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content too easy? simple fixes for free
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GreySix✭✭✭✭✭
✭I want to beat the game and meet the challenge set by the developers. I want the content to require me to be optimal or close to. The challenge of finding what is optimal is an enormous part of the fun of the game.
Fair enough, and you should be able to experience that.
On the other hand, I want to experience the game and explore the game-world cooperatively with another person. I want the content to be both challenging and fun. I like some fun entertainment after a grinding day of work, having put out various fires, dealing with buttpain from subordinates and bosses, and coming home tired and ready to unwind.
Why can the developers not accommodate both gaming styles?Crotchety Old Man Guild
"Hey you, get off my lawn!"7 -
Hilgara✭✭✭✭✭I want to beat the game and meet the challenge set by the developers. I want the content to require me to be optimal or close to. The challenge of finding what is optimal is an enormous part of the fun of the game.
Fair enough, and you should be able to experience that.
On the other hand, I want to experience the game and explore the game-world cooperatively with another person. I want the content to be both challenging and fun. I like some fun entertainment after a grinding day of work, having put out various fires, dealing with buttpain from subordinates and bosses, and coming home tired and ready to unwind.
Why can the developers not accommodate both gaming styles?
Surely if you are playing with a buddy its not too difficult for you? The way you describe it we are now moving away from what was your ideal solution.1 -
FlinkeKlinge✭✭✭
Fair enough, and you should be able to experience that.
On the other hand, I want to experience the game and explore the game-world cooperatively with another person. I want the content to be both challenging and fun. I like some fun entertainment after a grinding day of work, having put out various fires, dealing with buttpain from subordinates and bosses, and coming home tired and ready to unwind.
Why can the developers not accommodate both gaming styles?
That´s the part of the discussion, i don´t seem to get.
All the quests, apart from the ones in 4-man group dungeons and the craglorn content, is suited to solo play. So is exploring and gathering.
Except for a few world bosses and (based on your build) dolmens, there is absolutely nothing too hard for a solo player.
"When you die, it just instantly robs life of many pleasures."
random guy in pub2 -
Ojustaboo✭✭✭✭✭
✭I love challenging content.
I don't like the vet content because its only really doable with a few specs and this game was supposed to get away from that.
I had to respec, swap my bow for a res staff, swap my summoning skills for other skills, now vet level is doable but I am in no way playing how I like.
Change is needed, nerfing isn't the answer in my opinion. Doshia was one of the best fights I've experienced in years in an mmo once you understood the mechanics, its now a faceroll and numorous NOT elite players have said how sad it was to play on an alt with zero challenge, killing in 2 or 3 shots, no need for pots, no need for ultimate etc, and its a real disappointment for many.
That one fight before it was nerfed twice was the thing that convinced me to preorder. Now its a faceroll for most people.
Now I see what they have anounced for vet so far and I worry for the trend this is setting.
I am no where near elite skilled, I'm probably the most carried person in any group due to my lack of skill, but I like a challenge.
I left Lotro for the one simple reason they made it all soloable and in the progress made the game a faceroll. Yes I complained about Lotros lack of new raids etc, but it was rolling alts, never having to use a pot, never having to watch my health bar, it not mattering what skill I used or what armour I wore.
Lotro never used to be like that, when they started dumming it down they assured concerned players it would never end up how it ended up. I never had any problems with them making content that was soloable, it was having no challenging content as well that I hated.
I am worried at whats been anounced so far, I see they arent releasing the rest of their plans until quakecon, never mind that the people paying want to know their plans, lets make tnem wait a week or so for a convention most people have zero interest in.
I almost feel like cancelling my sub today. I just don't like the "lets get another months sub before we anounce our plans" attitude, giving us a little taste in yesterday's anouncement as though we are all 15 yrs old. I almost feel like saying I'm going to wait until quakecon to see if I want to continue playing. Especially as vet content is such a huge deal to many players, making us wait for some PR event when we are paying customers is just wrong in my opinion.
As to the suggestions in this thread, why should someone play this game, earn their skills, learn their crafting and then get told by others that we shouldnt use any of it or should play a harder class etc. Don't forget, these 'others' are the same 'others' who happily complained that the content was too hard and (rightly) ignored suggestions they should learn to play, respec, change class etc.
I could say if you find the content too hard, play a sorc, res staff, be a vamp, use skills xyz, make sure your wearing armour set abc or even find someone else to group up and help you. And you will rightly tell me why you shouldn't have to.
And I would agree entirely with you, at the same time players who find the game too easy also shouldn't be expected to change their playstyles either.
There should be vet content where some is soloable and easier than other vet content of the same level, and some is as hard as the current vet stuff is.
If they nerf the hard stuff they are simply going to alienate a completey different group of players who will be just as vocal on here as those complaining its too hard.
I've already read plenty of snarky threads about how we asked for easy content and now we are still complaining. The simple fact it, they are two different groups and the only possible way of pleasing both, is to make content that appeals to both, and both groups need to understand that they may not find the other 'group' content fun, it may be too hard or too easy, but that the particular content was designed to appeal to a certain group.
Also implying that anyone that doesn't want content nerfed is some super duper elite type player is not constructive at all.
Edited by Ojustaboo on July 4, 2014 2:08PM2 -
Nidwin✭✭✭Okay, so, I am a VR8 Sword and Board Templar. I never use buffs ...
Yep and there's a good reason for it.
There's an issue in this game with S&B that makes it the ftw build for solo PVE. But because it's needed for the dungeons to have someone tank the big boss it isn't going to be something ZOS will be able to fix easily.Nidwinqq Templar (healzzz) United Warhammer Vets
Nidwinqq RR100 Magus till the end, R.I.P. Badlands1 -
reggielee✭✭✭✭agree, there are many legit ways to increase your own difficulty mode which many players do in every mmo as they enjoy that challenge. on the other hand, players can not adjust the base stats or mechanics of mobs to increase easeMama always said the fastest way to a man's heart is through his chest.2 -
FlinkeKlinge✭✭✭Agree with @Ojustaboo.
I consider myself a below average gamer, never touched an fps game, only ever played more laid back - style games, i.e. RPG´s and adventures.
So if someone like me, finds the game to be pretty easy, in regards to solo-content, i can´t imagine how a dumbing down of the content will effect players with above average gaming skills....
As it currently stands, i find the game to be actually pretty balanced.
There is challenge for the ones seeking it, but there is also the mind blowingly huge array of quests for the average joe.Edited by FlinkeKlinge on July 4, 2014 2:19PM"When you die, it just instantly robs life of many pleasures."
random guy in pub2 -
GreySix✭✭✭✭✭
✭I want to beat the game and meet the challenge set by the developers. I want the content to require me to be optimal or close to. The challenge of finding what is optimal is an enormous part of the fun of the game.
Fair enough, and you should be able to experience that.
On the other hand, I want to experience the game and explore the game-world cooperatively with another person. I want the content to be both challenging and fun. I like some fun entertainment after a grinding day of work, having put out various fires, dealing with buttpain from subordinates and bosses, and coming home tired and ready to unwind.
Why can the developers not accommodate both gaming styles?
Surely if you are playing with a buddy its not too difficult for you? The way you describe it we are now moving away from what was your ideal solution.
Actually, all of the main-story instances are still forced-solo, so that particular mechanic remains broken.Crotchety Old Man Guild
"Hey you, get off my lawn!"2 -
Hilgara✭✭✭✭✭
Actually, all of the main-story instances are still forced-solo, so that particular mechanic remains broken.
No they're not (or at least none I found) They only appear to be. The ones in vet are the cadewell silver/gold quests. You enter the instance and find the boss is a real handfull. So you go out and wait for someone else to show up. Along comes someone and you follow him in only to find he's not there. Its instanced. But if you had grouped with him before entering you would both be in the same instance.
Edited by Hilgara on July 4, 2014 2:41PM2 -
GreySix✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Actually, all of the main-story instances are still forced-solo, so that particular mechanic remains broken.
No they're not (or at least none I found) They only appear to be. The ones in vet are the cadewell silver/gold quests. You enter the instance and find the boss is a real handfull. So you go out and wait for someone else to show up. Along comes someone and you follow him in only to find he's not there. Its instanced. But if you had grouped with him before entering you would both be in the same instance.
Was referring to the main-story quests prior to veteran levels.
And we can add to that all Fighers Guild and Mages Guild quests.
All of those remain forced-solo, unless they changed it in the latest update.Crotchety Old Man Guild
"Hey you, get off my lawn!"1 -
Hilgara✭✭✭✭✭
Those will not be changing. The changes only apply to vet content. And to be honest neither should they change, You have to draw the line somewhere. Most people are getting through 1 to 50 fine. If you scale the difficulty for the few that can't the game really is heading for the pan
Was referring to the main-story quests prior to veteran levels.
And we can add to that all Fighers Guild and Mages Guild quests.
All of those remain forced-solo, unless they changed it in the latest update.3 -
FlinkeKlinge✭✭✭
Those will not be changing. The changes only apply to vet content. And to be honest neither should they change, You have to draw the line somewhere. Most people are getting through 1 to 50 fine. If you scale the difficulty for the few that can't the game really is heading for the pan
Was referring to the main-story quests prior to veteran levels.
And we can add to that all Fighers Guild and Mages Guild quests.
All of those remain forced-solo, unless they changed it in the latest update.
Exactly.
If you couldn´t handle the Harborage Quest by yourself, you should either give your build another thought, or accept that you are beyond hopeless when it comes to playing games.....
Edited by FlinkeKlinge on July 4, 2014 2:56PM"When you die, it just instantly robs life of many pleasures."
random guy in pub2 -
GreySix✭✭✭✭✭
✭... and that is why this game will continue to be nerfed into Oblivion.
Know that your dogged opposition to player choice is what helped bring it.Crotchety Old Man Guild
"Hey you, get off my lawn!"3 -
Sotha_Sil✭✭✭✭✭
✭Imo, it doesn't work like this.
The player shouldn't have to desperatly look for challenge in game. The game should offer him challenge whatever he does.
So if some classes using some build with some abillities roll their head all over their keyboard, I think there is an issue right there.Edited by Sotha_Sil on July 4, 2014 3:03PMRestoration is a perfectly valid school of magic, and don't let anyone tell you otherwise! - Spells and incantations for those with the talent to cast them!2 -
FlinkeKlinge✭✭✭... and that is why this game will continue to be nerfed into Oblivion.
Know that your dogged opposition to player choice is what helped bring it.
There is almost unlimited choice for the player to build a working character.
Not sure what you are getting at.
Everyone in my guild plays their characters differently, for example:
My Templar is 1h+s + resto staff in heavy armor
Our leader is a light armor destro staff Templar
There´s a bunch of 2h medium armor and heavy armor Templars
All these combinations, with totally different combat dynamics and skills, do work in solo and group play.
Edited by FlinkeKlinge on July 4, 2014 3:10PM"When you die, it just instantly robs life of many pleasures."
random guy in pub1 -
nerevarine1138✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭... and that is why this game will continue to be nerfed into Oblivion.
Know that your dogged opposition to player choice is what helped bring it.
You do realize that you are literally the only person on these forums who keeps asking for the main story quests to stop being solo instances, right?
And that has nothing to do with VR difficulty.----
Murray?3 -
GreySix✭✭✭✭✭
✭FlinkeKlinge wrote: »
History.
Have the game mechanics become harder ... or easier with time?
It really isn't that difficult to understand: Either allow something like a difficulty slider, or watch the game continue to get nerfed.Crotchety Old Man Guild
"Hey you, get off my lawn!"3 -
GreySix✭✭✭✭✭
✭nerevarine1138 wrote: »... and that is why this game will continue to be nerfed into Oblivion.
Know that your dogged opposition to player choice is what helped bring it.
You do realize that you are literally the only person on these forums who keeps asking for the main story quests to stop being solo instances, right?
And that has nothing to do with VR difficulty.
My response was to a poster who asserted all content could be played cooperatively.
That is patently false.Crotchety Old Man Guild
"Hey you, get off my lawn!"2 -
Hilgara✭✭✭✭✭FlinkeKlinge wrote: »
History.
Have the game mechanics become harder ... or easier with time?
It really isn't that difficult to understand: Either allow something like a difficulty slider, or watch the game continue to get nerfed.
You are comparing everything to WOW. Have you played anything more recent? Try Secret World or any of the survivalist MMO's like RUST or Day Z They have realised that easy = quick turnover of customers. People dont become invested in their characters when no effort is required to reach their goals. The MMO world has moved on from WOWEdited by Hilgara on July 4, 2014 3:15PM2 -
GreySix✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Only WoW I've played is their starter edition, so I can't really use them as a basis of comparison.FlinkeKlinge wrote: »
History.
Have the game mechanics become harder ... or easier with time?
It really isn't that difficult to understand: Either allow something like a difficulty slider, or watch the game continue to get nerfed.
You are comparing everything to WOW.
Yes, still play SWTOR.Have you played anything more recent?
How is that anything other than a reinforcement of my own position? If the developers don't enable customer choice, then the alternative will be further nerfing of content.Try Secret World or any of the survivalist MMO's like RUST or Day Z They have realised that easy = quick turnover of customers. People dont become invested in their characters when no effort is required to reach their goals. The MMO world has moved on from WOW
Is that what you prefer?Crotchety Old Man Guild
"Hey you, get off my lawn!"4 -
Hilgara✭✭✭✭✭
Only WoW I've played is their starter edition, so I can't really use them as a basis of comparison.FlinkeKlinge wrote: »
History.
Have the game mechanics become harder ... or easier with time?
It really isn't that difficult to understand: Either allow something like a difficulty slider, or watch the game continue to get nerfed.
You are comparing everything to WOW.
Yes, still play SWTOR.Have you played anything more recent?
How is that anything other than a reinforcement of my own position? If the developers don't enable customer choice, then the alternative will be further nerfing of content.Try Secret World or any of the survivalist MMO's like RUST or Day Z They have realised that easy = quick turnover of customers. People dont become invested in their characters when no effort is required to reach their goals. The MMO world has moved on from WOW
Is that what you prefer?
Sorry, dont follow. They are making games harder to cater for a growing customer base that demands harder content. How does that support your position?2 -
FlinkeKlinge✭✭✭Sorry, dont follow. They are making games harder to cater for a growing customer base that demands harder content. How does that support your position?
I´m not even sure what his position is, to be honest.
It seems to change, based on what was said in response to him.
Edited by FlinkeKlinge on July 4, 2014 3:29PM"When you die, it just instantly robs life of many pleasures."
random guy in pub5 -
GreySix✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I'm referring to ESO, not other games. I don't care about other games. I care about ESO.Sorry, dont follow. They are making games harder to cater for a growing customer base that demands harder content. How does that support your position?
And the trend in ESO is to nerf overall content. See no indication of a reversal for now. Do you?Crotchety Old Man Guild
"Hey you, get off my lawn!"3 -
FlinkeKlinge✭✭✭FlinkeKlinge wrote: »
Pretty easy for some of us to follow
Would you care to explain it to me then, please?
Because, i honestly don´t get what he wants.
"When you die, it just instantly robs life of many pleasures."
random guy in pub3 -
OrcLadySoul ShrivenFlinkeKlinge wrote: »FlinkeKlinge wrote: »
Pretty easy for some of us to follow
Would you care to explain it to me then, please?
Because, i honestly don´t get what he wants.
Is English not your primary language?3 -
FlinkeKlinge✭✭✭FlinkeKlinge wrote: »FlinkeKlinge wrote: »
Pretty easy for some of us to follow
Would you care to explain it to me then, please?
Because, i honestly don´t get what he wants.
Is English not your primary language?
It isn´t.
My problem isn´t with the comprehension of his words though, rather with their context."When you die, it just instantly robs life of many pleasures."
random guy in pub2 -
KariTR✭✭✭✭✭
Actually, all of the main-story instances are still forced-solo, so that particular mechanic remains broken.
No they're not (or at least none I found) They only appear to be. The ones in vet are the cadewell silver/gold quests. You enter the instance and find the boss is a real handfull. So you go out and wait for someone else to show up. Along comes someone and you follow him in only to find he's not there. Its instanced. But if you had grouped with him before entering you would both be in the same instance.
Ha, reading this side discussion about lack of forced solo story lines in Veteran Zones caused me to realise that the proposed changes could result in the L1-L50 maps being harder than VRs
2