Wrecking Blow - again!

Tdroid · January 2016

Can WB be problematic at time? No doubt. Hard skill to balance though. Let's briefly look at a couple reasons why:

- Make it interruptable by bashing: Skill is automatically worthless most of the time, since it is already inside bashing range when used. A counter balance to think again would necessitate either making it uninteruptable by soft-CC(which is what they did) or give it a proc chance like Crystal Frags, which I think would make things worse.

- Neft damage: That would kill stamina Sorcerer and Dragonknight more or less outright, being the only reliable burst damage those classes have for stamina. To make this problem even worse, 2-handed has one of the two reliable heals for stamina in the game through Rally, making a nerf to 2-handed burst damage a double nerf to stamina.The other heal being the Alliance Assualt skill line's Vigor.

I see only 2 options that strike me as useful: Either redo the CC effect in some way, or give all classes reliable Preferably a combination of the 2.

Also, side thing, but bringing back soft-caps could also balance things a bit, to keep the WB along with all other skills from being able to reach such insane damage spikes.

FENGRUSH · January 2016

Stigant wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Of course, ^ magicka is clearly OP with its massive amount of CC breaks and roll dodges, not to mention divided CPs and lack of spams. Clearly WB is sub par to such magnificence, magicka det is too good with it's blockable damage and 4 second timer. Not to mention frags and it's easy ability to maximize the CC immunity bug...

Clearly L2P...

I guess by that logic a stam sorc would pummel a magicka sorc with his WB, right?

If you have a more well rounded hand on balance, youd know an equally skilled magicka sorc is never going to run out of stam fighting a stam sorc and hes going to drop more damage on him than he can heal. Ultimately, he will win pretty much every fight. Thats the reality of the situation. Try blocking a curse/det/frag/dawnbreaker combo on a stam sorc - or better yet, try roll dodging it. Good luck either way.

That is really the issue you have in these threads. Your sig says youre a high elf sorc, so well presume youre a magicka sorc in here if youre complaining about WB - yet you should never lose to someone hammering WB if youre on the same skill level all else equal... maybe a well played dueling DK? Theres less than 5 I know of that could do that in the game. And yet here they are, jumping on a bandwagon - rather than engaging in a discussion about it.

While I tend to agree with you on almost every other topic, I have to say, you are not quite right about WB spam being not so hard to deal with ... see, you play exclusively (and proudly) stam-sorc which has the best toolset to deal with WB spam, while also can utilize the skill to its best potential ... you ve got Streak, Major Expedition almost full in-combat time on .. WB spam is not so hard to deal with for you ... try to delete one of your "slave characters" and lvl up and play Stamplar or Magicka DK .. then come back and tell us again

Ive played with a healing temp, also fought with a healing templar for awhile seeing how long they could last. With an appropriate build on full defense, I couldnt get through without going WW - reliably at least. Took a couple minutes each time.

Im not saying its easy, Im just saying Id rather deal with WB than be pounded with spambush and feared inbetween, especially if Im trying to block heal with a templar or a lot of other classes really.

Gilvoth · January 2016

Tdroid wrote: »

- Neft damage: That would kill stamina Sorcerer and Dragonknight more or less outright, being the only reliable burst damage those classes have for stamina.

there is not suppose to be a stamina sorcerer, lets just listen to it being said outloud ...

"stamina sorcerer"

it doesnt even sound realistic. its rediculas. the total ability for sorcerers is suppose to be "magicka" not stamina.

secondly, dragonights are not suppose to be "damage dealers" thier "a tank" not suppose to go around killing, thier purpose is to "tank" thier not suppose to issue out "burst damage" as you put it.

Stigant · January 2016

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

Tdroid wrote: »

- Neft damage: That would kill stamina Sorcerer and Dragonknight more or less outright, being the only reliable burst damage those classes have for stamina.

there is not suppose to be a stamina sorcerer, lets just listen to it being said outloud ...

"stamina sorcerer"

it doesnt even sound realistic. its rediculas. the total ability for sorcerers is suppose to be "magicka" not stamina.

secondly, dragonights are not suppose to be "damage dealers" thier "a tank" not suppose to go around killing, thier purpose is to "tank" thier not suppose to issue out "burst damage" as you put it.

this has to be the troll within you .. I mean really?

Stigant · January 2016

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Ive played with a healing temp, also fought with a healing templar for awhile seeing how long they could last. With an appropriate build on full defense, I couldnt get through without going WW - reliably at least. Took a couple minutes each time.

Im not saying its easy, Im just saying Id rather deal with WB than be pounded with spambush and feared inbetween, especially if Im trying to block heal with a templar or a lot of other classes really.

Yeah Spambu(L)sh(IT) is evil no doubt about that ...

Back to WB thought ... given the range + CC + Empower (selfbuff) + DMG of this skill + Brokn CC mechanics + clipping the animation in half into a HA which makes it really hard to even see if someone is half-decent player + GCD starts at the moment you push the button, which gives you quite huge burst capability, not to mention you can "stealthcast" it with full benefits of stealth attack ... it is a little too good skill overall ... in my personal opinion something has to be done with it ...

Nifty2g · January 2016

Stigant wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Ive played with a healing temp, also fought with a healing templar for awhile seeing how long they could last. With an appropriate build on full defense, I couldnt get through without going WW - reliably at least. Took a couple minutes each time.

Im not saying its easy, Im just saying Id rather deal with WB than be pounded with spambush and feared inbetween, especially if Im trying to block heal with a templar or a lot of other classes really.

Yeah Spambu(L)sh(IT) is evil no doubt about that ...

Back to WB thought ... given the range + CC + Empower (selfbuff) + DMG of this skill + Brokn CC mechanics + clipping the animation in half into a HA which makes it really hard to even see if someone is half-decent player + GCD starts at the moment you push the button, which gives you quite huge burst capability, not to mention you can "stealthcast" it with full benefits of stealth attack ... it is a little too good skill overall ... in my personal opinion something has to be done with it ...

Finally got an image to show with 2 crits; this is with wearing 4 Impenetrable

Anyone who wants to argue this isn't the hardest hitting skill is just lying to themselves and ignorant. Crystal Fragment can be mitigated with Hardy depending on the player and how well they dispense their Champion Points and how many Impenetrable they are wearing and can also be reflected, I believe Crystal Frag is totally fine.
You can't mitigate Wrecking Blow as you can with Crystal Frag - that is another issue but has been confirmed to be fixed.

Fix Wrecking Blow by removing the Empower, fix the CC problems and then it may be a balanced skill. @Wrobel this has been an issue for 2 Major Updates now, and it is still not adjusted.

Don't blame the players using it; it's obviously a cheese skill sure but the issue is the incompetence it's taken to even get any feedback on fixing this skill. I wonder if we're going to finally have it balanced after the 3rd major update.

Ampnode · January 2016

xAPxZeez wrote: »

After reading these posts here is what I'm seeing. This ability which is available to EVERYONE needs a nerf. I haven't figured or can't execute one of the many strategies people have given me on a plate. I REFUSE to change, LEARN or ADAPT.
I am not willing to put some points into stamina or use a tri-food because I'm not willing to.

Instead change this ability so that I can kill more people at once and die less.

If someone(s) catches you off guard and you're alone should they beat you? Yes, they should. They have positioned themselves and executed their strat on you. You should struggle it's pvp.

Want to live longer? Travel with people together.

If 3 people are spamming wb on you do you think you should live? No, how about all 3 attack you a combo of cc and dd should you live? No, stop ruining this game. Sometimes you die stop complaining how op everything is and instead focus your time on adapting to it.

Okay, I'll continue to adapt to a skill hits 12K+ and has a broken CC.

"No, how about all 3 attack you a combo of cc and dd should you live? No"

I'd rather be CC'd periodically with fear/fossilize/whatever than an ability that throws you in the air and can do this even when you have CC immunity still on. There is already proof showing WB's CC is plain out broken, and for you to sit here and tell us to adapt to an ability that's broken is delusional of you.

"If someone(s) catches you off guard and you're alone should they beat you? Yes"

I'm going to assume you're a NB for bringing this up randomly, which I hope you're not a WB using NB. Anyway, in the logic I'm seeing stated here... everyone should always lose against a NB? I mean, that's the whole point of the class, which is to be pure stealth. If you actually believe this, I'm just going to say this: "Stop being an oaf thinking just because you're a stealthing NB with an OP ability that you should win against everyone and play another class." Hell, this is already the logic put out by ZoS anyways, which will hopefully be fixed in the upcoming class changes in the next DLC. If you're not a NB, then ignore what I said there and take no offense to it.

Didgerion · January 2016

CJohnson81 wrote: »

I was showing my brother Cyrodiil over the Christmas Holiday. I left my keep, hopped on my sweet new black senche, ran about 100 yards and got WB'd from stealth for a one shot kill. I left Cyrodiil and told him, nevermind, it really isn't that fun.

Here we go, one shot builds are coming back - expect further cyrodiil damage reductions patches.

As of WB I'd gladly trade the WB ability to surprise attack on my stam sorc.

It is really easy to dodge/block/interrupt WB attacks.

Lord-Otto · January 2016

It is only easy to dodge when you're fighting 1v1. Have no trouble with that. Never happens in PvP, though. Also, dodging, blocking, rolling is not a viable counter for a mag character. even with my tri-stat food, 13k stamina are way too less to do any fancy maneuvering.

What I criticize the most is how easy it is and how it offers so much. Why is it okay that you instagib an opponent out of stealth with Wrecking Blow, when I as a magicka DK have to fight you for a minute, because I can't burst you down in an instant? Even a sorc can't, you always have a visual indication that you're being targeted by burst spells.
How about the "L2P people" actually learned to play themselves and stepped into our footsteps and not have access to skills like WB or Spambush?

Anyway, little off track there...
I think asking for the cc to be removed is fair. Nightblades have Fear, DKs Fossilize, Sorcs Rune Prison, Templars pretty toothsticks ( ^_- ). I don't think any stamina build suffers from using those instead of WB's cc. Stamina users often complain how their magicka bar is useless. Well, use it for cc, fair and square.

Asmael · January 2016

I don't care about WB damage.

What I care about, is that I managed to hit someone who had full stamina with a WB, that he took little damage because he blocked, that FTC showed that he blocked, and yet he was flying in the air.

WB goes thru block at times, and this is my biggest grip with this skill, but not the only one.

That, and the bugged LoS / range check (getting hit by a WB from someone talon'd and facing the other side? Check. Getting hit from 12+ meters? Check).

rolandlu7prb18_ESO · January 2016

maybe this is intended by zos developer. u know, their way to make this game more "playable".

Brrrofski · January 2016

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Of course, ^ magicka is clearly OP with its massive amount of CC breaks and roll dodges, not to mention divided CPs and lack of spams. Clearly WB is sub par to such magnificence, magicka det is too good with it's blockable damage and 4 second timer. Not to mention frags and it's easy ability to maximize the CC immunity bug...

Clearly L2P...

I guess by that logic a stam sorc would pummel a magicka sorc with his WB, right?

If you have a more well rounded hand on balance, youd know an equally skilled magicka sorc is never going to run out of stam fighting a stam sorc and hes going to drop more damage on him than he can heal. Ultimately, he will win pretty much every fight. Thats the reality of the situation. Try blocking a curse/det/frag/dawnbreaker combo on a stam sorc - or better yet, try roll dodging it. Good luck either way.

That is really the issue you have in these threads. Your sig says youre a high elf sorc, so well presume youre a magicka sorc in here if youre complaining about WB - yet you should never lose to someone hammering WB if youre on the same skill level all else equal... maybe a well played dueling DK? Theres less than 5 I know of that could do that in the game. And yet here they are, jumping on a bandwagon - rather than engaging in a discussion about it.

Exactly.

Any person with half a brain running a magica build uses unstoppable pots and puts a fair amount of CP's into tumbling. People want their spell damage/crit pots. Sometimes you need to lose a bit of damage to retain some survivability.

Tumbling, pots, roll dodge, walk through, cc them first... Hell, even blocking a WB helps a lot.
If you're unsure how to block, try running the tutorial again. It shows you how!

AltusVenifus · January 2016

I play with it... I don't want to, because it is cheating... it will change.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · January 2016

danno8 wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

Niaver wrote: »

found1779 wrote: »

As soon as a stamina sorcerer has another means of burst damage. then i would say wb needs to be checked into. but at the moment wrecking blow is the only burst damage a stamina sorcerer has. so it should stay the way it is unless other classes burst damage gets nerfed also. like say a nightblade.

Well the same for stam DK. The only burst ability. And if you are experienced enough you will never be caught by WB.

How about 3 people casting it? How do you deal with that?

You die that's how you deal with it Theee people hitting you at once you should be dying

danno8 wrote: »

xAPxZeez wrote: »

Boo hoo someone has a move and I don't like it. Suck it up and learn how to avoid or counter it like everyone else. Dark flare is regularly hitting me for 9-11k, so does overload, frags and numberous other moves.

You WILL DIE IN PVP everyone does. Stop all the nerfing and test these proposed changes better before implimentating them so they don't have to be continuously adjusted on the fly.

Now imagine if Overload had a 4.5 second CC attached to it, so the next one is a guaranteed hit.

Imagine Dark Flare having a 4.5 second CC, so the second one is guarantee hit.

Frags does have a (shorter) CC, but generally doesn't hit as hard due to CP's. Also to get the 20% bonus you have to use other spells for the proc, so using 2 CF's back to back is not as strong as 2 WB's.

WB just has everything except range, which hardly matters in a game with spammable gap closers and questionable distance calculations.

Over Load only spammable Ultimate

Dark Flare has a healing debuff making you heals weaker

Frags you are joking of course the power with a cast time that can fire instantly at half the cost? At range and can Proc off DoTs.

The big difference is all those things, while beneficial, do not cause immediate death for the opponent.

CC management is everything in PvP. WB makes this too easy. That is all. Keep the damage, keep the empowered, remove the CC.

But does that fix the problem then I can just Shield Charge you every five seconds or fear, frags or any of the other CCs anyone can do this most just don't.

I keep debuffs down the whole fight without WB I keep people with the CC immune.

MikeB · January 2016

It kills me that people can defend WB with a strait face. Can it be dodged? Yes. When you're not getting WB'd from someone in stealth thats 7 meters away from you. The range needs to be cut in half and the CC removed. The only ability that is similar to WB is Ambush, which does half the damage, only immobilizes (not stunned, you can still act) for 1second versus WB's Knocked back AND stunned for 3.5 seconds and both do empower. The only benefit Ambush has over WB is it has a 22 meter range vs WB's 7m range. I'd take WB over Ambush every time if I had to choose one or the other, its a no brainer. Does that really sound balanced? If you say yes you're just fanboying WB.

Greyhame · January 2016

MikeB wrote: »

It kills me that people can defend WB with a strait face. Can it be dodged? Yes. When you're not getting WB'd from someone in stealth thats 7 meters away from you. The range needs to be cut in half and the CC removed. The only ability that is similar to WB is Ambush, which does half the damage, only immobilizes (not stunned, you can still act) for 1second versus WB's Knocked back AND stunned for 3.5 seconds and both do empower. The only benefit Ambush has over WB is it has a 22 meter range vs WB's 7m range. I'd take WB over Ambush every time if I had to choose one or the other, its a no brainer. Does that really sound balanced? If you say yes you're just fanboying WB.

Did you just say that you would take WB over Ambush every time? I find that hard to believe. Ambush is amazing. I run 2h/bow and my spammable attack is sneak attack most of the time. WB is only useful when you are fighting people that don't know what they are doing. All the people complaining about how OP it is don't know what they are doing. Complaining about WB out of stealth? A charged heavy into a sneak attack from stealth does more damage it just takes a little timing.

MikeB · January 2016

Greyhame wrote: »

MikeB wrote: »

It kills me that people can defend WB with a strait face. Can it be dodged? Yes. When you're not getting WB'd from someone in stealth thats 7 meters away from you. The range needs to be cut in half and the CC removed. The only ability that is similar to WB is Ambush, which does half the damage, only immobilizes (not stunned, you can still act) for 1second versus WB's Knocked back AND stunned for 3.5 seconds and both do empower. The only benefit Ambush has over WB is it has a 22 meter range vs WB's 7m range. I'd take WB over Ambush every time if I had to choose one or the other, its a no brainer. Does that really sound balanced? If you say yes you're just fanboying WB.

Did you just say that you would take WB over Ambush every time? I find that hard to believe. Ambush is amazing. I run 2h/bow and my spammable attack is sneak attack most of the time. WB is only useful when you are fighting people that don't know what they are doing. All the people complaining about how OP it is don't know what they are doing. Complaining about WB out of stealth? A charged heavy into a sneak attack from stealth does more damage it just takes a little timing.

So, we have our first fanboy. As someone who has over 50 hours in PvP in ESO, was a Grand Marshall and earned every Gladiator title up to season 8 in WoW I'd say I know what I'm doing. ESO is far from being a balanced PvP experience and until they can learn from others failures it never will be. Not until they separate how abilities perform and act in PvP versus PvE it will never be balanced. There are several videos showing how WB is broken that has nothing to do with its ridiculous range for a melee ability, empower, knock back and stun. Just saying Ambush is better than WB shows how unfamiliar you are with the skill, you shun it over ambush due to the stigma the ability has.

Lord-Otto · January 2016

Greyhame wrote: »

MikeB wrote: »

It kills me that people can defend WB with a strait face. Can it be dodged? Yes. When you're not getting WB'd from someone in stealth thats 7 meters away from you. The range needs to be cut in half and the CC removed. The only ability that is similar to WB is Ambush, which does half the damage, only immobilizes (not stunned, you can still act) for 1second versus WB's Knocked back AND stunned for 3.5 seconds and both do empower. The only benefit Ambush has over WB is it has a 22 meter range vs WB's 7m range. I'd take WB over Ambush every time if I had to choose one or the other, its a no brainer. Does that really sound balanced? If you say yes you're just fanboying WB.

Did you just say that you would take WB over Ambush every time? I find that hard to believe. Ambush is amazing. I run 2h/bow and my spammable attack is sneak attack most of the time. WB is only useful when you are fighting people that don't know what they are doing. All the people complaining about how OP it is don't know what they are doing. Complaining about WB out of stealth? A charged heavy into a sneak attack from stealth does more damage it just takes a little timing.

The hell did I just read?
Yeah, I know what to do against WB, walk through the opponent. Guess what? On my way through the opponent, I get hit by at least 1 WB, as it's a fast move with high range. My opponent, of course, will try to circle around me so I can't walk through him, so a second incoming WB is likely. And when I finally succeed to get through him/her, it won't cost any stamina to the WB user. But now that I'm close to his/her CLOSE RANGE weapon, I'm fighting in his home turf. As a magicka char, I put up my shield, each one is immediately broken by that 12k WB. Immo potion is up, for 15 seconds, I can only defend, as the moment I switch the offense bar, I eat that 12k WB to my health, and BOOM! pot is down, I'm getting cc'ed, the second WB to my health before cc break kills me.
Oh yeah, I totally do not know what to do. Obviously, spamming that one button is way more sophisticated than my strategy of blocking/rolling/movement with a close watch to my limited stamina bar.

Nonono, guys, you ain't fooling no one here. Wrecking Blow is shamelessly overpowered and ESO's noob tube, but even worse. Either give destro staffs a magicka version of Wrecking Blow, or nerf it.
It's funny how some people want to convince us WB isn't all that great, but pull out the forks and torches when someone wants to see it tweaked, isn't it? If you do not rely on it as a crutch, why are you peeps so upset?

A charged heavy attack into stealth... What's next? Give nightblades a spammable nuclear bomb and say it's easily countered by logging out of the game before it hits and then log back in? How about people spamming abusive crab get forced into putting as much effort into using the skill actively as we have to to evade it? Risk versus reward, in other words?

Oh, and Ambush. We know.

Didgerion · January 2016

Tdroid wrote: »

Wrecking Blow - again!

You've misspelled it the right way to say it is:

Wreeeeeeeeeckiiiinng Bloooooow - it is form the whale's language.

Lucky28 · January 2016

Wreaking Blow does need to be adjusted. but only really in it's range, it's range is freakin' stupid it shouldn't be like 5x greater than the length of the the weapon, that's just foolish.

leepalmer95 · January 2016

Lucky28 wrote: »

Wreaking Blow does need to be adjusted. but only really in it's range, it's range is freakin' stupid it shouldn't be like 5x greater than the length of the the weapon, that's just foolish.

What about the broken cc we leaving that in?

Lucky28 · January 2016

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

Wreaking Blow does need to be adjusted. but only really in it's range, it's range is freakin' stupid it shouldn't be like 5x greater than the length of the the weapon, that's just foolish.

What about the broken cc we leaving that in?

That's not a WB thing only, CC is broken in general.

Artis · January 2016

CyrusArya wrote: »

Wanna nerf WB? Fine. Give DK and Sorc a strong stamina dps skill and you can have your nerf.

It's not about DPS that much. It's about having DPS+CC in one button. Such a nobrainer. It's a dumb skill.

Jade1986 · January 2016

Sharee wrote: »

I have a lot less problems with this now that i started playing a heavy-armor s/s magicka DK. Block the first WB, fossilize, DOT the guy up while he is breaking free, root him and get behind so he cant swing at you, if he rolls out of it chain yourself back to him and root again and get behind again, as soon as 8 secs are up from the last fossilize fossil him again and drop a meteor on his head, etc. etc.

Stay aggressive, do not give him enough breathing room to complete the swing.

On a related note, ZOS is planning to add a physical resistance star in the champion system, once that's in WB should hurt a lot less.

There already is......3 of them in fact. There doesn't need to be another star.

Jade1986 · January 2016

Angarato wrote: »

wb is the noobtube ability. it can hit upto 12k damage in a game where most pvpers have around 20k health
add a cc to that and you have the most op move in the game and thats without the fact theres ALSO an empower on it.

most classes have 1 cc button 1 high burst damage button and 1 buff button. wb spammers have 1 button that does all 3.
its NOT easy to run through them unless theyre a potato.
- you can backpeddle while using it
- you can snare the person and he'll never run through you
- if you fail it costs 0 stamina, just press it again
- if you land 1 you can already start casting the next 1 during the animation so even if the target breaks out instantly the next 1 will hit putting them in execute range.
- "you can block" the only other ability that you HAVE to block or die is take flight or ice comet which is an expensive ultimate

2 options to fix this ability
- make it a CC move keep the empower whatever but make it do damage onpar with streak or fossilize or something
- make it a dps move and remove the CC and empower.
-

I have been hit for 18 k heavy attacks. 16 K Crystal frags and 28 k snipes. WB is by no means the strongest ability.

Also, if you remove the cc ability, I would expect the CC to be removed from crystal frags as well. You cannot neuter one ability and leave the others as is.

Lucky28 · January 2016

laced wrote: »

Angarato wrote: »

wb is the noobtube ability. it can hit upto 12k damage in a game where most pvpers have around 20k health
add a cc to that and you have the most op move in the game and thats without the fact theres ALSO an empower on it.

most classes have 1 cc button 1 high burst damage button and 1 buff button. wb spammers have 1 button that does all 3.
its NOT easy to run through them unless theyre a potato.
- you can backpeddle while using it
- you can snare the person and he'll never run through you
- if you fail it costs 0 stamina, just press it again
- if you land 1 you can already start casting the next 1 during the animation so even if the target breaks out instantly the next 1 will hit putting them in execute range.
- "you can block" the only other ability that you HAVE to block or die is take flight or ice comet which is an expensive ultimate

2 options to fix this ability
- make it a CC move keep the empower whatever but make it do damage onpar with streak or fossilize or something
- make it a dps move and remove the CC and empower.
-

I have been hit for 18 k heavy attacks. 16 K Crystal frags and 28 k snipes. WB is by no means the strongest ability.

Also, if you remove the cc ability, I would expect the CC to be removed from crystal frags as well. You cannot neuter one ability and leave the others as is.

hard casting Crystal Fragments can be interrupted as can snipe. Wreaking blow cannot be interrupted. So if you want everything equal, Wreaking blow should be interruptible.

Synthets · January 2016

Lucky28 wrote: »

laced wrote: »

Angarato wrote: »

wb is the noobtube ability. it can hit upto 12k damage in a game where most pvpers have around 20k health
add a cc to that and you have the most op move in the game and thats without the fact theres ALSO an empower on it.

most classes have 1 cc button 1 high burst damage button and 1 buff button. wb spammers have 1 button that does all 3.
its NOT easy to run through them unless theyre a potato.
- you can backpeddle while using it
- you can snare the person and he'll never run through you
- if you fail it costs 0 stamina, just press it again
- if you land 1 you can already start casting the next 1 during the animation so even if the target breaks out instantly the next 1 will hit putting them in execute range.
- "you can block" the only other ability that you HAVE to block or die is take flight or ice comet which is an expensive ultimate

2 options to fix this ability
- make it a CC move keep the empower whatever but make it do damage onpar with streak or fossilize or something
- make it a dps move and remove the CC and empower.
-

I have been hit for 18 k heavy attacks. 16 K Crystal frags and 28 k snipes. WB is by no means the strongest ability.

Also, if you remove the cc ability, I would expect the CC to be removed from crystal frags as well. You cannot neuter one ability and leave the others as is.

hard casting Crystal Fragments can be interrupted as can snipe. Wreaking blow cannot be interrupted. So if you want everything equal, Wreaking blow should be interruptible.

If everything is equal that means the damage is equal as well - right? So 12k = 18k = 16k = 28k confirmed?

Anyhow I have no opinion on this matter, because honestly I've not seen a place where small scale pvp matters in this game so a single target ability is largely useless in 99% cases unless used at range to pick someone off.

What should be fixed is the ability to run through an enemy zerg with 20 players and aoe everything down with next to no skill involved.

Ampnode · January 2016

laced wrote: »

Angarato wrote: »

wb is the noobtube ability. it can hit upto 12k damage in a game where most pvpers have around 20k health
add a cc to that and you have the most op move in the game and thats without the fact theres ALSO an empower on it.

most classes have 1 cc button 1 high burst damage button and 1 buff button. wb spammers have 1 button that does all 3.
its NOT easy to run through them unless theyre a potato.
- you can backpeddle while using it
- you can snare the person and he'll never run through you
- if you fail it costs 0 stamina, just press it again
- if you land 1 you can already start casting the next 1 during the animation so even if the target breaks out instantly the next 1 will hit putting them in execute range.
- "you can block" the only other ability that you HAVE to block or die is take flight or ice comet which is an expensive ultimate

2 options to fix this ability
- make it a CC move keep the empower whatever but make it do damage onpar with streak or fossilize or something
- make it a dps move and remove the CC and empower.
-

I have been hit for 18 k heavy attacks. 16 K Crystal frags and 28 k snipes. WB is by no means the strongest ability.

Also, if you remove the cc ability, I would expect the CC to be removed from crystal frags as well. You cannot neuter one ability and leave the others as is.

28 k snipes

We're here to discuss an ability, not exaggerated damage numbers you come up with in your head. Let's go over the other 2, though.

18 k heavy attacks. 16 K Crystal frags

Heavy attacks, I've seen happen and have been killed by them in 1 hit with a lucky camo hunter proc, but that's a broken mechanic that, again, favors NBs. Crystal frags, never been hit with a 16K after 1.7. Probably because I wear 2 heavy, 5 light, and S&B with 6 piece impen, but that number only seems possible if you're wearing full medium or light. Anyway, the only way a frag can be at all effective is through procing it. If somebody is hard casting 'em? You can interrupt it, unlike WB. Since they're mainly used by procing it, they're not used as frequently as WB is up in front of your face. You can then go on about the combo a sorc can do with that proc'd frag, but that's easily avoided by simply blocking their entire curse, det, frag, and dawnbreaker combo. Then you can say you can just do the same with WB; however, keep in mind that WB is used every second. You're receiving a constant CC that throws out 10K+ damage. WB - Used every 1 second; Frag - Used every 4-5 seconds. Not only that, but it's easy to stop a sorc from setting up that combo.

@Synthets

This post goes to you as well.

Waffennacht · January 2016

I really hate it when people say Frag is anywhere near the same as Wrecking Blow, similar at most.

Frag has a hard cast that cannot be animation cancelled or have a heavy attack too.

Frag has at most Half the CC time

In order to receive any damage bonus you Must use a DIFFERENT move and only then have 35% chance to proc.

Frags can be interrupted when hard cast.

Frags has a severely lower damage, those 16k Frags would easily be 24k WBs.

Then we could go into how armors/passives/and game mechanics all favor stamina builds and have the game's best non templar heal.

We could go into how you can consistently use the CC bug only with WBs or NBs...

You can say how WB will far more consistently hit target rather than Frag

So please don't even try and say Sorcs have anything like the pure awesomeness that is Wrrrrreecccckkkkkinnnggg BLLLLOOOOWWWWWWWWW

Lord-Otto · January 2016

Yup, Waffenacht is right here.
One thing I want to add, though, is how you can easily block Frags. It consumes no stamina at all. Block WB and half your bar is gone, if you're not a stamina build.