Dear ZOS, Your CC is not working

Huntler · April 2015

I don't know how many times this has to get posted, but your CC doesn't work. You don't get immunity unless you break free and you most certainly are getting double knocked up while in the middle of CC such as wrecking blow. By now we are well aware no one plays PvP on the ZOS team or they would have known this months ago, but this is kind of gross that the impression you guys are under of how thing work is clearly wrong...

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

woodsro wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

You're correct. Fear does have some issues. We can tell you that we've identified the issue that was causing you to fall through the ground, or through the map entirely, and are testing the fix we've implemented. We hope to get this out in an incremental patch in the near future.

@ZOS_GinaBruno: Do you also look into why fear is very difficult to break nowadays and that fear, in the current state of the game (one-shot-wars) might have to be adjusted to not be more deciding than any ultimate?

A one second delay (which is pretty much standard atm playing in Cyrodiil) from break-free to any defensive maneuver is currently causing certain death, even when breaking immediately.

One potential change we're exploring is to remove the stun, which should help with the responsiveness. This would likely not happen until the next major update, though the falling-through-the-world issue will be fixed much, much sooner (potentially in the next week or two).

@ZOS_GinaBruno Hi Gina!

Quick question, if i may have a few moments of your time.

The Sorcerer Skill Streak does the Following:

Streak
Gives a 1.5 sec stun
Then gives 6 secs of CC immunity.

Fear
a 4 sec loss of control of your character
no CC immunity given unless you use break free

Why does Streak that only stuns for a 1.5 secs give 6 secs of CC immunity without using break free, yet Fear can be spammed over and over again and unless the person uses break free, Fear gives no cc immunity?

For the sake of consistence either the CC Immunity should be removed from Streak and CC Immunity only given by using break free, or Fear needs to give CC Immunity after its duration like Streak does now.

This is my only issue with the skill, other than that, its fine. If Streak can't be spammed to keep someone CC then Fear shouldn't be able to be either. Regardless, I hope this could be brought to devs attention and addressed at some point.

Thank you for your time Gina. Hope you have a great weekend!

Hello! All CC effects should be providing a 5 second immunity after the effect ends. We double checked internally, and this seems to be the case. If you're seeing otherwise, could you let us know with some details?

Thanks! And you have a great weekend as well.

Thats a literal quote from Gina said they tested it internally. Just literally tested myself it took 10 seconds. @ZOS_GinaBruno this is really ridiculous and I'd love to have a talk with whoever you have checking these things.

I'll lay it out for you:

Get 2 players on 1 side, 1 player on the other. Try it once where the person getting hit doesn't break free, first you'll see if you wait that player does NOT get immunity upon completion of the effect. Furthermore, if a second player hits the downed player, the player gets knocked up again and refreshed stun.

It is literally the simplest test of all time, but quoted saying you guys checked this, how is that possible?

More importantly, as I have said... you do not get immunity unless you break free, at least from wrecking blow and most other CC out there (petrify, fear, etc.) and you can be stunned multiple times while currently stunned which in effect makes you stunned longer or indefinitely.

Not to sound angry, but it is beyond upsetting to see you "checked" this to see it so horridly wrong upon very simple testing.

edit: Yes I reported it through in game bug, no I will not be posting a video because I don't have that capability. Anyone could easily recreate the test, however.

xylena · April 2015

agreed, the broken CC mechanics have really been sucking the fun out of pvp lately... try to fight while outnumbered (and not bolt or roll or cloak away), and it's inevitable that you will be killed during a CC break animation or while stun-locked

like most game mechanics right now, CC encourages players to stack and spam, and punishes them for striking out on their own or in small groups... sad that CC benefits the crowd more than those trying to control it

SoulScream · April 2015

Thank you for calling them out on this.

PVP is the least fun for me that it has been and I've played since beta.

Xsorus · April 2015

Some CC will not give immunity on Breaks...Petrify is an example...If I hit ya with it, then wrecking blow it'll knock you up (you then get immunity)

if I was for example do Shield Charge + Wrecking Blow...WB wouldn't knock ya up.

Fear of course will not give immunity at all unless ya break it...which makes no sense because its insanely powerful just for the fact it doesn't break on damage (Lets call it what it is..its a bloody stun)

Huntler · April 2015

Xsorus wrote: »

Some CC will not give immunity on Breaks...Petrify is an example...If I hit ya with it, then wrecking blow it'll knock you up (you then get immunity)

if I was for example do Shield Charge + Wrecking Blow...WB wouldn't knock ya up.

Fear of course will not give immunity at all unless ya break it...which makes no sense because its insanely powerful just for the fact it doesn't break on damage (Lets call it what it is..its a bloody stun)

Notice the Gina quote. ALL CC is supposed to give you immunity regardless.
And back to back WB will continuously knock you up.

saintmurray · April 2015

I couldn't agree more. Like in 1.5 when pvp was negate wars. 1.6 has become broken CC wars with fear being the main culprit.

Oughash · April 2015

Xsorus wrote: »

Some CC will not give immunity on Breaks...Petrify is an example...If I hit ya with it, then wrecking blow it'll knock you up (you then get immunity)

if I was for example do Shield Charge + Wrecking Blow...WB wouldn't knock ya up.

Fear of course will not give immunity at all unless ya break it...which makes no sense because its insanely powerful just for the fact it doesn't break on damage (Lets call it what it is..its a bloody stun)

This "feature" is hilariously broken. That it has remained so is clear proof that nobody at ZoS does any PvP because all it takes is two or three fights to run into this.

Oughash · April 2015

Oh yeah. Don't forget the fear video that @Ezareth posted. I have evidence that he has smashed two mice b/c of it.

Aminals · April 2015

Gotta shuffle breh

MormondPayne_EP · April 2015

I made a comment in another thread criticising the way ZOS responds, or more accurately, doesn't respond to issues raised by the PVP player base in a constructive way that relied on facts and referenced specific responses like this.

***edited*** something happened by some sort of magic and my posts were magically gone from the thread. Evidently, the code of conduct prohibits any comment that calls into question ZOS ability, or lack there of, in responding and rectifying game breaking issues.

When every patch brings back old bugs and problems from previous iterations of updates then I can hear the circus music playing and the clown car is circling the arena.

Watch this post get deleted by the bourgeoisie for some other trumped up reference to the "hallowed" code of conduct.

Is this technically naming and shaming ZOS?

Teargrants · April 2015

LF job as ZOS internal tester, pst. Enjoy low pressure work environment.

Mumyo · April 2015

WHy are Sorcs comparing streak to fear???

Erock25 · April 2015

Mumyo wrote: »

WHy are Sorcs comparing streak to fear???

They're comparing a CC effect to a CC effect.

Huntler · April 2015

MormondPayne_EP wrote: »

I made a comment in another thread criticising the way ZOS responds, or more accurately, doesn't respond to issues raised by the PVP player base in a constructive way that relied on facts and referenced specific responses like this.

***edited*** something happened by some sort of magic and my posts were magically gone from the thread. Evidently, the code of conduct prohibits any comment that calls into question ZOS ability, or lack there of, in responding and rectifying game breaking issues.

When every patch brings back old bugs and problems from previous iterations of updates then I can hear the circus music playing and the clown car is circling the arena.

Watch this post get deleted by the bourgeoisie for some other trumped up reference to the "hallowed" code of conduct.

Is this technically naming and shaming ZOS?

edit that out, its against TOS to talk about mod actions and you'll get in trouble for it.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match the player's edited version]

Xsorus · April 2015

Huntler wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Some CC will not give immunity on Breaks...Petrify is an example...If I hit ya with it, then wrecking blow it'll knock you up (you then get immunity)

if I was for example do Shield Charge + Wrecking Blow...WB wouldn't knock ya up.

Fear of course will not give immunity at all unless ya break it...which makes no sense because its insanely powerful just for the fact it doesn't break on damage (Lets call it what it is..its a bloody stun)

Notice the Gina quote. ALL CC is supposed to give you immunity regardless.
And back to back WB will continuously knock you up.

I've honestly never noticed back to back wbs doing knock up twice..not sure how true that is

saintmurray · April 2015

Xsorus wrote: »

Huntler wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Some CC will not give immunity on Breaks...Petrify is an example...If I hit ya with it, then wrecking blow it'll knock you up (you then get immunity)

if I was for example do Shield Charge + Wrecking Blow...WB wouldn't knock ya up.

Fear of course will not give immunity at all unless ya break it...which makes no sense because its insanely powerful just for the fact it doesn't break on damage (Lets call it what it is..its a bloody stun)

Notice the Gina quote. ALL CC is supposed to give you immunity regardless.
And back to back WB will continuously knock you up.

I've honestly never noticed back to back wbs doing knock up twice..not sure how true that is

Not wanting to poke the bee hive because I wanna stay on topic bagging cc but I think if you run outa stam from blocking you will continuously be knocked up

Teargrants · April 2015

saintmurray wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Huntler wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Some CC will not give immunity on Breaks...Petrify is an example...If I hit ya with it, then wrecking blow it'll knock you up (you then get immunity)

if I was for example do Shield Charge + Wrecking Blow...WB wouldn't knock ya up.

Fear of course will not give immunity at all unless ya break it...which makes no sense because its insanely powerful just for the fact it doesn't break on damage (Lets call it what it is..its a bloody stun)

Notice the Gina quote. ALL CC is supposed to give you immunity regardless.
And back to back WB will continuously knock you up.

I've honestly never noticed back to back wbs doing knock up twice..not sure how true that is

Not wanting to poke the bee hive because I wanna stay on topic bagging cc but I think if you run outa stam from blocking you will continuously be knocked up

Shoulda used protection.

saintmurray · April 2015

Teargrants wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Huntler wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Some CC will not give immunity on Breaks...Petrify is an example...If I hit ya with it, then wrecking blow it'll knock you up (you then get immunity)

if I was for example do Shield Charge + Wrecking Blow...WB wouldn't knock ya up.

Fear of course will not give immunity at all unless ya break it...which makes no sense because its insanely powerful just for the fact it doesn't break on damage (Lets call it what it is..its a bloody stun)

Notice the Gina quote. ALL CC is supposed to give you immunity regardless.
And back to back WB will continuously knock you up.

I've honestly never noticed back to back wbs doing knock up twice..not sure how true that is

Not wanting to poke the bee hive because I wanna stay on topic bagging cc but I think if you run outa stam from blocking you will continuously be knocked up

Shoulda used protection.

I've been going fine this long without barrier :P

Teargrants · April 2015

saintmurray wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Huntler wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Some CC will not give immunity on Breaks...Petrify is an example...If I hit ya with it, then wrecking blow it'll knock you up (you then get immunity)

if I was for example do Shield Charge + Wrecking Blow...WB wouldn't knock ya up.

Fear of course will not give immunity at all unless ya break it...which makes no sense because its insanely powerful just for the fact it doesn't break on damage (Lets call it what it is..its a bloody stun)

Notice the Gina quote. ALL CC is supposed to give you immunity regardless.
And back to back WB will continuously knock you up.

I've honestly never noticed back to back wbs doing knock up twice..not sure how true that is

Not wanting to poke the bee hive because I wanna stay on topic bagging cc but I think if you run outa stam from blocking you will continuously be knocked up

Shoulda used protection.

I've been going fine this long without damage shields :P

What happens when you can't pull out of combat fast enough?

saintmurray · April 2015

Teargrants wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

saintmurray wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Huntler wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Some CC will not give immunity on Breaks...Petrify is an example...If I hit ya with it, then wrecking blow it'll knock you up (you then get immunity)

if I was for example do Shield Charge + Wrecking Blow...WB wouldn't knock ya up.

Fear of course will not give immunity at all unless ya break it...which makes no sense because its insanely powerful just for the fact it doesn't break on damage (Lets call it what it is..its a bloody stun)

Notice the Gina quote. ALL CC is supposed to give you immunity regardless.
And back to back WB will continuously knock you up.

I've honestly never noticed back to back wbs doing knock up twice..not sure how true that is

Not wanting to poke the bee hive because I wanna stay on topic bagging cc but I think if you run outa stam from blocking you will continuously be knocked up

Shoulda used protection.

I've been going fine this long without damage shields :P

What happens when you can't pull out of combat fast enough?

I suffer from pretty bad lag so I always try to finish my opponent off with a focused aim.

Huntler · April 2015

Xsorus wrote: »

Huntler wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Some CC will not give immunity on Breaks...Petrify is an example...If I hit ya with it, then wrecking blow it'll knock you up (you then get immunity)

if I was for example do Shield Charge + Wrecking Blow...WB wouldn't knock ya up.

Fear of course will not give immunity at all unless ya break it...which makes no sense because its insanely powerful just for the fact it doesn't break on damage (Lets call it what it is..its a bloody stun)

Notice the Gina quote. ALL CC is supposed to give you immunity regardless.
And back to back WB will continuously knock you up.

I've honestly never noticed back to back wbs doing knock up twice..not sure how true that is

I'll let others "confirm" as I completely understand my word on testing isn't enough to confirm things. I suggest anyone who goes about testing this to first test that just not breaking out will lead to no immunity (WB is my control here). Then after, I would have 2 players wrecking blow the same person. Just to copy my test.

I can 100% say that Gina's claim in the OP quote I put up that all CC gives you immunity (even without breaking out) is completely false, and however this double CC is happening, it IS happening. I don't know if its when you are in the middle of the CC animation, you can still be CCed again, or if just being stunned other stuns can work only after the stun wears off are you immune (I'm sure there are other possibilities), but this is most definitely happening. My test was with wrecking blow, I am sure there are others, but I can say fear/petrify you have to break out of.

RinaldoGandolphi · April 2015

Quoteed my post, I'm honored Huntler

haha!

Nah, seriously though, I'm done pvp in this game until a few things are addressed. I plan on writing out a very formal and respectful treatise on the subject soon. Templars will QQ because of it, Sorcs will QQ because if it, Nightblades will QQ because if it, and DK will QQ because of it, but it needs to be said.

There are glaring problems with pvp cc, and skills in this game that need addressed. If this game is to be successful, they need to be addressed.

An error doesn't become a mistake until you refuse to correct it-JFK

I hope after I write my treatise that ZOS is able to recognize the errors and fix them before they become mistakes. They got it right by removing the mana regen penalty on Bolt Escape I suggested I'm my "hate sorc thread" they are close, they change a few things and this game may have the best pvp ever.

Cody · April 2015

i have had instances where I have broken a CC, then got CCed again instantly after:( particularly with fear.

Huntler · April 2015

Cody wrote: »

i have had instances where I have broken a CC, then got CCed against instantly after:( particularly with fear.

Nevermind, you edited.

Sypher · April 2015

There are plenty of CC issues unfortunately but when I tested fear it gave immunity after the duration ended.

But there a few other cases where cc immunity isn't given.

I'm tired of trying to cope with the inconsistentcy regarding game mechanics.

Ezareth · April 2015

Ishammael wrote: »

Oh yeah. Don't forget the fear video that @Ezareth posted. I have evidence that he has smashed two mice b/c of it.

And I'm slowly but surely replacing the all plastic keys on my mechanical keyboard with Heavy duty Zinc ones because no plastic on the earth can withstand my righteous Nerd-rage when this game bugs out in the middle of me slaughtering lowbies.

Oughash · April 2015

Ezareth wrote: »

Ishammael wrote: »

Oh yeah. Don't forget the fear video that @Ezareth posted. I have evidence that he has smashed two mice b/c of it.

And I'm slowly but surely replacing the all plastic keys on my mechanical keyboard with Heavy duty Zinc ones because no plastic on the earth can withstand my righteous Nerd-rage when this game bugs out in the middle of me slaughtering lowbies.

I played a ton this weekend. The only thing I was dying to, besides my own stupidity, was fear. The 1-2 sec delay before you can break it is death.

C0pp3rhead · April 2015

Shield Charge is another skill that myself and a number of my guildmates have encountered that seems to occasionally bypass CC immunity. It is not uncommon for me to break free from a stun only to be shield charged immediately and find myself flat on my a$$.

Lava_Croft · April 2015

Crowd Control, like other things in this game, has been in various states of brokenness since release. Given the fact that we are over a year into the game's life and over a year deep into my and everybody else's wallet, I doubt this is ever going to be fixed in any other way than the regular ZOS way: band aids.

[EDIT] Obviously the band aids will introduce new bugs that require more band aids.

Morvul · April 2015

My experience with CC in cyrodiil:

a) every CC that actually gives immunity only does so once it ends. If a second CC skill lands bevor the first CC is over, the player is actually affected by the second CC. (so in regards to Huntlers example: two players using wrecking blow consecutively can golf-bat a player across the entirety of cyrodiil - except for the fact that most folks are dead after the 3rd WB)

b) it is relatively common that CCs end and still do not grant immunity: back to back fears or back to back petrifys being the most common culprits in my experience (but I have also been back-to-back crystal-frag-knockdowned)

c) sometimes I CC break, and still get CCed again within less then a second. In my experience, this only happens when the second CC lands basically right after the CC break, it never happend to me 3 or 4 seconds after the CC break (with the obvious exception of fights that were lagged to hell and back)

personally, I consider a) a design-flaw, while I assume that b) and c) could be attributed to lag-related problems

stonescorsa · April 2015

Most of this game is broke in a bad way we have 1 button spammers (most other mmos cant spam one button) we have cc completely broke. Horses that knock you off when you get on them (really annoying). Fear that makes you go through the world. I can keep going but it will be a long list everyone just unsub as they are more concerned about the console then the players who have paid for over a year. Zos if this is how you treat us we hope your game blows on console