1.6.1 Numbers for refining raw materials

Mathius_Mordred · February 2015

Robbmrp wrote: »

Gyudan wrote: »

I refined over 20,000 raw materials on the PTS tonight. Here are the numbers and some basic ratios. I let you draw your own conclusions.

PS: materials refined with quantities below 1,000 can't provide accurate figures. Just ignore those if they bother you.

Enjoy.

Should we be worried from the 0's showing for those smithing materials where you refined over 100 and didn't see 1 gold? Currently on the live server when I'm refinined 100-150 raw ore I get at LEAST 1 gold temper regardless of ore level.

IMO they need to increase the gold and purple drops to double the percentage your listing. If they are already at 10% for gold, they may have a bug.

hmm, I'm at smithing 45 and have been religiously refining ore for the last 3 months, so many thousands of ore samples, to date I have never received a tempering alloy, I have 4 in total in my bank and these all came from the hireling.

So if those drop rates are correct in the OP chart then this represents a massive improvement from my point of view, but then again I may have been unlucky.

OP, awesome work, many thanks for your efforts.

DeLindsay · February 2015

Mathius_Mordred wrote: »

hmm, I'm at smithing 45 and have been religiously refining ore for the last 3 months, so many thousands of ore samples, to date I have never received a tempering alloy, I have 4 in total in my bank and these all came from the hireling.

So if those drop rates are correct in the OP chart then this represents a massive improvement from my point of view, but then again I may have been unlucky.

OP, awesome work, many thanks for your efforts.

You either have 0/3 in Extraction or are seriously the unluckiest person I've ever seen. With 3/3 Extraction I get ~5% Refining on Live as well as ~5% on PTS just like the others that tested nearly 40K Raw mats in total.

killedbyping · February 2015

So basicaly, chances are almost the same as on Live ? This is NOT what i call "significant increase".

alkoriak · February 2015

oddsmaker wrote: »

Nice work. A standard statistical analysis reveals no significant differences between the chance for gold for ore/cloth/leather/wood or for purple. Look like chance is about 5.3% of getting gold and 6.7% chance of getting purple per refinement.

How do you get those percentages? As far as the OP chart shows the chances displayed are on 1000 mats, so 4.64 per 1000 or 0,464% for ores to give a gold temper.

P3ZZL3 · February 2015

Just a thought on the comments made about "Why did they nerf the Hirelings, surely there is a better way?".

Just throwing an idea out there, could they not take a users account and keep the Hirelings stats as they are for their highest levelled/most used character?

That would give the player of a particular type of skill the chance to get the mats, and would mean that you would have to at least work some on your characters if they were to over take your core character?

IT would also remove the chance of farming with Hirelings?

DeLindsay · February 2015

alkoriak wrote: »

How do you get those percentages? As far as the OP chart shows the chances displayed are on 1000 mats, so 4.64 per 1000 or 0,464% for ores to give a gold temper.

In total between me, the OP and several others we have refined around 40,000 raw mats on PTS since 1.6 hit and we are all seeing within a 0.3% deviation. All of us are getting ~5% Refine rate for Legendary Tempers for ZoS's "significant increase" which is actually the same as Live right now.

alkoriak · February 2015

DeLindsay wrote: »

alkoriak wrote: »

How do you get those percentages? As far as the OP chart shows the chances displayed are on 1000 mats, so 4.64 per 1000 or 0,464% for ores to give a gold temper.

In total between me, the OP and several others we have refined around 40,000 raw mats on PTS since 1.6 hit and we are all seeing within a 0.3% deviation. All of us are getting ~5% Refine rate for Legendary Tempers for ZoS's "significant increase" which is actually the same as Live right now.

Ok, so look again at the first post where the OP said having refined +- 20.000 mats. In fact the total mats refined is 22150, he obtained 118 gold tempers from them which is 0,53%, nowhere near the 5% mentioned from other posts (the OP doesn't give numbers just the chart for us to deciipher). So I maybe miss something or there is an error in some numbers?

edit : Ah, I just saw the problem, you speak of rate per refine (10 mats) and I speak of rate per raw mat. So that explains it

.

DeLindsay · February 2015

alkoriak wrote: »

edit : Ah, I just saw the problem, you speak of rate per refine (10 mats) and I speak of rate per raw mat. So that explains it .

Yessir, it's always based on per Refine.

Mathius_Mordred · February 2015

DeLindsay wrote: »

Mathius_Mordred wrote: »

hmm, I'm at smithing 45 and have been religiously refining ore for the last 3 months, so many thousands of ore samples, to date I have never received a tempering alloy, I have 4 in total in my bank and these all came from the hireling.

So if those drop rates are correct in the OP chart then this represents a massive improvement from my point of view, but then again I may have been unlucky.

OP, awesome work, many thanks for your efforts.

You either have 0/3 in Extraction or are seriously the unluckiest person I've ever seen. With 3/3 Extraction I get ~5% Refining on Live as well as ~5% on PTS just like the others that tested nearly 40K Raw mats in total.

Nope I have 2/2, 3/3 in everything. Get a lot of grain solvents and a huge number of honing stones but never seen an alloy, so I guess you've now met the unluckiest person ever

DeLindsay · February 2015

Mathius_Mordred wrote: »

Nope I have 2/2, 3/3 in everything. Get a lot of grain solvents and a huge number of honing stones but never seen an alloy, so I guess you've now met the unluckiest person ever

Just ouch dude.

AlnilamE · February 2015

Mathius_Mordred wrote: »

DeLindsay wrote: »

Mathius_Mordred wrote: »

hmm, I'm at smithing 45 and have been religiously refining ore for the last 3 months, so many thousands of ore samples, to date I have never received a tempering alloy, I have 4 in total in my bank and these all came from the hireling.

So if those drop rates are correct in the OP chart then this represents a massive improvement from my point of view, but then again I may have been unlucky.

OP, awesome work, many thanks for your efforts.

You either have 0/3 in Extraction or are seriously the unluckiest person I've ever seen. With 3/3 Extraction I get ~5% Refining on Live as well as ~5% on PTS just like the others that tested nearly 40K Raw mats in total.

Nope I have 2/2, 3/3 in everything. Get a lot of grain solvents and a huge number of honing stones but never seen an alloy, so I guess you've now met the unluckiest person ever

Yeah, while I've gotten alloys and rosin on occasion, it's certainly not at the same rate I get Dreugh Wax...

I will test refining on the PTS when they copy our toons over again. I have been stocking up on mats.

Leeric · February 2015

Greagor wrote: »

@leeric i can sell mine

haha it was more of a joke, and Im sure you could make more gold off of them than I am willing to pay lol

NukeAllTheThings · February 2015

I wanted to update this thread with data I just compiled from refining.

I stocked up on my live character over the last week and I have a total of 1510 refines

DeLindsay · February 2015

3rdwardhobocub18_ESO wrote: »

I wanted to update this thread with data I just compiled from refining.

I stocked up on my live character over the last week and I have a total of 1510 refines

And your results for all Legendary Tempers is 5.03%, almost identical to what the rest of us are getting on PTS. So now we're up to ~55K raw mats Refined with a 5.08% (+/- 0.05 or so). 100K would be a better overall test value but 55K is still good.

Grapdjan · February 2015

But you can't refine enchanting materials, so how are we going to get Kuta?

AlnilamE · February 2015

I actually got a kuta from the Enchanter's box when I did my first ever enchanting writ on PTS last night.

Too bad it's a PTS kuta...

Will refine the mats I stockpiled in the next day or two and post results.

DeLindsay · February 2015

AlnilamE wrote: »

I actually got a kuta from the Enchanter's box when I did my first ever enchanting writ on PTS last night.

Too bad it's a PTS kuta...

Will refine the mats I stockpiled in the next day or two and post results.

I got (2) Kuta from the Enchanter's Coffer when I did my week worth of Enchanting Writs during 1.6. I received 0 Kuta from Hirelings the entire time. As for others I've seen 2 Players say they received (1) Kuta from Hirelings during their week on PTS. Basically Kuta's global drop rate (via farming, Hirelings and Writ turn-ins combined) is about 1.8% on PTS, which is beyond horrible.

NukeAllTheThings · February 2015

DeLindsay wrote: »

3rdwardhobocub18_ESO wrote: »

I wanted to update this thread with data I just compiled from refining.

I stocked up on my live character over the last week and I have a total of 1510 refines

And your results for all Legendary Tempers is 5.03%, almost identical to what the rest of us are getting on PTS. So now we're up to ~55K raw mats Refined with a 5.08% (+/- 0.05 or so). 100K would be a better overall test value but 55K is still good.

Yeah I wish I had more, but ran out of time and money to buy before they copied to PTS. But, what I am seeing is a good increase in the refining drop rate based on the work from some folks on reddit.

reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/2tjkoe/results_of_refining_20000_raw_materials/

20960 total raw materials
56 gold (drop rate 2.67%)
147 purple (drop rate 7.01%)
293 blue (drop rate 13.97%)

I am going to be testing the gold drop rate on crafting writs the rest of the week. Last week I did 15 writs and got 9 gold drops and 4 survey reports.

DeLindsay · February 2015

3rdwardhobocub18_ESO wrote: »

...

Yeah I've seen that thread and several previous threads (some with higher results) and maybe I'm just lucky on Live because I get pretty much 5% for Legendary Tempers on Live right now via Refining. That's why I'm not seeing this as a "significant increase", from my perspective personally. Then again I get an average of ~10 Legendary Tempers + 2-3 Kuta every single day via Hirelings on Live, more than most claim to get. This is ofc with (8) Characters worth of 3/3 Hirelings.

It's not the ~5% Refine rate of Legendary Tempers or the +/- 80% reduction to them via Hirelings that bothers me it's the Kuta problem. A Global ~1.8% drop rate for them is idiotic. I could understand if they dropped Hireling Kutas to 1 every other day (3-4/week) while also increasing the spawn rate in Aspect nodes to say 3-5% along with the boost they did add to the Enchanter's Coffer but they didn't. Getting 0-1 Kuta/week out of a possible 112 Enchanting Hirelings per week is stupid.

One poster made the comment in another thread about this that ZoS probably did this due to people being able to make as many free accounts as they want come March 17th to spam Hireling armies. Although I can agree with that perspective there's no way in hell I'm going through all that mess again and my Hirelings that I've had since about the first month of launch, will be much less worthwhile come 1.6. I'll still keep them for the mats in general but it's going to be a hard pill to swallow after all the hard work we've all done.

DeLindsay · February 2015

Anyone have any new stats for Refining in 1.6.2? ZoS ninja buffed Kuta and ninja nerfed Legendary Tempers via Hirelings this patch, was just curious if the same happened to Refining. I'll have a small batch to report when NA loses the PTS this Tuesday as my focus has been solely on Legerdemain this week.

NukeAllTheThings · February 2015

Not sure about kuta but hirelings seem to bring the same amount as they did in 1.6.1. I had 70 hireling mails and got 2 legendary in 1.6.1, in 1.6.2 I have had 3 legendary out of 80

I have been doing wood, cloth and metal writs and will have my numbers from that a little later today.

LunaRae · February 2015

I had a stack of 1,000 voidstone ore I've been sitting on for a long time now - decided to see if I should cash in now or wait for 1.6
-
Got 0 alloys (gold), 2 grain solvent (purp), and 4 dwarven oil (blue). Seems extremely awful right now, is it intended to be useless to refine raw mats now?

starkerealm · February 2015

LunaRae wrote: »

I had a stack of 1,000 voidstone ore I've been sitting on for a long time now - decided to see if I should cash in now or wait for 1.6
-
Got 0 alloys (gold), 2 grain solvent (purp), and 4 dwarven oil (blue). Seems extremely awful right now, is it intended to be useless to refine raw mats now?

On 100 refines, you're looking at about a 20% margin for error. Given the drop rate seems to be around 5%, getting 0 is not a stretch.

DeLindsay · February 2015

Alright NA's week is about up for 1.6.2 (it's 3:30 am for me on Tuesday) and here are my results for just the ore I had on me for the copy plus what I got from Hirelings this week, it's not much but it's better than nothing.

(10) Ash, (10) Beech, (10) Birch, (10) Hickory, (560) Maple, (240) Nightwood.
Total: 83 Refines = (5) Rosin

(300) Rawhide, (300) Jute, (20) Kreshweed, (250) Void Bloom, (20) Shadowhide.
Total: 89 Refines = (5) Dreugh Wax

(10) Galatite, (330) Iron, (130) Voidstone.
Total: 47 Refines = (3) Tempering Alloy

That gives a 1.6.2 Refine rate for Legendary Tempers (2190 Raw mats) of 5.9%. It's hard to say if ZoS ninja increased it by less than 1% as we were seeing a range of 4.9-5.4% Refine rates for 1.6 and 1.6.1 and my 219 Refines is a small batch.

NukeAllTheThings · February 2015

Ok, I did BS, CL & WW writs for 6 days using my 4 max crafters on NA server.

Totals
72 Writs
24 Legendary
13 Surveys (2 potent nirncrux & 1 fortified nirncrux)

DeLindsay · February 2015

3rdwardhobocub18_ESO wrote: »

Totals
72 Writs
24 Legendary
13 Surveys (2 potent nirncrux & 1 fortified nirncrux)

I would've done a test on Writs but since the day they came out I have NEVER received even one Survey Report from BS/WW/Cloth, I stopped doing them after ~2 weeks and have tried them sporadically since and still no Surveys, on my VR14 that's maxed in all Crafting. On the flip side I do the Consumable Writs every day and average 1.5 Surveys/day from those 3, go figure.

Robbmrp · February 2015

Iago wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

Iago wrote: »

Robbmrp wrote: »

Gyudan wrote: »

I refined over 20,000 raw materials on the PTS tonight. Here are the numbers and some basic ratios. I let you draw your own conclusions.

PS: materials refined with quantities below 1,000 can't provide accurate figures. Just ignore those if they bother you.

Enjoy.

Should we be worried from the 0's showing for those smithing materials where you refined over 100 and didn't see 1 gold? Currently on the live server when I'm refinined 100-150 raw ore I get at LEAST 1 gold temper regardless of ore level.

IMO they need to increase the gold and purple drops to double the percentage your listing. If they are already at 10% for gold, they may have a bug.

1 Temp Alloy out of every 100? I get one tenth of that currently on the live server.

RNG Hates Me.........................

I hates both of us. Never got that average...

I get 1 temp alloy for every thousand Voidstone I refine and he gets 1 out of every 100.....

What I've noticed is that the higher the material level the less valuable tempers you receive from it. I'm not sure if it's a bug that's related to the programming they added a while back so that you wouldn't receive tempers if you refined material over your character level. It could have something to do with that. The material I refine and usually see more purple/gold temper's per 150 refined are well below my V14 level.

NukeAllTheThings · February 2015

I feel your pain. RNG has been very good to me in the game, but I pretty much despise these writs. I had only been doing them to get nirncrux but I found that I got more by farming mats in Upper Craglorn and I made more gold selling off the refined nightwood, voidbloom and voidstone than I would on the couple of nirncrux that might come from rolling the dice on writs.

This drop rate on legendaries will get me force me back doing writs since my hirelings are useless.

starkerealm · February 2015

Robbmrp wrote: »

Iago wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

Iago wrote: »

Robbmrp wrote: »

Gyudan wrote: »

I refined over 20,000 raw materials on the PTS tonight. Here are the numbers and some basic ratios. I let you draw your own conclusions.

PS: materials refined with quantities below 1,000 can't provide accurate figures. Just ignore those if they bother you.

Enjoy.

Should we be worried from the 0's showing for those smithing materials where you refined over 100 and didn't see 1 gold? Currently on the live server when I'm refinined 100-150 raw ore I get at LEAST 1 gold temper regardless of ore level.

IMO they need to increase the gold and purple drops to double the percentage your listing. If they are already at 10% for gold, they may have a bug.

1 Temp Alloy out of every 100? I get one tenth of that currently on the live server.

RNG Hates Me.........................

I hates both of us. Never got that average...

I get 1 temp alloy for every thousand Voidstone I refine and he gets 1 out of every 100.....

What I've noticed is that the higher the material level the less valuable tempers you receive from it. I'm not sure if it's a bug that's related to the programming they added a while back so that you wouldn't receive tempers if you refined material over your character level. It could have something to do with that. The material I refine and usually see more purple/gold temper's per 150 refined are well below my V14 level.

That's probably an RNG fluke.

Gyudan · February 2015

starkerealm wrote: »

That's probably an RNG fluke.

I agree. My tests don't show that at all.

Thanks @3rdwardhobocub18_ESO for the input on writs.

I'll be posting updated numbers soon after I'm done downloading the patch.