C0pp3rhead wrote: »

Rune_Relic wrote: »

BUT... you want to do it because you have better stats, better gear, better weapons (through a grinding arms race).
Your way is to take a gun to a knife fight and see who wins.
My way is to take a knife to a knife fight and see who wins.

1. Why would you bring a knife to a knife fight if you know everyone else is going to have guns? That's like saying you're benching your best player because the other team's best player is injured.
2. Of course I want better gear and weapons. Do you expect me to play a game where I can't advance, can't become stronger, and can't get better gear except for once but every 6th months when the devs feel like releasing new content? It's not a crutch - it's called progression. If someone else can't progress as fast or hasn't progressed as far, that's not my problem. I'm going to wear my Aether gear into Cyrodiil (at least for now) because I earned it. Just because there are people in Cyrodiil who don't PvE doesn't mean I shouldn't wear it. Just because you don't want to play as many hours as me doesn't mean I should earn fewer CP.

Faugaun wrote: »

I'm suggesting that you should have freedom to play how you want and still progress equally fast to everyone else for effort put in

This doesn't make sense. Either we progress equally fast or we progress based on effort. To try to combine these is giving a crutch to some players and limiting others. This isn't Care-Bears the rpg. If I want to put in the effort, I ought to get the reward. That's why many people attain high crafting skills for themselves. Sure, you can find someone to do it for you, but some players want to be self-reliant, not hobbled by the schedules of others.

does this include fishing, rp, crafting, collecting mounts, buying and selling items in guild stores, exploration, helping out newbies, administrating a guild, sorting the guild bank.....etc...all these activities should reward you equally to: griming, PvP, questing, trials etc?

If you spend 3 hours in a dungeon with a group, you get xp and maybe some loot. Maybe you all wipe and just get a little XP. If I want to endure 5 hours of mind-numbing boredom while killing a couple thousand atronachs in Craglorn, that's my choice. If you don't want to do it, you don't have to. If your vendetta is against grinding, I said previously that grinding as a viable game mechanic is endemic to MMO's. If you want grinding to stop, lend your voice to all of us who are begging for more content, like the Imperial City. We have to grind because we have no other option. We're competitive, and that's fun for us. Don't take that away by limiting our progression, by preventing us from reaching our full potential.

As for the other activities you named,
If you fish for 3 hours, you get 3 hours worth of fish, which you can sell for gold. There should be a fishing skill line, but I'm not responsible for ESO's half-baked game designs. Same for crafting - craft stuff, sell it for gold or enjoy it yourself. Buying and selling items generates gold. Gathering and collecting things gets you gold as well. Gold and what you can do with that gold is your reward for these activities.

Helping out newbies is something you do out of the goodness of your heart, not because you want XP. If someone in my group isn't pulling their weight, I talk to them about it, offer them advice, offer to craft some stuff cheap for 'em. I don't do it because I want XP. I want them to be a better player and enjoy the game.

Administering a guild is a responsibility that you accept as a guild leader. If you're a guild leader because you just want XP, you've probably got 10 people in your guild who just need the extra bank space.

Collecting mounts is now the purview of the crown store. If I can get xp for collecting mounts, pets, or costumes which cost money, that's Pay-2-Win.

RP is fun, but you can RP while dungeoneering or socializing. XP is not the goal of socializing. I can tell a story over TS - doesn't mean I deserve XP for it. I run with a Khajiit in Cyrodiil who tells stories about the funny things his cubs did that day. I appreciate his humor and accent, plus he's a good PvP'er. He doesn't want XP for posing for screenshots and sitting in taverns. RP is supposed to be fun. If that's not enough for you then maybe you should be doing something else. Character progression in RP doesn't depend on XP or getting a Valkyn Skorial Helm - it's about telling a story and expressing yourself or your character through the relationships you build with your buddies.

If you want XP, quest & kill.
If you want gold, buy & sell.
If you want to RP, just have fun with it.

C0pp3rhead wrote: »

@Faugaun
On the other hand, I could grind with my guildmates and support them through the boredom. That helps my community and creates fraternity with my fellow players

You're right. If a player does nothing but grind, they will be playing a single player game. However, most players want to participate in guilds, raids, pvp, crafting, and all sorts of things. If a player wants to sacrifice his in-game social life, his real life priorities, or even real social life, that's his/her business not mine. I don't have the right to tell them they can't.

But by your logic, I'm gimping my progression by sleeping or having a job. It's called opportunity cost. If you don't want to run back to the bank every 20 minutes, you have to limit the number of items you loot. You'll be missing out on some materials, but you get more xp. It's a tradeoff. If you value your guild more than XP, this is a good thing, and you should do what you value. If don't want to deal with guild administration activities, then don't do them. Someone else can do them, and you can accept a demotion and the scorn of your peers. It's a tradeoff. Just like anything else, you have to prioritize and weigh costs & benefits.

What you're asking for is all the benefits without any of the costs. Either that, or you want ZOS to hobble anyone who you fear might surpass you.