Change CP increase to max 2,5% instead of the 25% right now and ALL your problems are fixed

Attorneyatlawl · July 2015

Seaber wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Seaber wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

10,000 tooltip. 15,000 crit base.

25% final damage pre mitigation, 25% critical-portion-only damage boost.

With physdmg star maxed, 12500 goes into enemy non crit with 40% armor mitigation, your pen = 20% results in 32% reduction in dmg dealt = 8500 damage done. Without dmg dealt = 6800.

With both physdmg star maxed and physcritdmg star maxed, 12500 non crit goes in. Around half the time, give or take depending on your crit chance, instead of critting for a base 18750 pre-pen, you gain 25% on the critical portion of the hit only, which is 12550 * 0.5 = 6250. You now crit for a base 18750 + (0.25 * 6250) = 20312 base. After mitigation, instead of critically hitting for 12750, you hit for 13812 damage.

(Not so impressive as your misunderstanding made it look... )

Just saw this "gem".

There's no point in including mitigation if you are keeping it constant because it is constant but I'll go with it.

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

After mitigation, instead of critically hitting for 12750, you hit for 13812 damage.

You pulled the 12750 out of your arse. You should have put 10200.

and 13812.5/10200=1.354

(Not as insignificant as your ballshit made it look... )

Not sure what you're even responding to, because it has nothing to do with the post or my math. Pull up a calculator on your phone if you can't do it in your head before flaming with masked profanity. Nitpicking over typo's doesn't do much for your argument where I accidentally wrote 12550 instead of 12500 earlier in. Mitigation is included to show the end result rather than unobtainable pre mitigation numbers which are misleading.

EDIT: Thanks for illustrating, however, that you did none of the math and instead just jumped to post. Anyone who had followed along the post would have easily noticed the error you just made when trying to incorrectly "fix" the proper math I'd already posted as the mechanics are explained in mine . 18750 * 0.68 = 12750. That is the number after mitigation with the damage passive but not the crit boost one. The part you even tried to take issue with was 100% correct. "After mitigation, instead of critically hitting for 12750, you hit for 13812 damage." (when having the 25% physcrit damage star maxed).

You replied to a post talking about the increase from having 2 stars maxed.
You started talking about both stars and included them both in your calculations.

Why would you do that?

You did it because you are trying to hide how powerful the champion system is.

#misleading

If you read the post, you might have noticed I illustrated how each star affects the outcome. But, I don't think you're actually interested in the topic so much as the people. Thanks for your input.

Moonshadow66 · July 2015

I couldn't play for 3 weeks and now I want to use up the ton of accumulated enlightenment before it gets nerfed, if you please.

Seaber · July 2015

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Seaber wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Seaber wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

10,000 tooltip. 15,000 crit base.

25% final damage pre mitigation, 25% critical-portion-only damage boost.

With physdmg star maxed, 12500 goes into enemy non crit with 40% armor mitigation, your pen = 20% results in 32% reduction in dmg dealt = 8500 damage done. Without dmg dealt = 6800.

With both physdmg star maxed and physcritdmg star maxed, 12500 non crit goes in. Around half the time, give or take depending on your crit chance, instead of critting for a base 18750 pre-pen, you gain 25% on the critical portion of the hit only, which is 12550 * 0.5 = 6250. You now crit for a base 18750 + (0.25 * 6250) = 20312 base. After mitigation, instead of critically hitting for 12750, you hit for 13812 damage.

(Not so impressive as your misunderstanding made it look... )

Just saw this "gem".

There's no point in including mitigation if you are keeping it constant because it is constant but I'll go with it.

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

After mitigation, instead of critically hitting for 12750, you hit for 13812 damage.

You pulled the 12750 out of your arse. You should have put 10200.

and 13812.5/10200=1.354

(Not as insignificant as your ballshit made it look... )

Not sure what you're even responding to, because it has nothing to do with the post or my math. Pull up a calculator on your phone if you can't do it in your head before flaming with masked profanity. Nitpicking over typo's doesn't do much for your argument where I accidentally wrote 12550 instead of 12500 earlier in. Mitigation is included to show the end result rather than unobtainable pre mitigation numbers which are misleading.

EDIT: Thanks for illustrating, however, that you did none of the math and instead just jumped to post. Anyone who had followed along the post would have easily noticed the error you just made when trying to incorrectly "fix" the proper math I'd already posted as the mechanics are explained in mine . 18750 * 0.68 = 12750. That is the number after mitigation with the damage passive but not the crit boost one. The part you even tried to take issue with was 100% correct. "After mitigation, instead of critically hitting for 12750, you hit for 13812 damage." (when having the 25% physcrit damage star maxed).

You replied to a post talking about the increase from having 2 stars maxed.
You started talking about both stars and included them both in your calculations.

Why would you do that?

You did it because you are trying to hide how powerful the champion system is.

#misleading

If you read the post, you might have noticed I illustrated how each star affects the outcome. But, I don't think you're actually interested in the topic so much as the people. Thanks for your input.

Now you're trying to act all high and mighty because I called you out on your misleading ***. Good job

Tolmos · July 2015

I still prefer the idea of not nerfing CP, or even CP gains, but scaling it to be more back heavy. Have the bulk of the return happen early on, like in the first 1000-1500 CP (perhaps up to 15% gain), and have the remaining 10% come from the back end (1501-3600).

This effectively buffs EVERYONE right this moment, including the players with the most CP, but makes the overall reward taper off so that most players will hit the bulk of the reward in a timely manner, and hardcore progression gamers can continue to progress past what the average player would achieve; just their return wouldn't be game breaking.

I know that's how it was supposed to be now, but my understanding is that it's not. I think that would solve a lot of future problems down the road involving new players by using a buff, so that current player's hard work won't be ruined. AND progression can continue for those who are into that kind of thing.

Sandmanninja · July 2015

Robotmafia wrote: »

better solution would be to reduce the amount of CP you can obtain... downscale the points by a factor of 10.. so instead of 3600 make it 360.. instead of 100 point make it 10... 3600 just takes way to long... then limit the amount u can spend to lets say 120 and that way ud have elements of diversity/customization...

I disagree. Keep the LONG TERM goal of a LOT of CPs, just throttle how many you can farm in a single day.

That HAS to be the simplest and most logical solution. Even programming-wise it's easy:
If DailyCPGain => 10 THEN
DONT GAIN MORE

(it would be the reverse - just stick CP increase inside the conditional test, but yeah, it should be easy to implement)

EVERYONE is complaining about people farming mobs, grinding CP and pulling ahead.
Don't nerf CPs
Don't reduce how many you can EARN (honestly, it is hard/repetitive work killing mobs for an hour or two)
Just. Introduce. A. Daily. Cap.
Period.

95% of the people will stop [snip]
The ONLY people that will complain then are people that ABUSE the CP system by farming mobs for 10+ hours a day.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

Cookiethief · July 2015

I always thought of they just did a different CP tree for PvP, capped it at 500, and provided all the points. Then everyone would be on equal footing

eliisra · July 2015

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Let's face it, the difference between 400 champion points and 700 is pretty big... the difference between 700 and 1000 is much smaller. The differences between 1000 and 1300, 1300 and 1600, etc. become progressively and rapidly tinier in raw power gained as you have the majority of the best passives at high investments (50 points gives much more than half the power for a passive, generally landing around 3/4ths of it) and the rest maxed at 100 already.

You know, I can sorta agree about this when it comes to PvE. Only 8-10 signs are "best passives" for a pure PvE dps build, rest are minor perks.

By the time you have around 700 points, that best stuff is max or close to.

The problem is(like always) in PvP. You use way more capable and well round characters in Cyrodiil. You need self-sustain, healing, shielding, blocking, dodging and cc break, dmg, crit resits, all types of recovery and cost reductions, all mitigations and resistances and so on. Investing in all these things boots your players strength a lot. So even going past that 700+ CP a PvP'er will still be progressing and growing a lot in strength.

I mean I would need around 2000 CP myself to max out my main PvP characters "best passives".

Tolmos · July 2015

Sandmanninja wrote: »

EVERYONE is complaining about people farming mobs, grinding CP and pulling ahead.
Don't nerf CPs
Don't reduce how many you can EARN (honestly, it is hard/repetitive work killing mobs for an hour or two)
Just. Introduce. A. Daily. Cap.
Period.

95% of the people will stop b!tching.
The ONLY people that will complain then are people that ABUSE the CP system by farming mobs for 10+ hours a day.

The only problem here is that doing this solves another problem perfectly: the problem of new players ever catching up to the previous ones. The ONLY way to fairly do this is to calculate how many CP a player today should have max, based on that system, and throttle back everyone's CP to that point who is past it. If you nerf my CP gains to some amount a day, but leave people's CP in place that got far beyond that each day, you are just nerfing me to buff them. There's no point in that, at all.

Attorneyatlawl · July 2015

eliisra wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Let's face it, the difference between 400 champion points and 700 is pretty big... the difference between 700 and 1000 is much smaller. The differences between 1000 and 1300, 1300 and 1600, etc. become progressively and rapidly tinier in raw power gained as you have the majority of the best passives at high investments (50 points gives much more than half the power for a passive, generally landing around 3/4ths of it) and the rest maxed at 100 already.

You know, I can sorta agree about this when it comes to PvE. Only 8-10 signs are "best passives" for a pure PvE dps build, rest are minor perks.

By the time you have around 700 points, that best stuff is max or close to.

The problem is(like always) in PvP. You use way more capable and well round characters in Cyrodiil. You need self-sustain, healing, shielding, blocking, dodging and cc break, dmg, crit resits, all types of recovery and cost reductions, all mitigations and resistances and so on. Investing in all these things boots your players strength a lot. So even going past that 700+ CP a PvP'er will still be progressing and growing a lot in strength.

I mean I would need around 2000 CP myself to max out my main PvP characters "best passives".

Growing in strength, absolutely... but growing "a lot" is where I still disagree, given how the passives scale at 20 points versus 30, 50, and 100 points. You get the vast majority of the power you get, including PVP, from putting in just half of the points that you can at maximum per star, even

. Personally, like I've said before... as long as some balance is brought to XP sources in general so grinding isn't the best by a mile, I really don't see a problem with having a long-term progression for an MMORPG, since it's already very bottom-heavy.