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Please Tweak Blocking
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Guppet✭✭✭✭✭
✭Artemiisia wrote: »Second of all, this post has as much relation to PvE as PvP, since if you change it to pvp, it will affect pve and veteran/trails and such like crazy.
Well and solo play, since mobs of 3 that jumps around you, you wont be able to do anything against, if you are a casuel player.
But then again, those that suggest this are the "really good" players of pvp......
There are movement strategies for keeping multiple enemies in front of you. My Karate school use to practice this. Never allowing the enemy behind you by circling around them. You want to just ignore this strategy in favor of allowing players to just stand in one spot and get hit from all directions, which resembles more an arcade game than real combat.
What did your Karate school teach you to do against magic attacks? Don't bring real world examples to a game based on magic!!!0 -
SFBryan18✭✭✭✭✭
✭Requiemslove wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »
While you're wasting your time throwing light attacks, he's spamming his abilities while holding up a 360 shield. I understand. Obviously the strategy in this game is that everyone holds block all the time.
My point being pet is you are taking this far too seriously. Maybe take 5, have a drink?
That really didn't contribute anything to this discussion at all. Maybe don't post if you have nothing of value to input.Artemiisia wrote: »Second of all, this post has as much relation to PvE as PvP, since if you change it to pvp, it will affect pve and veteran/trails and such like crazy.
Well and solo play, since mobs of 3 that jumps around you, you wont be able to do anything against, if you are a casuel player.
But then again, those that suggest this are the "really good" players of pvp......
There are movement strategies for keeping multiple enemies in front of you. My Karate school use to practice this. Never allowing the enemy behind you by circling around them. You want to just ignore this strategy in favor of allowing players to just stand in one spot and get hit from all directions, which resembles more an arcade game than real combat.
What did your Karate school teach you to do against magic attacks? Don't bring real world examples to a game based on magic!!!
So I guess swinging a sword or shooting an arrow in this game are based on magic? God, some of these people...Edited by SFBryan18 on August 16, 2014 5:33PM2 -
Rune_Relic✭✭✭✭✭
✭Requiemslove wrote: »xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »Any 2v1 would be a complete loss as well
2v1 is supposed to be a complete loss. It's 2 vs 1. What do you expect? You think one guy should be able to roll through multiple enemies by himself? Now that would be over powered.
OK, does it not count who the 2 are vs the 1? Also, you do not equate player skill. If the 1 has more skill than the 2 combined, and fights well and uses the environment better, why such a shock if the 1 wins? Not saying it should be the case, just food for thought.
It is assumed that 1 + 1 = 2. I didn't say 1.7vs2.2, I said 2 vs 1. These number represent equally matched opponents.
No.....they don't...
Yes, they do. When you balance something, you always do it on an even playing field.
Mate, if every player in MMOs that support PvP was equally matched you would not have winners and losers. Too often it seems the difference is to do with gear, in a lot of MMOs which I feel is frankly the wrong way to go, but in good ones as this can be, with the right care it can hopefully be about which player or group of players has MORE SKILL. As an example, take a beat em up game like say, soul calibre, as example. Pit two players, who know each other well against one another, and on paper they are evenly matched however in practice, for every fight, one player WILL be slightly better than the other. No one is ever always evenly matched. Most often, its just being able to notch up the most wins. And that, is the essence of PvP.
But that's not the idea of balancing.
The idea of balancing differing classes is the gain in some areas and suffer in others.
It literally is hand paper scissors kind of thing.
You have to understand you opponents weaknesses and your strengths.
If you both understand each others limitations, it will be a standoff if well balanced.
If you don't understand or exploit your enemies weakness and maximise your strengths....you die
Many of the problems with this game is that;
a. the classes, abilities and skills and archetypes make no logical sense.
b. the classes are completely unbalanced.
They have tried to twist game reality so much no one understands it and there is no common frame of reference or understaning other than skirt + stick wins.
Personally I wish the would release all the game data formulas so we could all get together and fix the damn thing "properly" and "once" and for all. In a logical way.Edited by Rune_Relic on August 16, 2014 6:09PMAnything that can be exploited will be exploited0 -
Touchen✭✭b. the classes are completely unbalanced.
where do you get this ?. the combination of abilities are huge. If a player says his class i "unbalanced". yet i can find other players who wrecks in pvp against other classes. it is up to the player and the build he choses to play with and the playstyle he uses.
i have tried templar,nightblade and dragonknight.
every one of these are great in different aspects.
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Touchen✭✭and classes isent the issue on this thread, it is still that blocking gives to much advantage in many prespectivs0
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Requiemslove✭✭✭Rune_Relic wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »Any 2v1 would be a complete loss as well
2v1 is supposed to be a complete loss. It's 2 vs 1. What do you expect? You think one guy should be able to roll through multiple enemies by himself? Now that would be over powered.
OK, does it not count who the 2 are vs the 1? Also, you do not equate player skill. If the 1 has more skill than the 2 combined, and fights well and uses the environment better, why such a shock if the 1 wins? Not saying it should be the case, just food for thought.
It is assumed that 1 + 1 = 2. I didn't say 1.7vs2.2, I said 2 vs 1. These number represent equally matched opponents.
No.....they don't...
Yes, they do. When you balance something, you always do it on an even playing field.
Mate, if every player in MMOs that support PvP was equally matched you would not have winners and losers. Too often it seems the difference is to do with gear, in a lot of MMOs which I feel is frankly the wrong way to go, but in good ones as this can be, with the right care it can hopefully be about which player or group of players has MORE SKILL. As an example, take a beat em up game like say, soul calibre, as example. Pit two players, who know each other well against one another, and on paper they are evenly matched however in practice, for every fight, one player WILL be slightly better than the other. No one is ever always evenly matched. Most often, its just being able to notch up the most wins. And that, is the essence of PvP.
But that's not the idea of balancing.
The idea of balancing differing classes is the gain in some areas and suffer in others.
It literally is hand paper scissors kind of thing.
You have to understand you opponents weaknesses and your strengths.
If you both understand each others limitations, it will be a standoff if well balanced.
If you don't understand or exploit your enemies weakness and maximise your strengths....you die
Many of the problems with this game is that;
a. the classes, abilities and skills and archetypes make no logical sense.
b. the classes are completely unbalanced.
They have tried to twist game reality so much no one understands it and there is no common frame of reference or understaning other than skirt + stick wins.
Personally I wish the would release all the game data formulas so we could all get together and fix the damn thing "properly" and "once" and for all. In a logical way.
Knowledge and understanding of yourself and your opponent, your strengths, their strengths, your weaknesses, their weaknesses, is the balance. The rest is down to skill. You can be as learned in your abilities and your enemies abilities as you wish to, but if you lack the skill to fight, you will still lose.0 -
Obscure✭✭✭✭✭I bet I can root you more times than you can dodge
you sure ? , i have medium armor with reduce cost of roll dodge xD that will be a never ending roll dodge/root competition xD + bow passive
If I was sure I'd say I can root you more than you can dodge
But I digress. The real problem is that I can spam you with roots while I'm blocking...or just spam you with anything while blocking really. Covering spell casting with blocks is simply part of how to play ESO, and that's just dumb.
Block should...
• prevent casting.
• not reduce as much damage with a staff as it does with a weapon.
• be broken by an enemy Bash unless you're blocking with a shield.
Blocking and Attacking at the same time is just stupid, there's a reason within this TES based combat system that you never could block and attack at the same time. Odd when one can see more effort to create game balance in the past single player TES games like Morrowind, Oblivion, and Skyrim in which the whole point is to become insanely overpowered. How tragically ironic.0 -
Lionxoft✭✭✭✭✭
✭xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »Since we have a bunch of people that don't understand how blocking works in this game, I'll explain a few things and how you go about countering it.
First lets look at the numbers
213 - This is the amount of Stamina anyone you see in Light Armor (or Medium Armor) and a Staff (Or any weapon not a 1hd/shield) with no Blocking Glyphs is going to lose every time they block, This means any Multi hit ability is absolutely going to wreck anyone blocking while doing this. These people usually aren't built for stamina either, Things like Dodge Rolls and Break free is also going to wreck their stamina as well.
153 - This is the amount of Stamina anyone in Light/Medium Armor will use if they equip a 1hd/shield. Again remember these players are generally not build for Stamina usually, and if they're wearing things like light armor their Dodge Rolls and Break Free's cost a lot of Stamina. Same thing applies before. If someone is blocking like this just weaving light attacks in on any of your abilities or using Multi hit abilities absolutely wrecks people like this.
53 - This is how much Block cost if you equip 3 Legendary Block Cost Reduction Glyphs on your jewelry, Run Defensive Stance (Or its other morph), and equip 5 pieces of heavy armor. These guys are hard to bring down, But they're bloody suppose to be hard to bring down because they've built themselves that way.
Now with that said, Most of the time I see people complaining about Blocking, Its usually about the first 2 numbers above. Those are the people that are just really causing people so much trouble. Why? Because most people simply don't understand how to counter blocking.
In any Scenario involving a 1v1, If you see someone blocking and you're right next to them...don't Block...Start Beating the ever living crap out of them with Light attacks. Do this while circling the target as well. You will drain the stamina of the person you're blocking. Multi hit attacks also work as well. Even then that's not all you can do to fight Blocking, Any PBAE or AOE will damage the Blocker for 100% of the damage, This includes things like Impulse/Steel Tornado for example. Cone Effects will be blocked though so don't use them. Dual Wielders are esp powerful when dealing with Blockers in a 1v1 because they can do things like Heated Blade which basically means you can apply a 4 Second 100% miss debuff to a Dragon Knight for example that lets ya basically sit there and spam light attacks on the DK while he holds block. He will miss most of his abilities (Except for things like Fiery Breath or Talons). This is useful for draining the stamina of the light armored 1hd/shield dk's.
The absolute most powerful ANTI Block ability in the game comes in the form of the Nightblades Fear (Templars get an Anti Block ability as well, but i've not seen it used). This is a 4 second fear that goes through Block. Once you're hit with it you start running and you can be hit from behind while this is happening. You cannot Block while feared either. So you have 2 choices, You can either sit there and get hit for damage, or you can use Break Free, which is going to cost you a buttload of Stamina.
Now with that said, If you're coming across any player and you have multiple people with you, and they're holding Block...And they're anything but the last Number....You should have zero problem draining their stamina to nothing in a matter of seconds. People who are built for blocking will take a bit, But these are people who run things like 1hd/shield+3 block glyphs and usually Defensive Stance and/or Heavy Armor. They will always take a while but you have multiple ways to hurt them or stop them from Blocking.
In closing....This is a L2P Issue.
It's not a L2P issue. It's a mechanic that requires no skill at all. As a DK, I block... All the time. Consequences? Never. Players that waft the scent of their own flatulent with pleasure tend to think that blocking while casting requires skill yet it really doesn't. Anyone can mindlessly block while casting. Hold one button down while pressing another.
Is it too much to ask for an active combat system that has risk vs reward instead of just reward? When someone has to react when to block instead of blocking all the time.
In closing... This is not a L2P issue instead it is some folks wanting combat decisions to have actual risk vs reward.0 -
jelliedsoup✭✭✭✭✭Constant blocking 360 degrees and attacking at the same time means block is broken.www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=Ks8_KGHqmO40 -
Origin✭✭✭jelliedsoup wrote: »Constant blocking 360 degrees and attacking at the same time means block is broken.
This is a fantasy game, so yes it is possible and it doesn't mean is broken. Get used to it.1 -
jelliedsoup✭✭✭✭✭
Try not to use the fantasy argument too much, if you're referring to a concept which already has a meaning.jelliedsoup wrote: »Constant blocking 360 degrees and attacking at the same time means block is broken.
This is a fantasy game, so yes it is possible and it doesn't mean is broken. Get used to it.
Rename blocking to snodgroting and then use that generic and poorly considered logic and it might even work.
The devs should try a bit more thought for those who want to use some skill to fight in this game.
Edited by jelliedsoup on August 17, 2014 2:00AMwww.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=Ks8_KGHqmO40 -
Vunter✭✭✭Can I bump this? I just got killed by a dude that spammed some instant aoe with his shield up.0