Removal of VR

dodgehopper_ESO · October 2015

Arato wrote: »

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

s_tibob16_ESO wrote: »

With champion points as an infinite or (near infinite) progression system in place I do not see the need to keep VR levels. I'm really hoping that with their removal comes a simplification of the types of basic crafting materials as well (as in, only iron/steel/(orc?)ore, dwemer, then ebony as the highest tier metal.) Right now there's way too many with the VR's.

You know, I really wanted this myself, in single player TES games, ebony is the highest grade of raw metal (Daedric is just a processed ebony).. but here they've thrown in all kinds of metals that simply don't exist in the TES universe and it feels corny.

But with the raise to VR16 and adding a new tier of material? Not going to happen unfortunately.

A lot of us are thinking this regarding Ebony. I don't understand galatite, quicksilver, void steel or any of those either. They don't really fit the lore too well unless Void Steel, galatite and quicksilver are just ores of Ebony??? I've posted about this topic before as well.

I mean I totally understand making up materials for a fantasy world, afterall, orichalcum doesn't exist, neither does "dwemer metal" (although from the looks of it, it's brass, but that's an alloy), and neither does ebony as a metal (ebony is a wood). Yeah, they're made up, but they're also relatively consistent within the other games in Tamriel. You ALWAYS had iron, steel, dwemer, "orcish" which in Skyrim is made from Orichalcum, ebony, and daedric (which is ebony treated in daedric blood), then there was "elven" which in skyrim is made of moonstone (and in TESO... that makes Khajiit???)

I want consistency. You ruin a fantasy world by making it inconsistent.

I'd like some consistency with Alchemy as well actually. Alchemy was always such a rich skill to work on, and actually is what really drew me into the game of Morrowind to start. My first character in Morrowind was an argonian monk, and as I recall alchemy was one of the level up skills for monk in Morrowind. If that was not the case at the very least I know that I played the hell out of alchemy in that game. The discovery was fun, the gathering and mixing up of materials was fun. It really helped for immersion. Different regions grew different plants, each with their own useful, healthful or deleterious effects. I could craft poisons, I could craft curatives, and I could even craft poisonous curatives. This sort of depth was wonderful. In ESO I don't really see the point. Most of the items you can make with deleterious effects don't really make up for it, making the Snakeblood passive pretty uninteresting. I gather so many materials that I find I'd rather just make the best in class for myself. I am happy that a lot of the materials follow the themes of past games, although I really miss quite a few signature items in Alchemy. Daedra hearts, scathecrew, Saltrice, void salts, frost salts, fire salts, vampire dust, bone meal, giants toe, etc to name a few. I want to make Jarrin Root poisons that actually hurt (DB/Tong patch?). I'd love to make waterbreathing potions or enchantments, but ESO wasn't made for that. Waterwalking and Levitation were signature entertainments for me as well but I can understand them not adding these. I've noticed that Provisioning seems to have taken on some of the functions of alchemy in this Orc patch coming up. I'm hopeful that eventually Alchemy sees its day in the sun though.

TLDR: I feel like a lot of the itemization could use a little bit more serious going over with the lore.

NewBlacksmurf · October 2015

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

deadlock007 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

1 every hour or so maybe if you're just grinding mobs in a circle, which appeals to a very small minority of gamers. If you're questing it takes longer.

LOL, I don't grind

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

Please share by faction, zone and method how you're gaining 1 VR per hour
msg me if you'd rather not comment here.

seriously

Here is a link to the last time I commented on a post about VR ranks. I was very surprised at how easy it is now.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2307563/#Comment_2307563

I'm going to claim your timer is extremely inaccurate.
your comments:

Easily? No. I'd sooner quit the game than play like this. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against grinders, but it irks me when people use grinding XP rate as the baseline. This isn't how everyone imagines having fun.

But it really is a lot easier now than it used to be. My boyfriend and I decided to level a couple of our lower vets the other weekend by doing some quests in Cadwell's gold (I hardly ever grind either) and managed to get 1 1/4 vet levels in about 1.5 hours. This was casual play and even taking a break or 2 for drinks and smokes. Yes we are subbed and married in game and took XP pots but still, it was pretty freakin fast.

So you're telling me that you and someone else played with:
-ESO Plus
-RIng of Mara
-XP Pots

and you didn't grind "hardly" and did quests for approx. 1 - 1.5 hours and gained 1 VR level in Cadwell's gold zone.

Please be specific because having done those and while doing that zone this month with a friend where all situations apply to us, either you lost track of time or you're not sharing something really important. In that timeframe not grinding, my experience has been at best to gain 1/4th of a VR level but you're saying 1+1/4.

Ok it's pretty simple, this is like the 3rd or 4th time both of us have done these quests, so we know the story and skip through the dialog and gather multiple quests in the zone at the same time and work on them at the same time while killing mobs that we run past instead of ignoring them. My point was that VR is a lot easier to get through now and the devs time would be better spent on new content and bug fixes and not reworking the whole game because of a problem that really doesn't exist anymore.

Also, I don't understand just because YOU didn't get it why you would accuse me of being wrong instead of just asking for a little more clarification. That wasn't very nice

#VRNEEDTOSTAY

I'm accusing you of being wrong because I've been playing since closed BETA and PC lauch

deadlock007 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

1 every hour or so maybe if you're just grinding mobs in a circle, which appeals to a very small minority of gamers. If you're questing it takes longer.

LOL, I don't grind

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

Please share by faction, zone and method how you're gaining 1 VR per hour
msg me if you'd rather not comment here.

seriously

Here is a link to the last time I commented on a post about VR ranks. I was very surprised at how easy it is now.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2307563/#Comment_2307563

I'm going to claim your timer is extremely inaccurate.
your comments:

Easily? No. I'd sooner quit the game than play like this. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against grinders, but it irks me when people use grinding XP rate as the baseline. This isn't how everyone imagines having fun.

But it really is a lot easier now than it used to be. My boyfriend and I decided to level a couple of our lower vets the other weekend by doing some quests in Cadwell's gold (I hardly ever grind either) and managed to get 1 1/4 vet levels in about 1.5 hours. This was casual play and even taking a break or 2 for drinks and smokes. Yes we are subbed and married in game and took XP pots but still, it was pretty freakin fast.

So you're telling me that you and someone else played with:
-ESO Plus
-RIng of Mara
-XP Pots

and you didn't grind "hardly" and did quests for approx. 1 - 1.5 hours and gained 1 VR level in Cadwell's gold zone.

Please be specific because having done those and while doing that zone this month with a friend where all situations apply to us, either you lost track of time or you're not sharing something really important. In that timeframe not grinding, my experience has been at best to gain 1/4th of a VR level but you're saying 1+1/4.

Ok it's pretty simple, this is like the 3rd or 4th time both of us have done these quests, so we know the story and skip through the dialog and gather multiple quests in the zone at the same time and work on them at the same time while killing mobs that we run past instead of ignoring them. My point was that VR is a lot easier to get through now and the devs time would be better spent on new content and bug fixes and not reworking the whole game because of a problem that really doesn't exist anymore.

Also, I don't understand just because YOU didn't get it why you would accuse me of being wrong instead of just asking for a little more clarification. That wasn't very nice

#VRNEEDTOSTAY

I'm accusing you of inaccurately sharing the time it took to gain 1+ VR levels because you're suggesting that you gained approx 1.3 to 1.5 mil exp questing in 1 hour.

I've been playing throug each faction and in no rush but basically you're saying you and someone else did an entire zone (most all quests in 1 hour)

That's definitely not a reason for VR levels to stay. While you and others may enjoy the VR zones (which I'm not suggesting to remove) the fact of the matter is it was announced to go away and be replaced with cp.

It's time to finish and stop addon VR levels

NewBlacksmurf · October 2015

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

phbell wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

phbell wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

phbell wrote: »

The only people that I see complaining are those that do not want to do the work to earn them.

define earn them and please specify when said time-frame of "earn them" was accomplished by yourself.

-I'm writing this because depending on when you progressed the methods have changed drastically from PC launch until now.
When it was common to do silver n gold only via grouping and then later the difficulty was changed to allow solo progress. VR was 8, then 10, 12, 14 and now 16 pending what will be a VR18 max soon.

OR Craglorn grinding when that was released as well as the silver and gold zone grinding
.....fast forward to now

All the above has changed so when you comment saying people don't want to work or earn levels, its taken very different depending on whose reading the comments. Right now people hear, "go do all the quests in silver and gold or PvP grind public dungeons or IC sewers."

Me personally...when i see comment like this, I tend to think there is a lack of consideration for others as we all heard and to some extent are aware of the announcement made prior to the justice system, champion system and console launch that Veteran levels are being removed. That alone is the reason VR should be removed....

The "them" to which I refer is Vet levels and by "earn" i mean exactly what the word means. Do the work. I got my first 3 toons to VR 12 back when that was the highest level and each level required more XP last the last - V12 needing something like 5.4M xp. Then 1.6 dropped and those players that followed could earn V12 with 1M xp per level. Then the latest patch has lowered each level to 850K and still people complain.

Lack of consideration? Perhaps. But no more than the lack of consideration offered those that put in the game time and work to reach the VR levels, from those that want the same levels without putting in the same effort.

Remove Vet levels? Every time ZOS says this they add 2 more levels, making it even harder to unwind. Soon VR18 will be the max. That is a odd way to go about eliminating them.

Ok so in context...you're expecting others to progress as you have when in fact whichever way you decided to level up, all options are drastically different and take a whole heck of a lot longer.

The only changes that work to a players advantage now are if they don't mind doing the silver and gold quests (not grinding but the actual quests) or go to a PvP public dungeon or IC sewers all which still take longer than when the max was vr12.

I think both of us having been around back then can fairly agree that things are drastically different.
My question to you is this....why should players "earn" VR levels knowing that they will be completely removed soon?

Regardless of any opinions, does it make sense to "earn" something that will be taken away? (Think of how VR was applied to champion levels) or how (the champion level cap takes away any "earned" champion levels over 502)

In regards to Vet rankings what Zenimax says and what Zenimax does are very different things. Champion Points were intended to replace VR levels, yet we now have both. With each update 2 higher Vet levels have been added, but suddenly CP's are being capped. This is a strange way to go about eliminating Vet Ranks - at least to my thinking. With Capped CP and no other upward progression (vis a vis, Vet levels) the only reason to continue supporting this game is added content;, however, given the fact that the current infrastructure cannot support the current player-base and content (as evidenced with the lag, CTDT, ridiculous load screens, etc.) any new content holds less appeal. Frankly Zenimax appears rudderless so I wouldn't wager real money on any outcomes.

In my opinion...
If they just focus on removing VR and whatever will happen in adjusting CP it makes or allows people to enjoy all content at each person's interest level. Everything isn't for everyone but the first issue was when the game was made too easy.

IF the game was still challenging as it was back around October closed beta then level 50 is actually an accomplishment.
World bosses required help not solo and dolemans required small groups of 3 or more.

VR has found its way into the game for a lack of trying to seperate ppl who want a challenge from "casual" players.

VR hasn't succeeded ever in doing this. Even the dungeons

So...step one...remove VR levels and disconnect any silver n gold ANd Craglorn from that system.
Use champion levels and keep the cap but if they really want to create hard content. Have CP (off) end game encounters and CP for regular encounters. Also bump the effectiveness of cp up a small bit and move the level 3-50 back to where it was in closed beta in Ovtober 2013

Volkodav · October 2015

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

I dont like reaching Vet ranks because it forces you into some zone I didnt plan to play,and still blocks me from others. If it opened up all zones,like all three of them,it would be fine.I try now not to reach vr1.

F7sus4 · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Arato wrote: »

I played Guild Wars for several years. I play GW2 still and have played it since launch. I have several characters at cap with maxed out gear, and they've had those stats for 2+ years, and I'm quite happy they're not raising the level cap in their expansion. I just want more content to do, not more illusory "progression"

There's nothing wrong with adding more levels (VR ranks) to conquer unless it does not mean you need to grind your whole gear again from scratch. This could be easily solved by allowing crafting skills to increase level of the item. Not only would this allow you to keep your gear updates forever, but would eliminate the problem of having VR13 items worth 2k and the same VR14 item worth 200k gold.

Minsc · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Nothing more boring, for me, than GW2 and its lack of progression ( apart from the wvsw skills /grinding for legendary weapons) .
Main reason I prefer the system to remain as it is, is that I have absolute faith in the developers to great a big mess if they proceed with another ground-breaking change

DaveMoeDee · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Aeula wrote: »

Desperately want them to be removed so I can come back, I'm mainly a solo player (Give or take the odd dungeon, trial ect...) and since they've removed all the easy ways of leveling I've been stuck at VR12 since 1.3. I hate craglorn's group-only quests and I hate PvP, but I still want to level to VR 16 to do future trials, wrothgar might help, true, but I doubt it'll take me the 4 VR's I need.
If they won't remove them at least add a way for us solo players to farm the xp we need, reducing the xp needed is nice and all, but it isn't enough.

I am mainly a solo player but the daily solo quests in Cyrodiil give good XP. I used them almost exclusively (plus writs) to level from v12 to v15. Of course, once I hit v16, I'll need to get IC. I'm planning on shelving that character until after I play through Fallout 4. Then I'll sub for Orsinium and play some IC for gear upgrades.

DaveMoeDee · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Turelus wrote: »

I don't care what happens with VR ranks, just give me the chance to use ANY SET at ANY LEVEL!!!

Or maybe a min level for a set is fine, but letting them all go to max level would be nice.

DaveMoeDee · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Rayste wrote: »

At this point, given the amount of new content and different ways to level, there really isn't a reason to remove them. That would be a lot of wasted resources for no reason. If you must, just lower the xp required per vet rank even more.

That said, no more vet levels need to be added.

Isn't there still a reason? 8 x v16 is a big number.

The solution? Only give people 4 character slots.

SleepyTroll · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

WhiskeyRiver.AZub17_ESO wrote: »

I dont like reaching Vet ranks because it forces you into some zone I didnt plan to play,and still blocks me from others. If it opened up all zones,like all three of them,it would be fine.I try now not to reach vr1.

what? this doesn't even make sense, you try not to reach vet one because they force you into another zone? when does that happen? you can go do a bunch of other things at vet 1.

Teiji · October 2015

The only reason Veteran Ranks feel okay now is because over the course of the past year and a half they've been preparing to have them removed.

The reason they are less of a huge issue is due to them reducing the overbearing anxiety and problem of them slowly.

Eventually they will be such a low issue because they will be removed. You can say "Oh I think they're okay now" well, obviously. It's part of the development process of removing something which is tied into every nook and cranny of gameplay post level 50; reduce them in power slowly, fix gameplay, develop DLC, fix DLC and so on - doing this all at the same time while removing Veteran Ranks.

They're being removed regardless of how we feel about it, it's well overdue and is one of the main issues we had to abruptly transition to B2P and have to wait an extra year for Dark Brotherhood, IC, the Thieves Guild and much, much more.

nimander99 · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

It's nice to see that most people like Vranks.

DaveMoeDee · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

SleepyTroll wrote: »

WhiskeyRiver.AZub17_ESO wrote: »

I dont like reaching Vet ranks because it forces you into some zone I didnt plan to play,and still blocks me from others. If it opened up all zones,like all three of them,it would be fine.I try now not to reach vr1.

what? this doesn't even make sense, you try not to reach vet one because they force you into another zone? when does that happen? you can go do a bunch of other things at vet 1.

Sometimes people overthink things and make something unpleasant that would have been pleasant otherwise.

deadlock007 · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

1 every hour or so maybe if you're just grinding mobs in a circle, which appeals to a very small minority of gamers. If you're questing it takes longer.

LOL, I don't grind

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

Please share by faction, zone and method how you're gaining 1 VR per hour
msg me if you'd rather not comment here.

seriously

Here is a link to the last time I commented on a post about VR ranks. I was very surprised at how easy it is now.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2307563/#Comment_2307563

I'm going to claim your timer is extremely inaccurate.
your comments:

Easily? No. I'd sooner quit the game than play like this. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against grinders, but it irks me when people use grinding XP rate as the baseline. This isn't how everyone imagines having fun.

But it really is a lot easier now than it used to be. My boyfriend and I decided to level a couple of our lower vets the other weekend by doing some quests in Cadwell's gold (I hardly ever grind either) and managed to get 1 1/4 vet levels in about 1.5 hours. This was casual play and even taking a break or 2 for drinks and smokes. Yes we are subbed and married in game and took XP pots but still, it was pretty freakin fast.

So you're telling me that you and someone else played with:
-ESO Plus
-RIng of Mara
-XP Pots

and you didn't grind "hardly" and did quests for approx. 1 - 1.5 hours and gained 1 VR level in Cadwell's gold zone.

Please be specific because having done those and while doing that zone this month with a friend where all situations apply to us, either you lost track of time or you're not sharing something really important. In that timeframe not grinding, my experience has been at best to gain 1/4th of a VR level but you're saying 1+1/4.

Ok it's pretty simple, this is like the 3rd or 4th time both of us have done these quests, so we know the story and skip through the dialog and gather multiple quests in the zone at the same time and work on them at the same time while killing mobs that we run past instead of ignoring them. My point was that VR is a lot easier to get through now and the devs time would be better spent on new content and bug fixes and not reworking the whole game because of a problem that really doesn't exist anymore.

Also, I don't understand just because YOU didn't get it why you would accuse me of being wrong instead of just asking for a little more clarification. That wasn't very nice

#VRNEEDTOSTAY

I'm accusing you of being wrong because I've been playing since closed BETA and PC lauch

deadlock007 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

1 every hour or so maybe if you're just grinding mobs in a circle, which appeals to a very small minority of gamers. If you're questing it takes longer.

LOL, I don't grind

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

Please share by faction, zone and method how you're gaining 1 VR per hour
msg me if you'd rather not comment here.

seriously

Here is a link to the last time I commented on a post about VR ranks. I was very surprised at how easy it is now.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2307563/#Comment_2307563

I'm going to claim your timer is extremely inaccurate.
your comments:

Easily? No. I'd sooner quit the game than play like this. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against grinders, but it irks me when people use grinding XP rate as the baseline. This isn't how everyone imagines having fun.

But it really is a lot easier now than it used to be. My boyfriend and I decided to level a couple of our lower vets the other weekend by doing some quests in Cadwell's gold (I hardly ever grind either) and managed to get 1 1/4 vet levels in about 1.5 hours. This was casual play and even taking a break or 2 for drinks and smokes. Yes we are subbed and married in game and took XP pots but still, it was pretty freakin fast.

So you're telling me that you and someone else played with:
-ESO Plus
-RIng of Mara
-XP Pots

and you didn't grind "hardly" and did quests for approx. 1 - 1.5 hours and gained 1 VR level in Cadwell's gold zone.

Please be specific because having done those and while doing that zone this month with a friend where all situations apply to us, either you lost track of time or you're not sharing something really important. In that timeframe not grinding, my experience has been at best to gain 1/4th of a VR level but you're saying 1+1/4.

Ok it's pretty simple, this is like the 3rd or 4th time both of us have done these quests, so we know the story and skip through the dialog and gather multiple quests in the zone at the same time and work on them at the same time while killing mobs that we run past instead of ignoring them. My point was that VR is a lot easier to get through now and the devs time would be better spent on new content and bug fixes and not reworking the whole game because of a problem that really doesn't exist anymore.

Also, I don't understand just because YOU didn't get it why you would accuse me of being wrong instead of just asking for a little more clarification. That wasn't very nice

#VRNEEDTOSTAY

I'm accusing you of inaccurately sharing the time it took to gain 1+ VR levels because you're suggesting that you gained approx 1.3 to 1.5 mil exp questing in 1 hour.

I've been playing throug each faction and in no rush but basically you're saying you and someone else did an entire zone (most all quests in 1 hour)

That's definitely not a reason for VR levels to stay. While you and others may enjoy the VR zones (which I'm not suggesting to remove) the fact of the matter is it was announced to go away and be replaced with cp.

It's time to finish and stop addon VR levels

Ok, I will bite one more time Ms. Smurf. I said I gained around 1 1/4 VR in 1 and 1/2 hours. I know how long it took and how much was gained. I never said it was the whole zone, in fact it was only about 1/2 of a zone. I could go into more detail, but I doubt it would do any good. It seems you are not going to believe me because you haven't done it or can't do it. Also apparently since you have played since beta and I have only played everyday since PC early release that automatically makes you right.

I am only here to support that VR needs to stay. If they tweak the XP a little more and open all the areas as soon as you hit vet, even more people would be just fine with them. It is a waste of time to try to get rid of them and it they do out right get rid of them it will likely screw things up somehow.

Just look at the results of this small poll on a forum full of complaints. The tides are turning my friend, VR ain't so bad anymore.

k9mouse · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

I like the VR system and CS as is. I really don't understand all the whining is about them. I kind of see a point about PVP and CS, but ESO also have PVE. Why should PVE suffer due to PVP camp whining all the time? Most (but not all) neft requests always come from the PVP side of the player based, IMHO.

My view how to remove VR is to set the amount of XP per VR level the same as CS point. It takes 400K to get a CP and if VR level is also takes 400K XP to get, to get to max VR, one just have to have a max of 16 CS points -- easy to get. For all intent and purposes, VR levels will be removed, but in name that way. If the above idea was used, the Max level will be 50 and one can easy get 16 "bonus" stats and skill points fast.

TBH, however, I like how it is now the best. I rather not have ZOS to remove VR at all. Overall it is good to listen to one's player based 90% of the time, but sometimes (like in this case), it is better NOT to listen to the player base.

Olysja · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

vr system atm is pretty perfect. i don't see the point about removing it. v1 v16 grinding in duo is less than 15hours. questing takes a bit more ofc but you will earn CPs from v1 so i don't rly see the problem. if they put 2 more vr each 2new DLC it's fine. ofc they can't do v16 with IC and v18 with Orsinium will be rly rly tard: )

DisgracefulMind · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

There is no need to remove them. They have significantly reduced the xp needed per.

Aerieth · October 2015

You guys do realize that they don't need to replace Veteran Ranks with anything to make it work? That's the whole point.

If you're at max rank/level - what ever you want to call it - when you hit 50 (as in, finish your main story), this means people can get to doing real end-game stuff that much faster instead of grinding twice as many quests as they have from 1-50. The two additional factions worth of grinding made all my friends quit the game, me included. Came back almost a year later to see what's up and finally could finish leveling / ranking up, but it wasn't enjoyable. Not everyone enjoys running through thousands of quests to get where they want to be. Doing hardest PvE content and PvP on a even level with everyone else.

For what I can see, they have two easy options with existing gear:
1) Keep Veteran Ranks in gear. You'd need to be Level 50 to equip them, but you can equip all VR gear at that level (50).
2) Scale all VR gear down to level 50 and make the usable gear pool really big, supporting a far bigger number of viable builds than we have right now. The fact that they haven't scaled DSA and Trials to VR14-16 could mean that this option is what they're going for. Why balance something if you have to balance it again relatively soon (Removal of Veteran Ranks)?

Of course, there's a chance they got something else up their sleeve, but I'd bet on one of these coming true.

Edited for clarity

I_killed_Vivec · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Aerieth wrote: »

You guys do realize that they don't need to replace Veteran Ranks with anything to make it work? That's the whole point.

If you're at max rank/level - what ever you want to call it - when you hit 50 (as in, finish your main story), this means people can get to doing real end-game stuff that much faster instead of grinding twice as many quests as they have from 1-50. The two additional factions worth of grinding made all my friends quit the game, me included. Came back almost a year later to see what's up and finally could finish leveling / ranking up, but it wasn't enjoyable. Not everyone enjoys running through thousands of quests to get where they want to be. Doing hardest PvE content and PvP on a even level with everyone else.

For what I can see, they have two easy options with existing gear:
1) Keep Veteran Ranks in gear. You'd need to be Level 50 to equip them, but you can equip all VR gear at that level (50).
2) Scale all VR gear down to level 50 and make the usable gear pool really big, supporting a far bigger number of viable builds than we have right now. The fact that they haven't scaled DSA and Trials to VR14-16 could mean that this option is what they're going for. Why balance something if you have to balance it again relatively soon (Removal of Veteran Ranks)?

Of course, there's a chance they got something else up their sleeve, but I'd bet on one of these coming true.

Edited for clarity

Oh...

So you just trashed half of crafting - all the VR materials, the food and drink, the enchantments... gone because everything stops at level 50 because when you get there you want the best. With no progression. Ever.

Not scaling DSA and trials to VR16 is indicative of one thing - they want you to buy the DLC!

When it comes to balancing things, why add two VR levels, why add new VR16 gear, why add VR15/16 materials, why add new VR16 enchantments, why add new VR15 food and drink (and even more when Orsinium comes out), why add new VR15 solvents for alchemy... if it's all going to be scrapped?

By the way, if you all quit a year ago, just what happened so that you "finally could finish leveling / ranking up"? There was a reduction in the XP requirement, but 4 more ranks were added. You must be seething about Champion Points! Now there is a grind for you, even if you managed to get a hundred or so leveling your not Vet characters to VR16, you'll still be HUNDREDS of CP behind - doing "hardest" PvE content, PvP "on an even level" with everyone else?

I really don't think so.

NewBlacksmurf · October 2015

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

deadlock007 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

1 every hour or so maybe if you're just grinding mobs in a circle, which appeals to a very small minority of gamers. If you're questing it takes longer.

LOL, I don't grind

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

Please share by faction, zone and method how you're gaining 1 VR per hour
msg me if you'd rather not comment here.

seriously

Here is a link to the last time I commented on a post about VR ranks. I was very surprised at how easy it is now.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2307563/#Comment_2307563

I'm going to claim your timer is extremely inaccurate.
your comments:

Easily? No. I'd sooner quit the game than play like this. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against grinders, but it irks me when people use grinding XP rate as the baseline. This isn't how everyone imagines having fun.

But it really is a lot easier now than it used to be. My boyfriend and I decided to level a couple of our lower vets the other weekend by doing some quests in Cadwell's gold (I hardly ever grind either) and managed to get 1 1/4 vet levels in about 1.5 hours. This was casual play and even taking a break or 2 for drinks and smokes. Yes we are subbed and married in game and took XP pots but still, it was pretty freakin fast.

So you're telling me that you and someone else played with:
-ESO Plus
-RIng of Mara
-XP Pots

and you didn't grind "hardly" and did quests for approx. 1 - 1.5 hours and gained 1 VR level in Cadwell's gold zone.

Please be specific because having done those and while doing that zone this month with a friend where all situations apply to us, either you lost track of time or you're not sharing something really important. In that timeframe not grinding, my experience has been at best to gain 1/4th of a VR level but you're saying 1+1/4.

Ok it's pretty simple, this is like the 3rd or 4th time both of us have done these quests, so we know the story and skip through the dialog and gather multiple quests in the zone at the same time and work on them at the same time while killing mobs that we run past instead of ignoring them. My point was that VR is a lot easier to get through now and the devs time would be better spent on new content and bug fixes and not reworking the whole game because of a problem that really doesn't exist anymore.

Also, I don't understand just because YOU didn't get it why you would accuse me of being wrong instead of just asking for a little more clarification. That wasn't very nice

#VRNEEDTOSTAY

I'm accusing you of being wrong because I've been playing since closed BETA and PC lauch

deadlock007 wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

1 every hour or so maybe if you're just grinding mobs in a circle, which appeals to a very small minority of gamers. If you're questing it takes longer.

LOL, I don't grind

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

deadlock007 wrote: »

The_Drexill wrote: »

VR is why I haven't come back to the game, and likely wont. Leaves you too far behind after a break... not to mention they're 100% boring and uninspired.

You know they have changed them so you can easily get 1 every hour or so. We have people wanting to make the devs rework the whole game over something that takes about 15-20 hours of playtime. It's even worse when some of the people demanding it DON'T EVEN PLAY THE GAME......

Please share by faction, zone and method how you're gaining 1 VR per hour
msg me if you'd rather not comment here.

seriously

Here is a link to the last time I commented on a post about VR ranks. I was very surprised at how easy it is now.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2307563/#Comment_2307563

I'm going to claim your timer is extremely inaccurate.
your comments:

Easily? No. I'd sooner quit the game than play like this. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against grinders, but it irks me when people use grinding XP rate as the baseline. This isn't how everyone imagines having fun.

But it really is a lot easier now than it used to be. My boyfriend and I decided to level a couple of our lower vets the other weekend by doing some quests in Cadwell's gold (I hardly ever grind either) and managed to get 1 1/4 vet levels in about 1.5 hours. This was casual play and even taking a break or 2 for drinks and smokes. Yes we are subbed and married in game and took XP pots but still, it was pretty freakin fast.

So you're telling me that you and someone else played with:
-ESO Plus
-RIng of Mara
-XP Pots

and you didn't grind "hardly" and did quests for approx. 1 - 1.5 hours and gained 1 VR level in Cadwell's gold zone.

Please be specific because having done those and while doing that zone this month with a friend where all situations apply to us, either you lost track of time or you're not sharing something really important. In that timeframe not grinding, my experience has been at best to gain 1/4th of a VR level but you're saying 1+1/4.

Ok it's pretty simple, this is like the 3rd or 4th time both of us have done these quests, so we know the story and skip through the dialog and gather multiple quests in the zone at the same time and work on them at the same time while killing mobs that we run past instead of ignoring them. My point was that VR is a lot easier to get through now and the devs time would be better spent on new content and bug fixes and not reworking the whole game because of a problem that really doesn't exist anymore.

Also, I don't understand just because YOU didn't get it why you would accuse me of being wrong instead of just asking for a little more clarification. That wasn't very nice

#VRNEEDTOSTAY

I'm accusing you of inaccurately sharing the time it took to gain 1+ VR levels because you're suggesting that you gained approx 1.3 to 1.5 mil exp questing in 1 hour.

I've been playing throug each faction and in no rush but basically you're saying you and someone else did an entire zone (most all quests in 1 hour)

That's definitely not a reason for VR levels to stay. While you and others may enjoy the VR zones (which I'm not suggesting to remove) the fact of the matter is it was announced to go away and be replaced with cp.

It's time to finish and stop addon VR levels

Ok, I will bite one more time Ms. Smurf. I said I gained around 1 1/4 VR in 1 and 1/2 hours. I know how long it took and how much was gained. I never said it was the whole zone, in fact it was only about 1/2 of a zone. I could go into more detail, but I doubt it would do any good. It seems you are not going to believe me because you haven't done it or can't do it. Also apparently since you have played since beta and I have only played everyday since PC early release that automatically makes you right.

I am only here to support that VR needs to stay. If they tweak the XP a little more and open all the areas as soon as you hit vet, even more people would be just fine with them. It is a waste of time to try to get rid of them and it they do out right get rid of them it will likely screw things up somehow.

Just look at the results of this small poll on a forum full of complaints. The tides are turning my friend, VR ain't so bad anymore.

Ahhh....I see where you're going with this.
-I'm suggesting that the amount of exp you gained during the time when you gained it "a couple of weeks ago" in a post on Oct 8th suggests that during this time you had multiple exp bonuses going such as EXP pots, ring of Mara and ESP Plus with the 15% reduction of Vet exp and benefits of 50% increase vet quest exp.

With all that in context, you're sharing that you and your partner gained over 1,000,000 exp in less than 90 minutes (actually less due to your breaks). Yes I don't believe you....and what I'm saying is I believe that you gained at or over 1,000,000 exp and that you did 1/2 of a zone and had all the benefits going but I do not believe the amount of time this was accomplished in is accurate.

I'm not limiting this to what I've been able to achieve but basing this off of actual application. The only place that you can pull that amount of exp in that time-frame is either, public dungeon grinds, Cyrodil questing/grinding or PvE grinding.
I've not done every quest in the game but I have done over 90% of base, silver and gold quests starting on AD and DC factions and the time it takes to complete even half a zone of quests in either gold zone is more than 90 minutes.

Regarding VR needing to stay....
-What good does VR offer if the future is scaled content, the grouping tool now remove level requirements, Cyrodil battle levels everyone to a min of VR14 and CP's are on a catch-up with a max?

The game is being changed so that we all can play together better. Keeping VR, keeps separation and disconnects us from content. The character progression model in this game is based on a 3-50 level range and VR tries to add on to that only incorporating gear, weapons, mats and resource pools.

The VR's aren't even real levels and don't need to be here along with CP's. CP's provide a much longer progression with better rewards so it makes sense to remove VR's. Maybe even as a bonus the silver and gold zones become scaled to each character after finishing the main story.

Aerieth · October 2015

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

Aerieth wrote: »

You guys do realize that they don't need to replace Veteran Ranks with anything to make it work? That's the whole point.

If you're at max rank/level - what ever you want to call it - when you hit 50 (as in, finish your main story), this means people can get to doing real end-game stuff that much faster instead of grinding twice as many quests as they have from 1-50. The two additional factions worth of grinding made all my friends quit the game, me included. Came back almost a year later to see what's up and finally could finish leveling / ranking up, but it wasn't enjoyable. Not everyone enjoys running through thousands of quests to get where they want to be. Doing hardest PvE content and PvP on a even level with everyone else.

For what I can see, they have two easy options with existing gear:
1) Keep Veteran Ranks in gear. You'd need to be Level 50 to equip them, but you can equip all VR gear at that level (50).
2) Scale all VR gear down to level 50 and make the usable gear pool really big, supporting a far bigger number of viable builds than we have right now. The fact that they haven't scaled DSA and Trials to VR14-16 could mean that this option is what they're going for. Why balance something if you have to balance it again relatively soon (Removal of Veteran Ranks)?

Of course, there's a chance they got something else up their sleeve, but I'd bet on one of these coming true.

Edited for clarity

Oh...

So you just trashed half of crafting - all the VR materials, the food and drink, the enchantments... gone because everything stops at level 50 because when you get there you want the best. With no progression. Ever.

Not scaling DSA and trials to VR16 is indicative of one thing - they want you to buy the DLC!

When it comes to balancing things, why add two VR levels, why add new VR16 gear, why add VR15/16 materials, why add new VR16 enchantments, why add new VR15 food and drink (and even more when Orsinium comes out), why add new VR15 solvents for alchemy... if it's all going to be scrapped?

By the way, if you all quit a year ago, just what happened so that you "finally could finish leveling / ranking up"? There was a reduction in the XP requirement, but 4 more ranks were added. You must be seething about Champion Points! Now there is a grind for you, even if you managed to get a hundred or so leveling your not Vet characters to VR16, you'll still be HUNDREDS of CP behind - doing "hardest" PvE content, PvP "on an even level" with everyone else?

I really don't think so.

The champion system is a whole another can of worms. This thread is about "Removal of VR", not about CP.

I didn't quit a year ago. We all started the live game from early-access, though most of us played since the beta. I came back after a year of not playing the game. We all quit about a month into the game's launch, before they raised the cap to 12.

Why add stuff? People need something to do while they work on more content and the removal of the ranks. As I said in my post: "The fact that they haven't scaled DSA and Trials to VR14-16 could mean that this option is what they're going for."

The increase in max level (read: power level) is the easiest way for an MMO to start from a clean slate. No need to worry about the balancing of old items, if they're going to be obsolete compared to new ones, in their total power level. No need to worry about the balance of new content compared to the old if everything new is on a complete new level.

They might as well keep the progression in gear and items, to me it makes no difference. All I want is the character level grind to end along with the main story. They can keep the Cadwell's in there for those who want more solo questing. On my alts I'll just visit to get my skill points.

Sausage · October 2015

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

Aerieth wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

Aerieth wrote: »

You guys do realize that they don't need to replace Veteran Ranks with anything to make it work? That's the whole point.

If you're at max rank/level - what ever you want to call it - when you hit 50 (as in, finish your main story), this means people can get to doing real end-game stuff that much faster instead of grinding twice as many quests as they have from 1-50. The two additional factions worth of grinding made all my friends quit the game, me included. Came back almost a year later to see what's up and finally could finish leveling / ranking up, but it wasn't enjoyable. Not everyone enjoys running through thousands of quests to get where they want to be. Doing hardest PvE content and PvP on a even level with everyone else.

For what I can see, they have two easy options with existing gear:
1) Keep Veteran Ranks in gear. You'd need to be Level 50 to equip them, but you can equip all VR gear at that level (50).
2) Scale all VR gear down to level 50 and make the usable gear pool really big, supporting a far bigger number of viable builds than we have right now. The fact that they haven't scaled DSA and Trials to VR14-16 could mean that this option is what they're going for. Why balance something if you have to balance it again relatively soon (Removal of Veteran Ranks)?

Of course, there's a chance they got something else up their sleeve, but I'd bet on one of these coming true.

Edited for clarity

Oh...

So you just trashed half of crafting - all the VR materials, the food and drink, the enchantments... gone because everything stops at level 50 because when you get there you want the best. With no progression. Ever.

Not scaling DSA and trials to VR16 is indicative of one thing - they want you to buy the DLC!

When it comes to balancing things, why add two VR levels, why add new VR16 gear, why add VR15/16 materials, why add new VR16 enchantments, why add new VR15 food and drink (and even more when Orsinium comes out), why add new VR15 solvents for alchemy... if it's all going to be scrapped?

By the way, if you all quit a year ago, just what happened so that you "finally could finish leveling / ranking up"? There was a reduction in the XP requirement, but 4 more ranks were added. You must be seething about Champion Points! Now there is a grind for you, even if you managed to get a hundred or so leveling your not Vet characters to VR16, you'll still be HUNDREDS of CP behind - doing "hardest" PvE content, PvP "on an even level" with everyone else?

I really don't think so.

The champion system is a whole another can of worms. This thread is about "Removal of VR", not about CP.

I didn't quit a year ago. We all started the live game from early-access, though most of us played since the beta. I came back after a year of not playing the game. We all quit about a month into the game's launch, before they raised the cap to 12.

Why add stuff? People need something to do while they work on more content and the removal of the ranks. As I said in my post: "The fact that they haven't scaled DSA and Trials to VR14-16 could mean that this option is what they're going for."

The increase in max level (read: power level) is the easiest way for an MMO to start from a clean slate. No need to worry about the balancing of old items, if they're going to be obsolete compared to new ones, in their total power level. No need to worry about the balance of new content compared to the old if everything new is on a complete new level.

They might as well keep the progression in gear and items, to me it makes no difference. All I want is the character level grind to end along with the main story. They can keep the Cadwell's in there for those who want more solo questing. On my alts I'll just visit to get my skill points.

If you read the options carefully theres one "I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else." VRs are replaced with CP. So this thread is about CP too.

Im sure Zen have great things for us planned after VR-removal.

Pallmor · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Leave the VR system alone. Every time ZOS tries to fix something this big, they usually just make it worse.

shadowwraith666 · October 2015

i am a bit undecided on the VR matter atm as i've still to reach that stage in the game however from what i've read about the CP system especially about then being shared with other characters (similar to diablo's paragon system) sounds like a good idea.

Aerieth · October 2015

Sausage wrote: »

Aerieth wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

Aerieth wrote: »

You guys do realize that they don't need to replace Veteran Ranks with anything to make it work? That's the whole point.

If you're at max rank/level - what ever you want to call it - when you hit 50 (as in, finish your main story), this means people can get to doing real end-game stuff that much faster instead of grinding twice as many quests as they have from 1-50. The two additional factions worth of grinding made all my friends quit the game, me included. Came back almost a year later to see what's up and finally could finish leveling / ranking up, but it wasn't enjoyable. Not everyone enjoys running through thousands of quests to get where they want to be. Doing hardest PvE content and PvP on a even level with everyone else.

For what I can see, they have two easy options with existing gear:
1) Keep Veteran Ranks in gear. You'd need to be Level 50 to equip them, but you can equip all VR gear at that level (50).
2) Scale all VR gear down to level 50 and make the usable gear pool really big, supporting a far bigger number of viable builds than we have right now. The fact that they haven't scaled DSA and Trials to VR14-16 could mean that this option is what they're going for. Why balance something if you have to balance it again relatively soon (Removal of Veteran Ranks)?

Of course, there's a chance they got something else up their sleeve, but I'd bet on one of these coming true.

Edited for clarity

Oh...

So you just trashed half of crafting - all the VR materials, the food and drink, the enchantments... gone because everything stops at level 50 because when you get there you want the best. With no progression. Ever.

Not scaling DSA and trials to VR16 is indicative of one thing - they want you to buy the DLC!

When it comes to balancing things, why add two VR levels, why add new VR16 gear, why add VR15/16 materials, why add new VR16 enchantments, why add new VR15 food and drink (and even more when Orsinium comes out), why add new VR15 solvents for alchemy... if it's all going to be scrapped?

By the way, if you all quit a year ago, just what happened so that you "finally could finish leveling / ranking up"? There was a reduction in the XP requirement, but 4 more ranks were added. You must be seething about Champion Points! Now there is a grind for you, even if you managed to get a hundred or so leveling your not Vet characters to VR16, you'll still be HUNDREDS of CP behind - doing "hardest" PvE content, PvP "on an even level" with everyone else?

I really don't think so.

The champion system is a whole another can of worms. This thread is about "Removal of VR", not about CP.

I didn't quit a year ago. We all started the live game from early-access, though most of us played since the beta. I came back after a year of not playing the game. We all quit about a month into the game's launch, before they raised the cap to 12.

Why add stuff? People need something to do while they work on more content and the removal of the ranks. As I said in my post: "The fact that they haven't scaled DSA and Trials to VR14-16 could mean that this option is what they're going for."

The increase in max level (read: power level) is the easiest way for an MMO to start from a clean slate. No need to worry about the balancing of old items, if they're going to be obsolete compared to new ones, in their total power level. No need to worry about the balance of new content compared to the old if everything new is on a complete new level.

They might as well keep the progression in gear and items, to me it makes no difference. All I want is the character level grind to end along with the main story. They can keep the Cadwell's in there for those who want more solo questing. On my alts I'll just visit to get my skill points.

If you read the options carefully theres one "I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else." VRs are replaced with CP. So this thread is about CP too.

Im sure Zen have great things for us planned after VR-removal.

My statement was made assuming "something else" didn't include CP, but something else that hasn't been mentioned by ZOS. If this wasn't the OP's intention, then my bad.

terrordactyl1971 · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

I don't see any benefit to removing them. It will take up lots of dev time that could be spent making new content, then we'll have 3 months of patches afterwards fixing the things it broke.

Better to leave as is and just tweak from time to time. Wholesale changes aren't worth it

Sleep · October 2015

I think they're just going to rename it.

Callous2208 · October 2015

I want to keep VR ranks but they should be modified somehow.

Sleep wrote: »

I think they're just going to rename it.

That's what I would do. 90% of people would be giddy and move on. Happily grinding out 16 regular levels instead of vr's because reasons.

Enodoc · October 2015

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

Sleep wrote: »

I think they're just going to rename it.

If they did that and nothing else, they won't get rid of the problem. Therefore I think that would be unlikely.

Nestor · October 2015

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Thing is, if they remove the VR Ranks, is the Grind still going to go away? Your still going to have to level something on your character through some system to gain power or is everyone going to be become all powerful at L50 or whatever? Or does character progression continue after LMax? If it continues, what is the mechanism? CP's? People have to grind for those or do quests to get those. So, your going to still be doing the same content or grind if you want to progress your character.