Xsorus wrote: »

I don't think people realize how bloody good surprise attack is compared to wrecking blow.. Esp vs a sorc

Exactly my point, Surprise Attack can be animation canceled with a heavy attack & bash for an easy 15k damage, and you can do this much faster than Wrecking Blow, the only advantage to wrecking blow is the stun, when, if cloaked, Surprise Attack does for you, the empower is useless as a stamblade cause you can get that from ambush, the damage is worse than Surprise Attack in every sense as you can only cancel WB with a heavy attack which is at most 13-14k dmg if it crits, and you just can't use it as fast as Surprise attack, put two Stamblades in the same room with the same gear and the same exact skill bars except one has WB and one has Surprise attack, let them fight 10 times, ten bucks says the one with Surprise Attack wins 80% of the fights.

Waylander wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

Wrecking Blow is so slow and so easy to dodge, I rarely get killed by it, whenever I see a Stamblade using WB I face-keyboard then roll my face across the keyboard and go bang my head on a wall, you don't use Wrecking Blow over surprise attack... You just... Just stahp. Plz.

With 300 ping (Aussie) I am a wrecking blowers delight. They must wonder why I don't move, it's just I haven't seen the animation yet.

Galalin wrote: »

I have trained many years playing baseball and more recently golf much love in the swing is the key

DK SCRUB OUT

Well you have hit me for a home run a couple of times.

reactive armour set = aussie handicap remover

All I know is that if ZoS doesn't fix PvP by the time I'm done with Knights of the Fallen Empire in SWTOR I'm gone for good at that point because Fallout 4, The Division, Halo 5, etc will all be released and I'll have an enjoyable time playing those games and I won't be playing them just because friends do. Cough. ESO. Cough.

If they had listened to us from the start, and continued to listen to us, this game would be so much better, and it still does have so much potential, but ZoS needs to stop ignoring the majority and quit listening to the minority of players that just QQ and whine.

Yonkit wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

aco5712 wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

aco5712 wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

You can stack stamina and weapon damage all you want, it will never come close to healing for 4K a tic like health recovery can. Esp with the healing debuff from battle spirit working against it. You could probably get a crap ton out of it if you stack heal received though. But yea.. Between blood craze, vigor, health recovery I'm sitting at basically 7,8k healing every 2 seconds...

As for what reduces it, I'm thinking maybe healing debuffs might.. I need to test and see which is doing it though.. Maybe poisons status effect? I'm going to see if I can run through some tests tomorrow on it see which damage type is reducing it.

@Xsorus poison decreases your health recovery

That's what people have said, which is odd, but it does give a reason to run poison I guess...

yeh well i mean all enchants need to proc something. Fire is for high burst dot. Poison for health rec. debuff. Disease for healing debuff. I think ice might be able to proc snare. I think i lightning might be able to proc damage debuff.

Thankfully most people aren't running poison now heheh, well cept for poison injection.

I also think people are underestimating weapon Enchants right now and powered trait

A lot of abilities you wouldn't think about actually use poison damage, Lethal Arrow and Poison Injection are two of the most common. Most DW group players I know have disease on one Sword and Poison on the other, couple of the World skills use it, and of course the skill we all know and love that doesn't use it but can proc it because ZoS. Trap Beast.

Lol does trap beast proc it? I mean it says magic damage I think, and honestly I think trap beast should be poison. That's kind of weird it does

Most of the DW I see use weapon damage on off hand now, and lethal arrow is less used now vs focused aim cause of mighty cp passive.

Poison injection will be the one you see the most now I'd think

JDar wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

JDar wrote: »

There is no ZoS_EricW in that list, which is a crock. Of all the people to put in an ivory tower. It basically says, the guy who matters isn't supposed to care what you think.

Lol, if ZoS cared about what we thought they wouldn't have pushed PTS to live the way it was.

Xsorus wrote: »

You can stack stamina and weapon damage all you want, it will never come close to healing for 4K a tic like health recovery can. Esp with the healing debuff from battle spirit working against it. You could probably get a crap ton out of it if you stack heal received though. But yea.. Between blood craze, vigor, health recovery I'm sitting at basically 7,8k healing every 2 seconds...

As for what reduces it, I'm thinking maybe healing debuffs might.. I need to test and see which is doing it though.. Maybe poisons status effect? I'm going to see if I can run through some tests tomorrow on it see which damage type is reducing it.

Rally & Vigor buffed with Igneous Shield and only 27 CP into Blessed and 10 into Quick Recovery heals me for 3.5k a tick noncrit Vigor and rally is 1.1k a tick noncrit, so that's a little over 9k healing every 2 seconds, and 4.6k a second. Noncrits. So yea.......

RadioheadSh0t wrote: »

I'm sorry, there are a lot of things that could be done for DKs, reverting the Wings nerf is not one that I agree with.

There are two true reflects in the game, and one is a one-off that only reflects Magicka projectiles, the other used to be able to negate all ranged attacks.

The wings nerf may be the most necessary of all the DK nerfs. And wings are still highly effective, and are still the only counter to ranged builds.

No one class should be invulnerable to ranged attacks, and anyone who would argue otherwise is not pragmatic in their opinion.

@RadioheadSh0t A class with no ranged abilities and a broken gap closer SHOULD be immune to ranged, all ranged, all the time, give us a gap closer that works, and is a class skill, and you can keep wings the way it is.

I hate to dredge up a year old argument but yeah wings never should have been nerfed. Only people who spammed ranged attacks faceroll-style and refused to develop a balanced build with a credible melee option had a problem with Reflective Scales.

@JDar you're completely correct, no one should have Ranged on both bars or Melee on both bars, no one, if you do, you're just gimping yourself, and only people with this playstyle had issues with DKs, I can't tell you how many times back when DKs were supposedly OP I died because I had gotten into a melee fight and someone comes along and JFK snipes me because I've stopped flapping my wings. It's all about timing, ofc you're not going to kill a DK spamming wings, stop attacking with ranged and let his guard go down. Besides, there's still people that kill themselves on my wings, and people like that just need to stop playing the game, I mean come on...

Yonkit wrote: »

aco5712 wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

All I know is that if ZoS doesn't fix PvP by the time I'm done with Knights of the Fallen Empire in SWTOR I'm gone for good at that point because Fallout 4, The Division, Halo 5, etc will all be released and I'll have an enjoyable time playing those games and I won't be playing them just because friends do. Cough. ESO. Cough.

If they had listened to us from the start, and continued to listen to us, this game would be so much better, and it still does have so much potential, but ZoS needs to stop ignoring the majority and quit listening to the minority of players that just QQ and whine.

you listen to the hardcore players and min/maxers because they know the ins and outs of the game. You dont listen to the general public because they are all a bunch of scrubs. Its plain and simple.

Obviously not for the people at ZoS. xD

ZOS right now

I don't want to sound like the *** 90% of the PvP population knows me to be.


But I don't consider myself a good PvPer because I faceroll 1vX omg get rekt scrub zergs, I consider myself a good PvPer because I know what every skill in the game does and all the FOTM builds and how to counter them and how to react to every situation, except gravity because lets be honest, gravity is a ***, but because of this, I consider myself a good PvPer because put up against that 90% PvP population I'd just roll them over, because ALOT of people jump into Cyrodiil thinking they can do hybrid builds, or use a restoration staff and heal in medium armor, or some crazy crap, when, a few months ago, you could pull it off, but now, lol no.

People like me, like @blabafat , like @Sypher r, King Richard, LORD FENGRUSH @Armitas, @vortexman11 , who isn't very vocal as he could be, you guys in this thread, and dozens of others, are the ones that ZoS should listen too. Not the daily QQers like....

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/218310/cloak-needs-a-nerf#latest

These people ZoS shouldn't listen too, but they do, and I think it's simply because of all the people trying to defend against QQers, makes the thread longer, bigger, and ZoS gets the attention and instead of actually reading the thread they just judge by the title and amount of posts and nerf from there. Which tbqh, is probably how they do it... It's how I'd do it if I wanted to be a lazy dev no one liked.

Xsorus wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

JDar wrote: »

There is no ZoS_EricW in that list, which is a crock. Of all the people to put in an ivory tower. It basically says, the guy who matters isn't supposed to care what you think.

Lol, if ZoS cared about what we thought they wouldn't have pushed PTS to live the way it was.

Xsorus wrote: »

You can stack stamina and weapon damage all you want, it will never come close to healing for 4K a tic like health recovery can. Esp with the healing debuff from battle spirit working against it. You could probably get a crap ton out of it if you stack heal received though. But yea.. Between blood craze, vigor, health recovery I'm sitting at basically 7,8k healing every 2 seconds...

As for what reduces it, I'm thinking maybe healing debuffs might.. I need to test and see which is doing it though.. Maybe poisons status effect? I'm going to see if I can run through some tests tomorrow on it see which damage type is reducing it.

Rally & Vigor buffed with Igneous Shield and only 27 CP into Blessed and 10 into Quick Recovery heals me for 3.5k a tick noncrit Vigor and rally is 1.1k a tick noncrit, so that's a little over 9k healing every 2 seconds, and 4.6k a second. Noncrits. So yea.......

RadioheadSh0t wrote: »

I'm sorry, there are a lot of things that could be done for DKs, reverting the Wings nerf is not one that I agree with.

There are two true reflects in the game, and one is a one-off that only reflects Magicka projectiles, the other used to be able to negate all ranged attacks.

The wings nerf may be the most necessary of all the DK nerfs. And wings are still highly effective, and are still the only counter to ranged builds.

No one class should be invulnerable to ranged attacks, and anyone who would argue otherwise is not pragmatic in their opinion.

@RadioheadSh0t A class with no ranged abilities and a broken gap closer SHOULD be immune to ranged, all ranged, all the time, give us a gap closer that works, and is a class skill, and you can keep wings the way it is.

I'm almost certain rally and vigor are 2 second intervals not 1 second. I know my vigor will do around 2k per tic and blood craze is pretty much just like rally in terms of healing. I find it hard to believe vigor hitting 3.5k though in pvp without a *** ton of healing received. The healing debuff is just to rough.

Actually it has to be 1 second intervals on vigor cause it's 5 second duration. So my hps is higher then I originally thought

Vigor is each second, Rally I think is 2s. Not sure, too lazy to go look it up cause I QQ'd for the night.

Yonkit wrote: »

I don't want to sound like the *** 90% of the PvP population knows me to be.


But I don't consider myself a good PvPer because I faceroll 1vX omg get rekt scrub zergs, I consider myself a good PvPer because I know what every skill in the game does and all the FOTM builds and how to counter them and how to react to every situation, except gravity because lets be honest, gravity is a ***, but because of this, I consider myself a good PvPer because put up against that 90% PvP population I'd just roll them over, because ALOT of people jump into Cyrodiil thinking they can do hybrid builds, or use a restoration staff and heal in medium armor, or some crazy crap, when, a few months ago, you could pull it off, but now, lol no.

People like me, like @blabafat , like @Sypher r, King Richard, LORD FENGRUSH @Armitas, @vortexman11 , who isn't very vocal as he could be, you guys in this thread, and dozens of others, are the ones that ZoS should listen too. Not the daily QQers like....

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/218310/cloak-needs-a-nerf#latest

These people ZoS shouldn't listen too, but they do, and I think it's simply because of all the people trying to defend against QQers, makes the thread longer, bigger, and ZoS gets the attention and instead of actually reading the thread they just judge by the title and amount of posts and nerf from there. Which tbqh, is probably how they do it... It's how I'd do it if I wanted to be a lazy dev no one liked.

Cloak is an issue now cause they bloody ignored everyone who said nerfing detect pots was stupid.
Then they proceeded to make cloak a freaking magic version of dodge without the dodge penalty

I mean Zenimax is so much more concerned with maintaining their, "Play How You Want" crap that they moderate the forums like a children's game, it's a M-Rated game so stop banning people for swearing on the forums, it's the world we live in, this isn't Salt Lake City in the 20s. Start LISTENING to the customers that are swearing on the forums because they're so fed up with the current state of the game, it's quite easy to realize the difference between ranting for no reason other than QQ, and ranting with the intention to get information out and suggestions out but doing it in a way that voices frustration and intelligence. For example.

"**** you ZoS for nerfing DKs!" = Ranting & nonconstructive.

"**** you ZoS for nerfing DKs because X is horrible Y is bad and Z needs to be tweaked so it's functional." = Ranting with constructive criticism on the intent of getting an issue fixed that's game-breaking.

ZoS can't decipher the two, or at least, their forum moderators can't. In which case they need to be fired and intelligent ones need to be hired, and I'll probably get a 3 day forum suspension for saying this lol.

Yonkit wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

I don't want to sound like the *** 90% of the PvP population knows me to be.


But I don't consider myself a good PvPer because I faceroll 1vX omg get rekt scrub zergs, I consider myself a good PvPer because I know what every skill in the game does and all the FOTM builds and how to counter them and how to react to every situation, except gravity because lets be honest, gravity is a ***, but because of this, I consider myself a good PvPer because put up against that 90% PvP population I'd just roll them over, because ALOT of people jump into Cyrodiil thinking they can do hybrid builds, or use a restoration staff and heal in medium armor, or some crazy crap, when, a few months ago, you could pull it off, but now, lol no.

People like me, like @blabafat , like @Sypher r, King Richard, LORD FENGRUSH @Armitas, @vortexman11 , who isn't very vocal as he could be, you guys in this thread, and dozens of others, are the ones that ZoS should listen too. Not the daily QQers like....

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/218310/cloak-needs-a-nerf#latest

These people ZoS shouldn't listen too, but they do, and I think it's simply because of all the people trying to defend against QQers, makes the thread longer, bigger, and ZoS gets the attention and instead of actually reading the thread they just judge by the title and amount of posts and nerf from there. Which tbqh, is probably how they do it... It's how I'd do it if I wanted to be a lazy dev no one liked.

Cloak is an issue now cause they bloody ignored everyone who said nerfing detect pots was stupid.
Then they proceeded to make cloak a freaking magic version of dodge without the dodge penalty

@Xsorus Detect potions need to get reverted to last patch yes, other than that if they make any negative change directly to cloak or how it works in anyway I quit permanently. Cloak is absolutely fine, there's 40 something skills that break it so no, it doesn't need a nerf, Detect Potions need a buff. Two different things.

Probably just reverting the detect pots would work, the magical regen penalty they are thinking of probably won't work..
Or they could just make that damn scorching reveal not have its dot cleansed even if the nightblade uses dark cloak and doesn't stealth.

Xsorus wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

I don't want to sound like the *** 90% of the PvP population knows me to be.


But I don't consider myself a good PvPer because I faceroll 1vX omg get rekt scrub zergs, I consider myself a good PvPer because I know what every skill in the game does and all the FOTM builds and how to counter them and how to react to every situation, except gravity because lets be honest, gravity is a ***, but because of this, I consider myself a good PvPer because put up against that 90% PvP population I'd just roll them over, because ALOT of people jump into Cyrodiil thinking they can do hybrid builds, or use a restoration staff and heal in medium armor, or some crazy crap, when, a few months ago, you could pull it off, but now, lol no.

People like me, like @blabafat , like @Sypher r, King Richard, LORD FENGRUSH @Armitas, @vortexman11 , who isn't very vocal as he could be, you guys in this thread, and dozens of others, are the ones that ZoS should listen too. Not the daily QQers like....

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/218310/cloak-needs-a-nerf#latest

These people ZoS shouldn't listen too, but they do, and I think it's simply because of all the people trying to defend against QQers, makes the thread longer, bigger, and ZoS gets the attention and instead of actually reading the thread they just judge by the title and amount of posts and nerf from there. Which tbqh, is probably how they do it... It's how I'd do it if I wanted to be a lazy dev no one liked.

Cloak is an issue now cause they bloody ignored everyone who said nerfing detect pots was stupid.
Then they proceeded to make cloak a freaking magic version of dodge without the dodge penalty

@Xsorus Detect potions need to get reverted to last patch yes, other than that if they make any negative change directly to cloak or how it works in anyway I quit permanently. Cloak is absolutely fine, there's 40 something skills that break it so no, it doesn't need a nerf, Detect Potions need a buff. Two different things.

Probably just reverting the detect pots would work, the magical regen penalty they are thinking of probably won't work..
Or they could just make that damn scorching reveal not have its dot cleansed even if the nightblade uses dark cloak and doesn't stealth.

Scorching Flare needs to like.. Be a heat seeking missile, not an AoE, you cast it, it finds something that's stealthed, nukes it, and tags it so it can't stealth for 6-10s. As it stands a magblade can outrun flare so easily, stamblade not so much as they aren't stacking major expedition and concealed weapon and vampire sneak but still.

Xsorus wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

I don't want to sound like the *** 90% of the PvP population knows me to be.


But I don't consider myself a good PvPer because I faceroll 1vX omg get rekt scrub zergs, I consider myself a good PvPer because I know what every skill in the game does and all the FOTM builds and how to counter them and how to react to every situation, except gravity because lets be honest, gravity is a ***, but because of this, I consider myself a good PvPer because put up against that 90% PvP population I'd just roll them over, because ALOT of people jump into Cyrodiil thinking they can do hybrid builds, or use a restoration staff and heal in medium armor, or some crazy crap, when, a few months ago, you could pull it off, but now, lol no.

People like me, like @blabafat , like @Sypher r, King Richard, LORD FENGRUSH @Armitas, @vortexman11 , who isn't very vocal as he could be, you guys in this thread, and dozens of others, are the ones that ZoS should listen too. Not the daily QQers like....

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/218310/cloak-needs-a-nerf#latest

These people ZoS shouldn't listen too, but they do, and I think it's simply because of all the people trying to defend against QQers, makes the thread longer, bigger, and ZoS gets the attention and instead of actually reading the thread they just judge by the title and amount of posts and nerf from there. Which tbqh, is probably how they do it... It's how I'd do it if I wanted to be a lazy dev no one liked.

Cloak is an issue now cause they bloody ignored everyone who said nerfing detect pots was stupid.
Then they proceeded to make cloak a freaking magic version of dodge without the dodge penalty

@Xsorus Detect potions need to get reverted to last patch yes, other than that if they make any negative change directly to cloak or how it works in anyway I quit permanently. Cloak is absolutely fine, there's 40 something skills that break it so no, it doesn't need a nerf, Detect Potions need a buff. Two different things.

Probably just reverting the detect pots would work, the magical regen penalty they are thinking of probably won't work..
Or they could just make that damn scorching reveal not have its dot cleansed even if the nightblade uses dark cloak and doesn't stealth.

Scorching Flare needs to like.. Be a heat seeking missile, not an AoE, you cast it, it finds something that's stealthed, nukes it, and tags it so it can't stealth for 6-10s. As it stands a magblade can outrun flare so easily, stamblade not so much as they aren't stacking major expedition and concealed weapon and vampire sneak but still.

Yea, it's like that guard ability, very badly designed... Like I'm trying to think who would of ever used guard even when blocking worked.. Let alone now

I thought about using it on a Max Stam Max Regen build for group play, toggle it on to catch a meteor, reflect meteor, toggle it off, but not with the nerf to blocking lol.

Xsorus wrote: »

I don't think people realize how bloody good surprise attack is compared to wrecking blow.. Esp vs a sorc

If I see someone charging up a wrecking blow, I streak through them and it's a whiff. If I see someone is using surprise attack on me, well, my shields are usually down by that point aaaaand here comes the inc strike