First impressions - XP boosters missing the mark

MCMancub · June 2015

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Dru1076 wrote: »

Upon hearing of these xp boosters I mentioned in several threads I thought it was a great idea. Now I know more, I have changed my mind. As a casual player, it had taken me since December to get my main character to v9. I realise it will be quicker when I skip past a lot of stuff levelling an alt, but given the hours I can play it will still take me months to level up the other classes I would like to try. You beauty, I thought, I will be able to do it in a matter of weeks now. Er...ah... Wrong.

I thought these would help me, the casual player with little opportunity to play, to get up there and keep within shooting distance of those who have more time to spend playing. Turns out it is just another way for those who can play more to steal ahead. Those with multiple high level characters will have the recipe long before I will (some clever people anyway have it), and for some reason anything that involves luck leaves me a wider berth. I have found one legendary bit of loot in my whole time playing, and that was a kuta that I can't use.

So, as far as I can tell these boosters are not going to be a benefit to me, but only make it harder for me to keep up. This is the impression I have right now... And I am really hoping to have this turned around.

As a casual, it is a mathematical certainty that boosters will boost those least in need of it, and widen the CP gap at an accelerated rate.

It is not just your impression, it is a cold, hard fact.

This was of course pointed out when the existence of this game-poisoning rubbish was first data-mined and posted on the forums, but Zenimax can only see the money to be made as they... later on... introduce Crown Store boost potions to suck the cash from the further disadvantaged casuals.

They just need the fact of the massive competitive disadvantage introduced for the benefit of no-lifers to sink in to the minds of casuals to create the desired demand for the pay-to-keep-up version.

Basic marketing campaign tactics 101 - if no real demand for something exists, create the demand and then supply the solution.

I guess they are just hoping we are all blinkered and spoon fed sufficiently not to notice we are being taken for a costly ride...

This is complete and utter bullcrap. The "softcap" for CP, the point at which investing another point becomes significantly worse, is 1080 and for individual skills the cap is much, much lower (about 30 points in). Diminishing returns mean the more CP you get, the more useless they become.

Mathematically, XP potions benefit those with few CP exponentially more than they do those with lots of CP.

All XP potions do is reduce the time it takes for hardcore gamers to hit this diminishing return wall while increasing the rate at which players with less CP improve.

TL;DR: XP potions actually do help players "catch up" in CP. Maybe not in the amount of CP, but certainly in the strength they get from CP.

EDIT: If you've never studied calculus, understand this concept might be a little challenging.

reften · June 2015

rajaniemiorama_ESO wrote: »

If the boosters only counted toward xp gains and excluded CP gains it would be a much better balance and tool.

Exactly. Casual gamer (me) can get one guy to VR14, power gamers want at least 4. But as a casual gamer, I can compete with 1 VR14 player.

Now, power gamers will focus on 1 character, and boost the he!! out of their CPs. This is going to spread out the playing field.

Saturn · June 2015

Dru1076 wrote: »

Upon hearing of these xp boosters I mentioned in several threads I thought it was a great idea. Now I know more, I have changed my mind. As a casual player, it had taken me since December to get my main character to v9. I realise it will be quicker when I skip past a lot of stuff levelling an alt, but given the hours I can play it will still take me months to level up the other classes I would like to try. You beauty, I thought, I will be able to do it in a matter of weeks now. Er...ah... Wrong.

I thought these would help me, the casual player with little opportunity to play, to get up there and keep within shooting distance of those who have more time to spend playing. Turns out it is just another way for those who can play more to steal ahead. Those with multiple high level characters will have the recipe long before I will (some clever people anyway have it), and for some reason anything that involves luck leaves me a wider berth. I have found one legendary bit of loot in my whole time playing, and that was a kuta that I can't use.

So, as far as I can tell these boosters are not going to be a benefit to me, but only make it harder for me to keep up. This is the impression I have right now... And I am really hoping to have this turned around.

This is the exact problem with the exp boosters, they not only exclude new/casual players that don't want to grind for A: the recipe and its materials or B: the gold to buy the booster once people are selling them in stores. Further the boosters affect Champion points, which is a BIG issue. There are already players that have grinded to 1000 cps, this will only make those players reach 3600 a lot faster. Most people that have played consistently since 1.6 all have between 180-250 champion points, but the people that exploited it early on or have grinded a lot are now way far ahead. I know a few people with 500ish and have heard/seen screenshots of people above 800.. Once those players hit 3600 way before everyone else then they don't need to be good players, they will be so much more powerful than everyone else just because of the passive health/magicka/stamina increase the points give them.

Just an example. I made a new character recently and skipped the story to test how much my stats would go up from putting my 225 champion points into each tree. After putting 75 points into the thief, the warrior and the mage celestials, my base stats increased by roughly 13%, health was a tiny bit more with 14%. That is with 75 points, now imagine 1200 in each celestial...

nimander99 · June 2015

Makkir wrote: »

Sell all your recipe fragments and perfect roe while you're able to fetch a premium. Worry about completing when prices drop drastically in a few weeks.

You sir, are correct

AlnilamE · June 2015

MCMancub wrote: »

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Dru1076 wrote: »

Upon hearing of these xp boosters I mentioned in several threads I thought it was a great idea. Now I know more, I have changed my mind. As a casual player, it had taken me since December to get my main character to v9. I realise it will be quicker when I skip past a lot of stuff levelling an alt, but given the hours I can play it will still take me months to level up the other classes I would like to try. You beauty, I thought, I will be able to do it in a matter of weeks now. Er...ah... Wrong.

I thought these would help me, the casual player with little opportunity to play, to get up there and keep within shooting distance of those who have more time to spend playing. Turns out it is just another way for those who can play more to steal ahead. Those with multiple high level characters will have the recipe long before I will (some clever people anyway have it), and for some reason anything that involves luck leaves me a wider berth. I have found one legendary bit of loot in my whole time playing, and that was a kuta that I can't use.

So, as far as I can tell these boosters are not going to be a benefit to me, but only make it harder for me to keep up. This is the impression I have right now... And I am really hoping to have this turned around.

As a casual, it is a mathematical certainty that boosters will boost those least in need of it, and widen the CP gap at an accelerated rate.

It is not just your impression, it is a cold, hard fact.

This was of course pointed out when the existence of this game-poisoning rubbish was first data-mined and posted on the forums, but Zenimax can only see the money to be made as they... later on... introduce Crown Store boost potions to suck the cash from the further disadvantaged casuals.

They just need the fact of the massive competitive disadvantage introduced for the benefit of no-lifers to sink in to the minds of casuals to create the desired demand for the pay-to-keep-up version.

Basic marketing campaign tactics 101 - if no real demand for something exists, create the demand and then supply the solution.

I guess they are just hoping we are all blinkered and spoon fed sufficiently not to notice we are being taken for a costly ride...

This is complete and utter bullcrap. The "softcap" for CP, the point at which investing another point becomes significantly worse, is 1080 and for individual skills the cap is much, much lower (about 30 points in). Diminishing returns mean the more CP you get, the more useless they become.

Mathematically, XP potions benefit those with few CP exponentially more than they do those with lots of CP.

All XP potions do is reduce the time it takes for hardcore gamers to hit this diminishing return wall while increasing the rate at which players with less CP improve.

TL;DR: XP potions actually do help players "catch up" in CP. Maybe not in the amount of CP, but certainly in the strength they get from CP.

EDIT: If you've never studied calculus, understand this concept might be a little challenging.

Pretty much this.

Also, this system works in such a way that you have to decide how you want to benefit from the potions: Do you want the money/skill or do you want the XP.

Because if you want the XP, then spending time trying to get the recipe pieces and mats yourself is going to be detrimental to XP gain. It's going to be more effective for you to just keep grinding or earning XP in whichever way, than it will be to run around fishing and doing writs to get the mats and make the potions and THEN go earn XP.

If I really wanted as many CP as possible as fast as I can, running around trying to do Provisioning writs on 7 characters wasn't the best way to spend my short gaming time before work. Neither was going fishing on Tuesday.

But I do things that I find fun, and I earn CP and levels along the way, so it doesn't matter to me.

From what I've seen so far, the recipes and mats are not too rare that the prices will not adjust in 1-2 weeks (though I haven't gotten one yet). So if you really want to use them, wait a bit and they should become more reasonably priced and more readily available, and you may have found some pieces of your own as well.

vovus69 · June 2015

Re pricing. pieces of recipe is ~200k-300k now. If you want to sell it for sure - go to first area or Craglorn and for 200k you will sell it in 10 mins. Roe is 20k-25k. You might get it cheaper, but you should be lucky or seller should be stupid. Whole recipe - saw only one sell - 1M. Not sure that it is representative. Ready potions - 20k easy in any guild store.

Hope it helps.

Junipus · June 2015

Saturn wrote: »

Dru1076 wrote: »

Upon hearing of these xp boosters I mentioned in several threads I thought it was a great idea. Now I know more, I have changed my mind. As a casual player, it had taken me since December to get my main character to v9. I realise it will be quicker when I skip past a lot of stuff levelling an alt, but given the hours I can play it will still take me months to level up the other classes I would like to try. You beauty, I thought, I will be able to do it in a matter of weeks now. Er...ah... Wrong.

I thought these would help me, the casual player with little opportunity to play, to get up there and keep within shooting distance of those who have more time to spend playing. Turns out it is just another way for those who can play more to steal ahead. Those with multiple high level characters will have the recipe long before I will (some clever people anyway have it), and for some reason anything that involves luck leaves me a wider berth. I have found one legendary bit of loot in my whole time playing, and that was a kuta that I can't use.

So, as far as I can tell these boosters are not going to be a benefit to me, but only make it harder for me to keep up. This is the impression I have right now... And I am really hoping to have this turned around.

This is the exact problem with the exp boosters, they not only exclude new/casual players that don't want to grind for A: the recipe and its materials or B: the gold to buy the booster once people are selling them in stores. Further the boosters affect Champion points, which is a BIG issue. There are already players that have grinded to 1000 cps, this will only make those players reach 3600 a lot faster. Most people that have played consistently since 1.6 all have between 180-250 champion points, but the people that exploited it early on or have grinded a lot are now way far ahead. I know a few people with 500ish and have heard/seen screenshots of people above 800.. Once those players hit 3600 way before everyone else then they don't need to be good players, they will be so much more powerful than everyone else just because of the passive health/magicka/stamina increase the points give them.

Just an example. I made a new character recently and skipped the story to test how much my stats would go up from putting my 225 champion points into each tree. After putting 75 points into the thief, the warrior and the mage celestials, my base stats increased by roughly 13%, health was a tiny bit more with 14%. That is with 75 points, now imagine 1200 in each celestial...

See my previous post on the first page.

All these arguments and similar ones are based on the premise that someone who puts 5 hours a week into the game should have the same progress and rewards as someone who puts 50 hours a week in, just because. I'm sure if you worked 40 hours in RL and were paid the same as someone doing the same job for 10 hours you wouldn't be very happy about it.

XP booster implementation hasn't helped anything, but the underlying principles of these arguments are flawed in reality.

Dru1076 · June 2015

I wonder, @dap_robertb16_ESO , why such players would be forced to face off in campaigns. In many games, this is not the case.

Junipus · June 2015

Dru1076 wrote: »

I wonder, @dap_robertb16_ESO , why such players would be forced to face off in campaigns. In many games, this is not the case.

The way ZOS have implemented things make it different to other MMOs, but it doesn't change the underlying points mentioned by myself and others in this thread.I've mentioned before here about some thoughts on the PvP side of things.

Egonieser · June 2015

Dru1076 wrote: »

theweakminded wrote: »

Everyone does have access to these, give it a week and they will be cheap. They are expensive now because it is new and rare. Just take motifs as an example. Dwemer pages sold for 30k at the start of their release, now 3-5k

Not everyone has access to them. Only those who have gold to spare. New players are out. So are a lot of casuals who spnd gold on things like bank upgrades and bags and horses. Personally, I cant afford these potions right now.

But I agree...they will be cheaper soon. By the time I really need them, I should be able to make them I suppose. I confess, I think the fact that I didn't get a fragment, or any of the new ingredient after over an hour fishing, has me feeling like I simply will NEVER have these items. The fact that I cannot for the life of me, despite always checking for them, find a gold motif after seven months of playing the game does not help there.

Don't worry, you are not alone. I too have very little time to play and haven't had any great loot despite playing since beta. Only had 2 dwemer pages across 3 alts and that's with checking every single container. Never had any other motifs or any worthwile drops except for some purple decon trash for the epic upgrade item. Despite all that i make whatever time i have to play quite productive. I waste no time doing menial things but balance it evenly between champ point grind, keeping up with crafting and researches etc and i have managed just fine. I have thousands of craft materials, 2 max crafters and always decent gear on me at any level. For a casual playstyle it fits just fine and i even manage to pvp quite well. 1 vs 1 i win 80% of the times so it ain't too bad.

Try not to achieve the unachievable, instead focus on what you CAN realistically do in the short timeframe you have and things will be much better. Once you get in the routine, it will become fast and efficient even if you don't have a lot of time.

eventide03b14a_ESO · June 2015

This happens frequently. Instead of people seeing the big picture we get all excited by some shiny new thing the devs are putting out and it's not until we see it in practice that we realize how terrible it is and then ask them to change or remove it. This happened with the justice system and now with the XP pots. Can we please stop praising them before we see how these things are actually going to be implemented?

Right now the only people who can afford 20k xp pots that only last 30 minutes are people who play a lot. This does absolutely nothing for "casual" or even normal players. Basically it's only going to increase the gap between "hardcore" players and the rest of us unless we shell out real money for the crown store versions. Now isn't it starting to look a lot more like pay to win?

AlnilamE · June 2015

What's wrong with the Justice System?

EQBallzz · June 2015

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

This happens frequently. Instead of people seeing the big picture we get all excited by some shiny new thing the devs are putting out and it's not until we see it in practice that we realize how terrible it is and then ask them to change or remove it. This happened with the justice system and now with the XP pots. Can we please stop praising them before we see how these things are actually going to be implemented?

Right now the only people who can afford 20k xp pots that only last 30 minutes are people who play a lot. This does absolutely nothing for "casual" or even normal players. Basically it's only going to increase the gap between "hardcore" players and the rest of us unless we shell out real money for the crown store versions. Now isn't it starting to look a lot more like pay to win?

Pretty much what we expected. They first release an "in-game" version of something that is nearly impossible to acquire through normal gameplay and then release a P2W shop variant for "convenience". It won't help anyone "catch up" but it will make them a lot of money and ensure those with the most money make the most progress. Looks like P2W has finally arrived. All the F2P fans rejoice! You finally got what you wanted I guess?

yodased · June 2015

The entire underlying concept that people with more champion points are going to beat you in pvp simply because they have more champion points is flawed though.

These hardcore gamers as you like to call them are always going to beat the casuals in pvp because they play more. They min-max and theory craft. They always have 7/7 gold gear with gold glyphs and will spend a million AP on a hunch that they can be 1/10 better in their TTK.

Having XP pots that gets them to the stopping point of the Champion system faster isn't going to change that they are simply going to be significantly more skilled and experienced in PvP than someone who doesn't put the same amount of time and effort into it.

As to why you have to "face off" against them in pvp as someone with less time than they do to play the game, that's just the way it has to be. It's not like you can't join a pug group and take keeps, you can get on siege, you can repair walls and doors, you can take resources and still add to the campaign. You are not going to be able to emulate those who can 1vX and honestly, nor should you.

Where does it stop? A different campaign for each individual playstyle would mean 100 campaigns, even which, the hardcore gamers would find a way into them and still win because thats what they do. They win at video games.

EQBallzz · June 2015

yodased wrote: »

The entire underlying concept that people with more champion points are going to beat you in pvp simply because they have more champion points is flawed though.

These hardcore gamers as you like to call them are always going to beat the casuals in pvp because they play more. They min-max and theory craft. They always have 7/7 gold gear with gold glyphs and will spend a million AP on a hunch that they can be 1/10 better in their TTK.

Having XP pots that gets them to the stopping point of the Champion system faster isn't going to change that they are simply going to be significantly more skilled and experienced in PvP than someone who doesn't put the same amount of time and effort into it.

As to why you have to "face off" against them in pvp as someone with less time than they do to play the game, that's just the way it has to be. It's not like you can't join a pug group and take keeps, you can get on siege, you can repair walls and doors, you can take resources and still add to the campaign. You are not going to be able to emulate those who can 1vX and honestly, nor should you.

Where does it stop? A different campaign for each individual playstyle would mean 100 campaigns, even which, the hardcore gamers would find a way into them and still win because thats what they do. They win at video games.

That's a fair point and I agree with you but I don't think the issue is an expectation of equality. Even with no XP pots there will always be a gap between players that have more time and/or skill. It's inevitable. The problem comes when the game system adds another method of gaining progress on top of that with a monetary value such that people feel pressure to spend money to even be in the same ballpark and if they don't..those with more time and/or skill get an even bigger advantage. That's not a recipe for much fun for most people. The game systems should be trying to limit the power gap not exacerbate it.

MrGhosty · June 2015

Dru1076 wrote: »

I wonder, @dap_robertb16_ESO , why such players would be forced to face off in campaigns. In many games, this is not the case.

Which games perchance? The idea of competitive PvP for a long long while has been about this very thing. I was a console gamer in the early years and Halo 2 had matchmaking that grouped players based on their skill rank but beyond that most games ala call of duty and battlefield just put everyone together where the guys who have put the time in will destroy you.

I will confess to not knowing what MMO PvP has been doing but from what I've heard there wasn't much rhyme or reason who got matched up. I'm by my nature a casual player, I tend to spend smaller chunks of time on many titles at once so I don't expect to go into Cyrodiil and be a god among men. I have to pick my targets carefully and buddy up with some of my faction who have put the time in if I want to be competitive and I'm ok with that. It gives me a goal to work for, and when those times in PvP are inevitably frustrating I go do something else in game which gives me more value for the time I have to play.

It is also worth pointing out that these XP boosters help the vet14s who no longer have any meaningful content to do and earn their CP. If you are a lower level player you have far more options as far as content goes to get those. Most end game activities have terrible return rates so I'm personally quite pleased that they gave everyone an option with this.

Consider the trickle down effect, a Vet14 master crafter devotes a large chunk of their time gathering the recipe and ingredients. They craft these potions for themselves and some to sell to others. Potions go for a big price giving that veteran player something new "to do" in game. As this trend continues, the proliferation of ingredients and recipe fragments eventually leads to the price stabilizing and/or reducing to a level casual players can then afford at which point the game is normalized and everyone has easy access. From this point players who value a particular playstyle now have a way to make gold for themselves reliably that doesn't require them to grind content they don't want to. This stable source of goods allows players who don't want to grind for the mats to easily purchase what they need from guild stores for a fair price.

Only speculators and impatient people buy this stuff as the insane prices as soon as it drops. You can be patient and get it down the line or impatient and pay the tax that comes with that. Seems a fair deal all around.

Vet14s or players who have a ton of CP aren't the enemy here, they're just trying to get the most out of their game same as you. They don't deserve to be handicapped or left out of what meager new content there is simply because Joe Blow who only plays two hours a week wants to jump into the fight and compete with a player who has logged considerably more time.

I am a proponent of fairness, but fair does not always mean equal nor should it.

Junipus · June 2015

If it's any consolation for the OP, the potions are now selling in EU zone chat for around 25-30k and a lot of people predict stabilisation around 4-8k. Given that you can earn that quite easily, it wouldn't be surprising to have most people use them without the credit card warriors.

Dru1076 · June 2015

yodased wrote: »

The entire underlying concept that people with more champion points are going to beat you in pvp simply because they have more champion points is flawed though.

These hardcore gamers as you like to call them are always going to beat the casuals in pvp because they play more. They min-max and theory craft. They always have 7/7 gold gear with gold glyphs and will spend a million AP on a hunch that they can be 1/10 better in their TTK.

Having XP pots that gets them to the stopping point of the Champion system faster isn't going to change that they are simply going to be significantly more skilled and experienced in PvP than someone who doesn't put the same amount of time and effort into it.

As to why you have to "face off" against them in pvp as someone with less time than they do to play the game, that's just the way it has to be. It's not like you can't join a pug group and take keeps, you can get on siege, you can repair walls and doors, you can take resources and still add to the campaign. You are not going to be able to emulate those who can 1vX and honestly, nor should you.

Where does it stop? A different campaign for each individual playstyle would mean 100 campaigns, even which, the hardcore gamers would find a way into them and still win because thats what they do. They win at video games.

Um.... Don't know why anyone would object to a campaign where you can be safe from more powerful players. I have learned that after 1080 champ points is when the returns become really insignificant. It would take me at my current rate 3 full years to reach that level. Pretty sure I will be playing something else a fait while before that. How many players will? Surely if you are into competing, you would prefer to fight players who provide a challenge? So it should work out for everyone.

Worstluck · June 2015

I don't care for the idea of XP potions anyways. Any game that needs something like this is doing something wrong in my opinion. I have felt the need for something like a xp booster in this game at times...why not just fix this issue? Oh right, that requires work and makes less money I suppose. Maybe after console? Or wait, something new after E3...no wait, maybe after summer is over?

As far as feeling like the gap is widening, this is nothing new in MMO's. Just accept the fact that someone that spends 6-12 hours a day in game is going to be more powerful than you. Try to find things that entertain you, and not focus on how powerful the guy next to you is (or the guy who just two-shot you).

Dagoth_Rac · June 2015

MCMancub wrote: »

This is complete and utter bullcrap. The "softcap" for CP, the point at which investing another point becomes significantly worse, is 1080 and for individual skills the cap is much, much lower (about 30 points in). Diminishing returns mean the more CP you get, the more useless they become.

The diminishing returns are not very diminishing. Here is a graph of the most common star scaling:

There is a slight bump early in the distribution, but it is mostly a straight power gain. Someone with 100 CP has 25% increased elemental damage. Someone with 30 CP has about 10% increased elemental damage. So 100 CP is well more than double the damage increase of 30 CP. Yes, it is 2.5x the damage increase rather than the 3.33x damage of a purely linear system. But let's not act like a 25% increase is a minor difference compared to 10%. Yes, it is diminishing, but not by much. There is a lot of power in points 31-100, significantly more than points 1-30.

"Linear" does not equal "flat". So the scaling going linear after the 30th point in a star means you gain about the same power from each point going 31-100. It says nothing about the actual power gain per point. Being at 20% after 30 points and 25% after 100 would be diminishing returns. Being at 10% after 30 points and 25% after 100 points is also diminishing returns. One is a lot more diminishing, though!

I understand why they did it this way. Gaining true, measurable power with each point will keep people playing and chasing Champ Points. If the diminishing returns are too diminishing, people will get bored and stop playing because they will feel their character has stagnated. But this post seems based around, "Don't worry, you don't gain much after a certain point." That is just false.

Makkir · June 2015

AlnilamE wrote: »

What's wrong with the Justice System?

Ask OJ

Dru1076 · June 2015

After giving it a bit of thought and reading all the replies, I do feel a little more at ease. I get what these potions are for, and they are not what I was hoping for. They are something that I might be able to make one day if I am still playing. There really won't be a recipe fragment with my writ tomorrow. And probably not the next day either. And fishing when I could be levelling up is just a waste of time until I can use the Perfect Roe. But its okay, it really is. Because I don't need them anymore.

This system lets me down, because I wanted to use these potions to build alts to try the other races out in Cyrodil. With a clear understanding of the champion point system, I no longer have any desire to go to Cyrodil except to seek the skyshards there I haven't got yet. I don't like GTAV, Call of Duty, or any other game that puts me at the mercy of hardcore gamers, because in such games skill is not as important as the amount of time you can spend playing. I can't spend a great deal of time playing because I have a job and I work long hours. Oh... And I have a life outside of Tamriel. When I started playing this game, V14 was a magic level that meant it came down to your build, and how well you used it. This is an era of ESO I missed. As several people pointed out, casual gamers like me can never hope to compete with the hard core gamers who can play hour after hour. I don't want to.

But there's still a great deal of stuff for me to do. And the best news is, I realise as I write this, I don't need a great many champion points to do it. So I don't need booster potions. The PVE part of the game allows you to build up a character quite well as it is. As far as I can work out, by choosing to stay out of the alliance war I eliminate my need to craft xp boosters.

So...xp boosters: A luxury item I don't need. But for a while there, I thought they could be beautiful. That said, I'll stop going on about this now.

ArcVelarian · June 2015

And now they're for sale in the Crown store........

WebBull · June 2015

Dru1076 wrote: »

Upon hearing of these xp boosters I mentioned in several threads I thought it was a great idea. Now I know more, I have changed my mind. As a casual player, it had taken me since December to get my main character to v9. I realise it will be quicker when I skip past a lot of stuff levelling an alt, but given the hours I can play it will still take me months to level up the other classes I would like to try. You beauty, I thought, I will be able to do it in a matter of weeks now. Er...ah... Wrong.

I thought these would help me, the casual player with little opportunity to play, to get up there and keep within shooting distance of those who have more time to spend playing. Turns out it is just another way for those who can play more to steal ahead. Those with multiple high level characters will have the recipe long before I will (some clever people anyway have it), and for some reason anything that involves luck leaves me a wider berth. I have found one legendary bit of loot in my whole time playing, and that was a kuta that I can't use.

So, as far as I can tell these boosters are not going to be a benefit to me, but only make it harder for me to keep up. This is the impression I have right now... And I am really hoping to have this turned around.

The only problem I see here is your expectations. It's not the potions. Why do you expect to be on the same level as some one who plays 3 to 4 times more than you? Hardcore gamers are always going to have the edge over casual gamers. I am pretty sure that ZOS never claimed buy potions and you can immediately catch up to people that play far more often than you. Again, this is nothing more than your false expectation.

This is an MMO. MMO's have continual advancement. You can't expect ZOS to stop all advancement options for V14's until YOU catch up.

Makkir · June 2015

ArcVelarian wrote: »

And now they're for sale in the Crown store........

Are they? As of 10am EST I did NOT see them in the crown store.

Dru1076 · June 2015

WebBull wrote: »

Dru1076 wrote: »

Upon hearing of these xp boosters I mentioned in several threads I thought it was a great idea. Now I know more, I have changed my mind. As a casual player, it had taken me since December to get my main character to v9. I realise it will be quicker when I skip past a lot of stuff levelling an alt, but given the hours I can play it will still take me months to level up the other classes I would like to try. You beauty, I thought, I will be able to do it in a matter of weeks now. Er...ah... Wrong.

I thought these would help me, the casual player with little opportunity to play, to get up there and keep within shooting distance of those who have more time to spend playing. Turns out it is just another way for those who can play more to steal ahead. Those with multiple high level characters will have the recipe long before I will (some clever people anyway have it), and for some reason anything that involves luck leaves me a wider berth. I have found one legendary bit of loot in my whole time playing, and that was a kuta that I can't use.

So, as far as I can tell these boosters are not going to be a benefit to me, but only make it harder for me to keep up. This is the impression I have right now... And I am really hoping to have this turned around.

The only problem I see here is your expectations. It's not the potions. Why do you expect to be on the same level as some one who plays 3 to 4 times more than you? Hardcore gamers are always going to have the edge over casual gamers. I am pretty sure that ZOS never claimed buy potions and you can immediately catch up to people that play far more often than you. Again, this is nothing more than your false expectation.

This is an MMO. MMO's have continual advancement. You can't expect ZOS to stop all advancement options for V14's until YOU catch up.

You are not the first to point this out. But hey... When I started playing this game there were no champ points, and in about a months time I WOULD be on the same playing field if not for champion points. So if I feel I bit let down, I reckon I have a right, considering the fairness of the original system was my favourite thing about it. Yeah its an MMO. but I'd be playing this game if it wasn't, because I'm mainly here because it is Elder Scrolls.

Lykurgis · June 2015

EQBallzz wrote: »

This is what some of us have been trying to tell people all along about XP pots. People who are behind or starting late will never be able to use the pots as a way to "catch up" because everyone has access to them. Anyone that is ahead of you (for whatever reason) will also be using the pots so will stay ahead.

I think this is spot on. Couple guys i know with 600+ CP have the time/resources to stay buffed, and they will do what they can to keep the gap as wide as they can, because...who would want to give up such an advantage in PVP right?

EQBallzz wrote: »

This is only compounded by the fact that this version of XP pots are not easy to come by so those with more time will have more gold to buy the pots and more time to farm the mats to create the pots while those with less time/resources will spend all their time trying to acquire the pots and cancel out any time savings that the pots would have provided. Why would you spend hours fishing and skinning fish and doing writs (that earn you no XP) just for the rare chance at getting what you need for an XP pot when you could just keep questing or grinding and keep leveling without losing any time?

I came to the same conclusion the first day after I skinned 4 stacks of fish after a night fishing and got 0 Roe. I pretty much lost interest after seeing my very limited and valuable playtime ruined by dumpster aids RNG. Couple that with running 8 level 50 writs/day since that patch and have 0 frags, pretty much just going back to doing what I was doing before.

Blackmoon777 · June 2015

i took a break from ESO (played POE again - nice game btw, and i think it has gr8 future) today i want to get back to ESO, i patched the game and what i see... "EXPIRIENCE BOOSTERS NOW AWAIABLE", i didnt even loged in, i think i am done with this game

sad....

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · June 2015

Dru1076 wrote: »

WebBull wrote: »

Dru1076 wrote: »

Upon hearing of these xp boosters I mentioned in several threads I thought it was a great idea. Now I know more, I have changed my mind. As a casual player, it had taken me since December to get my main character to v9. I realise it will be quicker when I skip past a lot of stuff levelling an alt, but given the hours I can play it will still take me months to level up the other classes I would like to try. You beauty, I thought, I will be able to do it in a matter of weeks now. Er...ah... Wrong.

I thought these would help me, the casual player with little opportunity to play, to get up there and keep within shooting distance of those who have more time to spend playing. Turns out it is just another way for those who can play more to steal ahead. Those with multiple high level characters will have the recipe long before I will (some clever people anyway have it), and for some reason anything that involves luck leaves me a wider berth. I have found one legendary bit of loot in my whole time playing, and that was a kuta that I can't use.

So, as far as I can tell these boosters are not going to be a benefit to me, but only make it harder for me to keep up. This is the impression I have right now... And I am really hoping to have this turned around.

The only problem I see here is your expectations. It's not the potions. Why do you expect to be on the same level as some one who plays 3 to 4 times more than you? Hardcore gamers are always going to have the edge over casual gamers. I am pretty sure that ZOS never claimed buy potions and you can immediately catch up to people that play far more often than you. Again, this is nothing more than your false expectation.

This is an MMO. MMO's have continual advancement. You can't expect ZOS to stop all advancement options for V14's until YOU catch up.

You are not the first to point this out. But hey... When I started playing this game there were no champ points, and in about a months time I WOULD be on the same playing field if not for champion points. So if I feel I bit let down, I reckon I have a right, considering the fairness of the original system was my favourite thing about it. Yeah its an MMO. but I'd be playing this game if it wasn't, because I'm mainly here because it is Elder Scrolls.

So you are saying within a month you could max out all your skills and hit VR14. Be all geared up and equal to people who have been playing this game for a long time? Sorry not buying that. There is simply no way you could do that within 30 days. Especially if this is your first character.

Mashille · June 2015

I agree. The XP Potion should be more beneficial to people who can;t play as much as the people who already have 300+ Champion Points rather than just making it the same for everyone and give players who play a lot an even bigger chance to storm ahead.

My idea would be to have the XP potions get weaker the more you use them in a certain time frame.

For example, when you first use an XP potion it would give you a 50% Boost to XP, then however if you used another Potionn within 24 Hours the amount of XP will be reduced to 15% then if you used another potion within 24 hours the amount of XP gained would be reduced to 5%.

This would make the potions a less flat out advantage and more of a way for people who do not have as much time on their hands to catch up with the people who play all the time.