Soooo...no opt out for the Justice System?

Jennifur_Vultee · January 2015

I remember saying many times I didn't want to participate in the justice system and every time someone would say, "If you don't want to participate you can just opt out." I tried the public test server today and I have the option in gameplay settings to "Prevent Attacking Innocents" yet no option to "Turn Justice System off". So I guess the "opt out" people kept talking about was basically "Don't loot anything ever again outside mobs and dungeons." I have a provisioning character who's materials will all go bad once the new patch goes live so I guess I have no choice but to run dungeons for provisioning materials since I can no longer get them in towns in the hundreds of containers there.

I did try the theft thing and had accumulated 15 lockpicks, was spotted by one random maid and was confronted by the next guard I came close to, I had to pay a 5 gold fine and lost the lockpicks. All lockpicks, provisioning/crafting materials I saw were steal only, as were recipes and racial style motifs. So I'm guessing those will now be in the cash shop as "convience items" for people like me who don't want to spend half the day trying to steal provisioning/crafting materials just to lose them because one person spots you.

Iago · January 2015

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

I remember saying many times I didn't want to participate in the justice system and every time someone would say, "If you don't want to participate you can just opt out." I tried the public test server today and I have the option in gameplay settings to "Prevent Attacking Innocents" yet no option to "Turn Justice System off". So I guess the "opt out" people kept talking about was basically "Don't loot anything ever again outside mobs and dungeons." I have a provisioning character who's materials will all go bad once the new patch goes live so I guess I have no choice but to run dungeons for provisioning materials since I can no longer get them in towns in the hundreds of containers there.

I did try the theft thing and had accumulated 15 lockpicks, was spotted by one random maid and was confronted by the next guard I came close to, I had to pay a 5 gold fine and lost the lockpicks. All lockpicks, provisioning/crafting materials I saw were steal only, as were recipes and racial style motifs. So I'm guessing those will now be in the cash shop as "convience items" for people like me who don't want to spend half the day trying to steal provisioning/crafting materials just to lose them because one person spots you.

no way man.........

BBSooner · January 2015

I've seen mentioned in chat that most provisioning mats can be bought from grocers, brewers, chefs, etc. So we can either buy our goods like civilized people or steal them like street rats. If you can get a hold of purple recipe ingredients that way, dunno.

Lynnessa · January 2015

There's no way that crafting materials and the like will be steal-only. It'll be okay, OP. Take a deep breath and relax

UrQuan · January 2015

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

So I guess the "opt out" people kept talking about was basically "Don't loot anything ever again outside mobs and dungeons."

Yup, that's exactly how you opt out of it.

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

I have a provisioning character who's materials will all go bad once the new patch goes live so I guess I have no choice but to run dungeons for provisioning materials since I can no longer get them in towns in the hundreds of containers there.

Nope. First off, not all of your materials will go stale, and the ones that do can be sold to vendors. Second, all provisioning materials (except for the rare ones that are the equivalent of tomatoes and such pre 1.6) can now be purchased from grocers, brewers, and cooks, so there's no need to run dungeons for provisioning materials if you don't want to. I haven't checked the PTS yet, but the devs have said that the prices the stale ingredients sell for should be enough for people to replace them with new ingredients.

Heck, one good way of getting provisioning materials is by doing provisioning writs. You get back way more in materials than you put into them, and apparently in 1.6 you get a chance to get rare ingredients from them. So do a writ, get the ingredients from it as a reward, and spend the gold that you get from it on more ingredients.

Robbmrp · January 2015

Jennifur_Vultee wrote: »

no option to "Turn Justice System off".

Yet another example of something we can buy in the Crown Store....

DanielMaxwell · January 2015

Lynnessa wrote: »

There's no way that crafting materials and the like will be steal-only. It'll be okay, OP. Take a deep breath and relax

do not count on that , making crafting mats for provisioning , and alchemy have low drop rates while being "steal only" inside towns will make those items a good candidate for the cash shop . Anything that the management of ZOS thinks will sell in the cash shop will eventually end up there .

I would not be surprised to see the spawn rates for all crafting mats get altered to the point of buying a random crafting mat box from the cash shop becoming the best way to level or use the various crafting skills

spryler · January 2015

No, only some of Tamriel's containers are for theft. There are still (supposed to be) lots of containers that are non-theft that still provide all the necessary mats.

To opt-out as you put it, you literally just don't steal anything. The only disadvantage is you have to watch for the red icon before you open containers.

Vyle_Byte · January 2015

As a Provisioner, I have to say I am not very happy with the Justice system's 'every damn container in the world is now considered stealing'. Have been on the PTS and I, personally think there is much too much 'red'. There are too many NPCs around. I don't want to be a thief. That's not my thing.

Buy everything from a grocer? Bah! Do writs? lol No thanks, maybe had writs been around before my provisioning was 50. It sucks, period. There are some of us that thought 'opting out' meant we could carry on with our normal game lives but this system makes that impossible.

On a side note, for new players.. we who have been here this past year have had a major advantage. We could loot anything and everything we wanted, all the motifs, all the materials we ever wanted with no repercussions. New players are going to come in and have to either be thieves and risk losing it all, or save up months of play time moneys to get what they want/need.

yodased · January 2015

It comes down to the fact that the game has changed significantly from what you are used to.

There is no 'normal' pre 1.6 game life, it doesn't exist. The game is now (well soon to be) this, not that.

What you are 'used' to doing pre 1.6 is considered stealing in 1.6 there is no way around that.

In every other ES game it was this way as well, it honestly should have been this way the entire game, but it wasn't. Now it is.

Sounds harsh, but its a reality. There is nothing we can do to change it and they sure aren't going back to the way it was, so adapt and survive.

Vyle_Byte · January 2015

yodased wrote: »

It comes down to the fact that the game has changed significantly from what you are used to.

There is no 'normal' pre 1.6 game life, it doesn't exist. The game is now (well soon to be) this, not that.

What you are 'used' to doing pre 1.6 is considered stealing in 1.6 there is no way around that.

In every other ES game it was this way as well, it honestly should have been this way the entire game, but it wasn't. Now it is.

Sounds harsh, but its a reality. There is nothing we can do to change it and they sure aren't going back to the way it was, so adapt and survive.

True that. However, they wanted feedback and our opinions so I'll happily give my voice on the matter lol!

LasurArkinshade · January 2015

The notion that opting out of the justice system would be a way for you to steal stuff without actual consequences is... well, ridiculous. Seriously - that makes no sense. It'd defeat the entire point of the system - few people would willingly enable an optional feature that lets them get arrested when they could just do it without consequence by disabling it.

When they said you could opt out of the justice system it always seemed fairly clear to me that they meant you could enable an option to avoid accidentally committing crimes - which is what they did with the option to disable attacking innocents.

fougerec99b16_ESO · January 2015

I don't steal anything but I did accidentally kill someone's livestock and it was awesome. Bad guy moved, arrow went wide, killed a cow and ended up a fugitive from justice living in the woods until the heat died down.

That is exactly what I want in an Elder Scrolls game and what I hoped the Justice System would allow for.

Rebeccas04nub18_ESO · January 2015

The problem is, about 95% of the containers in a city, town, business or abode are steal-only containers. I'm REALLY hoping ZOS cuts this back to no more than 1/2 before it goes live.

fougerec99b16_ESO · January 2015

It seems that containers that would logically belong to someone are "steal" and ones that aren't are free to grab. Just so happens that someone else may have found that before you did.

dharbert · January 2015

Good thing I know of a spot with hundreds of containers and zero witnesses....

Iago · January 2015

dharbert wrote: »

Good thing I know of a spot with hundreds of containers and zero witnesses....

That spot is OP NERF it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

JK

Valen_Byte · January 2015

c0rp wrote: »

Newsflash: There are lots of places in Tamriel where you can loot containers that aren't in a city and owned by someone. Go explore and find some.

Newsflash: You are missing the point. I personally don't have a dog in this fight. The issue is the sheer amount of containers in a city. Hundreds, in fact. Versus the few containers that are unowned throughout Tamriel. You go from being able to find hundreds of mats in just a few min. to having to search for hours for the same amount.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting Comments]

Dreamo84 · January 2015

Unfortunately people are gonna have to a adapt to a system that should have been in since launch.

This is a role playing game. You liked that you just ran out looting everyone's stuff with no repercussions?

As for your opt out option. That would basically mean you can steal without any risk. That wouldn't exactly be fair...

Samadhi · January 2015

Valen_Byte wrote: »

... You go from being able to find hundreds of mats in just a few min. to having to search for hours for the same amount.
...

So now it has gone from hundreds of mats in just a few minutes, to being comparable to the other crafts?

s7732425ub17_ESO · January 2015

For those of you that do not know this yet:

There is an "opt-out" option. However, you cannot opt out of the justice system entirely. Instead, this "opt-out" option is only "disable accidental attacking of NPCs." What this means is that you can still steal stuff and get caught and have to pay your bounty. It also means that you can accidentally heal another player who is in combat with guards and also get a bounty yourself.

Valen_Byte · January 2015

Samadhi wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

... You go from being able to find hundreds of mats in just a few min. to having to search for hours for the same amount.
...

So now it has gone from hundreds of mats in just a few minutes, to being comparable to the other crafts?

Well, yes, and no. You can gather tons of stuff, but you're only looking for two or three that are useful.

Dreamo84 · January 2015

It's rather relieving to me. I got sick of feeling like I constantly had to check everything EVERYWHERE, or miss out on mats,

DeLindsay · January 2015

LasurArkinshade wrote: »

The notion that opting out of the justice system would be a way for you to steal stuff without actual consequences is... well, ridiculous. Seriously - that makes no sense. It'd defeat the entire point of the system - few people would willingly enable an optional feature that lets them get arrested when they could just do it without consequence by disabling it.

When they said you could opt out of the justice system it always seemed fairly clear to me that they meant you could enable an option to avoid accidentally committing crimes - which is what they did with the option to disable attacking innocents.

I hope Zos NEVER adds any form of 100% Opt-Out to the Justice System. Previous TES games had consequences for stealing everything in sight, and soon ESO will too. It's a great change and tbh, the Justice System is the most fun I've had playing ESO since near launch when it was new. I'm sorry OP, it's not anything against you personally but this is still a TES game and TES games have consequences for everything you do. There are still PLENTY of un-owned containers in the World, just not many in Towns, but really isn't that to be expected in a living breathing world?

Nestor · January 2015

Have you checked containers in places like the Docks? Or the Warehouse District in Velyn Harbor?

Me, I turned on Auto Loot for the first time and am stuffing my Provisioning Mule up to the gills with food. I can sell the moldy stuff and buy fresh.

kongkim · January 2015

Really how naive are you to think there would be a option to turn a full system off? They have never said that. they have said there is a option to do don't steam or kill people and that way will not be part of it.

nimander99 · January 2015

So what its sounding like to me is if the container is 'owned' then you have to steal it. If its in the open world then its lootable? ummmm that sound like an Elder Scrolls game to me, so... what are we talking about?

Elsonso · January 2015

Rebeccas04nub18_ESO wrote: »

The problem is, about 95% of the containers in a city, town, business or abode are steal-only containers. I'm REALLY hoping ZOS cuts this back to no more than 1/2 before it goes live.

I am hoping that they do not do this, actually.

I can see them making a few more open world containers so they they are free, but anything that should reasonably be owned, and not abandoned, should have a theft associated with it.

My only real concern about theft is any place where an NPC quest giver or shopkeeper is hiding behind stuff that can be stolen. If it is possible to accidentally steal it while trying to interact with the NPC, that would not be good.

There was one shopkeeper in Oblivion, Bravil as I recall, that was hiding behind stacks of bottles and it was too easy to take the bottles.

Greeniewolfub17_ESO · January 2015

spryler wrote: »

No, only some of Tamriel's containers are for theft. There are still (supposed to be) lots of containers that are non-theft that still provide all the necessary mats.

To opt-out as you put it, you literally just don't steal anything. The only disadvantage is you have to watch for the red icon before you open containers.

Every town I have been in so far, EVERY container is marked as "steal from." even ones that make no sense to be marked as such.

Greeniewolfub17_ESO · January 2015

Rebeccas04nub18_ESO wrote: »

The problem is, about 95% of the containers in a city, town, business or abode are steal-only containers. I'm REALLY hoping ZOS cuts this back to no more than 1/2 before it goes live.

Yeah. Agreed. Or change it more skyrim style where only certain things are more likely to get noticed.

MornaBaine · January 2015

I'm pretty sure when they spoke of an "opt out" on the Live Stream they were speaking of the PvP portion of the Justice System, which isn't even in the game yet. Unfortunately, they did not really make this CLEAR on the Live Stream segment.