Vampire Stage 4 & Justice System
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MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
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I've always thought it was stupid to be stronger while you were in more torment from not eating... There needs to be something different that encourages eating as a way of staying stronger and maybe side quests to increase the potency of one's bloodline that involves crafting mats perhaps? could be interesting for the economy... or idk something different. I've never understood the eat so you lose all your powers concept. wah waaa.reagen_lionel wrote: »Yeah I never did agree with how they implemented vampire stages. The time for each stage is far too short as well.
Not to mention a vampires powers get stronger the more starved they are that this system implies is just folly and nonsensical. Should be reversed in my opinion.
But the stages require a significant increase in thier duration.That is certain. I am glad for the idea for the justice system recognizing vampirism as a crime, as it is now however, Its way too easy to have this occur and much too often. I like the consequence however.
You know, with all the things they felt perfectly fine with NOT bringing over from the previous ES games, the fact that they decided TO include the nonsensical Stages wherein you actually become STRONGER as you starve just baffles me. They threw out the much longer timers of those Stages and gave us vampires that walk in the sun without penalty, were perfectly fine with introducing a NEW strain of vampirism for which there is zero lore... but decided to keep THAT?
And I would dearly LOVE to see some side quests for vampires (and werewolves!) introduced as well. Especially if there were quest rewards that actually enhanced your vampire in some way.PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!0 -
ItsMeToo✭✭✭✭✭
"The expression I could not care less originally meant 'it would be impossible for me to care less than I do because I do not care at all'. It was originally a British saying and came to the US in the 1950s. It is senseless to transform it into the now-common I could care less. If you could care less, that means you care at least a little. The original is quite sarcastic and the other form is clearly nonsense. The inverted form I could care less was coined in the US and is found only here, recorded in print by 1966. The question is, something caused the negative to vanish even while the original form of the expression was still very much in vogue and available for comparison - so what was it? There are other American English expressions that have a similar sarcastic inversion of an apparent sense, such as Tell me about it!, which usually means 'Don't tell me about it, because I know all about it already'. The Yiddish I should be so lucky!, in which the real sense is often 'I have no hope of being so lucky', has a similar stress pattern with the same sarcastic inversion of meaning as does I could care less."And I think you mean that as a non-RPer, you could care less. Couldn't care less means that it is very important to you. Sorry, former high school teacher here. *grins*
http://dictionary.reference.com/help/faq/language/g09.html
I agree... I'm glad you posted this reply so that at least some people will finally know the meaning of these sayings.FYI - There is no such thing as 'night capping' in a world wide MMO.FYI - There was no paid Beta. When they launched the game the Beta was over, even if you don't think it was.FYI - It's B2P not F2P. There is a difference.FYI - It doesn't take any player skill to mash keys or buttons in this game. The ones that stay alive longer have the better internet connection and speed.FYI - The game is not broken, it still works. It just has 'bugs' that need to be fixed.Balance is a "Bad" thing.
Example: There were hundreds of Jedi and only two Sith in Star Wars. The Jedi wanted, "Balance in the Force" and they got it. Now there are only two Jedi and two Sith.
Balance is a "Bad" thing.Is the glass half full or half empty?
I say, "Get a smaller glass."1 -
ItsMeToo✭✭✭✭✭How about wearing a helm and armor that completely covers your body along with a potion that you can craft that masks the smell of decay and last for 30 game minutes per potion. This way you could stay in stage 4 and do your town business as long as you had potions and kept completely covered.Edited by ItsMeToo on December 12, 2014 11:45AMFYI - There is no such thing as 'night capping' in a world wide MMO.FYI - There was no paid Beta. When they launched the game the Beta was over, even if you don't think it was.FYI - It's B2P not F2P. There is a difference.FYI - It doesn't take any player skill to mash keys or buttons in this game. The ones that stay alive longer have the better internet connection and speed.FYI - The game is not broken, it still works. It just has 'bugs' that need to be fixed.Balance is a "Bad" thing.
Example: There were hundreds of Jedi and only two Sith in Star Wars. The Jedi wanted, "Balance in the Force" and they got it. Now there are only two Jedi and two Sith.
Balance is a "Bad" thing.Is the glass half full or half empty?
I say, "Get a smaller glass."0 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭How about wearing a helm and armor that completely covers your body along with a potion that you can craft that masks the smell of decay and last for 30 game minutes per potion. This way you could stay in stage 4 and do your town business as long as you had potions and kept completely covered.
Vampires are not zombies (despite what they look like at Stage 4) and are not rotting. They are in a state of UNdeath where no nasty diesease nor troublesome microbes may take hold in their pristine flesh. Ergo, no "stench of decay" thank you very much. My vampire thought you should know that. LOL
Regarding your idea however, the idea of "disguises" fror vampires has been batted about extensively on these forums. But it has been almost universally agreed that any such "disguise" should "break" at Stage 4, revealing the vampire for what they are and at their most monstrous precisely because most of us who play vampires WANT there to be consequences for entering Stage 4. Your concern about your inability to "get things done" is valid though and, I think, would be best served by reversing the length of time on Stages 1 and 3.Edited by MornaBaine on December 12, 2014 12:25PMPAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!0 -
ItsMeToo✭✭✭✭✭MornaBaine wrote: »How about wearing a helm and armor that completely covers your body along with a potion that you can craft that masks the smell of decay and last for 30 game minutes per potion. This way you could stay in stage 4 and do your town business as long as you had potions and kept completely covered.
Vampires are not zombies (despite what they look like at Stage 4) and are not rotting. They are in a state of UNdeath where no nasty diesease nor troublesome microbes may take hold in their pristine flesh. Ergo, no "stench of decay" thank you very much. My vampire thought you should know that. LOL
Regarding your idea however, the idea of "disguises" fror vampires has been batted about extensively on these forums. But it has been almost universally agreed that any such "disguise" should "break" at Stage 4, revealing the vampire for what they are and at their most monstrous precisely because most of us who play vampires WANT there to be consequences for entering Stage 4. Your concern about your inability to "get things done" is valid though and, I think, would be best served by reversing the length of time on Stages 1 and 3.
I never said Vampires were zombies. ZOS made them look like they were decaying and I was just covering the option as if they were or could smell like death or maybe they just farted.
I read the forums and have seen the posts on "disguises" (a.k.a. costumes). Armor is not a costume and could be an option for those who don't want to be revealed, but still want to be part of the "Justice System".
More options are a good thing to help people play how they want.FYI - There is no such thing as 'night capping' in a world wide MMO.FYI - There was no paid Beta. When they launched the game the Beta was over, even if you don't think it was.FYI - It's B2P not F2P. There is a difference.FYI - It doesn't take any player skill to mash keys or buttons in this game. The ones that stay alive longer have the better internet connection and speed.FYI - The game is not broken, it still works. It just has 'bugs' that need to be fixed.Balance is a "Bad" thing.
Example: There were hundreds of Jedi and only two Sith in Star Wars. The Jedi wanted, "Balance in the Force" and they got it. Now there are only two Jedi and two Sith.
Balance is a "Bad" thing.Is the glass half full or half empty?
I say, "Get a smaller glass."0 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MornaBaine wrote: »How about wearing a helm and armor that completely covers your body along with a potion that you can craft that masks the smell of decay and last for 30 game minutes per potion. This way you could stay in stage 4 and do your town business as long as you had potions and kept completely covered.
Vampires are not zombies (despite what they look like at Stage 4) and are not rotting. They are in a state of UNdeath where no nasty diesease nor troublesome microbes may take hold in their pristine flesh. Ergo, no "stench of decay" thank you very much. My vampire thought you should know that. LOL
Regarding your idea however, the idea of "disguises" fror vampires has been batted about extensively on these forums. But it has been almost universally agreed that any such "disguise" should "break" at Stage 4, revealing the vampire for what they are and at their most monstrous precisely because most of us who play vampires WANT there to be consequences for entering Stage 4. Your concern about your inability to "get things done" is valid though and, I think, would be best served by reversing the length of time on Stages 1 and 3.
I never said Vampires were zombies. ZOS made them look like they were decaying and I was just covering the option as if they were or could smell like death or maybe they just farted.
I read the forums and have seen the posts on "disguises" (a.k.a. costumes). Armor is not a costume and could be an option for those who don't want to be revealed, but still want to be part of the "Justice System".
More options are a good thing to help people play how they want.
Hmmm...apparently humor just doesn't translate to print.
At any rate, for your "armor as disguise" to work they would have to specially code all the helmets that COMPLETELY cover the face to work so that if a vampire were wearing them it would "mask" the Stage 4 condition. This would require a good deal more effort than is necessary. It would be far easier for them to create a disguise to equip in the costume slot that performed the same function. IF they do that I hope they give us a few different options, including one that would return your vampire to the appearance they had BEFORE they became a vampire. But I would ALSO love to see some really cool masks and completely concealing robes with cowls and even armor.
However, I'm still going to have to maintain that I don't want to see these things NEGATE the NPC reactions to Stage 4 that are upcoming with the Justice System. And if they tweak the Stage timers there's no reason for them to.PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!0 -
cravnbeer✭✭✭I just want one area where I can do my crafting, selling and deposits without being bothered with the justice system.1 safe harbor for vamps or criminals is really preferable the more I think about it.
The consequences for stage 4 with the justice system is an annoyance nothing more.Edited by cravnbeer on December 12, 2014 1:04PM0 -
Robocles✭✭✭✭✭MornaBaine wrote: »
I watched it twice and didn't see them confirm it.
Like I said in a different thread, if they would take a minute to post some solid information (in print) on this forum, there would be no need for 1,000 threads, never-ending questions, and wild speculation.
Yeah... it's fun to watch all the speculation slowly (or quickly) turn into "fact" the more it's discussed. There was a thread where someone (I can't be arsed to link it) posted a bunch of information that was NOT in the stream as if it was fact. Then, of course, most of the discussion became about what to do about these items that weren't necessarily correct. Someone did come in and correct it, but it seemed to fall on deaf ears.0 -
BloodStorm✭✭✭
I have never seen twilight or read the books. I prefer vampires as godlike figures to humans and humans are like ants and other insects / creatures of the human world that are for eating and controlling or just flat out ignoring and pretending they do not exist very much and vampires that are ruthless when dealing with non-vampires. A lot of Vampire RP players and people who like being a vampire would actually love the Idea of a almost 4th faction type thing. If the vampire houses that already exist in each factions are officially places to sell and repair stuff at stage 4 that would be a good thing and it would be a easy thing for ZOS to do by just putting a NPC who can repair and sell in the vampire hideouts that already exist in-game in Eastmarch / Bladespire and so on. They could make it though that the vampire hideouts only have repair and sell options for the most part. If you plan on doing other things you need to go to real towns and stuff. I would love Castle Volkihar to be in Skyrim when the rest of it opens up and have it be like a vampire central place with all the things that mortal cities have pretty much but that is probably just going to be a dream of mine. Lord Harkon better be in ESO though eventually. Like was said in other posts and older discussions on the forums Lord Harkon is around 3000 years old in ESO since he is around 4000 in Skyrim the actual game.RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »I saw that with the new justice system stage 4 vampire is a crime. Does anyone know
will there be some sort of safe city for stage 4 vampires or will the timers be increased?
Why should there be a 'safe city'? Being a blood crazed vampire IS a crime to ALL living beings. At stage 4, that is what a vampire is. Be thankful that it is only stage 4. With the Twilight wannabes (you know those who openly talk about being a vampire), I'd opt for the guards to KOS at stage 1. (Discretion is the key to successful vampire RP!)
Edited by BloodStorm on December 12, 2014 1:23PM0 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I just want one area where I can do my crafting, selling and deposits without being bothered with the justice system.1 safe harbor for vamps or criminals is really preferable the more I think about it.
The consequences for stage 4 with the justice system is an annoyance nothing more.
From what I understand so far though the Justice System is "opt in" so it shouldn't really have an impact on those who don't want to deal with it. I find that a little disappointing really but I guess it does help eliminate the whine factor.PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!0 -
ItsMeToo✭✭✭✭✭MornaBaine wrote: »MornaBaine wrote: »How about wearing a helm and armor that completely covers your body along with a potion that you can craft that masks the smell of decay and last for 30 game minutes per potion. This way you could stay in stage 4 and do your town business as long as you had potions and kept completely covered.
Vampires are not zombies (despite what they look like at Stage 4) and are not rotting. They are in a state of UNdeath where no nasty diesease nor troublesome microbes may take hold in their pristine flesh. Ergo, no "stench of decay" thank you very much. My vampire thought you should know that. LOL
Regarding your idea however, the idea of "disguises" fror vampires has been batted about extensively on these forums. But it has been almost universally agreed that any such "disguise" should "break" at Stage 4, revealing the vampire for what they are and at their most monstrous precisely because most of us who play vampires WANT there to be consequences for entering Stage 4. Your concern about your inability to "get things done" is valid though and, I think, would be best served by reversing the length of time on Stages 1 and 3.
I never said Vampires were zombies. ZOS made them look like they were decaying and I was just covering the option as if they were or could smell like death or maybe they just farted.
I read the forums and have seen the posts on "disguises" (a.k.a. costumes). Armor is not a costume and could be an option for those who don't want to be revealed, but still want to be part of the "Justice System".
More options are a good thing to help people play how they want.
Hmmm...apparently humor just doesn't translate to print.
At any rate, for your "armor as disguise" to work they would have to specially code all the helmets that COMPLETELY cover the face to work so that if a vampire were wearing them it would "mask" the Stage 4 condition. This would require a good deal more effort than is necessary. It would be far easier for them to create a disguise to equip in the costume slot that performed the same function. IF they do that I hope they give us a few different options, including one that would return your vampire to the appearance they had BEFORE they became a vampire. But I would ALSO love to see some really cool masks and completely concealing robes with cowls and even armor.
However, I'm still going to have to maintain that I don't want to see these things NEGATE the NPC reactions to Stage 4 that are upcoming with the Justice System. And if they tweak the Stage timers there's no reason for them to.
I saw the humor in your post and it wasn't wasted on me.
I still want the option to allow players to be in the "Justice System" and negate the NPC reactions at all stages.
Adding more skills to the Vampire Tree, both active and passive would be nice. Maybe being able to charm an NPC to allow for trading or doing your bidding. Like buying something for you.FYI - There is no such thing as 'night capping' in a world wide MMO.FYI - There was no paid Beta. When they launched the game the Beta was over, even if you don't think it was.FYI - It's B2P not F2P. There is a difference.FYI - It doesn't take any player skill to mash keys or buttons in this game. The ones that stay alive longer have the better internet connection and speed.FYI - The game is not broken, it still works. It just has 'bugs' that need to be fixed.Balance is a "Bad" thing.
Example: There were hundreds of Jedi and only two Sith in Star Wars. The Jedi wanted, "Balance in the Force" and they got it. Now there are only two Jedi and two Sith.
Balance is a "Bad" thing.Is the glass half full or half empty?
I say, "Get a smaller glass."0 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
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I saw the humor in your post and it wasn't wasted on me.
I still want the option to allow players to be in the "Justice System" and negate the NPC reactions at all stages.
I understand your desire for this but I don't think it's feasible to expect the Devs to make it to where you can only "opt in" to the parts of the Justice System you want to take part in and escape the parts of it you find inconvenient.Adding more skills to the Vampire Tree, both active and passive would be nice. Maybe being able to charm an NPC to allow for trading or doing your bidding. Like buying something for you.
This I am completely on board with. Vampires definitely need to have additional skills and certainly skills that allow them to feed without their victim instantly aggroing them afterwards.
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!0 -
ItsMeToo✭✭✭✭✭MornaBaine wrote: »I just want one area where I can do my crafting, selling and deposits without being bothered with the justice system.1 safe harbor for vamps or criminals is really preferable the more I think about it.
The consequences for stage 4 with the justice system is an annoyance nothing more.
From what I understand so far though the Justice System is "opt in" so it shouldn't really have an impact on those who don't want to deal with it. I find that a little disappointing really but I guess it does help eliminate the whine factor.
It's an "opt out", as per the ESO Live.FYI - There is no such thing as 'night capping' in a world wide MMO.FYI - There was no paid Beta. When they launched the game the Beta was over, even if you don't think it was.FYI - It's B2P not F2P. There is a difference.FYI - It doesn't take any player skill to mash keys or buttons in this game. The ones that stay alive longer have the better internet connection and speed.FYI - The game is not broken, it still works. It just has 'bugs' that need to be fixed.Balance is a "Bad" thing.
Example: There were hundreds of Jedi and only two Sith in Star Wars. The Jedi wanted, "Balance in the Force" and they got it. Now there are only two Jedi and two Sith.
Balance is a "Bad" thing.Is the glass half full or half empty?
I say, "Get a smaller glass."0 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MornaBaine wrote: »I just want one area where I can do my crafting, selling and deposits without being bothered with the justice system.1 safe harbor for vamps or criminals is really preferable the more I think about it.
The consequences for stage 4 with the justice system is an annoyance nothing more.
From what I understand so far though the Justice System is "opt in" so it shouldn't really have an impact on those who don't want to deal with it. I find that a little disappointing really but I guess it does help eliminate the whine factor.
It's an "opt out", as per the ESO Live.
Same difference really though yes, I understand the default will be "Justice System ON" and then you'll have to choose to opt out. Either way, the point is that the system itself, and your participation in it, is optional.PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!0 -
murmur✭✭✭I just want one area where I can do my crafting, selling and deposits without being bothered with the justice system.1 safe harbor for vamps or criminals is really preferable the more I think about it.
The consequences for stage 4 with the justice system is an annoyance nothing more.
Just go to Cyrodiil to do your banking and stuff, no justice system in there. And if you need to buy stuff from guild traders, do your shopping with non vamp alt and you don't need to worry about stages.1 -
ItsMeToo✭✭✭✭✭I just want one area where I can do my crafting, selling and deposits without being bothered with the justice system.1 safe harbor for vamps or criminals is really preferable the more I think about it.
The consequences for stage 4 with the justice system is an annoyance nothing more.
Just go to Cyrodiil to do your banking and stuff, no justice system in there. And if you need to buy stuff from guild traders, do your shopping with non vamp alt and you don't need to worry about stages.
That's a "bandaid fix" and not a solution. Some people don't like to make alts, log on and off alts to do banking/crafting/buying/selling/etc. or go to Cyrodiil.FYI - There is no such thing as 'night capping' in a world wide MMO.FYI - There was no paid Beta. When they launched the game the Beta was over, even if you don't think it was.FYI - It's B2P not F2P. There is a difference.FYI - It doesn't take any player skill to mash keys or buttons in this game. The ones that stay alive longer have the better internet connection and speed.FYI - The game is not broken, it still works. It just has 'bugs' that need to be fixed.Balance is a "Bad" thing.
Example: There were hundreds of Jedi and only two Sith in Star Wars. The Jedi wanted, "Balance in the Force" and they got it. Now there are only two Jedi and two Sith.
Balance is a "Bad" thing.Is the glass half full or half empty?
I say, "Get a smaller glass."0 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I just want one area where I can do my crafting, selling and deposits without being bothered with the justice system.1 safe harbor for vamps or criminals is really preferable the more I think about it.
The consequences for stage 4 with the justice system is an annoyance nothing more.
Just go to Cyrodiil to do your banking and stuff, no justice system in there. And if you need to buy stuff from guild traders, do your shopping with non vamp alt and you don't need to worry about stages.
WHAT? Calm, rational and LOGICAL reasoning? An actual workable ANSWER to the problem? You, Sir, do NOT belong on these forums! PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!0 -
TheHutzSoul Shriven[/quote]
And I think you mean that as a non-RPer, you could care less. Couldn't care less means that it is very important to you. Sorry, former high school teacher here. *grins*
[/quote]RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »I saw that with the new justice system stage 4 vampire is a crime. Does anyone know
will there be some sort of safe city for stage 4 vampires or will the timers be increased?
Why should there be a 'safe city'? Being a blood crazed vampire IS a crime to ALL living beings. At stage 4, that is what a vampire is. Be thankful that it is only stage 4. With the Twilight wannabes (you know those who openly talk about being a vampire), I'd opt for the guards to KOS at stage 1. (Discretion is the key to successful vampire RP!)
Except with the number of vampires in this game it only makes sense that they'd create some kind of haven for themselves. I'm a dunmer templar healer/caster, it makes sense to be a vampire for the magic regen, I couldn't care less about the RP aspect. I'm fine with not being able to wander into just any city but I dont want to have to feed and lessen my bonuses everytime i have to unload my inventory.
Well, as I have had to do the inventory shuffle last night, I do understand the importance of merchants outside of cities. There are a few. There is one in Lord Diel's camp, one wandering east of Daggerfall and at least two wandering around Bangkorai. I am sure that they exist in the other zones but these are the ones I can name off the top of my head. There is an achievement for intimidating the wandering merchants.
And I think you mean that as a non-RPer, you could care less. Couldn't care less means that it is very important to you. Sorry, former high school teacher here. *grins*
Umm actually, I'm pretty sure I said it correctly. If I could care less then there's room for care...If I could not care less then I am at the minimum amount of caring. Glad you're not teaching any more 1 -
phreatophile✭✭✭✭✭
✭MornaBaine wrote: »I understand your desire for this but I don't think it's feasible to expect the Devs to make it to where you can only "opt in" to the parts of the Justice System you want to take part in and escape the parts of it you find inconvenient.
We have yet to really have an explanation of how many aspects of the Justice system will work. The opt out has been described as a menu/settings toggle. I guess opting out of the Justice system will mean it is impossible to target non-hostile NPC's and impossible to loot items that would be flagged stolen. If we opt out will everybody still see us when stealthed like they do now? If we opt in will we be invisible to everybody? The list goes on, and on.
(IMHO)I really doubt that it will be possible to simply toggle the ability to run around town as a stage 4 vampire or as a transformed werewolf without any consequence, while the next player into town gets stomped by the guards for doing the exact same thing.
I really hope that Vamps and Weres cannot simply opt out. There were never adequate downsides to being a vampire, and they've nerfed the good pretty hard, mostly due to PvP QQing. The whole situation could do with a healthy dose of disinfectant. Justice might be a good start, or it might be another in a long line of predictable failures. Until we as players have to pay hard for the power that comes with being a vampire, it will remain the default choice too many people or the power will get nerfed and nerfed until it is no more than a bad appearance set and very minor buffs/debuffs.1
