Official Feedback Thread for Crafting Node Scaling

Pangnirtung · October 2015

BalticBlues wrote: »

Crafting WAS FUN in former times, but since IC, CRAFTING SUCKS.
ZOS, please bring back the fun in crafting. Please do not repeat the failures of the IC.
People hope that Orisinium will fix crafting. Please give us back the crafting fun in the game.

This one thousand times ZOS.

Why have you taken something that was fun and interesting and made it into a boring and almost pointless grind?

Who decided to do this to an unbroken facet of the game?

helediron · October 2015

Faulgor wrote: »

helediron wrote: »

After spending three days in Wrothgar, these are my harvesting and crafting results.
...snip...

I find it odd that I got a third of the refined materials you got over three days within a single hour.

We can't compare these results directly. The difference was you collected only vr15 nodes when i collected everything. I believe your method is much faster when looking for only vr15+ mats and nothing wrong with that. My goal was to get the statistics and fill HarvestMap. Just to clarify three days was totally 18 hours of playtime consisting of questing, exploring and farming. Of those activities, farming took maybe 6-7 hours.

I farmed the area with speedbuff and nightblade cloak, which in practise rivals harvesting speed with horse. If you got third of my mats, then three hours would have brought same amount. If i spent six hours, my effeciency was half of yours. But that's logical because i farmed also the lower tier nodes.

I just wonder how farming of only top tier nodes works in live? Will the area fill with only vr14 nodes just like selective flower farming?

Ourorboros · October 2015

angelyn wrote: »

Maotti_Nor wrote: »

Hagebutte wrote: »

In the german forums @ZOS_KaiSchober answered questions about the node scaling/number :

ZOS_KaiSchober wrote: »

JCHunsi wrote: »

Ist es eigentlich beasichtigt das man, bei ausgelevelten Handwerksfähigkeiten, auch die V10 - V14 Materialien findetet oder sollte man nur die neuen Materialen finden?
Konnte dies in den Patchnotes dies bezüglich nichts genaueres finden!
Habe bis jetzt nämlich nur das Glück gehabt die die V14 Materialien zu finden bis auf 2 Rohe Ahnenseidevorkommen.

Ja, es ist Absicht, da die Handwerk9-Materialien noch für die Dailies gebraucht werden, Das Verhältnis dürfte bei ca. 4:1 zu Gunsten der VR10-14 Mats liegen.

Roughly translated, he says that you still find V10-14 mats because they are still needed for dailies. The ratio should supposedly be 4(old):1(new).

I asked which dailies he's referring to, since the writs definitely require the new mats. Moreover the ratio is far from 4:1 in my experience.

That doesn't even make sense!

Nightwood, Voidstone and Void cloth drops in VR7-10 zones and Craglorn aswell. Same with Shadowhide which is found in VR8-10 areas + Craglorn.

Or have you forgotten about these areas Zenimax?

Yes. Any player needing V14 mats can farm in loads of other places. Orsinium should ONLY DROP THE HIGHEST MATERIAL YOU CAN CRAFT WITH.

Saying only high level mats

Pangnirtung wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Crafting WAS FUN in former times, but since IC, CRAFTING SUCKS.
ZOS, please bring back the fun in crafting. Please do not repeat the failures of the IC.
People hope that Orisinium will fix crafting. Please give us back the crafting fun in the game.

This one thousand times ZOS.

Why have you taken something that was fun and interesting and made it into a boring and almost pointless grind?

Who decided to do this to an unbroken facet of the game?

Yeah, pointless grind from our perspective. But it doubtless has a point, or they wouldn't have made the changes. Anyone who is surprised when more crafting items show up in the crown store is ignoring the writing on the wall.

Grileenor · October 2015

Ourorboros wrote: »

Yeah, pointless grind from our perspective. But it doubtless has a point, or they wouldn't have made the changes. Anyone who is surprised when more crafting items show up in the crown store is ignoring the writing on the wall.

You believe, ZOS is trying to trade fun for money? This has never worked and never will. When the fun is leaving so are the customers.

Nebthet78 · October 2015

Grileenor wrote: »

Ourorboros wrote: »

Yeah, pointless grind from our perspective. But it doubtless has a point, or they wouldn't have made the changes. Anyone who is surprised when more crafting items show up in the crown store is ignoring the writing on the wall.

You believe, ZOS is trying to trade fun for money? This has never worked and never will. When the fun is leaving so are the customers.

Considering this is what has happened with the mats grind introduced in IC..Yes, Yes I do feel that ZOS is trying to trade fun for money and playing like myself are speaking up and warning them to reverse that course now because we will not accept it with the release of Orsinium.

I hate IC because of the grind it forced on me to be able to gain mats to upgrade my crafted gear so I was better at doing trials with the guild I am in using my tank/dps hybrid because I won't be forced into a cookie cutter role to do things that are suppose to be fun.

BalticBlues · October 2015

Grileenor wrote: »

Yes I do feel that ZOS is trying to trade fun for money and playing like myself are speaking up and warning them to reverse that course now because we will not accept it with the release of Orsinium.

The strange this is, IMHO they do not "trade fun for money".
Instead, they trade fun for grinding.
This is something I really do not understand. What is the purpose?

As a fan who had so much fun in the game, I was decided to buy each and every DLC.
ZOS could have all my DLC money I spend each month. I am the ideal customer.
Then the IC DLC turned all the fun I had in the game into grinding.
As such, the IC for me was the worst DLC I've bought this year.

I will buy Orisinium the day it comes out, because I cannot give up hope yet.
However, if Orisinium will be grinding again instead of fun, this will probably be my last DLC.
I am playing games to have fun. There is tedious "grinding" enough in most of our daily jobs.

Therefore, ZOS, please take our DLC money for Orisinium and make crafting fun again.

angelyn · October 2015

BalticBlues wrote: »

Grileenor wrote: »

Yes I do feel that ZOS is trying to trade fun for money and playing like myself are speaking up and warning them to reverse that course now because we will not accept it with the release of Orsinium.

The strange this is, IMHO they do not "trade fun for money".
Instead, they trade fun for grinding.
This is something I really do not understand. What is the purpose?

As a fan who had so much fun in the game, I was decided to buy each and every DLC.
ZOS could have all my DLC money I spend each month. I am the ideal customer.
Then the IC DLC turned all the fun I had in the game into grinding.
As such, the IC for me was the worst DLC I've bought this year.

I will buy Orisinium the day it comes out, because I cannot give up hope yet.
However, if Orisinium will be grinding again instead of fun, this will probably be my last DLC.
I am playing games to have fun. There is tedious "grinding" enough in most of our daily jobs.

Therefore, ZOS, please take our DLC money for Orisinium and make crafting fun again.

Absolutely. I play to have fun. For me grind does not equal fun.

Faulgor · October 2015

angelyn wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Grileenor wrote: »

Yes I do feel that ZOS is trying to trade fun for money and playing like myself are speaking up and warning them to reverse that course now because we will not accept it with the release of Orsinium.

The strange this is, IMHO they do not "trade fun for money".
Instead, they trade fun for grinding.
This is something I really do not understand. What is the purpose?

As a fan who had so much fun in the game, I was decided to buy each and every DLC.
ZOS could have all my DLC money I spend each month. I am the ideal customer.
Then the IC DLC turned all the fun I had in the game into grinding.
As such, the IC for me was the worst DLC I've bought this year.

I will buy Orisinium the day it comes out, because I cannot give up hope yet.
However, if Orisinium will be grinding again instead of fun, this will probably be my last DLC.
I am playing games to have fun. There is tedious "grinding" enough in most of our daily jobs.

Therefore, ZOS, please take our DLC money for Orisinium and make crafting fun again.

Absolutely. I play to have fun. For me grind does not equal fun.

Frankly that sounds tautological to me. People always call what they don't consider fun "grinding".

I have fun collecting trophies in IC sewers.
I have fun collecting loot to deconstruct for materials.
I have fun collecting crafting nodes with a chance for double yield / Nirncrux / Casserite / whatever.
I have fun collecting materials to do my daily writs for a chance to get a Glass Fragment.
I have fun earning Champion Points when I have a nice leveling spot for myself.

Yet all of these things have been called grinding at one time or another. The term doesn't mean anything but "I don't want to do it" and adds nothing to the discussion in my opinion.

Flattedfifth · October 2015

Faulgor wrote: »

angelyn wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Grileenor wrote: »

Yes I do feel that ZOS is trying to trade fun for money and playing like myself are speaking up and warning them to reverse that course now because we will not accept it with the release of Orsinium.

The strange this is, IMHO they do not "trade fun for money".
Instead, they trade fun for grinding.
This is something I really do not understand. What is the purpose?

As a fan who had so much fun in the game, I was decided to buy each and every DLC.
ZOS could have all my DLC money I spend each month. I am the ideal customer.
Then the IC DLC turned all the fun I had in the game into grinding.
As such, the IC for me was the worst DLC I've bought this year.

I will buy Orisinium the day it comes out, because I cannot give up hope yet.
However, if Orisinium will be grinding again instead of fun, this will probably be my last DLC.
I am playing games to have fun. There is tedious "grinding" enough in most of our daily jobs.

Therefore, ZOS, please take our DLC money for Orisinium and make crafting fun again.

Absolutely. I play to have fun. For me grind does not equal fun.

Frankly that sounds tautological to me. People always call what they don't consider fun "grinding".

I have fun collecting trophies in IC sewers.
I have fun collecting loot to deconstruct for materials.
I have fun collecting crafting nodes with a chance for double yield / Nirncrux / Casserite / whatever.
I have fun collecting materials to do my daily writs for a chance to get a Glass Fragment.
I have fun earning Champion Points when I have a nice leveling spot for myself.

Yet all of these things have been called grinding at one time or another. The term doesn't mean anything but "I don't want to do it" and adds nothing to the discussion in my opinion.

Get ready to be burned at the stake for the truth.

angelyn · October 2015

Flattedfifth wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

angelyn wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Grileenor wrote: »

Yes I do feel that ZOS is trying to trade fun for money and playing like myself are speaking up and warning them to reverse that course now because we will not accept it with the release of Orsinium.

The strange this is, IMHO they do not "trade fun for money".
Instead, they trade fun for grinding.
This is something I really do not understand. What is the purpose?

As a fan who had so much fun in the game, I was decided to buy each and every DLC.
ZOS could have all my DLC money I spend each month. I am the ideal customer.
Then the IC DLC turned all the fun I had in the game into grinding.
As such, the IC for me was the worst DLC I've bought this year.

I will buy Orisinium the day it comes out, because I cannot give up hope yet.
However, if Orisinium will be grinding again instead of fun, this will probably be my last DLC.
I am playing games to have fun. There is tedious "grinding" enough in most of our daily jobs.

Therefore, ZOS, please take our DLC money for Orisinium and make crafting fun again.

Absolutely. I play to have fun. For me grind does not equal fun.

Frankly that sounds tautological to me. People always call what they don't consider fun "grinding".

I have fun collecting trophies in IC sewers.
I have fun collecting loot to deconstruct for materials.
I have fun collecting crafting nodes with a chance for double yield / Nirncrux / Casserite / whatever.
I have fun collecting materials to do my daily writs for a chance to get a Glass Fragment.
I have fun earning Champion Points when I have a nice leveling spot for myself.

Yet all of these things have been called grinding at one time or another. The term doesn't mean anything but "I don't want to do it" and adds nothing to the discussion in my opinion.

Get ready to be burned at the stake for the truth.

Actually, I do not resort to flaming/insulting or using an aggressive tone with people who have a different opinion to me. You can see this in another thread where im addressing Faulgor respectfully and thanking them for not turning a disagreement of opinions into a slanging match.

Perhaps, @Faulgor I should have been more explicit, since I can see where you are coming from:

Monotonous/miniscule/time consuming tasks(or activities perceived as such) can be enjoyable/ entertaining up to a point. For example, it may be fun to crochet for half an hour a day, knowing that in a month I'll have crocheted a blanket. Spending all the time in my day crocheting, without the knowledge that a goal of a blanket is atleast achievable within the next year doesn't equal fun to me. It is then a grind.

The point where they tip into "Un fun "/grind territory for me, is when there is so much of it in game, that I am unable to spend time on anything else, or where it's suddenly being implemented where there wasn't one before, and the objects of said grinding appear in the cash shop. An example of this would be trying to find mats for 3 days, and still not having enough to fulfill a "daily" writ, in which the materials invested are worth 30k and the "reward" is 10k at most.

So TLDR, some "grinding" may be ok. Making crafting all "grinding", will tip it from being fun into being a tedious chore for many people. Since as you mentioned in another thread,the recent crafting changes have encouraged you to start doing writs, deconstructing and crafting items, your opinion will most assuredly be different to the majority of people who have been doing those activities already, since the days they started playing the game.

/respectfully disagreeing

Zahne · October 2015

I don't understand why v15+ materials have to be rare in the first place, If I am a max level character with maxxed out crafting I shouldn't struggle to find enough materials to make myself a set of armor

GTech_1 · October 2015

Faulgor wrote: »

angelyn wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Grileenor wrote: »

Yes I do feel that ZOS is trying to trade fun for money and playing like myself are speaking up and warning them to reverse that course now because we will not accept it with the release of Orsinium.

The strange this is, IMHO they do not "trade fun for money".
Instead, they trade fun for grinding.
This is something I really do not understand. What is the purpose?

As a fan who had so much fun in the game, I was decided to buy each and every DLC.
ZOS could have all my DLC money I spend each month. I am the ideal customer.
Then the IC DLC turned all the fun I had in the game into grinding.
As such, the IC for me was the worst DLC I've bought this year.

I will buy Orisinium the day it comes out, because I cannot give up hope yet.
However, if Orisinium will be grinding again instead of fun, this will probably be my last DLC.
I am playing games to have fun. There is tedious "grinding" enough in most of our daily jobs.

Therefore, ZOS, please take our DLC money for Orisinium and make crafting fun again.

Absolutely. I play to have fun. For me grind does not equal fun.

Frankly that sounds tautological to me. People always call what they don't consider fun "grinding".

I have fun collecting trophies in IC sewers.
I have fun collecting loot to deconstruct for materials.
I have fun collecting crafting nodes with a chance for double yield / Nirncrux / Casserite / whatever.
I have fun collecting materials to do my daily writs for a chance to get a Glass Fragment.
I have fun earning Champion Points when I have a nice leveling spot for myself.

Yet all of these things have been called grinding at one time or another. The term doesn't mean anything but "I don't want to do it" and adds nothing to the discussion in my opinion.

"I don't want to do it" adds quite a bit to a "Feedback" thread.
In fact, that is the entire, directed, purpose of a feedback thread.

This thread is not here to discuss the accepted definition of "Grind".

The obvious:
Games are supposed to be fun, not work. That's why folks play them.
I (currently) pay Zenimax to deliver that fun.
That may change, with decisions such as this one, and that is likely why they posted the feedback thread in the first place: To determine if the system would be a success.

As inferred by the vast majority of folks in this thread, including myself:
The current system on the PTS is an unacceptable, tedious, gear grind.

Additional note: Previous Elder Scrolls titles have never been a tedious gear grind.
And in fact, decisions like these risk damaging the integrity of the Elder Scrolls IP.

Sincerely,
~GTech_1

SpAEkus · October 2015

@ZOS_GinaBruno

I posted this on the Patch 2.2.1 page as well.

Did the 2.2.1 patch change the Orsinium Writs/Material Leveling again?

I just pulled a Clothing Writ from the Orsinium City board and received a Writ for Belkarth, Craglorn.

The character is VR6 with L50 Clothing Skill with 10/10 material passive. I thought the writs were still tied to material skill levels with Orsinium. Did today's patch add back in a character usable check as well?

Or is the writ board not accepting that I have access to Orsinium as a VR6 character with battle leveling.

If the writ board in Orsinium is going to use requirement tables all the way from Veteran 14 to Veteran 16 we will have to jump all the way back and forth between Craglorn and Orsinium.

If the Orsinium writ board has the same character level check as Craglorn does for VR1 then that should be noted in the patch notes or add a notice to the writ board that you will still only receive VR14 material writs unless you are character level VR15.

Wycks · October 2015

Do Veteran Rank 15 and above materials still feel rare?

So rare that everyone going to stop playing because you forgot games are supposed to be fun.

Pangnirtung · October 2015

bob.ellisonb16_ESO wrote: »

Do Veteran Rank 15 and above materials still feel rare?

So rare that everyone going to stop playing because you forgot games are supposed to be fun.

If you are asking if they are more frequent since the last patch it seems to me like NOTHING has changed.

Out of every ten nodes ONE seems to be Rubedite. Still really, really low for crafting.

Sounomi · October 2015

SpAEkus wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno

I posted this on the Patch 2.2.1 page as well.

Did the 2.2.1 patch change the Orsinium Writs/Material Leveling again?

I just pulled a Clothing Writ from the Orsinium City board and received a Writ for Belkarth, Craglorn.

The character is VR6 with L50 Clothing Skill with 10/10 material passive. I thought the writs were still tied to material skill levels with Orsinium. Did today's patch add back in a character usable check as well?

Or is the writ board not accepting that I have access to Orsinium as a VR6 character with battle leveling.

If the writ board in Orsinium is going to use requirement tables all the way from Veteran 14 to Veteran 16 we will have to jump all the way back and forth between Craglorn and Orsinium.

If the Orsinium writ board has the same character level check as Craglorn does for VR1 then that should be noted in the patch notes or add a notice to the writ board that you will still only receive VR14 material writs unless you are character level VR15.

I checked this with my V15 char that has maxed out crafting and they got the usual Craglorn writs as well. That's fine by me since tier 9 mats are so much easier to get and they seem dead set on keeping tier 10 mats on the rarer side (which IMHO, is fine as well).

Now if they'd just put the hirelings back to where they were. Getting some tier 9 mats with a chance of a refined tier 10 mat was better than a single tier 10 raw mat.

Although I've been getting tier 10 enchanting runes consistently, which is quite nice.

Casdha · October 2015

Has anyone tested with a friend whether or not you see the same node if you are at the same level of crafting. Is your Rubedite their Void stone when viewing the same node?

Me and a friend tested the justice system this way when it came out and sure enough their junk piece of trait stone in a night stand was my Motif waiting to be stolen.

It is not obvious on Nirncrux because you have to harvest before you see it, but above ground should be obvious. I can see real problems with this once it goes live if the node is the same for everyone who is leveled to get them.

Edit: Also if someone lower level gets lets say an iron node and harvests it does that clear the Rubedite node for you?

Faulgor · October 2015

GTech_1 wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

angelyn wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

Grileenor wrote: »

Yes I do feel that ZOS is trying to trade fun for money and playing like myself are speaking up and warning them to reverse that course now because we will not accept it with the release of Orsinium.

The strange this is, IMHO they do not "trade fun for money".
Instead, they trade fun for grinding.
This is something I really do not understand. What is the purpose?

As a fan who had so much fun in the game, I was decided to buy each and every DLC.
ZOS could have all my DLC money I spend each month. I am the ideal customer.
Then the IC DLC turned all the fun I had in the game into grinding.
As such, the IC for me was the worst DLC I've bought this year.

I will buy Orisinium the day it comes out, because I cannot give up hope yet.
However, if Orisinium will be grinding again instead of fun, this will probably be my last DLC.
I am playing games to have fun. There is tedious "grinding" enough in most of our daily jobs.

Therefore, ZOS, please take our DLC money for Orisinium and make crafting fun again.

Absolutely. I play to have fun. For me grind does not equal fun.

Frankly that sounds tautological to me. People always call what they don't consider fun "grinding".

I have fun collecting trophies in IC sewers.
I have fun collecting loot to deconstruct for materials.
I have fun collecting crafting nodes with a chance for double yield / Nirncrux / Casserite / whatever.
I have fun collecting materials to do my daily writs for a chance to get a Glass Fragment.
I have fun earning Champion Points when I have a nice leveling spot for myself.

Yet all of these things have been called grinding at one time or another. The term doesn't mean anything but "I don't want to do it" and adds nothing to the discussion in my opinion.

"I don't want to do it" adds quite a bit to a "Feedback" thread.
In fact, that is the entire, directed, purpose of a feedback thread.

This thread is not here to discuss the accepted definition of "Grind".

The obvious:
Games are supposed to be fun, not work. That's why folks play them.
I (currently) pay Zenimax to deliver that fun.
That may change, with decisions such as this one, and that is likely why they posted the feedback thread in the first place: To determine if the system would be a success.

As inferred by the vast majority of folks in this thread, including myself:
The current system on the PTS is an unacceptable, tedious, gear grind.

Additional note: Previous Elder Scrolls titles have never been a tedious gear grind.
And in fact, decisions like these risk damaging the integrity of the Elder Scrolls IP.

Sincerely,
~GTech_1

Of course, there are perfectly fine reasons not wanting to do things. That was not my point. My point was that the term "grinding" alone does not explain anything.
As I tried to point out with my first post you quote, collecting things is actually fun to me and a considerable amount of other people. When you say games should be fun and not work, I totally agree, but I evidently feel that different things are fun than you do.

GTech_1 wrote: »

As inferred by the vast majority of folks in this thread, including myself:
The current system on the PTS is an unacceptable, tedious, gear grind.

See, that's exactly my issue. That statement doesn't explain your problem at all, and I'm inclined to reply that no, it isn't an unacceptably tedious gear grind. The availability of VR15+ materials increases significantly with Orsinum, so I really can't see why you would be opposed.

Let me ask a few things of players who are unhappy with the current availability of VR15+ materials:
Why do you want them?
What is giving you the impression that you need them?
What is it you actually want to do "for fun" if you don't consider improving your gear fun?

GTech_1 wrote: »

Additional note: Previous Elder Scrolls titles have never been a tedious gear grind.
And in fact, decisions like these risk damaging the integrity of the Elder Scrolls IP.

Oh please. Until Skyrim you couldn't even craft gear, the single player system for gear was entirely different. In Morrowind, when you wanted the best gear, you had to search up and down the whole of Red Mountain for a piece of Glass or even Daedric armor, of which there were only very few in the world. The dreaded scaling made that quite trivial in Oblivion, but then you still had to "grind out" the levels to get the scaling for the best armor. And when there was a crafting system to make your own gear like Enchanting or Smithing in Skyrim, it was very much a case of "grinding" by enchanting again and again and again or crafting and improving countless daggers. In fact the whole skill system was similar to this. I don't know if you'd call it grinding, but spamming Muffle a few hundred times to level Illusion certainly didn't feel like fun to me. And this was even worse in Morrowind and Oblivion were you wanted the correct skills for each level-up to get the best amount of governing attributes ...
Elder Scrolls certainly has it's fair share of repetitive activties for character progression.

GTech_1 · October 2015

Again, this is not a discussion thread. It is a feedback thread. Please cease your attempt to derail it.

Faulgor · October 2015

GTech_1 wrote: »

Again, this is not a discussion thread. It is a feedback thread. Please cease your attempt to derail it.

Amusing, considering the point of my posts was to get people to voice better feedback than simply repeating "it's a grind".

I also find it odd that you scold me for replying to your reply, drawing arbitrary lines between feedback and discussion when both have been going on in this thread since the first page, all of which, as far as I can tell, has been on topic.

mlstevens42_ESO · October 2015

I am not just looking at it from my own view point and trying to think just how someone with less time then myself will obtain enough materials to craft v 16 items. Even though I personally do not want to spend all day looking for materials I do have the time to do so. Others play perhaps a few hours during a week. A couple of friends for example play perhaps four to five hours a week if that. If I have to spend well over an hour to even find a few nodes when I admittedly have time I can burn on it what are those that have less time going to think about it.

Crafting supplies were readily available for every tier previous to this one the expectation would be that his would continue to be the case so they would be able to craft their own gear. Let us drop the writs and other uses for the materials for the moment I am just talking about making a set of level appropriate gear for a capped out character. I think I remember something close to 1000 ingots let alone wood and so on for just ONE set of stuff. Many have more then one character to suit up. This is a lot of WORK. Especially for those that do not have time. Because the materials are scarce and take a lot of time people then expect to be paid quite a bit of cash to provide said things for those who have less time. This means they will not be able to get suited up quickly to move on with what ever they find fun. Regardless of a few having fun spending hours and hours to get materials to craft with I think you will find far more will not think that spending all of the few hours they have trying to find mats to be fun at all.

This is the crux of the matter at what point does it become work and not fun for people. This is entertainment if it becomes to much like work many will not want to be here in this game. Even though I do admittedly have the time that I could put into this game to get the materials it is already not fun for me. Far to many things seem to take quite a time investment of late. Yes games are time killers even the very best of them, but most of the time I am doing something I like. Lately the stuff here has not been very fun and seems far to much like work. I am not saying that there should not be any challenges in the game there should be. Spending days looking for logs, ore piles and plants and killing whole herds of animals to outfit my people..... Let's just say I have other better uses for time inside game or out as it is to boring to just collect mats all the time. This is of course my opinion.

If mat collection is your version of fun more power to you. I do think most though do it as a means to an end. As in I craft for the most part to make my people gear....my own personal toons. I do not normally sell materials or such like. In games where I have been a merchant I did not sell materials I made things out of the materials and sold the items I made. It seems to be more profitable however in this one to just sell the mats. Certainly I could see doing that for cash once my people were outfitted. It would still be an unpleasant and time consuming ordeal. I would expect premium prices if I forced myself to do this. Of course since I do not find such things fun it would probably only be done for a short time just because cash often buys things that I may be unwilling to put time in for. PVP for the akaviri motif comes to mind. Oh I have time but not only do I have no real interest in banging heads all day I do not happen to be any good at it either. So would take far more time then I am willing to put into it.

My friends that have so little time would probably be sol on having the time or the funds needful to get materials. This would stop the fun you see. People that are not having fun normally do not continue to play this goes for both those that do and do not have time. No fun well can always find something that is and do that instead. So if this game becomes to much work expect to see far less people playing. Those with less time are those that will be far less forgiving about things that consume loads of time in games as they simply have to many other things to do. Even if they are well off they are not always going to think buy from cash shop. More often will be takes to much time not worth playing at all. Which sooner or later means no more game as it can not support itself.

Ourorboros · October 2015

How's this for feedback?:
@Faulgor has been providing some thought-provoking alternative views to the v15-16 mat situation. I've been in the "this is a grind" camp. Faulgor not only has posted some hopeful harvesting results, but also some interesting perspectives on grinding in this and other Elder Scroll games.

Since I choose not to play on PTS, I rely on feedback from those who do. It seems like there is a big RNG element to harvesting the new mats (not too surprising considering how much RNG affects other parts of the game), so harvesting results vary from horrible to tolerable.

I've invested a lot of time in the game, and I am not going to stop playing without finding out myself if the availability, or lack thereof, of new mats sucks all the fun out of the game. Orsinium is not the DLC that keeps me playing. I'm looking for Dark Brotherhood and Thieves Guild. I'll grind out new mats for new gear until they get here. It will keep me occupied while I wait for content I really want.

Aquanova · October 2015

I don't particularly like that the nodes scale to your character's crafting level, since this will limit me to only 1 character being able to farm any VR15/16 mats. What's more concerning to me is the that you still get more VR14 mat nodes in Orsinium then VR15/16. The zone is a VR16 area, and as long as you are at least VR15 (and max level crafter) you should only find VR15/16 nodes there.

helediron · October 2015

I created a new vr16 template and took the gear writs. They still require vr15 items but now we need to craft just one item of each. Woodworking still has the bug requiring to craft bristlecone ice staff though (crafting ruby ash ice staff doesn't finish the writ).

I did half hour speedfarm only picking rubby (the vr15) mats. I got 28 rubedite ore, 3 raw ancestor silks and 59 rough ruby ash. I think i got so few ancestor silks because i probably ran past them. Silks are hard to distinguish from other plants while ruby ash and rubedo are clearly visible. I have to add that i dislike that selective farming, and if this affects other players, there will be much griefing.
EDIT: be careful not to scale this up. It took about half hour to sweep the lower Wrothgar with aid from HarvestMap. I did second pass and found hardly any vr15 mats. Trying relog farming next.

I think this is still not going to work. I simply will not do writs. Using top tier mats for writs is foolish while ZOS keeps strangling the supply and requiring tenfold amounts for vr16. In IC there were one rubby sink - now there is two. It's clear that writs have lower priority.

Regarding grinding I would like to bring in what happens in vWGT. I've been farming it three to six times per day on live, and many days i got no item at all. Now that place will get higher drop rate.

Increased the drop rate of set items from the White-Gold Tower and Imperial City Prison dungeons by approximately 2.5 times their previous rate.

ZOS admitted gear grind from dungeons was out-of-proportions. I think crafting/harvesting needs same fix.

The best solution is to drop vr16 mats requirement significantly and increase supply. I prefer 100% rubby drop rate from nodes but at least double it. Let mobs drop rubby gear and significantly increase deconstruction mats drop to five-six per item.

pelennor_fields · October 2015

Lurking

G0ku · October 2015

Sorry for being that person; another person posted this in another thread but I have to quote that:

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

First and foremost, we want everyone to know that we have zero interest in trying to extend your playtime by making you grind for experience. That includes grinding quests, monsters, dungeons, or anything else. If people aren't having a good time, we know they won’t stick around, so artificially inflating time spent playing is a self-defeating practice we aren't interested in. Our number one priority is fun (this is a game, after all!) and promoting a diverse array of activity options that allow you to pursue experience gains however you like.

Marrtha · October 2015

The mats still feel rare. When it comes to crafting, either the amounts needed should be lowered or the mats should be more accessible. We don't need to faceroll through it, but nor should we grind for materials or farm until we start rotting behind the screen. These type of nodes just won't work out if there is only a chance. Those who have maxed crafting and are vet 15-16 should be able to have guaranteed corresponding raw materials in nodes. Pretty simple. As it is atm, it is not going to work. It will bother players, they have been loud so far, and will not keep their interest.

hiyde · October 2015

Casdha wrote: »

Please ignore the complaints that may come from folks not getting their mats as easily. It was their choice to spend their skill points in fighting skills rather than crafting.

Finally some fair compensation for different choices in game play.

First: I don't think they should ignore *anyone*. This is a feedback thread.

I say this as a person who's never run group content and does not PvP: It shouldn't require special hoops to jump through to collect basic craft mats. I'd love to see special perks for dedicated crafters with lots of skill points invested, but maybe something more creative than resource nodes?

Casdha · October 2015

hiyde wrote: »

Casdha wrote: »

Please ignore the complaints that may come from folks not getting their mats as easily. It was their choice to spend their skill points in fighting skills rather than crafting.

Finally some fair compensation for different choices in game play.

First: I don't think they should ignore *anyone*. This is a feedback thread.

I say this as a person who's never run group content and does not PvP: It shouldn't require special hoops to jump through to collect basic craft mats. I'd love to see special perks for dedicated crafters with lots of skill points invested, but maybe something more creative than resource nodes?

Agree,
I had amended that statement several posts down from my original once the patch was done and you could play it and see what they had done. I didn't realize it until I played my crafting character. I played my lowest crafter first to test the scaling.

Edit: as far as the "ignore" goes,,, that is the nicest way I could put it compared to what is coming when this goes live,,,,,,,, I guess it should say something along the lines of " Ignore all the folks who like to resort to name calling to get their way."

pelennor_fields · October 2015

You can have all your skill points in crafting and you still aren't going to be able to do daily writs anymore. If you can't do writs with frequency you won't be able to get writ rewards like 1/10 glass motif scraps. Fix the V16 drop rate normalizing them or cap master writs at V14. If you don't someone might think you are gouging out the crafter's eyes and driving us to the crown store for motifs @ $40 a pop! :O