Champion system has given me no motivation to play

AbraXuSeXile · March 2015

I think i speak for all hardcore PvPers which this game has quite a lot of, when i say you've screwed us big time. None of us want some silly system what is never ending, we are maximisers and work hard as hell to get our character to be the very best it can be, Why would you even implement this system, what is the actual point of it, You say 1 CP per day why not cap it at that? Or simply give us 1 CP a day to keep everyone on par, Or just speed it up and let us maximise it.

I really don't see the point of nerfing us then giving us a system that will put us on par with our old characters, There is no need for this system and everyone was happy being without this system, You must understand this isn't 2003 when a never ending progression system was acceptable and everyone was duly motivated to keep ploughing on, MMO's are old now we've all done this before in other games. People want to end grinding and maximised characters then get on with business, be it trading, pvping, dungeons whatever people's poison is.

And it's not just the hardcore pvp'ers that get shafted, It's future players who are NEVER going to have the same champion points and will end up not being on the same turf as everyone else.

Casuals are not going to reach 1cp a day and will end up getting excluded from dungeons and trials.

Roleplayers are likely not going to get much CP and will likely get excluded from activities also not having an up to par character.

I'm too long in the tooth for this carrot on a stick crap, I just want to maximise my character then logon and play PvP.

And i don't care for anyone who says 'your not meant grind it just play' that's all well and good but some things give more CP than others, My usual day is logon and pvp then log off, But since patch i've had to go skyreach to keep competitive, and PvP gives absolutely nothing so some other grind spot will be found and i'll be forced to go there.

Also PvP sucks now, gg zos.

Roechacca · March 2015

Accurate post on my sentiments as well . This is a big ZOS middle finger directed at some of Us .

ShadowDisciple · March 2015

Only probleM i see is that ESO forces you to pve to be able to pvp...imo CP should be more easily obtained thru pvp. Increase CP xp gain in pvp and that should be ok.

AbraXuSeXile · March 2015

ShadowDisciple wrote: »

Only probleM i see is that ESO forces you to pve to be able to pvp...imo CP should be more easily obtained thru pvp. Increase CP xp gain in pvp and that should be ok.

It should actually be a system that ends some time this life time, its actually annoys me that ill never finish it.

Scotia · March 2015

This is a casual game imo, the champion system gives many players the ability to progress when at level cap, we already had a system called the Vet system that many did not like. There are many players that did not do the Silver and Gold and went to Craglorn and exploited the massive exp per hour to get to VR 14. This was not Zen's intent. Clearly this game is not for you, as we can consistently see that Zen does not want min/maxers and those that get to the top quickly. PVP imo as always been an afterthought in this game, nothing new.

Animal_Mother · March 2015

I feel abused by ZOS and ESO.

I'm told it will get better and for a while it does. Then something comes up and it gets bad again. And then I'm told it will get better.

I got this empty feeling entering Haderus the other day. All the familiar faces were gone. It was empty; stale.

I'm told it will get better. ESO is good for me - just ride out the bad spots; remember the good times. This is for the better.

r.jan_emailb16_ESO · March 2015

Problem with the CP system is very simple: it's too strong. 25% extra fire/shock/magic/whatever damage? More armor, more regen, less costs on everything? Huge shield when blocking? Boosts to every stat?

It's not like people stop getting stronger at some point. Yes, there's a diminishing return, but the overall result is still damn strong. And as it has been said before, I will never reach the point where I get all the passives I want/need. And the closer I get to that hypothetical point, the stronger I am compared to new players. Like it or not, at some point new players are getting excluded from vet dungeons etc., and there is just nothing they can do about it. Likewise they will have no chance in PvP.

Roechacca · March 2015

People are up in arms again and leaving . Best release the Tiger mount now . Throw a distraction .

Drazhar14 · March 2015

It's a great system for PvE, but not PvP. They should make the champion system only apply to PvE content. Either that, or make the bonuses from the champion system significantly less in strength.

AbraXuSeXile · March 2015

I dont see how its great for PvE, People will get excluded for not having enough points.

Bloodfang · March 2015

If you ask me, its best to make it on timer..Where 3 CP is max you can get in a day..

1 CP if you play 1 hour
2 CP if you play 2 hours
3 CP if you play 3 hours

There you go, plenty of motivation to log in..you wont have to worry about grinding xp..you will just play the damn game and stop looking at Champion UI every 5secs..

And about Enlightenment, it should activate only to those casuals who play less than 10 hours weekly, and it should allow them to get a few more CPs when they do play..

Digiman · March 2015

Mixed feelings. I feel the CP system was an excellent way to help get us stronger instead of keeping us capped at a level but at the same time nerfing us really skewed the system for PvP builds.

The PTS has been utter mess with the combat team utterly ignoring the advice, suggestions and testing from the people who dedicated their hard earned time they payed for playing instead testing a system being ignored.

Many of the problems and issues that are happening on live were brought up on the PTS and never addressed.

I guess we all have to agree that this CP system was never a addition but a complete overhaul of a nearly year long game. We payed for but got little compensation monentary wise for money we supported ZoS with.

Hopefully things will balance out, I am stick to Cyrodiil for grinding CP. The mobs aren't as strong and I can side quest with PvP.

Jando · March 2015

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

ShadowDisciple wrote: »

Only probleM i see is that ESO forces you to pve to be able to pvp...imo CP should be more easily obtained thru pvp. Increase CP xp gain in pvp and that should be ok.

It should actually be a system that ends some time this life time, its actually annoys me that ill never finish it.

I agree. My proposal for the Champion System can be found here:

forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/155768/the-champion-system-its-problems-and-a-proposed-solution#latest

Lava_Croft · March 2015

While overall a very nice piece of work, the Champion System has been designed without a single regard for the PvP side of ESO. No sane designer would come up with such ridiculously overpowered buffs and think it would not horribly skew the already questionable balance in Cyrodiil.

r.jan_emailb16_ESO · March 2015

I also like it how I get punished xp-wise when I'm playing in a group bigger than two.

Roechacca · March 2015

Getting one more toon to VR14 that's only 50k xp away then I'm done . The hell with CP

ginoboehm · March 2015

i will quit/only play casual without investing money in this game because champion system will be abused and makes people so much more powerful many people i talked to will quit too or just stoping progression oriented gameplay. the people who love champion system do not grasp that investing more time in a mindless activity like grinding should not net a more powerful player.

Personofsecrets · March 2015

My issue is that experience gain is so low everywhere that I don't want to play with my guild unless I am enlightened. I also don't want to play if I just got enlightened as I want that enlightenment value to build.

Grim13 · March 2015

Agreed, OP.

I can barely bring myself to log in anymore...

They nerf my character so that I can rebuild using CP, they completely change the balance of the game, and they made it so PvP grants very little CP... roflmao.

There are people grinding CP at a rate that will likely see them hit max by year's end.

Honestly, I feel alienated... and my disinterest grows daily as I slip further behind.

technohic · March 2015

You know whats worse? CPs apply to non-VR characters so you cannot get away from the system by using an alt.

nerevarine1138 · March 2015

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

we are maximisers

And this is the heart of the problem (not unique to PvP).

A very small subset of gamers are so obsessed with having the biggest numbers on their imaginary charts that they literally cannot handle a system that emphasizes constant and varied character progression. And it's really annoying.

People keep complaining that ESO is trying too hard to be like other games. But the instant the developers actually add features that create new styles of play (Justice System, Champion System, etc.), people throw fits on the forums because it no longer resembles the old familiar MMO styles.

Chesimac · March 2015

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno
Is something actually going to be done about the champion system? Its very apparent now that most of your playerbase doesn't like it, are you going to sit back and wait 5 months like you usually do or actually do something?

Roechacca · March 2015

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

we are maximisers

And this is the heart of the problem (not unique to PvP).

A very small subset of gamers are so obsessed with having the biggest numbers on their imaginary charts that they literally cannot handle a system that emphasizes constant and varied character progression. And it's really annoying.

People keep complaining that ESO is trying too hard to be like other games. But the instant the developers actually add features that create new styles of play (Justice System, Champion System, etc.), people throw fits on the forums because it no longer resembles the old familiar MMO styles.

If it ain't broke , don't fix it . Or try to sell it as "inovative & new" . Because it's neither . It's horizontal progression with a ribbon on the box . People that have been playing MMO's forever and a day have seen every gimmick out there and don't need the same used car salesman telling Us it's some new ground breaking feature .

nerevarine1138 · March 2015

Chesimac wrote: »

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno
Is something actually going to be done about the champion system? Its very apparent now that most of your playerbase doesn't like it, are you going to sit back and wait 5 months like you usually do or actually do something?

This was implemented because the playerbase asked for a change. There are some kinks that need to be ironed out, but they aren't changing back to a linear progression with a clear stopping point. Nor should they.

AbraXuSeXile · March 2015

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

we are maximisers

And this is the heart of the problem (not unique to PvP).

A very small subset of gamers are so obsessed with having the biggest numbers on their imaginary charts that they literally cannot handle a system that emphasizes constant and varied character progression. And it's really annoying.

People keep complaining that ESO is trying too hard to be like other games. But the instant the developers actually add features that create new styles of play (Justice System, Champion System, etc.), people throw fits on the forums because it no longer resembles the old familiar MMO styles.

Its called being competitive, which isnt a small number of people. Anyone who is in a proper pvp or pve guild is a maximiser to be the best.

And the justice system and champion system has been done on many other games under different names, its nothing new except that they was completable in this life time.

AbraXuSeXile · March 2015

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Chesimac wrote: »

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno
Is something actually going to be done about the champion system? Its very apparent now that most of your playerbase doesn't like it, are you going to sit back and wait 5 months like you usually do or actually do something?

This was implemented because the playerbase asked for a change. There are some kinks that need to be ironed out, but they aren't changing back to a linear progression with a clear stopping point. Nor should they.

Show me where people asked for a system where they would take our stats and make us get them over the course of the next 10 years lol.

Undaunted grind was hard enough on the pvpers but we did it, but this system is baws.

Roechacca · March 2015

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

we are maximisers

And this is the heart of the problem (not unique to PvP).

A very small subset of gamers are so obsessed with having the biggest numbers on their imaginary charts that they literally cannot handle a system that emphasizes constant and varied character progression. And it's really annoying.

People keep complaining that ESO is trying too hard to be like other games. But the instant the developers actually add features that create new styles of play (Justice System, Champion System, etc.), people throw fits on the forums because it no longer resembles the old familiar MMO styles.

Its called being competitive, which isnt a small number of people. Anyone who is in a proper pvp or pve guild is a maximiser to be the best.

And the justice system and champion system has been done on many other games under different names, its nothing new except that they was completable in this life time.

This guy gets it ^

nerevarine1138 · March 2015

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

we are maximisers

And this is the heart of the problem (not unique to PvP).

A very small subset of gamers are so obsessed with having the biggest numbers on their imaginary charts that they literally cannot handle a system that emphasizes constant and varied character progression. And it's really annoying.

People keep complaining that ESO is trying too hard to be like other games. But the instant the developers actually add features that create new styles of play (Justice System, Champion System, etc.), people throw fits on the forums because it no longer resembles the old familiar MMO styles.

Its called being competitive, which isnt a small number of people. Anyone who is in a proper pvp or pve guild is a maximiser to be the best.

And the justice system and champion system has been done on many other games under different names, its nothing new except that they was completable in this life time.

And again, this is a change in the way that many MMO veterans approach their game. But no, most players aren't as "competitive" as you think. Most MMO players never see most endgame content. And this game is for everyone to enjoy, not just the min/maxers.

The CS takes the game closer to an Elder Scrolls game, which is a good thing. Your adventure in the prior games never ended; you just kept progressing. It's worked for years, but people need to give it a chance in an MMO setting instead of instantly declaring it terrible because it breaks with the traditional model.

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Chesimac wrote: »

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno
Is something actually going to be done about the champion system? Its very apparent now that most of your playerbase doesn't like it, are you going to sit back and wait 5 months like you usually do or actually do something?

This was implemented because the playerbase asked for a change. There are some kinks that need to be ironed out, but they aren't changing back to a linear progression with a clear stopping point. Nor should they.

Show me where people asked for a system where they would take our stats and make us get them over the course of the next 10 years lol.

Undaunted grind was hard enough on the pvpers but we did it, but this system is baws.

Most ES veterans asked for a system that was more open and less of a definitive, level-capped endgame. And you don't have to "earn back" your stats. My characters are stronger now than they were pre-patch. If yours aren't, change your build.

AltusVenifus · March 2015

I am frustrated as well. I have PVP'ed for 20+ hours since release. I have earned 4 CP. PVE grinders have made 10x the amount...

Roechacca · March 2015

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

we are maximisers

And this is the heart of the problem (not unique to PvP).

A very small subset of gamers are so obsessed with having the biggest numbers on their imaginary charts that they literally cannot handle a system that emphasizes constant and varied character progression. And it's really annoying.

People keep complaining that ESO is trying too hard to be like other games. But the instant the developers actually add features that create new styles of play (Justice System, Champion System, etc.), people throw fits on the forums because it no longer resembles the old familiar MMO styles.

Its called being competitive, which isnt a small number of people. Anyone who is in a proper pvp or pve guild is a maximiser to be the best.

And the justice system and champion system has been done on many other games under different names, its nothing new except that they was completable in this life time.

And again, this is a change in the way that many MMO veterans approach their game. But no, most players aren't as "competitive" as you think. Most MMO players never see most endgame content. And this game is for everyone to enjoy, not just the min/maxers.

The CS takes the game closer to an Elder Scrolls game, which is a good thing. Your adventure in the prior games never ended; you just kept progressing. It's worked for years, but people need to give it a chance in an MMO setting instead of instantly declaring it terrible because it breaks with the traditional model.

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Chesimac wrote: »

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno
Is something actually going to be done about the champion system? Its very apparent now that most of your playerbase doesn't like it, are you going to sit back and wait 5 months like you usually do or actually do something?

This was implemented because the playerbase asked for a change. There are some kinks that need to be ironed out, but they aren't changing back to a linear progression with a clear stopping point. Nor should they.

Show me where people asked for a system where they would take our stats and make us get them over the course of the next 10 years lol.

Undaunted grind was hard enough on the pvpers but we did it, but this system is baws.

Most ES veterans asked for a system that was more open and less of a definitive, level-capped endgame. And you don't have to "earn back" your stats. My characters are stronger now than they were pre-patch. If yours aren't, change your build.

Where are you getting this "most" from ?

nerevarine1138 · March 2015

roechacca wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

we are maximisers

And this is the heart of the problem (not unique to PvP).

A very small subset of gamers are so obsessed with having the biggest numbers on their imaginary charts that they literally cannot handle a system that emphasizes constant and varied character progression. And it's really annoying.

People keep complaining that ESO is trying too hard to be like other games. But the instant the developers actually add features that create new styles of play (Justice System, Champion System, etc.), people throw fits on the forums because it no longer resembles the old familiar MMO styles.

Its called being competitive, which isnt a small number of people. Anyone who is in a proper pvp or pve guild is a maximiser to be the best.

And the justice system and champion system has been done on many other games under different names, its nothing new except that they was completable in this life time.

And again, this is a change in the way that many MMO veterans approach their game. But no, most players aren't as "competitive" as you think. Most MMO players never see most endgame content. And this game is for everyone to enjoy, not just the min/maxers.

The CS takes the game closer to an Elder Scrolls game, which is a good thing. Your adventure in the prior games never ended; you just kept progressing. It's worked for years, but people need to give it a chance in an MMO setting instead of instantly declaring it terrible because it breaks with the traditional model.

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Chesimac wrote: »

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno
Is something actually going to be done about the champion system? Its very apparent now that most of your playerbase doesn't like it, are you going to sit back and wait 5 months like you usually do or actually do something?

This was implemented because the playerbase asked for a change. There are some kinks that need to be ironed out, but they aren't changing back to a linear progression with a clear stopping point. Nor should they.

Show me where people asked for a system where they would take our stats and make us get them over the course of the next 10 years lol.

Undaunted grind was hard enough on the pvpers but we did it, but this system is baws.

Most ES veterans asked for a system that was more open and less of a definitive, level-capped endgame. And you don't have to "earn back" your stats. My characters are stronger now than they were pre-patch. If yours aren't, change your build.

Where are you getting this "most" from ?

These forums were a major source of the feedback. So were the Reddit AMAs, in-game feedback, etc. The developers were very up-front about why they were changing the leveling system, and it makes sense.