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Do you think the meteor should be able to be reflected?
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ultimate shouldnt be the i win button but should help to change the chances now if someone is silly enough to meteor someone wiht reflect up then they should be punished for it im sorry but its purly L2P if people didnt just zerg ball and actually fought and open their eyes for a min then they would learn how to counter/play and then find when the right time to use this/any ulti instead of going "duhhh ima press R now duhh"0 -
tennant94✭✭✭No! Blocking negates a ton of the damage, stops the knock back and leaves you free to leave the rather small ground dot.1 -
Lava_Croft✭✭✭✭✭
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Just like Sorcerers like to think only they have shields, so do Dragon Knights think they are the only ones able to reflect things.Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Yes it should but ZOS finally gave into the babies crying and made it un-reflectable thank babies for yet another nerf to DKs.
The real downer of unreflectable Meteor is that Templars can no longer do Meteor -> Watch DK flap wings -> cast Eclipse -> Enjoy pinball.
Edited by Lava_Croft on February 7, 2016 9:14AM1 -
Cody✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Lava_Croft wrote: »
Just like Sorcerers like to think only they have shields, so do Dragon Knights think they are the only ones able to reflect things.Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Yes it should but ZOS finally gave into the babies crying and made it un-reflectable thank babies for yet another nerf to DKs.
The real downer of unreflectable Meteor is that Templars can no longer do Meteor -> Watch DK flap wings -> cast Eclipse -> Enjoy pinball.
in all fairness, sorcerers are the only ones you will see consistently pulling 18-25K damage sheild stacks, and scales is much better than posture:)Edited by Cody on February 7, 2016 4:13PM0 -
KatzMainTank✭✭✭I think it should be reflect capable.EP - V12 - Crafter
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Lava_Croft✭✭✭✭✭
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Still a lot of non-Sorcerers depend on damage shields and a lot of non-Dragon Knights depend on Defensive Posture.Lava_Croft wrote: »
Just like Sorcerers like to think only they have shields, so do Dragon Knights think they are the only ones able to reflect things.Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »Yes it should but ZOS finally gave into the babies crying and made it un-reflectable thank babies for yet another nerf to DKs.
The real downer of unreflectable Meteor is that Templars can no longer do Meteor -> Watch DK flap wings -> cast Eclipse -> Enjoy pinball.
in all fairness, sorcerers are the only ones you will see consistently pulling 18-25K damage sheild stacks, and scales is much better than posture:)0 -
kyle.wilson✭✭✭✭✭
✭Currently using a sorc I find almost all my main skills reflected in my face when I face a DK. I end up using skills that interrupt and trip their rotation to gain the advantage. But I don't have any issues with the reflect. Just be smart enough to roll dodge out of it.0 -
Jura23✭✭✭✭✭
✭Probably yes, but the problem isn't it's not gonna be reflectable anymore. Problem is, it was the only counter and Meteor is now the go to ultimate for everybody, because it has literally no drawbacks, unlike other ultimates, which you can dodge, walk out of, or just need to be aimed.Georgion - Bosmer/Templar - PC/EU0 -
Lava_Croft✭✭✭✭✭
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You make it sound like every other Meteor in PvP gets reflected, something is certainly not the case.Probably yes, but the problem isn't it's not gonna be reflectable anymore. Problem is, it was the only counter and Meteor is now the go to ultimate for everybody, because it has literally no drawbacks, unlike other ultimates, which you can dodge, walk out of, or just need to be aimed.
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code65536✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It's a non-spammable 200-cost ultimate that's supposed to be a giant rock from the heavens. (Overload, on the other hand, is spammable, cheap, and doesn't drain the entire ultimate pool on a single use, and should be reflected.) Reflection was always an idiotic idea, both from a gameplay/balance perspective and from a lore/common-sense perspective.
Plus, the victim is given an impossible-to-miss audio and visual warning. You see that meteor coming from quite a ways away. Just hold block. The only times I've been able to kill an experienced player with meteor was when they've already been drained of resources and I'm just finishing them off.Nightfighters ― PC/NA and PC/EU
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AddictionX✭✭✭✭How is Block a viable counter to it?
Stand and hold block.... jump around if you must... oh im cc'd cant block anymore... when they should of been doing that before.
I should be able to dodge it if i other ulties your able to dodge/not cast while rooted/ and doesn't cancel when being hit.
Make take flight undodgeable, able to casted while rooted, and not cancel when being hit by light attacks, and use the ultimate when it never casted.Edited by AddictionX on February 10, 2016 8:42AM0 -
Chelos✭✭✭✭✭Is there any other ultimate that can be reflected?
AFAIK: No- Ich bin nicht merkwürdig ich bin eine limitierte Auflage!
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SemiD4rkness✭✭✭✭✭No, its an ultimate and shoulnd't be so easy to just reflect it. You can already block it and negate most of its damage, and that's comming from a guy who slots defensive stance all the time.0
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Johngo0036✭✭✭✭✭Johngo0036 wrote: »@Huggalump - "Meteor is already very easy to avoid" - Please name these ways to avoid it
you block...
The majority of the times I use meteor, it does minimal damage because the guy knows to right click when he sees a massive circle around him
Block is not avoiding, it is minimizing the damage.
Most other ultimates can be avoided by dodgerolling but meteor cannot be.. yes other ultimates can also be blocked still doing damage..... however if i dodgeroll at the right time on most other ultimates i can get away with NO damage...Why should meteor be different?
Make meteor dodgerollable with the DOT still around which i would roll out of anyway..
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✭✭Johngo0036 wrote: »Johngo0036 wrote: »@Huggalump - "Meteor is already very easy to avoid" - Please name these ways to avoid it
you block...
The majority of the times I use meteor, it does minimal damage because the guy knows to right click when he sees a massive circle around him
Block is not avoiding, it is minimizing the damage.
Most other ultimates can be avoided by dodgerolling but meteor cannot be.. yes other ultimates can also be blocked still doing damage..... however if i dodgeroll at the right time on most other ultimates i can get away with NO damage...Why should meteor be different?
Make meteor dodgerollable with the DOT still around which i would roll out of anyway..
Other ultimates don't give you a giant blue circle around your feet to tell you they are about to hit you.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
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Digiman✭✭✭✭✭CatchMeTrolling wrote: »
How many ultimates are reflectable? Besides with a simple button the DK got a free ultimate on top of the one they were building.0 -
RoamingRiverElk✭✭✭✭✭Johngo0036 wrote: »Johngo0036 wrote: »@Huggalump - "Meteor is already very easy to avoid" - Please name these ways to avoid it
you block...
The majority of the times I use meteor, it does minimal damage because the guy knows to right click when he sees a massive circle around him
Block is not avoiding, it is minimizing the damage.
Most other ultimates can be avoided by dodgerolling but meteor cannot be.. yes other ultimates can also be blocked still doing damage..... however if i dodgeroll at the right time on most other ultimates i can get away with NO damage...Why should meteor be different?
Make meteor dodgerollable with the DOT still around which i would roll out of anyway..
Other ultimates don't give you a giant blue circle around your feet to tell you they are about to hit you.
The fact that it has such a long travel time is part of the issue though, someone can both CC you with fossilize or rune or fear at the right time so that you don't have a chance to block that very hard hitting ultimate, AND you can still combine it with some other hard hitting normal skill, plus, in case of magicka builds, detonation.
Meteor is a *stackable* ultimate, not just one that CCs and does a lot of damage. This, I think, is a crucial aspect of it that often gets overlooked.
When I see that meteor coming my way (and it's not that I always see it - or see it in time - due to whatever technical problems there are with the game), when on my DK I may even use wings twice before it hits, just to try to make it sure that the meteor does get reflected even if I'm CCd despite blocking.
Meteor being reflectable at least allowed it to be countered better. Now everyone will use it because it has no drawbacks and can be used without at least having to see whether the enemy is one who might reflect it.Edited by RoamingRiverElk on February 10, 2016 5:42PMDalris Aalr - Magicka (Stamina) DK | Dalfish - Magicka Sorc | Dal Aalr - Magicka Warden | Dalrish - Mag/Stam NB | Irana Aalr - PvE Templar1 -
TheM0rganism✭✭✭Meteor is the most-bang-for-your-buck ULT in the game. Nothing comes close to that damage/cost ratio on an instant-cast ranged spell.
If you're dumb enough to cast it on someone holding a shield you deserve to die. Only try-hard-dps-edgelords would want it to not be reflected as their demand for ROLE BALANCE is ruining ESO.
Tanks should tank. Healers should heal. And Dps should shut up and enjoy being carried through everything as they spam one skill over and over.
If you're the type of player who duels and uses daedric mines, you're cancerPS4 DC Stamina Templar Tank/DPS...because I ALWAYS play on hard mode
#2233 - Never Forget1 -
BurtFreeman✭✭✭reflected to the caster maybe, then we should make immune to all ultimate even a frog.
may be mitigated with another ultimate. i mean is the name that you must keep in your head and the meteor too. meteor should be unstoppable and they are.
thought, ground damage should be mitigated in some way and it is with cpEdited by BurtFreeman on February 10, 2016 6:03PM0 -
TheM0rganism✭✭✭BurtFreeman wrote: »reflected to the caster maybe, then we should make immune to all ultimate even a frog.
may be mitigated with another ultimate. i voted no.
I'm sure this was hilarious when you were thinking it over in your head but it doesn't make sense. Please explain or edit this to be comprehensible.PS4 DC Stamina Templar Tank/DPS...because I ALWAYS play on hard mode
#2233 - Never Forget0 -
BurtFreeman✭✭✭TheM0rganism wrote: »BurtFreeman wrote: »reflected to the caster maybe, then we should make immune to all ultimate even a frog.
may be mitigated with another ultimate. i voted no.
I'm sure this was hilarious when you were thinking it over in your head but it doesn't make sense. Please explain or edit this to be comprehensible.
i've just done in the main time. anyway meteor is avaible around the end of gold, when you collect all lore books.
make meteor reflectable take away all the ultimate and the weight of reward it give by exploring all tamriel.
grinding to v16 is not in half to get it, so it's fine to be a very powerfull ability, as mage fury top conquest.Edited by BurtFreeman on February 10, 2016 6:09PM0 -
TheM0rganism✭✭✭BurtFreeman wrote: »TheM0rganism wrote: »BurtFreeman wrote: »reflected to the caster maybe, then we should make immune to all ultimate even a frog.
may be mitigated with another ultimate. i voted no.
I'm sure this was hilarious when you were thinking it over in your head but it doesn't make sense. Please explain or edit this to be comprehensible.
i've just done in the main time. anyway meteor is avaible around the end of gold, when you collect all lore books.
make meteor reflectable take away all the ultimate and the weight of reward it give by exploring all tamriel.
grinding to v16 is not in half to get it, so it's fine to be a very powerfull ability, as mage fury top conquest.
Okay...
Do you think Soul Strike should be interruptable?
Do you you think a simple dodge roll behind the caster should completely avoid a Dawnbreaker?
Do you think the dodge mechanic should apply to ULTs in general?
There should be pros and cons to every ultimate. As of right now, the only thing keeping everyone from running Meteor is PvP is the reflect-ability of it.
And on your point about it taking a lot of PvE exploration to even get that high in Mage's Guild only serves to undermines your point: it is a PvE skill. In PvP, it should have some type of downside.PS4 DC Stamina Templar Tank/DPS...because I ALWAYS play on hard mode
#2233 - Never Forget0 -
BurtFreeman✭✭✭TheM0rganism wrote: »BurtFreeman wrote: »TheM0rganism wrote: »BurtFreeman wrote: »reflected to the caster maybe, then we should make immune to all ultimate even a frog.
may be mitigated with another ultimate. i voted no.
I'm sure this was hilarious when you were thinking it over in your head but it doesn't make sense. Please explain or edit this to be comprehensible.
i've just done in the main time. anyway meteor is avaible around the end of gold, when you collect all lore books.
make meteor reflectable take away all the ultimate and the weight of reward it give by exploring all tamriel.
grinding to v16 is not in half to get it, so it's fine to be a very powerfull ability, as mage fury top conquest.
Okay...
Do you think Soul Strike should be interruptable?
Do you you think a simple dodge roll behind the caster should completely avoid a Dawnbreaker?
Do you think the dodge mechanic should apply to ULTs in general?
There should be pros and cons to every ultimate. As of right now, the only thing keeping everyone from running Meteor is PvP is the reflect-ability of it.
And on your point about it taking a lot of PvE exploration to even get that high in Mage's Guild only serves to undermines your point: it is a PvE skill. In PvP, it should have some type of downside.
i do not pvp anymore, because of lag. thougnt i have one sergent, and i remember at that time the use of negate was popular.
i mean an ultimate need to remain as powerfull as it is, if is attack or defensive one. so any class has the possibilitiy to have both in thei bars.
thake dk for example: with magma shell you become immortal for a while, it give you the possibilitie to do your thing.
you should not stop or reflect an ultimate with a skill, you need a defensive ultimate to do it.0 -
NativeJoe✭✭✭✭✭*maliciously twiddles fingers* yes...yes... keep mentioning Overload "is" reflectable... bring it up to " par" with the other ultimates and make it unreflectable...muahahahahhahaha650cp+ Sorcerer 100+ days /played
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TheM0rganism✭✭✭BurtFreeman wrote: »TheM0rganism wrote: »BurtFreeman wrote: »TheM0rganism wrote: »BurtFreeman wrote: »reflected to the caster maybe, then we should make immune to all ultimate even a frog.
may be mitigated with another ultimate. i voted no.
I'm sure this was hilarious when you were thinking it over in your head but it doesn't make sense. Please explain or edit this to be comprehensible.
i've just done in the main time. anyway meteor is avaible around the end of gold, when you collect all lore books.
make meteor reflectable take away all the ultimate and the weight of reward it give by exploring all tamriel.
grinding to v16 is not in half to get it, so it's fine to be a very powerfull ability, as mage fury top conquest.
Okay...
Do you think Soul Strike should be interruptable?
Do you you think a simple dodge roll behind the caster should completely avoid a Dawnbreaker?
Do you think the dodge mechanic should apply to ULTs in general?
There should be pros and cons to every ultimate. As of right now, the only thing keeping everyone from running Meteor is PvP is the reflect-ability of it.
And on your point about it taking a lot of PvE exploration to even get that high in Mage's Guild only serves to undermines your point: it is a PvE skill. In PvP, it should have some type of downside.
i do not pvp anymore, because of lag. thougnt i have one sergent, and i remember at that time the use of negate was popular.
i mean an ultimate need to remain as powerfull as it is, if is attack or defensive one. so any class has the possibilitiy to have both in thei bars.
thake dk for example: with magma shell you become immortal for a while, it give you the possibilitie to do your thing.
you should not stop or reflect an ultimate with a skill, you need a defensive ultimate to do it.
You are advocating a one-button-win design and that, inherently, is a terrible idea.
[snip] You also mention the use of Negate magic, which is only available to a single class, as a means of actually countering an ultimate. Do you honestly think 75% of the the classes should be completely shafted in this regard? Veil of Blades/Magma Shell/Empowering Sweep are all reactive at best and only good for mitigating the damage.
Finally, you're completely undermining the entire concept of class roles. [snip] Why even bother having tanks? The whole point of this class is to sacrifice damage in order to mitigate/avoid/reflect/withstand damage. Not a single ability in that tree does considerable damage given the stamina costs for each of them. You must clearly only play one class, because you have no concept of what a tank should be doing.
[snip]
[Edited to remove inflammatory comments]Edited by ZOS_CoriJ on February 10, 2016 9:53PMPS4 DC Stamina Templar Tank/DPS...because I ALWAYS play on hard mode
#2233 - Never Forget0 -
BurtFreeman✭✭✭TheM0rganism wrote: »
You are advocating a one-button-win design and that, inherently, is a terrible idea.BurtFreeman wrote: »TheM0rganism wrote: »BurtFreeman wrote: »TheM0rganism wrote: »BurtFreeman wrote: »reflected to the caster maybe, then we should make immune to all ultimate even a frog.
may be mitigated with another ultimate. i voted no.
I'm sure this was hilarious when you were thinking it over in your head but it doesn't make sense. Please explain or edit this to be comprehensible.
i've just done in the main time. anyway meteor is avaible around the end of gold, when you collect all lore books.
make meteor reflectable take away all the ultimate and the weight of reward it give by exploring all tamriel.
grinding to v16 is not in half to get it, so it's fine to be a very powerfull ability, as mage fury top conquest.
Okay...
Do you think Soul Strike should be interruptable?
Do you you think a simple dodge roll behind the caster should completely avoid a Dawnbreaker?
Do you think the dodge mechanic should apply to ULTs in general?
There should be pros and cons to every ultimate. As of right now, the only thing keeping everyone from running Meteor is PvP is the reflect-ability of it.
And on your point about it taking a lot of PvE exploration to even get that high in Mage's Guild only serves to undermines your point: it is a PvE skill. In PvP, it should have some type of downside.
i do not pvp anymore, because of lag. thougnt i have one sergent, and i remember at that time the use of negate was popular.
i mean an ultimate need to remain as powerfull as it is, if is attack or defensive one. so any class has the possibilitiy to have both in thei bars.
thake dk for example: with magma shell you become immortal for a while, it give you the possibilitie to do your thing.
you should not stop or reflect an ultimate with a skill, you need a defensive ultimate to do it.
You also mention the use of Negate magic, which is only available to a single class, as a means of actually countering an ultimate. Do you honestly think 75% of the the classes should be completely shafted in this regard? Veil of Blades/Magma Shell/Empowering Sweep are all reactive at best and only good for mitigating the damage.
Finally, you're completely undermining the entire concept of class roles. Why even bother having tanks? The whole point of this class is to sacrifice damage in order to mitigate/avoid/reflect/withstand damage. Not a single ability in that tree does considerable damage given the stamina costs for each of them. You must clearly only play one class, because you have no concept of what a tank should be doing.
sorry mate if i disturb your audience. i did not realize to be so badly in...formed.
sorry again if i permit myself to speak
[Edited to remove quoted content]Edited by ZOS_CoriJ on February 10, 2016 9:54PM0 -
Huggalump✭✭✭✭RoamingRiverElk wrote: »Johngo0036 wrote: »Johngo0036 wrote: »@Huggalump - "Meteor is already very easy to avoid" - Please name these ways to avoid it
you block...
The majority of the times I use meteor, it does minimal damage because the guy knows to right click when he sees a massive circle around him
Block is not avoiding, it is minimizing the damage.
Most other ultimates can be avoided by dodgerolling but meteor cannot be.. yes other ultimates can also be blocked still doing damage..... however if i dodgeroll at the right time on most other ultimates i can get away with NO damage...Why should meteor be different?
Make meteor dodgerollable with the DOT still around which i would roll out of anyway..
Other ultimates don't give you a giant blue circle around your feet to tell you they are about to hit you.
The fact that it has such a long travel time is part of the issue though, someone can both CC you with fossilize or rune or fear at the right time so that you don't have a chance to block that very hard hitting ultimate, AND you can still combine it with some other hard hitting normal skill, plus, in case of magicka builds, detonation.
Meteor is a *stackable* ultimate, not just one that CCs and does a lot of damage. This, I think, is a crucial aspect of it that often gets overlooked.
When I see that meteor coming my way (and it's not that I always see it - or see it in time - due to whatever technical problems there are with the game), when on my DK I may even use wings twice before it hits, just to try to make it sure that the meteor does get reflected even if I'm CCd despite blocking.
Meteor being reflectable at least allowed it to be countered better. Now everyone will use it because it has no drawbacks and can be used without at least having to see whether the enemy is one who might reflect it.
that's a pretty good point, about it being stackable damage due to the build up time0
