Why 2xKagrenac + 2xTorugs over 4xMagnus?

BreacaT · February 2016

I've often read that for a Templar Magicka DD, it's preferable to have 2xKagrenac armour and 2xTorugs swords. But, if you swapped these out for 4xMagnus Gift then the buffs appear to be better as you get the 4-part-sets..

By my reckoning...
2xKagrenac + 2xTorugs = 834 Max Magicka + 112 Spell Damage
vs
4xMagnus = 834 Max Magicka + 112 Magicka Recovery + 112 Spell Damage

What have I missed?

Leandor · February 2016

You want to retain the spell damage bonus even if you switch to your staff off bar. 4 torug is equally bad as 2+2. Only reason I could envisage.

Most recommendations go for 5 kag, 3 willpower, 2 monsterset (kena or guardian, mostly) and 2 torug. Basically to amplify templar rez power. This setup considers DW and 1HS, no staff.

YMMV.

Waffennacht · February 2016

Actually that only works if a peice of armor is torug, if you run just x2 torug swords then you still lose the bonus when switching. If this is the case then magnus is still the better option as you retain regen.

Now your logic makes sense if you have 1 torug armor, and 1 torug sword, and then run a torug staff, however you lose magicka which means you lose only a total of 20ish spell dmg by keeping magnus.

Imo Magnus is still a superior option thanks to the maintained sustain

Holy-Dope · February 2016

Aboslutly no reason for 2 crag= 2 toureg. It's absurd. You are literally wasting 1 Armour slot and gaining nothing. 4 Magnus is very good for sustain as well DPS if you are not using Kena (shoulder only) or else you can try-

5pc Julianos (chest/ Legs/Boots + 2 swords on both bars)
3 Pc - Arch mage/ Overwhelming/ Toureg/ Elemental succession and so many other options ( Head/ Gloves/ belts)
1 Kena Shoulder (looks cool)

and you guessed right the last 3 pcs.........

Oreyn_Bearclaw · February 2016

The only possible reason I could think is if people want to craft gear now, but they plan to incorporate Monster sets in the future that they dont have yet. Then it might make sense to make Torugs swords and have a place holder like Kags for extra magic until you get the monster pieces you want.

On my Templar, I always run a 5 piece (Spell Power Cure or Kags), 3 willpower and a 4 piece Magnus. I lose the 4 piece when I swap to my off bar, but now that I have Maelstrom Resto staff, it really doesnt matter. Next patch, 2-piece bogdan is probably coming off the bench, which means I will likely need to make some new swords in Torugs.

Csiminae · February 2016

The dual wield torug's pact swords (precise), on the back bar increases your spell damage and spell crit on your front bar with a staff equipped. Is it a bug or working as intended? I checked it out. You get the torug's pact spell damage on the front bar, even if you are wearing 4/5/3 pieces Magnus, Juliano's, willpower. The catch is, you do not get any of this if you are actually wearing any Torug's pact's armor.

Waffennacht · February 2016

Csiminae wrote: »

The dual wield torug's pact swords (precise), on the back bar increases your spell damage and spell crit on your front bar with a staff equipped. Is it a bug or working as intended? I checked it out. You get the torug's pact spell damage on the front bar, even if you are wearing 4/5/3 pieces Magnus, Juliano's, willpower. The catch is, you do not get any of this if you are actually wearing any Torug's pact's armor.

I thought that bug was fixed a while ago. I will have to check if it is still happening, however as I am on console I cannot even be sure of the tool tip numbers.

I also wonder how old the builds that you are looking at. If they are older they may indeed be incorporating the bug in the build. Personally I wouldn't rely on it, but if it is still happening must as well give it a shot.

code65536 · February 2016

Waffennacht wrote: »

Actually that only works if a peice of armor is torug, if you run just x2 torug swords then you still lose the bonus when switching.

Incorrect. The character sheet is buggy. But controlled tests using a combat log to show exact damage numbers indicate that everything is working as intended--just don't trust the stat numbers in the UI.

@BreacaT Where do you see anyone suggesting 2p Kag? Are you sure it's not a typo or a misread and that the person meant 5p Kag? The only reason to run Kag is to get the 5p bonus; if you're not using all 5 pieces, you might as well not use Kag at all. Besides, there are plenty of other lower-trait sets that can provide a 2p max magicka bonus.

Waffennacht · February 2016

@code65536 im very interested. One what exactly do I need / do to get the stat bonus? Second Im on xbox so I do not have access to a combat log yet, does this still work on xbox console?

Daveheart · February 2016

I've never seen anyone recommend using Kag's for anything other than the full 5 piece set.

code65536 · February 2016

Waffennacht wrote: »

@code65536 im very interested. One what exactly do I need / do to get the stat bonus? Second Im on xbox so I do not have access to a combat log yet, does this still work on xbox console?

You just need two pieces of Torug on your currently-active bar to get the spell damage bonus. Doesn't matter if it's 2 weapons or weapon+armor or whatever. Basically, it works just fine the way that you expect it to work. Whatever bugs people report with it are purely cosmetic bugs in the UI.

Kahen40k · February 2016

BreacaT wrote: »

I've often read that for a Templar Magicka DD, it's preferable to have 2xKagrenac armour and 2xTorugs swords. But, if you swapped these out for 4xMagnus Gift then the buffs appear to be better as you get the 4-part-sets..

By my reckoning...
2xKagrenac + 2xTorugs = 834 Max Magicka + 112 Spell Damage
vs
4xMagnus = 834 Max Magicka + 112 Magicka Recovery + 112 Spell Damage

What have I missed?

I think that what you read is related to armour pieces and not full sets, and this setup is used for some sort of hybrid builds in pvp mainly. Lets say, for istance, that you wanna make a half healer/half dps; a pretty common combination would be 4 seducer and 3 kagrenac, as armour, then a resto seducer for healing bar and dual or 1h and shield kagrenac for offensive bar. Another one that i can think of is is with 2 willpower and 1 endurance jewels, 1 resto willpower for healing and 1h and shield endurance for defence bar. Those are just example, but you can be pretty creative.
As for the one you mention, i used it myself before, but the reason was simple:
my templar was with a full healing setup, using 5 kagrenac, but i had a julianos as well for dps in easy dailys and stuff like that; I would have go 5 julianos and 4 magnus, but i already had 2 torug nirn swords, so i ask myself, do i wanna spend 200k+ for a backup gear? No, screw magika regen. Other than that, i don't see any othe reason.