Biting jabs OP?

Jolinius · August 2015

Ive been getting one shotted on live with this and 2 shotted on pts with no real way to counter this ability. Like it goes gap closer biting jabs me playing through break free animation second biting jabs dead. Or gap closer bting jabs try to roll dodge knocked out of rolldodge into more biting jabs ...dead. Or block it does a huge amount of damage through block and drains your stam very fast and cant put enough pressure on to do any good . You cant cloak out of it and its very hard to run from with its large range and snare from burning light.

Its an aoe interrupt and cc that debuffs the enemy with off balance procs exploiter ,burning light etc . Has the longest mellee range and does the most dps in game. Just the fact that you can spam this one ability and get the highest dps of any class makes me think this should be looked at.

p.s. I dont have any trouble countering this on my sorc just all other classes.

If anyone has some suggestions on this i would like to hear them.

Alcast · August 2015

Step 2m aside? Usually dmg is not high, between 1-3k/jab
for example, I cant get trhough a sorcs shield when he is stacking it with jabs.....better nerf *** like that

it already got nerfed twice fyi

on PTS there is a bug atm which multiplies the dmg i think

tplink3r1 · August 2015

Fun fact: As a templar, i never got killed by another templar spamming Jabs.

LazyLewis · August 2015

You shouldn't just have to 'step to the side' it comes down to how much damage it does which is absolutely insane

tplink3r1 · August 2015

LazyLewis wrote: »

You shouldn't just have to 'step to the side' it comes down to how much damage it does which is absolutely insane

Right, you also shouldn't have to block, or heal because you have been hit by an ability, if you do, that ability needs a nerf!

Alcast · August 2015

LazyLewis wrote: »

You shouldn't just have to 'step to the side' it comes down to how much damage it does which is absolutely insane

as i said, it does not deal a lot of damage, and you can block it.

if you are talking PTS, then again, there is a bug where it deals 5x or 10x the normal damage atm

kkampaseb17_ESO · August 2015

Alcast wrote: »

LazyLewis wrote: »

You shouldn't just have to 'step to the side' it comes down to how much damage it does which is absolutely insane

as i said, it does not deal a lot of damage, and you can block it.

if you are talking PTS, then again, there is a bug where it deals 5x or 10x the normal damage atm

And is this bug acknowledged by the devs or are we going to have a funny first week during the release of this update?

Ace_SiN · August 2015

LazyLewis wrote: »

You shouldn't just have to 'step to the side' it comes down to how much damage it does which is absolutely insane

You shouldn't have to avoid damage to not take damage?

Biting Jabs is only powerful if you get the full channel off on someone. The thing is it's not difficult for anyone to avoid, at the very least, half of the channel by simple movement(if you're dying by 2 jabs, then you need to put on armor). The user is also leaving himself open to attack, since again, it's a channel.

A nerf to this skill would make it useless.

Hears_Bright_Colors · August 2015

tplink3r1 wrote: »

LazyLewis wrote: »

You shouldn't just have to 'step to the side' it comes down to how much damage it does which is absolutely insane

Right, you also shouldn't have to block, or heal because you have been hit by an ability, if you do, that ability needs a nerf!

My concealed weapon hits for 50k, but you can block or roll dodge it. It's fine, yeah? Skill damage needs to be balanced whether you can block/dodge it or not.

As someone else said, flying blade and jab spam are doing more damage than intended on PTS right now. Just have to deal with the PTS warriors spamming the hell out of it until it gets fixed and put into a build.

Ahzek · August 2015

On live jabs is not an issue for me.
On PTS however i have had some nasty experiences with over 8k dmg per stab, which is completly insane considering the battle spirit changes.
If thats a bug lets pray it gets fixed. If not lets pray,it gets nerfed xD.

Personofsecrets · August 2015

Now that people can't hold up block reasonably, yes, in PVP, OP

Cinbri · August 2015

Well, on previous pts it was bugged and dealt like full cahnnel - 15k damage. Didnt try it on current pts.

tplink3r1 · August 2015

Hears_Bright_Colors wrote: »

tplink3r1 wrote: »

LazyLewis wrote: »

You shouldn't just have to 'step to the side' it comes down to how much damage it does which is absolutely insane

Right, you also shouldn't have to block, or heal because you have been hit by an ability, if you do, that ability needs a nerf!

My concealed weapon hits for 50k, but you can block or roll dodge it. It's fine, yeah? Skill damage needs to be balanced whether you can block/dodge it or not.

As someone else said, flying blade and jab spam are doing more damage than intended on PTS right now. Just have to deal with the PTS warriors spamming the hell out of it until it gets fixed and put into a build.

Well, Jabs doesn't hit for 50k and Concealed weapon is really easy to aim.
If CW was as hard as Jabs to aim i wouldn't mind they increasing its damage.

Rhaegar75 · August 2015

don't worry, if it is a bug, they won't just fix it ....they'll probably nerf the whole class ....AGAIN

Forcebuster · August 2015

Don't think anything is wrong with it, as a skill that hits 4 times and one roll dodge avoids all 4 attacks, what do you expect happens if you get stunned and don't get up in time?. same thing with any ability: like wrecking blow if someone comes up to you and you don't break out of it, you will be getting knocked up in the air constantly or maybe if he/she is lucky can 1 shot you with it ,and on pts it doesn't hit as high as it does on live.

kkampaseb17_ESO · August 2015

Forcebuster wrote: »

Don't think anything is wrong with it, as a skill that hits 4 times and one roll dodge avoids all 4 attacks, what do you expect happens if you get stunned and don't get up in time?. same thing with any ability: like wrecking blow if someone comes up to you and you don't break out of it, you will be getting knocked up in the air constantly or maybe if he/she is lucky can 1 shot you with it ,and on pts it doesn't hit as high as it does on live.

So you mean you cannot cast it again....ever cause your resources are depleted? When you cast it again what the person has to do again? Dodge or block? And when exactly can he start using damage on you? Ohh.....he has better to stay away from you and kite you? BS....damage has to be dealt. It is unreasonable anything to be hitting for 15k damage with the current Battle spirit...end of story.

timidobserver · August 2015

Ace_SiN wrote: »

LazyLewis wrote: »

You shouldn't just have to 'step to the side' it comes down to how much damage it does which is absolutely insane

You shouldn't have to avoid damage to not take damage?

Biting Jabs is only powerful if you get the full channel off on someone. The thing is it's not difficult for anyone to avoid, at the very least, half of the channel by simple movement(if you're dying by 2 jabs, then you need to put on armor). The user is also leaving himself open to attack, since again, it's a channel.

A nerf to this skill would make it useless.

Armor is worthless against anyone running a proper biting jabs build. Jabs should not be nerfed, but the easily obtainable 100% penetration should be. The reason everyone takes so much damage from jabs, or any well built stam build, is because it is like they are naked. The only way to deal with this on live was damage shields or perma block.

Jolinius · August 2015

Yeah stepping 2m to the side works when your directly on their face but its a cone attack so if further back that cone is bigger.Also they can aim the jabs. From what ive been seeing its about 8k to 12k per biting jab channe without burning light procl. If you get hit with the first one it knocks you back into that large cone of damage so its very hard to get out of.Also the clipping is weird...like if someone is trying to wb you you just walk through them ....cant do that with jabs ....ive accidently gotten too close to the back of a templar while he was jabbing away and it jabbed out in front of him into the cone of damage.

Stalwart385 · August 2015

I have ran into an insane damage biting jabs on PTS. Compared to other solo fights in particular. While blocking with full stam and full health in heavy armor I was getting killed before the third jabs finished. That was with a heal in between and strafing to avoid. Normally my playstyle is to absorb the initial burst then wear down the enemy. This has worked well in most encounters but that one jabs build I ran into, I had no chance. My guess is it is a bug because it feels like an outlier from my time on PTS. I've also ran into several templars running jabs that did not have the deadly pop that one had. Maybe its a penetration issue or a missed decimal point on a certain level of jabs. Who knows.

I can't say I've seen anything like it on live.

Alcast · August 2015

Stalwart385 wrote: »

I have ran into an insane damage biting jabs on PTS. Compared to other solo fights in particular. While blocking with full stam and full health in heavy armor I was getting killed before the third jabs finished. That was with a heal in between and strafing to avoid. Normally my playstyle is to absorb the initial burst then wear down the enemy. This has worked well in most encounters but that one jabs build I ran into, I had no chance. My guess is it is a bug because it feels like an outlier from my time on PTS. I've also ran into several templars running jabs that did not have the deadly pop that one had. Maybe its a penetration issue or a missed decimal point on a certain level of jabs. Who knows.

I can't say I've seen anything like it on live.

One of the flying blade levels also deals like 5x the dmg

so prolly one of the jabs levels also has a 0 too much

Jolinius · August 2015

If it is just a damge bug thats causing extra damage then its not so bad but they still get better dps than any other class just spamming one ability which makes angry on my other dps classes and on my stam templar dps makes me bored.

Alcast · August 2015

Jolinius wrote: »

If it is just a damge bug thats causing extra damage then its not so bad but they still get better dps than any other class just spamming one ability which makes angry on my other dps classes and on my stam templar dps makes me bored.

you can get the same dps with ANY other class..

tplink3r1 · August 2015

kkampaseb17_ESO wrote: »

Forcebuster wrote: »

Don't think anything is wrong with it, as a skill that hits 4 times and one roll dodge avoids all 4 attacks, what do you expect happens if you get stunned and don't get up in time?. same thing with any ability: like wrecking blow if someone comes up to you and you don't break out of it, you will be getting knocked up in the air constantly or maybe if he/she is lucky can 1 shot you with it ,and on pts it doesn't hit as high as it does on live.

So you mean you cannot cast it again....ever cause your resources are depleted? When you cast it again what the person has to do again? Dodge or block? And when exactly can he start using damage on you? Ohh.....he has better to stay away from you and kite you? BS....damage has to be dealt. It is unreasonable anything to be hitting for 15k damage with the current Battle spirit...end of story.

15k Jab? I can't get my 4 jabs to hit for 10k with around 4k weapon damage(5pc ravager active) and 28k stamina and you are saying 15k jabs is normal.
Each of my jabs has 1200+140% damage for the closest target, that means 2880 per jab.
2880*4 = 11520, half of that is 5760(battle spirit buff).
If people are hitting you for 15k+ with this ability they must be abusing some kind of bug.
note: i ignored crits and armor.
note2: Just tested my damage on a DK, each of my jabs dealt 1355(non-crit) damage on him.

Jolinius · August 2015

Alcast wrote: »

Jolinius wrote: »

If it is just a damge bug thats causing extra damage then its not so bad but they still get better dps than any other class just spamming one ability which makes angry on my other dps classes and on my stam templar dps makes me bored.

you can get the same dps with ANY other class..

I challenge you to get 28k single target sustained dps on a non daedra with a sorc or nb. And then post a video please.

Anazasi · August 2015

On PTS with the players who are exploiting the Twice Borne double mundas glitch Bitting Jabs the Stamina Ability will hit for 11k. I am sure on live it is hitting for 22k or better. Stepping to the side on live is easy because you don't have to suffer the penalty for dodging however on PTS you might as well bend over and kiss your asssss goodbye. This UPDATE is a very sad and buggy product and will more than likely not be released on August 31st without major overhaul. If it is release on August 31st it will be the end of ESO the players will not accept this type of buggy content.

FYI new bug on PTS today is the ultimate spamming. Yes that's right unlimited Ultimate spamming.

olemanwinter · August 2015

My build *was* made for max DPS burst. I have no defense and no armor and on live put out more single target burst than any other build I know of.

On the PTS I was running with a templar in full heavy armor who had tons of self heals and he was just running through the sewers spamming nothing but biting jabs.

Biting jabs spam in full heavy is now higher DPS than my full rotation out of stealth as a stam NB.

So, yeah, it's OP.

Alcast · August 2015

Jolinius wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

Jolinius wrote: »

If it is just a damge bug thats causing extra damage then its not so bad but they still get better dps than any other class just spamming one ability which makes angry on my other dps classes and on my stam templar dps makes me bored.

you can get the same dps with ANY other class..

I challenge you to get 28k single target sustained dps on a non daedra with a sorc or nb. And then post a video please.

here you go, 29k dps on bloodspawn (my friends char)

you can get 30k+ with any class on Bloodspawn, its only a question of what setup you use

https://youtu.be/MhICiLSgp10

Vatter · August 2015

instead of crying for biting jabs nerf how about crying for a armor penetration nerf. thats the real problem. but then that would effect your NB as well and we can't be having that can we.

olemanwinter · August 2015

Vatter wrote: »

instead of crying for biting jabs nerf how about crying for a armor penetration nerf. thats the real problem. but then that would effect your NB as well and we can't be having that can we.

The armor penetration nerf is global, so it's already affecting NB equally.

If biting jabs is doing RELATIVELY less damage to other skills on live and somehow now doing RELATIVELY greater damage to other skills on the PTS, and nothing in the patch notes explains a purposefully made change by Zos, then something is wrong and needs fixed.

It's either intended or it's not. If it's intended then they should say so. If it's not intended then it needs fixed.

olemanwinter · August 2015

Alcast wrote: »

SNIP - YOUTUBE VIDEO

I think he means NOW on the PTS. Your video is from March.

I could be confused, but I think the issue here is how there is a global reduction in damage that seems to have hit everything harder than biting jabs which equates to a buff to Templar DPS.

They adjusted the resistance values on the PTS for NPCs even outside of Cyrodiil, so your video is no longer valid.

His point, right or wrong, I believe is that only templars are going to be able to achieve pre-2.1 levels of DPS.

That's the gist I got anyway.

Alcast · August 2015

olemanwinter wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

SNIP - YOUTUBE VIDEO

I think he means NOW on the PTS. Your video is from March.

I could be confused, but I think the issue here is how there is a global reduction in damage that seems to have hit everything harder than biting jabs which equates to a buff to Templar DPS.

They adjusted the resistance values on the PTS for NPCs even outside of Cyrodiil, so your video is no longer valid.

His point, right or wrong, I believe is that only templars are going to be able to achieve pre-2.1 levels of DPS.

That's the gist I got anyway.

@Jolinius

i was on pts today, and my jabs do hit with LESS dmg than currently on live. (PvP wise)
I will go and check PvE now on pts , gimmi a few mins

IF jabs did hit A LOT harder, then pls tell me the secret how to