ZoS, definitive answer please: are Troll Camps illegal?

Xallus · September 2014

I thought the DC troll camps were bad... damn

wllstrt75b14_ESO · September 2014

SeltzerDuke wrote: »

There must be a lot of PVEers placing gank insurance/duelers/misguided pugs (insert lame pretext for justifying troll camp placements) in AD territory tonight. Or maybe red is planning a skyshard hunting party. Good times!

Most of the camp originally posted could be not considered troll camps,the AD post that is. putting camps between 2 keeps could be there for a ganking group between keeps, could be for easy repsawn on keep resources at both keeps or could be a pve camp...

Troll camps really become an issue when they prevent the defensive placement at a keep or you have been trolled so bad you cant put anymore down.

The red pic is just blatantly obvious, now maybe EP trolls are just terrible at hiding their intent while AD trolls are really good at hiding it, or maybe AD trolls are not trolls and just not the brightest of players while EP trolls just dont care if they are found out.

Offensive placed troll camps are really a non-issue and can be dealt with easy enough it is the defensive ones that are detrimental and cause the loss of keeps.

Malveria · September 2014

This was during an emp push.

Can we quit mincing details and arguing possibilities? Troll camping is happening and it's costing us keeps.

dcincali · September 2014

DC Troll camped their way to Emp on Thorn NA and we have this garbage rebuttal to work with.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

This sort of behavior is not something we like to see. It's against the spirit of the game, and hurts the health of ESO's PVP. We also understand that a handful of bad eggs will always try to ruin the fun for all. That's up to us to solve. As Brian mentioned, we are exploring development-drive solutions and will share what we have in mind as soon as possible.

"and hurts the health of ESO's PVP."

"That's up to us to solve."

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ @ZOS_GinaBruno‌ @ZOS_BrianWheeler‌

ZOS Has not SOLVED anything, it is STILL happening even with reports of said troll campers and you have NOT officially stated if it is LEGAL. If it is a banable offense say so for those of use who take the time to report the garbage players doing these sorts of things so we know WE ARE NOT WASTING OUR TIME.

Arito · September 2014

Camps could be made bind on pickup so they cannot be traded to alts. This would negatively impact some pvp groups that have dedicated camp placers, but would largely eliminate the troll camping since lvl 10s don't make a ton of AP anyway so it would become unsustainable. As it stands now, I could pay somebody from another faction gold and send them 500 camps (faction matched from guild store) in the mail to place all over cyrodiil. Camps could also have an increased cost, which may cut down on blood porting, though I think this is a lesser issue than the troll camping.

Asgari · September 2014

Just remove tents. Make people run across the map and ride horses. Make use of rapid and other speed boosts to travel the map.

Will surely help with the overall lag of the servers and keep the massive zerg balls down.

Xsorus · September 2014

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

Just remove tents. Make people run across the map and ride horses. Make use of rapid and other speed boosts to travel the map.

Will surely help with the overall lag of the servers and keep the massive zerg balls down.

This

Remove Camps, Increase HP of Keep Walls

BloodStorm · September 2014

Trolls are strong. They have great self-healing. Just team up with some more people to take those hairy monsters out!

Rylana · September 2014

Some of the screenies in this thread show AD camps south of bleakers

Depending on the time of day, what day, those screens were taken, those may very well be Aldmeri Vice gank group camps (we like to hang around that general area, lots and lots of traffic)

So those camps are legit most likely. (and if anyone in AD is mad about that camp placement, too bad, I am sort of sick of constant keep siege warfare personally, ive been having wayyyyy more fun out in the field)

Fillem_Fulla · September 2014

Every keep should have its own spawn camp that players can repair when it gets low . Ithink this could possible stop some of the troll camps. Would also be another defensive strat to protect the point from seige

Grim13 · September 2014

DC are *** cheaters.

ZOS needs to take a look into having permanent GMs in the more populated campaigns (at least) to try and combat this horseshit.

Just lost Aless due to a troll fc... now we've had one placed blocking an fc at Roe.

Asgari · September 2014

Grim13 wrote: »

DC are *** cheaters.

ZOS needs to take a look into having permanent GMs in the more populated campaigns (at least) to try and combat this horseshit.

Just lost Aless due to a troll fc... now we've had one placed blocking an fc at Roe.

BURN ALL THOSE DC PLAYERS! better yet, ban them all!

Dleatherus · September 2014

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

Grim13 wrote: »

DC are *** cheaters.

ZOS needs to take a look into having permanent GMs in the more populated campaigns (at least) to try and combat this horseshit.

Just lost Aless due to a troll fc... now we've had one placed blocking an fc at Roe.

BURN ALL THOSE DC PLAYERS! better yet, ban them all!

better yet - instead of burning them how about we just roast them them in garlic and butter and instead of banning them have a feast? - might be the first time i enjoyed an exploiter!

D.

Grim13 · September 2014

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

Grim13 wrote: »

DC are *** cheaters.

ZOS needs to take a look into having permanent GMs in the more populated campaigns (at least) to try and combat this horseshit.

Just lost Aless due to a troll fc... now we've had one placed blocking an fc at Roe.

BURN ALL THOSE DC PLAYERS! better yet, ban them all!

Nah, only banning the ones cheating would suffice.

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO · September 2014

Dudis wrote: »

No.

I very much doubt most "troll camps" even are meant to be troll camps. That said though, they seem to be very rare anyways where I play (EU Thornblade)

your lucky you havent seen them. trolls have figured very good placements of "enemy camps" in their territory where they hinder the ability to drop a camp at multiple locations. once I logged on and there were 4 camps "strategically placed" in enemy territory which were able to disrupt attacks on most of their territory. most would call this obvious interference.
a single poorly placed camp is one thing, it can be for a lot of reasons, but once you start seeing multiples placed in a way to obviously disrupt your own faction, people start yelling spy. it would be a lot of trouble to go through for enemies and it seems unlikely, but why would someone do that to their own team?

Yam_of_the_Center · September 2014

Dleatherus wrote: »

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

Grim13 wrote: »

DC are *** cheaters.

ZOS needs to take a look into having permanent GMs in the more populated campaigns (at least) to try and combat this horseshit.

Just lost Aless due to a troll fc... now we've had one placed blocking an fc at Roe.

BURN ALL THOSE DC PLAYERS! better yet, ban them all!

better yet - instead of burning them how about we just roast them them in garlic and butter and instead of banning them have a feast? - might be the first time i enjoyed an exploiter!

D.

I thought you were a fat Orc, not a fat Bosmer.

Dleatherus · September 2014

Yam_of_the_Center wrote: »

Dleatherus wrote: »

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

Grim13 wrote: »

DC are *** cheaters.

ZOS needs to take a look into having permanent GMs in the more populated campaigns (at least) to try and combat this horseshit.

Just lost Aless due to a troll fc... now we've had one placed blocking an fc at Roe.

BURN ALL THOSE DC PLAYERS! better yet, ban them all!

better yet - instead of burning them how about we just roast them them in garlic and butter and instead of banning them have a feast? - might be the first time i enjoyed an exploiter!

D.

I thought you were a fat Orc, not a fat Bosmer.

i'm NOT fat, i'm portly

D.

frozywozy · September 2014

driosketch wrote: »

Dleatherus wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Modified the OP to link to the TOS which would (to me, anyway) clearly indicate that troll camps are, in fact, illegal.

troll camps are for sure an issue

they are aware of it:

D.

@Dleatherus‌ , that sounds more like he's talking about blood-porting issues which is a common complaint rather than troll camp. Which I'm not even convinced is a real problem.

Like a poster mentioned above, someone might put a camp up to quest. Someone might also be new and helpful, but ignorant about how to best place a camp. I remember when I started out, I was trying to place a camp between Roe and Allesia in case the one at Allesia went down, you wouldn't need to run back all the way from Roe. Eventually you find a spot only to realize it's only because the keep camp is down. I've seen camps in this place called a troll camp, but is there any actual proof of that?

It doesn't change the fact that if we put names on placed camps, make them vr12+ only and we see repeatedly the same character dropping bad camps over and over again, it may be a good sign that this person is not new and ignorant but just trying to get easy pvdooring going for his faction.

Dleatherus · September 2014

frozywozy wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

Dleatherus wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Modified the OP to link to the TOS which would (to me, anyway) clearly indicate that troll camps are, in fact, illegal.

troll camps are for sure an issue

they are aware of it:

D.

@Dleatherus‌ , that sounds more like he's talking about blood-porting issues which is a common complaint rather than troll camp. Which I'm not even convinced is a real problem.

Like a poster mentioned above, someone might put a camp up to quest. Someone might also be new and helpful, but ignorant about how to best place a camp. I remember when I started out, I was trying to place a camp between Roe and Allesia in case the one at Allesia went down, you wouldn't need to run back all the way from Roe. Eventually you find a spot only to realize it's only because the keep camp is down. I've seen camps in this place called a troll camp, but is there any actual proof of that?

It doesn't change the fact that if we put names on placed camps, make them vr12+ only and we see repeatedly the same character dropping bad camps over and over again, it may be a good sign that this person is not new and ignorant but just trying to get easy pvdooring going for his faction.

although i'm not usually a fan of restricting certain actions to the upper levels, what @frozywozy proposes here makes sense if they don't have a fix already in works that could be rolled out soon

there are enough players VR12+ that would be more than happy to spend the AP and be responsible for placing the camps

putting the name on them, would also help prevent this problem

but them putting names on camps probably contradicts their own naming and shaming policy of trolls and they would have to ban themselves

D.

p.s. I think @ZOS_BrianWheeler mentioned a while back that they were looking into the possibility of guild forward camps
a possibility could be to when placing a guild forward camp, to make it available to just the guild, or all of the alliance?

Vizier · September 2014

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

This sort of behavior is not something we like to see. It's against the spirit of the game, and hurts the health of ESO's PVP. We also understand that a handful of bad eggs will always try to ruin the fun for all. That's up to us to solve. As Brian mentioned, we are exploring development-drive solutions and will share what we have in mind as soon as possible.

Suggestions:
1: 50% reduction is camp sphere of influence (radius- those placed in wilderness by adventurers, noobs or gank squads, will have less impact on sieges.)
2: Can only use camp to rez if one actually died within the sphere of influence. (virtually ends Blood Porting.)
3: Allow one camp to be placed per person and/or their name attached to the camps for specific reporting.
4: Consider allowing more camps in a sphere of influence but restrict use to the group that placed it. (I suggest a new unique camp for this aside from standard FC's)

Implementation of any one of these factors would improve PvP. All together would greatly enhance the PvP experience and and necessitate a need for better strategy and coordination from factions to take and hold keeps.

darkdruidssb14_ESO · September 2014

What I don't understand is why they can't just disable the FCs until they make some viable solutions.... that way people will stop trolling with them, they will stop being abused and we can see what it would play like without them. That would buy some time for ZOS to make their solution and implement it if they see that disabling them is not the solution they want.

You disabled mercenaries so you could improve them.... disable FCs until you improve them. The worst that will happen is that people will realize we either need them or we don't.

Dleatherus · September 2014

darkdruidssb14_ESO wrote: »

What I don't understand is why they can't just disable the FCs until they make some viable solutions.... that way people will stop trolling with them, they will stop being abused and we can see what it would play like without them. That would buy some time for ZOS to make their solution and implement it if they see that disabling them is not the solution they want.

You disabled mercenaries so you could improve them.... disable FCs until you improve them. The worst that will happen is that people will realize we either need them or we don't.

/signed

D.

Phinix1 · September 2014

Vizier wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

This sort of behavior is not something we like to see. It's against the spirit of the game, and hurts the health of ESO's PVP. We also understand that a handful of bad eggs will always try to ruin the fun for all. That's up to us to solve. As Brian mentioned, we are exploring development-drive solutions and will share what we have in mind as soon as possible.

Suggestions:
1: 50% reduction is camp sphere of influence (radius- those placed in wilderness by adventurers, noobs or gank squads, will have less impact on sieges.)
2: Can only use camp to rez if one actually died within the sphere of influence. (virtually ends Blood Porting.)
3: Allow one camp to be placed per person and/or their name attached to the camps for specific reporting.
4: Consider allowing more camps in a sphere of influence but restrict use to the group that placed it. (I suggest a new unique camp for this aside from standard FC's)

Implementation of any one of these factors would improve PvP. All together would greatly enhance the PvP experience and and necessitate a need for better strategy and coordination from factions to take and hold keeps.

Excellent suggestions.

Asgari · September 2014

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

This sort of behavior is not something we like to see. It's against the spirit of the game, and hurts the health of ESO's PVP. We also understand that a handful of bad eggs will always try to ruin the fun for all. That's up to us to solve. As Brian mentioned, we are exploring development-drive solutions and will share what we have in mind as soon as possible.

Suggestions:
1: 50% reduction is camp sphere of influence (radius- those placed in wilderness by adventurers, noobs or gank squads, will have less impact on sieges.)
2: Can only use camp to rez if one actually died within the sphere of influence. (virtually ends Blood Porting.)
3: Allow one camp to be placed per person and/or their name attached to the camps for specific reporting.
4: Consider allowing more camps in a sphere of influence but restrict use to the group that placed it. (I suggest a new unique camp for this aside from standard FC's)

Implementation of any one of these factors would improve PvP. All together would greatly enhance the PvP experience and and necessitate a need for better strategy and coordination from factions to take and hold keeps.

Excellent suggestions.

How can they possibly code in a system to properly track all player movements at all given times to see which zones they are in and out of.

I still say the only way to fix this is by have names displayed on the FC. This naming and shaming thing needs to go. The game is rated Mature.

SirAndy · September 2014

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

How can they possibly code in a system to properly track all player movements at all given times to see which zones they are in and out of.

If done right, that is actually the simple part ...

Asgari · September 2014

SirAndy wrote: »

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

How can they possibly code in a system to properly track all player movements at all given times to see which zones they are in and out of.

If done right, that is actually the simple part ...

You forgot the part where @ZOS has to do it.

Muizer · September 2014

So. while we wait for Zenimax to fix this, I wonder if people complaining here will actually do the "right thing" themselves if they spot what is quite probably an enemy troll camp: burn it down, even if it means the nme may put up a camp in a place more useful to them.

There's not much of an excuse not to. If it's a troll camp, the nme won't stop you from destroying it. Or do we just make ourselves complicit by finding excuses why it might be the nme's fault? PvP is always going to be rubbish if we all let ourselves get sucked into a moral race to the bottom.

Dleatherus · September 2014

if you gave a 2500AP reward for each enemy forward camp burned it might help

D.

DaisyK · September 2014

Is this even possible?? can't even put them up next to eachother that close imo...

riverdragon72 · September 2014

names on the camps would be the best, then the perp is caught red handed. I still think only players in the radius of the camp should be allowed to respawn with it.