Sypher vs. Crown & Parody: Results of the bet!

maxjapank · December 2015

Xeniph wrote: »

Crown wrote: »

@FENGRUSH The hostility is due to my being very proud of how much she's learned over the past month, and the never ending *** talking and whispers that she gets now when she's online. I took your response as another implied insult.

She spends most of her time finding the red vs blue fights, and killing people who are out of position. Similar to what most of you solo players do, though you guys tend to find the fights between your faction and one other - which limits you to specific targets that other players from your own faction have likely already targeted. With zero support from other allied players, it's all on her to kill or be killed - or do enough damage to opponents already in fights such that her percentage of AP gains is higher than others.

The simple way as a DC, find an AD fighting an EP. Wait until both are low on resources. Kill the more powerful one, then the less powerful one. Get the points.

IE...True ganking. Good for her!

I did this for a long while after release. The run times to/from Bleakers eventually got tedius and I got lazy. It most certainly will keep you on your toes though.

I'm sure her rage tells are frequent and plentiful.

Something like this. There is something about getting double AP when fighting near the other two factions, especially near a resource / Bleakers like place.

WRX · December 2015

IDK wtf happened.

Just had the worst breakfast [I have] *ever* had. Ever. I love Sausage. Teach kids to use vivid words to describe tasty...or even yucky...foods! McMuffins are awesome and I went for Burger King’s knock off. Imagine an English muffin soaked in artificial butter oil, toasted, assembled with a spongy egg-like substance, cheese whiz or something, and a sausage puck. Now, wait a few hours, microwave until completely indestructible, and serve to an unsuspecting consumer. It was malevolently bad.

Huckdabuck · December 2015

frozywozy wrote: »

Definitely a L2Read issue.

Crown · December 2015

@maxjapank It's not double AP. Look at the example @Sypher made in his stream. He got 200 (if I recall correctly) AP for two kills that other people made just by dropping caltrops in a SMALL 2v2 fight, then about the same when he killed the two people who were left alive (the winners of the 2v2).

In a situation like that, the equivalent AP can be made solo ganking one target. If you look at the amount of damage that is done when large groups collide, they will out damage most solo players by an order of magnitude, rendering the AP gains for that solo player insignificant. There's an art and a skill to doing it optimally - the same as there is for anything else in this game. I think that Parody helped me make the point about AP farming, and that was our goal at the start of this exercise.

It's also IMPORTANT to keep in mind that this is not something that a lot of people do in the same place, as you'll only reduce each other's AP gains.

Parody probably made about 1/3 of her AP from this, and the rest by being in the right place at the right time ganking.

Crown · December 2015

WRX wrote: »

IDK wtf happened.

Just had the worst breakfast [I have] *ever* had. Ever. I love Sausage. Teach kids to use vivid words to describe tasty...or even yucky...foods! McMuffins are awesome and I went for Burger King’s knock off. Imagine an English muffin soaked in artificial butter oil, toasted, assembled with a spongy egg-like substance, cheese whiz or something, and a sausage puck. Now, wait a few hours, microwave until completely indestructible, and serve to an unsuspecting consumer. It was malevolently bad.

You should have had pizza.

Derra · December 2015

Telling people it´s easy to farm ap solo on a NB nowadays is the same as doing that in 1.2 on a DK.

Hey we´ve got one class outperforming all others. Ofc i´ll use that as a benchmark for my argument because it really goes well with the point i´m trying to make.
Holy spaghettimonster you people sometimes make me wonder.

Erondil · December 2015

Derra wrote: »

Telling people it´s easy to farm ap solo on a NB nowadays is the same as doing that in 1.2 on a DK.

Hey we´ve got one class outperforming all others. Ofc i´ll use that as a benchmark for my argument because it really goes well with the point i´m trying to make.
Holy spaghettimonster you people sometimes make me wonder.

It's easy when its not lagging*
But I guess you can do it effectively with a sorc aswell (when its not lagging) the frostsoul way. Be ahead of the pug zerg, bomb ennemy groups with deto+bats+impulse>streak back to the zerg>profit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qB1fogJxfNM[MEDIA] at 19:25
Not really solo, more like kris "solo" tho

Satiar · December 2015

Zheg wrote: »

Crown, even if brians changes had nothing to do with syphers thread and everything to do with reducing group size (don't buy that), if ZOS honestly thinks slightly lower AP gains for large groups is going to help, Camelot unchained can't come quickly enough. It was said multiple times in the AP thread, but what the eff do we use AP for? Seriously.

Groups form up to push map objectives, fight other groups, and (sometimes) to just get lots of player kills from people potatoing into a farm (which is about kills, not AP). If groups want more AP and care about it, they'd go get the AP buff from a delve every hour, and they obviously aren't. Groups aren't going to split apart because of slightly lowered AP gains. So, I honestly hope ZOS isn't so out of touch to believe that.

As an aside, my group makes less AP in lag too because bulb/steve/I usually look at the map to figure out where else to push if a keep fight is a cluster-eff with too many blue, or simply take a pause and try to wait for the ping to calm down before engaging again. So, a solo player isn't the only one making less in lag.

Actually you get less AP cuz I don't let you get Dee Ticks.

Satiar · December 2015

frozywozy wrote: »

Oh man.

You loved my group when it was playing for your faction. How times change

Hydrocodone · December 2015

The OP and it's attitude diminish the game, Stupid is as Stupid does!

JDar · December 2015

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Crown wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

@Crown Didn't Parody just follow around your group out of group ?

@FENGRUSH Following around a group and healing doesn't net you much AP. I haven't seen you on leader boards in a while, is that what you've been failing at lately?

Parody's AP gains are solo all the way. @Sypher can confirm that.

I didnt say following around healing ... I asked if she was following around. Im not on leaderboards because I play on pretty much every campaign every night and usually in sewers... whats with the hostility in a simple question?

Simply asked what kind of solo play it was. Im willing to bet it isnt running around solo killing either way.

I have been running in the same guilds that Crown is in and I practically never saw Lightingale.

It sounds really easy on paper but sap and proxy bombing a large group and surviving isn't as easy as it sounds. You have to have a very strong build and know what you are doing to cloak away from a large group and beat the aoe damage/CC. If you think the only people who are good are people who are on your radar you are mistaken.

JDar · December 2015

Hydrocodone wrote: »

The OP and it's attitude diminish the game, Stupid is as Stupid does!

What attitude would that be? Can you elaborate?

CamBam370 · December 2015

Zerg... Zerg.... Zerg.....

Crown · December 2015

JDar wrote: »

Hydrocodone wrote: »

The OP and it's attitude diminish the game, Stupid is as Stupid does!

What attitude would that be? Can you elaborate?

He probably can't. Every time his arguments gets shot down or proven wrong in another thread he ends his debates with some elaborate nonsensical statement that anyone with a shred of common sense and/or basic experience in the game knows is wrong. He'll then wait for the next opportunity to say something negative or hateful about me with no justification or background evidence to support his statements. We've gotten used to it - he's just one of the people who blames me for all the world's problems. It's easiest to just ignore him.

frozywozy · December 2015

Satiar wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Oh man.

You loved my group when it was playing for your faction. How times change

Yeah, the game was not as laggy and you were not running 24men.

Sypher · December 2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uPYozSwJIE

Manoekin · December 2015

frozywozy wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Oh man.

You loved my group when it was playing for your faction. How times change

Yeah, the game was not as laggy and you were not running 24men.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoU5jqjdrmU

What.

JDar · December 2015

Sypher wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uPYozSwJIE

I take back what I said about this requiring a whole lot of skill or technique, but still Light is a good player for other reasons and has proved it.

Satiar · December 2015

frozywozy wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Oh man.

You loved my group when it was playing for your faction. How times change

Yeah, the game was not as laggy and you were not running 24men.

Uhhhhhh...

VE has run 24 men pretty much since we had the ability to do it. We filled full raids for months before we went DC, and you know it. You ran in some of those. You're in some of our videos lol, please don't even try to deny it. You also know that lag is not a new thing, lag was horrible before we rerolled and after we rerolled.

The difference is I'm not playing for your faction anymore. That's it.

Satiar · December 2015

Manoekin wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Oh man.

You loved my group when it was playing for your faction. How times change

Yeah, the game was not as laggy and you were not running 24men.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoU5jqjdrmU

What.

Ahhhh, the fights that forced us to go stam/nirn. We had people with max spell damage builds critting prox dets for under 3k on you guys, it was insane. Thankfully I was already full stam/nirn and was in Italy at the time, and simply returned to see the entire guild had re-geared to copy me!

But yeah, I dunno what Frozn is about. About the only time VE didn't run big groups was when Bulb was taking a break and I was building the guild out of people from zone chat. We ran big for a good while, even before we absorbed most of Pride's core. Anything to the contrary is nonsense.

Xsorus · December 2015

frozywozy wrote: »

Which is funny, cause if it's anything like Daoc.. Those groups are not going to do well in that game.

Derra · December 2015

Xsorus wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Which is funny, cause if it's anything like Daoc.. Those groups are not going to do well in that game.

I would not be too sure about that.

Organised 16 - slots were already dreaded because they were pretty much unbeatable. What might be a saving grace is daoc did not have and CU hopefully won´t have any mechanics enabling those grps.

Xsorus · December 2015

Derra wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Which is funny, cause if it's anything like Daoc.. Those groups are not going to do well in that game.

I would not be too sure about that.

Organised 16 - slots were already dreaded because they were pretty much unbeatable. What might be a saving grace is daoc did not have and CU hopefully won´t have any mechanics enabling those grps.

My group ended up killing most of the 16 man groups fairly easy unless it was something silly; esp when we ran out alb caster group with 3 theurgist. Anyway most of the time those setups did not last long because it basically ended up with every other 8 man going directly for you and you not getting any good fights. If you ran 16 even if it was for example hib vs mid and you were 2 groups of Albs both would hib and mid would disengage each other and go directly for you, the 8 mans would then run around just ignoring one another and hit the 16 man over and over till they logged off. They were very good at policing themselves basically.

No one out up with this 24 man is one group ***...

CU will likely have the same types of groups.. And if it had the group limit at 8 you'll probably see the same development of ajing you till ya log if ya try running more then 8

Alcast · December 2015

Derra wrote: »

Telling people it´s easy to farm ap solo on a NB nowadays is the same as doing that in 1.2 on a DK.

Hey we´ve got one class outperforming all others. Ofc i´ll use that as a benchmark for my argument because it really goes well with the point i´m trying to make.
Holy spaghettimonster you people sometimes make me wonder.

this

WRX · December 2015

Manoekin wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Oh man.

You loved my group when it was playing for your faction. How times change

Yeah, the game was not as laggy and you were not running 24men.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoU5jqjdrmU

What.

Talk about a super team there. GG, to bad that is around the time the game basically stopped supporting competitive PvP as we knew it.

And Sypher's video sums up pretty well the issue with some mechanics as far as AP goes. Points are points, and I see no issue with getting 500k+ points per day. But it is super cheese, and the worst of players (which these aren't) could be 5 stars in 2 months doing this. At least to me, AR and AP is nearly the only achievement that is a genuine challenge and actually means something, and seeing it this way is meh..

Can't say it is worse than abusing AoE caps or lagging out skills either though.

FENGRUSH · December 2015

WRX wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Oh man.

You loved my group when it was playing for your faction. How times change

Yeah, the game was not as laggy and you were not running 24men.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoU5jqjdrmU

What.

Talk about a super team there. GG, to bad that is around the time the game basically stopped supporting competitive PvP as we knew it.

And Sypher's video sums up pretty well the issue with some mechanics as far as AP goes. Points are points, and I see no issue with getting 500k+ points per day. But it is super cheese, and the worst of players (which these aren't) could be 5 stars in 2 months doing this. At least to me, AR and AP is nearly the only achievement that is a genuine challenge and actually means something, and seeing it this way is meh..

Can't say it is worse than abusing AoE caps or lagging out skills either though.

FENGRUSH approved

Docmandu · December 2015

Some of these streamers are always quick to cry and point out issues for them.. then continue to slot reverberating bash (since it's known to be broken) and ask for invis pots so they can exploit the bug with invisible rez... yeah, really the type of players ZOS should listen to.

Psilent · December 2015

I remember Pixysticks doing this a lot at the KC LM on Haderus and the gate during the Forward Camp era. He'd run into us spamming every AoE at his disposal and then die. The AD buff defenders would push into us and wipe us and then he'd release.

The other AD would be so pissed asking me if we were giving him solo defense ticks because they couldn't match his AP gain and the current Emperor was worried once he got dethroned he'd lose his throne to Pixysticks; which he did eventually.

One day I flat out just asked Pixy what he was doing and he explained it to me. Nice guy, miss him. One of the few players that legitimately one shot me with a 24k Crystal Fragment.

frozywozy · December 2015

Manoekin wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Oh man.

You loved my group when it was playing for your faction. How times change

Yeah, the game was not as laggy and you were not running 24men.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoU5jqjdrmU

What.

First, I see people from Pride, Hijinx and Havoc in that group. I didn't play with VE anymore at that point. Second and as I sais previously and as it's prouven in the video, the latency was much better.

Manoekin · December 2015

Psilent wrote: »

I remember Pixysticks doing this a lot at the KC LM on Haderus and the gate during the Forward Camp era. He'd run into us spamming every AoE at his disposal and then die. The AD buff defenders would push into us and wipe us and then he'd release.

The other AD would be so pissed asking me if we were giving him solo defense ticks because they couldn't match his AP gain and the current Emperor was worried once he got dethroned he'd lose his throne to Pixysticks; which he did eventually.

One day I flat out just asked Pixy what he was doing and he explained it to me. Nice guy, miss him. One of the few players that legitimately one shot me with a 24k Crystal Fragment.

Best solo AP farmer was Amseruaq, who farmed suicide resources staying in the tower and throwing trops down on enemy groups trying to blood port. He was actually the first ever Thorn emp that way I think.

Sypher vs. Crown &amp; Parody: Results of the bet!

Sypher vs. Crown & Parody: Results of the bet!