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Dragonknights - The Misconception
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eliisra✭✭✭✭✭
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I hate to dredge up a year old argument but yeah wings never should have been nerfed. Only people who spammed ranged attacks faceroll-style and refused to develop a balanced build with a credible melee option had a problem with Reflective Scales.
Yes, being perma immune to ranged single target was totally balanced.
It had the same issues as today's NB Cloak, to stand a chance with appropriate counters, you had to remake your entire build around killing one DK. Leaving you weak against other classes.
If you went in mele, you got rekt and feed the DK ulti and resources. Only class that could mele fight a DK was tanky templars. But If you ranged you only had DoT's and AoE, resto light- and heavy attacks, because everything else got Reflected.
For normal PvP you need a well rounded build that works okay against 4 different classes. Leaving one single skill so strong that it forces opponents to rearrange their entire build around killing one single class, is just dumb. Something the Cloak Mafia also refuses to accept, since they only need to slot Mark themselves. Yet everyone else, unwilling to give up 30% of their skill slots for one class, have l2p issues.
Other than that I do agree with the topic, magicka DK needs buffing. They mainly need a gap closer and mobility, in my opinion. Majority of DK players quit or re-rolled NB, so about time that ZoS gives a ***.1 -
Yonkit✭✭✭✭✭Here are a few small fixes that could help:
1. Major evasion to cinderstorm, revert to be cast at your feet. Leave eruption as is for range, increase dmg 2x.
2. Revert heal on gdb to actually be 33%.
3. Add major heroism to inferno. Add minor heroism to a passive which activates when you cast an ardent flame spell.
4. Fix chains so that one is a pull which gives cc immunity. The other morph pulls you to them, no cc immunity.
5. Fix wings so that it blocks projectiles from stealth.
@Ishammael all great ideas, particulary #3. @ZOS_GinaBruno get this man a cookie!Has an Alter Ego in the form of a very large quadrupedal black & white Bear.0 -
Yonkit✭✭✭✭✭
I hate to dredge up a year old argument but yeah wings never should have been nerfed. Only people who spammed ranged attacks faceroll-style and refused to develop a balanced build with a credible melee option had a problem with Reflective Scales.
Yes, being perma immune to ranged single target was totally balanced.
It had the same issues as today's NB Cloak, to stand a chance with appropriate counters, you had to remake your entire build around killing one DK. Leaving you weak against other classes.
If you went in mele, you got rekt and feed the DK ulti and resources. Only class that could mele fight a DK was tanky templars. But If you ranged you only had DoT's and AoE, resto light- and heavy attacks, because everything else got Reflected.
For normal PvP you need a well rounded build that works okay against 4 different classes. Leaving one single skill so strong that it forces opponents to rearrange their entire build around killing one single class, is just dumb. Something the Cloak Mafia also refuses to accept, since they only need to slot Mark themselves. Yet everyone else, unwilling to give up 30% of their skill slots for one class, have l2p issues.
Other than that I do agree with the topic, magicka DK needs buffing. They mainly need a gap closer and mobility, in my opinion. Majority of DK players quit or re-rolled NB, so about time that ZoS gives a ***.
30% of your skill slots?
You mean 2 slots. or 1, if you don't want to run it on both bars, cause you don't need too, or you can just run ANY AOE IN THE GAME EVER. #justsayin #l2pHas an Alter Ego in the form of a very large quadrupedal black & white Bear.0 -
Mumyo✭✭✭✭✭I don't think people realize how bloody good surprise attack is compared to wrecking blow.. Esp vs a sorc
Exactly my point, Surprise Attack can be animation canceled with a heavy attack & bash for an easy 15k damage, and you can do this much faster than Wrecking Blow, the only advantage to wrecking blow is the stun, when, if cloaked, Surprise Attack does for you, the empower is useless as a stamblade cause you can get that from ambush, the damage is worse than Surprise Attack in every sense as you can only cancel WB with a heavy attack which is at most 13-14k dmg if it crits, and you just can't use it as fast as Surprise attack, put two Stamblades in the same room with the same gear and the same exact skill bars except one has WB and one has Surprise attack, let them fight 10 times, ten bucks says the one with Surprise Attack wins 80% of the fights.
That is not only a dk issue, the only classes that can do so actually are dks and nbs xD
Whip and Surprise attack.
And Wrecking blow actually isnt a thing you spam without brain.
Ever tried magnum shot against nb? Its pretty effective in combination to some certain skills a dk can use and only a dk has.
If u want every class to have exactly the same options then u should play a game without any diversity.
And before any of u dks cry more u should take a look at the other classes, their passives and actives before u cry like little babies again.
U are by far the best designed class in this game with the most options. Dk can go so many ways and that in an effective way.
If u need help because u are bad with ur class u're welcome to ask me for some good dk's i can give u a list but its not that big since every dk decided to cry in the corner instead of trying things.
Thank god i know a few very good dk's. PM me!
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Nivzruo_ESO✭✭✭✭DK aren't OP but they certainly aren't weak. Every class atm is balanced, all have strong spec but have counters too.Nelgyntc- V14 NB1 -
Yonkit✭✭✭✭✭Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »DK aren't OP but they certainly aren't weak. Every class atm is balanced, all have strong spec but have counters too.
Strong Magicka DK spec? Do tell.Has an Alter Ego in the form of a very large quadrupedal black & white Bear.0 -
DUTCH_REAPER✭✭✭✭✭
✭Hahahahaha. Man....thank goodness you were here to tell me to L2P. Phew.. Who would have thought I just need to L2P.2 -
Nivzruo_ESO✭✭✭✭Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »DK aren't OP but they certainly aren't weak. Every class atm is balanced, all have strong spec but have counters too.
Strong Magicka DK spec? Do tell.
I forget the guys name.. but he's like the top DK in the game, I saw him SnB magika tanking 5 guys never dropping below 90% hp the other day... I think his name starts with a Shal.. something. But yea the builds are out there and each class has some super strong stuff right now.Nelgyntc- V14 NB0 -
Darnathian✭✭✭✭✭
✭RadioheadSh0t wrote: »I'm sorry, there are a lot of things that could be done for DKs, reverting the Wings nerf is not one that I agree with.
There are two true reflects in the game, and one is a one-off that only reflects Magicka projectiles, the other used to be able to negate all ranged attacks.
The wings nerf may be the most necessary of all the DK nerfs. And wings are still highly effective, and are still the only counter to ranged builds.
No one class should be invulnerable to ranged attacks, and anyone who would argue otherwise is not pragmatic in their opinion.
Well they were designed to be the grunts. They don't have much ranged fire power themselves.0 -
Yonkit✭✭✭✭✭Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »DK aren't OP but they certainly aren't weak. Every class atm is balanced, all have strong spec but have counters too.
Strong Magicka DK spec? Do tell.
I forget the guys name.. but he's like the top DK in the game, I saw him SnB magika tanking 5 guys never dropping below 90% hp the other day... I think his name starts with a Shal.. something. But yea the builds are out there and each class has some super strong stuff right now.
Sure. Tanking. Any class can do that, and Nbs can do it much much better atm thanks to Siphoning attacks, if he truly was tanking then he wasn't doing any damage whatsoever because Magicka DK can't do any significant battle-changing dmg... Wet noodle, DKs have Igneous Shield for the heal buff and Take Flight as a good stam burst ultimate, that is legitimately, it.Has an Alter Ego in the form of a very large quadrupedal black & white Bear.0 -
Nivzruo_ESO✭✭✭✭
Idk man.. his flame whip was killing ***. before 5 got there he was killing them 1 or 2 at a time with ease.Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »DK aren't OP but they certainly aren't weak. Every class atm is balanced, all have strong spec but have counters too.
Strong Magicka DK spec? Do tell.
I forget the guys name.. but he's like the top DK in the game, I saw him SnB magika tanking 5 guys never dropping below 90% hp the other day... I think his name starts with a Shal.. something. But yea the builds are out there and each class has some super strong stuff right now.
Sure. Tanking. Any class can do that, and Nbs can do it much much better atm thanks to Siphoning attacks, if he truly was tanking then he wasn't doing any damage whatsoever because Magicka DK can't do any significant battle-changing dmg... Wet noodle, DKs have Igneous Shield for the heal buff and Take Flight as a good stam burst ultimate, that is legitimately, it.
Nelgyntc- V14 NB0 -
Yonkit✭✭✭✭✭Darnathian wrote: »RadioheadSh0t wrote: »I'm sorry, there are a lot of things that could be done for DKs, reverting the Wings nerf is not one that I agree with.
There are two true reflects in the game, and one is a one-off that only reflects Magicka projectiles, the other used to be able to negate all ranged attacks.
The wings nerf may be the most necessary of all the DK nerfs. And wings are still highly effective, and are still the only counter to ranged builds.
No one class should be invulnerable to ranged attacks, and anyone who would argue otherwise is not pragmatic in their opinion.
Well they were designed to be the grunts. They don't have much ranged fire power themselves.
@Darnathian whatya mean we don't have ranged firepower! I can fist you! For like! 2k damage! At the expense of like! 2.8k magicka! Oh and it heals me!Has an Alter Ego in the form of a very large quadrupedal black & white Bear.0 -
Darnathian✭✭✭✭✭
✭Darnathian wrote: »RadioheadSh0t wrote: »I'm sorry, there are a lot of things that could be done for DKs, reverting the Wings nerf is not one that I agree with.
There are two true reflects in the game, and one is a one-off that only reflects Magicka projectiles, the other used to be able to negate all ranged attacks.
The wings nerf may be the most necessary of all the DK nerfs. And wings are still highly effective, and are still the only counter to ranged builds.
No one class should be invulnerable to ranged attacks, and anyone who would argue otherwise is not pragmatic in their opinion.
Well they were designed to be the grunts. They don't have much ranged fire power themselves.
@Darnathian whatya mean we don't have ranged firepower! I can fist you! For like! 2k damage! At the expense of like! 2.8k magicka! Oh and it heals me!
I wish I could laugh. Sadly it's ashame what happened to the dk and this game. My 44 days off for surgery came at a bad time. Thought I was done with Eso. Leveling my fifth vet16. Doing Templar this time. Have to admit they are a lot of fun0 -
_Chaos✭✭✭✭✭
✭I don't think people realize how bloody good surprise attack is compared to wrecking blow.. Esp vs a sorc
Exactly my point, Surprise Attack can be animation canceled with a heavy attack & bash for an easy 15k damage, and you can do this much faster than Wrecking Blow, the only advantage to wrecking blow is the stun, when, if cloaked, Surprise Attack does for you, the empower is useless as a stamblade cause you can get that from ambush, the damage is worse than Surprise Attack in every sense as you can only cancel WB with a heavy attack which is at most 13-14k dmg if it crits, and you just can't use it as fast as Surprise attack, put two Stamblades in the same room with the same gear and the same exact skill bars except one has WB and one has Surprise attack, let them fight 10 times, ten bucks says the one with Surprise Attack wins 80% of the fights.
That is not only a dk issue, the only classes that can do so actually are dks and nbs xD
Whip and Surprise attack.
And Wrecking blow actually isnt a thing you spam without brain.
Ever tried magnum shot against nb? Its pretty effective in combination to some certain skills a dk can use and only a dk has.
If u want every class to have exactly the same options then u should play a game without any diversity.
And before any of u dks cry more u should take a look at the other classes, their passives and actives before u cry like little babies again.
U are by far the best designed class in this game with the most options. Dk can go so many ways and that in an effective way.
If u need help because u are bad with ur class u're welcome to ask me for some good dk's i can give u a list but its not that big since every dk decided to cry in the corner instead of trying things.
Thank god i know a few very good dk's. PM me!
And how do said magicka DK's heal, & do they ever run solo?
Have you read anything in this thread?'Chaos1 -
Armitas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »DK aren't OP but they certainly aren't weak. Every class atm is balanced, all have strong spec but have counters too.
Strong Magicka DK spec? Do tell.
I forget the guys name.. but he's like the top DK in the game, I saw him SnB magika tanking 5 guys never dropping below 90% hp the other day... I think his name starts with a Shal.. something. But yea the builds are out there and each class has some super strong stuff right now.
I can do the same thing against inexperienced pvpers, anyone can. The gap between experience in this game is huge and it makes a humongous difference. Those inexperienced players then go on the generic forums, the only one ZOS regularly reads, and get things nerfed, that is pretty much the story of the DK minus a few things. These anecdotal accounts are truly meaningless.Edited by Armitas on October 5, 2015 2:44PMRetired.
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Rohaus✭✭✭✭✭I agree with Yonkit's post. I enjoy playing my DK but that is because I am indeed a Stam build. I actually use 2 abilities offered to the DK, the rest are all Stam abilities that EVERYONE has access to.
#DKLyfe
I don't count the Ultimate but yea, on my Stam DK I use Igneous Shield and that's it, very rarely will I slot Unstable Flame or Burning Breath.
I use Igneous Shield on my S/B bar and Volatile Armor on my dual wield bar.
I swap between Corrosive Armor and Take Flight for my Ultimate on my dual wield bar. On my S/B bar I use Flawless DB.YouTube channel Rohaus Lives!
Daggerfall Covenant
VR16 DragonKnight0 -
HeroOfNone✭✭✭✭✭
✭Chains could be good if they returned them to the brief momen of glory they had after 1.6. Chains were responsive, I could jump off a ledge and chain 2-3 folks before plummeting to my dearh, at times even pull 2 off snd chain my way up on the guy with CC immunity. You could fly around, though it was a bit more like spiderman.
Showed developers this and asked if was a legal move to use or if it was an exploit. They sent the standard "here is what an exploit" definition and gave no direct response. Next patch hits and chains is unresponsive again.
Guess I killed it.0 -
ScarecrowBoat✭✭✭Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »I forget the guys name.. but he's like the top DK in the game, I saw him SnB magika tanking 5 guys never dropping below 90% hp the other day... I think his name starts with a Shal.. something. But yea the builds are out there and each class has some super strong stuff right now.
Yea i was there too i think his name was Scarecrow Yacht or somethingFANTASIAAAAAAAAAAGM of SBHMember of Zerona's Fan Boy ClubHow do i get out of cyrodiil0