Thank you ZOS!!!

daneyulebub17_ESO · January 2015

Woot! I thought FREE ESO was great, but my neighbor just dragged this big cylindrical can out to his front curb, and it's full of free stuff too! Wooooot!!! Love me some free!!!

Ethona · January 2015

Cody wrote: »

Let me explain EXACTLY why "Free to play" is not really "free to play"(even though technically ESO is going Buy to play)

You may not have to pay a sub fee, but you and your girlfriend will still have to pay for DLC(the new zones like wrothgar, murkmire, etc) as well as anything else ZOS charges for. They have to make money somehow.

Now that there is no 15 a month sub fee, you could find yourself paying MORE than the original sub fee to play the game.

Tell me, how is that "free to pay"?

It isn't. so enjoy that mentality of yours; because soon reality is going to come crashing down VERY hard on you.

Let me explain to you that in every B2P and F2P forums I find folks like you preaching about how we'll end up spending tons more. I have played tons of B2P/F2P games and in almost all but a few I spent ZERO cash ever mainly because the games were never worth it. However, in those that I did spend cash I never had to spend any at all. I only spent cash for some things I valued for my char and playtime. At NO time EVER in any of those games have I spent more than 50 dollars in their cash shop over the years of playing those games. I have spent money buying expansions (DLC) though so long as the content was worth playing. I'm talking about the only few good B2P/F2P games here such as RIFT, SWTOR, LOTRO. This LIE about how players will find themselves spending more than before is just that LIES lest these ppl have zero control at spending their money. That's a problem they have and not for me to worry about. This game is going B2P so man up and deal with it or go back to ["World of Crycraft: Money Coming To Me" note all money goes to blizzard]

Razzak · January 2015

Ethona wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

Let me explain EXACTLY why "Free to play" is not really "free to play"(even though technically ESO is going Buy to play)

You may not have to pay a sub fee, but you and your girlfriend will still have to pay for DLC(the new zones like wrothgar, murkmire, etc) as well as anything else ZOS charges for. They have to make money somehow.

Now that there is no 15 a month sub fee, you could find yourself paying MORE than the original sub fee to play the game.

Tell me, how is that "free to pay"?

It isn't. so enjoy that mentality of yours; because soon reality is going to come crashing down VERY hard on you.

Let me explain to you that in every B2P and F2P forums I find folks like you preaching about how we'll end up spending tons more. I have played tons of B2P/F2P games and in almost all but a few I spent ZERO cash ever mainly because the games were never worth it. However, in those that I did spend cash I never had to spend any at all. I only spent cash for some things I valued for my char and playtime. At NO time EVER in any of those games have I spent more than 50 dollars in their cash shop over the years of playing those games. I have spent money buying expansions (DLC) though so long as the content was worth playing. I'm talking about the only few good B2P/F2P games here such as RIFT, SWTOR, LOTRO. This LIE about how players will find themselves spending more than before is just that LIES lest these ppl have zero control at spending their money. That's a problem they have and not for me to worry about. This game is going B2P so man up and deal with it or go back to ["World of Crycraft: Money Coming To Me" note all money goes to blizzard]

Many will spend more. That's the point of those carrots in the cash shop. And sadly, it's usually kids with little to no real attitude to how much something is worth. Just think about hairstyle changes. Paying 5, 10 or even more Eur for something like that is beyond stupid, but they and many more will be doing just that. And there is absolutely no reason why they should charge such amounts. But they will.

The other problem is that with your 13 EUR sub, you will get less real content and much, much more carrots in cash shop.

So, it's not just about spending more, it's also about getting less for the same amount of sub. Or I should say, before 1.5 when they were at least doing something for sub based ESO.

Emencie · January 2015

Ethona wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

Let me explain EXACTLY why "Free to play" is not really "free to play"(even though technically ESO is going Buy to play)

You may not have to pay a sub fee, but you and your girlfriend will still have to pay for DLC(the new zones like wrothgar, murkmire, etc) as well as anything else ZOS charges for. They have to make money somehow.

Now that there is no 15 a month sub fee, you could find yourself paying MORE than the original sub fee to play the game.

Tell me, how is that "free to pay"?

It isn't. so enjoy that mentality of yours; because soon reality is going to come crashing down VERY hard on you.

Let me explain to you that in every B2P and F2P forums I find folks like you preaching about how we'll end up spending tons more. I have played tons of B2P/F2P games and in almost all but a few I spent ZERO cash ever mainly because the games were never worth it. However, in those that I did spend cash I never had to spend any at all. I only spent cash for some things I valued for my char and playtime. At NO time EVER in any of those games have I spent more than 50 dollars in their cash shop over the years of playing those games. I have spent money buying expansions (DLC) though so long as the content was worth playing. I'm talking about the only few good B2P/F2P games here such as RIFT, SWTOR, LOTRO. This LIE about how players will find themselves spending more than before is just that LIES lest these ppl have zero control at spending their money. That's a problem they have and not for me to worry about. This game is going B2P so man up and deal with it or go back to ["World of Crycraft: Money Coming To Me" note all money goes to blizzard]

How could you possibly Play LOTRO or SWTOR without spending any money?

Are we talking about you playing 3 hours a month or something?

SWTOR has a lockout to everything, literally! You cannot do any end game content, or PvP. Last time I was in LOTRO it was in the same boat. Can you even get to SWTOR level cap without paying these days? I'm pretty sure you cannot. 3 dungeons a week, no raids, 5 PvP matches, and you cant even equip 80% of the end game gear without purchasing a pass!

Hell Just in expansions SWTOR is over $50.00 right now... Do you not have any expansion? Even if you are spending every waking moment creating characters to achievement farm cartel points you are maxing out at roughly 10cc/hour a value so minimal it's laughable.

I'm calling BS on this, either you don't play enough to even get to the locked content, which means you barely count as casual, or you have spent a lot more than you think on micro transactions.

BBSooner · January 2015

Ethona wrote: »

Bouvin wrote: »

dietlime wrote: »

I somehow doubt the game collapses now that it's free to play. Think about all the people that just sort of like it, bought it, but don't subscribe because they don't feel that strongly about it? Those people will actually play now.

Ya.

Just look at LoTRO after F2P.

It pretty much died, despite the influx of new players at the beginning of the switch.

Why did that happen? Because you actually need revenue to pay for game development. And when revenue starts to drop off, guess what? Game development ceases.

That's exactly what happened with LoTRO.

WHAT? What you've stated about LOTRO is 100% completely false! LOTRO has had a handful of fairly large expansions with good content since it's F2P conversion and the world has tons of active players. You shouldn't spread misleading info because you're emo taking arrows to both knees at random.

Uh, no. The quality of content has been steadily decreasing since SoA. LotRO is a shell of what it was, even if we part opinions in what "quality content" LotRO has to different people it's clear the store is pointed to at every opportunity, and was confirmed by Sapience around a year ago iirc that they have no plans on developing new raids in the foreseeable future (content that apparently didn't have the quality/support to be created when compared to the return they could get by popping out some more landscape fetch quests and sell it in the store). It truly is a shame what happened to LotRO (founder here).

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Kraven · January 2015

Ethona wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

Let me explain EXACTLY why "Free to play" is not really "free to play"(even though technically ESO is going Buy to play)

You may not have to pay a sub fee, but you and your girlfriend will still have to pay for DLC(the new zones like wrothgar, murkmire, etc) as well as anything else ZOS charges for. They have to make money somehow.

Now that there is no 15 a month sub fee, you could find yourself paying MORE than the original sub fee to play the game.

Tell me, how is that "free to pay"?

It isn't. so enjoy that mentality of yours; because soon reality is going to come crashing down VERY hard on you.

Let me explain to you that in every B2P and F2P forums I find folks like you preaching about how we'll end up spending tons more. I have played tons of B2P/F2P games and in almost all but a few I spent ZERO cash ever mainly because the games were never worth it. However, in those that I did spend cash I never had to spend any at all. I only spent cash for some things I valued for my char and playtime. At NO time EVER in any of those games have I spent more than 50 dollars in their cash shop over the years of playing those games. I have spent money buying expansions (DLC) though so long as the content was worth playing. I'm talking about the only few good B2P/F2P games here such as RIFT, SWTOR, LOTRO. This LIE about how players will find themselves spending more than before is just that LIES lest these ppl have zero control at spending their money. That's a problem they have and not for me to worry about. This game is going B2P so man up and deal with it or go back to ["World of Crycraft: Money Coming To Me" note all money goes to blizzard]

And if every player is like you then how do those games make money to make new content? Oh. Well better hope the content they have already made and stored up to put on the cash shop as DLC is enough to last a while. What B2P/F2P game comes out with nearly as much content as it's counter part?

Gw, EQ2, Wow. All released in the same time period, which one has the most content, has had the most expansions and still made it's company a crap ton of profit? EQ2. With a combination of cash shop and sub model BUT with a 300x better combination than what ZOS is doing. Sony's big flaw was being a crap company that pushed players away by making bad business decisions and alienating their players (Well ZOS got that part right) not to mention all the security issues that came from the constant hacks they kept bringing on themselves.

If you want to look at ESO, model going forward feel free to look at LOtRO. Look at it's game quality and content additions since going f2p. Look at it's player base and community since going F2P.

Samadhi · January 2015

dietlime wrote: »

Watch the people who don't like the game enough to justify a sub roll in and outnumber the horrible, negative, hateful, sky-is-falling crowd on here. It's going to be glorious.
...

Best group to cater to.

Darlgon · January 2015

Ethona wrote: »

Bouvin wrote: »

dietlime wrote: »

I somehow doubt the game collapses now that it's free to play. Think about all the people that just sort of like it, bought it, but don't subscribe because they don't feel that strongly about it? Those people will actually play now.

Ya.

Just look at LoTRO after F2P.

It pretty much died, despite the influx of new players at the beginning of the switch.

Why did that happen? Because you actually need revenue to pay for game development. And when revenue starts to drop off, guess what? Game development ceases.

That's exactly what happened with LoTRO.

WHAT? What you've stated about LOTRO is 100% completely false! LOTRO has had a handful of fairly large expansions with good content since it's F2P conversion and the world has tons of active players. You shouldn't spread misleading info because you're emo taking arrows to both knees at random.

Thats rich.. umm. No.. You must have left Lotro after Mirkwood, or base that on what you read in the scrubbed version of the official forums. Anyone who spoke up agains the machine was banned and their posts removed. The "expansions" were excuses to bleed money out of subs who blew their TP on cosmetics. Once that got tiring, even lifetime subs who were not paying, pretty much left.

As far as good content.. well.. even tho I subbed up until August 2014, the game content was so sad, I could not bear to login since ESO Betas came out. After Mirkwood, Turbine pretty much said, we dont want hard-core raid types. They could not even fix the one raid after 2 years and gave up on the bugs in it. Then came the horsies, with some classes able to solo "raid" mobs. Of notice, that the warden class was broken for 18 months, then went OP until the next fubar. The broken class system revamp. Then "raids" being replaced with a mini-game where your character didnt matter, just the number of times you mindlessly ground thru the same story over and over.

Sigh.. when I think of how I felt in Moria, or even in dreary Mirkwood, and what the game became.. Yeah, the F2P/B2P conversion broke it.. even tho I blame the management at WB/Turbine more than the devs.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Ethona · January 2015

Emencie wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

Let me explain EXACTLY why "Free to play" is not really "free to play"(even though technically ESO is going Buy to play)

You may not have to pay a sub fee, but you and your girlfriend will still have to pay for DLC(the new zones like wrothgar, murkmire, etc) as well as anything else ZOS charges for. They have to make money somehow.

Now that there is no 15 a month sub fee, you could find yourself paying MORE than the original sub fee to play the game.

Tell me, how is that "free to pay"?

It isn't. so enjoy that mentality of yours; because soon reality is going to come crashing down VERY hard on you.

Let me explain to you that in every B2P and F2P forums I find folks like you preaching about how we'll end up spending tons more. I have played tons of B2P/F2P games and in almost all but a few I spent ZERO cash ever mainly because the games were never worth it. However, in those that I did spend cash I never had to spend any at all. I only spent cash for some things I valued for my char and playtime. At NO time EVER in any of those games have I spent more than 50 dollars in their cash shop over the years of playing those games. I have spent money buying expansions (DLC) though so long as the content was worth playing. I'm talking about the only few good B2P/F2P games here such as RIFT, SWTOR, LOTRO. This LIE about how players will find themselves spending more than before is just that LIES lest these ppl have zero control at spending their money. That's a problem they have and not for me to worry about. This game is going B2P so man up and deal with it or go back to ["World of Crycraft: Money Coming To Me" note all money goes to blizzard]

How could you possibly Play LOTRO or SWTOR without spending any money?

Are we talking about you playing 3 hours a month or something?

SWTOR has a lockout to everything, literally! You cannot do any end game content, or PvP. Last time I was in LOTRO it was in the same boat. Can you even get to SWTOR level cap without paying these days? I'm pretty sure you cannot. 3 dungeons a week, no raids, 5 PvP matches, and you cant even equip 80% of the end game gear without purchasing a pass!

Hell Just in expansions SWTOR is over $50.00 right now... Do you not have any expansion? Even if you are spending every waking moment creating characters to achievement farm cartel points you are maxing out at roughly 10cc/hour a value so minimal it's laughable.

I'm calling BS on this, either you don't play enough to even get to the locked content, which means you barely count as casual, or you have spent a lot more than you think on micro transactions.

A) It would be a good thing to be a bit more mindful and not assume every player desires end-game content such as raiding or pvp. I play SWTOR as F2P and exp the story and buy the expansion content. I never said I didn't buy expansions or that I wouldn't spend money in a cash shop for fluffy items. I only said that in all of these games less than 50 dollars in the cash shop got me what I need to enjoy the game forever and ever along with buying expansions if they were worth it. You either didn't read all I said or you can't read or you're so emo right now that it's clouded your thoughts.

Both expansions for SWTOR does come to 50 dollars, and? Once again I enjoy buying good expansions and will do so for ESO if the expansions/DLC are worth it.

C) BS? How can you call BS on someone else playing and buying habits? Some ppl don't always play a game for stuff like raids and pvp. You know well enough like I do that you can exp all of SWTOR levels and Story driven content for free and that's exactly what I play that game for ONLY! When it comes to LOTRO I buy just the expansions and that's all I need to exp the story and leveling in LOTRO.

Why don't you go and grab some drink and food and cool off a little because you're not thinking straight.

ESO is now B2P and I will only buy DLC if it's worth it! That is how I wanted this game to be and I'm very much happy that the game is B2P now. I will enjoy the game for what's worth rather folks like you play it or not. Honestly I won't miss any of you if you leave.

Plantagenet · January 2015

burningcrow wrote: »

Aye tea tree oil is good. I use almond oil as a base and a mix of peppermint, tea tree, and eucalyptus oils for fragrance.

I really like the clove/vanilla mix. If done well, it is excellent.

Ethona · January 2015

BBSooner wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

Bouvin wrote: »

dietlime wrote: »

I somehow doubt the game collapses now that it's free to play. Think about all the people that just sort of like it, bought it, but don't subscribe because they don't feel that strongly about it? Those people will actually play now.

Ya.

Just look at LoTRO after F2P.

It pretty much died, despite the influx of new players at the beginning of the switch.

Why did that happen? Because you actually need revenue to pay for game development. And when revenue starts to drop off, guess what? Game development ceases.

That's exactly what happened with LoTRO.

WHAT? What you've stated about LOTRO is 100% completely false! LOTRO has had a handful of fairly large expansions with good content since it's F2P conversion and the world has tons of active players. You shouldn't spread misleading info because you're emo taking arrows to both knees at random.

Uh, no. The quality of content has been steadily decreasing since SoA. LotRO is a shell of what it was, even if we part opinions in what "quality content" LotRO has to different people it's clear the store is pointed to at every opportunity, and was confirmed by Sapience around a year ago iirc that they have no plans on developing new raids in the foreseeable future (content that apparently didn't have the quality/support to be created when compared to the return they could get by popping out some more landscape fetch quests and sell it in the store). It truly is a shame what happened to LotRO (founder here).

That Sap you mention is a joke and so thankful the Sap has ran dry and no longer spreads corruption upon those boards. It's your opinion about how you feel for the game, fine, but it's my opinion that the game is still doing well for it self and plenty of folks enjoy it. B2P didn't kill Skyrim did it? B2P won't kill ESO either lest nay sayers spreading doubt run ppl away from the game. Soon enough we all will see in time how the games does and I'm pretty sure the game will be here for years to come. You may not be playing it but that doesn't mean it died.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Ethona · January 2015

Kraven wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

Let me explain EXACTLY why "Free to play" is not really "free to play"(even though technically ESO is going Buy to play)

You may not have to pay a sub fee, but you and your girlfriend will still have to pay for DLC(the new zones like wrothgar, murkmire, etc) as well as anything else ZOS charges for. They have to make money somehow.

Now that there is no 15 a month sub fee, you could find yourself paying MORE than the original sub fee to play the game.

Tell me, how is that "free to pay"?

It isn't. so enjoy that mentality of yours; because soon reality is going to come crashing down VERY hard on you.

Let me explain to you that in every B2P and F2P forums I find folks like you preaching about how we'll end up spending tons more. I have played tons of B2P/F2P games and in almost all but a few I spent ZERO cash ever mainly because the games were never worth it. However, in those that I did spend cash I never had to spend any at all. I only spent cash for some things I valued for my char and playtime. At NO time EVER in any of those games have I spent more than 50 dollars in their cash shop over the years of playing those games. I have spent money buying expansions (DLC) though so long as the content was worth playing. I'm talking about the only few good B2P/F2P games here such as RIFT, SWTOR, LOTRO. This LIE about how players will find themselves spending more than before is just that LIES lest these ppl have zero control at spending their money. That's a problem they have and not for me to worry about. This game is going B2P so man up and deal with it or go back to ["World of Crycraft: Money Coming To Me" note all money goes to blizzard]

And if every player is like you then how do those games make money to make new content? Oh. Well better hope the content they have already made and stored up to put on the cash shop as DLC is enough to last a while. What B2P/F2P game comes out with nearly as much content as it's counter part?

Gw, EQ2, Wow. All released in the same time period, which one has the most content, has had the most expansions and still made it's company a crap ton of profit? EQ2. With a combination of cash shop and sub model BUT with a 300x better combination than what ZOS is doing. Sony's big flaw was being a crap company that pushed players away by making bad business decisions and alienating their players (Well ZOS got that part right) not to mention all the security issues that came from the constant hacks they kept bringing on themselves.

If you want to look at ESO, model going forward feel free to look at LOtRO. Look at it's game quality and content additions since going f2p. Look at it's player base and community since going F2P.

All I have to say is if you're a B2P game studio than you better make some good content that folks like me will buy. Nothing stopping them from making good qul content every 6 months that i'd toss 30 dollars at. Nothing stopping them from making good qul expansions every year or so that I'd be willing to toss 50 dollars at. However it has to be good stuff and it has to be REAL content/expansions in the form of landzones and quests and story and features ect..

If that's not enough for them to make a living than they shouldn't be making video games or picked the B2P model. That was the company choice not mines.

I play LOTRO since it's release and I still play LOTRO. I enjoy LOTRO and treat it as a B2P game whereas I buy expansions and play those expansions and not buy anything else with cash. In other words .... Turbine better come out with some good qul expansions if they want anymore of my money. Also, what of the people that plays LOTRO? I'm sure like any game they have some bad ppl but I have met far more good spirited players on LOTRO than any game EVER in my nearly 34 years in this sorry world.

BBSooner · January 2015

Ethona wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

Bouvin wrote: »

dietlime wrote: »

I somehow doubt the game collapses now that it's free to play. Think about all the people that just sort of like it, bought it, but don't subscribe because they don't feel that strongly about it? Those people will actually play now.

Ya.

Just look at LoTRO after F2P.

It pretty much died, despite the influx of new players at the beginning of the switch.

Why did that happen? Because you actually need revenue to pay for game development. And when revenue starts to drop off, guess what? Game development ceases.

That's exactly what happened with LoTRO.

WHAT? What you've stated about LOTRO is 100% completely false! LOTRO has had a handful of fairly large expansions with good content since it's F2P conversion and the world has tons of active players. You shouldn't spread misleading info because you're emo taking arrows to both knees at random.

Uh, no. The quality of content has been steadily decreasing since SoA. LotRO is a shell of what it was, even if we part opinions in what "quality content" LotRO has to different people it's clear the store is pointed to at every opportunity, and was confirmed by Sapience around a year ago iirc that they have no plans on developing new raids in the foreseeable future (content that apparently didn't have the quality/support to be created when compared to the return they could get by popping out some more landscape fetch quests and sell it in the store). It truly is a shame what happened to LotRO (founder here).

That Sap you mention is a joke and so thankful the Sap has ran dry and no longer spreads corruption upon those boards. It's your opinion about how you feel for the game, fine, but it's my opinion that the game is still doing well for it self and plenty of folks enjoy it. B2P didn't kill Skyrim did it? B2P won't kill ESO either lest nay sayers spreading doubt run ppl away from the game. Soon enough we all will see in time how the games does and I'm pretty sure the game will be here for years to come. You may not be playing it but that doesn't mean it died.

Skyrim isn't an MMO. Skyrim doesn't include previously enjoyed 4-6 week updates that expand player enjoyment. Skyrim is no longer supported with patches and official updates. Hell, Bethesda still has game halting bugs in all of their single player titles (not just Skyrim) that luckily community mods patch for us.

I never said I wouldn't be playing, and never said it would die. I have, however, openly discussed the very real possibility (and incredibly likely at that) that over time the focus will shift from releasing fun/interesting/diverse content towards a focus on what will make the most money if sold on the cash shop.

You disliking Sapience is one thing, but whether you dislike them or not it doesn't change Turbines official stance towards whether they'd develop quality content or throw some busy work on a landscape and sell it in a store.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Emencie · January 2015

Ethona wrote: »

Emencie wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

Let me explain EXACTLY why "Free to play" is not really "free to play"(even though technically ESO is going Buy to play)

You may not have to pay a sub fee, but you and your girlfriend will still have to pay for DLC(the new zones like wrothgar, murkmire, etc) as well as anything else ZOS charges for. They have to make money somehow.

Now that there is no 15 a month sub fee, you could find yourself paying MORE than the original sub fee to play the game.

Tell me, how is that "free to pay"?

It isn't. so enjoy that mentality of yours; because soon reality is going to come crashing down VERY hard on you.

Let me explain to you that in every B2P and F2P forums I find folks like you preaching about how we'll end up spending tons more. I have played tons of B2P/F2P games and in almost all but a few I spent ZERO cash ever mainly because the games were never worth it. However, in those that I did spend cash I never had to spend any at all. I only spent cash for some things I valued for my char and playtime. At NO time EVER in any of those games have I spent more than 50 dollars in their cash shop over the years of playing those games. I have spent money buying expansions (DLC) though so long as the content was worth playing. I'm talking about the only few good B2P/F2P games here such as RIFT, SWTOR, LOTRO. This LIE about how players will find themselves spending more than before is just that LIES lest these ppl have zero control at spending their money. That's a problem they have and not for me to worry about. This game is going B2P so man up and deal with it or go back to ["World of Crycraft: Money Coming To Me" note all money goes to blizzard]

How could you possibly Play LOTRO or SWTOR without spending any money?

Are we talking about you playing 3 hours a month or something?

SWTOR has a lockout to everything, literally! You cannot do any end game content, or PvP. Last time I was in LOTRO it was in the same boat. Can you even get to SWTOR level cap without paying these days? I'm pretty sure you cannot. 3 dungeons a week, no raids, 5 PvP matches, and you cant even equip 80% of the end game gear without purchasing a pass!

Hell Just in expansions SWTOR is over $50.00 right now... Do you not have any expansion? Even if you are spending every waking moment creating characters to achievement farm cartel points you are maxing out at roughly 10cc/hour a value so minimal it's laughable.

I'm calling BS on this, either you don't play enough to even get to the locked content, which means you barely count as casual, or you have spent a lot more than you think on micro transactions.

A) It would be a good thing to be a bit more mindful and not assume every player desires end-game content such as raiding or pvp. I play SWTOR as F2P and exp the story and buy the expansion content. I never said I didn't buy expansions or that I wouldn't spend money in a cash shop for fluffy items. I only said that in all of these games less than 50 dollars in the cash shop got me what I need to enjoy the game forever and ever along with buying expansions if they were worth it. You either didn't read all I said or you can't read or you're so emo right now that it's clouded your thoughts.

Both expansions for SWTOR does come to 50 dollars, and? Once again I enjoy buying good expansions and will do so for ESO if the expansions/DLC are worth it.

C) BS? How can you call BS on someone else playing and buying habits? Some ppl don't always play a game for stuff like raids and pvp. You know well enough like I do that you can exp all of SWTOR levels and Story driven content for free and that's exactly what I play that game for ONLY! When it comes to LOTRO I buy just the expansions and that's all I need to exp the story and leveling in LOTRO.

Why don't you go and grab some drink and food and cool off a little because you're not thinking straight.

ESO is now B2P and I will only buy DLC if it's worth it! That is how I wanted this game to be and I'm very much happy that the game is B2P now. I will enjoy the game for what's worth rather folks like you play it or not. Honestly I won't miss any of you if you leave.

Im thinking completely straight because I played SWTOR. I just know that at less than $50.00 spent you would have to fall into one of three categories to claim what you are claiming.

#1 You don't play the game enough to get to any of the lockouts so it doesn't matter to you, You don't PvP, you don't raid, you don't run more than 3 flashpoints a week, you don't participate in trade (more than 2 items listed) You don't use any of the advanced chat features or channels, and only run 3 space missions a week. You have no elite gear and likely don't participate in any events because you cannot wear or use any event rewards.

If this is the case, your opinion has very little value because you haven't even played or experienced the game past the leveling storyline which is a very short experience in SWTOR.

#2 You have paid for more than $50.00 worth of content you just don't realize it because it was a little here a little there.

This is what I assumed.

#3 You are lying.

Ethona · January 2015

BBSooner wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

Bouvin wrote: »

dietlime wrote: »

I somehow doubt the game collapses now that it's free to play. Think about all the people that just sort of like it, bought it, but don't subscribe because they don't feel that strongly about it? Those people will actually play now.

Ya.

Just look at LoTRO after F2P.

It pretty much died, despite the influx of new players at the beginning of the switch.

Why did that happen? Because you actually need revenue to pay for game development. And when revenue starts to drop off, guess what? Game development ceases.

That's exactly what happened with LoTRO.

WHAT? What you've stated about LOTRO is 100% completely false! LOTRO has had a handful of fairly large expansions with good content since it's F2P conversion and the world has tons of active players. You shouldn't spread misleading info because you're emo taking arrows to both knees at random.

Uh, no. The quality of content has been steadily decreasing since SoA. LotRO is a shell of what it was, even if we part opinions in what "quality content" LotRO has to different people it's clear the store is pointed to at every opportunity, and was confirmed by Sapience around a year ago iirc that they have no plans on developing new raids in the foreseeable future (content that apparently didn't have the quality/support to be created when compared to the return they could get by popping out some more landscape fetch quests and sell it in the store). It truly is a shame what happened to LotRO (founder here).

That Sap you mention is a joke and so thankful the Sap has ran dry and no longer spreads corruption upon those boards. It's your opinion about how you feel for the game, fine, but it's my opinion that the game is still doing well for it self and plenty of folks enjoy it. B2P didn't kill Skyrim did it? B2P won't kill ESO either lest nay sayers spreading doubt run ppl away from the game. Soon enough we all will see in time how the games does and I'm pretty sure the game will be here for years to come. You may not be playing it but that doesn't mean it died.

Skyrim isn't an MMO. Skyrim doesn't include previously enjoyed 4-6 week updates that expand player enjoyment. Skyrim is no longer supported with patches and official updates. Hell, Bethesda still has game halting bugs in all of their single player titles (not just Skyrim) that luckily community mods patch for us.

I never said I wouldn't be playing, and never said it would die. I have, however, openly discussed the very real possibility (and incredibly likely at that) that over time the focus will shift from releasing fun/interesting/diverse content towards a focus on what will make the most money if sold on the cash shop.

You disliking Sapience is one thing, but whether you dislike them or not it doesn't change Turbines official stance towards whether they'd develop quality content or throw some busy work on a landscape and sell it in a store.

The day ZOS goes from making good qul content to crap content is the day I spend no more money on the game just as if I cancel my sub to the game. The ball is in their hands, of course it is, which is why we are doing nothing but wasting our times talking about all of this. They probably sit back and LOL at us anyways. However, nothing we can say or do right now to change their minds about B2P. So honestly let's all just hope it turns out to be a good thing. Personally I hope the game does make you happy and everyone else happy. It will take time for some players to put this change behind them. I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. I just hope that the next expansion is good because someday the dream is going to come to an end. I'm not blinded to that future at all.

Anyways It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Samadhi · January 2015

Ethona wrote: »

... I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer. ...

Not familiar with LOTRO, so must ask what makes you feel this way.
What is corrupt about what they are doing?

Ethona · January 2015

Emencie wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

Emencie wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

Let me explain EXACTLY why "Free to play" is not really "free to play"(even though technically ESO is going Buy to play)

You may not have to pay a sub fee, but you and your girlfriend will still have to pay for DLC(the new zones like wrothgar, murkmire, etc) as well as anything else ZOS charges for. They have to make money somehow.

Now that there is no 15 a month sub fee, you could find yourself paying MORE than the original sub fee to play the game.

Tell me, how is that "free to pay"?

It isn't. so enjoy that mentality of yours; because soon reality is going to come crashing down VERY hard on you.

Let me explain to you that in every B2P and F2P forums I find folks like you preaching about how we'll end up spending tons more. I have played tons of B2P/F2P games and in almost all but a few I spent ZERO cash ever mainly because the games were never worth it. However, in those that I did spend cash I never had to spend any at all. I only spent cash for some things I valued for my char and playtime. At NO time EVER in any of those games have I spent more than 50 dollars in their cash shop over the years of playing those games. I have spent money buying expansions (DLC) though so long as the content was worth playing. I'm talking about the only few good B2P/F2P games here such as RIFT, SWTOR, LOTRO. This LIE about how players will find themselves spending more than before is just that LIES lest these ppl have zero control at spending their money. That's a problem they have and not for me to worry about. This game is going B2P so man up and deal with it or go back to ["World of Crycraft: Money Coming To Me" note all money goes to blizzard]

How could you possibly Play LOTRO or SWTOR without spending any money?

Are we talking about you playing 3 hours a month or something?

SWTOR has a lockout to everything, literally! You cannot do any end game content, or PvP. Last time I was in LOTRO it was in the same boat. Can you even get to SWTOR level cap without paying these days? I'm pretty sure you cannot. 3 dungeons a week, no raids, 5 PvP matches, and you cant even equip 80% of the end game gear without purchasing a pass!

Hell Just in expansions SWTOR is over $50.00 right now... Do you not have any expansion? Even if you are spending every waking moment creating characters to achievement farm cartel points you are maxing out at roughly 10cc/hour a value so minimal it's laughable.

I'm calling BS on this, either you don't play enough to even get to the locked content, which means you barely count as casual, or you have spent a lot more than you think on micro transactions.

A) It would be a good thing to be a bit more mindful and not assume every player desires end-game content such as raiding or pvp. I play SWTOR as F2P and exp the story and buy the expansion content. I never said I didn't buy expansions or that I wouldn't spend money in a cash shop for fluffy items. I only said that in all of these games less than 50 dollars in the cash shop got me what I need to enjoy the game forever and ever along with buying expansions if they were worth it. You either didn't read all I said or you can't read or you're so emo right now that it's clouded your thoughts.

Both expansions for SWTOR does come to 50 dollars, and? Once again I enjoy buying good expansions and will do so for ESO if the expansions/DLC are worth it.

C) BS? How can you call BS on someone else playing and buying habits? Some ppl don't always play a game for stuff like raids and pvp. You know well enough like I do that you can exp all of SWTOR levels and Story driven content for free and that's exactly what I play that game for ONLY! When it comes to LOTRO I buy just the expansions and that's all I need to exp the story and leveling in LOTRO.

Why don't you go and grab some drink and food and cool off a little because you're not thinking straight.

ESO is now B2P and I will only buy DLC if it's worth it! That is how I wanted this game to be and I'm very much happy that the game is B2P now. I will enjoy the game for what's worth rather folks like you play it or not. Honestly I won't miss any of you if you leave.

Im thinking completely straight because I played SWTOR. I just know that at less than $50.00 spent you would have to fall into one of three categories to claim what you are claiming.

#1 You don't play the game enough to get to any of the lockouts so it doesn't matter to you, You don't PvP, you don't raid, you don't run more than 3 flashpoints a week, you don't participate in trade (more than 2 items listed) You don't use any of the advanced chat features or channels, and only run 3 space missions a week. You have no elite gear and likely don't participate in any events because you cannot wear or use any event rewards.

If this is the case, your opinion has very little value because you haven't even played or experienced the game past the leveling storyline which is a very short experience in SWTOR.

#2 You have paid for more than $50.00 worth of content you just don't realize it because it was a little here a little there.

This is what I assumed.

#3 You are lying.

1= You're right, I only play the game for the story and that's it. Because I only play the game for the story than I do not need to spend loads in the cash shop to open up content that I don't play and never will play. Thus I'm right when I said earlier that I spend less than 50 dollars in any cash shop in any game. I have the choice to play and pay for what I want and kudos to SWTOR for giving me that option. Also Kudos to ZOS for giving me that future as well.

2=You're right and wrong here. I haven't leveled up every class just yet to exp all of the stories but I'm only lacking two classes on the imp side to do so. Once I have those to level up through story .. then I would have nothing to do but sit here and wait for them to put out another expansion that I may or may not buy! My opinion is and always will be my opinion. You do not accept my opinion and I'm ok with that because you are just someone I do not know in this world other than your lack of comprehension.

3=I paid for the game when it was release and paid for a sub as well for nearly a year. You can add that up if you wish but after the game went F2P they gave me a pile of store credits for some reason which I have used for this and that over the years. I still have about 100 something of those coins left over even! The only two things I spent money on after f2p was the first and second expansion. I also enjoy every bit of it in my OWN way.

It's my opinion that you seem upset that I was able to get enjoyment out of a F2P game without spending more than 50 dollars during it's F2P. Anyways you will probably keep replying to me and honestly I want to play some ESO right now. I tell you what though, I will take the moral high ground by simply not replying to anymore of your posts that are directed at me. Oh don't worry, I won't give in.

Emencie · January 2015

Samadhi wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

... I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer. ...

Not familiar with LOTRO, so must ask what makes you feel this way.
What is corrupt about what they are doing?

It's a system designed to part certain personality types from their money with some morally devious tactics. The problem with it when a games goes to F2P is we get to watch the game development go from, "What is fun for our players?" to "What will make people fork over more money?"
I was going to explain it more to you but honestly I cannot do it better than Extra credits did.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwI0u9L4R8U

BBSooner · January 2015

Emencie wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

... I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer. ...

Not familiar with LOTRO, so must ask what makes you feel this way.
What is corrupt about what they are doing?

The problem with it when a games goes to F2P is we get to watch the game development go from, "What is fun for our players?" to "What will make people fork over more money?"

So much this. It's a business, they want to make money, I'm fine with the premise. People that pretend this switch in mindset didn't happen or say "I don't think <studio ruled by a major media Corp. who are neither gamers nor interested in the best direction of the IP in terms of non-monetary popularity> will do it to their fans this time " are what I don't understand. The source of income for the product had changed, the product will change to maximize that income. These changes are specifically designed to make the game just fun enough (RE: restrict development to minimal costs) to keep the player putting cash towards it.

Ethona · January 2015

Samadhi wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

... I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer. ...

Not familiar with LOTRO, so must ask what makes you feel this way.
What is corrupt about what they are doing?

I'm guessing you're asking about the fan? Well it's just my opinion that the fan like so many and well all for-profit business put profits first and the blades are just cutting deeper. Other things happens too but you'd need to spend vast time reading the story. That's all I have time to say and all I'm going to say when it comes to my opinions on fan blades.

Tonnopesce · January 2015

WhiskyBob wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwI0u9L4R8U
and this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXA559KNopI

I do think that this is something who got my interest but as a father i can assure you that the 90% of the companies out there are abusing the uman psiche in order to obtain money even in games specifically designed for childrens.
This makes me a little bit worried on how far they can go
quick example i do have a tablet and i have installed a lot of "free games" even designed for childrens in order to entertain my son well... when we go out for dinner when we have to wait for someting..ect
a month has passed and i saw that all the games (ok maybe we can take out the 10%) have something inside that is just not right...
in order to avoid this i've buyed to my son a 3ds with mario and stuff since there i'm shure that his mind dont get abused in order to gain more money.
Now i can reconnaise when a company is doing bad buisness with his game and you know i like a lot THIS game so i will continue to complain since i will be shure that the ZOS is going the right way

sorry bad english

Samadhi · January 2015

Emencie wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

... I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer. ...

Not familiar with LOTRO, so must ask what makes you feel this way.
What is corrupt about what they are doing?

It's a system designed to part certain personality types from their money with some morally devious tactics. The problem with it when a games goes to F2P is we get to watch the game development go from, "What is fun for our players?" to "What will make people fork over more money?"
I was going to explain it more to you but honestly I cannot do it better than Extra credits did.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwI0u9L4R8U

Thank you for the post, though it does make me less comfortable with ZOS decision than previously. Gave you an Insightful.

It is difficult for me to believe that developers who wanted the game to thrive with a subscription model were the arbiters of the decision to go f2p.
If the decision to go f2p was made on the basis of potential financial success rather than player satisfaction (as it seems to have been), then the entire basis of going down the f2p path has begun with a tainted step.

Vis · January 2015

dietlime wrote: »

I'm sure I am not alone in being excited to be able to play for free! I have two computers, two accounts, but can't afford $30 a month just for one game for me and my girl, when so many others don't have a subscription fee.

Can't afford $30 a month? You and your girl have bigger problems and should probably not be gaming until they are addressed.

Ethona · January 2015

BBSooner wrote: »

Emencie wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

... I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer. ...

Not familiar with LOTRO, so must ask what makes you feel this way.
What is corrupt about what they are doing?

The problem with it when a games goes to F2P is we get to watch the game development go from, "What is fun for our players?" to "What will make people fork over more money?"

So much this. It's a business, they want to make money, I'm fine with the premise. People that pretend this switch in mindset didn't happen or say "I don't think <studio ruled by a major media Corp. who are neither gamers nor interested in the best direction of the IP in terms of non-monetary popularity> will do it to their fans this time " are what I don't understand. The source of income for the product had changed, the product will change to maximize that income. These changes are specifically designed to make the game just fun enough (RE: restrict development to minimal costs) to keep the player putting cash towards it.

Exactly! If it wasn't for the fairly decent player base for LOTRO it would have died many times over. I treat LOTRO as a B2P game which shields me from their oppressive store and allows me to still share my playtime with those I came to know and care about. It's a sad thing what has happen to that game but they can't keep it going forever.

F2P is a model that if done right could be a beautiful thing. However, F2P allows for massive greed and corruption which nearly always happens. This turns F2P into a oppressive model. Sometimes though they're some F2P games that has B2P pay/play routs built into them, like lotro, that still allows me to exp the story and hang with friends. The only wrong to that is by me paying for expansions I'm kind of part of the problem of funding such a bad business model.

Which is why I'm glad that ZOS went B2P and not F2P because that means .. there's still time left!

Tonnopesce · January 2015

Samadhi wrote: »

Emencie wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

... I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer. ...

Not familiar with LOTRO, so must ask what makes you feel this way.
What is corrupt about what they are doing?

It's a system designed to part certain personality types from their money with some morally devious tactics. The problem with it when a games goes to F2P is we get to watch the game development go from, "What is fun for our players?" to "What will make people fork over more money?"
I was going to explain it more to you but honestly I cannot do it better than Extra credits did.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwI0u9L4R8U

Thank you for the post, though it does make me less comfortable with ZOS decision than previously. Gave you an Insightful.
It is difficult for me to believe that developers who wanted the game to thrive with a subscription model were the arbiters of the decision to go f2p.
If the decision to go f2p was made on the basis of potential financial success rather than player satisfaction (as it seems to have been), then the entire basis of going down the f2p path has begun with a tainted step.

Sorry but i dont see it like you:
I do belive in ZOS good company since i belive that the change model was due to the console "premium" membership so it was a decision made for the players , unfortunatly not for us PC Mustardrace players.
For this reason i want to see where is going.

BBSooner · January 2015

Ethona wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Emencie wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

... I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer. ...

Not familiar with LOTRO, so must ask what makes you feel this way.
What is corrupt about what they are doing?

The problem with it when a games goes to F2P is we get to watch the game development go from, "What is fun for our players?" to "What will make people fork over more money?"

So much this. It's a business, they want to make money, I'm fine with the premise. People that pretend this switch in mindset didn't happen or say "I don't think <studio ruled by a major media Corp. who are neither gamers nor interested in the best direction of the IP in terms of non-monetary popularity> will do it to their fans this time " are what I don't understand. The source of income for the product had changed, the product will change to maximize that income. These changes are specifically designed to make the game just fun enough (RE: restrict development to minimal costs) to keep the player putting cash towards it.

Which is why I'm glad that ZOS went B2P and not F2P because that means .. there's still time left!

The only difference is they get an initial burst of income from box sales. Since box sales aren't sustainable in the long term the path is set for the cash shop being the primary income source.

Kraven · January 2015

Already, from their FB page:

The Elder Scrolls Online
35 mins ·

Look I get the sub fee on pc but not on consoles I was planning on getting this the day it came out but after finding out theres a 15/month fee for xbox one I decided not to along with hundreds of others its bad enough we have to pay 60/year for xbox live amd 60$ a game i averaged 180/year with this for xbox so pleasr do us a fav and drop the monthly fees for consoles thats just robbery!

Elder scrolls charge 60 for thw game and 15 a month to play add thay to xbox one 60/year no game yet charged you to play you just need gold membership why cant they be the same

‎The Elder Scrolls Online
7 hrs ·

Is this game charging a subscription fee to play ??? Keep being told it is ????

thanks fella wass gutted when i heard bout them charging loved skyrim
Like · 6 hrs

The Elder Scrolls Online
14 hrs · Edited ·

I must say after playing the alpha and beta and being disgusted by the utter disgrace of screwing over the elder scrolls fanbase for bratty WoW mmo fanboys and making it p2p , I am glad to hear this is going b2p ( hopefully it stays b2p and does not go full f2p). The game still has issues but as long as Zenimax does not micro-transaction the crap out of this game ( like EA and SWTOR) then this game will see a surge of new players and a new age. Just remember Zenimax to remember the fans that made you great and you will stay successful.

You silly subscribers "Zenimax to remember the fans that made you great" obviously refers to those who quit after a week,

These are your new players. Those expecting Skyriim. Those that were previously 'Disgusted' with game play. And those already bitching that sub still exists at all.

Gameplay is the same.
It's still not Skyriim online.
Those of you continuing to pay the sub are now the elitist *** you throw a fit about others being.

Sooooo, how long do you really expect these players to hang around? Long enough to keep the MMO up and running for over a decade like sub based games do? Or in for a quick buck like all other fly by night MMOs that have come out recently?

Considering the developers reason for being subscription based anyway was quoted on several occasions as being "To deliver a top quality game they could be proud of making and the players would enjoy to play. To not make developmental sacrifices that the other models require."
And now? They have already admitted that not only will quality of content decline but that their developers can't even be proud of the game their making now because of the sacrifices to content and integrity of the product.

Hey defend it all you want. And some of you have gotten quite defensive about it, but IF you believe what they say then you have to believe it all. Pick and choose when they're being honest? Based on?

Vis · January 2015

Ethona wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Emencie wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

... I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer. ...

Not familiar with LOTRO, so must ask what makes you feel this way.
What is corrupt about what they are doing?

The problem with it when a games goes to F2P is we get to watch the game development go from, "What is fun for our players?" to "What will make people fork over more money?"

So much this. It's a business, they want to make money, I'm fine with the premise. People that pretend this switch in mindset didn't happen or say "I don't think <studio ruled by a major media Corp. who are neither gamers nor interested in the best direction of the IP in terms of non-monetary popularity> will do it to their fans this time " are what I don't understand. The source of income for the product had changed, the product will change to maximize that income. These changes are specifically designed to make the game just fun enough (RE: restrict development to minimal costs) to keep the player putting cash towards it.

Exactly! If it wasn't for the fairly decent player base for LOTRO it would have died many times over. I treat LOTRO as a B2P game which shields me from their oppressive store and allows me to still share my playtime with those I came to know and care about. It's a sad thing what has happen to that game but they can't keep it going forever.

F2P is a model that if done right could be a beautiful thing. However, F2P allows for massive greed and corruption which nearly always happens. This turns F2P into a oppressive model. Sometimes though they're some F2P games that has B2P pay/play routs built into them, like lotro, that still allows me to exp the story and hang with friends. The only wrong to that is by me paying for expansions I'm kind of part of the problem of funding such a bad business model.

Which is why I'm glad that ZOS went B2P and not F2P because that means .. there's still time left!

LOTRO is the embodiment of what is wrong about b2p and f2p games. For those not familiar with Lotro's p2w decline, take it from a former Lotro whale, or see the shop for yourself:

http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/LOTRO_Store

Tonnopesce · January 2015

Kraven wrote: »

Already, from their FB page:

The Elder Scrolls Online
35 mins ·

Look I get the sub fee on pc but not on consoles I was planning on getting this the day it came out but after finding out theres a 15/month fee for xbox one I decided not to along with hundreds of others its bad enough we have to pay 60/year for xbox live amd 60$ a game i averaged 180/year with this for xbox so pleasr do us a fav and drop the monthly fees for consoles thats just robbery!

Elder scrolls charge 60 for thw game and 15 a month to play add thay to xbox one 60/year no game yet charged you to play you just need gold membership why cant they be the same

‎The Elder Scrolls Online
7 hrs ·

Is this game charging a subscription fee to play ??? Keep being told it is ????

thanks fella wass gutted when i heard bout them charging loved skyrim
Like · 6 hrs

The Elder Scrolls Online
14 hrs · Edited ·

I must say after playing the alpha and beta and being disgusted by the utter disgrace of screwing over the elder scrolls fanbase for bratty WoW mmo fanboys and making it p2p , I am glad to hear this is going b2p ( hopefully it stays b2p and does not go full f2p). The game still has issues but as long as Zenimax does not micro-transaction the crap out of this game ( like EA and SWTOR) then this game will see a surge of new players and a new age. Just remember Zenimax to remember the fans that made you great and you will stay successful.

You silly subscribers "Zenimax to remember the fans that made you great" obviously refers to those who quit after a week,

These are your new players. Those expecting Skyriim. Those that were previously 'Disgusted' with game play. And those already bitching that sub still exists at all.

Gameplay is the same.
It's still not Skyriim online.
Those of you continuing to pay the sub are now the elitist *** you throw a fit about others being.

Sooooo, how long do you really expect these players to hang around? Long enough to keep the MMO up and running for over a decade like sub based games do? Or in for a quick buck like all other fly by night MMOs that have come out recently?

Considering the developers reason for being subscription based anyway was quoted on several occasions as being "To deliver a top quality game they could be proud of making and the players would enjoy to play. To not make developmental sacrifices that the other models require."
And now? They have already admitted that not only will quality of content decline but that their developers can't even be proud of the game their making now because of the sacrifices to content and integrity of the product.

Hey defend it all you want. And some of you have gotten quite defensive about it, but IF you believe what they say then you have to believe it all. Pick and choose when they're being honest? Based on?

Just to know with the "over a decade" game you are referring to WOW.....
GRATZ it was the first and only MMO of his time..... they have the 90% of the word subscriptions but i do belive that even blizzard if coming out with a new game it will be B2P or F2p.... o wait it has already happened.... WOW is the last of his genere now move on please.

Samadhi · January 2015

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Emencie wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Ethona wrote: »

... I also agree that LOTRO is going down hill but that's not because of the game model. It's my opinion that the folks in charge of the fan has became corrupt to the point of utter greed and no longer have the heart of a gamer. ...

Not familiar with LOTRO, so must ask what makes you feel this way.
What is corrupt about what they are doing?

It's a system designed to part certain personality types from their money with some morally devious tactics. The problem with it when a games goes to F2P is we get to watch the game development go from, "What is fun for our players?" to "What will make people fork over more money?"
I was going to explain it more to you but honestly I cannot do it better than Extra credits did.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwI0u9L4R8U

Thank you for the post, though it does make me less comfortable with ZOS decision than previously. Gave you an Insightful.
It is difficult for me to believe that developers who wanted the game to thrive with a subscription model were the arbiters of the decision to go f2p.
If the decision to go f2p was made on the basis of potential financial success rather than player satisfaction (as it seems to have been), then the entire basis of going down the f2p path has begun with a tainted step.

Sorry but i dont see it like you:
I do belive in ZOS good company since i belive that the change model was due to the console "premium" membership so it was a decision made for the players , unfortunatly not for us PC Mustardrace players.
For this reason i want to see where is going.

No need to apologize, have no expectations of everyone feeling the same about an issue.
Also want to see where this is going, and personally will continue purchasing Game Time Cards in the exact same capacity as present. If the system becomes a pay2win and my subscription is no longer sufficient to keep pace with the game, will reconsider staying at that point.
It remains difficult to believe that the decision was made with more than revenue in mind though. Perhaps just feel this way due to how the game was portrayed as being conceived as subscription from the ground up, and that free2play was classed by those involved with content as being less desirable than simply shutting down.