THE REAL ZERG BUSTER

vortexman11 · April 2015

You're all going to hate me, and Im saying in advance that I accept that fact.

I've read alot of topics over the past few weeks from people giving various ways to "bust zergs" and cause people to spread out. First there was magicka detonation, Im not even going to comment on that skill as it is no where near what we expected it to be, then theres been the update to siege, but we're now seeing this has done nothing because spamming Purge/Efficient Purge/Cleanse makes it utterly useless. So I would like to give my own solution to this problem of stacking and "zerging" even though 99% of the population of the forums will hate me for it.

Bring back ultimate gain from AoE abilities.

I know you all hated it. The Impulse Impulse Batswarm Impulse Standard of Might. But lets look at it more closely.

What allowed players to gain such massive amounts of ultimate?
What prevented players from gaining such massive amounts of ultimate?

Let me answer this first question by using an example. Theres a stack of 15 players that 3 players are about to bomb. The 3 players are at an obvious disadvantage by numbers, YET due to the fact that they build ultimate off of their AoE abilities they're able to have more of a chance against such overwhelming numbers. Now, what does this cause that stack of 15 people to do? Well....you can't purge an ultimate, sure you could negate it, but the only real way to prevent that group from wiping is for them to SPREAD OUT.

Now the answer to that second question is simple, to prevent people from gaining massive amounts of ultimate allowing them to use powerful skills you simply don't get grouped up.

How would this help balance things out you might ask? Well its pretty obvious, the group in whatever fight with the least people, would be gaining more ultimate per person than the group with more people. Basically, the more outnumbered you are, the more ultimate you get.

This stops PvP from being a simple numbers game, because sure the increased siege damage was good, but if you have 10 people, and the enemy has 30 people, all that means is they have enough people to run just as much siege while have 20 others to do whatever.

Now! Let the hate begin! I just wanted to express my opinion even though you all think it's wrong.

frozywozy · April 2015

vortexman11 wrote: »

You're all going to hate me, and Im saying in advance that I accept that fact.

I've read alot of topics over the past few weeks from people giving various ways to "bust zergs" and cause people to spread out. First there was magicka detonation, Im not even going to comment on that skill as it is no where near what we expected it to be, then theres been the update to siege, but we're now seeing this has done nothing because spamming Purge/Efficient Purge/Cleanse makes it utterly useless. So I would like to give my own solution to this problem of stacking and "zerging" even though 99% of the population of the forums will hate me for it.

Bring back ultimate gain from AoE abilities.

I know you all hated it. The Impulse Impulse Batswarm Impulse Standard of Might. But lets look at it more closely.

What allowed players to gain such massive amounts of ultimate?
What prevented players from gaining such massive amounts of ultimate?

Let me answer this first question by using an example. Theres a stack of 15 players that 3 players are about to bomb. The 3 players are at an obvious disadvantage by numbers, YET due to the fact that they build ultimate off of their AoE abilities they're able to have more of a chance against such overwhelming numbers. Now, what does this cause that stack of 15 people to do? Well....you can't purge an ultimate, sure you could negate it, but the only real way to prevent that group from wiping is for them to SPREAD OUT.

Now the answer to that second question is simple, to prevent people from gaining massive amounts of ultimate allowing them to use powerful skills you simply don't get grouped up.

How would this help balance things out you might ask? Well its pretty obvious, the group in whatever fight with the least people, would be gaining more ultimate per person than the group with more people. Basically, the more outnumbered you are, the more ultimate you get.

This stops PvP from being a simple numbers game, because sure the increased siege damage was good, but if you have 10 people, and the enemy has 30 people, all that means is they have enough people to run just as much siege while have 20 others to do whatever.

Now! Let the hate begin! I just wanted to express my opinion even though you all think it's wrong.

So your solution in other words is to assure perma devouring swarms to the 10members left in MBF against all larger groups to assure their total domination ? No thx.

coolermh · April 2015

We just need a skill that gains expotential damage the more people it hits.

Gan Xing · April 2015

This will help balance 10 v 60 fights (a little bit), but people will complain that if they have 60 people, then logically they should be able to wipe 10.

Then there is strategic fighting, where 10 can wipe 60, and they will still complain.

vortexman11 · April 2015

frozywozy wrote: »

vortexman11 wrote: »

You're all going to hate me, and Im saying in advance that I accept that fact.

I've read alot of topics over the past few weeks from people giving various ways to "bust zergs" and cause people to spread out. First there was magicka detonation, Im not even going to comment on that skill as it is no where near what we expected it to be, then theres been the update to siege, but we're now seeing this has done nothing because spamming Purge/Efficient Purge/Cleanse makes it utterly useless. So I would like to give my own solution to this problem of stacking and "zerging" even though 99% of the population of the forums will hate me for it.

Bring back ultimate gain from AoE abilities.

I know you all hated it. The Impulse Impulse Batswarm Impulse Standard of Might. But lets look at it more closely.

What allowed players to gain such massive amounts of ultimate?
What prevented players from gaining such massive amounts of ultimate?

Let me answer this first question by using an example. Theres a stack of 15 players that 3 players are about to bomb. The 3 players are at an obvious disadvantage by numbers, YET due to the fact that they build ultimate off of their AoE abilities they're able to have more of a chance against such overwhelming numbers. Now, what does this cause that stack of 15 people to do? Well....you can't purge an ultimate, sure you could negate it, but the only real way to prevent that group from wiping is for them to SPREAD OUT.

Now the answer to that second question is simple, to prevent people from gaining massive amounts of ultimate allowing them to use powerful skills you simply don't get grouped up.

How would this help balance things out you might ask? Well its pretty obvious, the group in whatever fight with the least people, would be gaining more ultimate per person than the group with more people. Basically, the more outnumbered you are, the more ultimate you get.

This stops PvP from being a simple numbers game, because sure the increased siege damage was good, but if you have 10 people, and the enemy has 30 people, all that means is they have enough people to run just as much siege while have 20 others to do whatever.

Now! Let the hate begin! I just wanted to express my opinion even though you all think it's wrong.

So your solution in other words is to assure perma devouring swarms to the 10members left in MBF against all larger groups to assure your total domination ? No thx.

That would be the result of people not spreading out thus feeding the 10 members left of MBF crazy amounts of ultimate

tonemd · April 2015

This doesn't stop the zerg-train at all. It just enhances it. What does the 15 do against the 3? Group heal through your ults, spam their own AOEs and then blast you with their ults. Does your suggestion also apply to healing AOEs? That makes it even worse. Lag zerg sits in a tower lagging the server with healing springs or grand heal or whatever, building ult and bombing anyone stupid enough to try to take them out through the "can't use my abilitie" lag. They will always have heals and ults at their disposal.

vortexman11 · April 2015

tonemd wrote: »

This doesn't stop the zerg-train at all. It just enhances it. What does the 15 do against the 3? Group heal through your ults, spam their own AOEs and then blast you with their ults. Does your suggestion also apply to healing AOEs? That makes it even worse. Lag zerg sits in a tower lagging the server with healing springs or grand heal or whatever, building ult and bombing anyone stupid enough to try to take them out through the "can't use my abilitie" lag. They will always have heals and ults at their disposal.

Im not sure about building ultimate off of heals as it worked in 1.5, but I think what I said still stands, that group of 3 will be building ultimate alot faster than that group of 15, the 15 people would have 3 people to build ultimate off of while the 3 people would have 15 people to build ultimate off of.

vortexman11 · April 2015

coolermh wrote: »

We just need a skill that gains expotential damage the more people it hits.

I agree with this idea, but I think the fact that it could instantly wipe a group of 30 people is a bit extreme...not saying its a bad idea though

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · April 2015

Umm hold block > Clouding Bat > Sap Essence > Steel Tornado x 8 with 10 friends on the breach

vortexman11 · April 2015

You guys don't seem to get the point, that yes, you'll build ultimate very quickly, but it would only be that way if the enemy chooses to group up and run into you like that. You avoid the AoE's you avoid giving your enemy crazy amounts of ultimate. Spreading out would be a necessity because even with increased siege damage you can just purge and heal through it

WarrioroftheWind_ESO · April 2015

I think this would be a bad idea. People gain ultimate stupid fast anyway as we've seen in some of these big battles, even small ones. I really think they should just buff the dmg of abilities like Detonation and make it less clunky. Abilities like pulsar do way more damage and much more efficiently in dmg to cost. Maybe they should bring back non-dispellable snares from oilpots and caltrops, because otherwise there's no use in being careful about entering a breach. I've seen groups just waltz up inside keeps and I've been IN them because it's ridiculously easy with the correct buff setup. Or they could just bring back ground oil. The only people who would die to it were the dumb or careless ones, and people have been very dumb and careless with breaches lately. Alot of people also overlook the use of anti-anti siege, positioning sieges to hit the breach and first flag room to really throttle enemy resistance. I've been on the receiving end of it often enough but I rarely see my own group using it. People need to get into the habit of it more.

frozywozy · April 2015

The solution is to make Cleanse costs like 8k magicka to use.

FENGRUSH · April 2015

Fengrush approves

Alomar · April 2015

I disagree with both the siege and the magicka detonation perspectives. So things aren't handed to you on a silver platter, too bad nothing is supposed to be in an rvr mmorpg.

Siege if used in general from unorganized grps often does wipe "zergs" (imo is 25 or more) more than often it does so very often. Yet, when siege is used by players who simply organize/coordinate their shots, it litteraly takes 2 shots from only two firepot trebs to wipe an organized raid. Two volley's of 16 dmg. (32K dmg non-vamp) now that the initial dot is fixed is enough to kill any stacked group of players without a barrier and even with barriers/cleanes/purges will kill 1/2-2/3 of the stacked players leaving the rest extremely vulnerable with low resources. There's also the fact that most of the time there is way more than just two siege being used against zergs, so if done correctly and players actually use some initiative and organize themselves they can be very deadly against "zergs".

On the other hand, I have in fact found many (most) instances where the current siege meta (aka *** tons of dmg) favors the zergs because they simply have more numbers which means more people who can man siege against smaller even organized grps. Yet, the ability to use siege to defeat zergs still exists with a fraction of work, which should be expected to be successful in any rvr style mmo.

Then there's magicka detonation, so it isn't a 1 shot to all people around you easymode win button. Well try stacking spell damage and using it with a coordinated grp having 2-4 proc at the exact same time with crits from 10-18+k each, does that not kill a zerg good enough for you or was that too difficult to do?

When it comes to gaining ulti from aoe'ing it would indeed favor hardcore and organized players over zergs while the current ulti-gen mechanic does benefit zergs, yet it isn't needed. Don't get me wrong, if they changed it I'd be happy as ****, but they won't they went the opposite direction in 1.6.

Rune_Relic · April 2015

So you answer to spreading people out is to make the already powerful..even more godlike ?
Where as if we boost siege instead, no individual gains any more godlike powers then anyone else.

I propose flash bangs from the crown store.
Anyone using magelight and detect potions gets blinded for 10 seconds.
Anyone in the blast radius gets a <20m knock away + fall damage + offbalance + stun
:d

That does specifically what its supposed to do....force people apart and make them vulnerable.
You still have to pick them off.
Cant be blocked, purged, break...only dodge.

This does not add to the damage calcs like other aoes.
the zerg is blown apart and needs single target damage to finish them (aoe wont work).
It eliminates any outgoing aoes/dots/channels from the impacted group.
ie. it eliminates damage calcs from adding to the backlog and minimises lag.
[an antil-lag bomb]

vortexman11 · April 2015

Rune_Relic wrote: »

So you answer to spreading people out is to make the already powerful..even more godlike ?
Where as if we boost siege instead, no individual gains any more godlike powers then anyone else.

I propose flash bangs from the crown store.
Anyone using magelight and detect potions gets blinded for 10 seconds.
Anyone in the blast radius gets a <20m knock away + fall damage + offbalance + stun
:d

That does specifically what its supposed to do....force people apart and make them vulnerable.
You still have to pick them off.
Cant be blocked, purged, break...only dodge.

This does not add to the damage calcs like other aoes.
the zerg is blown apart and needs single target damage to finish them (aoe wont work).
It eliminates any outgoing aoes/dots/channels from the impacted group.
ie. it eliminates damage calcs from adding to the backlog and minimises lag.
[an antil-lag bomb]

What I proposed does not make the already powerful godlike, it gives the outnumbered a fighting chance

WRX · April 2015

I 100% agree with this, they removed AoE caps but also removed the way we do most our damage. This has been brought up to ZOS by us, issue is then it limits builds again to AoE builds being better.

But yeah, give me that back and I will be running 8-12 man groups.

Durann · April 2015

Tell you what, these three players will wipe no matter what. Know why? Heh, lag. Can't set negates, can't put your banner, swarm goes off without healing. The only thing they can do against zergs, is to fix the lag. And we all know that this is not possible, otherwise they would have done it already. Oh, the test on the PTS, where they have found something that causes lag? Heh, lies... Or at least not the truth. I am all in for gaining ulti from AoE, siege (but not healing), but that doesn't help

vortexman11 · April 2015

Durann wrote: »

Tell you what, these three players will wipe no matter what. Know why? Heh, lag. Can't set negates, can't put your banner, swarm goes off without healing. The only thing they can do against zergs, is to fix the lag. And we all know that this is not possible, otherwise they would have done it already. Oh, the test on the PTS, where they have found something that causes lag? Heh, lies... Or at least not the truth. I am all in for gaining ulti from AoE, siege (but not healing), but that doesn't help

Yeah, I think the way healing builds ultimate right now is good, as they basically have the Major Heroism buff at all times

Emma_Overload · April 2015

vortexman11 wrote: »

You're all going to hate me, and Im saying in advance that I accept that fact.

I've read alot of topics over the past few weeks from people giving various ways to "bust zergs" and cause people to spread out. First there was magicka detonation, Im not even going to comment on that skill as it is no where near what we expected it to be, then theres been the update to siege, but we're now seeing this has done nothing because spamming Purge/Efficient Purge/Cleanse makes it utterly useless. So I would like to give my own solution to this problem of stacking and "zerging" even though 99% of the population of the forums will hate me for it.

Bring back ultimate gain from AoE abilities.

I know you all hated it. The Impulse Impulse Batswarm Impulse Standard of Might. But lets look at it more closely.

What allowed players to gain such massive amounts of ultimate?
What prevented players from gaining such massive amounts of ultimate?

Let me answer this first question by using an example. Theres a stack of 15 players that 3 players are about to bomb. The 3 players are at an obvious disadvantage by numbers, YET due to the fact that they build ultimate off of their AoE abilities they're able to have more of a chance against such overwhelming numbers. Now, what does this cause that stack of 15 people to do? Well....you can't purge an ultimate, sure you could negate it, but the only real way to prevent that group from wiping is for them to SPREAD OUT.

Now the answer to that second question is simple, to prevent people from gaining massive amounts of ultimate allowing them to use powerful skills you simply don't get grouped up.

How would this help balance things out you might ask? Well its pretty obvious, the group in whatever fight with the least people, would be gaining more ultimate per person than the group with more people. Basically, the more outnumbered you are, the more ultimate you get.

This stops PvP from being a simple numbers game, because sure the increased siege damage was good, but if you have 10 people, and the enemy has 30 people, all that means is they have enough people to run just as much siege while have 20 others to do whatever.

Now! Let the hate begin! I just wanted to express my opinion even though you all think it's wrong.

I don't hate you ... I AGREE with you!

Not only do Ultimates need to make a comeback (early and often!), but I want to see Wall of Elements restored to its former glory. The Elemental Blockade morph used to be one of the best AOE spells in the game, if you knew how to use it properly. Now it just plain SUCKS - nobody uses Wall of Elements or any of its morphs anymore.

Seriously, what was the point of nerfing Ultimates and AOE spells if they were just going to turn around and give everyone siege weapons that are basically like the rocket launchers in Quake, LOL?!

.

Rune_Relic · April 2015

vortexman11 wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

So you answer to spreading people out is to make the already powerful..even more godlike ?
Where as if we boost siege instead, no individual gains any more godlike powers then anyone else.

I propose flash bangs from the crown store.
Anyone using magelight and detect potions gets blinded for 10 seconds.
Anyone in the blast radius gets a <20m knock away + fall damage + offbalance + stun
:d

That does specifically what its supposed to do....force people apart and make them vulnerable.
You still have to pick them off.
Cant be blocked, purged, break...only dodge.

This does not add to the damage calcs like other aoes.
the zerg is blown apart and needs single target damage to finish them (aoe wont work).
It eliminates any outgoing aoes/dots/channels from the impacted group.
ie. it eliminates damage calcs from adding to the backlog and minimises lag.
[an antil-lag bomb]

What I proposed does not make the already powerful godlike, it gives the outnumbered a fighting chance

No ...it gives you AP farming godmode upon all noobs.
We will be back to DKs perverting the land of tamriel

We will be back to crit builds ruling everything.

vortexman11 · April 2015

Rune_Relic wrote: »

vortexman11 wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

So you answer to spreading people out is to make the already powerful..even more godlike ?
Where as if we boost siege instead, no individual gains any more godlike powers then anyone else.

I propose flash bangs from the crown store.
Anyone using magelight and detect potions gets blinded for 10 seconds.
Anyone in the blast radius gets a <20m knock away + fall damage + offbalance + stun
:d

That does specifically what its supposed to do....force people apart and make them vulnerable.
You still have to pick them off.
Cant be blocked, purged, break...only dodge.

This does not add to the damage calcs like other aoes.
the zerg is blown apart and needs single target damage to finish them (aoe wont work).
It eliminates any outgoing aoes/dots/channels from the impacted group.
ie. it eliminates damage calcs from adding to the backlog and minimises lag.
[an antil-lag bomb]

What I proposed does not make the already powerful godlike, it gives the outnumbered a fighting chance

No ...it gives you AP farming godmode upon all noobs.

And the fact that 40 "noobs" (not calling anyone a noob, just quoting) can form up and crush anything if they know how to put up siege is better?

Rune_Relic · April 2015

vortexman11 wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

vortexman11 wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

So you answer to spreading people out is to make the already powerful..even more godlike ?
Where as if we boost siege instead, no individual gains any more godlike powers then anyone else.

I propose flash bangs from the crown store.
Anyone using magelight and detect potions gets blinded for 10 seconds.
Anyone in the blast radius gets a <20m knock away + fall damage + offbalance + stun
:d

That does specifically what its supposed to do....force people apart and make them vulnerable.
You still have to pick them off.
Cant be blocked, purged, break...only dodge.

This does not add to the damage calcs like other aoes.
the zerg is blown apart and needs single target damage to finish them (aoe wont work).
It eliminates any outgoing aoes/dots/channels from the impacted group.
ie. it eliminates damage calcs from adding to the backlog and minimises lag.
[an antil-lag bomb]

What I proposed does not make the already powerful godlike, it gives the outnumbered a fighting chance

No ...it gives you AP farming godmode upon all noobs.

And the fact that 40 "noobs" (not calling anyone a noob, just quoting) can form up and crush anything if they know how to put up siege is better?

Nope....but neither is giving one person the ability to wipe them all out with one hit.
And needless to say one specific class/race/build will be much much better at it than anyone else.

I dont mind if EVERYONE can do it regardless of skill/level and all have a achance at the same AP reward.
But thats not what you are asking for.

EDIT misread your post....yes noob siege is much better then all that power in one persons hands or a limited few min maxers
Thats why al the OP players cried.....they suddenly had a level playing field instead of being gods.
Anyway...siege do damage..that wasnt what I asked for

vortexman11 · April 2015

Rune_Relic wrote: »

vortexman11 wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

vortexman11 wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

So you answer to spreading people out is to make the already powerful..even more godlike ?
Where as if we boost siege instead, no individual gains any more godlike powers then anyone else.

I propose flash bangs from the crown store.
Anyone using magelight and detect potions gets blinded for 10 seconds.
Anyone in the blast radius gets a <20m knock away + fall damage + offbalance + stun
:d

That does specifically what its supposed to do....force people apart and make them vulnerable.
You still have to pick them off.
Cant be blocked, purged, break...only dodge.

This does not add to the damage calcs like other aoes.
the zerg is blown apart and needs single target damage to finish them (aoe wont work).
It eliminates any outgoing aoes/dots/channels from the impacted group.
ie. it eliminates damage calcs from adding to the backlog and minimises lag.
[an antil-lag bomb]

What I proposed does not make the already powerful godlike, it gives the outnumbered a fighting chance

No ...it gives you AP farming godmode upon all noobs.

And the fact that 40 "noobs" (not calling anyone a noob, just quoting) can form up and crush anything if they know how to put up siege is better?

Nope....but neither is giving one person the ability to wipe them all out with one hit.
And needless to say one specific class/race/build will be much much better at it than anyone else.

I dont mind if EVERYONE can do it regardless of skill/level and all have a achance at the same AP reward.
But thats not what you are asking for.

EDIT misread your post....yes noob siege is much better then all that power in one persons hands or a limited few min maxers
Thats why al the OP players cried.....they suddenly had a level playing field instead of being gods.
Anyway...siege do damage..that wasnt what I asked for

You still don't get my point. This is about forcing people to spread out. If they don't spread out then yes, of course there will be players that build so much ultimate that they're practically gods, and thats the fault of the mindless mass of players that did not spread out

FENGRUSH · April 2015

vortexman11 wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

vortexman11 wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

vortexman11 wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

So you answer to spreading people out is to make the already powerful..even more godlike ?
Where as if we boost siege instead, no individual gains any more godlike powers then anyone else.

I propose flash bangs from the crown store.
Anyone using magelight and detect potions gets blinded for 10 seconds.
Anyone in the blast radius gets a <20m knock away + fall damage + offbalance + stun
:d

That does specifically what its supposed to do....force people apart and make them vulnerable.
You still have to pick them off.
Cant be blocked, purged, break...only dodge.

This does not add to the damage calcs like other aoes.
the zerg is blown apart and needs single target damage to finish them (aoe wont work).
It eliminates any outgoing aoes/dots/channels from the impacted group.
ie. it eliminates damage calcs from adding to the backlog and minimises lag.
[an antil-lag bomb]

What I proposed does not make the already powerful godlike, it gives the outnumbered a fighting chance

No ...it gives you AP farming godmode upon all noobs.

And the fact that 40 "noobs" (not calling anyone a noob, just quoting) can form up and crush anything if they know how to put up siege is better?

Nope....but neither is giving one person the ability to wipe them all out with one hit.
And needless to say one specific class/race/build will be much much better at it than anyone else.

I dont mind if EVERYONE can do it regardless of skill/level and all have a achance at the same AP reward.
But thats not what you are asking for.

EDIT misread your post....yes noob siege is much better then all that power in one persons hands or a limited few min maxers
Thats why al the OP players cried.....they suddenly had a level playing field instead of being gods.
Anyway...siege do damage..that wasnt what I asked for

You still don't get my point. This is about forcing people to spread out. If they don't spread out then yes, of course there will be players that build so much ultimate that they're practically gods, and thats the fault of the mindless mass of players that did not spread out

Agree there needs to be more of a deterrent. Devs wont go back this route, itd be glorious day indeed though. Theyre only lending aid to the blobs though minus the siege.

Cogo · April 2015

vortexman11 wrote: »

You're all going to hate me, and Im saying in advance that I accept that fact.

I've read alot of topics over the past few weeks from people giving various ways to "bust zergs" and cause people to spread out. First there was magicka detonation, Im not even going to comment on that skill as it is no where near what we expected it to be, then theres been the update to siege, but we're now seeing this has done nothing because spamming Purge/Efficient Purge/Cleanse makes it utterly useless. So I would like to give my own solution to this problem of stacking and "zerging" even though 99% of the population of the forums will hate me for it.

Bring back ultimate gain from AoE abilities.

I know you all hated it. The Impulse Impulse Batswarm Impulse Standard of Might. But lets look at it more closely.

What allowed players to gain such massive amounts of ultimate?
What prevented players from gaining such massive amounts of ultimate?

Let me answer this first question by using an example. Theres a stack of 15 players that 3 players are about to bomb. The 3 players are at an obvious disadvantage by numbers, YET due to the fact that they build ultimate off of their AoE abilities they're able to have more of a chance against such overwhelming numbers. Now, what does this cause that stack of 15 people to do? Well....you can't purge an ultimate, sure you could negate it, but the only real way to prevent that group from wiping is for them to SPREAD OUT.

Now the answer to that second question is simple, to prevent people from gaining massive amounts of ultimate allowing them to use powerful skills you simply don't get grouped up.

How would this help balance things out you might ask? Well its pretty obvious, the group in whatever fight with the least people, would be gaining more ultimate per person than the group with more people. Basically, the more outnumbered you are, the more ultimate you get.

This stops PvP from being a simple numbers game, because sure the increased siege damage was good, but if you have 10 people, and the enemy has 30 people, all that means is they have enough people to run just as much siege while have 20 others to do whatever.

Now! Let the hate begin! I just wanted to express my opinion even though you all think it's wrong.

You can buy "Zerg Buster" in the Crown Store! Win the war with a button click!

The Kittah is here to protect me from the evil moderators!

The_Drexill · April 2015

DAoC style AoE Mez + PBAoE bombs imo.

Joy_Division · April 2015

I'm pretty sure this will only make "pain trains" stronger as they will also reap the benefits of more ultimate gain. All these "solutions" that keep getting forwarded usually fail to recognize that anything a small group can do, so can a "zerg."

vortexman11 · April 2015

Joy_Division wrote: »

I'm pretty sure this will only make "pain trains" stronger as they will also reap the benefits of more ultimate gain. All these "solutions" that keep getting forwarded usually fail to recognize that anything a small group can do, so can a "zerg."

I don't think you fully read my post, the smaller group will always end up getting more ultimate per person, sure a zerg can do the same thing, but they'd end up getting less ultimate as they have less targets, in the current system with the Major/Minor Herosim buff you cannot gain ultimate any faster than anyone else, whether its 10 vs 20 or 10 vs 10.

What my post basically says is that when you are outnumbered if you can build ultimate from AoE's you'll end up getting more per person, and more in total due to having more targets

Poxheart · April 2015

Contrary to what you said in your first post, your suggestion is just a numbers game & this idea won't do anything to prevent people from stacking; rather it will just encourage it. The best way to counter the small stacked group is to hit it with a slightly larger stacked group. More raw damage from aoe spam & ultimates will wipe the smaller group before they can generate enough ultimate to counter it. So you respond by making your group larger & the cycle continues.

vortexman11 · April 2015

Poxheart wrote: »

Contrary to what you said in your first post, your suggestion is just a numbers game & this idea won't do anything to prevent people from stacking; rather it will just encourage it. The best way to counter the small stacked group is to hit it with a slightly larger stacked group. More raw damage from aoe spam & ultimates will wipe the smaller group before they can generate enough ultimate to counter it. So you respond by making your group larger & the cycle continues.

If stacked the smaller group will still generate more ultimate per person if both groups remain stacked. Theres no way to deny the fact that unless the larger group spreads out the smaller group would gain more ultimate and be placed on more even of a playing field. They'll be outnumbered, but have much stronger skills at their disposal more often