Wrecking Blow Spammers

kevlarto_ESO · August 2015

I been watching a lot of twitch streams of folks on the PTS, so it seems like the new meta is Wrecking Blow, shows up on almost all the death recap's, so my question since large amounts of people are gravitating to it, what's broke about it or is it just in an over powered state ? my experience with mmo's is when lots of folks start using it there is something up with it, is this something ZOS is looking at, ?

Winterpsy · August 2015

Wrecking blow is a solid skill pick but nowhere overpowered. It has a pretty long wind up, slow animation, so the damage of it is actually quite misleading as due to the slow animation dps is much lower. The biggest boon of it is the thing you can knock folks into the air, removing them from battle for a couple secs, and it can be chained smoothly together with gap closers.
But this when broke free and immune is not working anymore.

The bad thing about WB that it has a long reach (often it seems the enemy is out of reach, still the WB activates), and you dont need to aim precisely to make it working.

Soris · August 2015

WB spam is cheesy atm. Sure you can cancel it by moving left and right but keep in mind, in update 6, its cast time was reduced by .5 seconds and they made it cannot be interrupted by any other action other than CC.
So it became an easy mode kill button in my eyes. Before that, it was a solid skill, required high amount of situational awareness and such things to successfully hitting your opponent. It was like risk and reward. But not anymore.

Winterpsy · August 2015

On ps4 it's.still pretty darn slow. Can smoke a cig before I press block to block it.
On vet levels damage is in between 5-8Kl

Alcast · August 2015

People cant roll like monkey anymore or block infinitely, so take my wblow in da face!

Derra · August 2015

wtb uninterruptable crystal fragments...

BuggeX · August 2015

Alcast wrote: »

People cant roll like monkey anymore or block infinitely, so take my wblow in da face!

Jeckll · August 2015

Alcast wrote: »

take my wblow in da ...

DARK CLOAK!!!!!

Alcast wrote: »

take my wblow in da ...

DARK CLOAK!!!!!

Alcast wrote: »

take my wblow in da ...

DARK CLOAK!!!!!

Alcast wrote: »

God dammit Jeckll, you're so annoying...

Mystikkal · August 2015

I know from a Stam DK's perspective it's used a lot because it's the only burst we have.. what else would we do, use burning breath to burst them down? The honest truth is that it's far from OP if you are a vet and are playing vets. If you are playing good ppl, or are outnumbered, it makes you a sitting target to get focused. Prob not as extremely in pts but on live, you can insta die trying to get a wrecking blow off. Plus you can't block while casting it, nor can you animation cancel it very quickly. And while ppl like to say it takes no skill, it's actually one of the harder skills to land as you need to keep the right distance and los. It's far from op

actosh · August 2015

Well. Sa hits also hard and is instant.
If u want to counter wb spammers, get the *** offensive!

Cc em, dodge roll trhough him and most wb users, skill is not op it is perfect, cant handle this.

If u go defensive u get wrecked.

Skills r by the way not the problem the prob is softcaps r gone and u can stack shitloads of stam or mag and weapon or spellpower.

So dont blame skills ^^

Jar_Ek · August 2015

Add in that 2handers have better support skills than dual wield (gap closer, heal+wpn power, decent single target execute), then 2handers are more likely to be used in general and wb is the go-to burst/cc for that weapon. Also only nb and templar have a stamina direct damage ability... and the new block and dodge roll make blocking / highly defensive builds suboptimal/harder to use, then it's no suprise that wb is seeing more use.

actosh · August 2015

Stamsorcs and Stam Dks rely on it, mostly.
For pvp i like 2handed more then dw for the above stated reasons.

Teiji · August 2015

actosh wrote: »

Stamsorcs and Stam Dks rely on it, mostly.
For pvp i like 2handed more then dw for the above stated reasons.

Exactly. None of this "what's broke about it?" what's broke about it? Maybe the fact that Sorcerer and Dragonknight are forced to depend on Wrecking Blow for damage, ZoS loves bullying them the most whilst ignoring Templar maliciously and Nightblade gets nothing but praise as their siblings are neglected.

Even with 5k weapon damage using Unstable Flame is a joke because one damage shield and the damage-over-time is completely nullified.

Sorcerer? Well they do more damage with heavy attacks thanks to Bound Armaments! Really would be better of with something like Sheer Venom damage proc which is 100% guaranteed to proc on light attacks but with a cooldown as opposed to heavy attack damage increase.

Ezareth · August 2015

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

I been watching a lot of twitch streams of folks on the PTS, so it seems like the new meta is Wrecking Blow, shows up on almost all the death recap's, so my question since large amounts of people are gravitating to it, what's broke about it or is it just in an over powered state ? my experience with mmo's is when lots of folks start using it there is something up with it, is this something ZOS is looking at, ?

It is exactly as I predicted in my "Boring Combat" thread.

Wrecking blow is the single highest stamina ability out there and it has a CC effect.

In a game where blocking and dodge rolls are rare, wrecking blow gives you the best damage and utility for your GCD of 1 ability per second . You are disadvantaged if you block WB, you're better off just healing it and focusing on damaging your enemy down. Just stupid boring combat....to be expected really considering the changes they made.

kaithuzar · August 2015

You can cc them, or block, or dodge roll, but ultimately you can't spam any of those defenses yet they can spam wrecking blow. End result is that your resources will run out & they will wreck you. If you have no resources & get hit once you WILL get hit a second time & die. Even if you have resources when are getting back up, if you get knocked down once there is not enough time to use an ability or skill on your bar before the you take a 2nd one to the face. If it's being pushed as a "slow" ability it needs to be 1 second slower so you can ACTUALLY REACT after getting wrecked by the first one.

actosh · August 2015

Teiji wrote: »

actosh wrote: »

Stamsorcs and Stam Dks rely on it, mostly.
For pvp i like 2handed more then dw for the above stated reasons.

Exactly. None of this "what's broke about it?" what's broke about it? Maybe the fact that Sorcerer and Dragonknight are forced to depend on Wrecking Blow for damage, ZoS loves bullying them the most whilst ignoring Templar maliciously and Nightblade gets nothing but praise as their siblings are neglected.

Even with 5k weapon damage using Unstable Flame is a joke because one damage shield and the damage-over-time is completely nullified.

Sorcerer? Well they do more damage with heavy attacks thanks to Bound Armaments! Really would be better of with something like Sheer Venom damage proc which is 100% guaranteed to proc on light attacks but with a cooldown as opposed to heavy attack damage increase.

We, sorcs and dk, could use dw and rapid strikes(wich cant be interupted) . The reason we choose 2handed was mentioned often enough,

High Dps with Wb (against movin targets a bit harder to land but pretty easy to learn)
Finisher that starts scaling at 49%
Heal+Dmg Buff and if u choose to a snare remove ^^
Gap Closer

Then u got cleave left ^^

Since dks lack a finisher and a Stam based high dps skill we go for 2handed.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler pls make dizzying swing an instant and lower the dmg compared to wrecking blow ^^

Strider_Roshin · August 2015

Meh WB doesn't bother me at all. It's a great move to use against bad players or players that aren't paying attention to you. Personally I think WB has nothing on crystal frags. That's like a WB that hits harder and has a 28m range.

Alcast · August 2015

Jeckll wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

take my wblow in da ...

DARK CLOAK!!!!!

Alcast wrote: »

take my wblow in da ...

DARK CLOAK!!!!!

Alcast wrote: »

take my wblow in da ...

DARK CLOAK!!!!!

Alcast wrote: »

God dammit Jeckll, you're so annoying...

good one xD

Armitas · August 2015

Several reasons

As long as you are in front of the enemy when they cast it it will hit you no matter how far away you are or even if you are 1 story above them. The hit or miss calculation does not match the animation. It appears to occur far before the animation hits.
Its channel cannot be bash interrupted
Block often fails to work on it, mostly due to improper animation.
You can channel heavy attacks underneath it for free giving you a WB immediately followed by a heavy attack each one buffing the other one by 10% and 20%
With 14k WB's it puts tremendous pressure on any opponent without a lot of consequence due to the short channel time and CC and gives the recipient few options to avoid it. You can mez/stun the opponent if they don't have immunity, or drop your block and try to get behind them while hoping they don't know how to back strafe. If you fail to get behind them you just got nuked.
It is so good there is no reason to use anything else, hence the spam.

Strider_Roshin · August 2015

Armitas wrote: »

Several reasons
As long as you are in front of the enemy when they cast it it will hit you no matter how far away you are or even if you are 1 story above them

Its channel cannot be bash interrupted

Block often fails to work on it

You can channel heavy attacks underneath it for free giving you a WB immediately followed by a heavy attack each one buffing the other one by 10% and 20%

With 14k WB's it puts tremendous pressure on any opponent without a lot of consequence due to the short channel time and CC and gives the recipient few options to avoid it.

It is so good there is no reason to use anything else, hence the spam.

I don't use it, and I do just fine. People want to spam it? Go ahead, I find nothing wrong with it. Just because it's a good move doesn't make it a broken one.

Armitas · August 2015

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Several reasons
As long as you are in front of the enemy when they cast it it will hit you no matter how far away you are or even if you are 1 story above them

Its channel cannot be bash interrupted

Block often fails to work on it

You can channel heavy attacks underneath it for free giving you a WB immediately followed by a heavy attack each one buffing the other one by 10% and 20%

With 14k WB's it puts tremendous pressure on any opponent without a lot of consequence due to the short channel time and CC and gives the recipient few options to avoid it.

It is so good there is no reason to use anything else, hence the spam.

I don't use it, and I do just fine. People want to spam it? Go ahead, I find nothing wrong with it. Just because it's a good move doesn't make it a broken one.

You use a two hander and don't use WB? what do you use for damage? I didn't say it was broken because it was the best skill in the tree, I said that was the reason why it was being spammed. I also listed several aspects that are quite literally broken with the skill.

kaithuzar · August 2015

Armitas wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Several reasons
As long as you are in front of the enemy when they cast it it will hit you no matter how far away you are or even if you are 1 story above them

Its channel cannot be bash interrupted

Block often fails to work on it

You can channel heavy attacks underneath it for free giving you a WB immediately followed by a heavy attack each one buffing the other one by 10% and 20%

With 14k WB's it puts tremendous pressure on any opponent without a lot of consequence due to the short channel time and CC and gives the recipient few options to avoid it.

It is so good there is no reason to use anything else, hence the spam.

I don't use it, and I do just fine. People want to spam it? Go ahead, I find nothing wrong with it. Just because it's a good move doesn't make it a broken one.

You use a two hander and don't use WB? what do you use for damage? I didn't say it was broken because it was the best skill in the tree, I said that was the reason why it was being spammed. I also listed several aspects that are quite literally broken with the skill.

There was a combo people were doing, heavy attack bow/poison inject + crit rush + heavy attack 2 hander + executioner/impale (if nb)

xylena · August 2015

stam dk/sorc have no other option remotely as strong for spammable direct dps

Araxleon · August 2015

Its not the damage that pisses me off...

Its that damn CC break delay once hit with knockback... Cheesy...

Ezareth · August 2015

Araxleon wrote: »

Its not the damage that pisses me off...

Its that damn CC break delay once hit with knockback... Cheesy...

Kind of like cloak spamming nightblades! I'm looking at you @Araxleon ! :P~

I still remember our fight on my Sorc! I think I attacked your bot more than you! lol.

TBois · August 2015

xylena wrote: »

stam dk/sorc have no other option remotely as strong for spammable direct dps

Check out my hall pass

Araxleon · August 2015

Ezareth wrote: »

Araxleon wrote: »

Its not the damage that pisses me off...

Its that damn CC break delay once hit with knockback... Cheesy...

Kind of like cloak spamming nightblades! I'm looking at you @Araxleon ! :P~

I still remember our fight on my Sorc! I think I attacked your bot more than you! lol.

When my bot tanks metoer i feel like a baby DK

xaraan · August 2015

It's a bit overpowered as it is. ZoS has heard this (on forums and in guild feedback) since 1.6 testing when they first were rolling out that big change and chose to ignore the feedback. Don't know why, but there you have it. This is why I've always pushed them to play the game more (and more seriously) as it seems they don't understand (or understand the why of) much of the feedback they are given.

Docmandu · August 2015

Mystikkal wrote: »

I know from a Stam DK's perspective it's used a lot because it's the only burst we have.. what else would we do, use burning breath to burst them down?

I recall a not so long ago stream where somebody had to bring out the OP Magicka NB to just barely be able to beat a perma blocking DK that hit like a truck on PTS (he couldn't do it with the magicka templar and magicka sorc). Damage + Defense, all in 1 nice package.

Forestd16b14_ESO · August 2015

WB has been a problem since U6 a few months ago and needs to be fixed. BEfore any one says "its not spammable and not OP and bla bla bla" it's it spammable just like crystal frags and WB is OP but not cause it hits like a truck it's suppost to that it's job it's OP cause it is spammable and were 2 or 3 hits from it completely drains your stamina either from breaking free from the knock back or from blocking cause one WB hit while blocking drains a quarter of it.

WB needs to not be nerfed but toned down to were it isn't the spammable power house it is now like crystal frags.

WillhelmBlack · August 2015

I was in the PTS the other day and a DK purposely WB'd me from stealth into the path of a mobs shield charge. Needless to say it was insta-death. I thought I'd been one shot at first lol, it actually hit me for nearly 10k but the mobs attack was over 18k, ouch.