I feel like ESO classes are really balanced.

Anilahation · January 2016

If you guys want to balance Nightblade stealth then rework Magelight.

Magelight morph, invisibility doesn't work at 11 range radius.

Now make templar cleanse have a purge morph that can remove buffs to help push them into meta to counter magelights.

literally imagine how powerful templars would be if they could cleanse off Buffs( of course it would be one buff per cast)

Alorier · January 2016

A Templar in PvP is like a lone Gazelle just waiting to be picked off by the pack of nightblades

Anilahation · January 2016

Also someone asked what I play, I play Mage/healer DK and Stamina Templar.

Flameheart · January 2016

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Especially for a game that doesn't really homogenize the classes.

you can disagree but the fact is no MMO has 100% class balance unless they are incredibly homogenized.

So I feel like ZOS is balancing the classes pretty well.

Wow, somebody just said it.

Cinbri · January 2016

How templar can be unbalanced in pvp? C'mon all you need and all you can do is just press BoL button, perfect balance.

Lenikus · January 2016

Classes being able to overpower one another doesn't imply Imbalance. The classes are meant to be different, I'm a stamina Nightblade, i can gank people easily and burst down newbz with light armor fairly easily, i then proceed to teabag or /pushup them a bit, for the lulz, of course, But I still suffer whenever i meet a magicka sorc up front, and if i can't take down any templar or DK in the first few seconds, i always lose the fight or have to run.

Nightblades do what they are meant to do. Burst down newbz. If you have more than 25k health, or decent armor / buffs / shields up, you have everything you need to either kill, or scare off any nightblades that you see coming your way.

Just like Magicka DKs, everyone says they are bad, they need a buff, and stuff. They kinda do, Green Dragon Blood sux. But try to kill a Magicka DK with a Magicka Sorcerer. You simply can't. the DK will flap his wings to victory and burn down the Sorc eventually.

Balance implies a rock , paper, scissors game. not a "Everyone is equal" system.

Anilahation · January 2016

Lenikus wrote: »

Classes being able to overpower one another doesn't imply Imbalance. The classes are meant to be different, I'm a stamina Nightblade, i can gank people easily and burst down newbz with light armor fairly easily, i then proceed to teabag or /pushup them a bit, for the lulz, of course, But I still suffer whenever i meet a magicka sorc up front, and if i can't take down any templar or DK in the first few seconds, i always lose the fight or have to run.

Nightblades do what they are meant to do. Burst down newbz. If you have more than 25k health, or decent armor / buffs / shields up, you have everything you need to either kill, or scare off any nightblades that you see coming your way.

Just like Magicka DKs, everyone says they are bad, they need a buff, and stuff. They kinda do, Green Dragon Blood sux. But try to kill a Magicka DK with a Magicka Sorcerer. You simply can't. the DK will flap his wings to victory and burn down the Sorc eventually.

Balance implies a rock , paper, scissors game. not a "Everyone is equal" system.

I love fighting others

Lenikus wrote: »

Classes being able to overpower one another doesn't imply Imbalance. The classes are meant to be different, I'm a stamina Nightblade, i can gank people easily and burst down newbz with light armor fairly easily, i then proceed to teabag or /pushup them a bit, for the lulz, of course, But I still suffer whenever i meet a magicka sorc up front, and if i can't take down any templar or DK in the first few seconds, i always lose the fight or have to run.

Nightblades do what they are meant to do. Burst down newbz. If you have more than 25k health, or decent armor / buffs / shields up, you have everything you need to either kill, or scare off any nightblades that you see coming your way.

Just like Magicka DKs, everyone says they are bad, they need a buff, and stuff. They kinda do, Green Dragon Blood sux. But try to kill a Magicka DK with a Magicka Sorcerer. You simply can't. the DK will flap his wings to victory and burn down the Sorc eventually.

Balance implies a rock , paper, scissors game. not a "Everyone is equal" system.

Pretty much,in mobas X champion counters Y but Y loses to Z that X beats.

that's balance, while allowing choices to be different.

If you want everyone equal go play chess or Pong.

Cernow · January 2016

Lenikus wrote: »

Balance implies a rock , paper, scissors game. not a "Everyone is equal" system.

This is one way to balance PvP, it's not the only way. It is probably the easiest way, hence why it's so prevalent.

The problem is that rock, paper, scissors only really works for group PvP. For obvious reasons, it is much less effective for balancing 1v1. If you're paper and keep running into scissors 1v1 you're going to get very frustrated. Players like to feel they have a chance in 1v1, that if they play well they can win. Rock, paper scissors negates that, it just leaves you feeling frustrated that there was little you could do to change the outcome, you were beaten by the game design not the player.

What needs to happen is for all classes to have a range of abilities suited to both group and solo play and a range of viable abilities that help with burst, sustain, survivability, escape etc. There's only a very limited number of skills that can be slotted, no-one can have it all in their loadout so choices still need to be made. If those choices make you paper and you run into scissors, so be it, that's your loadout. But what it shouldn't be is for rock, paper or scissors to be hard-coded into the DNA of your class.

Lenikus · January 2016

Cernow wrote: »

Lenikus wrote: »

Balance implies a rock , paper, scissors game. not a "Everyone is equal" system.

...is much less effective for balancing 1v1...

Why you bringing 1v1 to a game where the PvP only happen in the open world scenario?

Cernow · January 2016

Lenikus wrote: »

Cernow wrote: »

Lenikus wrote: »

Balance implies a rock , paper, scissors game. not a "Everyone is equal" system.

...is much less effective for balancing 1v1...

Why you bringing 1v1 to a game where the PvP only happen in the open world scenario?

Because 1v1 is as relevant as group v group. All players, whether they favour solo or group play, will end up in a 1v1 situation quite frequently. Perhaps in IC or a Cyrodiil delve, perhaps split from their group in Cyrodiil, perhaps trying to catch up with the zerg, perhaps trying to get across Cyrodiil to an objective, perhaps scouting for their group,. perhaps because they went out seeking 1v1 duels in a quiet corner of the map, and so on.

But anyway, with the balance mess the Champion system has created, it's pointless worrying too much about balancing classes at this point. The classes could be perfectly balanced but a player with capped CPs is usually going to trump a player with 100x or 200x CPs anyway. Why worry about balancing 1v1 when some players can fight 1vGroup. Thus is the futility of trying to balance MMO PvP, players always want the crutch of beating someone else because of better gear, better stats they've ground out or because they chose a FOTM class or build. Then they come to the forums and tell everyone its a L2P issue

Cillion3117 · January 2016

I've killed every class and been killed by every class. Player skill goes a long way.

Volkodav · January 2016

Mojmir wrote: »

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Especially for a game that doesn't really homogenize the classes.

you can disagree but the fact is no MMO has 100% class balance unless they are incredibly homogenized.

So I feel like ZOS is balancing the classes pretty well.

I suddenly want a glass of milk

With macadamia nut cookies.

s7732425ub17_ESO · January 2016

I'm actually quite impressed with the current state of balance. Every class can do every role. There are viable stamina builds for all classes. There are actually tradeoffs between using one class over another. There are also pretty decent counters to certain classes, but not so where only a few skills are needed to make a god character.

BalticBlues · January 2016

Lenikus wrote: »

Nightblades do what they are meant to do. Burst down newbz.

I doubt that any class is meant to "burst down newbz".
No game can last without "newbz" to refresh the game with new players.
If ZOS wants to give new players a bad time in PvP, god mode NBs indeed are the ultimate way.

I55UE5 · January 2016

I don't think NBs need nerfed, rather other classes buffed or fixed. Other classes need the escape/defense night blades have as well as their learning curve.

As it stands, if a new player asked me what class to play for first character, I would say NB. This is because the escapes and learning curve, especially in PvP scenarios.

If you make a mistake, cloak provides breathing room, allowing the player to analyze the fight and if they can possibly win. The class also has very clear CC and combos I believe.

I would say that a new player would learn how to pick winning fights faster with this class. New players would also learn to recognize CC immunity and CC/burst timing with the much more clear kit NB has.

IcyDeadPeople · January 2016

I55UE5 wrote: »

I don't think NBs need nerfed, rather other classes buffed or fixed. Other classes need the escape/defense night blades have as well as their learning curve.

As it stands, if a new player asked me what class to play for first character, I would say NB. This is because the escapes and learning curve, especially in PvP scenarios.

If you make a mistake, cloak provides breathing room, allowing the player to analyze the fight and if they can possibly win. The class also has very clear CC and combos I believe.

I would say that a new player would learn how to pick winning fights faster with this class. New players would also learn to recognize CC immunity and CC/burst timing with the much more clear kit NB has.

I recall playing on DC in Hopesfire at launch, it seemed everyone in my alliance had rolled nightblades, while vampire DKs were most popular on EP. It was brutal.

Forestd16b14_ESO · January 2016

Yes the classes should be different and do different things but not one class should be able to do everything (Night Blades).

Sorcerers are magical DPS and or healers.
Templars healers and or tanks.
Dragon Knights stamina DPS and or tanks.
Night Blades magical/stamina DPS, healers, tanks all in 1.

Night Blades are supposed to be magical/stamina DPS not everything giving them god mod active.

Browiseth · January 2016

lemme just google what homogenized means...

...nope, still don't get it

cazlonb16_ESO · January 2016

There is only one absurdly overpowered combo: Argonian Templars. Fortunately ZOS know this and will continue to nerf them in every major patch.

Thelon · January 2016

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

I feel like ZOS is balancing the classes pretty well.

threefarms · January 2016

I feel like you need to shut up.

Ffastyl · January 2016

Alcast wrote: »

Which class do you want to play?

NB?
NB?
NB?
NB?

Nightblades are the most versatile class right now. That also makes them the most powerful. Through nerfs, bugs and bad design, Dragonknight and Templar are being shoehorned into their archetypical roles. Sorcerers have always been pigeonholed but relatively recent changes to the class have made non-magical builds feasible.

...The thing that saddens me is how much the forum population wants to shoehorn Nightblades as well, forcing all the classes into crippled states capable of only an archetype. I pray to the Eight the Devs do not appease the masses.

SemiD4rkness · January 2016

I feel like you play a Nightblade.

Forestd16b14_ESO · January 2016

Ffastyl wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Which class do you want to play?

NB?
NB?
NB?
NB?

Nightblades are the most versatile class right now. That also makes them the most powerful. Through nerfs, bugs and bad design, Dragonknight and Templar are being shoehorned into their archetypical roles. Sorcerers have always been pigeonholed but relatively recent changes to the class have made non-magical builds feasible.

...The thing that saddens me is how much the forum population wants to shoehorn Nightblades as well, forcing all the classes into crippled states capable of only an archetype. I pray to the Eight the Devs do not appease the masses.

Yes to dragon knights and templars getting buffed but night blades still need nerfed. There is no arguing about it even if DKs and Templars get buffed the DPS NB can dish out along with damage shields and rolling being as OP as they are now the NB class will still be the best and only class to play.

Infinite12 · January 2016

Sausage wrote: »

Balanced PVP wasnt never the plan, ESO is mass/zerg kind of game, but some players are just persistent.

"Wasn't never the plan"? So it WAS the plan?

CP5 · January 2016

Ffastyl wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Which class do you want to play?

NB?
NB?
NB?
NB?

Nightblades are the most versatile class right now. That also makes them the most powerful. Through nerfs, bugs and bad design, Dragonknight and Templar are being shoehorned into their archetypical roles. Sorcerers have always been pigeonholed but relatively recent changes to the class have made non-magical builds feasible.

...The thing that saddens me is how much the forum population wants to shoehorn Nightblades as well, forcing all the classes into crippled states capable of only an archetype. I pray to the Eight the Devs do not appease the masses.

After the past several major patches most of the community probably wants to see the cycle of nerfing take its full turn since they are the class that has gone relatively unharmed by the nerf hammer. Sadly we will likely never see decent balance in this game if ZOS intends to leave the game stagnant for half a year between balance passes, and in all of that time people get tired of waiting. ZOS's continued silence between these patches doesn't help much either.