Khaos_Bane wrote: »Some STA builds are ALREADY the highest DPS in the game, stop whining. How are people whining about STA ? Next patch STA will probably still be the highest DPS and even get buffed MORE with DB.
PhatGrimReaper wrote: »Because stam builds are so devoid of damage?
When I can kill someone in literally 1 second on my stamblade I don't think 25% less damage is going to be game breaking. It is perfectly possible to deliver 30k in damage in 1-1.2 secs right now.... reduce that by 25%.... still leaves 24k ish damage... what's the average health pool in cyro right now?
So long as it is possible to achieve high wep damage so much easier than it is to do the same with spell damage, I don't think we need more ulties with Physical damage.
Not everyone plays a FOTM stamblade....just sayin
Ofcourse a Stamblade which is retared way too strong now does not loose too much...
but the already weak stam classes are getting even weaker....
Khaos_Bane wrote: »Some STA builds are ALREADY the highest DPS in the game, stop whining. How are people whining about STA ? Next patch STA will probably still be the highest DPS and even get buffed MORE with DB.
Khaos_Bane wrote: »Some STA builds are ALREADY the highest DPS in the game, stop whining. How are people whining about STA ? Next patch STA will probably still be the highest DPS and even get buffed MORE with DB.
The two higest DPS builds in the game are currently magicka. Educate yourself.
The lack of softcaps and the missing counters to negate for example crit or pen will cause more imbalance over the years. Also cp system wasnt well thought out in the long run. It was and will be a high dps stack as much stuff as u can.
A total overhaul would be needed but i given up on it.
The lack of softcaps and the missing counters to negate for example crit or pen will cause more imbalance over the years. Also cp system wasnt well thought out in the long run. It was and will be a high dps stack as much stuff as u can.
A total overhaul would be needed but i given up on it.
We had soft caps before balance was worse. One dk could literally tank and kill 15 ppl even one bad dk could hold 10 ppl for five minutes they would hold you in talons and whip you, you would dodge roll then you were out of Stam to be taloned again. Then bats would hit and you were dead. Negate used to stun now it does not it does nothing to ANY Stam build the counter to negate is bombard Steel tornado proxy det. Ppl asked for the perfectly fine veteran system to be replaced. The cp tree is thanks to qq ers. I like it and glad I have both... A least for now. If you are having problems getting critted then you can build against it there is nothing imbalanced about that.
bowmanz607 wrote: »Fact: mag dominated for a year
Fact: Stam dominated for nearly a year
Fact: mag will will be better than Stam thus update
Fact: balance is not one dominates for a year, then the other and back again
Fact: saying one dominated for a long period of time over another is not a justification for current imbalances
Fact: weapon damage can get higher then mag
Fact mag has more utility and heals
Fact: weapon damage being more stackable does not mean that Stam has higher tool tip damage
Fact: mag can get higher tool tip damage than Stam in tg because they can allocate into less stars to receive more damage on skills they use with different damage types.
Fact: mag damage and spam damage can be equally mitigated
Fact: mag can increase ult damage and skill damage in one star
Fact: sram needs two split stars for ult damage/some skills and skill damage
This is not a Stam was needed and qq thread. This is simply objectively looking at the facts about what is coming. I am not mad Stam got nerfed. Hell I don't even call it a nerf so much as fixing a broken champ tree.justifying no change to damage types because it is mag turn to dominate is poor logic and the game will never be balanced. Regardless, wrobell all but stated that damage type change will come in next patch. My question is, given the speed in which they changed a set pc trap damage from mag damage to poison in like a week, why can't these damages changes come in now? At least to a skill like flawless dawnbreaker which is obviously for Stam users. Why not throw us a bone to naw on until next update?
bowmanz607 wrote: »Fact: mag dominated for a year
Fact: Stam dominated for nearly a year
Fact: mag will will be better than Stam thus update
Fact: balance is not one dominates for a year, then the other and back again
Fact: saying one dominated for a long period of time over another is not a justification for current imbalances
Fact: weapon damage can get higher then mag
Fact mag has more utility and heals
Fact: weapon damage being more stackable does not mean that Stam has higher tool tip damage
Fact: mag can get higher tool tip damage than Stam in tg because they can allocate into less stars to receive more damage on skills they use with different damage types.
Fact: mag damage and spam damage can be equally mitigated
Fact: mag can increase ult damage and skill damage in one star
Fact: sram needs two split stars for ult damage/some skills and skill damage
This is not a Stam was needed and qq thread. This is simply objectively looking at the facts about what is coming. I am not mad Stam got nerfed. Hell I don't even call it a nerf so much as fixing a broken champ tree.justifying no change to damage types because it is mag turn to dominate is poor logic and the game will never be balanced. Regardless, wrobell all but stated that damage type change will come in next patch. My question is, given the speed in which they changed a set pc trap damage from mag damage to poison in like a week, why can't these damages changes come in now? At least to a skill like flawless dawnbreaker which is obviously for Stam users. Why not throw us a bone to naw on until next update?
Those are not facts they are opinions. Please cite your sources. There is no evidence magic will be better there is no spell or magic weapon ability better than the typical Stam weapon or Stam ability. Let's use Destro staff since all have access to it fire ring does half damage after 10 seconds the damage of one steel tornado does instantly. Crushing shock does less the damage of one flying blade. Stam abilities even if you maxed the physical resistance cp tree i.e. surprise attack, wrecking blow currently are and will still the hardest hitting abilities in the game before or after the patch. Furthermore, since fire ring as the previous example is a elemental damage it is also a dot requiring I spec into 2 different cp trees just like I have to do now. Right now on live I have 100 in thaumaturge on my magic Templar and 67 in elemental expert since I use a fire staff. After the patch I will have 100 in elemental expert and 67 in dots since now my sweeps and the for mentioned fire ring are affected by this tree. There is NO difference... None. For my class and build and play style the only buff is directly to class abilities: flare, vampire bane, and the sweeps nerf and the javelin distance buff. Since, I do not use vampires bane nor flare it is irrelevant My sweeps were nerfed via the 5 percent heal and the javelin is a wash as the distance was not the benefit it was the knock back. I use defensive stance so the dark flare cast time (delay) will help me reflect the dark flare right back to you so good luck with that. As you can can surmise I am not expecting any buffs for my Templar.
Vigor is better than green dragon blood and just as good as healing ward. Vigor can be used by any and every class. No specific weapon needs to be carried or used or slotted. It is my expectation that this patch will produce more balance between Stam and magic than any patch before. Will it affect my particular build class or playstyle... Yes! It's a small net nerf. I will need to run with a rune slotted and throw it down essentially every 8 seconds. I can't wait.
bowmanz607 wrote: »Khaos_Bane wrote: »Some STA builds are ALREADY the highest DPS in the game, stop whining. How are people whining about STA ? Next patch STA will probably still be the highest DPS and even get buffed MORE with DB.
Well if you have been on pts you know what is true on live is not Tru on the pts
Khaos_Bane wrote: »bowmanz607 wrote: »Khaos_Bane wrote: »Some STA builds are ALREADY the highest DPS in the game, stop whining. How are people whining about STA ? Next patch STA will probably still be the highest DPS and even get buffed MORE with DB.
Well if you have been on pts you know what is true on live is not Tru on the pts
STA Weapon skills have not been nerfed and it's STILL PTS. I have a feeling a lot of people are going to QQ if MAG competes for DPS.
PhatGrimReaper wrote: »Because stam builds are so devoid of damage?
When I can kill someone in literally 1 second on my stamblade I don't think 25% less damage is going to be game breaking. It is perfectly possible to deliver 30k in damage in 1-1.2 secs right now.... reduce that by 25%.... still leaves 24k ish damage... what's the average health pool in cyro right now?
So long as it is possible to achieve high wep damage so much easier than it is to do the same with spell damage, I don't think we need more ulties with Physical damage.
Not all of us playing NB...
PhatGrimReaper wrote: »Because stam builds are so devoid of damage?
When I can kill someone in literally 1 second on my stamblade I don't think 25% less damage is going to be game breaking. It is perfectly possible to deliver 30k in damage in 1-1.2 secs right now.... reduce that by 25%.... still leaves 24k ish damage... what's the average health pool in cyro right now?
So long as it is possible to achieve high wep damage so much easier than it is to do the same with spell damage, I don't think we need more ulties with Physical damage.
Not everyone plays a FOTM stamblade....just sayin
Ofcourse a Stamblade which is retared way too strong now does not loose too much...
but the already weak stam classes are getting even weaker....
bowmanz607 wrote: »Fact: mag dominated for a year
Fact: Stam dominated for nearly a year
Fact: mag will will be better than Stam thus update
Fact: balance is not one dominates for a year, then the other and back again
Fact: saying one dominated for a long period of time over another is not a justification for current imbalances
Fact: weapon damage can get higher then mag
Fact mag has more utility and heals
Fact: weapon damage being more stackable does not mean that Stam has higher tool tip damage
Fact: mag can get higher tool tip damage than Stam in tg because they can allocate into less stars to receive more damage on skills they use with different damage types.
Fact: mag damage and spam damage can be equally mitigated
Fact: mag can increase ult damage and skill damage in one star
Fact: sram needs two split stars for ult damage/some skills and skill damage
This is not a Stam was needed and qq thread. This is simply objectively looking at the facts about what is coming. I am not mad Stam got nerfed. Hell I don't even call it a nerf so much as fixing a broken champ tree.justifying no change to damage types because it is mag turn to dominate is poor logic and the game will never be balanced. Regardless, wrobell all but stated that damage type change will come in next patch. My question is, given the speed in which they changed a set pc trap damage from mag damage to poison in like a week, why can't these damages changes come in now? At least to a skill like flawless dawnbreaker which is obviously for Stam users. Why not throw us a bone to naw on until next update?
Those are not facts they are opinions. Please cite your sources. There is no evidence magic will be better there is no spell or magic weapon ability better than the typical Stam weapon or Stam ability. Let's use Destro staff since all have access to it fire ring does half damage after 10 seconds the damage of one steel tornado does instantly. Crushing shock does less the damage of one flying blade. Stam abilities even if you maxed the physical resistance cp tree i.e. surprise attack, wrecking blow currently are and will still the hardest hitting abilities in the game before or after the patch. Furthermore, since fire ring as the previous example is a elemental damage it is also a dot requiring I spec into 2 different cp trees just like I have to do now. Right now on live I have 100 in thaumaturge on my magic Templar and 67 in elemental expert since I use a fire staff. After the patch I will have 100 in elemental expert and 67 in dots since now my sweeps and the for mentioned fire ring are affected by this tree. There is NO difference... None. For my class and build and play style the only buff is directly to class abilities: flare, vampire bane, and the sweeps nerf and the javelin distance buff. Since, I do not use vampires bane nor flare it is irrelevant My sweeps were nerfed via the 5 percent heal and the javelin is a wash as the distance was not the benefit it was the knock back. I use defensive stance so the dark flare cast time (delay) will help me reflect the dark flare right back to you so good luck with that. As you can can surmise I am not expecting any buffs for my Templar.
Vigor is better than green dragon blood and just as good as healing ward. Vigor can be used by any and every class. No specific weapon needs to be carried or used or slotted. It is my expectation that this patch will produce more balance between Stam and magic than any patch before. Will it affect my particular build class or playstyle... Yes! It's a small net nerf. I will need to run with a rune slotted and throw it down essentially every 8 seconds. I can't wait.
Khaos_Bane wrote: »Not really. They just need some parity in ultimates and CP with changes to removing MAG from skill in favor of poison/disease. STA still has some of the best AoE and ST burst skills in the game.PhatGrimReaper wrote: »Because stam builds are so devoid of damage?
When I can kill someone in literally 1 second on my stamblade I don't think 25% less damage is going to be game breaking. It is perfectly possible to deliver 30k in damage in 1-1.2 secs right now.... reduce that by 25%.... still leaves 24k ish damage... what's the average health pool in cyro right now?
So long as it is possible to achieve high wep damage so much easier than it is to do the same with spell damage, I don't think we need more ulties with Physical damage.
Not everyone plays a FOTM stamblade....just sayin
Ofcourse a Stamblade which is retared way too strong now does not loose too much...
but the already weak stam classes are getting even weaker....
dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO wrote: »bowmanz607 wrote: »Fact: mag dominated for a year
Fact: Stam dominated for nearly a year
Fact: mag will will be better than Stam thus update
Fact: balance is not one dominates for a year, then the other and back again
Fact: saying one dominated for a long period of time over another is not a justification for current imbalances
Fact: weapon damage can get higher then mag
Fact mag has more utility and heals
Fact: weapon damage being more stackable does not mean that Stam has higher tool tip damage
Fact: mag can get higher tool tip damage than Stam in tg because they can allocate into less stars to receive more damage on skills they use with different damage types.
Fact: mag damage and spam damage can be equally mitigated
Fact: mag can increase ult damage and skill damage in one star
Fact: sram needs two split stars for ult damage/some skills and skill damage
This is not a Stam was needed and qq thread. This is simply objectively looking at the facts about what is coming. I am not mad Stam got nerfed. Hell I don't even call it a nerf so much as fixing a broken champ tree.justifying no change to damage types because it is mag turn to dominate is poor logic and the game will never be balanced. Regardless, wrobell all but stated that damage type change will come in next patch. My question is, given the speed in which they changed a set pc trap damage from mag damage to poison in like a week, why can't these damages changes come in now? At least to a skill like flawless dawnbreaker which is obviously for Stam users. Why not throw us a bone to naw on until next update?
Those are not facts they are opinions. Please cite your sources. There is no evidence magic will be better there is no spell or magic weapon ability better than the typical Stam weapon or Stam ability. Let's use Destro staff since all have access to it fire ring does half damage after 10 seconds the damage of one steel tornado does instantly. Crushing shock does less the damage of one flying blade. Stam abilities even if you maxed the physical resistance cp tree i.e. surprise attack, wrecking blow currently are and will still the hardest hitting abilities in the game before or after the patch. Furthermore, since fire ring as the previous example is a elemental damage it is also a dot requiring I spec into 2 different cp trees just like I have to do now. Right now on live I have 100 in thaumaturge on my magic Templar and 67 in elemental expert since I use a fire staff. After the patch I will have 100 in elemental expert and 67 in dots since now my sweeps and the for mentioned fire ring are affected by this tree. There is NO difference... None. For my class and build and play style the only buff is directly to class abilities: flare, vampire bane, and the sweeps nerf and the javelin distance buff. Since, I do not use vampires bane nor flare it is irrelevant My sweeps were nerfed via the 5 percent heal and the javelin is a wash as the distance was not the benefit it was the knock back. I use defensive stance so the dark flare cast time (delay) will help me reflect the dark flare right back to you so good luck with that. As you can can surmise I am not expecting any buffs for my Templar.
Vigor is better than green dragon blood and just as good as healing ward. Vigor can be used by any and every class. No specific weapon needs to be carried or used or slotted. It is my expectation that this patch will produce more balance between Stam and magic than any patch before. Will it affect my particular build class or playstyle... Yes! It's a small net nerf. I will need to run with a rune slotted and throw it down essentially every 8 seconds. I can't wait.
sweeps was actually greatly buffed because it gets more damage from the new damage over time cp( as well as radient destruction), channels that damage are dots. thats a possible 25% more damage with enough cp.
PhatGrimReaper wrote: »Maybe when Light armor increases SD by 12%........?
dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO wrote: »bowmanz607 wrote: »Fact: mag dominated for a year
Fact: Stam dominated for nearly a year
Fact: mag will will be better than Stam thus update
Fact: balance is not one dominates for a year, then the other and back again
Fact: saying one dominated for a long period of time over another is not a justification for current imbalances
Fact: weapon damage can get higher then mag
Fact mag has more utility and heals
Fact: weapon damage being more stackable does not mean that Stam has higher tool tip damage
Fact: mag can get higher tool tip damage than Stam in tg because they can allocate into less stars to receive more damage on skills they use with different damage types.
Fact: mag damage and spam damage can be equally mitigated
Fact: mag can increase ult damage and skill damage in one star
Fact: sram needs two split stars for ult damage/some skills and skill damage
This is not a Stam was needed and qq thread. This is simply objectively looking at the facts about what is coming. I am not mad Stam got nerfed. Hell I don't even call it a nerf so much as fixing a broken champ tree.justifying no change to damage types because it is mag turn to dominate is poor logic and the game will never be balanced. Regardless, wrobell all but stated that damage type change will come in next patch. My question is, given the speed in which they changed a set pc trap damage from mag damage to poison in like a week, why can't these damages changes come in now? At least to a skill like flawless dawnbreaker which is obviously for Stam users. Why not throw us a bone to naw on until next update?
Those are not facts they are opinions. Please cite your sources. There is no evidence magic will be better there is no spell or magic weapon ability better than the typical Stam weapon or Stam ability. Let's use Destro staff since all have access to it fire ring does half damage after 10 seconds the damage of one steel tornado does instantly. Crushing shock does less the damage of one flying blade. Stam abilities even if you maxed the physical resistance cp tree i.e. surprise attack, wrecking blow currently are and will still the hardest hitting abilities in the game before or after the patch. Furthermore, since fire ring as the previous example is a elemental damage it is also a dot requiring I spec into 2 different cp trees just like I have to do now. Right now on live I have 100 in thaumaturge on my magic Templar and 67 in elemental expert since I use a fire staff. After the patch I will have 100 in elemental expert and 67 in dots since now my sweeps and the for mentioned fire ring are affected by this tree. There is NO difference... None. For my class and build and play style the only buff is directly to class abilities: flare, vampire bane, and the sweeps nerf and the javelin distance buff. Since, I do not use vampires bane nor flare it is irrelevant My sweeps were nerfed via the 5 percent heal and the javelin is a wash as the distance was not the benefit it was the knock back. I use defensive stance so the dark flare cast time (delay) will help me reflect the dark flare right back to you so good luck with that. As you can can surmise I am not expecting any buffs for my Templar.
Vigor is better than green dragon blood and just as good as healing ward. Vigor can be used by any and every class. No specific weapon needs to be carried or used or slotted. It is my expectation that this patch will produce more balance between Stam and magic than any patch before. Will it affect my particular build class or playstyle... Yes! It's a small net nerf. I will need to run with a rune slotted and throw it down essentially every 8 seconds. I can't wait.
sweeps was actually greatly buffed because it gets more damage from the new damage over time cp( as well as radient destruction), channels that damage are dots. thats a possible 25% more damage with enough cp.
Just tried it I do less damage than live by a signifigant factor. I don't use radiant oppression on my build not against using it just don't. FYI I used giants and mamoths in EP rift as part Caldwell silver area. I used combat log and compared with FTC damage report to record my damage. 100 in thaumaturge rest in damage over tine effects on live. 100 in elemental rest in damage over time effects. It's about a loss of 271 to 809 dps loss as the range and about 440 loss avg per sweep. The variability was accounted for by burning light procs and critical hits. This makes the nerf to healing even more pronounced. Less damage less heals which was reduced 5 percent. In no cirmunstances was there a dps increase or any buff I can measure or record. I did not use any buff except tri food to boost my magic. Again a nerf, I assume if your build includes vampires bane or dark flare you may experience an increase in dps but I don't run any of the abilities impacted by the patch. Nothing that will prompt me to continue playing my Templar. Btw I used 300 cp maximum for both tests.
Nono, steel tornado and stamina equipment was already there in aug/sept 2014! Think about the pvp sets as the one with the +600 weapon dmg proc, etc. etc.. I'll not repeat again why itemization in ESO has always been pro-stamina MOST of the time + the Ultimate which passively raises weapon power, as another user already pointed out: Stamina has been on the sunny side a looong time, remember bow-ganking back in late 2014.., or "new" race boni, like 30% stamina reg (now 20%).bowmanz607 wrote: »Magicka dominated the first year of this game.
Francescolg wrote: »Nono, steel tornado and stamina equipment was already there in aug/sept 2014! Think about the pvp sets as the one with the +600 weapon dmg proc, etc. etc.. I'll not repeat again why itemization in ESO has always been pro-stamina MOST of the time + the Ultimate which passively raises weapon power, as another user already pointed out: Stamina has been on the sunny side a looong time, remember bow-ganking back in late 2014.., or "new" race boni, like 30% stamina reg (now 20%).bowmanz607 wrote: »Magicka dominated the first year of this game.
The developers made so many goodies for stamina since fall 2014, that I don't bother to mention them all.
bowmanz607 wrote: »PhatGrimReaper wrote: »With the exception of ults, I can sort of see what you mean, however, when you take into account the entire PVP environment in the upcoming patch, I think you'll find that stam is in a stronger position with the changes to mobility and siege. Magicka builds are profoundly more affected by the changes to Retreating and stam damage from siege than stam users. I think you'll find that it will balance itself out in a rather messy way.
I see your point. But mag builds also have a whole lot utility and heals available to them along with abilities like purge. Where you lack in mobility you gain in other ways. On a side note, I'm sure we will see more ppl using charging maneuvers now.
dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO wrote: »bowmanz607 wrote: »PhatGrimReaper wrote: »With the exception of ults, I can sort of see what you mean, however, when you take into account the entire PVP environment in the upcoming patch, I think you'll find that stam is in a stronger position with the changes to mobility and siege. Magicka builds are profoundly more affected by the changes to Retreating and stam damage from siege than stam users. I think you'll find that it will balance itself out in a rather messy way.
I see your point. But mag builds also have a whole lot utility and heals available to them along with abilities like purge. Where you lack in mobility you gain in other ways. On a side note, I'm sure we will see more ppl using charging maneuvers now.
vigor is the best heal in the game after BOL so tagging magica with the utility of heals is total nonsense