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Major Brutality: Should it be given to Twin Slashes instead of Hidden Blade?
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Xantaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭No- Stay's with Hidden BladeNo. Stick with Flying Blade. It makes this unused skill more interesting.Xantaria - Lead of Chimaira
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Jeckll✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭No- Stay's with Hidden BladeI dont think Twin Slashes needs a buff. Rending Slashes is a awesome DPS ability for PvE already and in endgame PvE, I get Major Brutality from Panaceas anyways. I think Twin Slashes in in a good spot atm in general and doesnt need a change.
I'm also not sure if I like Major Brutality on Flying Blade. A big plus for Rally is the ability to precast it in stealth, giving your opener the benefit already while with the Flying Blade or Twin Slashes solution, I have to apply it in Combat.
But I could life with that, if it's assossiated with a ranged skill like Flying Blade. With Twin Slashes, you HAVE to go melee to keep it up, making it useless in situations you are forced to use ranged attacks.
On Flying Blade, you'll at least have some range aka flexibility to reapply it.
Just to make it clear, both options are just worse versions of Rally which is a precastable, very long buff, Hot and instant heal on demand. It's a nice goody but to use DW without 2h in builds other than ganking builds, you will still require Vigor to be effective.Edited by Jeckll on July 8, 2015 7:39AMJeckll has quit the game. Thanks for the great time.0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No- Stay's with Hidden BladeGreenSoup2HoT wrote: »In my opinion, i think this was the worst skill they could of put major brutality on.
As someone who run's DW/Bow. Why would i waste a slot for Hidden Blade when i have a whole other bar for long range
Not everyone runs DW/bow, and thus not everyone has a whole other bar for long range. And i consider twin slashes useless in PvP. Because not only does blocking halve the direct damage as with any other incoming damage, it also completely negates the DOT. And DOT makes up for the majority of twin slashes' damage.
If i hit you with flying blade that does 5000 damage directly, and you block it, i will do 2500 damage.
If i hit you with twin slashes that do 1000 damage directly and 6000 damage as a DOT, and you block it, i will do 500 damage, and that's it.0 -
lathbury✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes- Twin Slash'sMaster_Kas wrote: »@DDuke what is your Max dmg with flying blade from sneak buffed?
My highest snipe is 21 566 or 21 565 on a v14 . Just want to compare
tooltip says 5000 dmg for flying blade and 6500 for snipe. so direct damage it would seem snipes better until you factor in the cast time which would make a comparison to wrecking blow more accurate. and the fact that you are not going to get major brutality from a bow so unless you wanna chug pots all day you will either take dw or 2h on your second bar anyway.
as mentioned earlier flying blade has its niche to fill and with the change is gonna make a great opener in pvp for melee centric builds.Edited by lathbury on July 8, 2015 11:06AM0 -
bertenburnyb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭no Potato vote option?
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DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No- Stay's with Hidden BladeMaster_Kas wrote: »@DDuke what is your Max dmg with flying blade from sneak buffed?
My highest snipe is 21 566 or 21 565 on a v14 . Just want to compare
I've got 16-17k crits with it, but I suppose those have been on low health targets (dual wield abilities get extra 20% damage on targets below 25% health).
Normally, the dmg from stealth is around 14k~Edited by DDuke on July 8, 2015 11:11AM0 -
GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes- Twin Slash'sGreenSoup2HoT wrote: »In my opinion, i think this was the worst skill they could of put major brutality on.
As someone who run's DW/Bow. Why would i waste a slot for Hidden Blade when i have a whole other bar for long range
Not everyone runs DW/bow, and thus not everyone has a whole other bar for long range. And i consider twin slashes useless in PvP. Because not only does blocking halve the direct damage as with any other incoming damage, it also completely negates the DOT. And DOT makes up for the majority of twin slashes' damage.
If i hit you with flying blade that does 5000 damage directly, and you block it, i will do 2500 damage.
If i hit you with twin slashes that do 1000 damage directly and 6000 damage as a DOT, and you block it, i will do 500 damage, and that's it.
You can't block for 1.5 second's after i use Ambush. This is where any good NB would applie Twin Slashes. You could argue any Skill can be Blocked. However there is CC to utilize so that doesn't happen.
Say Flying Blade does get Major Brutality. How will people who run a Bow bar benefit off of this? I'm pretty sure a majority of the NB player base play's with a Bow compared to those without one. This change only effect's Dw/Dw user's who don't dedicate a bar for range.
Why buff a skill that only effect's a small player base. If Twin Slashes got Major Brutality. It would still fit any Melee centered build such as DW/DW but also DW/Bow.
If you use Twin Slashes for Major Brutality right after you open with Ambush, your only loosing out on the initial damage compared to opening with Hidden Blade then using Ambush. Not everything need's to be under the effect's of Major Brutality. This make's game play sour because since Damage is everyone's number one priority. You are forced to use Hidden Blade to proc Major Brutality. Which give's Bow user's less confidence to even be Bow user's.
People are also debating that having Major Brutality on a combat skill is bad. Isn't the point to get into combat? At least i don't have to prep for fight's with Rally, i can just jump in and know my rotation will get the job done.
Edited by GreenSoup2HoT on July 8, 2015 11:47AMPS4 NA DC0 -
lathbury✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes- Twin Slash's
Got to disagree here twin slashes is far from useful in PVP and if you use it after ambush you are essentially wasting the 20% empower buff. For the most effiecient use you would want to land your hardest hiting ability after ambush with major brutality already applied.GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »In my opinion, i think this was the worst skill they could of put major brutality on.
As someone who run's DW/Bow. Why would i waste a slot for Hidden Blade when i have a whole other bar for long range
Not everyone runs DW/bow, and thus not everyone has a whole other bar for long range. And i consider twin slashes useless in PvP. Because not only does blocking halve the direct damage as with any other incoming damage, it also completely negates the DOT. And DOT makes up for the majority of twin slashes' damage.
If i hit you with flying blade that does 5000 damage directly, and you block it, i will do 2500 damage.
If i hit you with twin slashes that do 1000 damage directly and 6000 damage as a DOT, and you block it, i will do 500 damage, and that's it.
You can't block for 1.5 second's after i use Ambush. This is where any good NB would applie Twin Slashes. You could argue any Skill can be Blocked. However there is CC to utilize so that doesn't happen.
Say Flying Blade does get Major Brutality. How will people who run a Bow bar benefit off of this? I'm pretty sure a majority of the NB player base play's with a Bow compared to those without one. This change only effect's Dw/Dw user's who don't dedicate a bar for range.
Why buff a skill that only effect's a small player base. If Twin Slashes got Major Brutality. It would still fit any Melee centered build such as DW/DW but also DW/Bow.
it will affect dw bow users to removing from them the need to chug weapon power pots and apply the buff from range unlike putting it on slashes would do.Edited by lathbury on July 8, 2015 11:48AM0 -
BlackEar✭✭✭✭✭Other- A different skill perhaps?Put it on the cloak ability instead.Bjorn Blackbear - Master Angler - Collector - Black Market Mogul - Ebonheart Pact - Exterminatus - EU.
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GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes- Twin Slash's
Got to disagree here twin slashes is far from useful in PVP and if you use it after ambush you are essentially wasting the 20% empower buff. For the most effiecient use you would want to land your hardest hiting ability after ambush with major brutality already applied.GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »In my opinion, i think this was the worst skill they could of put major brutality on.
As someone who run's DW/Bow. Why would i waste a slot for Hidden Blade when i have a whole other bar for long range
Not everyone runs DW/bow, and thus not everyone has a whole other bar for long range. And i consider twin slashes useless in PvP. Because not only does blocking halve the direct damage as with any other incoming damage, it also completely negates the DOT. And DOT makes up for the majority of twin slashes' damage.
If i hit you with flying blade that does 5000 damage directly, and you block it, i will do 2500 damage.
If i hit you with twin slashes that do 1000 damage directly and 6000 damage as a DOT, and you block it, i will do 500 damage, and that's it.
You can't block for 1.5 second's after i use Ambush. This is where any good NB would applie Twin Slashes. You could argue any Skill can be Blocked. However there is CC to utilize so that doesn't happen.
Say Flying Blade does get Major Brutality. How will people who run a Bow bar benefit off of this? I'm pretty sure a majority of the NB player base play's with a Bow compared to those without one. This change only effect's Dw/Dw user's who don't dedicate a bar for range.
Why buff a skill that only effect's a small player base. If Twin Slashes got Major Brutality. It would still fit any Melee centered build such as DW/DW but also DW/Bow.
it will affect dw bow users to removing from them the need to chug weapon power pots and apply the buff from range unlike putting it on slashes would do.
This is where Greed come's in. You want the optimal choice for damage. Giving 20% Extra damage for a DoT isn't a bad thing. If i'm a bow user, i'm not going to go out of my way to use Hidden Blade with "MB" then Snipe for the extra damage. So what your missing out on is a bit of extra damage from your first strike. Big deal.
Your being a stickler for damage.
Edited by GreenSoup2HoT on July 8, 2015 11:54AMPS4 NA DC0 -
lathbury✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes- Twin Slash'sGreenSoup2HoT wrote: »
Got to disagree here twin slashes is far from useful in PVP and if you use it after ambush you are essentially wasting the 20% empower buff. For the most effiecient use you would want to land your hardest hiting ability after ambush with major brutality already applied.GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »In my opinion, i think this was the worst skill they could of put major brutality on.
As someone who run's DW/Bow. Why would i waste a slot for Hidden Blade when i have a whole other bar for long range
Not everyone runs DW/bow, and thus not everyone has a whole other bar for long range. And i consider twin slashes useless in PvP. Because not only does blocking halve the direct damage as with any other incoming damage, it also completely negates the DOT. And DOT makes up for the majority of twin slashes' damage.
If i hit you with flying blade that does 5000 damage directly, and you block it, i will do 2500 damage.
If i hit you with twin slashes that do 1000 damage directly and 6000 damage as a DOT, and you block it, i will do 500 damage, and that's it.
You can't block for 1.5 second's after i use Ambush. This is where any good NB would applie Twin Slashes. You could argue any Skill can be Blocked. However there is CC to utilize so that doesn't happen.
Say Flying Blade does get Major Brutality. How will people who run a Bow bar benefit off of this? I'm pretty sure a majority of the NB player base play's with a Bow compared to those without one. This change only effect's Dw/Dw user's who don't dedicate a bar for range.
Why buff a skill that only effect's a small player base. If Twin Slashes got Major Brutality. It would still fit any Melee centered build such as DW/DW but also DW/Bow.
it will affect dw bow users to removing from them the need to chug weapon power pots and apply the buff from range unlike putting it on slashes would do.
This is where Greed come's in. You want the optimal choice for damage. Giving 20% Extra damage for a DoT isn't a bad thing. If i'm a bow user, i'm not going to go out of my way to use Hidden Blade with "MB" then Snipe for the extra damage. So what your missing out on is a bit of extra damage from your first strike. Big deal.
the empower buff will only apply to the initial weak hit of slashes so it is a waste. you snipe from stealth then use flying blade to give you the buff this snares and gives you the buff now you have the choice close on them with ambush or keep using bow skills now with the buff and them snared0 -
GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes- Twin Slash'sPut it on the cloak ability instead.
Once you do that, people will be crying for a cloak nerf though. You don't want that.
It would defiantly work. Since you can proc Cloak whenever you want.
I've heard you don't decloak after you Ambush (in pvp at least), so you could cloak>ambush>surprise att combo and get the 20% extra damage from "MB" on your initial Ambush.
PS4 NA DC0 -
Xantaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭No- Stay's with Hidden BladeThis Change is made to BUFF Flying Blade!!!
And not to otimize your source of Major Brutality.
And thus they should definitely stick with flying Blade.Xantaria - Lead of Chimaira
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lathbury✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes- Twin Slash'sGreenSoup2HoT wrote: »Put it on the cloak ability instead.
Once you do that, people will be crying for a cloak nerf though. You don't want that.
It would defiantly work. Since you can proc Cloak whenever you want.
I've heard you don't decloak after you Ambush (in pvp at least), so you could cloak>ambush>surprise att combo and get the 20% extra damage from "MB" on your initial Ambush.
think he means blade cloak from dw. you do lose nb cloak when ambushing and the rotation you listed is the same as mine but with cloak instead of flying blade an aoe damage shield as opposed to a heavy hitting ranged snare.Edited by lathbury on July 8, 2015 12:02PM0 -
Ffastyl✭✭✭✭✭No- Stay's with Hidden BladeMomentum is the fifth and final active ability for Two Handed, so Major Brutality should be assigned to the fifth and final active ability of Dual Wield: Hidden Blade.
Doing so also makes the AoE morph more attractive, because it requires no target to cast.Edited by Ffastyl on July 8, 2015 12:07PM"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it."
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lathbury✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes- Twin Slash'sMomentum is the fifth and final active ability for Two Handed, so Major Brutality should be assigned to the fifth and final active ability of Dual Wield: Hidden Blade.
Doing so also makes the AoE morph more attractive, because it requires no target to cast.
never considered that but it will give other classes a damaging aoe skill that grants the buff like us nb's have with power extraction. +1 for balanceEdited by lathbury on July 8, 2015 12:10PM0 -
GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes- Twin Slash'sThis Change is made to BUFF Flying Blade!!!
And not to otimize your source of Major Brutality.
And thus they should definitely stick with flying Blade.
I'm trying to Support all the Nb user's who utilize a Bow. Just because i'm one of them doesn't mean i've started this topic to optimize my setup alone.
Currently there is no insensitive to drop your 2h rally with this change. If Twin Slashes got "MB", i believe people might use DW over 2H.Edited by GreenSoup2HoT on July 8, 2015 12:23PMPS4 NA DC0 -
Lynx7386✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Doing so also makes the AoE morph more attractive, because it requires no target to cast.
That doesnt necessarily mean it will give you the buff out of combat, though. Power extraction, for nightblades, is an aoe that gives major brutality, but it doesnt give the buff unless you damage a target with it.PS4 / NA
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GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes- Twin Slash'sDoing so also makes the AoE morph more attractive, because it requires no target to cast.
If Major Brutality was on Flying Blade, you would be opening with it. So it doesn't even matter. Rally is different because your usually popping it early for the HoT.
Even if "mb" was on Twin Slashes, it would be the second move in your rotation. Not that big of deal.
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Komma✭✭✭✭✭Other- A different skill perhaps?Quick cloak would be better. Its a buff so put it on a buff skill.Kohma Kozzy-cr160-Stamblade
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GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes- Twin Slash'sQuick cloak would be better. Its a buff so put it on a buff skill.
Would you really want to use a bar slot for blade cloak though? I don't even want to use Hidden Blade, unless i was DW/DW i probably would. I'd rather Twin Slashes because multiple play style's can utilize it.
Edited by GreenSoup2HoT on July 8, 2015 8:38PMPS4 NA DC0
