At what point should we discuss CP imbalance in Cyrodiil?

sadownik · August 2015

BossTuggles wrote: »

sadowink, do you not think people who have been playing the game for a while now should have an advantage over new players? lets be honest anyone thinking they are just going to pick up a game an dominate is not really a smart person, thats not just this game either in all games be it mmo/fps/ whatever you wanna pick.

Oh i totaly understand the need for veterans to be stronger. But does it mean that their lvl should be unreachable? We are not talking about some artifact gear here. We are talking about something as basic as leveling.

Suru · August 2015

sadownik wrote: »

Suru wrote: »

A very smart friend of mind has a really interesting take on CP Imbalance. He told me that yes at times fighting someone and encountering someone with alot of CP can be annoying but he doesnt mind it much becuase fighting these people is all chance and in the grand scheme of things anyone who pvps seriously is at avarage in their own regard.

Well its all good now, but as in all MMOs with time there is bigger and bigger precentage of "veteran" players and i honestly dont see how somebody startig the game in 6 months will be a ble to compete in pvp.

And yea that is true, new players are on the short end of the stick, but they are implimenting making the first 400 CP being easier. and IMO the 75 point passives are some of the strongest in the game, so getting to 225 quick as well as the first 400 easier is amazing. At that point you can max reduced cost till it dimishes vertically at 10% and then max regen making it more balanced ; or putting points in those quality of life passives like tumbling. Everyone pvping now will have a steady progression rate some lower and some higher than the average in 6 months from now. There will always be those people with way more CP which we just call statistical anomalies.

sadownik · August 2015

Suru wrote: »

sadownik wrote: »

Suru wrote: »

A very smart friend of mind has a really interesting take on CP Imbalance. He told me that yes at times fighting someone and encountering someone with alot of CP can be annoying but he doesnt mind it much becuase fighting these people is all chance and in the grand scheme of things anyone who pvps seriously is at avarage in their own regard.

Well its all good now, but as in all MMOs with time there is bigger and bigger precentage of "veteran" players and i honestly dont see how somebody startig the game in 6 months will be a ble to compete in pvp.

And yea that is true, new players are on the short end of the stick, but they are implimenting making the first 400 CP being easier. and IMO the 75 point passives are some of the strongest in the game, so getting to 225 quick as well as the first 400 easier is amazing. At that point you can max reduced cost till it dimishes vertically at 10% and then max regen making it more balanced ; or putting points in those quality of life passives like tumbling. Everyone pvping now will have a steady progression rate some lower and some higher than the average in 6 months from now. There will always be those people with way more CP which we just call statistical anomalies.

If and when they will indeed implement that situation will be different.

BrassRazoo · August 2015

You can discuss it anytime you like, just as long as you don't expect anything to be done about, which there shouldn't be.

ThePonzzz · August 2015

The biggest issue really is when someone has what appears like unlimited magicka/stamina in a small skirmish. There is just no way to compete when it's one-on-one when you have like 87 CP against someone with 500 CP. It becomes very apparent that they are superior to you, even if you have more skill.

Since battle leveling exists, it should take into account CP disadvantages. I don't think non-CP campaigns are the answer. I think there just needs to be a hard cap on percentages and disabling the passives.

Jules · August 2015

Xiphyla wrote: »

Jules wrote: »

We all know that CP is a crucial piece in the development of a build. If you want to be strong at this time, you must have decent CP. We're talking 300+ or gtfo realistically. And that's conservative. As time continues, the disparity between those with 300 and those with 1k+ grows tremendously. And the gap between current players and new/returning players is even more disgusting.

I just honestly wanted to get the general consensus on how people feel about this. Personally, I applaud/am jealous of those who have high cp. But I'm just not interested in grinding 5hrs a day to join those ranks.

My main concern is just balance; both between the current population and the potential population. Can we honestly expect anyone to start playing or returning to ESO knowing that they are this far behind? Is there a feasible way to balance these CP in Cyro without discouraging the progression of those with higher CP? I think a hard cap is somewhat harsh. A cap on how many CP are applicable in Cyro is also harsh, but the most equalizing. I've heard talks of quarterly caps or scaling them (ie: 1-100 takes less xp than 300-400) which I think is probably the most fair way to do it.

Not sure what the exact right answer is here though. Interested in hearing people's thoughts.

Why issit harsh ? Just because people want to have a huge advantage over other people in pvp .

I mean, I wouldn't be entirely against the cap chilling at like 360 or something comparable. However, I can imagine being in the shoes of someone who had grinded all the excess and being pretttttyyyy salty. Pretty much would mean days of their lives had been wasted grinding for absolutely nothing. I don't think that's right. I just think it should be a tad more balanced.

Celas_Dranacea · August 2015

Create a seasonal caps with the first cap being at 300 cp.

Make there be a 50% cost reduction to earn the first 250 cp.

After that, the cp cap as well as the cost reduction can go up by 100 every 3 months / 90 days..

Folks can earn on average 1cp per day and feel progress without dramatically outstripping slower players

The bottom line is, ZOS did not intend for people to have earned 600+ cp by now. This was possible due to failed mechanics.

The CP system is great, very cool, but the inequity between new and hardcore players is too great. There is a great enough divide considering skill, gear, and alliance ranks without having this huge cp gap.

Create this seasonal cap + cost reduction for lower ranks of cp and the issue is resolved.

Jules · August 2015

BrassRazoo wrote: »

You can discuss it anytime you like, just as long as you don't expect anything to be done about, which there shouldn't be.

Grats on most useless comment NA.

ToRelax · August 2015

Jules wrote: »

Xiphyla wrote: »

Jules wrote: »

We all know that CP is a crucial piece in the development of a build. If you want to be strong at this time, you must have decent CP. We're talking 300+ or gtfo realistically. And that's conservative. As time continues, the disparity between those with 300 and those with 1k+ grows tremendously. And the gap between current players and new/returning players is even more disgusting.

I just honestly wanted to get the general consensus on how people feel about this. Personally, I applaud/am jealous of those who have high cp. But I'm just not interested in grinding 5hrs a day to join those ranks.

My main concern is just balance; both between the current population and the potential population. Can we honestly expect anyone to start playing or returning to ESO knowing that they are this far behind? Is there a feasible way to balance these CP in Cyro without discouraging the progression of those with higher CP? I think a hard cap is somewhat harsh. A cap on how many CP are applicable in Cyro is also harsh, but the most equalizing. I've heard talks of quarterly caps or scaling them (ie: 1-100 takes less xp than 300-400) which I think is probably the most fair way to do it.

Not sure what the exact right answer is here though. Interested in hearing people's thoughts.

Why issit harsh ? Just because people want to have a huge advantage over other people in pvp .

I mean, I wouldn't be entirely against the cap chilling at like 360 or something comparable. However, I can imagine being in the shoes of someone who had grinded all the excess and being pretttttyyyy salty. Pretty much would mean days of their lives had been wasted grinding for absolutely nothing. I don't think that's right. I just think it should be a tad more balanced.

Honestly, spending days of their life on increasing the imbalance in a video game's pvp to their advantage sounds pretty wasted to me. Especially considering most competitive players would either quit when they can't stand the imbalances any longer or grind themselves.

Xeniph · August 2015

Personally I don't see this as an issue. I have yet to fight anyone that leaves me wondering "What happened?" . However I am in the 300 cp range.

With that said, aside from the campaign changes they spoke about, Zos also said they were looking at implementing a CP cap per "season" and a much more robust catch-up system, soon (tm).

Personally I think the right answer here is to leave it alone. I don't mind fighting folks with much more cp then myself, it gives me motivation to get more.

Dru1076 · August 2015

BossTuggles wrote: »

This mindset of everything has to be fair and equal no matter what is killing games in general. Keep it out of my pvp please. These people grind/craft/level so that they have an advantage over people who don't. If there is no advantage to obtain why even play an mmo at all? Like everything in life Time Spent = Success.

This makes sense as an argument until you realise that not everyone has the time to spend grinding. Some of us work for a living and the last time I checked the figures the average age of an MMO gamer was 36. How many people that age can still live like teenagers and play games all day?

Your argument assumes everybody has the same OPPORTUNITY to play but CHOOSE not to, which is fundamentally flawed. What you really saying, from my point of view, is that people who work for a living should be punished for not having time to play games. Which is pretty stupid if you really think about it.

Jules · August 2015

BossTuggles wrote: »

This mindset of everything has to be fair and equal no matter what is killing games in general. Keep it out of my pvp please. These people grind/craft/level so that they have an advantage over people who don't. If there is no advantage to obtain why even play an mmo at all? Like everything in life Time Spent = Success.

In a perfect world, you may be right.
However this is not a perfect world, it's a video game. And there are other things to consider.

How much fun will this game be in 6 months, in a year if there is no one playing? What will happen if everyone who picks it up immediately drops it because to catch up to their opponent is unfathomable/impossible?

There is more to consider than just the simple "I earned it, everyone else can shove it" school of thought.

BossTuggles · August 2015

Dru1076 wrote: »

BossTuggles wrote: »

This mindset of everything has to be fair and equal no matter what is killing games in general. Keep it out of my pvp please. These people grind/craft/level so that they have an advantage over people who don't. If there is no advantage to obtain why even play an mmo at all? Like everything in life Time Spent = Success.

This makes sense as an argument until you realise that not everyone has the time to spend grinding. Some of us work for a living and the last time I checked the figures the average age of an MMO gamer was 36. How many people that age can still live like teenagers and play games all day?

Your argument assumes everybody has the same OPPORTUNITY to play but CHOOSE not to, which is fundamentally flawed. What you really saying, from my point of view, is that people who work for a living should be punished for not having time to play games. Which is pretty stupid if you really think about it.

I have 45-50 hour work weeks. My CP is currently 218 i said it previous in this thread. I am probably below average and I maybe play 2-3 times a week and pvp with my friends and I make 3 CP a session easy. With all this being said your making it sound like im some teenager grinding away my summer vacation. Ignorance. Getting 1 CP for like a 2 hour pvp session is VERY easy and EXTREMELY doable. Im not even a big super boss in pvp. I, even being at the disadvantage, do not agree in any way that these other people who A) play more than me or B ) take this game more serious than me should be punished for these "under dogs" who can't put in the time or the effort. Again like anything in life Time Spent = Success if you dont put in the same time as other folks you should not be on equal foorting. they shouldnt be brought down to your level. You need to step your game up. This is the attitude I am speaking of. Everyone wants that raid gear / PvP skills / PvP rank whatever in any of these games but people do not want to put the effort into it.

Edit who knew that B ) makes an emoticon.

ThePonzzz · August 2015

Xeniph wrote: »

Personally I don't see this as an issue. I have yet to fight anyone that leaves me wondering "What happened?" . However I am in the 300 cp range.

With that said, aside from the campaign changes they spoke about, Zos also said they were looking at implementing a CP cap per "season" and a much more robust catch-up system, soon (tm).

Personally I think the right answer here is to leave it alone. I don't mind fighting folks with much more cp then myself, it gives me motivation to get more.

The 300 CP range is much further along than a lot of people who are more casual players. I physically can't even gain 3 CP in a day of playing because I simply don't have the time. If I gain 1, I feel good. This isn't a woe is me, but when it comes to PvP combat and battle leveling that is already part of this system, CP should be accounted for as well. If battle leveling didn't exist, and lower level characters were already at a disadvantage, I say the CP advantage as is would work. But that's not the case. Let my VR 14 gear and skills shine too then.

Septimus_Magna · August 2015

The design of the CS has been somewhat too long term for it to work in the beginning. The passives themselfs have decreasing benefits the more points you spend but this only gets noticable once you reach 600 CPs, or so I have been told. The problem is most players wont reach this many CPs for another year, after that the difference between hard-core CWCers and normal players will get smaller and smaller.

That being said, they could easily make a Battle Spirit debuff to decrease the effectiveness of CPs by x% while in Cyrodiil.

Yuke · August 2015

I was fighting an old companion from daoc days yesterday who was grinding vdsa/cwc since release. He had 1213 CPs on a stamblade and i died a horrible death.

That was the only situation i was really pissed about the system i have to say. I can deal with +/- 400cps difference but more then 2.5 times my cps is just almost impossible to cope with. His Lightattacks were dealing 6k critical damage.

Lucky28 · August 2015

manny254 wrote: »

Taresgos wrote: »

pls explain how to increase primary stats with CP?

Every champion point you spend gives you a small attribute boost. They correspond to the color of the Champion Point you earn. Orange gives health, green gives stamina, and blue gives magicka.

Nice i did not know that.

Anyways. i feel they changed something in the past three weeks. My computer was in the shop so i haven't played till today. and my V9 nord Sorc has gone complete beast mode. literally ROFLstomping players left and right in Cyrodiil..... i mean before i could hold my own well enough but all the sudden i just feel stupidly powerful, why?.

Not that i'm complaining mind you, just curious.

Leandor · August 2015

There is an undeniable advantage of having more CPs than your opponent, and it would be ludicrous to deny it. Also, the point where CP difference does not matter anymore is reached much later than the "first 300 or 400 points". Yes, the difference grows smaller, but there are still very significant secondary advantages. My opinion of the "more CP don't matter"-point is 1500 total.

That said, I still think that skill is of a larger influence, in a game where first hit wins. It depends on the opponent, what exactly is the first hit - the first one to CC after depleting stamina, the first one getting off the stealthed WB, the first one getting an unmitigated ranged crit... All equal strength skill opponent fights are decided in the blink of an eye, one mistake and toast.

Whether the WB does 20k or 25k does not really matter - with a decent rotation, you will get the second hit in to finish off the opponent.

CPs do not make it easier to press block at the right moment. Or dodge. Or shield. Whether the shield is 25% bigger or not - you have stopped his combo and will survive to see him make the mistake.

A good catch up mechanic for those far behind server average and a slow down mechanic for those far ahead of server average CP is the best solution. No need to remove the system after just having implemented it or retroactively put in place artificial caps that will do nothing but be either ineffective for catching up or massively punish those that already went beyond, considering it is a mistake that ZOS made in their conception, not the players that abused it.

NB: still only at 300 CP, too busy leveling the alts up to Veteran ranks.

k2blader · August 2015

ThePonzzz wrote: »

Xeniph wrote: »

Personally I don't see this as an issue. I have yet to fight anyone that leaves me wondering "What happened?" . However I am in the 300 cp range.

With that said, aside from the campaign changes they spoke about, Zos also said they were looking at implementing a CP cap per "season" and a much more robust catch-up system, soon (tm).

Personally I think the right answer here is to leave it alone. I don't mind fighting folks with much more cp then myself, it gives me motivation to get more.

The 300 CP range is much further along than a lot of people who are more casual players. I physically can't even gain 3 CP in a day of playing because I simply don't have the time. If I gain 1, I feel good. This isn't a woe is me, but when it comes to PvP combat and battle leveling that is already part of this system, CP should be accounted for as well. If battle leveling didn't exist, and lower level characters were already at a disadvantage, I say the CP advantage as is would work. But that's not the case. Let my VR 14 gear and skills shine too then.

Agree, many people who post on the PvP forums are already past or pretty close to the (magical?) 300 CP mark, so they don't really take the CP issue as seriously as those who feel it most. I play the game for PvP and that is how I've earned and will continue to earn the majority of my CPs (through slow leveling through PvP). I notice with the play time I can get in, I can gain 1 CP every 2-3 nights or so. Assuming this rate stays about the same, in about 6 months I may be able to hit ~160-190 CPs. Not complaining really; just wish folks understood there is a big difference for casual players.

[edit] maths is hard ;-\

DaveMoeDee · August 2015

VincentBlanquin wrote: »

if you play the game 2 months and get to vr14 (realistic for nongrinder and casual) you can have like 50 champion points overall and enough resources to have crafted gold gear. You play 2 months so you expect to be atleast sometimes competitive at pvp, but you have ZERO chance, almost zero chance to have 1vs1 with someone with your power. The same after 3 months with 100 champion points. Noone can stay here with only zerging for more than 2 months, its not bearable

2 months? That is not realistic. It would take pretty focused play just for the non-casual nongrinder. No chance for casual player, unless we are working with much different meanings of casual.

DaveMoeDee · August 2015

Celas_Dranacea wrote: »

Create a seasonal caps with the first cap being at 300 cp.

Make there be a 50% cost reduction to earn the first 250 cp.

After that, the cp cap as well as the cost reduction can go up by 100 every 3 months / 90 days..

Folks can earn on average 1cp per day and feel progress without dramatically outstripping slower players

The bottom line is, ZOS did not intend for people to have earned 600+ cp by now. This was possible due to failed mechanics.

The CP system is great, very cool, but the inequity between new and hardcore players is too great. There is a great enough divide considering skill, gear, and alliance ranks without having this huge cp gap.

Create this seasonal cap + cost reduction for lower ranks of cp and the issue is resolved.

I'm confused by this season cap. How will that help down the road when new players come to the game? Why should we adjust the game for the 'slow players' who didn't put in the effort in the past but not adjust the game for the people who will start playing two years from now?

That doesn't seem like a solution to me.

MaximillianDiE · August 2015

Zenimax will kill this game with the introduction of CP in the long run unless they do something pretty quickly as the imbalance is already starting to show itself. No new player will stay for long getting wrecked by people with such an advantage over them that CP gives. Its already noticeable in the way there are some players who were really ordinary pre 1.6 who have suddenly turned into demi-gods as a result of their huge CPeens. For the same the great (and not so great) pvpers of the past who quit because of lag, burnout, Nirn or any of the bazillion other reasons Zeni has given its pvp playerbase over the past 18 months. Why would they come back to get owned by some nub who's spent 8 hours a day mindlessly grinding mobs in Crackpipe Cave or elsewhere to get such a huge advantage?

Mindlessly grinding pve mobs for endless hours at a time does not and should not equate with "earning" anything in the pvp space. There should be a ceiling beyond which the real pvp can start otherwise why would anyone bother starting or restarting if the imbalance gets too wide or the time to catch up gets to be too much? Player attrition is already a problem for ESO as the fact that AS is now the only server with a reliable pvp population left and even then outside of US primetime that's quite variable now. When the CP gap gets too much to deal with or a better more balanced pvp based mmo (cough CU) comes out - just you watch the population plummet and with no new or returning players it won't be unable to replace those losses.

DaveMoeDee · August 2015

Dru1076 wrote: »

BossTuggles wrote: »

This mindset of everything has to be fair and equal no matter what is killing games in general. Keep it out of my pvp please. These people grind/craft/level so that they have an advantage over people who don't. If there is no advantage to obtain why even play an mmo at all? Like everything in life Time Spent = Success.

This makes sense as an argument until you realise that not everyone has the time to spend grinding. Some of us work for a living and the last time I checked the figures the average age of an MMO gamer was 36. How many people that age can still live like teenagers and play games all day?

Your argument assumes everybody has the same OPPORTUNITY to play but CHOOSE not to, which is fundamentally flawed. What you really saying, from my point of view, is that people who work for a living should be punished for not having time to play games. Which is pretty stupid if you really think about it.

Maybe people who can't put in the time should play multiplayer games that aren't RPGs if they want to be on equal statistical footing with the most advanced players.

Jules · August 2015

MaximillianDiE wrote: »

Zenimax will kill this game with the introduction of CP in the long run unless they do something pretty quickly as the imbalance is already starting to show itself. No new player will stay for long getting wrecked by people with such an advantage over them that CP gives. Its already noticeable in the way there are some players who were really ordinary pre 1.6 who have suddenly turned into demi-gods as a result of their huge CPeens. For the same the great (and not so great) pvpers of the past who quit because of lag, burnout, Nirn or any of the bazillion other reasons Zeni has given its pvp playerbase over the past 18 months. Why would they come back to get owned by some nub who's spent 8 hours a day mindlessly grinding mobs in Crackpipe Cave or elsewhere to get such a huge advantage?

Mindlessly grinding pve mobs for endless hours at a time does not and should not equate with "earning" anything in the pvp space. There should be a ceiling beyond which the real pvp can start otherwise why would anyone bother starting or restarting if the imbalance gets too wide or the time to catch up gets to be too much? Player attrition is already a problem for ESO as the fact that AS is now the only server with a reliable pvp population left and even then outside of US primetime that's quite variable now. When the CP gap gets too much to deal with or a better more balanced pvp based mmo (cough CU) comes out - just you watch the population plummet and with no new or returning players it won't be unable to replace those losses.

I agree. ZOS has given everyone numerous reasons to say fugg it. If lag and imbalances arent fixed or atleast on the right track w next update, fairly sure the population will hemorrhage.

WRX · August 2015

MaximillianDiE wrote: »

Zenimax will kill this game with the introduction of CP in the long run unless they do something pretty quickly as the imbalance is already starting to show itself. No new player will stay for long getting wrecked by people with such an advantage over them that CP gives. Its already noticeable in the way there are some players who were really ordinary pre 1.6 who have suddenly turned into demi-gods as a result of their huge CPeens. For the same the great (and not so great) pvpers of the past who quit because of lag, burnout, Nirn or any of the bazillion other reasons Zeni has given its pvp playerbase over the past 18 months. Why would they come back to get owned by some nub who's spent 8 hours a day mindlessly grinding mobs in Crackpipe Cave or elsewhere to get such a huge advantage?

Mindlessly grinding pve mobs for endless hours at a time does not and should not equate with "earning" anything in the pvp space. There should be a ceiling beyond which the real pvp can start otherwise why would anyone bother starting or restarting if the imbalance gets too wide or the time to catch up gets to be too much? Player attrition is already a problem for ESO as the fact that AS is now the only server with a reliable pvp population left and even then outside of US primetime that's quite variable now. When the CP gap gets too much to deal with or a better more balanced pvp based mmo (cough CU) comes out - just you watch the population plummet and with no new or returning players it won't be unable to replace those losses.

You guys still doing CU?

Ezareth · August 2015

k2blader wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

Xeniph wrote: »

Personally I don't see this as an issue. I have yet to fight anyone that leaves me wondering "What happened?" . However I am in the 300 cp range.

With that said, aside from the campaign changes they spoke about, Zos also said they were looking at implementing a CP cap per "season" and a much more robust catch-up system, soon (tm).

Personally I think the right answer here is to leave it alone. I don't mind fighting folks with much more cp then myself, it gives me motivation to get more.

The 300 CP range is much further along than a lot of people who are more casual players. I physically can't even gain 3 CP in a day of playing because I simply don't have the time. If I gain 1, I feel good. This isn't a woe is me, but when it comes to PvP combat and battle leveling that is already part of this system, CP should be accounted for as well. If battle leveling didn't exist, and lower level characters were already at a disadvantage, I say the CP advantage as is would work. But that's not the case. Let my VR 14 gear and skills shine too then.

Agree, many people who post on the PvP forums are already past or pretty close to the (magical?) 300 CP mark, so they don't really take the CP issue as seriously as those who feel it most. I play the game for PvP and that is how I've earned and will continue to earn the majority of my CPs (through slow leveling through PvP). I notice with the play time I can get in, I can gain 1 CP every 2-3 nights or so. Assuming this rate stays about the same, in about 6 months I may be able to hit ~160-190 CPs. Not complaining really; just wish folks understood there is a big difference for casual players.

[edit] maths is hard ;-\

If you're playing the game to PvP ( as most of us on these forums do) then you aren't playing if you're only getting one CP every 2-3 days...additionally you're losing enlightened because you're not ever unenlightened.

When enlightened a kill quest turnin is 50k. Tagging a player who dies is 9k. A defensive tick is 8k. If you're not making 400k AP a night in this state then you're not someone this game should be designed aeound, sorry.

The only reason someone shouldn't get 1 CP a night is if they're not playing. Which brings me to my second point.

Getting that second point beyond the first is 4 times harder along with every point after it. Only a handful of people are grinding insane amounts of CP and many of the ones I know who have have burned out and quit the game, or have stopped grinding for the most part....which leads me to my final point.

The same people who are complaining about this massive CP disparity are the same people who accuse others of exploiting, macroing or lagging out every time they die. Some people just can't accept the fact that they lost because of a lack of skill. We all fight people with an absurd competitive advantage over us every day...they're called Emperors. If you're fine with those then you shouldn't have an issue with dying to someone who ground out more CP...just like that Emp ground out more AP. The only reason people have issues with this is their egos.

sadownik · August 2015

Ezareth wrote: »

k2blader wrote: »

ThePonzzz wrote: »

Xeniph wrote: »

Personally I don't see this as an issue. I have yet to fight anyone that leaves me wondering "What happened?" . However I am in the 300 cp range.

With that said, aside from the campaign changes they spoke about, Zos also said they were looking at implementing a CP cap per "season" and a much more robust catch-up system, soon (tm).

Personally I think the right answer here is to leave it alone. I don't mind fighting folks with much more cp then myself, it gives me motivation to get more.

The 300 CP range is much further along than a lot of people who are more casual players. I physically can't even gain 3 CP in a day of playing because I simply don't have the time. If I gain 1, I feel good. This isn't a woe is me, but when it comes to PvP combat and battle leveling that is already part of this system, CP should be accounted for as well. If battle leveling didn't exist, and lower level characters were already at a disadvantage, I say the CP advantage as is would work. But that's not the case. Let my VR 14 gear and skills shine too then.

Agree, many people who post on the PvP forums are already past or pretty close to the (magical?) 300 CP mark, so they don't really take the CP issue as seriously as those who feel it most. I play the game for PvP and that is how I've earned and will continue to earn the majority of my CPs (through slow leveling through PvP). I notice with the play time I can get in, I can gain 1 CP every 2-3 nights or so. Assuming this rate stays about the same, in about 6 months I may be able to hit ~160-190 CPs. Not complaining really; just wish folks understood there is a big difference for casual players.

[edit] maths is hard ;-\

If you're playing the game to PvP ( as most of us on these forums do) then you aren't playing if you're only getting one CP every 2-3 days...additionally you're losing enlightened because you're not ever unenlightened.

When enlightened a kill quest turnin is 50k. Tagging a player who dies is 9k. A defensive tick is 8k. If you're not making 400k AP a night in this state then you're not someone this game should be designed aeound, sorry.

The only reason someone shouldn't get 1 CP a night is if they're not playing. Which brings me to my second point.

Getting that second point beyond the first is 4 times harder along with every point after it. Only a handful of people are grinding insane amounts of CP and many of the ones I know who have have burned out and quit the game, or have stopped grinding for the most part....which leads me to my final point.

The same people who are complaining about this massive CP disparity are the same people who accuse others of exploiting, macroing or lagging out every time they die. Some people just can't accept the fact that they lost because of a lack of skill. We all fight people with an absurd competitive advantage over us every day...they're called Emperors. If you're fine with those then you shouldn't have an issue with dying to someone who ground out more CP...just like that Emp ground out more AP. The only reason people have issues with this is their egos.

I really envy you, evening in pvp (2 h for me) on my vr 10 afair never got me full cp.

Itoq · August 2015

BossTuggles wrote: »

l? Like everything in life Time Spent = Success.

Time spent in an mmo should be primarily for honing instincts, fine tuning timing, innately understanding mechanics, etc.

Yes, for most mmo as we think of them today, a substantial chunk of that time will also be for grinding for better or more skill points, gear, and the like. But there has to be a limit on which time spent playing the game returns built in advantages.

The concept is not unlike practicing at a sport such as soccer.You can play and play and play and get better and better.

However, in soccer, there are not unlocks at 1000 hours which allow the use of hands or unlocks at 2000 hours which allow the use of rocket powered hover boards to move about. You are not rewarded the ability to tackle other players without penalty just because you have grinded out heading a ball 10,000 times.

Kova · August 2015

This is what player's grinding/boasting high CPs remind me of:

https://youtu.be/dGa4Nat2R00?t=2m38s

At 2:38.
The video contains NSFW language later on, but not at this time.

MaximillianDiE · August 2015

WRX wrote: »

You guys still doing CU?

Yes - that's the one all DiE members past and present (only a handful left now) are waiting for.