Zintair wrote: »

NovaShadow wrote: »

This entire thread just makes it seem like other Oceanic players like myself should give up pvp entirely so that your precious map stays perfectly in tact as you left it when you logged off.

All this night capping ***. You do realise I can say exactly the same thing about NA primetime. All the work I put into helping take keeps when its my primetime to play is gone down the drain when I log on the next morning to find everything has been taken back. Should I be complaining here about nightcapping when I'm asleep?

I don't because I know I cannot be on 24/7 and as a megaserver that doesn't shut down when you want it you've gotta deal with the fact that people like me that don't live in Northern Hemisphere have no option but to play on the NA or EU servers and as such we pvp at different times. This isn't going to change so learn to accept it.

I do agree however that if ZOS did make some changes to things it would make a difference, but what exactly those changes could be I do not know. But locking out Oceanic players from your precious campaign while you're in bed is NOT FAIR and I completely disagree with.

What work did you put in exactly? The front door say something mean?

This isn't directed at Oceanic players this is directed at CERTAIN AD Oceanic players who flood a server to make sure the entire map is yellow and they can win. THE SAME AD who take the map before maintenence to ensure free ticks at FULL Points. No class with garbage like this.

No one is saying don't take things but pop lock it at 5 am when everyone else 1 bar then claim you worked for something is where a line must be drawn.

I see you just assume I want to PVD when I would much rather not PVD. And how exactly can you say I don't put any work into it? That's incredibly stupid if you think all I wanna do is log into Cyrodiil and find the map blue and red and have to actually WORK to take things back. I would very much rather not.

I can say I am not part of those Oceanic players as I wasn't in this particular campaign when that happened. I just take offense that people label ALL Oceanic players in the same boat. I actually pvp rather often during NA primetime if I have the time in the morning to join and used to run with a large Guild but those days are over.

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

Zintair wrote: »

NovaShadow wrote: »

This entire thread just makes it seem like other Oceanic players like myself should give up pvp entirely so that your precious map stays perfectly in tact as you left it when you logged off.

All this night capping ***. You do realise I can say exactly the same thing about NA primetime. All the work I put into helping take keeps when its my primetime to play is gone down the drain when I log on the next morning to find everything has been taken back. Should I be complaining here about nightcapping when I'm asleep?

I don't because I know I cannot be on 24/7 and as a megaserver that doesn't shut down when you want it you've gotta deal with the fact that people like me that don't live in Northern Hemisphere have no option but to play on the NA or EU servers and as such we pvp at different times. This isn't going to change so learn to accept it.

I do agree however that if ZOS did make some changes to things it would make a difference, but what exactly those changes could be I do not know. But locking out Oceanic players from your precious campaign while you're in bed is NOT FAIR and I completely disagree with.

What work did you put in exactly? The front door say something mean?

This isn't directed at Oceanic players this is directed at CERTAIN AD Oceanic players who flood a server to make sure the entire map is yellow and they can win. THE SAME AD who take the map before maintenence to ensure free ticks at FULL Points. No class with garbage like this.

No one is saying don't take things but pop lock it at 5 am when everyone else 1 bar then claim you worked for something is where a line must be drawn.

Exactly.

If the overpopulated faction in question was looking for a serious, strong challenge, they would split up. Yes, I understand you want to play with your mates, but something's gotta give.

Either the game will give, and you'll never have another fight again, or the Aussies have to split themselves between EP and DC so that they can play against each other.

This is healthier for the game, gives them something to do beyond PvDoor, and helps them improve their skills and capabilities as players by having someone to fight on equal footing, instead of a smattering of insomniac NA players who are on the verge of exhaustion just trying to cling to a scroll temple (speaking as someone who's done this more than once).

You know what, I actually started out as EP, found a good Guild and had a lot of fun pvping but when that Guild faded away and all but a few left the game I found pvping with EP was the opposite of fun. I finally had the time to return to AD (the faction I chose in beta) and tested out pvp and actually liked it better as a banana instead of a strawberry. I intended to stay AD for the foreseeable future. I may consider my options if a pay to switch option is implemented, but that's a big maybe.

NovaShadow wrote: »

Zintair wrote: »

NovaShadow wrote: »

This entire thread just makes it seem like other Oceanic players like myself should give up pvp entirely so that your precious map stays perfectly in tact as you left it when you logged off.

All this night capping ***. You do realise I can say exactly the same thing about NA primetime. All the work I put into helping take keeps when its my primetime to play is gone down the drain when I log on the next morning to find everything has been taken back. Should I be complaining here about nightcapping when I'm asleep?

I don't because I know I cannot be on 24/7 and as a megaserver that doesn't shut down when you want it you've gotta deal with the fact that people like me that don't live in Northern Hemisphere have no option but to play on the NA or EU servers and as such we pvp at different times. This isn't going to change so learn to accept it.

I do agree however that if ZOS did make some changes to things it would make a difference, but what exactly those changes could be I do not know. But locking out Oceanic players from your precious campaign while you're in bed is NOT FAIR and I completely disagree with.

What work did you put in exactly? The front door say something mean?

This isn't directed at Oceanic players this is directed at CERTAIN AD Oceanic players who flood a server to make sure the entire map is yellow and they can win. THE SAME AD who take the map before maintenence to ensure free ticks at FULL Points. No class with garbage like this.

No one is saying don't take things but pop lock it at 5 am when everyone else 1 bar then claim you worked for something is where a line must be drawn.

I see you just assume I want to PVD when I would much rather not PVD. And how exactly can you say I don't put any work into it? That's incredibly stupid if you think all I wanna do is log into Cyrodiil and find the map blue and red and have to actually WORK to take things back. I would very much rather not.

I can say I am not part of those Oceanic players as I wasn't in this particular campaign when that happened. I just take offense that people label ALL Oceanic players in the same boat. I actually pvp rather often during NA primetime if I have the time in the morning to join and used to run with a large Guild but those days are over.

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

Zintair wrote: »

NovaShadow wrote: »

This entire thread just makes it seem like other Oceanic players like myself should give up pvp entirely so that your precious map stays perfectly in tact as you left it when you logged off.

All this night capping ***. You do realise I can say exactly the same thing about NA primetime. All the work I put into helping take keeps when its my primetime to play is gone down the drain when I log on the next morning to find everything has been taken back. Should I be complaining here about nightcapping when I'm asleep?

I don't because I know I cannot be on 24/7 and as a megaserver that doesn't shut down when you want it you've gotta deal with the fact that people like me that don't live in Northern Hemisphere have no option but to play on the NA or EU servers and as such we pvp at different times. This isn't going to change so learn to accept it.

I do agree however that if ZOS did make some changes to things it would make a difference, but what exactly those changes could be I do not know. But locking out Oceanic players from your precious campaign while you're in bed is NOT FAIR and I completely disagree with.

What work did you put in exactly? The front door say something mean?

This isn't directed at Oceanic players this is directed at CERTAIN AD Oceanic players who flood a server to make sure the entire map is yellow and they can win. THE SAME AD who take the map before maintenence to ensure free ticks at FULL Points. No class with garbage like this.

No one is saying don't take things but pop lock it at 5 am when everyone else 1 bar then claim you worked for something is where a line must be drawn.

Exactly.

If the overpopulated faction in question was looking for a serious, strong challenge, they would split up. Yes, I understand you want to play with your mates, but something's gotta give.

Either the game will give, and you'll never have another fight again, or the Aussies have to split themselves between EP and DC so that they can play against each other.

This is healthier for the game, gives them something to do beyond PvDoor, and helps them improve their skills and capabilities as players by having someone to fight on equal footing, instead of a smattering of insomniac NA players who are on the verge of exhaustion just trying to cling to a scroll temple (speaking as someone who's done this more than once).

You know what, I actually started out as EP, found a good Guild and had a lot of fun pvping but when that Guild faded away and all but a few left the game I found pvping with EP was the opposite of fun. I finally had the time to return to AD (the faction I chose in beta) and tested out pvp and actually liked it better as a banana instead of a strawberry. I intended to stay AD for the foreseeable future. I may consider my options if a pay to switch option is implemented, but that's a big maybe.

As with any stereotype, the intimations start because it's seen frequently.

For instance, the overnight of NA Thornblade 10/17-10/18 saw AD at 3 bars the entire night compared to only typically 1 bar of each opposition faction. That's double plus 50% of the opposing factions combined. AD ran the map and crowned an emperor without significant opposition until US morning hours where both factions went up to 2 bars and AD stayed three.

And this happens repeatedly.

How fair is it to the late night crew in EP/DC that they have to struggle against those impossibilities? How much "fun" do they have getting overrun keep after keep? And how much fun does the AD have in that situation with no challenge aside from the 'yay, we get to win!' mentality that a select few have. Seriously, it is a part of the current population cycle that is immensely frustrating to experience from an underdog perspective and is a huge part of the reason for much of the population attrition in the game's PVP.

You have multiple instances of players posting about how they don't want to play for the objectives -- the very reason we're supposed to be here -- because of this night capping and overnight population advantage.

Why do you think AD is constantly fighting two fronts? Because we have to hit them otherwise they'll always be outscoring us by miles due to the overnight crew.

How much longer does this have to happen before no one cares about objectives and DC/EP players just stop zoning into Cyrodiil all together?

There is no fight, no PVP, when you're missing an opposition team.

I wish more people brought up Guild Wars 2. That game had the same scoring system for their WvWvW system and had the exact same overnight population and night capping problems. Where's that game now? It fell flat and the populations shrunk dramatically due to the WvWvW failing the exact same reasons.

We have to fix this or fall into the same pit that GW2 did.

ZOS isn't fixing it. It falls on the players otherwise we lose the game we've invested so much in. No fights, no fun, no opposition. Just a see of AD and multiple empty maps. But, hey, at least you won, right?

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

NovaShadow wrote: »

Zintair wrote: »

NovaShadow wrote: »

This entire thread just makes it seem like other Oceanic players like myself should give up pvp entirely so that your precious map stays perfectly in tact as you left it when you logged off.

All this night capping ***. You do realise I can say exactly the same thing about NA primetime. All the work I put into helping take keeps when its my primetime to play is gone down the drain when I log on the next morning to find everything has been taken back. Should I be complaining here about nightcapping when I'm asleep?

I don't because I know I cannot be on 24/7 and as a megaserver that doesn't shut down when you want it you've gotta deal with the fact that people like me that don't live in Northern Hemisphere have no option but to play on the NA or EU servers and as such we pvp at different times. This isn't going to change so learn to accept it.

I do agree however that if ZOS did make some changes to things it would make a difference, but what exactly those changes could be I do not know. But locking out Oceanic players from your precious campaign while you're in bed is NOT FAIR and I completely disagree with.

What work did you put in exactly? The front door say something mean?

This isn't directed at Oceanic players this is directed at CERTAIN AD Oceanic players who flood a server to make sure the entire map is yellow and they can win. THE SAME AD who take the map before maintenence to ensure free ticks at FULL Points. No class with garbage like this.

No one is saying don't take things but pop lock it at 5 am when everyone else 1 bar then claim you worked for something is where a line must be drawn.

I see you just assume I want to PVD when I would much rather not PVD. And how exactly can you say I don't put any work into it? That's incredibly stupid if you think all I wanna do is log into Cyrodiil and find the map blue and red and have to actually WORK to take things back. I would very much rather not.

I can say I am not part of those Oceanic players as I wasn't in this particular campaign when that happened. I just take offense that people label ALL Oceanic players in the same boat. I actually pvp rather often during NA primetime if I have the time in the morning to join and used to run with a large Guild but those days are over.

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

Zintair wrote: »

NovaShadow wrote: »

This entire thread just makes it seem like other Oceanic players like myself should give up pvp entirely so that your precious map stays perfectly in tact as you left it when you logged off.

All this night capping ***. You do realise I can say exactly the same thing about NA primetime. All the work I put into helping take keeps when its my primetime to play is gone down the drain when I log on the next morning to find everything has been taken back. Should I be complaining here about nightcapping when I'm asleep?

I don't because I know I cannot be on 24/7 and as a megaserver that doesn't shut down when you want it you've gotta deal with the fact that people like me that don't live in Northern Hemisphere have no option but to play on the NA or EU servers and as such we pvp at different times. This isn't going to change so learn to accept it.

I do agree however that if ZOS did make some changes to things it would make a difference, but what exactly those changes could be I do not know. But locking out Oceanic players from your precious campaign while you're in bed is NOT FAIR and I completely disagree with.

What work did you put in exactly? The front door say something mean?

This isn't directed at Oceanic players this is directed at CERTAIN AD Oceanic players who flood a server to make sure the entire map is yellow and they can win. THE SAME AD who take the map before maintenence to ensure free ticks at FULL Points. No class with garbage like this.

No one is saying don't take things but pop lock it at 5 am when everyone else 1 bar then claim you worked for something is where a line must be drawn.

Exactly.

If the overpopulated faction in question was looking for a serious, strong challenge, they would split up. Yes, I understand you want to play with your mates, but something's gotta give.

Either the game will give, and you'll never have another fight again, or the Aussies have to split themselves between EP and DC so that they can play against each other.

This is healthier for the game, gives them something to do beyond PvDoor, and helps them improve their skills and capabilities as players by having someone to fight on equal footing, instead of a smattering of insomniac NA players who are on the verge of exhaustion just trying to cling to a scroll temple (speaking as someone who's done this more than once).

You know what, I actually started out as EP, found a good Guild and had a lot of fun pvping but when that Guild faded away and all but a few left the game I found pvping with EP was the opposite of fun. I finally had the time to return to AD (the faction I chose in beta) and tested out pvp and actually liked it better as a banana instead of a strawberry. I intended to stay AD for the foreseeable future. I may consider my options if a pay to switch option is implemented, but that's a big maybe.

As with any stereotype, the intimations start because it's seen frequently.

For instance, the overnight of NA Thornblade 10/17-10/18 saw AD at 3 bars the entire night compared to only typically 1 bar of each opposition faction. That's double plus 50% of the opposing factions combined. AD ran the map and crowned an emperor without significant opposition until US morning hours where both factions went up to 2 bars and AD stayed three.

And this happens repeatedly.

How fair is it to the late night crew in EP/DC that they have to struggle against those impossibilities? How much "fun" do they have getting overrun keep after keep? And how much fun does the AD have in that situation with no challenge aside from the 'yay, we get to win!' mentality that a select few have. Seriously, it is a part of the current population cycle that is immensely frustrating to experience from an underdog perspective and is a huge part of the reason for much of the population attrition in the game's PVP.

You have multiple instances of players posting about how they don't want to play for the objectives -- the very reason we're supposed to be here -- because of this night capping and overnight population advantage.

Why do you think AD is constantly fighting two fronts? Because we have to hit them otherwise they'll always be outscoring us by miles due to the overnight crew.

How much longer does this have to happen before no one cares about objectives and DC/EP players just stop zoning into Cyrodiil all together?

There is no fight, no PVP, when you're missing an opposition team.

I wish more people brought up Guild Wars 2. That game had the same scoring system for their WvWvW system and had the exact same overnight population and night capping problems. Where's that game now? It fell flat and the populations shrunk dramatically due to the WvWvW failing the exact same reasons.

We have to fix this or fall into the same pit that GW2 did.

ZOS isn't fixing it. It falls on the players otherwise we lose the game we've invested so much in. No fights, no fun, no opposition. Just a see of AD and multiple empty maps. But, hey, at least you won, right?

QFT... alas pissing in the wind only gets your trousers wet.
Too many people want to be on the winning side. They want the I win button if they can get it (sheer numbers).
Only ZOS can fix that because many/most people will always take the easy option.
Same reason everyone wears dress/stick if it appears OP or DK if it appears OP.
Most people are sheep...simple as that.
ZOS needs the make the easy option...hard...painful even.

In that vain scale the buffs for keeps/scrolls etc to be inversely proportional to polulations.
So the greater your over polulation the lower the buffs.
You don't need buffs if you outnumber people right ?

Last night, AD captured emperor. I stayed up late in order to help them do it. When we captured it, every alliance had 2 bars of population. 'Nuff said.

To them, you're the night cappers.

Scenario:
An American sees this thread title and thinks to himself, "Yeah, I hate those darn nightcapping Aussies. They suck."

An Australian sees this thread title and thinks to himself, "Yeah, I hate those darn nightcapping Americans. They suck."

Any of this clicking for you now?

I think people need to get away from the time of day it happens in. That really, truly is insignificant.

It's the population imbalances -- always has been and always will be -- that break the campaigns.

If it was triple locked at noon, then it'd be balanced. if it was DC locked, 2 bars AD/EP at 8pm Eastern US, that's an imbalance that needs to be corrected. It just so happens the imbalance in Thornblade is typically at night.

Can we get away from the ridiculous 'lock the map at certain times' suggestions?

The populations need to be balanced, the map doesn't need changing.

I agree that the population balance overall is one of the biggest problems (at all hours of the day). For example, right now on thorn NA, yellow and red are poplocked and blue is at two bars. Blue tried to attack Roe with 20 ppl and out pours a zerg of approx 80 yellow. Some days, when the fights are semi-balanced, it's a blast. Other days when every single fight is 4 or 5:1 against a zerg train...it's just not as fun as it used to be being the underdog.

I'm really starting to doubt I'll resub in Nov when my 6month sub is up because there's so little chance they will actually fix any of the massive *** problems in this game any time soon (lag being the biggest issue that creates *** like permastun, inability to use skills/doors/wep swap, etc)

That and travel to player allowing you to enter any campaign you want to.