Slurg wrote: »

newtinmpls wrote: »

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

Players who do not want to "steal" from NPC owned objects should be able to check a box that prevents them from interacting with objects owned by NPCs thereby confirming their choice to not be a thief under the justice system

I can see the addon should be called "external conscience"

It would seem some people do need extra mechanics in place to protect them from themselves if they really don't want to steal but they cant seem to stop themselves.

Asking ZOS to add this feature probably would take months but I like this idea of an add on performing this feature for the minority of players who don't want to steal ever but sometimes find themselves stealing anyway, somehow.

I wonder is an add on for this possible?

http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info943-NoAccidentalStealing.html

wraith808 wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

newtinmpls wrote: »

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

Players who do not want to "steal" from NPC owned objects should be able to check a box that prevents them from interacting with objects owned by NPCs thereby confirming their choice to not be a thief under the justice system

I can see the addon should be called "external conscience"

It would seem some people do need extra mechanics in place to protect them from themselves if they really don't want to steal but they cant seem to stop themselves.

Asking ZOS to add this feature probably would take months but I like this idea of an add on performing this feature for the minority of players who don't want to steal ever but sometimes find themselves stealing anyway, somehow.

I wonder is an add on for this possible?

http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info943-NoAccidentalStealing.html

Well then great, we already have a solution for those people who need an external control to keep them from stealing! I know some people hate add-ons but it seems to be the best option for the minority who would need these types of controls in order to truly opt out of the justice system at this point. Problem solved!

Or am I misreading the title of this thread and people really just want to loot without consequence? If so I think there's nothing to be done about that and it's time to move to the acceptance stage.

Nestor wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

Or am I misreading the title of this thread and people really just want to loot without consequence? If so I think there's nothing to be done about that and it's time to move to the acceptance stage.

If I choose to steal then I want to be able to and I will deal with the consequences and outcomes. But inadvertent clicking on something and getting nailed for stealing when there is no intent is another matter

But that add on lets you add an extra key press to confirm stealing. So inadvertent stealing is preventable. Quote below is from the add on page:

Stealing becomes possible if one of the following conditions are met:
You are hidden/stealthed.
The "Confirm Stealing"-key is pressed. The keybind can be set via ESC -> Controls -> Confirm Stealing (at the very bottom).
You doubletap the Interaction-key. (Disabled by default*)

I used to be a big advocate of asking changes to the default UI back when this was always going to be a pay to play game. Even then most concerns with the UI went unaddressed. And when changes were made, we ended up with things like pressing an extra key to delete mail AFTER we already had taken the attachments, or notifications of completion times for everyone in our guilds, and a lot of us had to download add ons to get rid of that! I'd rather not see us all get an extra key press forcing us to confirm "do you really want to steal this item", thanks.

Nestor wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

Or am I misreading the title of this thread and people really just want to loot without consequence? If so I think there's nothing to be done about that and it's time to move to the acceptance stage.

If I choose to steal then I want to be able to and I will deal with the consequences and outcomes. But inadvertent clicking on something and getting nailed for stealing when there is no intent is another matter

You've been told two ways to make that not a possibility. So... why is thread still going on?

BBSooner wrote: »

I've seen mentioned in chat that most provisioning mats can be bought from grocers, brewers, chefs, etc. So we can either buy our goods like civilized people or steal them like street rats. If you can get a hold of purple recipe ingredients that way, dunno.

LOL why yes - for 150 gold each. I will be stealing loads and selling for 75. :-P

I got the addon and it seems to work so far. Its pretty pathetic that I had to go get an outside the game addon to fix a problem the game designer caused.

Especially when it was so easy to fix it right themselves. Whats really lame is using the same key to open a door, use a table and loot a box to also pick up an item laying on a table. There should be a separate key for stealing. Since its part of a NEW system then let the stupid thing have its own key. I don't want to steal so I wont push the steal button.

But having that tick box like I mentioned is simpler and solves it all.

"No Loot Prompt For Owned Items" Is A Sensible Option To Request

There are many important NPCs, including merchants and bankers, who are standing next to or even actively using containers that contain owned items, and given the sometimes dodgy nature of the third-person cursor, it's very easy to activate the container instead of the NPC, especially when the NPC is surrounded by a crowd of players.

If some of us never want to steal and don't want to be bothered by prompts to steal, WHY ARGUE AGAINST THAT?

If you don't want to opt out, fine. Don't, and go your merry way. But please don't jump on people for wanting to eliminate what is, for them, a nuisance from the game.

I have some characters who are thieves and some who aren't. When I'm playing a character I don't want stealing, I'd rather not be bothered by prompts to steal.

There is already an option not to attack innocent NPCs. The "No Loot Prompt For Owned Items" option could be right below that.

Not complicated, not unreasonable, and not cause for giving people a hard time.

Majic wrote: »

"No Loot Prompt For Owned Items" Is A Sensible Option To Request

There are many important NPCs, including merchants and bankers, who are standing next to or even actively using containers that contain owned items, and given the sometimes dodgy nature of the third-person cursor, it's very easy to activate the container instead of the NPC, especially when the NPC is surrounded by a crowd of players.

If some of us never want to steal and don't want to be bothered by prompts to steal, WHY ARGUE AGAINST THAT?

If you don't want to opt out, fine. Don't, and go your merry way. But please don't jump on people for wanting to eliminate what is, for them, a nuisance from the game.

I have some characters who are thieves and some who aren't. When I'm playing a character I don't want stealing, I'd rather not be bothered by prompts to steal.

There is already an option not to attack innocent NPCs. The "No Loot Prompt For Owned Items" option could be right below that.

Not complicated, not unreasonable, and not cause for giving people a hard time.

sadly I think some of those jumping on people asking for that option , are just waiting for the PvP portion of the justice system so they can jump on the players who accidently "steal" something in game do to latency, lag , or the camera messing up on them . I would guess that they expect those players to be less skilled at PvP therefore making them easy kills for them so they do not have to deal with players who actually are skilled at PvP and can beat them.

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

Majic wrote: »

"No Loot Prompt For Owned Items" Is A Sensible Option To Request

There are many important NPCs, including merchants and bankers, who are standing next to or even actively using containers that contain owned items, and given the sometimes dodgy nature of the third-person cursor, it's very easy to activate the container instead of the NPC, especially when the NPC is surrounded by a crowd of players.

If some of us never want to steal and don't want to be bothered by prompts to steal, WHY ARGUE AGAINST THAT?

If you don't want to opt out, fine. Don't, and go your merry way. But please don't jump on people for wanting to eliminate what is, for them, a nuisance from the game.

I have some characters who are thieves and some who aren't. When I'm playing a character I don't want stealing, I'd rather not be bothered by prompts to steal.

There is already an option not to attack innocent NPCs. The "No Loot Prompt For Owned Items" option could be right below that.

Not complicated, not unreasonable, and not cause for giving people a hard time.

sadly I think some of those jumping on people asking for that option , are just waiting for the PvP portion of the justice system so they can jump on the players who accidently "steal" something in game do to latency, lag , or the camera messing up on them . I would guess that they expect those players to be less skilled at PvP therefore making them easy kills for them so they do not have to deal with players who actually are skilled at PvP and can beat them.

What? Accidentally stealing one item is not going to put anyone in KOS status so that argument doesn't hold up. The worst that happens is a guard comes up and confiscates stolen goods and they pay a fine. There is absolutely no reason for you to attack PVP players over this.

I don't see a lot of people "jumping on" people worried about accidentally stealing in this thread. I see a lot of suggestions being made about using work arounds and add ons to get the intended result. Let's be realistic, it's not likely that the system is going to change overnight to accommodate this request. We all need to adapt to the new game mechanics.

Nestor wrote: »

wraith808 wrote: »

You've been told two ways to make that not a possibility. So... why is thread still going on?

It's poor game design to ding someone for stealing if they click on something by accident because the camera does not point to an area right in front of you. I was looking at the Enchanting table, but instead activated a container right next to the table. And again, even after adjusting my stance at the enchanting table I activated the container. I never had a chance to not open the lock before I was dinged for stealing. Like I said, in previous games I could activate a lock, but not do anything with it, right in front of a guard, and not be dinged for stealing.

Ah, it was a lockbox you activated, right? Yeah, I noticed last night that you get dinged just for activating one even if you exit out without unlocking it.

Nestor wrote: »

wraith808 wrote: »

You've been told two ways to make that not a possibility. So... why is thread still going on?

It's poor game design to ding someone for stealing if they click on something by accident because the camera does not point to an area right in front of you. I was looking at the Enchanting table, but instead activated a container right next to the table. And again, even after adjusting my stance at the enchanting table I activated the container. I never had a chance to not open the lock before I was dinged for stealing. Like I said, in previous games I could activate a lock, but not do anything with it, right in front of a guard, and not be dinged for stealing.

Ok, so in that one case you were obviously dinged when you shouldn't have been, and you should /bug or /feedback that. But what about the other cases?

And I'd not noticed this because... well the add-on works well. Though you might disagree with it, perhaps that's the way to go in the meantime until it's resolved?

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

ZOS , the various ISPs , and us (the players) can only do so much about latency and lag .

For me (having a not-exactly-top-of-the-line computer) my lag is worst when there are detailed visuals; someone casting something sparkly in a bank can screw my characters interactions up a LOT (huge lags, pauses, things happening WAY after I did them).

For me, one effective solution is to toggle the graphics down to low (medium is the BEST I can ever due). In bright/sparkly dungeons like Toothmaul gully it's the difference between effective and dead. So I'd urge you to try that.

I agree its poor and very badly implemented In other words another major...BS! Looks like that game's masterminds think that only 12y old kids playing here. They should improve other things like solo content for VRs etc etc and not spending their time with crap contents like this
Its good that this game is going free cause i wouldn't bear the thought to spent another cent after this

wraith808 wrote: »

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

wraith808 wrote: »

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

Players who do not want to "steal" from NPC owned objects should be able to check a box that prevents them from interacting with objects owned by NPCs thereby confirming their choice to not be a thief under the justice system

Did you not see this?

UrQuan wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

The option to "never steal" should be a toggleable option. There is no question about this.

There is an option. It's called not stealing.

There's an option to toggle the ability to kill NPCs. I don't see this as being very different. Both could be done by accident.

How can you steal accidentally when there's this toggle:

UrQuan wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

The option to "never steal" should be a toggleable option. There is no question about this.

It is. Well, the toggle is actually more of a "never steal unless you confirm that you want to steal" option. Under the Auto Loot toggle is an Auto Loot Stolen Items toggle. Set it to off and you'll never steal anything without having to hit E once to loot, and then confirm that you want to steal the item by highlighting it and hitting E again, or by hitting R to steal everything.

E - E quick presses. You have to press the same key to search and loot, right? If they were different keys then I think it would be less of a chance.

I get that you may think it's unlikely that people could accidentally steal but do you think there is a reason the toggle shouldn't be added other than "players could just not steal".

No, it's E, then R... Unless you happen to have the item highlighted with your mouse, but does that actually happen to anyone when you're running around?

yes I did , but that does not address hitting the "E" key twice while having something highlighted in the loot window by accident . That is something that a few have had happen to them .

the use of an addon is not a viable solution for everyone , but adding in a setting that makes it so that a player can not interact with any object flagged as owned would work for everyone including console players who may not have access to addons for the game (do not play on console so I do not know if they have that option yet)

It's 'E' then "R' as explained above.

reread what I posted you are missing the part about having something highlighted in the open loot window which gets looted if the "E" key is pressed , while the "R" key loots everything.

Slurg wrote: »

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

Majic wrote: »

"No Loot Prompt For Owned Items" Is A Sensible Option To Request

There are many important NPCs, including merchants and bankers, who are standing next to or even actively using containers that contain owned items, and given the sometimes dodgy nature of the third-person cursor, it's very easy to activate the container instead of the NPC, especially when the NPC is surrounded by a crowd of players.

If some of us never want to steal and don't want to be bothered by prompts to steal, WHY ARGUE AGAINST THAT?

If you don't want to opt out, fine. Don't, and go your merry way. But please don't jump on people for wanting to eliminate what is, for them, a nuisance from the game.

I have some characters who are thieves and some who aren't. When I'm playing a character I don't want stealing, I'd rather not be bothered by prompts to steal.

There is already an option not to attack innocent NPCs. The "No Loot Prompt For Owned Items" option could be right below that.

Not complicated, not unreasonable, and not cause for giving people a hard time.

sadly I think some of those jumping on people asking for that option , are just waiting for the PvP portion of the justice system so they can jump on the players who accidently "steal" something in game do to latency, lag , or the camera messing up on them . I would guess that they expect those players to be less skilled at PvP therefore making them easy kills for them so they do not have to deal with players who actually are skilled at PvP and can beat them.

What? Accidentally stealing one item is not going to put anyone in KOS status so that argument doesn't hold up. The worst that happens is a guard comes up and confiscates stolen goods and they pay a fine. There is absolutely no reason for you to attack PVP players over this.

I don't see a lot of people "jumping on" people worried about accidentally stealing in this thread. I see a lot of suggestions being made about using work arounds and add ons to get the intended result. Let's be realistic, it's not likely that the system is going to change overnight to accommodate this request. We all need to adapt to the new game mechanics.

I did state that I think it is only some of those jumping on people not every person waiting for the PvP portion to go live . In my opinion most PvPers want good competition from those they face while a very small number want to use any means to grief other players and then flee when actual competition shows up .

A question for those against having the option to not be able to interact with "owned" objects . Why do you not want players to have that option ?

as for the Addon option how is that going to help out console players , since to the best of my knowledge console players will not have the use of addons .

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

wraith808 wrote: »

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

wraith808 wrote: »

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

Players who do not want to "steal" from NPC owned objects should be able to check a box that prevents them from interacting with objects owned by NPCs thereby confirming their choice to not be a thief under the justice system

Did you not see this?

UrQuan wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

The option to "never steal" should be a toggleable option. There is no question about this.

There is an option. It's called not stealing.

There's an option to toggle the ability to kill NPCs. I don't see this as being very different. Both could be done by accident.

How can you steal accidentally when there's this toggle:

UrQuan wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

The option to "never steal" should be a toggleable option. There is no question about this.

It is. Well, the toggle is actually more of a "never steal unless you confirm that you want to steal" option. Under the Auto Loot toggle is an Auto Loot Stolen Items toggle. Set it to off and you'll never steal anything without having to hit E once to loot, and then confirm that you want to steal the item by highlighting it and hitting E again, or by hitting R to steal everything.

E - E quick presses. You have to press the same key to search and loot, right? If they were different keys then I think it would be less of a chance.

I get that you may think it's unlikely that people could accidentally steal but do you think there is a reason the toggle shouldn't be added other than "players could just not steal".

No, it's E, then R... Unless you happen to have the item highlighted with your mouse, but does that actually happen to anyone when you're running around?

yes I did , but that does not address hitting the "E" key twice while having something highlighted in the loot window by accident . That is something that a few have had happen to them .

the use of an addon is not a viable solution for everyone , but adding in a setting that makes it so that a player can not interact with any object flagged as owned would work for everyone including console players who may not have access to addons for the game (do not play on console so I do not know if they have that option yet)

It's 'E' then "R' as explained above.

reread what I posted you are missing the part about having something highlighted in the open loot window which gets looted if the "E" key is pressed , while the "R" key loots everything.

Slurg wrote: »

DanielMaxwell wrote: »

Majic wrote: »

"No Loot Prompt For Owned Items" Is A Sensible Option To Request

There are many important NPCs, including merchants and bankers, who are standing next to or even actively using containers that contain owned items, and given the sometimes dodgy nature of the third-person cursor, it's very easy to activate the container instead of the NPC, especially when the NPC is surrounded by a crowd of players.

If some of us never want to steal and don't want to be bothered by prompts to steal, WHY ARGUE AGAINST THAT?

If you don't want to opt out, fine. Don't, and go your merry way. But please don't jump on people for wanting to eliminate what is, for them, a nuisance from the game.

I have some characters who are thieves and some who aren't. When I'm playing a character I don't want stealing, I'd rather not be bothered by prompts to steal.

There is already an option not to attack innocent NPCs. The "No Loot Prompt For Owned Items" option could be right below that.

Not complicated, not unreasonable, and not cause for giving people a hard time.

sadly I think some of those jumping on people asking for that option , are just waiting for the PvP portion of the justice system so they can jump on the players who accidently "steal" something in game do to latency, lag , or the camera messing up on them . I would guess that they expect those players to be less skilled at PvP therefore making them easy kills for them so they do not have to deal with players who actually are skilled at PvP and can beat them.

What? Accidentally stealing one item is not going to put anyone in KOS status so that argument doesn't hold up. The worst that happens is a guard comes up and confiscates stolen goods and they pay a fine. There is absolutely no reason for you to attack PVP players over this.

I don't see a lot of people "jumping on" people worried about accidentally stealing in this thread. I see a lot of suggestions being made about using work arounds and add ons to get the intended result. Let's be realistic, it's not likely that the system is going to change overnight to accommodate this request. We all need to adapt to the new game mechanics.

I did state that I think it is only some of those jumping on people not every person waiting for the PvP portion to go live . In my opinion most PvPers want good competition from those they face while a very small number want to use any means to grief other players and then flee when actual competition shows up .

A question for those against having the option to not be able to interact with "owned" objects . Why do you not want players to have that option ?

as for the Addon option how is that going to help out console players , since to the best of my knowledge console players will not have the use of addons .

I don't want players to have that option for a few reasons:

1. It's lazy.
2. Waste of developer resources.
3. It's lazy.
4. Players should take responsibility for their own actions. The penalties aren't steep enough that "accidental stealing" is an issue.
5. It's lazy.

@nerevarine1138 at least you are willing say something.

Anything that might retain players is not a waste of developer resources

Is it the players fault when they try to interact with a vendor who has alot of "owned" items spaced around them and the vendor is scripted to move frequently with in a confined space making it a hit or miss when you press the "E" key and end up stealing a item instead of opening the vendor chat window ?

I do not think that is the players fault and the players should not be dinged by the justice system for it.

Enlarging the vendors interaction sphere would make it impossible for those who do want to "steal" those items to do so . It would also take longer to remove all of the items that would be subject to such accidental "stealing" then to code the toggle accessed via game settings.

Adding in a toggle command that prevents a player from interacting with any "owned" objects would allow those who wish to "steal" to do so while preventing those who do not wish to from doing so , also since it would be a toggle players could turn it on/off based off of what they are doing , meaning if you decide that you want to try your luck at "stealing" from the various "owned" objects in town you can turn the toggle off , and then turn it back on when done . The toggle should never be able to remove any bounty or heat generated as that would lead to it being abused.

FYI I do not need the toggle or the addon to prevent me from "stealing" from NPCs , but I do realize that others my need it , or want it as a safe guard against things beyond their control . I also believe this would be a benefit to console players who do not have access to UI mods . ( to the best of my knowledge the console player will not have access to mods for the games UI )