Maelstrom Arena is too hard...NERF IT!

Nashin93 · November 2015

Lettigall wrote: »

Nashin93 wrote: »

hrothbern wrote: »

Nashin93 wrote: »

hrothbern wrote: »

gen_reynard2050 wrote: »

why! why! why! I just want solo to complete the arenaaa!

Are you Vet 16 with golden sets and in the range 400-500 CP?

Im a Vet 16 with Purples and I dont remember exact CP but somewhere around 250. I play for 4-6 hours a day due to work and life, but I still hate nerfs, kinda wish people would just keep trying instead of dying and giving up.

I share your attitude towards such a challenge as Maelstrom.

I posed the question to OP because he just shouted: "nerf"
If he would be a Vet 16 with purple gear and 100 CP, a tank with dual S&B equiped.....
I would at least understand where he is coming from
but still not enough reason to nerf it IMO.

Agreed, I used a Stamina Templar vr16 with purples and ~250 CP's and didn't use a guide so i went in there fresh. I actually really enjoyed each arena, I got to arena 7 before dying once (I didn't realise i had to bash the argonian behemoth lol), but after 2 tries I figured it out. And that is what i wish people would do more often, thats kinda how the Scrolls games have always been, its fun to explore and learn.

When playing Morrowind, the hardest part of that game was staying on track with a quest, because whilst on your way........."Oooo I wonder whats in this cave"

Are you sure you were in veteran difficulty not normal?

Yes I was talking about normal, however last night on vet i got to The Igneous Cistern on my Stamplar, however time restraints meant I had to Log off

Nashin93 · November 2015

hrothbern wrote: »

skillastatb16_ESO wrote: »

Then this thread should be named Buff Stam DK and Templar instead of this one.

VMA is correct as it is. PLZ @ZOS DONT NERF IT.

I think you make a very good point !!!!

Maelstrom should be the measure.... and a measure cannot be nerfed.

It will be an excellent measuring device to balance the classes better.

with some correlation analysis juggling even a tool to balance the racials better.

Call me crazy, but i found it easier on my Stamplar than my Magicka Sorc xD

XT4xm4nX · November 2015

[XBOX NA] Console Currently this is the only content in the game a player can be proud to have beaten. The title is one that only a few players get the honor of boasting around town. This is an MMO not every piece of content needs to cater to every single player. There is some content that a majority of the community will never complete and that is the way it should be in an MMO setting. There are quite a handful of hardcore MMO players out there playing ESO. 98% of the game currently Caters to a more casual player base. Is it too much to ask for the 2% to have a little something? Please don't NERF vMA. I spent 40 Hours in there across 4 attempts before finally completing with my Stam NB with a mind blowing score of 353 (Think I am the 2nd or 3rd Stam NB complete on console). vWGT and vICP were also great. Please realize that all of this content has a "NORMAL" mode. My group and I have all completed all of the end game content with under 300 champ points each & frankly could probably have gotten by with less and regardless of that if you think champion points are the issue . . . go get more. Would you be complaining that you couldn't beat v16 vMA with a lvl 37 toon? The same concept applies to not having enough champ points to complete. There has to be some content that is challenging for characters that are truly maxed out... otherwise what is the point for those characters to continue playing? You may argue that well it is such a small percentage of the community so who really cares but please realize that while these players may be small in number, they provide quite a bit to the gaming community. Who do you think is out there chaperoning newbs through vDSA & Trial runs? Who do you think is answering questions about gaming mechanics & builds? Who do you think is posting your YOUTUBE how to videos? Who do you think is running your larger active guilds? Who do you think is maintaining the websites you use to figure out your builds? Who do you think is running these fun PvP events? The list goes on. These players may be annoyingly good and they may melt your face in PvP but they also bring quite a bit of enjoyment and content beyond the content that you would otherwise not have so please try and consider these facts whilst your attempting to have ZOS nerf out the game stripping it of anything for these players to challenge themselves with. In closing I would just like to point out that this is an opinion and an attempt to assist some members of this forum to possibly look at this from a different direction. I am not pointing fingers at anyone in particular with these words and welcome disagreement. If you do in fact disagree try and do it politely : ) If you do agree thanks for your support.

~ Tax

melodeath · November 2015

Alcast wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

It is doable, did it now on 2 Stam chars (I think I am still the only dude that actually completed it with stam) and it is ffreaking hard, no idea how even an "good" player can beat that stuff lol

If its too hard, grind up a Magicka Sorc and then easy mode.

Fengrush beat it on his stam sorc last night and Sneaky Habanero on his Stam DK, both excellent players.

uhh okay, I thought Habanero is a Magicka DK.

I think stam Sorc is actually the easiest bc od Crit surge...gonna try later with Stam sorc, first gonna try with my badly geared Magicka sorc >.>

Sorcs have always the easy peasy way....lawl

i did it as a stamblade with 17k hp and and as vamp stage 4

felt like a real accomplishement when that last boss didnt get up after the stun. was the first time in years that i felt so good of completing somthing in a game.

usmcjdking · November 2015

Massively Multiplayer Online Single Player Game.

HeroOfNone · November 2015

The good thing with the difficulty in this is it shows the lack of strength in the DK class verses NB & Sorcs. Yes we've had DK's that completed this, but not the same amount as the other classes.

I will say that a lot of bugs need to be fixed or damage needs to be reduced to make it less of a punishment. Standing still to long on the toxic shock will get you killed quickly, rubber banding is almost a death sentence since you're still standing there while the damage pours in. Again, fix the bugs or reduce the penalty from the bugs.

There is a serious lack of mechanics & builds to fight. You build for strength and mobility. If you want to try and tough through dome of it with heavy armor or heal through the damage and wittle enemies down, you won't be able to. It's pretty absurd in my eye though, since if they dI'd build around these folks then they'd tame a long time and be low on the boards, but would still learn, get better, and pick up gear to do more DPS. Instead there is a pretty obvious wall disfavoring staining or long fights. It's all DPS, DPS, DPS.

Over all not displeased with the arena too much, but it's a very narrow build you need to complete it. I kinda doubt my khajiit DK is up for the order unless I get a bit more equipment, if I was playing a more meta build I'd probably be a bit further along.

anitajoneb17_ESO · November 2015

XT4xm4nX wrote: »

Is it too much to ask for the 2% to have a little something? .../...Please realize that all of this content has a "NORMAL" mode. .../... If you do in fact disagree try and do it politely : ) If you do agree thanks for your support.

~ Tax

1/ No, it's ok, as long as it doesn't mean that 98% have no access to the gear.
2/ as mentioned in numerous threads, the difference between normal and vet is too big (vet's too hard but normal is too easy)
3/ hope it was concise and polite enough :-)

XT4xm4nX · November 2015

1/ No, it's ok, as long as it doesn't mean that 98% have no access to the gear.
2/ as mentioned in numerous threads, the difference between normal and vet is too big (vet's too hard but normal is too easy)
3/ hope it was concise and polite enough :-)

[/quote]

Haha Well done and yes super polite. Although you did still find a way to be mildly snarky in your politeness which I can appreciate.

In response to 1. So by that you think 98% of the game should have the best gear? If anything give a 5% drop rate for normal MA runs for v16 and keep 100% for vMA
2. Is the difficulty spread really that big of a deal? If it is bring normal up closer to Vet not Vet down to Normal or just leave it the way it is so that EVERYONE can complete on normal & the TRYHARD challenge can be found on vMA

Xjcon · November 2015

X3ina wrote: »

You guys should be more precise on what u want, spammable shield or heals from crit or mobility of a sorc. And don't forget that we (sorcs) sacrifying other valuable things like hardy, elemental defense etc while putting 100 in bastion. So STOP CRYING IN EVERY TOPIC ABOUT HOW IMBALANCED SORCERER IS ...

Wait you mean the 20k shield that can't be critically hit, cost less then most heals, and can be spammed till Magicka is depleted? Why bother with other sources of damage mitigation with that much of an advantage.

It's no different then 1.5 DK being immortal. There is an imbalance and many players take advantage of it by playing That class.

Lets say they put shield breaker on those archers in VMA, the outrage from classes using a shield would push every other thread down so fast we wouldn't be able to discuss anything else.

Ezareth · November 2015

Xjcon wrote: »

X3ina wrote: »

You guys should be more precise on what u want, spammable shield or heals from crit or mobility of a sorc. And don't forget that we (sorcs) sacrifying other valuable things like hardy, elemental defense etc while putting 100 in bastion. So STOP CRYING IN EVERY TOPIC ABOUT HOW IMBALANCED SORCERER IS ...

Wait you mean the 20k shield that can't be critically hit, cost less then most heals, and can be spammed till Magicka is depleted? Why bother with other sources of damage mitigation with that much of an advantage.

It's no different then 1.5 DK being immortal. There is an imbalance and many players take advantage of it by playing That class.

Lets say they put shield breaker on those archers in VMA, the outrage from classes using a shield would push every other thread down so fast we wouldn't be able to discuss anything else.

20k? Maybe in early 1.6. Try 30K.

Regardless he had a point. Our defenses are split between two different areas.

And DKs in 1.5 weren't immortal, they died just like everyone else.

GreenSoup2HoT · November 2015

I'd say its to hard but hard for the wrong reason's. Increase the mechanic's but lower the god damn add damage. Make is so mechanic's like AoE's and such kill you. Not because add's do like 20k or something dumb.

anitajoneb17_ESO · November 2015

XT4xm4nX wrote: »

1/ No, it's ok, as long as it doesn't mean that 98% have no access to the gear.
2/ as mentioned in numerous threads, the difference between normal and vet is too big (vet's too hard but normal is too easy)
3/ hope it was concise and polite enough :-)

Haha Well done and yes super polite. Although you did still find a way to be mildly snarky in your politeness which I can appreciate.

In response to 1. So by that you think 98% of the game should have the best gear? If anything give a 5% drop rate for normal MA runs for v16 and keep 100% for vMA
2. Is the difficulty spread really that big of a deal? If it is bring normal up closer to Vet not Vet down to Normal or just leave it the way it is so that EVERYONE can complete on normal & the TRYHARD challenge can be found on vMA

[/quote]

In fact in intended to be nicely teasing, but it's hard in a foreign language (which english is for me) ;-)

to point 1.

Actually I don't think maelstrom weapons or VMSA gear in general are "the best". Luckily. But I'd still like to have access to it to give it a try. 5%=>100% is too much of a difference imho, I'd prefer 20%=>70% or something like that.

But it's not the point. The point is (but I might be very much a minority thinking this way) is that I think that we play for fun and fun varies a lot from one person to the next. Therefore I strongly disagree with the general "effort=>reward" mentality that seems to prevail. There's no such thing as "deserving the best weapon as a reward for the highest difficulty". Rewards are leaderboards, titles, dye colours, pets, whatever other shiny, but not gear.

Furthermore I don't even think there should be anything like "the best gear". I wish different gear would allow for different playstyles and not different levels of efficiency (horizontal diversity vs. vertical progression). Which is why I think all gear should be reasonably available to all players of all levels (not handed out "for free" but reasonably available). I know this is not how most MMOs work at the moment, they're very strong on "gear progression", I just wish it was different, or better said, more "horizontal".

to point 2.

In fact I'd prefer to have 3 levels of difficulty : normal / veteran / nightmare. The middle step is missing. You suggest buffing normal mode instead but you see, I'm not that bad either a player, normal version as it is now is probably already too hard for many people...

I'm not asking for nerfs but I'll be very happy when they come. Maybe I could beat vMSA if I worked more towards it, but it's just too hard to be fun to me, and I don't want to spend (long) time having no fun...

Dubhliam · November 2015

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

XT4xm4nX wrote: »

Is it too much to ask for the 2% to have a little something? .../...Please realize that all of this content has a "NORMAL" mode. .../... If you do in fact disagree try and do it politely : ) If you do agree thanks for your support.

~ Tax

1/ No, it's ok, as long as it doesn't mean that 98% have no access to the gear.
2/ as mentioned in numerous threads, the difference between normal and vet is too big (vet's too hard but normal is too easy)
3/ hope it was concise and polite enough :-)

Access to what gear?
That Trinimac and Briarheart stuff? You can find it in normal Wrothgar treasure chests. Or normal MA.

Oh, wait what? But it's not v16? Do you even know the difference in stats between v15 and v16 gear? 1,3%!

Some thing should be rewarding for being among the best in a large population game. 1.3% better.

Unsent.Soul · November 2015

olsborg wrote: »

vet mode is too hard I agree. Even if you win it, you have to change from your normal effective build just to cater to a specific stage and you die alot of times, its not fun to respawn something to death.

I bet you are the type of player that makes a character and expects to face roll everything with 1 build?

Learn to adapt, it's what humans do... did you take the "play your way" too seriously?

Can't 1 shot people in pvp, nerf
Can't solo trials, nerf
Can't see voidstone nodes with my only character, nerf
Can't complete VMA, nerf

XT4xm4nX · November 2015

@anitajoneb17_ESO

I admit that in theory what you are saying is a very cool idea. For me though I prefer the grind to the top style that currently exists is most MMOs. Furthermore the one issue I see with the horizontal concept is this. At the end of the day there will be a meta build a best in slot set up if you will. Something that is intended to create diversity and access to different rollouts will in the end become everyone in the game wearing exactly the same gear. IMO

~Tax

XT4xm4nX · November 2015

@anitajoneb17_ESO

Also i forgot to mention Maelstrom weapons are hands down best in slot in most cases IMO. It is hard to contest something that has a one piece set bonus in the enchant. Even if you don't like the proc the +WPN DMG is enough to legitimize the piece as best in slot. When referring to the best gear I was really only referring to the Weapons as the rest of the set pieces well frankly I wish they had put some more tantalizing pieces in there for such a difficult dungeon.

Tacadrie · November 2015

Don't nerf vMA BUT fix it please ... Ton of bugs ruins the fun in vMA!!!

GreenSoup2HoT · November 2015

skillastatb16_ESO wrote: »

www.twitch.tv/fengrush

STAMINA Sorcerer who completes it with an even better score than me a magicka sorc

You guys are just bad

StamSorc is one of the only stam classes that have insane burst heals like shield's. Every one of his critical rush's heal's him for 20k. So no, just because a stamina sorc ( one of the best in the game ) can complete this does not make it do-able for all stamina classes.

I'm a stamina nightblade vampire. I tried just stage 1 and the add's literally 2 shot you. I said *** that and will just go wear v15 (only 1.3% difference). I literally do not have the patience to wear some dumb as meta build and be a sheep to complete this. It show's that balance is not even considered what you look at the Zos to do list. You should be able to have various of combination's of gear sustain and skill's to complete this. Not 1 build per class.

I'm going to wait till some real balancing happens. vMA should not be a dps race. It should be avoiding mechanic's. No heavy Armour build can beat this. This arena just show's how op magicka sorc's are as well.

I really hope they tone down the insane amount of damage the add's do. Some build's like mine, do now relie on max damage. I have sustain. However that does not matter anymore since if you dont kill that add instantly you die.

I really hope Zos see's there number's and make some quick change's. This game is turning into max weapon and spell damage. Nothing else matter's. A tank or healer should be able to complete vMA with average damage but that just isn't the case.

StevK44_ESO · November 2015

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

skillastatb16_ESO wrote: »

www.twitch.tv/fengrush

STAMINA Sorcerer who completes it with an even better score than me a magicka sorc

You guys are just bad

StamSorc is one of the only stam classes that have insane burst heals like shield's. Every one of his critical rush's heal's him for 20k. So no, just because a stamina sorc ( one of the best in the game ) can complete this does not make it do-able for all stamina classes.

I'm a stamina nightblade vampire. I tried just stage 1 and the add's literally 2 shot you. I said *** that and will just go wear v15 (only 1.3% difference). I literally do not have the patience to wear some dumb as meta build and be a sheep to complete this. It show's that balance is not even considered what you look at the Zos to do list. You should be able to have various of combination's of gear sustain and skill's to complete this. Not 1 build per class.

I'm going to wait till some real balancing happens. vMA should not be a dps race. It should be avoiding mechanic's. No heavy Armour build can beat this. This arena just show's how op magicka sorc's are as well.

I really hope they tone down the insane amount of damage the add's do. Some build's like mine, do now relie on max damage. I have sustain. However that does not matter anymore since if you dont kill that add instantly you die.

I really hope Zos see's there number's and make some quick change's. This game is turning into max weapon and spell damage. Nothing else matter's. A tank or healer should be able to complete vMA with average damage but that just isn't the case.

Hi, I'm the 8th templar ranked on the NA leaderboards. I use stamina as my main resource pool. Currently my build is 5/1/1 heavy armor. My score is better than most magicka sorcs on the board. I will say it a million times. Veteran Maelstrom Arena is far more reliant on individual player skill than class/build.

Sausage · November 2015

This kind of content is good idea, as some people like it, but give something as awesome as Briarheart causes people to whine. The reason why people whine about VMA is because they want to get the new sets so bad, but they cant. Instead of giving them some awesome gears, they should give some unique craft style, or Title.

Also I dont like the idea, people learn to play with optimal builds and gears, thats not good direction for a game to go.

Nifty2g · November 2015

i just despise round 7, despise doesn't even express my hatred. I would write up a 1500 word essay on why this round sucks if i had to

TERMINAT0R_XVII · November 2015

[/quote]

Access to what gear?
That Trinimac and Briarheart stuff? You can find it in normal Wrothgar treasure chests. Or normal MA.

Oh, wait what? But it's not v16? Do you even know the difference in stats between v15 and v16 gear? 1,3%!

Some thing should be rewarding for being among the best in a large population game. 1.3% better.[/quote]

No actually there are a couple of the new sets that can only be gotten in maelstrom arena.

Sneaky-Snurr · November 2015

gen_reynard2050 wrote: »

why! why! why! I just want solo to complete the arenaaa!

No. Just.. no. No more nerfs. I hope the devs ignore your plea or whatever this is. It's so sad to see this game getting dumbed down due to all the nerfs imposed onto the players and enemy NPCs. Can we please just get through 2015 from now onwards without any more nerfs?

Please?

Nifty2g · November 2015

Sneaky-Snurr wrote: »

gen_reynard2050 wrote: »

why! why! why! I just want solo to complete the arenaaa!

No. Just.. no. No more nerfs. I hope the devs ignore your plea or whatever this is. It's so sad to see this game getting dumbed down due to all the nerfs imposed onto the players and enemy NPCs. Can we please just get through 2015 from now onwards without any more nerfs?

Please?

ill tell it how i see it
not enough people are able to complete the content, no one is going to buy content they have no chance beating.
the first month they dont normally nerf anything to let the 1% have their fun.

and from what it looks like there currently is 0 competition inside vma no one is trying to get #1 people are only running for the weekly. so this is going to obviously cause a nerf

do i want a nerf, no i want damage fixes on certain things and i want bug fixes. but i know zos will just nerf it 20% damage reduction acorss all of it. ill be very surprised and happy if they dont do that.

MLRPZ · November 2015

Good players will always have higher score than "casuals" even if they nerf the thing IMO.
I know it feels good to be able to beat something most of the people can't handle, but each week they are more and more players capable of doing vMA.
I did it in the first week without trying it before on PTS but i'm currently stuck on a 350K-ish score because i'm not a "top 1% player" just a guy with a lot of free time xD
IMO everyone can beat it, you just have to take a chill pill when it comes to bug

kadar · November 2015

"Nerf!"

...NO.
A lot of people I've noticed complaining about the difficulty claim skill by listing accomplishments made in group content. To then compare that to a solo experience that is intended to be really hard, is silly, imo.

Of course you have to change your build. Of course you will die a lot -- you don't have the support of your skilled group.

Perhaps it is better that its not just another daily that you face roll through by yourself as a warm up.
There is hard group content, why should the hard solo content be easier or even on par with that?

Pistolera_ESO · November 2015

I cant pass a single thing unless I go werewolf form. I'm just to casual/suckish for maelstrom and I guess I'll never finish it. Which I REALLY hate not completing! The arena has literally been the first time in this game that has made me slam my fist into my desk and rage quite the game.

PS I haven't been doing it vet lvl.

caperon · November 2015

I completed it for the first time past nigh in my magicka DK after 8 hours of suffering, it was my 3rd run to the arena (ive been there 25 hours in total). 324 final score

I have 430 CP, used twice born+ willpower+ kena + torug (usual) all spell power.

In my opinion 1st of all arena needs bug fixing. Dieing because of bugs is very frustrating and makes (me at least) lose concentration, making it harder than it really is.

2nd, before nerfing anything, i'd prefer a save (stage and deaths, while you advance) feature like the normal mode reseted each week, so people can work on the content. You would lose the hability to apear in leaderboards.

Lastly maybe they could reduce some of the dmg sources, like poison in stage 7, its almost instakill or the crazy crematorial guards. If you dont have a skill to heal you while doing dmg those are crazy hard. If i didnt have magma armor ready i usually died.

Im very happy now ive finished, even with my crapy rewards and crappy score, but I still think its a bit too hard, even knowing that its something that you improve a lot with practice. Being DK is part of the problem looking at leaderboards tho.

PBpsy · November 2015

Nifty2g wrote: »

i just despise round 7, despise doesn't even express my hatred. I would write up a 1500 word essay on why this round sucks if i had to

DO IT!!!!! YOU MUST!!!

usmcjdking · November 2015

vMA is NOT hard lol. It just shows the limitations of their combat system - 3/4ths of the standard *** I can do in other fast paced actions games I cannot do in ESO. It really only requires two things - decent damage & healing/ward > incoming damage. Poor design but they aren't paying me so whatever.

Anyone who is telling you it's a skill based issue has no idea what they are talking about and has almost zero experience will skill based games (NG, FNC, DS, Stalker, Mirror's Edge). ESO combat, with the lack of cooldowns, is educated button mashing. They even have a mechanic that allows you to mash buttons faster.

You need slightly better gear, probably a few more champion points and a better understanding of what skills to use and when to use them.