 1.2.3 and it has only got worse. In fact I dare say the PvP has become the same PvP of the first weekend beta stress tests that occured in late 2013 where you had constant rubber bands and 2-3 second delay.

@Xael

I agree with much of your sentiment, however, zerging will always happen. It happens simply because people just follow the nearest other people to the nearest action and proceed to spam attacks. That will never ever change.

These aren't generally the cause of lag as such because they might be many but 30 people spamming wb and snipe and gap closers don't generally generate lag. The Lag is more caused by the mass of calculations done due to net code and aoe targeting calcs. The lag is therefore more likely to be caused by the organised groups.

What can be changed, however, is the protection offered to people who pack up tightly. Removal of the falloff would mean that bunching up doesn't increase effective mitigation.

Removal of aoe - falloff would allow all skills to do their intended job and would negate the need for 1 massive burst attack built into a set. Lag should be reduced because fights would be quicker.

The benefit of this method is that it affects all skills rather than everyone wearing 1 set and using 1-2 skills. It provides diversity and choice.

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

Xael wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. As it is PVP is dying, and the lag there is horrendous... Now you have this bs going on. I just don't know, ZOS... I really don't know. But I really hope the next TESO comes soon. Because this nonsense right here...? I'm not feeling it.

Actually all I see is zergs, lag, and more zergs.

You are being extremely dishonest:
You imply Nightblades are the only class using Prox Det. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a gap closer. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a point blank AoE. You imply Nightblades are the only class with an AoE ult and what's more hilarious is that you imply all Nightblades spam Lotus Fan? Really? Lotus Fan is one of the worst abilities to spam considering it does not have a mini stun (like Ambush did) and its damage outside of stealth does less than a fully charged heavy attack with an Inferno staff. Abilities like Force Pulse/Crushing Shock do more damage and even give you the option to keep your distance where it's safe. I can do all this cheese on a Magicka Templar and Sorc just as easily as a Nightblade...

Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of Prox Det.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all gap close.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all point blank AoE.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all AoE ult.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of these skills/tactics in conjunction with the Vicious Death set.

You say PvP is dying and you blame Nightblades and VD making it worse? Yeah ok... because it's clearly not Stam (insert any class) using Shuffle, dodge rolling around objects while mashing Vigor cheesing everything up. It's not hordes of players running in zergs from A-Z trying to find safety in numbers right? As usual lets blame Nightblades and ask for more nerfs because we are misinformed and fueled by our misinformed state and otherwise can't be bothered to change up the way we play...

Lastly the greatest threat to this game are the developers who refuse to fix the lag in Cyrodiil caused by coding which started in v.1.2.3 that is exacerbated by players like yourself that pull the "safety in numbers" zerg nonsense. In fact this set (VD), used by any class, is one of the best things ZOS has done to counter all zergball aoe cap abusers.

If you are worried so much about VD spread out. Stop abusing AoE caps and spread out. Stop running in a zerg and play better. The problem isn't nightblades and it sure as hell isn't VD. The problem is people who think they are otherwise good at PvP in this game remove themselves and their bs tactics from the equation, pick a scapegoat and cry for nerfs while postulating false information to facilitate change. If you care so much about the state of PvP, stop posting threads like these and focus on the true problem that is lag and fps drops. It's been almost 2 years since 1.2.3 and it has only got worse. In fact I dare say the PvP has become the same PvP of the first weekend beta stress tests that occured in late 2013 where you had constant rubber bands and 2-3 second delay.

I'm going to go ahead and assume you're a Nightblade. I'm also going to go ahead and assume you use the VD set and combo being spoken about here. If I'm wrong, then I accept being wrong.

However, let's be honest here. The VD set? Is a bandaid fix. What they did to Proximity Detonation? You guessed it. Is a bandaid fix. The cheesy combo? I think you get what it is. Lol.

And it is Nightblades which are the main source of a lot of things. It was actually proven a while ago that most of the lag generated was due to Nightblades, as well as numerous other things. But in particular Nightblades were generating crazy lag and frame issues. Also, which class do you think is the most hated to encounter in PVP (overall)? Nightblades. In fact, there was a poll here on the forums which asked which class they dislike seeing the most in PVP. And the number one choice was Bightblade. Why do you think that is? C'mon now. Lol.

Xarc · April 2016

Another topic with guys full of frustrating.. Cloak nerfed and you still crying that we (NIGHTBLADES) own ? Maybe because many players who ambush you, do it because they're good enough to do it. And they're is a lot of ways to stop a NB, to stop his cloack use... just l2p maybe. And proxy det can be used by all classes so what?

Ch4mpTW · April 2016

Xarcus wrote: »

Another topic with guys full of frustrating.. Cloak nerfed and you still crying that we (NIGHTBLADES) own ? Maybe because many players who ambush you, do it because they're good enough to do it. And they're is a lot of ways to stop a NB, to stop his cloack use... just l2p maybe. And proxy det can be used by all classes so what?

... We aren't even really talking about cloak in this thread too much. Sure it was mentioned maybe once or twice, but that was it. But sure. How about you all's cloak gets the same treatment bolt escape got? Yes, would you like a taste of class penalty? Every time cloak is cast, the cost is increased if done before a certain grace period? Yes, yes, would you like that?

Frawr · April 2016

Xarcus wrote: »

Another topic with guys full of frustrating.. Cloak nerfed and you still crying that we (NIGHTBLADES) own ? Maybe because many players who ambush you, do it because they're good enough to do it. And they're is a lot of ways to stop a NB, to stop his cloack use... just l2p maybe. And proxy det can be used by all classes so what?

@xarcus
This isn't a nerf nb thread, it is a fix pvp thread.

As it happens, magicka nb is the worst culprit in the current meta because it can cloak and bomb. There is no arguing with that fact. That said, pvp can be fixed without direct nb nerfs.

Perhaps we could also unnerf streak and roll.

What do you think of the suggestions made?

Egonieser · April 2016

Xael wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. As it is PVP is dying, and the lag there is horrendous... Now you have this bs going on. I just don't know, ZOS... I really don't know. But I really hope the next TESO comes soon. Because this nonsense right here...? I'm not feeling it.

Actually all I see is zergs, lag, and more zergs.

You are being extremely dishonest:
You imply Nightblades are the only class using Prox Det. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a gap closer. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a point blank AoE. You imply Nightblades are the only class with an AoE ult and what's more hilarious is that you imply all Nightblades spam Lotus Fan? Really? Lotus Fan is one of the worst abilities to spam considering it does not have a mini stun (like Ambush did) and its damage outside of stealth does less than a fully charged heavy attack with an Inferno staff. Abilities like Force Pulse/Crushing Shock do more damage and even give you the option to keep your distance where it's safe. I can do all this cheese on a Magicka Templar and Sorc just as easily as a Nightblade...

Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of Prox Det.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all gap close.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all point blank AoE.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all AoE ult.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of these skills/tactics in conjunction with the Vicious Death set.

You say PvP is dying and you blame Nightblades and VD making it worse? Yeah ok... because it's clearly not Stam (insert any class) using Shuffle, dodge rolling around objects while mashing Vigor cheesing everything up. It's not hordes of players running in zergs from A-Z trying to find safety in numbers right? As usual lets blame Nightblades and ask for more nerfs because we are misinformed and fueled by our misinformed state and otherwise can't be bothered to change up the way we play...

Lastly the greatest threat to this game are the developers who refuse to fix the lag in Cyrodiil caused by coding which started in v.1.2.3 that is exacerbated by players like yourself that pull the "safety in numbers" zerg nonsense. In fact this set (VD), used by any class, is one of the best things ZOS has done to counter all zergball aoe cap abusers.

If you are worried so much about VD spread out. Stop abusing AoE caps and spread out. Stop running in a zerg and play better. The problem isn't nightblades and it sure as hell isn't VD. The problem is people who think they are otherwise good at PvP in this game remove themselves and their bs tactics from the equation, pick a scapegoat and cry for nerfs while postulating false information to facilitate change. If you care so much about the state of PvP, stop posting threads like these and focus on the true problem that is lag and fps drops. It's been almost 2 years since 1.2.3 and it has only got worse. In fact I dare say the PvP has become the same PvP of the first weekend beta stress tests that occured in late 2013 where you had constant rubber bands and 2-3 second delay.

While all this may be true to an extent, Night blades ARE a better choice for the issue at hand, while you listed all possible scenarios, you forgot to mention - NB has a cloak, indefinite cloak mind you, making pulling this off much more easily, because if you try and approach a group the normal way - you will get artillery bombed from range and be dead long before you get there, even if you try and sneak, there is 90% chance some stray AoE/caltrops or whatnot will pull you out long before you reach the target group and get instantly ganked.
While as you say - most classes can pull it off, it is not a secret NB is the most successful due to inherent stealth ability and bonuses (shadowy disguise before the bomb goes off for a guaranteed crit - no other class has that ability). That is why you will mainly see NBs using this setup for the most part.
Don't get me wrong - a lot of magicka users try and attempt the same and some get it right, some don't, but magBlades have a much higher success of doing it right due to class abilities not available for anyone else.

And I am not hating nor blaming night blades for this farce, heck I mainly play a magblade myself, but ZoS went over the top with cheese mechanics this time, they really did. Problem is not NBs, problem is that this set synergizes best with NB abilities.

Jaronking · April 2016

Xarcus wrote: »

Another topic with guys full of frustrating.. Cloak nerfed and you still crying that we (NIGHTBLADES) own ? Maybe because many players who ambush you, do it because they're good enough to do it. And they're is a lot of ways to stop a NB, to stop his cloack use... just l2p maybe. And proxy det can be used by all classes so what?

The Op gets killed by NightBlades a lot so he is trying to get them nerfed so he won't be killed so easy.

Volkodav · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. As it is PVP is dying, and the lag there is horrendous... Now you have this bs going on. I just don't know, ZOS... I really don't know. But I really hope the next TESO comes soon. Because this nonsense right here...? I'm not feeling it.

Why does this not surprise me. Everyone bi-tched about Cloaking skills,so they nerfed them. NOW you want the class nerfed even more because you still get killed by NB"s?
Could it be your playing style that needs an upgrade rather than the nerfing of another class?
What you might want to see is that Nightblades are overall a solid class that can get the job done,..without cloaking skills working as well as they once did.They have more than that one deadly skill to work with. And now,..you have to deal with them and you need to step it up and figure out how to do so.
Nightblades arent ruining PvP,they have just relearned how to use their other skills to their best advantage,now that non-NBs demanded they be drought down a peg.. They have adapted,and the class still kick's other players tails.

What? You want to make it to where NBs have NO skills they can use in PvP? You dont want them to be able to attack,or kill you? Then work around their skills.I dont see NBs whining about other classes killing them in PvP.

PS,
My NB is doing great with the newest patch. I dont feel any nerfs,as I never used those cloaking skills.

WalkingLegacy · April 2016

Whatzituyah wrote: »

Anzriel wrote: »

You know what would fix things? Fixing the actual issues in pvp rather than the band-aid fixes known as proxy det and vicious death. They aren't the problems, they're symptoms of other issues they refuse to see in pvp.

Animation Canceling? Zerging? Lag?

Zerging isn't the problem. The back end anti bot/hack and lightning patch are the problem. Use to be hundreds of people on screen.

Nowadays people call a group of 25 a zerg. No.

TheHsN · April 2016

after this patch i left playing PVP with all my nb now i make only PVE with them

Apoxsee · April 2016

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Could you guys share some counters for this? Staying seperated doesn't work, and I hate fights where I don't get to fight back, I'd like to hear how these NBs running this cheese acknowledge as their achilles heel, what makes them crumble.

Leki set for Stam and phoniex set for Magic... Once the NB does his thing he is open to be beat down due to his lack of sustained with this kamakazi build.

OtarTheMad · April 2016

Xael wrote: »

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yep... Another one of these threads. All you see now is: Proximity Detonation, Sap Essence, Soul Tether, Lotus Fan over and over and over again with the Vicious Death set. It's getting out of hand now. While I understand it's apart of the game, and I'm aware that the key to avoiding VD's explosion is keeping distance between me and the next person... This combo has to be checked by devs and ASAP. As it is PVP is dying, and the lag there is horrendous... Now you have this bs going on. I just don't know, ZOS... I really don't know. But I really hope the next TESO comes soon. Because this nonsense right here...? I'm not feeling it.

Actually all I see is zergs, lag, and more zergs.

You are being extremely dishonest:
You imply Nightblades are the only class using Prox Det. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a gap closer. You imply Nightblades are the only class with a point blank AoE. You imply Nightblades are the only class with an AoE ult and what's more hilarious is that you imply all Nightblades spam Lotus Fan? Really? Lotus Fan is one of the worst abilities to spam considering it does not have a mini stun (like Ambush did) and its damage outside of stealth does less than a fully charged heavy attack with an Inferno staff. Abilities like Force Pulse/Crushing Shock do more damage and even give you the option to keep your distance where it's safe. I can do all this cheese on a Magicka Templar and Sorc just as easily as a Nightblade...

Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of Prox Det.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all gap close.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all point blank AoE.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all AoE ult.
Templars, DKs, and Sorcs can all make use of these skills/tactics in conjunction with the Vicious Death set.

You say PvP is dying and you blame Nightblades and VD making it worse? Yeah ok... because it's clearly not Stam (insert any class) using Shuffle, dodge rolling around objects while mashing Vigor cheesing everything up. It's not hordes of players running in zergs from A-Z trying to find safety in numbers right? As usual lets blame Nightblades and ask for more nerfs because we are misinformed and fueled by our misinformed state and otherwise can't be bothered to change up the way we play...

Lastly the greatest threat to this game are the developers who refuse to fix the lag in Cyrodiil caused by coding which started in v.1.2.3 that is exacerbated by players like yourself that pull the "safety in numbers" zerg nonsense. In fact this set (VD), used by any class, is one of the best things ZOS has done to counter all zergball aoe cap abusers.

If you are worried so much about VD spread out. Stop abusing AoE caps and spread out. Stop running in a zerg and play better. The problem isn't nightblades and it sure as hell isn't VD. The problem is people who think they are otherwise good at PvP in this game remove themselves and their bs tactics from the equation, pick a scapegoat and cry for nerfs while postulating false information to facilitate change. If you care so much about the state of PvP, stop posting threads like these and focus on the true problem that is lag and fps drops. It's been almost 2 years since 1.2.3 and it has only got worse. In fact I dare say the PvP has become the same PvP of the first weekend beta stress tests that occured in late 2013 where you had constant rubber bands and 2-3 second delay.

This. Completely agree.

I love how everyone is treating this like it's the Nightblades fault.

Okay how about those 7 EP I blew up on my Sorc with just streak, meteor and proxy? Imagine if I had VD on top of it. How about the 6 DC I blew up on my DK with Proxy, Entropy, Leap, Essence and Talons? EVERYONE has the abilities to do this kind of combo... STOP blaming Nightblades lol.

It's completely insane how much players are attached to bunching up. The other day in TF EP sieged Roe and they had at least 2-3 raids there. Not only did I do that blow up combo (minus the VD sadly) but also ganked a few and it did nothing to the numbers. I mean I filled two bounty quests, would have done a third if the keep didn't flag and yet there were so many EP there it didn't matter. Players want less lag and crap? Spread out, attack another keep. One groups wants Roe from AD? Okay, one group flag Brindle, another flag Fare... make it a long ride for those who are not there... burn forward camps and force us to ride. Use some strategy instead of just massing at one keep.

Tan9oSuccka · April 2016

I hope this gets patched soon.

Everyone in AD and some in DC are running this build.

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

Whatzituyah wrote: »

Anzriel wrote: »

You know what would fix things? Fixing the actual issues in pvp rather than the band-aid fixes known as proxy det and vicious death. They aren't the problems, they're symptoms of other issues they refuse to see in pvp.

Animation Canceling? Zerging? Lag?

Zerging isn't the problem. The back end anti bot/hack and lightning patch are the problem. Use to be hundreds of people on screen.

Nowadays people call a group of 25 a zerg. No.

AD and some DC Thornblade has the cloak into Soul Tether/Proximity detonation/VD cheese down to a science.

I'm going to take a break from PvP until they fix this garbage.

makreth · April 2016

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Yusuf wrote: »

I switched from NB to Templar during this patch and i kinda disagree with this thread.
As long as you're not in fullblown zerg-hive-mind-mode and are cautious about cc-breaking and healing back up most of these NBs aren't a problem.

They're actually.. kind of bad once you survive that one-trick-pony-thing they're doing

Then again, maybe i've just encountered the bad ones on PC EU? Heck, what do i know.

They are a problem. You see, being as I almost exclusively PVP with my Sorcerer — these Nightblades aren't killing me. They can't really pop my shields, so when I notice them? I CC-break and proceed to annihilate them. However! Those who aren't Sorcerers? I see them catching it from this broken Nightblade combo, and getting really frustrated. Not only do I see it, I hear it nonstop. Seriously. I hear complaints about it almost every 15-20mins. Not to mention, these Nightblades have admittedly caught me a few times whilst in the middle of sieging. And as you can imagine, it's rough when that happens.

Dude are you saying we have to nerf sorc before nb now? Delete that post now !