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Guild Traders a lesson in elitist trading
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SteveCampsOut✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭timidobserver wrote: »SteveCampsOut wrote: »I make plenty of money in the current system but I think some sort of regional marketplace where guilds could buy in to share traders would be a better solution for buyers and sellers.
As for how guilds can afford the fees: yes many do raffles to afford the bids (which can be fun in their own right) but some can pay for themselves. Let's say I make 100,000 gold in sales in a store in one week and the guild gets 3.5%. Any guild with 100 comparable sellers can easily make enough to pay for a kiosk. Honestly the guilds that pressure members to pay out of their own funds when they can't sustain costs with their sales (I hear about this but haven't experienced it myself) are doing everyone a disservice.
It happens. I dumped two such guilds personally. And it's because of their practices that I'm leery of ever joining any new guild that holds raffles.
I can understand having an issue with guilds that force members to pay in, but what is the problem with optional raffles or requests for donations.
They still hyper inflate the cost of bidding on City Kiosks above what is sustainable by the kiosk sales. How many Guilds do you know that can truthfully sustain bids on kiosks ranging from a quarter of a million a week to a million based on sales alone?
Edited by SteveCampsOut on December 27, 2014 7:39PM@ֆȶɛʋɛƈǟʍքֆօʊȶ⍟
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Erik Ramzey CH782 Nightblade AD
Growling Kahjiti CH782 Nightblade EP
One of Many Faces CH782 Sorcerer DC
Grumpasaurus Rex CH782 Warden DCGuildmaster of Pacrooti's Hirelings AD Based LGBT Friendly Guild.
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timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭SteveCampsOut wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »SteveCampsOut wrote: »I make plenty of money in the current system but I think some sort of regional marketplace where guilds could buy in to share traders would be a better solution for buyers and sellers.
As for how guilds can afford the fees: yes many do raffles to afford the bids (which can be fun in their own right) but some can pay for themselves. Let's say I make 100,000 gold in sales in a store in one week and the guild gets 3.5%. Any guild with 100 comparable sellers can easily make enough to pay for a kiosk. Honestly the guilds that pressure members to pay out of their own funds when they can't sustain costs with their sales (I hear about this but haven't experienced it myself) are doing everyone a disservice.
It happens. I dumped two such guilds personally. And it's because of their practices that I'm leery of ever joining any new guild that holds raffles.
I can understand having an issue with guilds that force members to pay in, but what is the problem with optional raffles or requests for donations.
They still hyper inflate the cost of bidding on City Kiosks above what is sustainable by the kiosk sales. How many Guilds do you know that can truthfully sustain bids on kiosks ranging from a quarter of a million a week to a million based on sales alone?
Ummm, no. What hyper inflates the cost of bidding is the fact that anybody can join your guild and see what you are bidding. The result is guilds placing a massive bid to discourage people from trying to snipe their kiosk.
As long as it is 100% optional I don't see a problem with members chipping in in order to keep their store in a good sot.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
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SteveCampsOut✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭timidobserver wrote: »SteveCampsOut wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »SteveCampsOut wrote: »I make plenty of money in the current system but I think some sort of regional marketplace where guilds could buy in to share traders would be a better solution for buyers and sellers.
As for how guilds can afford the fees: yes many do raffles to afford the bids (which can be fun in their own right) but some can pay for themselves. Let's say I make 100,000 gold in sales in a store in one week and the guild gets 3.5%. Any guild with 100 comparable sellers can easily make enough to pay for a kiosk. Honestly the guilds that pressure members to pay out of their own funds when they can't sustain costs with their sales (I hear about this but haven't experienced it myself) are doing everyone a disservice.
It happens. I dumped two such guilds personally. And it's because of their practices that I'm leery of ever joining any new guild that holds raffles.
I can understand having an issue with guilds that force members to pay in, but what is the problem with optional raffles or requests for donations.
They still hyper inflate the cost of bidding on City Kiosks above what is sustainable by the kiosk sales. How many Guilds do you know that can truthfully sustain bids on kiosks ranging from a quarter of a million a week to a million based on sales alone?
Ummm, no. What hyper inflates the cost of bidding is the fact that anybody can join your guild and see what you are bidding. The result is guilds placing a massive bid to discourage people from trying to snipe their kiosk.
As long as it is 100% optional I don't see a problem with members chipping in in order to keep their store in a good sot.
We disagree. Mainly because your example only holds water if the bid is shown in the guild history long enough for a spy to catch and report and most of these large guilds have been waiting til the last second to place their bids precisely because of the spying issue for months now and yet the costs of the kiosks has NOT gone down one iota!Edited by SteveCampsOut on December 27, 2014 7:49PM@ֆȶɛʋɛƈǟʍքֆօʊȶ⍟
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Sheenara Soulstrong CH782 Dragonknight DC
Erik Ramzey CH782 Nightblade AD
Growling Kahjiti CH782 Nightblade EP
One of Many Faces CH782 Sorcerer DC
Grumpasaurus Rex CH782 Warden DCGuildmaster of Pacrooti's Hirelings AD Based LGBT Friendly Guild.
Stefrex Souliss CH701 Sorcerer AD
Grumpy Kahjiti CH701 Dragonknight DC
Slithisi Ksissi CH701 Nightblade EP
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Josie-The-Pussi-Cat CH701 Templar AD
Stug-Grog M'God CH701 Templar DC
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Trixie Truskan CH701 Sorcerer EP
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Epsilon_Echo✭✭✭✭martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »Epsilon_Echo wrote: »
Well that's where we have to draw the line isn't it? Do you want a generic slot machine where you dump gear and get gold, or do you want a whole extra subsystem of the game where effort leads to greater reward?
The devs opted for the latter and I agree.
And thats where we actually agree.
The anti-AH brigade hailed that kiosks would be a fairer system than an AH but we both agree that the current system favours more effort and is not a level playing field.
Trading should not be effort v reward like with itemisation or pve.
The trading framework is a system that should favour everyone.
Well since we know where each other stands let's explore the opinions. If we can't persuade each other I will simply voice my opinion and let any reader who cares take note.
Trade, in itself, is fair. That meaning, that no parties partakes against their will and no party pays more than what they personally think an item is worth.
For this reason I am against global action houses. Not only do I feel the current system is more interesting for reasons ready listed, but I feel global auction houses cause un-natural market trends for crafters. In games where crafting isn't as robust this is a non-issue. In ESO players wishing to make money on say, food, need lots of raw materials. Most of these materials have no value individually. The finished product may sell reasonably but if there is no value in mass harvesting then the secondary market for raw mats wouldn't exist. Thus everyone would have to harvest their own raw mats, greatly limiting supply and increasing prices. If all sellers were to pool all their raw materials into the ah then the price would plumet, supply would tank, finished product prices would rise. Want proof of theory? 6 months ago purple vr5 food was 300% more expensive than it is now. Smaller segmented traders allow for greater supply and growth potential for smaller seller's, otherwise we would still have those same dozen people selling purples in zone chat. True elitists3 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Alphashado wrote: »Alphashado wrote: »I've never yet managed to find a single item that I was looking for on a guild trader's kiosk. I can't sell anything because I refuse to join a guild solely for that purpose. The whole system is completely borked and defended only by those few who are profiting from it. The supreme irony is that they defend the system on the ground that a global auction house would lead to inflated prices
!
The game needs a fully effective public trading system, preferably faction-based.
There have been several polls on this topic and people like you are always surprised and amazed at how much support it gets. Believe it or not, this system is enjoyed by the majority of people playing the game and actually using it.
Simply untrue.
In this poll, only 39% liked the present system.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/136341/are-you-happy-with-esos-trade-system/p1
In this one, only 40% opposed an auction house.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/99659/do-you-want-an-auction-house/p1
I could go on...
Maybe you should take a closer look at those polls. Or better yet, let me rephrase my statement. You will not find a poll showing that a majority of players wants an auction house instead.
Too funny that you can only oppose my comments by changing your premise, and then adopting that new premise you claim there's no poll showing that a majority of players want an auction house when my second linked poll shows precisely that, with 59% wanting an auction house! 2 -
Slurg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭SteveCampsOut wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »SteveCampsOut wrote: »I make plenty of money in the current system but I think some sort of regional marketplace where guilds could buy in to share traders would be a better solution for buyers and sellers.
As for how guilds can afford the fees: yes many do raffles to afford the bids (which can be fun in their own right) but some can pay for themselves. Let's say I make 100,000 gold in sales in a store in one week and the guild gets 3.5%. Any guild with 100 comparable sellers can easily make enough to pay for a kiosk. Honestly the guilds that pressure members to pay out of their own funds when they can't sustain costs with their sales (I hear about this but haven't experienced it myself) are doing everyone a disservice.
It happens. I dumped two such guilds personally. And it's because of their practices that I'm leery of ever joining any new guild that holds raffles.
I can understand having an issue with guilds that force members to pay in, but what is the problem with optional raffles or requests for donations.
They still hyper inflate the cost of bidding on City Kiosks above what is sustainable by the kiosk sales. How many Guilds do you know that can truthfully sustain bids on kiosks ranging from a quarter of a million a week to a million based on sales alone?
Three that I know of easily make more than a quarter mill per week off store sales, and I'm sure there are many more.
Raffles should be a fun optional activity to boost the guild coffers, not the sole source of income, and they are fun and optional in the trade guilds I've been a part of. If you're in a guild that pressures you to pay to sell, it's time to find a new trade guild. There are plenty out there.Happy All the Holidays To You and Yours!
Remembering better days of less RNG in all the things.0 -
Slurg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Alphashado wrote: »Alphashado wrote: »I've never yet managed to find a single item that I was looking for on a guild trader's kiosk. I can't sell anything because I refuse to join a guild solely for that purpose. The whole system is completely borked and defended only by those few who are profiting from it. The supreme irony is that they defend the system on the ground that a global auction house would lead to inflated prices!
The game needs a fully effective public trading system, preferably faction-based.
There have been several polls on this topic and people like you are always surprised and amazed at how much support it gets. Believe it or not, this system is enjoyed by the majority of people playing the game and actually using it.
Simply untrue.
In this poll, only 39% liked the present system.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/136341/are-you-happy-with-esos-trade-system/p1
In this one, only 40% opposed an auction house.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/99659/do-you-want-an-auction-house/p1
I could go on...
Maybe you should take a closer look at those polls. Or better yet, let me rephrase my statement. You will not find a poll showing that a majority of players wants an auction house instead.
Too funny that you can only oppose my comments by changing your premise, and then adopting that new premise you claim there's no poll showing that a majority of players want an auction house when my second linked poll shows precisely that, with 59% wanting an auction house!
Your "proof' is a poll from May 20, long before the existing system was in place. I think if you want people to take you seriously it would help to point to something more recent.Happy All the Holidays To You and Yours!
Remembering better days of less RNG in all the things.2 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Alphashado wrote: »Alphashado wrote: »I've never yet managed to find a single item that I was looking for on a guild trader's kiosk. I can't sell anything because I refuse to join a guild solely for that purpose. The whole system is completely borked and defended only by those few who are profiting from it. The supreme irony is that they defend the system on the ground that a global auction house would lead to inflated prices!
The game needs a fully effective public trading system, preferably faction-based.
There have been several polls on this topic and people like you are always surprised and amazed at how much support it gets. Believe it or not, this system is enjoyed by the majority of people playing the game and actually using it.
Simply untrue.
In this poll, only 39% liked the present system.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/136341/are-you-happy-with-esos-trade-system/p1
In this one, only 40% opposed an auction house.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/99659/do-you-want-an-auction-house/p1
I could go on...
Maybe you should take a closer look at those polls. Or better yet, let me rephrase my statement. You will not find a poll showing that a majority of players wants an auction house instead.
Too funny that you can only oppose my comments by changing your premise, and then adopting that new premise you claim there's no poll showing that a majority of players want an auction house when my second linked poll shows precisely that, with 59% wanting an auction house!
Your "proof' is a poll from May 20, long before the existing system was in place. I think if you want people to take you seriously it would help to point to something more recent.
That poll showed people wanted an auction house, but they didn't get it, they got instead the present system which the first link I gave showed was supported by only 39% - in a poll taken in October.2 -
Slurg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Alphashado wrote: »Alphashado wrote: »I've never yet managed to find a single item that I was looking for on a guild trader's kiosk. I can't sell anything because I refuse to join a guild solely for that purpose. The whole system is completely borked and defended only by those few who are profiting from it. The supreme irony is that they defend the system on the ground that a global auction house would lead to inflated prices!
The game needs a fully effective public trading system, preferably faction-based.
There have been several polls on this topic and people like you are always surprised and amazed at how much support it gets. Believe it or not, this system is enjoyed by the majority of people playing the game and actually using it.
Simply untrue.
In this poll, only 39% liked the present system.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/136341/are-you-happy-with-esos-trade-system/p1
In this one, only 40% opposed an auction house.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/99659/do-you-want-an-auction-house/p1
I could go on...
Maybe you should take a closer look at those polls. Or better yet, let me rephrase my statement. You will not find a poll showing that a majority of players wants an auction house instead.
Too funny that you can only oppose my comments by changing your premise, and then adopting that new premise you claim there's no poll showing that a majority of players want an auction house when my second linked poll shows precisely that, with 59% wanting an auction house!
Your "proof' is a poll from May 20, long before the existing system was in place. I think if you want people to take you seriously it would help to point to something more recent.
That poll showed people wanted an auction house, but they didn't get it, they got instead the present system which the first link I gave showed was supported by only 39% - in a poll taken in October.
And 5% of the respondents to that poll voted "Squirrel". You really want to make your stand on that?
One thing ZOS has been very consistent about in their messaging from the beginning is there will be no global auction house. I think everyone's time is better spent providing constructive feedback on non-global auction house trading options.Happy All the Holidays To You and Yours!
Remembering better days of less RNG in all the things.2 -
SteveCampsOut✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Alphashado wrote: »Alphashado wrote: »I've never yet managed to find a single item that I was looking for on a guild trader's kiosk. I can't sell anything because I refuse to join a guild solely for that purpose. The whole system is completely borked and defended only by those few who are profiting from it. The supreme irony is that they defend the system on the ground that a global auction house would lead to inflated prices!
The game needs a fully effective public trading system, preferably faction-based.
There have been several polls on this topic and people like you are always surprised and amazed at how much support it gets. Believe it or not, this system is enjoyed by the majority of people playing the game and actually using it.
Simply untrue.
In this poll, only 39% liked the present system.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/136341/are-you-happy-with-esos-trade-system/p1
In this one, only 40% opposed an auction house.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/99659/do-you-want-an-auction-house/p1
I could go on...
Maybe you should take a closer look at those polls. Or better yet, let me rephrase my statement. You will not find a poll showing that a majority of players wants an auction house instead.
Too funny that you can only oppose my comments by changing your premise, and then adopting that new premise you claim there's no poll showing that a majority of players want an auction house when my second linked poll shows precisely that, with 59% wanting an auction house!
Your "proof' is a poll from May 20, long before the existing system was in place. I think if you want people to take you seriously it would help to point to something more recent.
That poll showed people wanted an auction house, but they didn't get it, they got instead the present system which the first link I gave showed was supported by only 39% - in a poll taken in October.
Ignore him, he keeps moving the finish line to his argument. You'll never win.
@ֆȶɛʋɛƈǟʍքֆօʊȶ⍟
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Grumpy Kahjiti CH782 Dragonknight AD
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Erik Ramzey CH782 Nightblade AD
Growling Kahjiti CH782 Nightblade EP
One of Many Faces CH782 Sorcerer DC
Grumpasaurus Rex CH782 Warden DCGuildmaster of Pacrooti's Hirelings AD Based LGBT Friendly Guild.
Stefrex Souliss CH701 Sorcerer AD
Grumpy Kahjiti CH701 Dragonknight DC
Slithisi Ksissi CH701 Nightblade EP
Pokes-With-Fire CH701 Dragonknight AD
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Stug-Grog M'God CH701 Templar DC
One With Many Faces CH701 Nightblade DC
Trixie Truskan CH701 Sorcerer EP
Grumpetasaurus Rex CH701 Warden EP1 -
Tonnopesce✭✭✭✭✭
✭Usually i'm pretty homeless in game i go around with 8-900 gold... but evry week i gain 2k to donate into my trader guild and assuming that evry player do that is over 1millon evry week only from the players + the gain from the cuts evry guild can make easy 1.5 mil a week and is not an elitist mechanic, when i'm in farming mood i can made 200k gold a week easy so the best that i can do for my guild is give the possibility th have a kiosk.
The kiosk sistem works great.Signature2 -
RSram✭✭✭✭✭There should be a global auction house, or at least an alliance auction house. But Zenimax apparently has no intention to do this and instead wants everyone to wayshrine between 200 vendors just to find one item.
If only there was a way we could all find items easier and buy and sell without a hassle.....oh yeah, there is.
ESO Trade
Buy, trade, and sell whatever, whenever, wherever. I created this site for you guys, use it. It's not fancy but its better than what you have now, which is no auction house at all.
I agree, but an AH is never going to happen, but there should be a search engine to search all the kiosks in a zone at the very minimum. I myself had wasted 20,00 gold on an item that I later heard was selling for 5000 at another Kiosk in the same zone.1 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Alphashado wrote: »Alphashado wrote: »I've never yet managed to find a single item that I was looking for on a guild trader's kiosk. I can't sell anything because I refuse to join a guild solely for that purpose. The whole system is completely borked and defended only by those few who are profiting from it. The supreme irony is that they defend the system on the ground that a global auction house would lead to inflated prices!
The game needs a fully effective public trading system, preferably faction-based.
There have been several polls on this topic and people like you are always surprised and amazed at how much support it gets. Believe it or not, this system is enjoyed by the majority of people playing the game and actually using it.
Simply untrue.
In this poll, only 39% liked the present system.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/136341/are-you-happy-with-esos-trade-system/p1
In this one, only 40% opposed an auction house.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/99659/do-you-want-an-auction-house/p1
I could go on...
Maybe you should take a closer look at those polls. Or better yet, let me rephrase my statement. You will not find a poll showing that a majority of players wants an auction house instead.
Too funny that you can only oppose my comments by changing your premise, and then adopting that new premise you claim there's no poll showing that a majority of players want an auction house when my second linked poll shows precisely that, with 59% wanting an auction house!
Your "proof' is a poll from May 20, long before the existing system was in place. I think if you want people to take you seriously it would help to point to something more recent.
That poll showed people wanted an auction house, but they didn't get it, they got instead the present system which the first link I gave showed was supported by only 39% - in a poll taken in October.
And 5% of the respondents to that poll voted "Squirrel". You really want to make your stand on that?
Only if I wanted to show how unpopular squirrels were.
Next concern with the polls?1 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭SteveCampsOut wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »SteveCampsOut wrote: »timidobserver wrote: »SteveCampsOut wrote: »I make plenty of money in the current system but I think some sort of regional marketplace where guilds could buy in to share traders would be a better solution for buyers and sellers.
As for how guilds can afford the fees: yes many do raffles to afford the bids (which can be fun in their own right) but some can pay for themselves. Let's say I make 100,000 gold in sales in a store in one week and the guild gets 3.5%. Any guild with 100 comparable sellers can easily make enough to pay for a kiosk. Honestly the guilds that pressure members to pay out of their own funds when they can't sustain costs with their sales (I hear about this but haven't experienced it myself) are doing everyone a disservice.
It happens. I dumped two such guilds personally. And it's because of their practices that I'm leery of ever joining any new guild that holds raffles.
I can understand having an issue with guilds that force members to pay in, but what is the problem with optional raffles or requests for donations.
They still hyper inflate the cost of bidding on City Kiosks above what is sustainable by the kiosk sales. How many Guilds do you know that can truthfully sustain bids on kiosks ranging from a quarter of a million a week to a million based on sales alone?
Ummm, no. What hyper inflates the cost of bidding is the fact that anybody can join your guild and see what you are bidding. The result is guilds placing a massive bid to discourage people from trying to snipe their kiosk.
As long as it is 100% optional I don't see a problem with members chipping in in order to keep their store in a good sot.
We disagree. Mainly because your example only holds water if the bid is shown in the guild history long enough for a spy to catch and report and most of these large guilds have been waiting til the last second to place their bids precisely because of the spying issue for months now and yet the costs of the kiosks has NOT gone down one iota!
Waiting definitely doesn't solve the problem. Even if you wait until the last minute, someone can sit there and wait for you to bid and then quickly report it so that it can be one-upped. A massively large bid is less likely to be one-upped.
Though this is completely beside the point. People can do what they want to do. If they want to donate toward the trader that is fine. It would only be a problem to those that are stuck in a terrible location because they are too cheap to donate to their guild. The only problem I could see is forced or coerced donations by any guild, which would cause me to immediately quit any trade guild.Edited by timidobserver on December 27, 2014 11:46PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
smacx250✭✭✭✭✭
I'm in such a guild. Members are kicked for 7 day sales inactivity. And then new members are recruited in zone chat (all of them!) to replace them. No "resume" required, no "references" - you just respond and you are in. This happens continuously, is "fair", and it is "open to all" (hat's off to the GM who mostly does the guild as the "game"). You are in no way pressured to participate in the 100% voluntary 50/50 raffle held each week - which also has a bunch of other nice "extra" prizes thrown in as well (and I do participate because it is fun, and isn't that a good use of game gold?). Finally, as a "side benefit" there are always a huge number of guildies online and available to help for pretty much anything one needs.martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »And that's the problem. There you have a highly organised, active and well run Trade guild. With.....500 people. They have to do a huge amount of organising and recruiting just to get a good spot to sell.
Competition is fine for you because you are in that guild.
Its not a system that is fair and open to all.
All and all, I find the ESO economics an enjoyable part of the game - I would find little value in an esoBay, even if it made moving stuff (in or out) a bit easier.
0 -
gw2only1b14_ESO✭✭✭martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »gw2only1b14_ESO wrote: »martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »So this week none of my 3 trading guilds have a trader.
One of them was ousted even though the bid was 280,000g in Wayrest
We don't need a system with so many barriers to effective trading.
This is a far cry from the assertion that not having an AH would create an egalitarian system.
So now my 3 trading guilds have no trader for a whole week, making less money, making it harder to bid, and inevitably losing members. Effectively these guilds now have no access to the open market.
The elite guilds control the market.
We just want to trade, buy & sell and not have to put so much effort into bidding, recruiting etc.
If we are not to have an AH the current system needs some serious reworking.
Instead of sitting with no Trader Grab a Keep/resource in the PvP zones all but 1 server is pretty one sided and watch the sales roll in
Does anyone actually use those?
I do, and others , in fact for the hell of it I put stuff for the first time on ours and was sold by days end. So yea0 -
martinhpb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Epsilon_Echo wrote: »
Well since we know where each other stands let's explore the opinions. If we can't persuade each other I will simply voice my opinion and let any reader who cares take note.
Trade, in itself, is fair. That meaning, that no parties partakes against their will and no party pays more than what they personally think an item is worth.
-snip only for shortening-
Thanks for reply epsilon
Problem is its not fair because there aren't enough spots and unless you are in a proactive guild you are screwed. in fact even proactive guilds are getting screwed.
The bidding trade guild operation is getting in the way of a level field of trading for Joe Shmoe.
I hear that AH in some games has been troublesome.
I came from LOTRO. In 7 years there were never any probs with the AH. In terms of trading, to me, this beautiful game is in the stone age.At least the spelling is difficult for you.
Hew's Bane*4 -
martinhpb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Three that I know of easily make more than a quarter mill per week off store sales, and I'm sure there are many more.
Raffles should be a fun optional activity to boost the guild coffers, not the sole source of income, and they are fun and optional in the trade guilds I've been a part of. If you're in a guild that pressures you to pay to sell, it's time to find a new trade guild. There are plenty out there.
Like I said from the start, a few guilds have the best selling options and its not open to all.
Trading should not be a mini game in terms of having access to be able to sell.
Do we really need all this flim flam just to be able to sell our stuff.
Because some guilds manage it, which actually equates to a minority of players in terms of the server, doesn't mean it works.
Look beyond your walls and see the big picture.
There are more people out there who do not have access to sell.
We need a new system.Edited by martinhpb16_ESO on December 28, 2014 1:07AMAt least the spelling is difficult for you.
Hew's Bane*5 -
martinhpb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm in such a guild. Members are kicked for 7 day sales inactivity. And then new members are recruited in zone chat (all of them!) to replace them. No "resume" required, no "references" - you just respond and you are in. This happens continuously, is "fair", and it is "open to all" (hat's off to the GM who mostly does the guild as the "game"). You are in no way pressured to participate in the 100% voluntary 50/50 raffle held each week - which also has a bunch of other nice "extra" prizes thrown in as well (and I do participate because it is fun, and isn't that a good use of game gold?). Finally, as a "side benefit" there are always a huge number of guildies online and available to help for pretty much anything one needs.
All and all, I find the ESO economics an enjoyable part of the game - I would find little value in an esoBay, even if it made moving stuff (in or out) a bit easier.
Yet again another example of "I'm in a guild like that, It works, all is fine"
Dude the majority aren't. Get it?
If we all were, then hunky dory.
Its an unequal system, savvy ?Edited by martinhpb16_ESO on December 28, 2014 1:14AMAt least the spelling is difficult for you.
Hew's Bane*5 -
Lynnessa✭✭✭✭martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »I never wrote that. mis-quote Please sort your parentheses out, thanks.
Oops. Darn nested quotes. I think I fixed it.
1 -
smacx250✭✭✭✭✭
Believe me, if I can be in such a guild, just about anyone can be - I'm about as asocial as they come, and I only do maybe .2% of the weekly sales. Just watch zone chat and join, and then drop out and join another if it turns out to be a bust. Since early access I've only been in a total of six different guilds. It isn't an "all is fine" post, it is a "compared to the rest of the game, it isn't remotely difficult to be in a good trading guild" post. But I agree, you do need to do something - it isn't just handed to you like a global AH would be.martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »I'm in such a guild. Members are kicked for 7 day sales inactivity. And then new members are recruited in zone chat (all of them!) to replace them. No "resume" required, no "references" - you just respond and you are in. This happens continuously, is "fair", and it is "open to all" (hat's off to the GM who mostly does the guild as the "game"). You are in no way pressured to participate in the 100% voluntary 50/50 raffle held each week - which also has a bunch of other nice "extra" prizes thrown in as well (and I do participate because it is fun, and isn't that a good use of game gold?). Finally, as a "side benefit" there are always a huge number of guildies online and available to help for pretty much anything one needs.
All and all, I find the ESO economics an enjoyable part of the game - I would find little value in an esoBay, even if it made moving stuff (in or out) a bit easier.
Yet again another example of "I'm in a guild like that, It works, all is fine"
Dude the majority aren't. Get it?
If we all were, then hunky dory.
Its an unequal system, savvy ?4 -
kelly.medleyb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »So this week none of my 3 trading guilds have a trader.
One of them was ousted even though the bid was 280,000g in Wayrest
We don't need a system with so many barriers to effective trading.
This is a far cry from the assertion that not having an AH would create an egalitarian system.
So now my 3 trading guilds have no trader for a whole week, making less money, making it harder to bid, and inevitably losing members. Effectively these guilds now have no access to the open market.
The elite guilds control the market.
We just want to trade, buy & sell and not have to put so much effort into bidding, recruiting etc.
If we are not to have an AH the current system needs some serious reworking.
Ask your guild leaders to bid on less contested vendors, that said, there should be some restriction on who can bid on traders, if you go around to all the traders you will notice that more than half of them are PvE or PvP guilds who just want a trader to look good or something, they have less than 20 pages and usually it's utter junk.
If ONLY trade guilds could bid on TRADERS that would open up the market to serious trade guilds instead of just ppl with egos.4 -
martinhpb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Believe me, if I can be in such a guild, just about anyone can be - I'm about as asocial as they come, and I only do maybe .2% of the weekly sales. Just watch zone chat and join, and then drop out and join another if it turns out to be a bust. Since early access I've only been in a total of six different guilds. It isn't an "all is fine" post, it is a "compared to the rest of the game, it isn't remotely difficult to be in a good trading guild" post. But I agree, you do need to do something - it isn't just handed to you like a global AH would be.
There aren't enough good spots for traders for all the guilds.
I'm in some good guilds, I don't want to keep jumping ship, every time they lose a bid.
At least the spelling is difficult for you.
Hew's Bane*2 -
kelly.medleyb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Alphashado wrote: »My favorite trading guild has a guild trader in an obscure location in a low population city. We get it for dirt cheap. I sell items constantly from this kiosk. You don't need to be in a prime location and you don't need to participate in an insane bidding war for said locations in order for your kiosk to be successful. You just need a good active guild with a well stocked store.
People will remember where it's at and come back.
^ This x 10. The system as is is MUCH better than I expected and I think its wonderful. Add a few more Kiosks and move some if you like but ZoS please do not overhaul it because of a few people who stubbornly refuse to move to a lower bidding area or build their trade store up.
I enjoy going around to out of the way traders to buy and in the future perhaps fence items.
Thank you for making a neat trading system and please don't give in to those who just don't know better.7 -
Syrani✭✭✭✭The current system works, but it's not very convenient - for buyers or sellers. If I want to buy something, I want to be able to find a reasonable price. If I want to sell something, I want my sale price to be reasonable. With the current system, and without using an add-on, this is difficult and time consuming. The only way to know if you are getting a good deal, or to know if you are overcharging for something you are selling, is to go to all the kiosks and get an average.
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For me personally, a faction based AH would be better, but the current system is not so much of a hassle that I would refuse to use it.1 -
abigfishy✭✭✭✭✭I am one of those people that is in a tiny guild of about six actives and 50 inactives and we have gotten Kiosks about half of the weeks. Obviously we don't get the prime locations but by bidding on some of the worst locations in Tamriel we often get lucky with a bid of just a couple of thousand. We do make an effort to always have 30 things each listed and stock the things we think people in the zone where the kiosk is housed will want. Usually it is a week of huge profits for all of us - well huge by our standards is maybe 10-20k each for the week. On the other hand I do "lol" when I go to a kiosk and see there are maybe seven things in total for sale at that kiosk.
However I do agree that more kiosks would be good and there were two excellent suggestions made.
1) Add 1-2 more kiosks at each of the key locations like Wayrest, Daggerfall etc.
2) Let the wandering merchants also be accompanied by a guild trader on their routes. Wouldn't be the best guild trader but again a lot better than nothing.Level 50 Characters
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kelly.medleyb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭I am one of those people that is in a tiny guild of about six actives and 50 inactives and we have gotten Kiosks about half of the weeks. Obviously we don't get the prime locations but by bidding on some of the worst locations in Tamriel we often get lucky with a bid of just a couple of thousand. We do make an effort to always have 30 things each listed and stock the things we think people in the zone where the kiosk is housed will want. Usually it is a week of huge profits for all of us - well huge by our standards is maybe 10-20k each for the week. On the other hand I do "lol" when I go to a kiosk and see there are maybe seven things in total for sale at that kiosk.
However I do agree that more kiosks would be good and there were two excellent suggestions made.
1) Add 1-2 more kiosks at each of the key locations like Wayrest, Daggerfall etc.
2) Let the wandering merchants also be accompanied by a guild trader on their routes. Wouldn't be the best guild trader but again a lot better than nothing.
Very smart.2 -
RSram✭✭✭✭✭I am one of those people that is in a tiny guild of about six actives and 50 inactives and we have gotten Kiosks about half of the weeks. Obviously we don't get the prime locations but by bidding on some of the worst locations in Tamriel we often get lucky with a bid of just a couple of thousand. We do make an effort to always have 30 things each listed and stock the things we think people in the zone where the kiosk is housed will want. Usually it is a week of huge profits for all of us - well huge by our standards is maybe 10-20k each for the week. On the other hand I do "lol" when I go to a kiosk and see there are maybe seven things in total for sale at that kiosk.
However I do agree that more kiosks would be good and there were two excellent suggestions made.
1) Add 1-2 more kiosks at each of the key locations like Wayrest, Daggerfall etc.
2) Let the wandering merchants also be accompanied by a guild trader on their routes. Wouldn't be the best guild trader but again a lot better than nothing.
I like your ideas a lot. I was wondering why there aren't more guild kiosks at each way-shrines; since there is no global search function, at least I could easily travel between the kiosks a lot quicker.
I also like the idea of a traveling guild merchant. In each zone, there could be several guild merchants traveling different routes.1 -
badmojo✭✭✭✭✭
✭It would be nice to have guild merchants in Cyrodiil also. It would allow all three factions to access a guild store. Put them in the daily quest cities, with a few traveling merchants.
Also, if your trade guild can't afford a trader, claim keeps in Cyrodiil, I'm always checking out the stores there when I need something, but surprisingly few guilds that claim actually have anything for sale. I usually claim them for my guilds just to see our tabard on the NPCs, that's how easy they are to claim.[DC/NA]2 -
Divad Zarn✭✭✭Those who want to make money with minimal using of brains and skills, gonna make it without ANY problem, those who are lazy asses and don't want to move little bit for anything (same was with VR lvls and old players was *** up cuz of those cryers and EQUALITY wishers) they will have nothing, thats how is life built, so STOP pushing down your tears and start thinking, also stop making games easyer, it ruined WoW, L2 and many, many other great MMOs, where was competition at start, but with time cuz of those full of tears kids games become way more easy, same with global AH, and check out now, who was more there, players who was achieving things with time and spending out personal time for game, or those dirty ass kids who was yelling everywhere that bloody EVERYTHING and EVERYWHERE is too *** hard for them, so find reasons in you, not in system we have now, its working great for major part of mature players, since we have some interest and competition.5