"I'm having a bad time, so you should have a bad time as well..."

Julianos · February 2016

Vildebill wrote: »

Getting really tired of all the complaints after the new patch notes. Especially of the PvP:ers complaining on the decrease of alliance points towards assault and support skill lines. Same goes for the ones complaining about cheap monster set items on the new vendor everyone wanted.

What annoys me the most is that the main argument is "I grinded my ass of for my Kena helmet, it sucked, so your gaming experience should suck too if you want it", or "it took me 3 months to get magica detonation which was hell, it shouldn't take you 2 weeks". I'm having a bad time, so you should have a bad time as well. Don't you hear how you all sound? Selfish and idiotic. It took a while for me as well to get some set items, sometimes it wasn't fun at all, mainly because of RNGsus (I'm an atheist), so why would I want anybody having as bad time as i had? Don't we want the game to be fun? To evolve? To learn from mistakes?

Life will never be fair, but isn't it better if other people can learn from the crap you did? Be humble instead of selfish!

Agreed %100

itscompton · February 2016

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

Vildebill wrote: »

Getting really tired of all the complaints after the new patch notes. Especially of the PvP:ers complaining on the decrease of alliance points towards assault and support skill lines. Same goes for the ones complaining about cheap monster set items on the new vendor everyone wanted.

What annoys me the most is that the main argument is "I grinded my ass of for my Kena helmet, it sucked, so your gaming experience should suck too if you want it", or "it took me 3 months to get magica detonation which was hell, it shouldn't take you 2 weeks". I'm having a bad time, so you should have a bad time as well. Don't you hear how you all sound? Selfish and idiotic. It took a while for me as well to get some set items, sometimes it wasn't fun at all, mainly because of RNGsus (I'm an atheist), so why would I want anybody having as bad time as i had? Don't we want the game to be fun? To evolve? To learn from mistakes?

Life will never be fair, but isn't it better if other people can learn from the crap you did? Be humble instead of selfish!

The thing is when you do grind your ass off and get that item you want it feels like you accomplished something. So why would anyone go through the struggle of doing hard content if they can just wait a couple months and buy the item? It's not about wanting others to suffer look at it like this, imagine you spent all summer working your ass off you finally got enough money saved up and you got a car then the day after you bought it your parents got your brother a car because they didn't want him to feel bad. Sure you are happy your brother has a car of his own but still it is annoying that he is just handed something for nothing.

Your analogy is flawed, the monster sets are likely going to cost upwards of a million AP and nobody's giving us the AP, we're grinding it out, hour after hour, day after day, week after week. We're earning the monsters sets just as much or more than those who do dungeons for them. Sure it might take 3 months of running a dungeon to get them but then again some people get them within the first couple of runs, which equates to just a few hours. I've been Pvping in Azura's NA PS4 and at the pace I've been earning I'll probably finish this contest with around 1.2 million AP but to get that much I've been PvPing for an average of 4-5 hours every day all month . That's putting serious time in and working for what I want. A better analogy is you work for tips I work for salary. I know more reliably how much time I'll have to work to earn my monster set, while you just don't know if you'll get stiffed 30 times in row OR maybe you'll get lucky and your first customer will make you monster set rich.

Khaos_Bane · February 2016

Vildebill wrote: »

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Pretty ignorant post by OP. Not everyone wanted the monster helm vendor, they want a fix to RNG of the sets. Also, PvE players wanted people to complete the content to get the sets. PvP players should have to complete the content to get the reward. As PvP players always say, RISK FOR REWARD for getting the skill lines. Now OP makes untrue ridiculous statements, brilliant !

So OP must be a PvP player? Make it easy for us to get gear acquired in PvE content and stop whining that we get it easily without having to complete content.

Why do you even care how the PvP:ers obtain their sets? Because "PvE players wanted people to complete the content to get the sets. PvP players should have to complete the content to get the reward."? Who are these "PvE Players"? You? Your friends? Your brother?

What is untrue and ridiculous about my "statement"?

I play like 2% PvP of my play time, so your "must" is a wrong one

Because certain gear is acquired by completing certain content and an incentive for people to complete that content. How difficult is this to understand? There is basically little incentive to complete group dungeons to acquire gear. The real fix was having a token system for running dungeons to acquire the exact gear piece you want, like AP in PvP.

People are complaining because ZoS COMPLETELY missed the boat on what the community wants. Then you have people making posts telling others to basically be quiet THEN MAKE A STATEMENT about wanting the game to grow.

So people offer suggestions on how to fix RNG problems in PvE which is trying to evolve the game.

anitajoneb17_ESO · February 2016

Magdalina wrote: »

Tl;dr - less of "I had a bad time so everyone should too", more of "I want my achievements/progression to feel meaningful".

It can't !
First, this is a game with "no end", supposed to be "endless". Let's say starting point is zero and "end" is initially 100, they will have to "push" that "end " (via new content, new caps, new gear, whatever) constantly, to 120, 140, 160, etc... endlessly. It's like climbing a mountain while willingly never wanting to reach the top.
Second, people must play together, thus you can't afford to have people's levels spread out all the way between 0 (start) and infinite (end). Therefore, catch up mechanics, systems changes and caps are implemented to ensure that "progress" is facilitated at the start and slowed at the end, if not entirely wiped.

Look at CPs : the system is entirely made to give you an artificial sense of progression as an incentive to play, but between diminishing returns, catch up mechanics, caps, and now entire zones where they are disabled, they become totally irrelevant and meaningless, because the priority is to put most players on equal ground.

In such a game, "progress" is doomed to be artificial, temporary, meaningless and ultimately nullified. Deal with it or go play a solo or coop game that actually has a beginning and an end, but in an MMO, there cannot be such thing as "progress".

.

Julianos · February 2016

Yesterday pledge was Darkshade for NA i got 2 engine guardian helmet in a row

Zyle · February 2016

Why do people in this thread feel like bringing their own personal life experiences outside of the game reinforces their argument? If anything it does the opposite. Here is a scenario: I've grinded for Kena helm since IC was released. I still have no helm. I have a friend who got a divines drop 3rd attempt on the 2nd day of release. So because I haven't gotten my helm everyone else should suffer including my friend? If anything my friend had to do less to get that helm than someone grinding 200k AP. Not everyone will have the same rng experience, but a bad experience shouldn't result in people feeling entitled.

TL;DR: Get over yourselves.

Faugaun · February 2016

Islyn wrote: »

You know what, I am nearly 34. I literally have had to WORK for every little thing I ever wanted in every aspect of my life. Nothing was ever handed to me, ever.

No award for coming in 4th.

At my kids' school, I saw the Head Teacher (Principal), signing an awfully large stack of maths 'awards.' I jokingly quipped that she oughtta get a rubber stamp - and she said I know right? We have to give one to everyone so they don't feel bad then have a whole SEPARATE invitational assembly for the other actual awards and trophies.

WTF now? In the everyone gets one assembly is the one where the little plays, and songs and stuff are done - the whole class stuff. Now I need to hit 6 ASSEMBLIES????????? (I have twin 9 year olds, and an 8 year old, they all get extra awards so we get the invites and the boys are in separate classes - that's 6 (!!) mornings over 2 weeks I have to be sat in the car for 40ish mins from when they go in to school to when the thing starts, then sit in the smelly lunch hall for another 30+ minutes.

All because 'everyone deserves an award for existing.

I think it has gone this way for many people and most people just grow up feeling entitled. So they expect everything to be handed to them because everything already is.

I would love to see demographics of this game and how many people are living off their parents and fobbing off school and work to game, etc. These people are basically taking their free ride mentality into the game as well, and frankly, they're not doing themselves, the World, or the game any favours.

I would love to see how the freeloaders line up with the complainers and if they're the same people. We'll never ever know so speculation is pointless - but the entitlement in the posts sure makes it appear that way.

However, it should not be a second JOB to just gear up and be competitive but it is, because That is the Nature of Competition.

Why should anyone get to be COMPETITIVE without COMPETING?

They shouldn't.

It's a game, something you do in your spare time, so it shouldn't be a slog. An Odyssey maybe, but a slog no.

However, rewards from achievements/clearing content should not just be handed out for free either.

There has to be some kind of a middle ground, which makes gameplay actually REWARDING but not like a second job but that doesn't make people who have more drive and flair for this sort of thing feel like there's no point in bothering, either.

I don't know - but something has to change because this way is just getting worse and worse.

Here's you a demographic. 32 year old male, three college degrees (A.S., B.S., M.S.), 3x kids (9,6,2),wife (works 1 day a week to care for the kids), I work 40-60 hours a week at $15 an hour to support my family and have worked since I was 15 .... Yeah I'm technically in the millennial category...yeah I think the grind should be removed, yeah I've worked hard to get what I have and frankly it's a shame that i cannot find a higher paying job because of older generations view of millennial workers.

We play a game for fun not to "work for it" in my view the person who plays 3 hours a week should be competitive (statswise) with the person who plays 40 hours a week. Guess what, people will still have to work to be top pvper or top trials players even with all that gear and the guy who plays more will have an edge....it's not Iike if we give people stuff suddenly there will be no challenge...its that the challenge shifts from against a RNG (boring) to against people (exciting and unpredictable).

Vildebill · February 2016

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Vildebill wrote: »

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Pretty ignorant post by OP. Not everyone wanted the monster helm vendor, they want a fix to RNG of the sets. Also, PvE players wanted people to complete the content to get the sets. PvP players should have to complete the content to get the reward. As PvP players always say, RISK FOR REWARD for getting the skill lines. Now OP makes untrue ridiculous statements, brilliant !

So OP must be a PvP player? Make it easy for us to get gear acquired in PvE content and stop whining that we get it easily without having to complete content.

Why do you even care how the PvP:ers obtain their sets? Because "PvE players wanted people to complete the content to get the sets. PvP players should have to complete the content to get the reward."? Who are these "PvE Players"? You? Your friends? Your brother?

What is untrue and ridiculous about my "statement"?

I play like 2% PvP of my play time, so your "must" is a wrong one

Because certain gear is acquired by completing certain content and an incentive for people to complete that content. How difficult is this to understand? There is basically little incentive to complete group dungeons to acquire gear. The real fix was having a token system for running dungeons to acquire the exact gear piece you want, like AP in PvP.

People are complaining because ZoS COMPLETELY missed the boat on what the community wants. Then you have people making posts telling others to basically be quiet THEN MAKE A STATEMENT about wanting the game to grow.

So people offer suggestions on how to fix RNG problems in PvE which is trying to evolve the game.

I agree on the token system, and that ZOS missed out on the RNG complaints. But my thread wasn't about that at all, it was about all the complaints that it's "unfair" and "we had a bad time getting things and everyone should have the same bad time". It seems like you missed my point

Aquanova · February 2016

Vildebill wrote: »

Getting really tired of all the complaints after the new patch notes. Especially of the PvP:ers complaining on the decrease of alliance points towards assault and support skill lines. Same goes for the ones complaining about cheap monster set items on the new vendor everyone wanted.

What annoys me the most is that the main argument is "I grinded my ass of for my Kena helmet, it sucked, so your gaming experience should suck too if you want it", or "it took me 3 months to get magica detonation which was hell, it shouldn't take you 2 weeks". I'm having a bad time, so you should have a bad time as well. Don't you hear how you all sound? Selfish and idiotic. It took a while for me as well to get some set items, sometimes it wasn't fun at all, mainly because of RNGsus (I'm an atheist), so why would I want anybody having as bad time as i had? Don't we want the game to be fun? To evolve? To learn from mistakes?

Life will never be fair, but isn't it better if other people can learn from the crap you did? Be humble instead of selfish!

AMEN!.......PREACH BABY PREACH

Elsonso · February 2016

Vildebill wrote: »

Getting really tired of all the complaints after the new patch notes. Especially of the PvP:ers complaining on the decrease of alliance points towards assault and support skill lines. Same goes for the ones complaining about cheap monster set items on the new vendor everyone wanted.

What annoys me the most is that the main argument is "I grinded my ass of for my Kena helmet, it sucked, so your gaming experience should suck too if you want it", or "it took me 3 months to get magica detonation which was hell, it shouldn't take you 2 weeks". I'm having a bad time, so you should have a bad time as well. Don't you hear how you all sound? Selfish and idiotic. It took a while for me as well to get some set items, sometimes it wasn't fun at all, mainly because of RNGsus (I'm an atheist), so why would I want anybody having as bad time as i had? Don't we want the game to be fun? To evolve? To learn from mistakes?

Life will never be fair, but isn't it better if other people can learn from the crap you did? Be humble instead of selfish!

Don't confuse the sentiment that you express above, which probably does exist, with the idea that certain things should be difficult to come by in the game and that by making things easy, they make the game too easy.

I do not have the Kena helmet, but I can see the need for it to be difficult to get and require time and effort to get it. I don't have any of those things you list, so I definitely do not fall into your pattern. I hope that when ZOS makes it easier to get these things, they make it sufficiently hard to get so that, when I do get around to getting those things, I don't feel like I am wasting my time.

Edit: My reply was in a tab in the corner... quite a bit changed in the thread after I wrote this and before I pressed send... time to go read it all.

Yusuf · February 2016

It's just like, "hey, i just want it to be harder for newer players to catch up to me, so they should play the game for a year before they can match me".

The Playerbase, or rather Forum-Base (players hardcore enough to even bother visit the forums are a minority anyways) should realize that there will always be new players checking out the game and that the "old hats" will always be dropping the game one by one.

Making it harder for new players to catch up is most stupid thing zenimax could do, and yes i know how long it took to get to combat frenzy and yes i know how long it took to get that molag kena helm.

If ZOS listened to those people there wouldn't be a game for those people to complain about anymore real soon.

daemonios · February 2016

Islyn wrote: »

However, rewards from achievements/clearing content should not just be handed out for free either.

There has to be some kind of a middle ground, which makes gameplay actually REWARDING but not like a second job but that doesn't make people who have more drive and flair for this sort of thing feel like there's no point in bothering, either.

Only quoted this post partly because it's rather long, but I have to say I wholeheartedly agree with @Islyn.

I don't want people to suffer because I've suffered. But there's a point where things are apparently being given away even if you don't play the game. A few examples:

- Monster difficulty: the Mages and Fighters Guild baddies at the end of the first quest (Doshia the Harvester and Whatshisface the Clannfear) were epic. Very very hard at low level, especially with few skills and passives unlocked, but still doable. Nowadays you just need to look at them funny and they croak. There is no fun to be had anymore, at all. Same goes for some of the encounters in the main quest (like the doppelgangers or Mannimarco) and all of the Silver/Gold zones, where you used to have to think twice before engaging a 3-enemy group.

- Level progression: due to very loud crying by some players, not only was the XP required to reach VR16 greatly reduced, but vet levels are actually going away. And since champion points are account-wide, players will be able to make new top-level toons in a matter of hours if they know how to grind. The problem here is that it affects everyone's progression, not just the grinders. It took me about 9 months to reach VR12, which was then the cap, and I felt damn proud (well, about as proud as you can feel for a game). My last VR16 toon took me maybe a month, with no grinding.

- Monster set vendor: I've said it before and I'll say it again - this is the worst possible solution to a very real problem with the drop rates and RNG in ESO. Nothing changes for the dozens of OTHER dropped, bound-on-pickup sets in the game. I've run vWGT and vICP maybe a hundred times each and still don't have all the pieces I want from the sets there.

In short, what I mean is that giving stuff away for free or for very little effort only reinforced a sense of entitlement and ultimately destroys any sense of accomplishment which for me is part of playing a game. I would MUCH rather see sensible changes to eliminate actual issues than stuff being given away because ZOS can't be bothered to find a balance between effort and reward.

Faugaun · February 2016

Turelus wrote: »

There are some good posts as well, at least regarding the Alliance War skill line costs. 90% reduction is a hell of a lot, a 50% would have been pretty big but more acceptable.

We're not annoyed that we worked hard to earn it, we're concerned at just how absurdly easy it is now, it's a single night or week of PvP to get all the skills. Whilst other skill line still require a substantial commitment to get.

Like werewolf? Or vampire? Both of those are 1 day activities....

Waseem wrote: »

the people "mad" about the new AP gain toward assault/support skill lines are those who putted hours and hours into running clicking 1 button and destroying the server by mindless zerging to reach rank 50 "ASAP"
people who do PvP to enjoy arent/as much mad as those, many dont care actually ^^
we all know it, we all knew it. if your PvP rank is 24 or 50 there is absolutely nothing to make you more skilled player.
***************************************************************
QQ about those selling kill rank 50 player achievement for 100k QQ

I pvp for fun and I approve of the reduced as....6 toons to caltrops is a slog at the old rate and the new rate will make it much less so...especially after 6 toons to vr16 ....another slog....can't wait till br removed

vyrusb23 · February 2016

Vildebill wrote: »

I'm having a bad time, so you should have a bad time as well. Don't you hear how you all sound? Selfish and idiotic.!

It was like that before the PTS. The latest patch to the PTS just brings out all of the publord poasters.

Faugaun · February 2016

Farorin wrote: »

Vildebill wrote: »

Getting really tired of all the complaints after the new patch notes. Especially of the PvP:ers complaining on the decrease of alliance points towards assault and support skill lines. Same goes for the ones complaining about cheap monster set items on the new vendor everyone wanted.

What annoys me the most is that the main argument is "I grinded my ass of for my Kena helmet, it sucked, so your gaming experience should suck too if you want it", or "it took me 3 months to get magica detonation which was hell, it shouldn't take you 2 weeks". I'm having a bad time, so you should have a bad time as well. Don't you hear how you all sound? Selfish and idiotic. It took a while for me as well to get some set items, sometimes it wasn't fun at all, mainly because of RNGsus (I'm an atheist), so why would I want anybody having as bad time as i had? Don't we want the game to be fun? To evolve? To learn from mistakes?

Life will never be fair, but isn't it better if other people can learn from the crap you did? Be humble instead of selfish!

HA! Found the atheist!

Sorry, I couldn't help myself. I get that all the time because I am like a reverse Bosmer IRL and I wanted to see how it felt to do it to someone else.

That being said. I totally agree with your post OP.

I am a PVPer and PVEer and it has taken me ages to get the skills and equipment I need. Making it easier to get just means it won't take away as much of my life away when I decide to get them again on an alt, so I don't see why everyone is crying and complaining all the time. Isn't it a good thing that we don't have to grind our lives away, and we can actually, you know, play the damn game? Grindyness sucks.

You missed the agnostic though!

Yeah....those of us with 8 alts we don't bother with that rare crap....try getting 250 sp on 8 toons...when it comes to monster helms for all those toons..fugetaboudtit

DRXHarbinger · February 2016

Bossdonut wrote: »

Artjuh90 wrote: »

@bossdonut i agree with you but there is no need for insults

There is always a need for insults.

Lol please tell me you're on Xbox. We would make awesome friends. So much truth in your posts.

ADarklore · February 2016

Reading through these posts and it becomes quite clear... players only care about what THEY want to experience in the game and they tend to think that, "because they like playing this certain way, the majority of other players do too"... which is clearly not true. Just because YOU want to grind for things and it makes YOU 'feel like you accomplished something' doesn't mean that everyone else receives that sense of accomplishment doing the same thing. Some players feel a sense of accomplishment by being able to buy something, or being able to pursue the easiest way to achievement, while others seem to relish in struggle and strife in order to receive that same sense of accomplishment. Hence the reason there should be numerous ways to achieve a goal instead of assuming that the majority of players want to endure struggle and strife.

Islyn · February 2016

Gutsripper. OMG. xD Wiped sooo many times on early access and Doshia ... When I started lvling an alt I remember feeling scared of that fight thinking I'd need to over level by at least 5...tried it on a whim at level and then I sneezed and the fight was over.

Nothing will bring me back to those days of 'lol doshia....yeah try that in like 10 more levels hunny' or how excited I was when I got her down....woo! take THAT you expletive expletive! That didn't feel very good, did it!!!

2nd time posts in guild, what the hell happened to doshia??

rfennell_ESO · February 2016

Vildebill wrote: »

Life will never be fair, but isn't it better if other people can learn from the crap you did? Be humble instead of selfish!

It's just how it is. People always want their accomplishments to not be diminished.

I'm not saying I agree or disagree with it, just saying that's human nature.

ADarklore · February 2016

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

It's just how it is. People always want their accomplishments to not be diminished.

I'm not saying I agree or disagree with it, just saying that's human nature.

But an accomplishment is an accomplishment WHEN it is achieved, not weeks, months or years later. Look at the real world, things change and the bar is constantly being adjusted for everything. When I graduated high school, we didn't have all these requirements that kids do today, should they be angry because they have to do more? Also, it isn't "human nature", it is a CHOICE to let something both you or not, it is also a CHOICE to not have any empathy in trying to see other sides to an issue instead of only focusing on yourself. People love to throw out, "it's human nature" as an excuse, when in reality, it isn't. There is no such thing as human nature, because everything we do, as individuals, is a CHOICE... hence the reason humans have free-will, while animals are the ones prone to their instincts.

Anhedonie · February 2016

PVErs get all ava abilities for free
PVPrs get all monster hats for free
Templars got rekt

Oh, these forums never change.

rfennell_ESO · February 2016

ADarklore wrote: »

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

It's just how it is. People always want their accomplishments to not be diminished.

I'm not saying I agree or disagree with it, just saying that's human nature.

But an accomplishment is an accomplishment WHEN it is achieved, not weeks, months or years later. Look at the real world, things change and the bar is constantly being adjusted for everything. When I graduated high school, we didn't have all these requirements that kids do today, should they be angry because they have to do more? Also, it isn't "human nature", it is a CHOICE to let something both you or not, it is also a CHOICE to not have any empathy in trying to see other sides to an issue instead of only focusing on yourself. People love to throw out, "it's human nature" as an excuse, when in reality, it isn't. There is no such thing as human nature, because everything we do, as individuals, is a CHOICE... hence the reason humans have free-will, while animals are the ones prone to their instincts.

Haha you think humans aren't really animals that adhere to their instincts?

I don't agree with the idea that things shouldn't be made easier to get because someone worked hard to get them. I think they should make all the monster sets purchasable with AP. Of course there is little to no way I'm setting foot in a dungeon and I have millions of AP sitting around waiting to spend it.

I do get why trivializing something that someone had to work hard for will *** someone off though.

I think human nature is "what's best for me" and the further you try to explain it from being so, the further you get from what's true about people. In this case exclusivity is best for some...

rfennell_ESO · February 2016

I think the argument that needs to be made is that exclusivity for a limited duration ought be enough.

SneaK · February 2016

I mainly PvP, and I cannot understand how any PvP'er would be mad at the change in the alliance skill line's XP. I hate grinding AP for det or vigor, why would this be a bad change??? Makes no sense.

vamp_emily · February 2016

AMEN!.......PREACH BABY PREACH

More like:

Breathe in... Breathe out.. Breathe in.. Breathe out. It will be ok.

Honestly i totally disagree with the OP. My time is valuable, and when they make changes to the game and begin making it easier for players to achieve something or buy things for gold/ap; I feel items in the game and my time have been devalued.

I've never felt "Forced" to do something in this game. Everything I do I enjoy it and I don't have a bad time unlike the op. I might not have the best gear, highest ranking, or any gold in the bank. But that is ok, I am still having fun.

But really i can careless any more about any upcoming changes in this game. I just hope the day I decide to move to a new MMO that people like the OP don't follow me. Just stay here, and eventually you will be able to buy what you want and no more crying about earning it/doing the time.

Artjuh90 · February 2016

main problem i have with the vendor is quite easy, People who still get the content where they were rewarded still have the same *** RNG to worry about while PvP get's a shortcut. increase the RNG and you wont hear me. it's as simple as that. and i call that fair.

WalkingLegacy · February 2016

Beating your head against the RNG wall is not fun. Replaying the same static content for the 100th time is not fun either.

Buying my upgrade with gold is not fun nor rewarding.

If I PvP I want access to to the top gear too, no matter how bad the loot system is on PvE side. But making a vendor to sell it wasn't the solution either. Another bandaid fox by inexperienced MMO developers.

Like there isn't many other successful MMOs to get ideas from...

Asherons_Call · February 2016

i just started PVP about a month ago and already have magicka detonation, it's not that hard to get if you know how to make AP. I for one am not upset about it taking less AP to level up

yodased · February 2016

vamp_emily wrote: »

I've never felt "Forced" to do something in this game. Everything I do I enjoy it and I don't have a bad time unlike the op. I might not have the best gear, highest ranking, or any gold in the bank. But that is ok, I am still having fun.

But really i can careless any more about any upcoming changes in this game. I just hope the day I decide to move to a new MMO that people like the OP don't follow me. Just stay here, and eventually you will be able to buy what you want and no more crying about earning it/doing the time.

This confuses me, as you state that you deserve to be emperor because reasons, yet berate someone for voicing an opinion that is similar.

Lysette · February 2016

Vildebill wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

Well there is a bit more to that than "I'm having a bad time so everyone should too".

First, yes RNG system is atrocious, but we've been talking again and again and again about introducing tokens for dungeons which'd allow us to buy pieces we want with 100% guarantee AND give us incentive to run dungeons at the same time(except then we could be sure we wouldn't be left with nothing after 300 runs). This vendor is a bandaid, it does solve the RNG issue somewhat(doesn't solve it for sets like Spellpower Cure, if we aren't going with tokens, then please add a vendor for those too because I'm tired of getting anything BUT the pieces I need in WGT) but it 100% removes the incentive to run dungeons. The whole Undaunted pledges system is pretty much useless with prices like that, why on Earth would you run hundreds of pledges for a chance of a random set random weight random trait shoulder when you can easily buy one? Same for helmets.

Second, yes people are/will be upset because someone gets things they had to "work" for pretty much handed out for them. And this is a natural reaction. Same type of natural reaction we had when they raised level cap again and after promising us our xp would get tracked it didn't and we had to go grind again. Same type of reaction we had when they upped Undaunted skilltree from 5 to 10 giving it great passives and screwing those of us regularily running dungeons over because people who'd done 0 dungeons leveled up to Undaunted 9 in a day by doing all dungeon achievements while people like me had to slowly grind as we had no achievements left and our experience for past achievements obviously didn't get backtracked. I could go on. Should we be happy others get it easier than we do? Maybe. But in the end you just kinda start feeling discouraged when instead of feeling rewarded for playing the game and achieving something in it you kinda feel punished. It's just a game yes. But we put time in it and we like feeling rewarded, feeling like we achieve something others didn't/couldn't. We don't like feeling like we'd generally be better off game progression-wise if we started playing later and played less, that just feels unfair.

Tl;dr - less of "I had a bad time so everyone should too", more of "I want my achievements/progression to feel meaningful".

We'll have to see how it works I guess but I'm not sure I'm too fond of this idea/prices.

Of course it's bad for you in the Undaunted skill line example, it's utterly idiotic that you don't get the achievement exp retroactive. Still, the change made it easier for new players to get the undaunted skill line passives. So the change was made for the better but badly implemented for the ones that already did the grind.

In the monster helmet case, the players who grinded for the helmets won't lose anything. There was just a change made so the ones that didn't have it will get it easier. And there goes the "I had a bad time so everyone should too".

Maybe someone who feels envy, is unable to see it that way and with it unable to feel happy for someone else. I think you explained it really well, just like Magdalina explained herself really well.

Maybe it can be explained with the "master angler" title. I respect that title, because this person showed persistence in an effort to achieve it and is not giving up easily. This is actually what I respect, this person's ability to push through it, it is not the title itself and if that title is later given to others for free, does not change my opinion about that person who really had to put in the effort. Maybe an envy person feels devalued by that others get it easier than him/her. And here is the flaw of this feeling, because it does not devalue the person at all, because the fact is not changing.

And maybe there is a second problem with this feeling of envy, the need for confirmation from the outside by a "title" which others don't have. To me a title is nice, but I would feel not different if there would be none. I know what I have achieved and and might feel pride. So the reward is actually coming from my inside and makes me feel good. While I now guess, that an envy person lacks this confirmation from the inside and depends on it given from the outside - a reward from someone else, to confirm it. And when this is made less "exclusive" it feels bad - at least that is what I think that envy is like and I see a pattern here. Because if my confirmation comes from the inside, and I know what I have done and do not need others to confirm it to feel accomplished, then I am free and able to be happy for others who have it easier than me. Because nothing is taken from me just because they have it easier.